Opinions and answers sought - Assassins/Barbarians.

Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo2,alt.games.diablo (More info?)

Xpost agd, agd2.

I found my first Ohm this season. This gets me thinking of making a
WWSin. Unfortunately, I'm not into PvP much, but I wonder if she can
be a suitable PvM build. Before I actually make a Chaos, there is a
question I would like to ask.
"Can I release TS charges by using WW?"
If not I won't be doing much damage, will I?

I will of course max Venom and Claw Mastery. I can foresee +5 skills
total, bringing WW to level 6. But will this be enough damage in Hell?
I have never played a WWBarb, how much damage does a level 6 WW do?
This brings me to my next 3 questions:
"Does Crushing Blow work with WhirlWind?"
"If it does, does it work in the same manner as other melee attacks?"
"Same questions for Critical Strike."

My plan is to equip the Natalya claw, Duress, Highlord, Guillame,
crafted gloves with IAS and crushing blow, resistances and leech rings,
GoreRiders, and Verdungo or Strings. I will switch to Harlequin,
Marrowwalk, and Soul Drainer if CB doesn't work. Any comments or
suggestions on these items? I do not have the runes for CoH, so the
Duress is there to stay. I do not think the unique claws are good
because none has ITD. I think Natalya's ITD is what makes this build
viable; therefore, this is also there to stay unless someone has a
strong argument against it. I do not have the runes for Fury (the only
other possible ITD claw) either.

Mana burners will be an issue, therefore I need to consider using
Insight for my merc. However, I would like my merc to use Reaper's
Toll for the CtC Decrepify to compensate lack of damage from WW. Any
thoughts here, especially those who have played WWSins or WWBarbs?

Thank you in advance for your replies.
19 answers Last reply
More about opinions answers sought assassins barbarians
  1. Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo2,alt.games.diablo (More info?)

    If your using for PvM and be careful what you make it in
    as it can cost a fortune to repair,avoid superior and
    unneccary skills on the claw.
  2. Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo2,alt.games.diablo (More info?)

    Alex Holtz schrieb:
    > Xpost agd, agd2.
    >
    > I found my first Ohm this season. This gets me thinking of making a
    > WWSin. Unfortunately, I'm not into PvP much, but I wonder if she can
    > be a suitable PvM build. Before I actually make a Chaos, there is a
    > question I would like to ask.
    > "Can I release TS charges by using WW?"

    I'd say yes, but only on the first hit. Doesn't make much sense IMHO.

    > If not I won't be doing much damage, will I?

    Damage output is somewhat limited, yes. But that can be fixed by using
    lots of CB.

    > I will of course max Venom and Claw Mastery. I can foresee +5 skills
    > total, bringing WW to level 6. But will this be enough damage in Hell?

    Only +all skills count, not +assassin skills.

    > I have never played a WWBarb, how much damage does a level 6 WW do?
    > This brings me to my next 3 questions:
    > "Does Crushing Blow work with WhirlWind?"

    Yes!

    > "If it does, does it work in the same manner as other melee attacks?"

    Yup

    > "Same questions for Critical Strike."

    No idea.

    > My plan is to equip the Natalya claw, Duress, Highlord, Guillame,
    > crafted gloves with IAS and crushing blow, resistances and leech rings,
    > GoreRiders, and Verdungo or Strings. I will switch to Harlequin,
    > Marrowwalk, and Soul Drainer if CB doesn't work. Any comments or
    > suggestions on these items? I do not have the runes for CoH, so the
    > Duress is there to stay. I do not think the unique claws are good
    > because none has ITD. I think Natalya's ITD is what makes this build
    > viable; therefore, this is also there to stay unless someone has a
    > strong argument against it. I do not have the runes for Fury (the only
    > other possible ITD claw) either.

    I tried both Natalyas and Bartucs and found Bartucs the better choice.

    > Mana burners will be an issue, therefore I need to consider using
    > Insight for my merc. However, I would like my merc to use Reaper's
    > Toll for the CtC Decrepify to compensate lack of damage from WW. Any
    > thoughts here, especially those who have played WWSins or WWBarbs?

    I wrote a report about my WWsin here in the group a while ago. However,
    Google Groups seem to have lost my posting. But I still have it in my
    archives :)

    <quote>

    Ever since 1.10 came out I wanted to make a Whirlwinding Assassin using
    a Chaos claw. But at the same time, I was convinced that I would never
    be able to get a hand on a legit OHM rune. So I stopped thinking about
    it during the first ladder season. But with the second season, I had
    some luck with hellforge rune drops early on and begun to plan for mule
    hellforge rushes.

    After two or three rushing sessions (I have access to up to five D2
    installations which allowes me to rush 3 mules along with the questing
    Smiter and a high level helper), I finally had collected enough ISTs,
    MALs and GULs to cube up an OHM. But I still needed a three socket elite
    claw with nice skills. After endless hell cow and baal runs without
    finding a usefull sleeve I checked the indiablo.de trade forums and
    traded a 3 socket Suwayyah with +2 Dragon Flight/+3 Death Sentry for an
    UM rune.

    In the meantime, I had leveled Chaotia to 57 thus having everything
    ready to start the chaos. I got only 292% ed - low end, but the range is
    only 290-340 (I hate variable stats on rune words, especially on high
    end rune words).

    Now I had to get the feeling for a new skill (well I had played WW Barbs
    before, but still) at lvl 57 in mid Nightmare. In Hardcore mode of
    course. With the most valuable item I ever had. Strange feeling :) . To
    my surprise, it worked better than I had dreamed of, given the fact that
    slvl 1 Whirlwind gives -50% damage. So Chaotia made her way to the
    remaining quests of Nightmare with ease and grew old enough for her
    final equipment:

    Chaos claw
    Upgraded Bartucs with ed jewel
    UMed Guillaumes face
    Duress wire fleece
    Gore riders
    Crafted dual leech hit power gloves
    String of Ears
    Raven Frost
    Rare 7% ll 5% ml ring
    21ish Mara's
    2 +3 Shadow Skill claws on weapon switch

    Of course, a Fury claw would perform better and is strongly recommended
    by the guide on diabloii.net, but how the heck should someone ever find
    or cube a JAH? (Well I found one in the old days of massive hell cowing)
    Another option would be a Jade Talon, but the resists part is covered by
    a high level Fade and a few charms. Speaking of skill points, here is
    what I was heading for:

    Max Fade
    Max Claw Mastery
    Max Venom
    Enough points in Shadow Master to cast at slvl 17
    15 points with skills in Weapon Block for 55% blocking
    1 point in both Mind Blast and Cloak of Shadows
    A few points in Blade Shield
    Martial Arts skill tree: nada lol

    After a short sneak into Hell and some resists charm tweaking I decided
    to skip the boring NM Baal run leveling sessions but to start with Hell
    right away, solo with one of my other high level chars sitting in the
    game with looting enabled.

    If you want to read the guide I based my build apon, search for 'PvM
    Shredsin' in the thread found here:
    http://forums.diabloii.net/showthread.php?t=126543&page=2&pp=10
    Lots of usefull info about Assassin builds in this thread BTW.

    Instead of giving a detailed report about the way of Chaotia through
    Hell (the end was reached about one month ago, I had not planed to write
    a report at all and have only a few screenshots to help my memory) I
    just want to discuss the pros and cons a bit.

    First of all (and most important), I had a lot of fun playing this char.
    It's a melee char (with Death Trap support though), you can (and have
    to) use the defensive abilities (Mind Blast, Cloak of Shadows) resulting
    in more than just a point and click game experiance, you use a multi
    target attack and don't have to target every single critter. And this is
    a surprisingly strong build. I soloed her to Guardian, so this build
    must be strong :) .

    Even though she had only about 1000 hit points at the beginning of Hell,
    I soon found out that it was possible to rush into the battles without
    too much precaution. She has 32% Damage Reduction (20% from Fade, 12%
    from String of Ears), she is moving while attacking causing most ranged
    attacks to miss, she has 55% chance to block attacks *while attacking*,
    she blocks attacks with Weapon Blocks that can't be blocked with a
    shield. 8% mana leech were enough to keep the blue bubble filled and
    keep the WW going (except against skelletons, physical immunes and mana
    burners of course, where she had to drink blue potions). Did I mention
    that I was surprised how durable that build is?

    So how to deal a good amount of damage when Whirlwind at slvl 3 has -34%
    dmg bonus? Well this penalty isn't as bad as it looks in the first
    place, because it is just substracted from the other damage modifiers:
    Claw Mastery +131%
    Str Bonus 0.75*152/100= +114%
    Dex Bonus 0.75*152/100= +114%
    WW Bonus -34%
    So it's still +325% in total, not too bad. Nearly 700 physical damage on
    average from both claws. Add 216-471 magical dmg from Chaos claw,
    690-710 from slvl 29 Venom and the cold damage from Duress, Ravenfrost
    and a bunch of charms and the numbers begin to look nice. But of course,
    the key modifier (as with most other melee chars in 1.10) is Crushing
    Blow. She has no less than 75%. Enough said. I don't think I have to
    mention how usefull Death Trap is even at low levels.

    The downside of this build is that it is very item dependend. You need
    an OHM and pretty much all of the other equipment Chaotia is using, or
    even more expensive stuff. A 'cheap' variant of this build does not exists.

    So what incidents during Chaotias travel through Hell did I keep in
    mind? Most of it was smooth going. Areas with lots of PIs or unleechable
    skeletons are definitely not the favorit areas of Chaotia. In the few
    maps where Oblivion Knights can spawn (Chaos Sanctuary, Worldstone Keep
    III), I had to switch to Blade Fury to avoid IM death. Fighting the
    Ancients was easier than expected (it required a few days until I was in
    the right mood for that though) using my standard 'lure then to the
    upper corner' approach. Oh and the fight with Lister was a tough one.
    Stoneskin, thus PI, extra strong, spectral hitting. I nearly gave up the
    fight because he healed himself at about the same rate as Chaotia could
    hurt him with Venom. But she finally made it as she made it to Guardian
    shortly thereafter.

    Oops no word about her merc. I decided that an Act 2 Holy Freeze desert
    warrior is the best choice, expecially if you have an ethereal Obediance
    Thresher you can equip him with.

    ---
    Hannes

    PS: If you can ever get a hand on an OHM rune, try this. So much fun :) .

    </quote>
  3. Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo2,alt.games.diablo (More info?)

    Hannes Brunner wrote:
    > Damage output is somewhat limited, yes. But that can be fixed by using
    > lots of CB.

    Great, I thought CB was nerfed for WW as when using a throwing weapon.

    > > I will of course max Venom and Claw Mastery. I can foresee +5 skills
    > > total, bringing WW to level 6. But will this be enough damage in Hell?
    >
    > Only +all skills count, not +assassin skills.

    Yes, the +skills I had in mind was Highlord, Harlequin, and Annihilus.
    That is +4, I was incorrectly thinking that Highlord had a +2 skill.
    But now knowing that CB works, I will use Guillame instead of
    Harlequin.

    > I tried both Natalyas and Bartucs and found Bartucs the better choice.

    You didn't have problem scoring hits? How much AR did you have?

    > I wrote a report about my WWsin here in the group a while ago. However,
    > Google Groups seem to have lost my posting. But I still have it in my
    > archives :)

    I generally found the guides on diinet not much to my liking, therefore
    I don't read them. Thank you for sharing your experience, Hannes.

    > 21ish Mara's

    With Fade on, do you really need the resistances from Mara's? I am
    leaning toward Highlord because of its Critical Strike and IAS.

    > Martial Arts skill tree: nada lol

    I am thinking Tiger Strike here to be released on a single powerful
    monster, such as Act bosses. Did you find CB to be sufficent?

    > First of all (and most important), I had a lot of fun playing this char.
    > It's a melee char (with Death Trap support though), you can (and have
    > to) use the defensive abilities (Mind Blast, Cloak of Shadows) resulting
    > in more than just a point and click game experiance, you use a multi
    > target attack and don't have to target every single critter. And this is
    > a surprisingly strong build. I soloed her to Guardian, so this build
    > must be strong :) .

    Great, that's what I like to hear. Same as you, I am planning to skip
    NM Baal run and to solo through Hell with a looter stand by.

    > Enough said. I don't think I have to
    > mention how usefull Death Trap is even at low levels.

    You mean Death Sentry here, correct? The claw I have is a Scissor
    Suwwayah with a +1 to Death Sentry. I am planning only to use the DS
    for its Corpse Explosion; therefore I do not plan on increasing its
    skill points through hard skill assignments. Hopefully this will be
    enough.

    > Oops no word about her merc. I decided that an Act 2 Holy Freeze desert
    > warrior is the best choice, expecially if you have an ethereal Obediance
    > Thresher you can equip him with.

    I have an ethereal Giant Poleaxe with 5 sockets available, but I am
    leaning more toward Reaper's Toll. I guess I will experiment with it.
  4. Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo2,alt.games.diablo (More info?)

    "Alex Holtz" <aholtz29@yahoo.com> writes:
    >I am planning only to use the DS
    >for its Corpse Explosion; therefore I do not plan on increasing its
    >skill points through hard skill assignments. Hopefully this will be
    >enough.

    Note that more points in DS increase CE radius, which I found very
    useful when I played my first trapper (in 1.07 or 1.08).

    - anton
    --
    Britton Robbins' D2 PDF Guides: http://www.brittonrobbins.com/D2Info.htm
  5. Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo2,alt.games.diablo (More info?)

    Alex Holtz schrieb:

    <snip>

    >>I tried both Natalyas and Bartucs and found Bartucs the better choice.
    >
    > You didn't have problem scoring hits? How much AR did you have?

    Around 4k with a few AR charms.

    >>21ish Mara's
    >
    > With Fade on, do you really need the resistances from Mara's? I am
    > leaning toward Highlord because of its Critical Strike and IAS.

    You don't need any IAS to hit the fastest WW attack speed unless you use
    a slow claw on the second slot and equip the claws in the wrong order.
    More details can be found here:
    http://e.domaindlx.com/JRichard/D2/aas22/whirlwindinfo.html

    I didn't have a Highlords and decided for Mara's mainly because of the
    +2 all skills. Can't remember if the resists were required or not.

    >>Martial Arts skill tree: nada lol
    >
    > I am thinking Tiger Strike here to be released on a single powerful
    > monster, such as Act bosses. Did you find CB to be sufficent?

    Yes. I think one of the major benefits of a WWsin is that you virtually
    never stand in one place thus getting hit much less. TS would counteract
    that benefit.

    > You mean Death Sentry here, correct? The claw I have is a Scissor
    > Suwwayah with a +1 to Death Sentry. I am planning only to use the DS
    > for its Corpse Explosion; therefore I do not plan on increasing its
    > skill points through hard skill assignments. Hopefully this will be
    > enough.

    Death Sentry, yes. My Chaos claw came with DS and Dragon Flight. About
    the best combination for this build :). No hard points allocated in DS
    either.

    >>Oops no word about her merc. I decided that an Act 2 Holy Freeze desert
    >>warrior is the best choice, expecially if you have an ethereal Obediance
    >>Thresher you can equip him with.
    >
    > I have an ethereal Giant Poleaxe with 5 sockets available, but I am
    > leaning more toward Reaper's Toll. I guess I will experiment with it.

    Reaper's will be a good selection especially against PIs. Against
    bosses, Obediance is hard to beat though.

    ---
    Hannes
  6. Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo2,alt.games.diablo (More info?)

    Alex Holtz wrote:
    > I found my first Ohm this season. This gets me thinking of making a
    > WWSin.

    This has happened to me twice. My assassin got stuck in the WW mode,
    could not move, attack, TP or use other skills. She seemed to take
    very little damage from the monsters while in this stuck position. Is
    this a known bug? If so, what should I do to avoid it? I thought I
    heard a similar bug on WW Barb in early 1.10, which was already fixed?
  7. Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo2,alt.games.diablo (More info?)

    Alex Holtz schrieb:
    > Alex Holtz wrote:
    >
    >>I found my first Ohm this season. This gets me thinking of making a
    >>WWSin.
    >
    > This has happened to me twice. My assassin got stuck in the WW mode,
    > could not move, attack, TP or use other skills. She seemed to take
    > very little damage from the monsters while in this stuck position. Is
    > this a known bug? If so, what should I do to avoid it? I thought I
    > heard a similar bug on WW Barb in early 1.10, which was already fixed?

    This happens if you gain a level while whirlwinding. IIRC pressing W for
    weapon switch will fix it. I switched to Blade Fury mode shortly before
    leveling.

    ---
    Hannes
  8. Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo2,alt.games.diablo (More info?)

    Hannes Brunner wrote:
    > Alex Holtz schrieb:
    > > This has happened to me twice. My assassin got stuck in the WW mode,
    > > could not move, attack, TP or use other skills. She seemed to take
    > > very little damage from the monsters while in this stuck position. Is
    > > this a known bug? If so, what should I do to avoid it? I thought I
    > > heard a similar bug on WW Barb in early 1.10, which was already fixed?
    >
    > This happens if you gain a level while whirlwinding. IIRC pressing W for
    > weapon switch will fix it. I switched to Blade Fury mode shortly before
    > leveling.
    >
    > ---
    > Hannes

    You are absolutely correct, Hannes. Thank you for the information.
    Pressing W did not fix that though. Therefore exiting the game is the
    only solution. My assassin is now level 68 in Lost City. Besides her
    skill level too low for this area, she only has 4% mana leech; thereby
    depleting her mana orb very quickly since she did not score many hits
    when WWing. It seems that I may have to do NM Baal runs after all, at
    least until level 70 so Annihilus will kick in; or probably until level
    75 so her resistances won't be in the red any longer.

    Current claws are Chaos and Bartuc's. Most likely switch that to
    Natalya as I have originally planned. AR in the upper 3700, CTH around
    70% but obviously much lower than that since my clvl is lower than the
    mlvl. Weapon block appx. 50%, is this capped at 75% similar to shield
    blocking? I am going to max this since there is no other skill I can
    think of that I should add. Shadow Master, Venom, and Claw Mastery are
    maxed. Maybe leftover skill points will go to Blade Shield similar to
    your build above.
  9. Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo2,alt.games.diablo (More info?)

    Hannes Brunner wrote:

    > You really should look for another source for mana leech. If you can't
    > keep the blue bubble filled this build isn't fun anymore.

    Hopefully when I get to the level when I can equip Natalya, this is no
    longer a problem. My only source of mana leech is from a ring (double
    leech). Now that you say it, I forgot that I had Soul Drainer gloves,
    that should add some more leech.

    > Resists in the red? With Fade active?

    Yes, I only have 1 hard point in Fade so far, because after reaching
    level 75, I'll have 28 more resistances from Anni and Torch; plus the
    +4 skill to Fade. On rough calculation, that will bring my resists to
    58/75/75/37.

    > With the diminishing returns of Weapon Block beyond around slvl 15, it's
    > imposible to reach 75% anyway (the skill planer displays 64% @ slvl 50).
    > 55% with items is a good target, maxing this skill is certainly a waste
    > of skillpoints. Blade Shield is stylish but not worth sinking too many
    > points here either. The only noticable advantage of more skill points is
    > the longer duration. Oh, don't forget to throw in some blade sentinels
    > now and then.

    I see. As you can tell, this is my first Claw-Claw Assassin. I have
    not put points in to Blade Sentinel, it does not look promising since
    the damage is only 3/8 weapon damage plus a little more. I was
    thinking Blade Shield, because even though it also has tiny damage, at
    least it hits when I'm WWing.

    For now (clvl 73), I have used only 68 skill points; 1 each in Shadow
    Disciplines with the 3 main ones maxed, plus 1 point in Blade Fury. By
    the time I move on to another char, level 90, she'll have 101 skill
    points; that is 33 more points. 3 probably goes to Fade. I have 2
    Shadow skill GC; therefore Mind Blast already has decent duration,
    there is no need to increase it further. Cloak of Shadow is, IMO, much
    more useful at lower level. Level 6 Death Sentry has acceptable range;
    I do not really want to add to all the prerequisites anyways. That
    will still leave me with 30 points.

    Now if I switch my Highlord to Mara's, I probably won't need to add any
    points to Fade; WWind, MBlast, DSsentry, and SMaster will all benefit;
    at the cost of losing some Deadly Strike. That's interesting
    proposition that deems trials. Of course I still need to find the
    Mara's first.

    > ---
    > Hannes
  10. Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo2,alt.games.diablo (More info?)

    Alex Holtz schrieb:
    > Hannes Brunner wrote:
    >
    >>Alex Holtz schrieb:
    >>
    >>>This has happened to me twice. My assassin got stuck in the WW mode,
    >>>could not move, attack, TP or use other skills. She seemed to take
    >>>very little damage from the monsters while in this stuck position. Is
    >>>this a known bug? If so, what should I do to avoid it? I thought I
    >>>heard a similar bug on WW Barb in early 1.10, which was already fixed?
    >>
    >>This happens if you gain a level while whirlwinding. IIRC pressing W for
    >>weapon switch will fix it. I switched to Blade Fury mode shortly before
    >>leveling.
    >>
    >>---
    >>Hannes
    >
    > You are absolutely correct, Hannes. Thank you for the information.
    > Pressing W did not fix that though. Therefore exiting the game is the
    > only solution. My assassin is now level 68 in Lost City. Besides her
    > skill level too low for this area, she only has 4% mana leech; thereby
    > depleting her mana orb very quickly since she did not score many hits
    > when WWing. It seems that I may have to do NM Baal runs after all, at
    > least until level 70 so Annihilus will kick in; or probably until level
    > 75 so her resistances won't be in the red any longer.

    You really should look for another source for mana leech. If you can't
    keep the blue bubble filled this build isn't fun anymore.

    Resists in the red? With Fade active?

    > Current claws are Chaos and Bartuc's. Most likely switch that to
    > Natalya as I have originally planned. AR in the upper 3700, CTH around
    > 70% but obviously much lower than that since my clvl is lower than the
    > mlvl. Weapon block appx. 50%, is this capped at 75% similar to shield
    > blocking? I am going to max this since there is no other skill I can
    > think of that I should add. Shadow Master, Venom, and Claw Mastery are
    > maxed. Maybe leftover skill points will go to Blade Shield similar to
    > your build above.

    With the diminishing returns of Weapon Block beyond around slvl 15, it's
    imposible to reach 75% anyway (the skill planer displays 64% @ slvl 50).
    55% with items is a good target, maxing this skill is certainly a waste
    of skillpoints. Blade Shield is stylish but not worth sinking too many
    points here either. The only noticable advantage of more skill points is
    the longer duration. Oh, don't forget to throw in some blade sentinels
    now and then.

    ---
    Hannes
  11. Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo2,alt.games.diablo (More info?)

    Alex Holtz schrieb:
    > Hannes Brunner wrote:
    >
    >>You really should look for another source for mana leech. If you can't
    >>keep the blue bubble filled this build isn't fun anymore.
    >
    > Hopefully when I get to the level when I can equip Natalya, this is no
    > longer a problem. My only source of mana leech is from a ring (double
    > leech). Now that you say it, I forgot that I had Soul Drainer gloves,
    > that should add some more leech.
    >
    >>Resists in the red? With Fade active?
    >
    > Yes, I only have 1 hard point in Fade so far, because after reaching
    > level 75, I'll have 28 more resistances from Anni and Torch; plus the
    > +4 skill to Fade. On rough calculation, that will bring my resists to
    > 58/75/75/37.
    >
    >>With the diminishing returns of Weapon Block beyond around slvl 15, it's
    >>imposible to reach 75% anyway (the skill planer displays 64% @ slvl 50).
    >>55% with items is a good target, maxing this skill is certainly a waste
    >>of skillpoints. Blade Shield is stylish but not worth sinking too many
    >>points here either. The only noticable advantage of more skill points is
    >>the longer duration. Oh, don't forget to throw in some blade sentinels
    >>now and then.
    >
    > I see. As you can tell, this is my first Claw-Claw Assassin. I have
    > not put points in to Blade Sentinel, it does not look promising since
    > the damage is only 3/8 weapon damage plus a little more. I was
    > thinking Blade Shield, because even though it also has tiny damage, at
    > least it hits when I'm WWing.

    Mods that transfer to Blade Sentinel:
    - Deadly Strike
    - Elemental damage/Venom (3/8)
    - Physical/Weapon damage (3/8)
    - Pierce Target (natural)
    - Prevent Monster Heal

    You can deal quite a bit damage to crowds with Blade Sentinel especially
    at high levels when you can keep running several blades at the same time.

    Mods that transfer to Blade Shield:
    - Deadly Strike
    - Elemental Damage/Venom (1/4)
    - Leech
    - Physical/Weapon Damage (1/4)

    The main reason for Blade Shield is that it helps with Leech. You have
    to get used to recast it before every battle though.

    > For now (clvl 73), I have used only 68 skill points; 1 each in Shadow
    > Disciplines with the 3 main ones maxed, plus 1 point in Blade Fury. By
    > the time I move on to another char, level 90, she'll have 101 skill
    > points; that is 33 more points. 3 probably goes to Fade. I have 2
    > Shadow skill GC; therefore Mind Blast already has decent duration,
    > there is no need to increase it further. Cloak of Shadow is, IMO, much
    > more useful at lower level. Level 6 Death Sentry has acceptable range;
    > I do not really want to add to all the prerequisites anyways. That
    > will still leave me with 30 points.

    Don't forget the hidden Physical Damage Reduction bonus of Fade. With
    every hard point in Fade, you get 1% PDR. Fade has to be active for PDR,
    it's not a passive bonus.

    I agree that more than one point in BF, MB and CoS is a bad idea. If you
    like to throw blades (which is a cool concept IMHO, too bad it's not
    strong enough to create a char around it) max Blade Sentinel might be a
    point to consider.

    > Now if I switch my Highlord to Mara's, I probably won't need to add any
    > points to Fade; WWind, MBlast, DSsentry, and SMaster will all benefit;
    > at the cost of losing some Deadly Strike. That's interesting
    > proposition that deems trials. Of course I still need to find the
    > Mara's first.

    I'd say Highlord's DS is better than Mara's extra +skill if you don't
    need the resists anyway.

    ---
    Hannes
  12. Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo2,alt.games.diablo (More info?)

    Hannes Brunner held her like they did by the lake on Naboo, while posting
    3pkj9tFarg24U1@individual.net to this Interweb chatroom:

    >>
    >> I see. As you can tell, this is my first Claw-Claw Assassin. I have
    >> not put points in to Blade Sentinel, it does not look promising since
    >> the damage is only 3/8 weapon damage plus a little more. I was
    >> thinking Blade Shield, because even though it also has tiny damage,
    >> at least it hits when I'm WWing.
    >
    > Mods that transfer to Blade Sentinel:
    > - Deadly Strike
    > - Elemental damage/Venom (3/8)
    > - Physical/Weapon damage (3/8)
    > - Pierce Target (natural)
    > - Prevent Monster Heal
    >
    > You can deal quite a bit damage to crowds with Blade Sentinel
    > especially at high levels when you can keep running several blades at
    > the same time.
    Lots of people mentioned Sentinel to me for my furysin, but once I hit 26 or
    so I found it to be useless.

    >
    > Don't forget the hidden Physical Damage Reduction bonus of Fade. With
    > every hard point in Fade, you get 1% PDR. Fade has to be active for
    > PDR, it's not a passive bonus.
    >
    It is extremely nice though, and works even better with String of
    Ears/Stormshield...

    > I agree that more than one point in BF, MB and CoS is a bad idea. If
    > you like to throw blades (which is a cool concept IMHO, too bad it's
    > not strong enough to create a char around it) max Blade Sentinel
    > might be a point to consider.
    >
    Woah. Blade Fury is not strong enough to build a character around? If I
    wasn't about to go to work, I'd google up the post I made a while ago where
    my furysin absolutely pwn3d the clone. She also participated in Uber killing
    and was VERY successful. Now, I'll agree that they need fairly uberfied
    gear, but the are definitely viable.
  13. Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo2,alt.games.diablo (More info?)

    >>I agree that more than one point in BF, MB and CoS is a bad idea. If
    >>you like to throw blades (which is a cool concept IMHO, too bad it's
    >>not strong enough to create a char around it) max Blade Sentinel
    >>might be a point to consider.
    >
    > Woah. Blade Fury is not strong enough to build a character around? If I
    > wasn't about to go to work, I'd google up the post I made a while ago where
    > my furysin absolutely pwn3d the clone. She also participated in Uber killing
    > and was VERY successful. Now, I'll agree that they need fairly uberfied
    > gear, but the are definitely viable.

    My bad. I meant Blade _Sentinel_ isn't powerfull enough. BF is a
    different story :).

    ---
    Hannes
  14. Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo2,alt.games.diablo (More info?)

    ~misfit~ wrote:

    > What skill allocation and items did / do you use Jabs? I've never played a
    > 'sin except for a half-hearted effort in 1.09 and am wondering about keeping
    > a few of the 'sin specific items I find....
    > --
    > ~misfit~

    As much Crushing Blow; same as Kicker, Smiter, and all other melee
    chars.
    1 point in BF.
    Rest up to you: Talon, DSentry (+synergies), Fade, MB, CoS, SM, BoS.
    If Claw-Claw: weapon block, "Strength" is cheap CB claw.
    If Weapon-Shield: many choices.
  15. Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo2,alt.games.diablo (More info?)

    ~misfit~ held her like they did by the lake on Naboo, while posting
    4335ef9f@news.orcon.net.nz to this Interweb chatroom:

    > Chris Lansdell wrote:
    >> Woah. Blade Fury is not strong enough to build a character around? If
    >> I wasn't about to go to work, I'd google up the post I made a while
    >> ago where my furysin absolutely pwn3d the clone. She also
    >> participated in Uber killing and was VERY successful. Now, I'll agree
    >> that they need fairly uberfied gear, but the are definitely viable.
    >
    > Yep, I've seen her in action.
    >
    > What skill allocation and items did / do you use Jabs? I've never
    > played a 'sin except for a half-hearted effort in 1.09 and am
    > wondering about keeping a few of the 'sin specific items I find....

    There's another thread on here somewhere with those details, please forgive
    me for not reposting them, but a)I'm lazy, and b) I'm la
  16. Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo2,alt.games.diablo (More info?)

    ~misfit~ held her like they did by the lake on Naboo, while posting
    4336c7fa@news.orcon.net.nz to this Interweb chatroom:

    > Chris Lansdell wrote:
    >> ~misfit~ held her like they did by the lake on Naboo, while posting
    >> 4335ef9f@news.orcon.net.nz to this Interweb chatroom:
    >>
    >>> Chris Lansdell wrote:
    >>>> Woah. Blade Fury is not strong enough to build a character around?
    >>>> If I wasn't about to go to work, I'd google up the post I made a
    >>>> while ago where my furysin absolutely pwn3d the clone. She also
    >>>> participated in Uber killing and was VERY successful. Now, I'll
    >>>> agree that they need fairly uberfied gear, but the are definitely
    >>>> viable.
    >>>
    >>> Yep, I've seen her in action.
    >>>
    >>> What skill allocation and items did / do you use Jabs? I've never
    >>> played a 'sin except for a half-hearted effort in 1.09 and am
    >>> wondering about keeping a few of the 'sin specific items I find....
    >>
    >> There's another thread on here somewhere with those details, please
    >> forgive me for not reposting them, but a)I'm lazy, and b) I'm la
    >
    > Can you at least give me a keyword or phrase / time frame to search
    > for?
    > Furysin I guess. Were you posting as Jabber or Chris then?

    Orion Ryder held her like they did by the lake on Naboo, while posting
    1127220460.642785.214990@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com to this Interweb
    chatroom:

    > My recent trip to uber-tristram has refueled Kasmir to come back to SC
    > play. He really only has experience playinfgAssassins and from what I
    > seen in uber-tris the only Sasin that is going to contribute anything
    > is a BF Sasin with some extra added specialties, something the
    > Armaggedon-like Goddess HolyStarsBatman with all of the Blowing Crush
    > gear.
    >
    > He played last night to level 9 and has held off on skill and stat
    > points. Jabber you might have posted your build and skills and stats
    > but if so can you paste them here or post what he needs to distribute
    > now and in the future.
    >
    http://groups.google.com/group/alt.games.diablo/browse_thread/thread/f70f07d45fabfde3/e0ae7fc231ac16bb?lnk=st&q=alt.games.diablo+furysin&rnum=12&hl=en#e0ae7fc231ac16bb

    That thread outlines the endgame gear I'm using. Skills:
    1 pt Blade Fury
    20 Venom
    Enough Fade to Max resists
    20 Shadow Master
    1 or so in Mind Blast
    Rest in Death Sentry and synergies

    Enough Str for...hmmm I think the hat or possibly the shield is the
    heaviest. Dex to taste, depending on how bad you find the AR. No Energy.
    Rest in Vit.

    If you want a pure furysin, then you don't put points in Death Sentry,
    instead go for Blade Sentinel. Cloak can be worth putting more than one
    point in, to increase the duration. It is essential to use Cloak against
    gloams and archers. Shadow Master is another candidate for maxing,
    especially if you can prebuff it substantially.
  17. Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo2,alt.games.diablo (More info?)

    "~misfit~" <misfit61nz@yahooters.co.nz>, in a display of leetness, fell down
    the stairs, tripped over an urn, and then threw a cracked sash at Baal...

    >> There's another thread on here somewhere with those details, please
    >> forgive me for not reposting them, but a)I'm lazy, and b) I'm la

    >Can you at least give me a keyword or phrase / time frame to search for?
    >
    >Furysin I guess. Were you posting as Jabber or Chris then?

    Should be easy to find... it's from a couple of days ago and has "BF Sassin
    Build Info" in the title.


    --
    USWest SCL: 82 barb, 87 necro, 87 paladin, 87 sorceress.
  18. Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo2,alt.games.diablo (More info?)

    "~misfit~" <misfit61nz@yahooters.co.nz> wrote in message
    news:43376d99@news.orcon.net.nz...
    > Stephen van Ham wrote:
    >> "~misfit~" <misfit61nz@yahooters.co.nz>, in a display of leetness,
    >> fell down the stairs, tripped over an urn, and then threw a cracked
    >> sash at Baal...
    >>
    >>>> There's another thread on here somewhere with those details, please
    >>>> forgive me for not reposting them, but a)I'm lazy, and b) I'm la
    >>
    >>> Can you at least give me a keyword or phrase / time frame to search
    >>> for?
    >>>
    >>> Furysin I guess. Were you posting as Jabber or Chris then?
    >>
    >> Should be easy to find... it's from a couple of days ago and has "BF
    >> Sassin Build Info" in the title.
    >
    > Cheers Stephen. That's one of the few threads I didn't read of late as
    > I've had little interest in assasins..... so far.

    Speaking of assassins, I found a realy high end firelizard's. Max to all
    skills, 261%ED and 66%FR.

    Mickey
  19. Archived from groups: alt.games.diablo2,alt.games.diablo (More info?)

    "Alex Holtz" <aholtz29@yahoo.com> wrote in message
    news:1127718168.296992.178200@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
    >
    > ~misfit~ wrote:
    >
    >> Currently I have him wearing MF gear, a 73% MF Tomb Reaver and a 2
    >> P-topaz
    >> Giant Skull. My MF runs are quite slow as I'm not CE'ing as much as I
    >> usually would as I don't have as much MF as I'm used to on the necro yet
    >> so
    >> I'm trying to let my merc get the final hit in on bosses as much as I
    >> can.
    >
    > Food for thought.
    > Suppose you have 300% MF. Your Actual MF is
    > Unique: 136%
    > Set: 187%
    > Rare: 200%
    >
    > With 421% MF, your merc's Actual MF is:
    > U: 156.86% --> difference of 20.86%
    > S: 228.56% --> difference of 41.56%
    > R: 247.40% --> difference of 47.40%
    >
    > Let's use an over pessimistic value to get a lower bound to benchmark.
    > With CE you kill 2x faster, that's 2 tries of 136% to get a unique
    > item. Without CE, it is 1 try of 156.86%. Still think you should
    > limit using CE?

    Unless you build a char desighned to kill a particular boss, you will ALWAYS
    do better in volume. For example, in 1.08, I had my gorillazon doing MF. Her
    sole raison d'etre was to kill Baal as at that time, he had the magic touch
    as far as certain items, like Schaefer's, Windforce and Grandfather. For
    areas like The Pit, The Ancient Tunnels and the WSK, I'd take volume and
    speed over a little more MF any time.

    Mickey
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