Long-winded story from a rookie

[Nadae]

(*scroll to the bottom for the true heart of the matter*)

Hi there. I have lurked a long time on this site and read a lot of techie information type articles. I, too, am thinking of building a computer and have some idea of where to start. However, I hope the community can explain a little better about some of this techie jargon that I do not completely understand.

First off, in plain English, here is what I hope my new computer will do:

Have a fast internet connection.

Do stunning Powerpoint Presentations (Likely, I would like to edit picture images for my work).

Play music and video well.

The games I play are mostly not too CPU intensive. I play mostly RPG's (Neverwinter Nights, Warcraft III, Baldur's Gate). However, now my computer is far too old to play the games I'd like to play: The Sims2, (future NWN 2), Star Wars Knights of the Old Republic (1 and 2), The Elder Scrolls Morrowind. Actually, my computer was already far too old about one to two years ago, but I have stuck with it because I have this policy about only buying a computer every four-five years. I refuse to care whether the people who play online with me tell me I have an ancient piece of junk.

Here are the specifications for 'said junk', a Laptop computer :

Pentium III 850 MHz
128 MB Ram
20 GB hardrive
NVidia Geforce2 Go 16 MB video card
Windows Me

I would like MOST of all to have better graphics cards. I have put graphics on some of the lowest settings in the games I play for better performance.

I am considering buying a Socket 754 motherboard per some of the advice that is posted here. However, does it truly matter if it's from any ol' company? Also, what is ON the motherboard is a bit confusing to me. There two ports on one board, there are three ports on another, etc. etc. I am not quite sure how to buy the right one. I am expecting... like I said, to last me for the next Five years if this is going to be the foundation of my computer build.

Sorry for the long post. Thanks. Hope you can help a girl out.

 

[pat]

"I am considering buying a Socket 754 motherboard per some of the advice that is posted here. However, does it truly matter if it's from any ol' company? Also, what is ON the motherboard is a bit confusing to me. There two ports on one board, there are three ports on another, etc. etc. I am not quite sure how to buy the right one. I am expecting... like I said, to last me for the next Five years if this is going to be the foundation of my computer build."

Well, do you have any brand in head for your board? What do you mean by 'an old company"?

Onboard feature usually mean stuff that are useful for today computing and that if you need them, you wont have to buy a PCI card to add these feature. usually consist of firewire, sound, video, lan,.. but may extend to wi-fi, RAID controller ,..

If you play game, you definitively dont want onboard video. LAN is useful, as you want a fast internet connection. Firewire...well, if you do video editing from a digital camcorder, it might be useful. Sound, most of today onboard sound is good. Not the best, but certainly sufficient for normal listening.

Do you want PCIe or AGP? in that case, going to 939 will be your only option as there is not yet PCIe solution for socket 754. But if you plan to buy for 5 years, then it wont matter if you go with either one, unless you plan to upgrade your video card later.

My question is: Will you keep that exaxct same system for 5 years withouit changing anything or if you plan to do some minor upgrade from time to time? And what is your budget?





-Always put the blame on you first, then on the hardware !!!

 

[Nadae]

Since I am not too familiar with brands in general, I was wondering if I just bought any socket 754 board I saw on Fry's electronic shelf, would that just be fine? Since I would like a fast internet connection then I would probably need LAN. I have no digital camcorder right now or a digital camera so I do not see much use for Firewire. Likely will not need such a trinket for the next year or so. Sound would be nice I think since I am an amateur musician and love music. If I could get good sound, that would be nice.

I am really not interested in PCI. It sounds like for people who want the latest and greatest toys and that's not for a practical girl like me. Eventually, though, knowing the gaming industry's fickle nature, I would eventually need to upgrade the graphics card maybe even less than five years (as my clunky laptop showed me), but I would rather wait as long as possible before I am even remotely interested in buy another computer component.

If I could keep the exact same system for five years that would be nice. I cannot predict within the next five years what component I would need, but I would bet I would need a new graphics card if I waited as long as even three years before upgrading a single piece of hardware.

My budget is basically not a problem, but I'm not going to throw away money either on some frivolous high-tech hardware because it's new, shiny and likely priced as high as it could be. I would like something that is dependable, durable and will let me enjoy my computer for the next five years.

-- Nadae

 

[o1die]

The Fry's combo deals usually include an ecs motherboard, which offer no frills and few bios adjustments. They either work or don't. Fry's will replace it for 30 days. After that, ecs will charge you a substantial fee for returning it to them for up to 3 years. I suggest a 754 combo with either a gigabyte or epox nforce3 board. They run about $200, and the nforce board will permit some overclocking if you decide to try it.

 

[pat]

If you get a good video card now, as the ATI x800xt, you'll probably be good for 5 years with AGP. But it is more expensive too. If you go cheaper, then I suggest that you go with PCIe. If you'll upgrade later, PCIe video card will probably be cheaper and easier to find than AGP ones.

That being said, if you want to go 754, then I can suggest that board, as I use it.

The Soltek k8an2e-gr I dont know about fry's, but newegg has it. For me it has been fast, stable and easy to setup. I dont know about any other 754 board, as I havent use any other than the Soltek.

This board has anything you'll want except firewire. And it is pretty inexpensive too. Based on the nforce3 250 GB, it has gigabit ethernet as well as the nvidia integrated firewall.

Since you dont want to upgrade as often as I do, then get a 3400+ 754 cpu. It will give you a lot of power for the years to come. Or, you can just get a 3000+ now, and upgrade it later.

Get 1 gigs of RAM now. Add more later if needed. Get 1 stick of 1 gigs.

Then, I guess that you want another HDD. High capacity HDD are getting cheaper... and Seagate has 5 years warranty on their HDD. 160 gigs will last you long enough!!!!

Will you need a DVD burner? The BenQ 1620 is doing a great job for me. Inexpensive too and perform good.

Onboard sound is not so bad. but doesnt have digital out. By amateur musician, do you mean that you compose music with you computer with MIDI?. I would suggest a sound card. I know the Chaintech sound card is inexpensive and has digital out. I have the revolution M-Audio here... I regret to have spend that much for this sound card as it is almost too good for me. But it is doing what I want and that ok.

Going PCIe, the Gigabyte k8nf-9 seem a nice board. Inexpensive and fast too. My friend is going to have one, so I will be able to test it. Get the 3200+. Going 939 mean goind dual channel. You'll need 2 identical memory stick to run it stable. If you want 1 gigs, then get 2 512 megs stick.

The gigabyte has good onboard sound too. 7.1 channels with digital in and out. Why not have a look at <A HREF="http://www.gamepc.com/labs/view_content.asp?id=gbnf44x&page=1" target="_new"> this review</A>

-Always put the blame on you first, then on the hardware !!!

 

[Ned_Flanders]

Socket 754 AMD Athlon 3400+
NF3 Motherboard
Nvidia 6800 Graphics card (or 6800GT if your feeling spicey!)


______________
Read the friggin FAQ, and use the search button or I'll kick yer face in!

 

[Lazerous]

Only lets not forget about the reacurring conflicts between the 6800 series video cards and the nForce 3 250 chipsets. I just finished a massive battle with this and the chipset won. Plus if you ever plan to OC your video card it wont work right with the nF3.

<A HREF="http://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?showtopic=126" target="_new"><font color=red>Read about this on the nVidia forum.</font color=red></A>

Lots of turmoil going on with this combo. better to stick with either an nf3 and an ati or a via and either but depending on how lucky you feel the nf3 is a fast chipset. judge for yourself though.

<font color=orange>AMD 64 3700+@2.52ghz
ABIT K8V-Pro
CORSAIR XMS (1gb) PC-3200
Gigabyte GF 6800gt 256mb
Audigy 2 ZS
2_36.7gb Raptors/Raid 0
Tt 480 watt PSU</font color=orange>

 

[Nadae]

Thank you for all your advice, but now I am having second thoughts about my original planning (such as it was).

I was curious about your point, Pat, on how if I did buy a AGP motherboard now, would it create difficulties for me down the line to find future AGP type graphic cards for upgrade for a reasonable price? I mena... as long as I waited long enough, the price of any component should go down, right? My own guesstimate is I may need a new graphics card after only three years (just based on my experiences with my old laptop which was 'the best it was' at the time I bought it.

Or, the other general consensus seems to be just buy an ATI x800 and be happy with that.

 

[Lazerous]

From what I read in other forums is that there is a new revision to the ABIT board. V1.1 that has addressed the agp lock. I have read that if you were to actually still recieve a V1.0 that you can send it to ABIT and they will swap it out with the V1.1.

Guess I can't substantiate till I have it in my hand though.

<font color=orange>AMD 64 3700+@2.52ghz
ABIT K8V-Pro
CORSAIR XMS (1gb) PC-3200
Gigabyte GF 6800gt 256mb
Audigy 2 ZS
2_36.7gb Raptors/Raid 0
Tt 480 watt PSU</font color=orange>

 

[Rugger]

What pat means is that PCIe will be replacing AGP as the standard for video cards. As PCIe cards and PCIe mobos becomes more and more prevalent, manufacturers will make less AGP cards - AGP Cards will become less available and more expensive.

I don't think you can compare a "latest/greatest" laptop video card to a vid card that is in a regular PC. The NF2 Go would not have been as good as a GF2 GTS type of board. I think you'll find a high-end PC card will perform well longer than a high-end laptop vid card.

I'm in the same boat as you as far as upgrading. I build a new PC every 3-5 years and I play a lot of the same types of games as you, too. So, when I build I want to have the best combination of price/performance ratio, dependability and customer service in my purchases. So, you shouldn't go with "any old company." Buy from a company with good customer service that makes well-built, reliable products.

Up until now I have been a big supporter of s754/AGP systems because the price difference between s754/s939 was too large to justify the expenditure for the s939. That and the s754 is 200Mhz faster than a similarly rated s939 (s754 3000+ is 2Ghz and the s939 3000+ is 1.8Ghz). With the recent release of many more s939 mobos the prices for new s939 solutions is dropping and becoming more reasonable. The price difference between a good s754 mobo and a good s939 mobo has dropped significantly. For example a DFI Lanparty UT nF3 cost $109 at Newegg and the DFI Lanparty UT nF4 Ultra D costs $159 - only a $50 difference. On a similar note the price between slower s754/s939 CPUs has dropped, too. An A64 s754 3000+ is $146 (retail box) and the A64 s939 3000+ is $165 (retail box) - only $19 difference. The price difference between s754 3400+ and a s939 3500+ is still $100. When you are talking about these CPUs, I don't think the 3500+ is worth that much more money. So...for an extra $69 you can get a mobo that should allow you to upgrade the CPU and easily upgrade your vid card. I think you would be perfectly happy getting a DFI nF4 mobo, a A64 3000+ and something like the MSI NX6800. In three years, if the system is not fast enough, you can upgrade the video card and go to a faster CPU. BTW, the 6800 can be easily modded to open up all 16 pipes - big bonus.

__________________________________________________
:tongue: <font color=red>Have you read the FAQ? Searched for other posts on this topic?</font color=red>

 

[Codesmith]

If my PC died today I would get.

Cheapest DFI NF4 motherboard with 2 16x pci-e slots.
Cheapest 90nm 939 CPU
Geforce 6600 GT with 2 DVI outputs and SLI support.
Corsair 2x512 XMS PC3200 Low latency (2-2-2-5)
Biggest Zalman 7xxx cooler that will fit my case/MB.

Latter I could trick turn the board into an SLI with a pencil and add a 2nd 6600 GT assuming Nvidia keeps improving their SLI to support more games, or all new games are written to support SLI.

You can save money by getting only one 512 module or dropping down to CL 3 memory or even getting Corsair Value memory.

You can also get the cheapest 939 avaliable, then upgrade a year or two latter.

A powersupply with 12v ATX v2.0 would be a decent investment as well.

 

[fishmahn]

Just watch out for nVidia's changing the drivers - read a blurb somewhere (maybe Anandtech?) that nVidia is changing drivers so maybe even the pencil mod won't work - it'll detect a non-SLI board and not allow SLI.

I'm pretty sure the current drivers still work with the pencil-modded chip, but not with an unmodded chip on a 2x16 mobo, hopefully they'll not make it so the pencil mods won't work either. Just a note of concern.

Mike.

 

[pat]

Humm. This lady just want a plain good computer, now you are talking about modding and so..

Still amaze me when someone just want to make it simple, how you start to make it complicated with OC, modding, and so.

Can we return back to basic?

-Always put the blame on you first, then on the hardware !!!

 

[pat]

"I was curious about your point, Pat, on how if I did buy a AGP motherboard now, would it create difficulties for me down the line to find future AGP type graphic cards for upgrade for a reasonable price? I mena... as long as I waited long enough, the price of any component should go down, right?"

Well, it can be lower, or, as older PCI card do, still run expensive, as there is almost no market for them.

I dont know.. Getting a nice ATI x800 card now will, for sure, last you long enough. Since you are mainly playing RPG game online, FPS is not an issue, as it is proved by your current setup still being able to do something with these game. by going with a fast video card could last for the next 5 years for those game, and I think that is your goal.

So, if you go socket 754, ATI x800xt, and 1 gigs of ram and a 3200+ CPU, then it should last you long enough. The CPU can be upgraded to a 3700+ if you end up needing more CPU later.

Are you planning to reuse some of your older component (hdd, cdrom,...)?

I usually keep my computer for at least 6 month, then sell the board and CPU and try something else. I you were from Canada, I could have a deal for you, as I'm planning to try something else... My board just being 6 months old...

-Always put the blame on you first, then on the hardware !!!