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Final Fantasy 13 coming to 360, PS3 why not PC?!

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November 25, 2009 11:19:54 PM

currently the release date for FFXIII is march 9th in the west and rumored for Xbox 360, confirmed for PS3 but i just dont see why they don't release it for PC? the GPU power on newer PC's are stronger than that within consoles (if you even think of turning this into a console vs pc gaming thread I'm closing it!)
especially with the increase in harddrive space on both consoles and PC's you could do a massive install for the game off 4 or so DVD's and run it just like running the old final fantasies in the series. I see no reason to not release it on the PC market.

anyone know why?
November 26, 2009 8:44:50 PM

couple of reasons i can think of,mainly based on opinion, but this one is fact;an ea spokesman in the summer along with the owners of crytech have pretty much said anyone who games on a pc has a high intellegence and technical ability and thus will pirate their games.[as if noones chipped their xbox wii or ps3] and thus will not produce games solely for the pc,and potentially not at all.

secondly - development and optimisation takes many man hours , as well as complying with guidelines,ratings and also online security,should there be any features/multiplayer.forcing costs up.

thirdly;with a few exceptions generally pc gaming is that little bit more in depth and thus we expect more content or obvious graphical improvements , and that can make or break game sales.

i would love nothing more than a dx11 version of ff7 fully polished with every graphical bell and whistle on it , but realistically you can see the "justified cos i bought it on the ps1" piracy excuse.its the sad state the world of gaming is in.
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November 26, 2009 8:59:47 PM

Piracy is an excuse they use to concentrate on the highly profitable console software market. Simply put, PC games don't sell like they used to. (Not inciting a console vs pc war honest) There used to be a much bigger gap between consoles and PCs than there is now (pc still obviously outperforms the consoles graphically) so the gamers who may have been enticed to go the PC route because of the superior graphics, don't have the contrast decision to make as they would have 5-10-15 years ago.

It is no secret that PC games sales have been in steady decline. I believe Piracy is not to blame (no study has ever attempted to gauge the true amount of sales loss, as opposed to the standard 1 pirated copy = 1 lost sale cover story) but the relatively closed gap between console and PC performance and technology.
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December 2, 2009 11:03:07 PM

i totally agree with PC games not selling as well as they did a few years ago, the console market is just a broader market with casual gamers and select titles having hardcore gamers that PC market is limited to now.

the silly thing is piracy is quite easy to prevent, go back to cartridges, costs roughly the same to buy a 40GB harddrive now(like 35$) that you would spend on a typical game on a DVD that has 1/10th the storage.
i could see a ton of fans be extremely pleased to see harddrive based games you never need to store on your system, carry it around to a friend's house to use there. etc
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December 3, 2009 10:55:44 AM

Frankly, Square simply doesn't release anything on the PC, and I doubt they have any significant experiance with the platform. Just getting off of Sony is a huge step for them at this point...
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December 3, 2009 4:32:22 PM

The Last Remnant. Never should have been released for PC, and I actually paid for it, ugh. Notice my ATI card in my sig. My rectum has never really healed.
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December 3, 2009 5:46:49 PM

I doubt it's piracy since they would still net positive sales by releasing on the PC even if piracy is high. PC piracy isn't going to cut into console sale more than what PC sales will more than make up for.

I also doubt it's a development thing. I remember reading something a while back where the development tools being used for this game actually made cross platform very easy and thus why it was coming to the 360 for the first time. I could understand if it was PS3 exclusive but if they put the work into getting it on the 360 it's not that much more to put it on the PC.

My guess; either they will release it on the PC but just haven't announced it yet and/or it might come out later. Or they are holding off releasing FF13 on the PC thinking that it might cut into the more profitable FF14 sales for the PC. If you haven't noticed Blizzard seems to have taken that attitude with WoW versus their other titles.
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December 3, 2009 5:55:39 PM

What was the last FF title released for the PC (not counting FF11), FF8? I wouldn't hold my breath, although the arguement that the 360 is essentially a PC and the game is being made for it, gives some hope to a PC port.
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December 3, 2009 6:16:11 PM

Piracy is one of the issues but it hurts the PC market both ways, and the fact that many users are buying consoles as opposed to a gaming pc, the game library is much bigger, they do not have to go through the hassle of building, updating drivers, dealing with faulty hardware, and the most important part, the pricing and economy. Back in 2001 there was a much bigger PC audience compared to now. And the fact that all PS1/PS2/Xbox/360 games are being pirated at this moment makes it even worse for the PC crowd. Many just prefer to buy a console and not have to deal with an over-priced pre-built pc. Consoles are much more user friendly than PC's, you just plug n play...

Look at it this way, if you come up with a game that is extremely popular on a console, would you port the game to a PC when in fact you know that it will be pirated by 65% of PC users? If a company does not see a marginal profit, they are beter off not making the game for the PC in the first place. Look at Battlefield 2, one of the most pirated PC games of all time. We had no Bad Company for PC, now all of a sudden there is such a high demand for BC2 PC-wise since the console version sucked and did not meet expectations.
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December 3, 2009 6:23:00 PM

JofaMang said:
What was the last FF title released for the PC (not counting FF11), FF8? I wouldn't hold my breath, although the arguement that the 360 is essentially a PC and the game is being made for it, gives some hope to a PC port.

I just did a quick search and I found some of the information on this. Square Enix is using "PC based Crystal Tools development environment" which as I remember reading in a separate article meant that essentially any game developed in that environment was essentially PC ready by default. It was just a matter of compiling it for the PC or something like that and obviously some optimization and additional testing/debugging. But that's why Last Remnant was a PC title and I'm sure it plays into the next FF MMO. So it's really not a development issue at all. So it's really a matter of deciding whether or not it's worth trying to sell the game on the PC. Historically FF games have not been great successes on the PC even when they are seen as huge successes on the consoles. Not releasing it on the PC may be a decision to protect the "integrity" of the game if they don't think there's enough sales out there to warrant getting bad reviews for a game that will be a blockbuster on the consoles.
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December 3, 2009 6:34:09 PM

OvrClkr said:
...
Back in 2001 there was a much bigger PC audience compared to now.
...


I don't think that's actually true. PC as a platform had a larger percentage of the gaming market in 2001 and has lost a lot of that market share to the newer consoles but PC gaming has actually grown a lot over the past decade. There are more PC gamers and more PC games are being sold now than ten years ago. It gets overlooked because the consoles have grown so much faster but the PC has not regressed as a gaming platform.
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December 3, 2009 6:41:45 PM

purplerat said:
I just did a quick search and I found some of the information on this. Square Enix is using "PC based Crystal Tools development environment" which as I remember reading in a separate article meant that essentially any game developed in that environment was essentially PC ready by default. It was just a matter of compiling it for the PC or something like that and obviously some optimization and additional testing/debugging. But that's why Last Remnant was a PC title and I'm sure it plays into the next FF MMO. So it's really not a development issue at all. So it's really a matter of deciding whether or not it's worth trying to sell the game on the PC. Historically FF games have not been great successes on the PC even when they are seen as huge successes on the consoles. Not releasing it on the PC may be a decision to protect the "integrity" of the game if they don't think there's enough sales out there to warrant getting bad reviews for a game that will be a blockbuster on the consoles.


I can also see the point that there may be PC owners out there who would pirate this title if available for the PC, but want it bad enough to pay for the console version if no PC was available. This of course doesn't really completley apply to the 360, being so heavily and successfully hacked for piracy, though I am not claiming that all 360s are hacked, heh.
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December 3, 2009 6:45:45 PM

JofaMang said:
I can also see the point that there may be PC owners out there who would pirate this title if available for the PC, but want it bad enough to pay for the console version if no PC was available. This of course doesn't really completley apply to the 360, being so heavily and successfully hacked for piracy, though I am not claiming that all 360s are hacked, heh.

I don't think that happens as often as developers might want us to think. I'm sure some people do do that, but not more than what the PC sales will easily negate.
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December 3, 2009 6:50:20 PM

purplerat said:
I don't think that's actually true. PC as a platform had a larger percentage of the gaming market in 2001 and has lost a lot of that market share to the newer consoles but PC gaming has actually grown a lot over the past decade. There are more PC gamers and more PC games are being sold now than ten years ago. It gets overlooked because the consoles have grown so much faster but the PC has not regressed as a gaming platform.


What I meant is more PC audience compared to the console audience. The only reason we have so many PC gamers is due to games like WoW and a few popular FPS games, other than that their aint that many as opposed to ALL the console owners, and this pertains not only to 360/PS3 users but to the Wii as well. Nintendo has outsold both MS and Sony with their latest console. In terms of games sold, the console market has outsold the PC market by almost 2000%...
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December 3, 2009 7:04:31 PM

OvrClkr said:
What I meant is more PC audience compared to the console audience. The only reason we have so many PC gamers is due to games like WoW and a few popular FPS games, other than that their aint that many as opposed to ALL the console owners, and this pertains not only to 360/PS3 users but to the Wii as well. Nintendo has outsold both MS and Sony with their latest console. In terms of games sold, the console market has outsold the PC market by almost 2000%...

That has more to do with consoles, especially the Wii, gaining in popularity amongst people who weren't previously gamers than PC gamers jumping over to consoles. However I think the casual and online game market on PCs is gaining amongst that demograph and it probably doesn't get noticed as much because a lot of the games are free and/or ad based. It may sound stupid but over Thanksgiving dinner I heard half my family, most of whom never play video games, talking about some Facebook game they were all hooked on. Like I said it sounds stupid and I know most hardcore gamers gawk at the idea of even considering those types of apps as games but it is a growing market and may play a big part in the future of PC gaming. If nothing else it does open up more people to the idea of using their PC as a gaming platform and it also opens up developers to what is necessary to gain a larger audience on the PC.
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December 3, 2009 7:55:51 PM

i know right now my rig will last me at least 5 - 6 years with maybe a graphics card upgrade down the line if it is truly necessary for a Dx12 (running Dx11 now so that will be at least 3-4 years of games)

funny slightly tangent question is how the hell are they going to fit FFXIII on dvd's for the 360? it's running at least one bluray right now (hopefully 2) which is the equivalent of 4-5 DVD's of material.

which of course begs the question: who doesnt want to be playing FFXIII across 3 monitors with eyefinity? i have 2 right now with a third on the way after borrowing a buddy's and it just doesnt feel the same without the peripheral vision of enemies sneaking up from the sides.
or go Nvidia's route and make it 3d, i could see a huge push for both companies being able to traverse sprawling environments as you watch an airship dive off a cliff seeing the edge just under your chin as it goes.
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December 3, 2009 8:00:32 PM

The FF games on the PS1 had something like 3 or more discs. So it wouldn't be too absurd for something similar on the 360.
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December 3, 2009 8:01:54 PM

yeah, by far the best FF i've played was 9 which had 4 disks and played for like 80 hours or so without goign too deep into side questing
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December 3, 2009 8:02:08 PM

purplerat said:
That has more to do with consoles, especially the Wii, gaining in popularity amongst people who weren't previously gamers than PC gamers jumping over to consoles. However I think the casual and online game market on PCs is gaining amongst that demograph and it probably doesn't get noticed as much because a lot of the games are free and/or ad based. It may sound stupid but over Thanksgiving dinner I heard half my family, most of whom never play video games, talking about some Facebook game they were all hooked on. Like I said it sounds stupid and I know most hardcore gamers gawk at the idea of even considering those types of apps as games but it is a growing market and may play a big part in the future of PC gaming. If nothing else it does open up more people to the idea of using their PC as a gaming platform and it also opens up developers to what is necessary to gain a larger audience on the PC.


Yea, I just hope PC gaming can last cause it does look like the consoles are taking over.... :( 
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December 3, 2009 8:08:27 PM

Until PC gaming can offer the ease of use and affordability of the Console market, while maintaining DRM and NOT trampling on the rights of PC owners at the same time, this is a situation that will not change directions. PC gaming has enjoyed a very strong graphical and technical advantage over consoles for a long time, and this alone has not stemmed the slow bleed out of the PC gaming market.
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December 3, 2009 8:17:31 PM

JofaMang said:
Until PC gaming can offer the ease of use and affordability of the Console market, while maintaining DRM and NOT trampling on the rights of PC owners at the same time, this is a situation that will not change directions. PC gaming has enjoyed a very strong graphical and technical advantage over consoles for a long time, and this alone has not stemmed the slow bleed out of the PC gaming market.

That's where I think looking at some of these Facebook type apps (albeit I've never played one) and other casual games will be the key to PC gaming and probably gaming in general. All the things you listed are basically achieved by the types of games I just mentioned. They are easy to use, don't require expensive or special hardware, they are cheap and don't have piracy issues and they are popular. If somebody figures out how to merge those elements of those games with the more advanced elements of what we traditionally think of as PC gaming they will make a lot of money.
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December 3, 2009 8:35:04 PM

Perhaps Larabee will be something special? Bringing high graphical prowess with OEM reliability and price? Suddenly your average surfing box might be capable of decent 3d gaming? I am not convinced this will be how it happens, just throwing it out there.
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December 3, 2009 8:36:27 PM

I still think the best option for anti-piracy is force the player to log in online every time they play. and even then it's "possible" to pirate it but you log the IP to the user name and you're all set. 99% of people have internet access who would end up playing these games and have a system to run them so it just makes sense to force that into the system. without online confirmation from the server saying yes this IP matches the disk that this game was first loaded to it shuts the system down and tracks the IP for legal consequences.

they want to stop piracy, thats how you do it. and the people who want to play the game will buy the game because thats who Square is marketing to anyway.
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December 3, 2009 11:29:14 PM

Ghost_Roadie said:
I still think the best option for anti-piracy is force the player to log in online every time they play. and even then it's "possible" to pirate it but you log the IP to the user name and you're all set. 99% of people have internet access who would end up playing these games and have a system to run them so it just makes sense to force that into the system. without online confirmation from the server saying yes this IP matches the disk that this game was first loaded to it shuts the system down and tracks the IP for legal consequences.

they want to stop piracy, thats how you do it. and the people who want to play the game will buy the game because thats who Square is marketing to anyway.


There are games that have tried this. Hackers work around it. There requires a drastically different approach to DRM to have any real influence on being able to hack it without infringing upon the customer.

What if you own a laptop, and you want to play your games on the go (like I did when my job had me travelling a lot) then too bad, your IPs don't match up. What if you don't have an internet connection? This is not totally impossible, nor likely, but denying people who don't have an internet connection isn't right, either.

I kind of like how Sony has designed BD and the developers have grown its protections. Game data is replicated redundantly on the disk. The game is coded to look for the closest known location for needed data, having a positive effect on loading times. What this has also done, is made it so that a game would require a drastic rewriting of code to use a ripped version void of the redundant information, OR a 25/50gb iso of the original BD. Until 50gb becomes a trivial download size, this effectively reduces the popularity of pirating. If you burned the iso to a BD, you pay sony, as they make more money off a blank BD than the royalties off that copy of the game, without all the middlemen taking their cut of that $60 price tag.

How many of you have heard of successful and popular ways to hack a PS3 to play pirated titles?
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December 4, 2009 2:25:50 AM

without a flashed bios which takes days of coding it's really hard to pirate BD's that and the cost to pirate games to disks is pretty expensive needing a burner (150-200+$ and disks which can run for upwards of 10$ a disk for high quality)

i'm hoping most PC titles go to BD to help stop piracy, especially with downloaded games, who wants to spend 10 days downloading a 50GB game?
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December 4, 2009 2:28:12 AM

^^ that will not happen, in a year or two BD's will be dirt cheap just like the DVD-R all over again =)
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December 4, 2009 2:34:40 AM

yes but downloads will still decrease dramatically (hopefully) simply due to the sheer size of the files that would have to be created to copy.

can't see the point right now to pirate BD's at 8x writing it takes like 14 hours to burn one disk.
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December 4, 2009 2:46:08 AM

14 hours? Dude it all depends on the size of the file. Not all games consume the full 25 or 50Gb. And yes it does take alot of time to burn a BD, but like I said as time goes by the BD's will get cheaper and we will have faster BD burners... It's a matter of time before BD pirating goes mainstream. It's inevitable, later on there will be something better than blue-ray and so forth, like a never ending cycle.....
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December 4, 2009 2:53:05 AM

i know, I'm just holding onto the last grips of hope that consoles will die out and PC gaming will take over

especially with the current state of things turning all consoles into Wii copies and PC gaming going into less stick waggling and more towards 3D and high realism rendering

(i just turned my own thread into pc vs console without intending to)
bottom line, there needs to be more anti-piracy efforts and more people not being dicks pirating games ruining the market for the rest of us who buy games
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December 4, 2009 4:26:42 AM

Pirates are not, and have not been the problem. People not buying games, is. They are not connected at the hip like the anti-piracy schills would have have you believe when they limit the installs your can perform on the game you just paid for, or if they have to justify not producing a port that would be fun on the PC.
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December 4, 2009 4:36:06 AM

i agree with the licence limit on most games. you just have to launch an e-mail asking for another install and they send you one
having to justify not porting a game is big for me because theres a ton of games that would be better on computer than playing with joysticks. especially with recent technology playing silent hill would be crazy in 3D or why halo 3 has taken forever to get a PC port with zero excuses
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December 4, 2009 4:46:32 AM

I hate the license limit. Due to some corruption in my OS while pushing my OC a few months back, I had to copy over my clean OS install image about 5 times in 2 months. Having to justify why i needed more installs for my wife's Spore and Sims3 to some CS prick was bullsh!t. I had to wipe the harddrive for re-imaging, no proper game uninstallation, image was pre game installs, and had to explain this to the CS about 10 times, even then he was reluctant until i demanded to speak to his supervisor. (newest image has my game installs now, found an 80gb I took out of my PS3 i could use instead of my old 20gb WD, heh)

My point is, it was 25mins on the phone dealing with a$$holes, that I should never have had to experience, as I already paid for the goddamn thing, and was being treated like a thief.
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December 4, 2009 5:10:32 AM

oh man you called in?
i just e-mail them, but then again i keep a full external back-up of my system just in case something like that happens.
i use 2 licences one for laptop (if it can run it) and one for main desktop, if i have to copy it i send in an e-mail before i need to use the last copy so i always have a back-up, once you deal with the same company multiple times they have a file for you.
also helps if you volunteer to do reviews for their games or send them high quality images for their ads as a tit for tat.
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December 4, 2009 5:22:03 AM

My wife wanted it reinstalled that day before she got home from work, heh. I sent an email and got no response in 2 hours, so I called in.
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December 4, 2009 1:16:00 PM

What game are you guys talking about? Licenses?
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December 4, 2009 1:44:41 PM

I'm pretty sure were done with limited licenses. Basically some companies (EA) wanted to implement a limited licenses (installs) and online verification each time the game is played scheme. But people freaked out about the latter when it was announced so they pulled back on the online verification and stuck with limited installs. That was a bad idea and a case where listening to customers didn't pay off. Had they kept the online checks it would have been easier to dump the limited number of installs because they still would have had the verifications as a backup. Online verification works better and is less intrusive anyways (i.e. Steam).
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December 4, 2009 3:15:45 PM

Both methods are still easily circumnavigated by hackers.
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December 4, 2009 3:20:00 PM

JofaMang said:
Both methods are still easily circumnavigated by hackers.

By hackers - yes. By average Joe, not so much. Nothing will ever be hack proof or unpirate-able. The best that can be done is to prevent the average user from easily being able to do it. The average person looking to play an online game would probably rather just pay the $50 than deal with proxy servers and vlans.
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January 10, 2014 3:17:11 AM

because they want you to buy a console
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