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Why do people turn off video sync?

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Last response: in PC Gaming
Anonymous
October 4, 2004 3:33:36 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.doom,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

Why do people turn off video sync when they benchmark? Perhaps a
better question would be: Do most people actually play games with the
video sync off?

I can't stand playing games without the video sync. On Doom 3, for
example, I could get 48 fps on the timedemo without video sync, but
only 35 with it. When it comes time to actually play the game, I turn
off the video sync and sacrifice nearly 30% of my framerate just to
avoid those nasty texture tearing.

But I get the impression than the majority of Doom 3 players
deactivate video sync when playing (maybe I'm wrong?). I can't
believe how anybody could possibly stand playing a game with the
textures tearing up all the time.

More about : people turn video sync

Anonymous
October 4, 2004 6:48:57 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.doom,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

Opticreep wrote:
> But I get the impression than the majority of Doom 3 players
> deactivate video sync when playing (maybe I'm wrong?). I can't
> believe how anybody could possibly stand playing a game with the
> textures tearing up all the time.


I suppose it's whatever is most important to you--and how fast your system
is.
--
chainbreaker

If you need to email, then chainbreaker (naturally) at comcast dot
net--that's "net" not "com"--should do it.
Anonymous
October 4, 2004 8:30:47 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.doom,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

I never play with VSync off. Turning vsync off is useful for
benchmarking, though.
Related resources
Can't find your answer ? Ask !
October 4, 2004 10:40:14 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.doom,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

There was a good article on triple buffering + vsync vs vsync off, if I
recall where it was I'll post. Anyway, the higher your refresh rate the
less noticeable tearing is. I don't notice it at all on 85hz with a normal
monitor, and leave vsync off in all my games.

rms
Anonymous
October 4, 2004 11:34:55 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.doom,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

Opticreep wrote:

> I can't stand playing games without the video sync. On Doom 3, for
> example, I could get 48 fps on the timedemo without video sync, but
> only 35 with it. When it comes time to actually play the game, I turn
> off the video sync and sacrifice nearly 30% of my framerate just to
> avoid those nasty texture tearing.

Glad I'm not the only one who feels this way. Nothing kills immersion for me
in a FPS faster than that tearing. I play games at a minimum of 75 Hz
refresh rate too, currently using an ATI X800 XT.

-Z-
October 4, 2004 11:57:01 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.doom,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

On 4 Oct 2004 11:33:36 -0700, opticreep@yahoo.com (Opticreep) wrote:

>Why do people turn off video sync when they benchmark?

Because otherwise you are benchmarking your choice of refresh rate on
your monitor. If you are comparing hardware you need to look at
min/avg/max framerates to make an informed comparison, if your refresh
rate is locked to 60 and your hardware is capable of higher framerates
then the avg/max results will be totally skewed.

> Perhaps a
>better question would be: Do most people actually play games with the
>video sync off?

I don't, I can't speak on behalf of most people though.
--
Andrew, contact via interpleb.blogspot.com
Help make Usenet a better place: English is read downwards,
please don't top post. Trim replies to quote only relevant text.
Check groups.google.com before asking an obvious question.
Anonymous
October 5, 2004 1:35:54 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.doom,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

"Opticreep" <opticreep@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:9e1f277e.0410041033.239ec3ff@posting.google.com...
> Why do people turn off video sync when they benchmark? Perhaps a
> better question would be: Do most people actually play games with the
> video sync off?
>
> I can't stand playing games without the video sync. On Doom 3, for
> example, I could get 48 fps on the timedemo without video sync, but
> only 35 with it. When it comes time to actually play the game, I turn
> off the video sync and sacrifice nearly 30% of my framerate just to
> avoid those nasty texture tearing.
>
> But I get the impression than the majority of Doom 3 players
> deactivate video sync when playing (maybe I'm wrong?). I can't
> believe how anybody could possibly stand playing a game with the
> textures tearing up all the time.

With a refresh rate of 75Hz and vsync set to off - I never see tearing.
Anonymous
October 5, 2004 4:27:32 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.doom,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

"Opticreep" <opticreep@yahoo.com> wrote
> Why do people turn off video sync when they benchmark? Perhaps a
> better question would be: Do most people actually play games with the
> video sync off?

I keep VSync off and don't see any tearing even if refresh
rate is only 60Hz. Guess I'm blind then, or something :-)

One friend of mine actually starts to feel sick if refresh rate
is below 85Hz and VSync isn't enabled.
October 5, 2004 5:21:13 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.doom,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

"Opticreep" <opticreep@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:9e1f277e.0410041033.239ec3ff@posting.google.com...
> Why do people turn off video sync when they benchmark? Perhaps a
> better question would be: Do most people actually play games with the
> video sync off?
>
> I can't stand playing games without the video sync. On Doom 3, for
> example, I could get 48 fps on the timedemo without video sync, but
> only 35 with it. When it comes time to actually play the game, I turn
> off the video sync and sacrifice nearly 30% of my framerate just to
> avoid those nasty texture tearing.
>
> But I get the impression than the majority of Doom 3 players
> deactivate video sync when playing (maybe I'm wrong?). I can't
> believe how anybody could possibly stand playing a game with the
> textures tearing up all the time.

Yeah absolute terrible Doom 3 has worst tearing up BIG TIME. I had to turn
video synvc on and look nice...
Anonymous
October 5, 2004 7:06:27 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.doom,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

Ditto

Andy.


"NuQ" <nuq@8x7fg89t7h.net> wrote in message
news:_mj8d.2653643$6p.445932@news.easynews.com...
>
> "Opticreep" <opticreep@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:9e1f277e.0410041033.239ec3ff@posting.google.com...
> > Why do people turn off video sync when they benchmark? Perhaps a
> > better question would be: Do most people actually play games with the
> > video sync off?
> >
> > I can't stand playing games without the video sync. On Doom 3, for
> > example, I could get 48 fps on the timedemo without video sync, but
> > only 35 with it. When it comes time to actually play the game, I turn
> > off the video sync and sacrifice nearly 30% of my framerate just to
> > avoid those nasty texture tearing.
> >
> > But I get the impression than the majority of Doom 3 players
> > deactivate video sync when playing (maybe I'm wrong?). I can't
> > believe how anybody could possibly stand playing a game with the
> > textures tearing up all the time.
>
> With a refresh rate of 75Hz and vsync set to off - I never see tearing.
>
>
October 5, 2004 7:38:31 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.doom,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

"Opticreep" <opticreep@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:9e1f277e.0410041033.239ec3ff@posting.google.com...
> Why do people turn off video sync when they benchmark? Perhaps a
> better question would be: Do most people actually play games with the
> video sync off?
>
> I can't stand playing games without the video sync. On Doom 3, for
> example, I could get 48 fps on the timedemo without video sync, but
> only 35 with it. When it comes time to actually play the game, I turn
> off the video sync and sacrifice nearly 30% of my framerate just to
> avoid those nasty texture tearing.
>
> But I get the impression than the majority of Doom 3 players
> deactivate video sync when playing (maybe I'm wrong?). I can't
> believe how anybody could possibly stand playing a game with the
> textures tearing up all the time.

I always play with V sync on. I use a 85Hz refresh rate and I still see
tearing easily on any OpenGL game I play with V sync turned off. Do guys
turn off V sync in DirectX games?? Maybe some guys just move through levels
so fast they doesn't notice, but all I have to do is stand in a doorway,
look out a window frame, or basically any straight edges in a game and turn
fast and I see tearing. Sometimes so bad a straight line will be cut in
half.
I like my games to look their best and will sacrifice some FPS so I can
enjoy them.
This same argument can be applied to AA. Some people just don't mind or see
jaggies. But for me once I got my 9800pro, I can never go back to playing
with out at lest 4x AA. To me games look so much better with AA on. Totally
changes the way textures look. To each his own I guess. JLC
Anonymous
October 5, 2004 11:17:28 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.doom,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

Zackman wrote:
>
> Glad I'm not the only one who feels this way. Nothing kills immersion
> for me in a FPS faster than that tearing. I play games at a minimum
> of 75 Hz refresh rate too, currently using an ATI X800 XT.

I always used to turn it off, but recently I've been leaving it on.

--
|
| The early bird might get the worm, but the second mouse gets the
cheese.
|
Anonymous
October 5, 2004 1:17:39 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.doom,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

I did loads of testing with the various graphics modes in Halo (my
multiplayer game of choice). It can use all the usual resolutions as well as
having refresh rate settings and either vsync on/off or a fixed 30fps mode.
After all the tests I found that 1024x768 at 85hz with VSync off gave the
best look and feel. I have a reasonably fast system.

"Opticreep" <opticreep@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:9e1f277e.0410041033.239ec3ff@posting.google.com...
> Why do people turn off video sync when they benchmark? Perhaps a
> better question would be: Do most people actually play games with the
> video sync off?
>
> I can't stand playing games without the video sync. On Doom 3, for
> example, I could get 48 fps on the timedemo without video sync, but
> only 35 with it. When it comes time to actually play the game, I turn
> off the video sync and sacrifice nearly 30% of my framerate just to
> avoid those nasty texture tearing.
>
> But I get the impression than the majority of Doom 3 players
> deactivate video sync when playing (maybe I'm wrong?). I can't
> believe how anybody could possibly stand playing a game with the
> textures tearing up all the time.
Anonymous
October 5, 2004 5:11:07 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.doom,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

On 10/4/2004 11:33 AM Opticreep brightened our day with:

>Why do people turn off video sync when they benchmark? Perhaps a
>better question would be: Do most people actually play games with the
>video sync off?
>
>I can't stand playing games without the video sync. On Doom 3, for
>example, I could get 48 fps on the timedemo without video sync, but
>only 35 with it. When it comes time to actually play the game, I turn
>off the video sync and sacrifice nearly 30% of my framerate just to
>avoid those nasty texture tearing.
>
>But I get the impression than the majority of Doom 3 players
>deactivate video sync when playing (maybe I'm wrong?). I can't
>believe how anybody could possibly stand playing a game with the
>textures tearing up all the time.
>
>
You never played Quake 3. You never dealt with a card or game that
doesn't properly make use of triple buffering.
If your card or the game doesn't use triple buffering, VSync halves
performance (well not always but enough). I've only noticed tearing on
a couple of the many games I've played. On my old GF3 and before that
my Voodoo 3, triple buffering worked poorly. The worst tearing I ever
noticed in a game was Medal of Honor: Allied Assault, at the same time
using VSync halved my framerates. The tearing was particularly bad
indoors in that game, so I used to keep a key bound to "toggle
r_swapinterval", that way whenever I went indoors I could turn VSync on.
For the most part, I leave it on now. Mainly because triple buffering
works well on my Radeon, especially in Doom 3, and D3 w/ my Radeon works
perfectly with VSync on. But for Far Cry, which doesn't have a very
well implemented use of the back buffer, I leave VSync off.

If you played Quake 3, everyone turned VSync off. Maybe that made me
get used to it in other games. Since a lot of Doom 3 players are old
Quake 3 players they may be used to doing that as well.

--
"...forged but accurate."

Steve ¤»Inglo«¤
www.inglostadt.com
Anonymous
October 5, 2004 10:39:13 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.doom,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

> I can't stand playing games without the video sync. On Doom 3, for
> example, I could get 48 fps on the timedemo without video sync, but
> only 35 with it. When it comes time to actually play the game, I turn
> off the video sync and sacrifice nearly 30% of my framerate just to
> avoid those nasty texture tearing.

Doom 3 is the first game I've played in the past 10 years that I actually
HAD to have VSync turned ON because its tearing and texture problems
were so ugly without it....but again, its the first game in 10 years where I
had
to turn the feature ON. no other gmae I've played has given me visual
problems
that required me to keep it turned on...

> But I get the impression than the majority of Doom 3 players
> deactivate video sync when playing (maybe I'm wrong?). I can't
> believe how anybody could possibly stand playing a game with the
> textures tearing up all the time.

Doom 3 is the exception, not the rule.
Anonymous
October 5, 2004 10:39:14 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.doom,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

"HeadRusch" <HeadRusch1@NO_SPAM_comcast.net> wrote in message news:<hTB8d.192471$D%.28235@attbi_s51>...
>
> Doom 3 is the first game I've played in the past 10 years that I actually
> HAD to have VSync turned ON because its tearing and texture problems
> were so ugly without it....but again, its the first game in 10 years where I


Did you force triple buffering on OpenGL for Doom3?

This helped me out immensely. Without triple buffering, VSync drops
my framerate by over 10 fps. Once I activated triple buffering,
framerates stay the same regardless of whether or not VSync is
activated.

In Doom 3, I ended up playing on high details, 2X anti-alias, 16X
anisotropic filtering, the "humus" fix, video sync ACTIVATED, triple
buffering activated, and refresh rate forced at 85 Hz. On my Athlon
64 & Radeon 9800 Pro combo, I got 41 fps on time demo. Without triple
buffering, the VSync causes the framerate to plummet to 29 fps.
Anonymous
October 6, 2004 1:34:15 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.doom,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

"JLC" <j.jc@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:XGo8d.306521$mD.29030@attbi_s02...
>
> "Opticreep" <opticreep@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:9e1f277e.0410041033.239ec3ff@posting.google.com...
>> Why do people turn off video sync when they benchmark? Perhaps a
>> better question would be: Do most people actually play games with the
>> video sync off?
>>
>> I can't stand playing games without the video sync. On Doom 3, for
>> example, I could get 48 fps on the timedemo without video sync, but
>> only 35 with it. When it comes time to actually play the game, I turn
>> off the video sync and sacrifice nearly 30% of my framerate just to
>> avoid those nasty texture tearing.
>>
>> But I get the impression than the majority of Doom 3 players
>> deactivate video sync when playing (maybe I'm wrong?). I can't
>> believe how anybody could possibly stand playing a game with the
>> textures tearing up all the time.
>
> I always play with V sync on. I use a 85Hz refresh rate and I still see
> tearing easily on any OpenGL game I play with V sync turned off. Do guys
> turn off V sync in DirectX games?? Maybe some guys just move through
> levels
> so fast they doesn't notice, but all I have to do is stand in a doorway,
> look out a window frame, or basically any straight edges in a game and
> turn
> fast and I see tearing. Sometimes so bad a straight line will be cut in
> half.
> I like my games to look their best and will sacrifice some FPS so I can
> enjoy them.
> This same argument can be applied to AA. Some people just don't mind or
> see
> jaggies. But for me once I got my 9800pro, I can never go back to playing
> with out at lest 4x AA. To me games look so much better with AA on.
> Totally
> changes the way textures look. To each his own I guess. JLC

Maybe the tearing is there, but I'm just not noticing. I'll try and
remember to make a conscious effort tonight to try and look.

I think some people just may not notice just like they can't notice a
refresh rate below 75Hz. I can spot a low refresh rate the split-second I
see one. Some people can see it at all. I've even A/B'ed it to some people
and they just shrug their shoulders and say they don't notice any
difference. Makes me just wanna slap 'em upside the head! ;-)
Anonymous
October 6, 2004 1:47:07 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.doom,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

On Mon, 04 Oct 2004 21:35:54 GMT, "NuQ" <nuq@8x7fg89t7h.net> wrote:

>
>With a refresh rate of 75Hz and vsync set to off - I never see tearing.
>

I can confirm lack of tearing as well.

However, in another action game that defaults the refresh rate to 60Hz, I
was seeing some anomalies in the graphics. Not sure if it was a placebo
but there was something "odd". At least it doesn't use white - that's the
worst colour to use at low refresh rates.
Anonymous
October 6, 2004 2:00:10 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.doom,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

One thing about V-sync is if you turn it off, your videocard is doing
extra work for nothing; beyond a certain point you really will not see those
extra frames per second. If you turn it on, I believe the videocard uses
slighly less power because it will "wait" a bit before continuing the
calculations; v-sync is literally waiting for the vertical redraw (which is
also why you avoid tearing).

And if you have an LCD monitor, it's just physically impossible for the
monitor to redraw the screen that fast anyways. A 16ms monitor, I believe,
can draw only slightly more than 60-70 screens per second.
Anonymous
October 6, 2004 5:12:27 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.doom (More info?)

>Why do people turn off video sync when they benchmark? Perhaps a
>better question would be: Do most people actually play games with the
>video sync off?
>
>I can't stand playing games without the video sync. On Doom 3, for
>example, I could get 48 fps on the timedemo without video sync, but
>only 35 with it. When it comes time to actually play the game, I turn
>off the video sync and sacrifice nearly 30% of my framerate just to
>avoid those nasty texture tearing.
>
>But I get the impression than the majority of Doom 3 players
>deactivate video sync when playing (maybe I'm wrong?). I can't
>believe how anybody could possibly stand playing a game with the
>textures tearing up all the time.

I run it with VSync off and have no tearing or any other problems.
Anonymous
October 27, 2004 10:43:52 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.doom,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

On Tue, 05 Oct 2004 21:34:15 GMT, "NuQ" <nuq@8x7fg89t7h.net> wrote:



>
>Maybe the tearing is there, but I'm just not noticing. I'll try and
>remember to make a conscious effort tonight to try and look.
>
>I think some people just may not notice just like they can't notice a
>refresh rate below 75Hz. I can spot a low refresh rate the split-second I
>see one. Some people can see it at all. I've even A/B'ed it to some people
>and they just shrug their shoulders and say they don't notice any
>difference. Makes me just wanna slap 'em upside the head! ;-)
>
Do you have astigmatism? I can see a monitor set to anything less
than 75 Hz from across the room. Have corrective lenses for
astigmatism and near-sighted.


--
the JarHead

There are 10 types of people in the world; those who understand binary, and those who don't.
Anonymous
October 29, 2004 10:34:33 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.doom,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

the JarHead <tech.info.mapson@jandjcomputing.com> wrote:
> On Tue, 05 Oct 2004 21:34:15 GMT, "NuQ" <nuq@8x7fg89t7h.net> wrote:
>
>
>
>>
>> Maybe the tearing is there, but I'm just not noticing. I'll try and
>> remember to make a conscious effort tonight to try and look.
>>
>> I think some people just may not notice just like they can't notice a
>> refresh rate below 75Hz. I can spot a low refresh rate the
>> split-second I see one. Some people can see it at all. I've even
>> A/B'ed it to some people and they just shrug their shoulders and say
>> they don't notice any difference. Makes me just wanna slap 'em
>> upside the head! ;-)
>>
> Do you have astigmatism? I can see a monitor set to anything less
> than 75 Hz from across the room. Have corrective lenses for
> astigmatism and near-sighted.

I have a very slight atigmatism - not enough to warrant corrective lenses
for. But, I don't have corrective lense for my nead-sightedness. Are you
saying this is why I can spot refresh rates lower than 75Hz?