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Patch 1.11

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July 30, 2005 1:47:11 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

Looks like Blizzard had announced that a new patch is coming:
http://www.battle.net/

No word on what it entails. But this was posted on another forum from a
Taiwanese site (http://www.unalis.com.tw/news/NewsDetail.aspx?ID=319):
Dialbo II load of destruction V1.11 will be out in August.

After a long wait, Blizzard expects to release Diablo II Expansion: Lord of
Destruction V1.11 in August. A new secret quest will be in Hell games.
Players must search through the evil caves to the throne of destruction to
find out the new Evil and kill it. This difficult quest will test the
ability of each player.

In v1.11, besides the new quest, player vs player will be cruder. For
example, there will be no time delay when casting town portal, which was for
player to have more time prepare for a fight or escape. The paladin cannot
use blessed hammer in town to avoid being harmed when coming out of the
town. When fighting the uber Diablo, be careful of not let Shenk or Blood
raven die. This will make killing uber Diablo more difficult. Also, when
equipment has certain skill, but player doesn't have this skill, this skill
can not be used or added.

Player doesn't need to worry. In V1.11, there are 10 more rune words. The
new equipment that never before seen can be found in some boss monsters. For
merc, player can hire the merc only 1- 5 level lower than player. Mer can
gain experience more quickly and can live longer to help player.
**************************************

So given past Blizzard performance, we should get the patch in August 2007.
I can't wait, LOL. Guess I'll believe it when I see it.

Regards-
Mark

Bongo-Fury

More about : patch

Anonymous
July 30, 2005 1:47:12 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

Mark wrote:
> Looks like Blizzard had announced that a new patch is coming:
> http://www.battle.net/

Andariel's twin sister, Lilith!

> After a long wait, Blizzard expects to release Diablo II Expansion: Lord of
> Destruction V1.11 in August. A new secret quest will be in Hell games.
> Players must search through the evil caves to the throne of destruction to
> find out the new Evil and kill it. This difficult quest will test the
> ability of each player.

I wonder why they don't implement that rumor monster, Reizarfg. There
used to be a screenshot of it on the Arreat Summit. If still is, I
can't find it anymore.

> Also, when
> equipment has certain skill, but player doesn't have this skill, this skill
> can not be used or added.

Bye bye Enigma, CtA, and Chaos. That doesn't make sense, no Barbarians
can use a Claw, and no Assassin can use the WW on a Chaos claw.

> For
> merc, player can hire the merc only 1- 5 level lower than player. Mer can

No more joining Mule Park games to level merc.

> gain experience more quickly and can live longer to help player.

Are current mercs not strong enough already?

> **************************************
>
> So given past Blizzard performance, we should get the patch in August 2007.
> I can't wait, LOL. Guess I'll believe it when I see it.
>
> Regards-
> Mark
>
> Bongo-Fury
July 30, 2005 1:47:12 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

"Mark" <bongofury@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:ztxGe.27$%a2.13@trndny03...
> Looks like Blizzard had announced that a new patch is coming:
> http://www.battle.net/
>
> No word on what it entails. But this was posted on another forum from a
> Taiwanese site (http://www.unalis.com.tw/news/NewsDetail.aspx?ID=319):
> Dialbo II load of destruction V1.11 will be out in August.
>
> After a long wait, Blizzard expects to release Diablo II Expansion: Lord
> of Destruction V1.11 in August. A new secret quest will be in Hell games.
> Players must search through the evil caves to the throne of destruction to
> find out the new Evil and kill it. This difficult quest will test the
> ability of each player.

Guess that is Lilith. Considering her backdrop unless they add an area looks
like she will be in the crypt/mauseleum/tower. Can't think of anywhere else
that has that distinctive backdrop unless it's one of the areas I often skip
over LOL

> In v1.11, besides the new quest, player vs player will be cruder. For
> example, there will be no time delay when casting town portal, which was
> for player to have more time prepare for a fight or escape. The paladin
> cannot use blessed hammer in town to avoid being harmed when coming out of
> the town. When fighting the uber Diablo, be careful of not let Shenk or
> Blood raven die. This will make killing uber Diablo more difficult. Also,
> when equipment has certain skill, but player doesn't have this skill, this
> skill can not be used or added.

So there goes the marrowalk bug eh? And using shenk/bloodraven to poof uber
D. Interesting.

> Player doesn't need to worry. In V1.11, there are 10 more rune words. The
> new equipment that never before seen can be found in some boss monsters.
> For merc, player can hire the merc only 1- 5 level lower than player. Mer
> can gain experience more quickly and can live longer to help player.
> **************************************

More runewords but hopefully with the easier to find runes. No going back
then to get a nm merc if you decide the hell one isn't doing what you
wanted. Guess we will see a lot less merc-lvling games. Not sure if I like
this idea or not. My damn merc's usually outlive me LOL

> So given past Blizzard performance, we should get the patch in August
> 2007. I can't wait, LOL. Guess I'll believe it when I see it.

LOL! Well we shall see what the first brings it's right around the
proverbial corner.

--
In a World full of Insanity
Here I Stand.
Sliver
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Anonymous
July 30, 2005 2:37:13 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

On Fri, 29 Jul 2005, "Mark" wrote:

>> Looks like Blizzard had announced that a new patch is coming:
>> http://www.battle.net/
>>
>> No word on what it entails. But this was posted on another forum from a
>> Taiwanese site (http://www.unalis.com.tw/news/NewsDetail.aspx?ID=319):
>> Dialbo II load of destruction V1.11 will be out in August.

"Load of Destruction"... was that a typo, or sarcasm?

>> In v1.11, besides the new quest, player vs player will be cruder. For
>> example, there will be no time delay when casting town portal,

I'm guessing this means that opening a TP equals teleporting to town
instantly. Perhaps a bass-ackwards attempt to deal with the tppk.

>> The paladin cannot use blessed hammer in town to avoid being harmed

I've never played a Hammerdin, what's this about?

>> When fighting the uber Diablo, be careful of not let Shenk or Blood
>> raven die. This will make killing uber Diablo more difficult. Also, when
>> equipment has certain skill, but player doesn't have this skill, this skill
>> can not be used or added.

*that* is a bite on the butt!

>> So given past Blizzard performance, we should get the patch in August 2007.
>> I can't wait, LOL. Guess I'll believe it when I see it.

My money is on Mark's analysis. I'd love to be proved wrong, but I play
CE (exclusively) so it doesn't really matter to me.
Anonymous
July 30, 2005 4:25:14 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

"Mark" <bongofury@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:ztxGe.27$%a2.13@trndny03...

> In v1.11, besides the new quest, player vs player will be cruder. For
> example, there will be no time delay when casting town portal, which was
for
> player to have more time prepare for a fight or escape. The paladin cannot
> use blessed hammer in town to avoid being harmed when coming out of the
> town. When fighting the uber Diablo, be careful of not let Shenk or Blood
> raven die. This will make killing uber Diablo more difficult. Also, when
> equipment has certain skill, but player doesn't have this skill, this
skill
> can not be used or added.

Smells like bullshit.

> So given past Blizzard performance, we should get the patch in August
2007.
> I can't wait, LOL. Guess I'll believe it when I see it.

Hahahahaha, so true.

> Regards-
> Mark
>
> Bongo-Fury
>
>
Anonymous
July 30, 2005 5:48:17 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

In a parallel universe, Anti-~misfit~ said exactly the opposite of:

> Sliver wrote:
>>
>> So there goes the marrowalk bug eh? And using shenk/bloodraven to
>> poof uber D. Interesting.
>
> What what what? About the Shenk/Bloodraven thing? You mean to make DC
> appear at their customary spots or is there a trick I'm missing?
>
> I've gotta stop panicking like this. ;-)

If you bring DClone next to shenk and kill shenk, DClone dies. I guess
it's probably the same thing with Blood Raven. For Shenk you spawn dc at
the wp above shenk, for Blood Raven damned if I know. Near as I can
figure you spawn at Stony Field then walk him all the way back but that
doesn't sound very convenient somehow.

*-) K.os
--
"He imagined for a moment his itinerary connecting up all the dots in the
sky like a child's numbered dots puzzle. He hoped that from some vantage
point in the Universe it might be seen to spell a very, very rude word" -
D. N. Adams
Anonymous
July 30, 2005 6:10:19 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

On Sat, 30 Jul 2005, "~misfit~" wrote:

>> Sliver wrote:
>> >
>> > So there goes the marrowalk bug eh? And using shenk/bloodraven to
>> > poof uber D. Interesting.
>>
>> What what what? About the Shenk/Bloodraven thing? You mean to make DC appear
>> at their customary spots or is there a trick I'm missing?
>>
>> I've gotta stop panicking like this. ;-)

yup it's PURE cheese.

You know that when you kill Shenk, everything in his vicinity dies.
Ditto BloodRaven.

So when DIABLO WALKS, take the wp near Eldritch, go to him (he becomes
DC) then retreat to Shenk, teasing DC with you. Then when DC is close
to Shenk, kill Shenk. DC dies, you've made a PURE CHEESE kill of DC.

Likewise, make DC take Bishibosh's place, make DC follow you to
BloodRaven's place, and kill BloodRaven.

This teaser they posted says this won't work anymore, and hints that it
might backfire.
Anonymous
July 30, 2005 6:28:52 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

After going to <http://tinyurl.com/2tnqw&gt;
Brian Brunner <brian.brunner@verizon.net.prophet> wrote

>On Sat, 30 Jul 2005, "~misfit~" wrote:
>
>>> Sliver wrote:
>>> >
>>> > So there goes the marrowalk bug eh? And using shenk/bloodraven to
>>> > poof uber D. Interesting.
>>>
>>> What what what? About the Shenk/Bloodraven thing? You mean to make DC appear
>>> at their customary spots or is there a trick I'm missing?
>>>
>>> I've gotta stop panicking like this. ;-)
>
>yup it's PURE cheese.
>
>You know that when you kill Shenk, everything in his vicinity dies.
>Ditto BloodRaven.
>
>So when DIABLO WALKS, take the wp near Eldritch, go to him (he becomes
>DC) then retreat to Shenk, teasing DC with you. Then when DC is close
>to Shenk, kill Shenk. DC dies, you've made a PURE CHEESE kill of DC.
>
>Likewise, make DC take Bishibosh's place, make DC follow you to
>BloodRaven's place, and kill BloodRaven.
>
>This teaser they posted says this won't work anymore, and hints that it
>might backfire.

Backfire? As in two Diablo Clones? :-o
--
no, i didn't forget the 'F's
http://www.geocities.com/jerk_o2002
http://www.geocities.com/nameless_mod
-My Diablo 2 Mod
http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/flash/bunny.php
-My theme song
Anonymous
July 30, 2005 7:21:50 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

"Mark" <bongofury@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:ztxGe.27$%a2.13@trndny03...
> Looks like Blizzard had announced that a new patch is coming:
> http://www.battle.net/
>
Okie dokes, I've done some scrutinizing. Screenshot 1 shows a battle with
DClone. There's a barb, and assassin and 2 mercs, with Battle Command,
Defiance and SALVATION auras. This suggests either a pally offscreen, or a
new a2 merc skill.

Never mind, next screenie shows a pally and druid too.

The Lilith shot is from A1, Crypt/Mauso/Tower, as previously mentioned.
Unless we get another area. Looks like she has innate CBF, as one shot shows
a zon's FA hitting her and she ain't blue.

http://www.blizzard.com/diablo2/screenshots/lilith-ss05... shows an a5
witch in the top right, and there is clearly an orange spitball. This
suggests either a new a5 area, some new backdrops, or increased monster
portability.

A lot of info here:
http://forums.diabloii.net/showthread.php?t=371254&page...
Most of it dumb. They don't even mention the possibility of Black for the CE
issue (though I agree it's Death Sentry)
Anonymous
July 30, 2005 8:58:12 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

On Sat, 30 Jul 2005, jerk-o wrote:

>> >This teaser they posted says this won't work anymore, and hints that it
>> >might backfire.
>>
>> Backfire? As in two Diablo Clones? :-o

If they both drop DC stuff, that's NO BACKFIRE, that's two WonderCharms
for the price of one!

(remember, half the trouble with alligator shoes is getting the
alligator out first...)
Anonymous
July 30, 2005 11:56:57 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

"Alex Holtz" <aholtz29@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1122676562.428354.104370@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
>
> Mark wrote:
> > Looks like Blizzard had announced that a new patch is coming:
> > http://www.battle.net/
>
> Andariel's twin sister, Lilith!
>
> > After a long wait, Blizzard expects to release Diablo II Expansion: Lord
of
> > Destruction V1.11 in August. A new secret quest will be in Hell games.
> > Players must search through the evil caves to the throne of destruction
to
> > find out the new Evil and kill it. This difficult quest will test the
> > ability of each player.
>
> I wonder why they don't implement that rumor monster, Reizarfg. There
> used to be a screenshot of it on the Arreat Summit. If still is, I
> can't find it anymore.

Because backwards, it is GFrazier, the grand idiot of Blizzard Inc.

Mickey
July 30, 2005 2:53:55 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

"Stephen van Ham" <svanham@xtra.co.nz> wrote in message
news:o kdle1hmgmuatg02u9n4kpid5avlcvi1cd@4ax.com...
> Long ago, in the world without shrimp, "Sliver"
> <Sliver@REMOVETHIShotmail.com>, supreme ruler of bunnies, hopped and
> flopped
> and said:
>
>>No going back then to get a nm merc if you decide the hell one isn't doing
>>what you
>>wanted. Guess we will see a lot less merc-lvling games. Not sure if I like
>>this idea or not. My damn merc's usually outlive me LOL
>
> I actually interpreted the change as the mercenary hire screens will no
> longer
> have a level cap on them, but rather all mercenaries listed will be within
> 5
> levels of the player (or the player who created the game, or whatever).
> So,
> for example, a level 80 character could go back to normal difficulty at
> any
> time and hire a level 75+ prayer mercenary, etc. Probably wishful
> thinking
> on my part.

I considered this myself and realized it made way too much sense therefore
ain't gonna happen LOL Kinda like the great march wp. I mean really why did
they include it when 9 times out of ten you just don't need to go there?
Then they got lazy in act 4. 2 wp's (not including the town one) and 3
quests. Just doesn't make sense when all acts have 6 quests and a full list
of wp's, unless you are planning on adding stuff in patches 8D

> On a personal note, I'd like to see baal "walks" or walks in other high
> level
> areas being just as rewarding, experience wise, as "telebaal" runs. When
> online "content" in public battle.net games is nothing more than standing
> in
> town and then waiting for a bot to send a portal from the throne room,
> there's
> something wrong.

I've participated in both. With a good team working together a baal walk can
be more rewarding than a telebaal game. Simple math more monsters killed
more xp. Problem is there are very few "good teams" working together.
Someone always feels the need to trigger half the map then run back to the
group freaking out cause they are getting clustered which brings a bloody
mob down on the rank and file and the death messages start spamming the
screen. Second problem is there are very few areas available to someone lvl
90+ to gain XP (without dying LOL). Having the max Alvl being 85 seems
rather screwy but then again there are many unbalanced issues in the game.
Your average gamer isn't going to see many of the high end drops ever, nor
will they get past 90 without resorting to following bots etc.

> Etc.
<snip>
I agree with all your etcs LOL

--
In a World full of Insanity
Here I Stand.
Sliver
Anonymous
July 30, 2005 4:35:50 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

Alex Holtz wrote:
> Mark wrote:
>> Looks like Blizzard had announced that a new patch is coming:
>> http://www.battle.net/
>
> Andariel's twin sister, Lilith!
>
>> After a long wait, Blizzard expects to release Diablo II Expansion:
>> Lord of Destruction V1.11 in August. A new secret quest will be in
>> Hell games. Players must search through the evil caves to the throne
>> of destruction to find out the new Evil and kill it. This difficult
>> quest will test the ability of each player.
>
> I wonder why they don't implement that rumor monster, Reizarfg. There
> used to be a screenshot of it on the Arreat Summit. If still is, I
> can't find it anymore.

I saw it a week or two ago. Hang on..............
Yep:

http://www.battle.net/diablo2exp/monsters/act5-reziarfg...
--
~misfit~ (panicking as usual) <g>
Anonymous
July 30, 2005 5:30:40 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

"Brian Brunner" <brian.brunner@verizon.net.prophet> wrote in message
news:p 7ole1p7838eg7tei8b86m1epb16omf4p0@4ax.com...
> On Sat, 30 Jul 2005, "~misfit~" wrote:
>
>>> Sliver wrote:
>>> >
>>> > So there goes the marrowalk bug eh? And using shenk/bloodraven to
>>> > poof uber D. Interesting.
>>>
>>> What what what? About the Shenk/Bloodraven thing? You mean to make DC
>>> appear
>>> at their customary spots or is there a trick I'm missing?
>>>
>>> I've gotta stop panicking like this. ;-)
>
> yup it's PURE cheese.
>
> You know that when you kill Shenk, everything in his vicinity dies.
> Ditto BloodRaven.
>
> So when DIABLO WALKS, take the wp near Eldritch, go to him (he becomes
> DC) then retreat to Shenk, teasing DC with you. Then when DC is close
> to Shenk, kill Shenk. DC dies, you've made a PURE CHEESE kill of DC.
>
> Likewise, make DC take Bishibosh's place, make DC follow you to
> BloodRaven's place, and kill BloodRaven.
>
> This teaser they posted says this won't work anymore, and hints that it
> might backfire.
>

I thought that was already fixed.

-Steve
Anonymous
July 30, 2005 9:57:55 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

On that special day, Alex Holtz, (aholtz29@yahoo.com) said...

> > Also, when
> > equipment has certain skill, but player doesn't have this skill, this skill
> > can not be used or added.
>
> Bye bye Enigma, CtA, and Chaos. That doesn't make sense, no Barbarians
> can use a Claw, and no Assassin can use the WW on a Chaos claw.

And a thing like Wolfhowl would make no sense any more.


Gabriele Neukam

Gabriele.Spamfighter.Neukam@t-online.de


--
Ah, Information. A property, too valuable these days, to give it away,
just so, at no cost.
Anonymous
July 30, 2005 9:57:55 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

On that special day, Chris Lansdell,
(clansdell@your.nf.clothes.sympatico.ca) said...

> http://www.blizzard.com/diablo2/screenshots/lilith-ss05... shows an a5
> witch in the top right, and there is clearly an orange spitball. This
> suggests either a new a5 area, some new backdrops, or increased monster
> portability.

The next screenshot shows a witch (she's blue). That might mean two
possibilities: either she is a necro revive and was chilled by Lilith
or she is a minion of Lilith.

The following screenshot indicates that Lilith has a poisonous attack,
just like Andy.

And another screenshot shows DC in *Tristram*. Someone must have
spawned Griswold as DC.


Gabriele Neukam

Gabriele.Spamfighter.Neukam@t-online.de


--
Ah, Information. A property, too valuable these days, to give it away,
just so, at no cost.
Anonymous
July 30, 2005 9:57:56 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

"Gabriele Neukam" <Gabriele.Spamfighter.Neukam@t-online.de> wrote in message
news:D cg80r$hff$01$1@news.t-online.com...
> On that special day, Alex Holtz, (aholtz29@yahoo.com) said...
>
> > > Also, when
> > > equipment has certain skill, but player doesn't have this skill, this
skill
> > > can not be used or added.
> >
> > Bye bye Enigma, CtA, and Chaos. That doesn't make sense, no Barbarians
> > can use a Claw, and no Assassin can use the WW on a Chaos claw.
>
> And a thing like Wolfhowl would make no sense any more.

Frankly, this is one change I won't believe until I see it, as it
invalidates SO many items and rune words.

Mickey
Anonymous
July 31, 2005 11:55:50 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

Long ago, in the world without shrimp, "Sliver"
<Sliver@REMOVETHIShotmail.com>, supreme ruler of bunnies, hopped and flopped
and said:

>> On a personal note, I'd like to see baal "walks" or walks in other high
>> level
>> areas being just as rewarding, experience wise, as "telebaal" runs. When
>> online "content" in public battle.net games is nothing more than standing
>> in
>> town and then waiting for a bot to send a portal from the throne room,
>> there's
>> something wrong.
>
>I've participated in both. With a good team working together a baal walk can
>be more rewarding than a telebaal game. Simple math more monsters killed
>more xp.

I'm talking about experience over time, not just the total amount of
experience.

>Problem is there are very few "good teams" working together.
>Someone always feels the need to trigger half the map then run back to the
>group freaking out cause they are getting clustered which brings a bloody
>mob down on the rank and file and the death messages start spamming the
>screen. Second problem is there are very few areas available to someone lvl
>90+ to gain XP (without dying LOL). Having the max Alvl being 85 seems
>rather screwy but then again there are many unbalanced issues in the game.
>Your average gamer isn't going to see many of the high end drops ever, nor
>will they get past 90 without resorting to following bots etc.

Hehe, true enough. Thank goodness for AGD games.


--
"My army shall destroy y- AHHHHHHHHH!"
Anonymous
July 31, 2005 8:25:10 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

"Mark" <bongofury@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:ztxGe.27$%a2.13@trndny03...

Blizzard is SO stupid. I can think of a one shot change that would put an
instant end to the Baal runs.

The real XP is with the minions. Make the minions such that the XP they
deliver is a factor of how many monsters are still alive in the keep. The
more that are still alive, the less XP you get. Clear the entire keep, and
they produce maximum XP. Of course, this would require someone at Blizzard
actually THINKING, something they seem allergic to.

Mickey
Anonymous
July 31, 2005 9:55:03 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

~misfit~ wrote:
> I couldn't agree more. If it wasn't for rushing a few mules through I'd
> never be able to get anywhere in HC. Oh, my skellimancer would but he's not
> very item-dependant. However my Zealot wouldn't have his Cresent Moon Phase
> Blade or Duress Scarab Husk. (I haven't found Heaven's Light or Guardian
> Angel despite risking my skellimancer's life on a daily basis MFing). The
> only way for me to get any halfway-decent gear is rune rushing and
> runewords. And it's not that damn easy! Ok, I can get mules to the forge in
> under 30 minutes in normal but I never do the normal forge anyway. Try
> rushing HC mules through NM with the close-quarters fighting in places like
> the maggot lair and the FE bug. Then try it in hell, remembering one
> momentary lapse of concentration can loose you your main character........

Misfit, I have a couple of Heaven's Lights spare I think. lmk if you
want one. not sure of the stats on them.

Not sure I understand why you need to rush so many mules through maggot
lair. They don't need that quest. Rush once with four mules. Each mule
gets a staff. Then each of those mules is rushed in separate rushes so
you don't have to keep doing the maggot lair. If that makes sense.

Even if you don't, only one mule has to pop in to grab a staff. So the
rusher kills everything in Coldwowrm's chcamber and one mule gets the
staff. (try not to use the skelimancer in the ML though).

Each required quest has a safe (ish) spot for a mule. The hardest "safe
spot" for a mule is Trav. Just be careful. Clear out behind, bring the
mule, quickly take out the Council from in front. Or TP in there.

I still think the best way to go about it is to just bring a mule (or
three) along any time you are questing.
Anonymous
August 1, 2005 12:04:02 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

~misfit~ wrote:
> chaliban wrote:
snippage throughout
> Hey there,
>
> > Misfit, I have a couple of Heaven's Lights spare I think. lmk if you
> > want one. not sure of the stats on them.
>
> That's mighty generous of you. Is this USWHCL?

Yes. Email me and I will put it on a mule for you sometime. Don't knwo
how much I can play over the next few days.
>
> So, I could take three mules through, get them all a staff, the use each
> mule with a staff to drag another couple of mules through? Act 2 is by far
> the slowest to get mules through, half the time spent on a mule push is in
> act 2.

yes. Although it means a lot of rushing through of the same difficulty
for each staff.
>
> > Even if you don't, only one mule has to pop in to grab a staff. So the
> > rusher kills everything in Coldwowrm's chcamber and one mule gets the
> > staff. (try not to use the skelimancer in the ML though).
>
> This is the way I currently do it. Backfired once when the summoner killed
> the mule with the staff. In hell too. That glacial spike (?) of his can
> shoot off-screen characters. Unfair. :-)

yes. and sometimes you kill the summoner with a stray bolt from your FO
or a FB that just misses what you were trying to hit. which means you
have to do arcane all over again.

> > Each required quest has a safe (ish) spot for a mule. The hardest
> > "safe spot" for a mule is Trav.
>
> For sure. The only two places that give me trouble are Trav and sometimes
> the summoner.
>
> > Just be careful. Clear out behind,
> > bring the mule, quickly take out the Council from in front. Or TP in
> > there.
>
> The council can cast hydra's behind. I lost a mule finding that out.

true. the rusher has to be quick.

> > I still think the best way to go about it is to just bring a mule (or
> > three) along any time you are questing.
>
> Yeah, could do. Trouble is, I always like to have a high-level looter in if
> I'm playing an area of similar level to the character and often have my
> enchantress and/or BO slave in there as well. I find it easier to just do
> dedicated mule rushes and have them ready in Harrogath for when a playing
> character is ready to kill Baal and go onto the next level.

My method is to cheese right from the start and get the character to
act 4 or 5 quickly with the mules in normal. Your chanter can chant and
be replaced by a mule. You won't lose any equip if you die, maybe a
twinked ravenclaw.

Regardless, IIRC, you have 4 connections. Questor and 3 mules. The
questor allows loot to all 3 mules. Questor dies. Only one mule has to
stay in the game. The other two leave and are replaced by BO/Chant and
(probably) your skelimancer. The area is cleared and the mule loots
your body.

> I might have to try to get a few mules through today in case the BCMs
> actually do get this patch implemented and it does have anti-rushing
> measures.

Well, if the patch comes, I'll probably be getting rid of all these
characters and just using new ones. Isn't it just like a ladder reset?
Anonymous
August 1, 2005 12:25:12 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

On Fri, 29 Jul 2005 21:47:11 GMT, Mark wrote:

> Looks like Blizzard had announced that a new patch is coming:
> http://www.battle.net/

Well, I'm surprised. I really didn't expect another patch, especially since
Blizzard had previously stated that 1.10 would be the last version. This
certainly adds substance to the D3 rumours ... and damn, I'm glad that
Blizzard is getting their head out of their WoW arse. :) 

M.
Anonymous
August 1, 2005 1:26:20 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 11:17:29 +1200, Stephen van Ham wrote:

> On a personal note, I'd like to see baal "walks" or walks in other high level
> areas being just as rewarding, experience wise, as "telebaal" runs. When
> online "content" in public battle.net games is nothing more than standing in
> town and then waiting for a bot to send a portal from the throne room, there's
> something wrong.

Very true. This was one of the reasons why I stopped playing online. There
was just no point in playing once I had beaten Baal, because nobody really
wanted to play in *any* act of Hell mode, and the only cooperative games I
could find were the "telebaal" types. Playing SP, on the other hand, had
the downside of Hell mode being incredibly tedious. Not difficult, just
slow and boring.

> Fixing the FE damage, in nightmare in particular, would be nice.

That, and adding all those realm-only runewords to the SP portion of the
game. The instant FE death that was fixed on the realms is *still* in SP,
which makes playing any sort of melee HC character in SP fairly pointless.

> Faster detection of dropped connections would be a nice bonus, and might
> convince me to play hardcore more.

Well, it's not too bad, really. I don't think I ever lost a HC character to
dropped connections (did lose one to a lag spike, though). If they shorten
this time too much, it could probably be exploited. I agree, though, that
it's annoying. HC is still fun, though ... you should try it. :)  (I think I
have been telling you this for two or three years now. *g*)

> Improved drops from sparkly chests would be great.

Agreed. In general, "surafce" adventuring should be encouraged. I'm not
advocating to make boss runs less lucrative (plenty of people like that),
but "just playing the game" should yield more rewards, too.

> Relaxed requirements on source items for crafting (e.g. let us blood craft
> with any armour or weapon we want) - bonus++++

Never made much sense to me that there are restrictions.

My biggest issue is monster randomization in Act5. I really hope they'll
remove this, but the odds of that happening are probably very low. I'd
generally like to see the tedium of 1.10 being a bit toned down. Not the
way it was in 1.09, but 1.10 is an overkill in Hell difficulty if you want
to also solo.

And I'm still in favour of level restrictions for NM and Hell, to
discourage Hell Forge runs/etc with mules. To me, this always seemed like
an exploit.

M.
August 1, 2005 1:26:21 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

"Michael Vondung" <mvondung@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1r2q4lx6325bc$.16gy5qxnxh5lm$.dlg@40tude.net...
>
> And I'm still in favour of level restrictions for NM and Hell, to
> discourage Hell Forge runs/etc with mules. To me, this always seemed like
> an exploit.

I couldn't possibly be more against this. While it 'might' discourage
rushing, it absolutely screws people like me who like (crazy) challenges.
Like killing Andy with a L1, Baal at L9, NM Diablo at L14, starting Hell in
1.10 at L42 (Guardian at L57). Stopping exploits is fine, but don't destroy
the game for people who like to 'push the envelope'. Better than level
restrictions would be eliminating getting credit for quests while in town
(or too far from the 'quest' area).

Of course 'rune rushing' is one of the few things that legit players can do
to (somewhat) level the playing field with dupers and botters. So I'm not
totally convinced that this 'feature' should be nerfed. If duping and
botting can be stopped (impossible), fine, then you can close the 'exploits'
available to the rest of us. But until then ...

Regards-
Mark

Bongo-Fury
Anonymous
August 1, 2005 4:37:15 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

On that special day, Mickey, (mickeyb@comcast.net) said...

> Clear the entire keep, and
> they produce maximum XP.

Only, if they fix that nasty lightning-damage-carries-over-to-physical-
damage-without-armour bug. If they hadn't done this, *together with
putting Black Souls into the keep 66% of the time, it would have been
much
more tolerable.


Gabriele Neukam

Gabriele.Spamfighter.Neukam@t-online.de


--
Ah, Information. A property, too valuable these days, to give it away,
just so, at no cost.
Anonymous
August 1, 2005 12:53:55 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

Long ago, in the world without shrimp, Michael Vondung <mvondung@gmail.com>,
supreme ruler of bunnies, hopped and flopped and said:

>On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 11:17:29 +1200, Stephen van Ham wrote:
>
>> On a personal note, I'd like to see baal "walks" or walks in other high level
>> areas being just as rewarding, experience wise, as "telebaal" runs. When
>> online "content" in public battle.net games is nothing more than standing in
>> town and then waiting for a bot to send a portal from the throne room, there's
>> something wrong.
>
>Very true. This was one of the reasons why I stopped playing online. There
>was just no point in playing once I had beaten Baal, because nobody really
>wanted to play in *any* act of Hell mode, and the only cooperative games I
>could find were the "telebaal" types. Playing SP, on the other hand, had
>the downside of Hell mode being incredibly tedious. Not difficult, just
>slow and boring.

The AGD community on USWest (both SC and HC now, although there's some
timezone issues with HC for me, and maybe you too) is pretty good in this
regard. Most people seem quite happy to quest through the "old fashioned
way" if one wants to.

>> Fixing the FE damage, in nightmare in particular, would be nice.

>That, and adding all those realm-only runewords to the SP portion of the
>game. The instant FE death that was fixed on the realms is *still* in SP,
>which makes playing any sort of melee HC character in SP fairly pointless.

Let's also throw in a shared stash, like some have discussed here. And for
the online version, make it across all characters on an account. And while
we're at it, increasing the character limit from eight to something higher,
say, 20 or 30, would be nice. At the very least, increasing the friends list
limit from 25 to say 50 accounts, would be useful.

>> Faster detection of dropped connections would be a nice bonus, and might
>> convince me to play hardcore more.

>Well, it's not too bad, really. I don't think I ever lost a HC character to
>dropped connections (did lose one to a lag spike, though). If they shorten
>this time too much, it could probably be exploited. I agree, though, that
>it's annoying. HC is still fun, though ... you should try it. :)  (I think I
>have been telling you this for two or three years now. *g*)

Really, it is that bad. A lot of my SC characters suffer their first (and in
some cases, only) death from this. The length of time is certainly a lot
longer than the "few seconds" that some people come up with when I mention
this. I know this for sure for two reasons. A) short and I tested some of
the scenarios, and some of them were in the 40-45 second ballpark, B) some of
the characters in question are built to stand in monster packs for a "few
seconds" without a death (heck, if they didn't, they'd be dying in general
play). Like, I had a level 97 javazon killed by shenk's pack just as got
down the steps (in 1.09!) from a dropped internet connection. She most
CERTAINLY would not have been slain in a "few seconds". A couple of my
sorceresses this season have suffered their first deaths while fighting
skeleton packs in the Pit (with no archers around). In both cases, they were
sorceresses with high life totals and max block. Barbarian in act 2 normal
with well over 300 life at the time -> slain by skeletons during a dropped
connection. Etc. Another sorceress -> slain in shenk's garden (1.10 this
time) - again, she was a country mile from the monsters when the connection
dropped, and the mercenary was at full health.

In most cases, it's dropped connections in situations where the mercenary
can't leech life that the problem occurs, or places where the mercenary was
probably overwhelmed 20 to one with no backup.

Another repeatable occurance is a death by dropped connection during a solo
minion run, usually against the fourth or last pack.

I've considered upgrading from a dialup connection to broadband on many
occasions, but from what Misfit has written, I'm not convinced it would be
that much better (although it's lag spikes rather than connection drops that
are the problem in his case, I think, same result, though). It might sound
like my connection is dropping every other minute, but in fact it's simply a
case of enormous amounts of time spent online (I don't play SP mode all that
much), with the disconnections spread out across that.

When I do decide to switch to broadband, it'll be for downloading half gig
video files, not for D2, hehe.

>> Improved drops from sparkly chests would be great.

>Agreed. In general, "surafce" adventuring should be encouraged. I'm not
>advocating to make boss runs less lucrative (plenty of people like that),
>but "just playing the game" should yield more rewards, too.

Yes.

Another problem is that with the content being relatively static, with each
game always has the same maps, just shuffled around a bit in terms of their
layout, that it's all so known to most people, and therefore less interesting
(no surprises). I'll never forget the first day that I played the expansion
pack, when there was this whole new act to explore. Great fun.

>> Relaxed requirements on source items for crafting (e.g. let us blood craft
>> with any armour or weapon we want) - bonus++++

>Never made much sense to me that there are restrictions.

>My biggest issue is monster randomization in Act5.

Hehe, you find it odd that flayers turn up in the worldstone keep? It's just
an enclosed version of the flayer jungle, but with stone walls and no jungle.
Makes perfect sense to me.

>I really hope they'll remove this, but the odds of that happening are probably very low. I'd
>generally like to see the tedium of 1.10 being a bit toned down. Not the
>way it was in 1.09, but 1.10 is an overkill in Hell difficulty if you want
>to also solo.

Hmmm, I must be used to it now, because I don't find 1.10 tedious at all,
except in rare instances of playing some melee characters that have a single
target attack (it certainly seems a lot less tedious than the betas were).
Caster builds I consider at this point to be way too easy (well, most... a
singer isn't exactly a power build), and many variants get through hell at lot
easier than might be expected. Some of this is probably a gear issue,
though. Reducing the life points of 1.10 monsters at this stage would bring
on a 1.09 type situation (most areas get mowed down with ease, even solo).
Making gear more easier to obtain without boss running, is probably the key.
So things like the chest drops, etc.

I wish rare items rolled with GOOD mods a lot more often than they do, because
I find rares to be far more interesting than uniques and sets.

>And I'm still in favour of level restrictions for NM and Hell, to
>discourage Hell Forge runs/etc with mules. To me, this always seemed like
>an exploit.

Your vision of what the game should be, is the same as mine... a continual
romp around all areas of the game, killing foes and getting items, not
dragging mules around to the "high spots" as quickly as possible, or
teleporting past all the content to get to the act bosses (it's an unfortunate
reality of gearing up some builds though, in the current version, though - I'm
currently doing a bit of this to collect specific items for a couple of non
paladin zeal builds). It's akin to the difference between reading a book or
merely reading the last page over and over. I'm fairly burned out from
reading the book over and over at this point (having 20+ characters in or
through hell this season alone), but I'm hopeful the developments in August,
whatever they may turn out to be, will be sufficient to respark my interest.

I'm not sure I'd go as far as putting level restrictions on the difficulties,
since some people enjoy pushing the envelope in solo play, but I'd certainly
put some restrictions on high level characters partying up with much lower
level ones.


--
"My army shall destroy y- AHHHHHHHHH!"
Anonymous
August 1, 2005 1:00:50 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

Long ago, in the world without shrimp, "Mark" <bongofury@verizon.net>, supreme
ruler of bunnies, hopped and flopped and said:

>Of course 'rune rushing' is one of the few things that legit players can do
>to (somewhat) level the playing field with dupers and botters. So I'm not
>totally convinced that this 'feature' should be nerfed. If duping and
>botting can be stopped (impossible), fine, then you can close the 'exploits'
>available to the rest of us. But until then ...

I wasn't aware that people were doing this to level the playing field with
dupes and botters. I thought they were doing this because the current drop
system means it often takes thousands of hours play before you see a high rune
drop, and people would rather have a chance at them every few hours play
instead.

The rune drops DO seem improved from 1.09 though, where the highest rune I
ever saw drop was an Um, while in 1.10 I've seen a Mal or two, an Ist, a few
Sur, a Lo and a Cham drop in general play (and an Ohm if I include team play).
But maybe Blizzard need to tweak the drop rates some more to keep things
interesting for people.

I'd also be in favour of more runewords that have just ONE high rune in them.
As it is, a lot of times when I see a high rune drop, it's somewhat of a non
event because I know I'm unlikely to see the other one or two high runes drop
that I need to actually do something with the first rune.


--
"My army shall destroy y- AHHHHHHHHH!"
Anonymous
August 1, 2005 1:07:20 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

Long ago, in the world without shrimp, "Mickey" <mickeyb@comcast.net>, supreme
ruler of bunnies, hopped and flopped and said:

>"Mark" <bongofury@verizon.net> wrote in message
>news:ztxGe.27$%a2.13@trndny03...
>
>Blizzard is SO stupid. I can think of a one shot change that would put an
>instant end to the Baal runs.
>
>The real XP is with the minions. Make the minions such that the XP they
>deliver is a factor of how many monsters are still alive in the keep. The
>more that are still alive, the less XP you get. Clear the entire keep, and
>they produce maximum XP. Of course, this would require someone at Blizzard
>actually THINKING, something they seem allergic to.

I'd like to see them lighten the experience nerfs for high level characters
(actually, I suppose a lot of people would), as well. It's silly that my
level 92 sorceress only gets about one thousand experience (give or take) for
a non-minion enemy in the worldstone keep in a solo game, and even sillier
that my 97 barbarian gets a couple of hundred experience for an entire boss
pack (yeah, like he's even going to make his experience bar MOVE unless it's
in an eight player telebaal run).

Actually, it's sillier in general that leveling up is faster (and easier) in
multiplayer than it is solo, although I suppose some of this was to encourage
people to make one eight player games rather than eight one player games
online.

I realise the current ynerfs are in place to keep the ladder runners from
getting to 99 too quickly, but let's face it, they're going to get to 99 no
matter Blizzard have in place, and that the ladder will always be about who
focuses on one character for the longest time, something I have no interest in
(playing just one character).


--
"My army shall destroy y- AHHHHHHHHH!"
Anonymous
August 1, 2005 10:12:13 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

~misfit~ wrote:
>> I might have to try to get a few mules through today in case the BCMs
> >> actually do get this patch implemented and it does have anti-rushing
> >> measures.
> >
> > Well, if the patch comes, I'll probably be getting rid of all these
> > characters and just using new ones. Isn't it just like a ladder reset?
>
> Don't say that! I've only just started to accumulate some 'wealth' in HC.

Sorry about that.
Anonymous
August 1, 2005 11:24:12 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

On that special day, ~misfit~, (misfit61nz@yahoot.co.nz) said...

> (I haven't found Heaven's Light or Guardian
> Angel despite risking my skellimancer's life on a daily basis MFing)

(hands misfit a handkerchief) Well, I've found one, but in Single-
Player. And thankfully my pally is meanwhile good enough to wear it,
cause if Patch 1.11 makes ATMA fail, how am I supposed to ever transfer
it when it is about time?

I pray that Tenshi makes another version, so that we can still use his
great program to ease all that muling.


Gabriele Neukam

Gabriele.Spamfighter.Neukam@t-online.de


--
Ah, Information. A property, too valuable these days, to give it away,
just so, at no cost.
Anonymous
August 2, 2005 12:41:24 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

On Mon, 1 Aug 2005, "~misfit~" wrote:

>> t can take half that time
>> to go around all the machines rejoining (they usually say "lost connection
>> to battlenet) and re-partying. As you know I'm an invalid with a bad back

Let me teach you a thing about being lazy.

KVM switch.

With this gizmo, I have 4 machines and one keyboard/video/mouse hardware
set sitting in front of me. To switch machines I punch the button on
the KVM switch. Getting 4 machines onto b.net and getting 3 mules &
main character into the same game is trivial.

KVM switches are pretty cheap.
Anonymous
August 2, 2005 1:05:51 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

"~misfit~" <misfit61nz@yahoot.co.nz> wrote in message
news:42eed386@news.orcon.net.nz...
> Woot!!! No re-set as yet! However, my HC MF necro is a lot more vulnerable
> without the "Marrowwalk feature".

The great thing about a sunmmoner necro,, the Marrows were just a bonus. My
nec still has a 2k bone spirit and 500 damage absorb bone armor even with
the bug gone, and he can STILL steamroll over anything in his path. I love
summoners.

> --
> ~misfit~
>
>
Anonymous
August 2, 2005 2:00:04 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

Steve W wrote on Sat, 30 Jul 2005 13:30:40 GMT:
>
> "Brian Brunner" <brian.brunner@verizon.net.prophet> wrote in message
> news:p 7ole1p7838eg7tei8b86m1epb16omf4p0@4ax.com...

> > You know that when you kill Shenk, everything in his vicinity dies.
> > Ditto BloodRaven.
> >
> > So when DIABLO WALKS, take the wp near Eldritch, go to him (he becomes
> > DC) then retreat to Shenk, teasing DC with you. Then when DC is close
> > to Shenk, kill Shenk. DC dies, you've made a PURE CHEESE kill of DC.

> I thought that was already fixed.

It was fixed over a year ago (but they didn't fix the one where you spawn
DC at the Hellforge, lure him into the CS, then open all the seals and
kill the 3 seal bosses).


--
"Ruleless 'law' will be a political weapon and control of the
judiciary will therefore be a political prize. 'Democracy' will
consist of the chaotic struggle to influence decision makers who are
not responsive to elections." -- Robert Bork
Anonymous
August 2, 2005 4:01:08 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

~misfit~ wrote:
> >>
> >> Don't say that! I've only just started to accumulate some 'wealth'
> >> in HC.
> >
> > Sorry about that.
>
> Woot!!! No re-set as yet! However, my HC MF necro is a lot more vulnerable
> without the "Marrowwalk feature". To think, all those extra points I put in
> strength so he could wear them could have gone into Vitality instead. He
> could 'make do' with War Travellers as he's an MFer, they have a lower
> strength requirement.
>
> BTW, thanks for the Heaven's Light.

What!?! No reset? But that's the only reason I gave you the HL!!!!!
I'll need it back now ;) 

Fortunately, I refuse to wear marrows on my necs. :)  Of course, that
may be whey they tend to have their deeds remembered.
Anonymous
August 2, 2005 9:01:42 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

"~misfit~" <misfit61nz@yahoot.co.nz> wrote in message
news:42ef3c06@news.orcon.net.nz...
> It could indeed. I'm bummed out as I bought some Marrows a couple days ago
> for my hybrid Golemlord/Boner and, although he's still only level 64 and
> can't wear them, I've been pumping his strength for the last eight
level-ups
> in preparation. The only other benefit Marrows have for a necro is + to
> skelly mastery and he's not raising skellys so that's a waste of points
that
> could have gone into vitaility.

This just in, adding a point to Prison will not give you the bonus back. Hit
92 a few minutes ago.

> --
> ~misfit~
>
>
Anonymous
August 2, 2005 6:22:09 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

Long ago, in the world without shrimp, "Shiflet" <rshiflet@charter.net>,
supreme ruler of bunnies, hopped and flopped and said:

>
>"~misfit~" <misfit61nz@yahoot.co.nz> wrote in message
>news:42eed386@news.orcon.net.nz...
>> Woot!!! No re-set as yet! However, my HC MF necro is a lot more vulnerable
>> without the "Marrowwalk feature".
>
>The great thing about a sunmmoner necro,, the Marrows were just a bonus. My
>nec still has a 2k bone spirit and 500 damage absorb bone armor even with
>the bug gone, and he can STILL steamroll over anything in his path. I love
>summoners.

I was, ummm, examining my boner earlier, and he doesn't look too shabby after
the change either. Then again, he wasn't built specifically around the
marrows, either. Dalai's fireball amazon, on the other hand, looks like a
fish out of water.


--
"My army shall destroy y- AHHHHHHHHH!"
Anonymous
August 2, 2005 9:41:55 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

After going to <http://tinyurl.com/2tnqw&gt;
"Mark" <bongofury@verizon.net> wrote

>Looks like Blizzard had announced that a new patch is coming:
>http://www.battle.net/
>
>No word on what it entails. But this was posted on another forum from a
>Taiwanese site (http://www.unalis.com.tw/news/NewsDetail.aspx?ID=319):
>Dialbo II load of destruction V1.11 will be out in August.
>
>After a long wait, Blizzard expects to release Diablo II Expansion: Lord of
>Destruction V1.11 in August. A new secret quest will be in Hell games.
>Players must search through the evil caves to the throne of destruction to
>find out the new Evil and kill it. This difficult quest will test the
>ability of each player.
>
>In v1.11, besides the new quest, player vs player will be cruder. For
>example, there will be no time delay when casting town portal, which was for
>player to have more time prepare for a fight or escape. The paladin cannot
>use blessed hammer in town to avoid being harmed when coming out of the
>town. When fighting the uber Diablo, be careful of not let Shenk or Blood
>raven die. This will make killing uber Diablo more difficult. Also, when
>equipment has certain skill, but player doesn't have this skill, this skill
>can not be used or added.
>
>Player doesn't need to worry. In V1.11, there are 10 more rune words. The
>new equipment that never before seen can be found in some boss monsters. For
>merc, player can hire the merc only 1- 5 level lower than player. Mer can
>gain experience more quickly and can live longer to help player.
>**************************************
>
>So given past Blizzard performance, we should get the patch in August 2007.
>I can't wait, LOL. Guess I'll believe it when I see it.

Didn't Blizzard say that 1.10 would be the last patch for Diablo 2?
--
no, i didn't forget the 'F's
http://www.geocities.com/jerk_o2002
http://www.geocities.com/nameless_mod
-My Diablo 2 Mod
http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/flash/bunny.php
-My theme song
Anonymous
August 3, 2005 12:34:47 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo (More info?)

Long ago, in the world without shrimp, jerk-o <jerk-o@yomomma.org>, supreme
ruler of bunnies, hopped and flopped and said:

>Didn't Blizzard say that 1.10 would be the last patch for Diablo 2?

What I thought they said was that 1.10 would be the last patch with major
balance changes. And I don't consider marrowwalks fix to be a major balance
change (I realise you didn't mention marrows, but someone is bound to), since
I play so many build, and the people I game with play so many builds (although
losing trangs+moonfall at the same time was annoying). The marrows change is
simply a drop in the ocean for us. For others, I guess it might be considered
a major change.


--
"My army shall destroy y- AHHHHHHHHH!"
!