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Wireless networks on Pavilions

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April 14, 2005 1:05:04 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.hp.hardware (More info?)

I have two Pavilion desktop PCs (a 400 series and a 700 series, both UK
models. The 700 is around four months old - so it's already pretty-much out
of date <g>). I have just bought a PDA with wireless and Bluetooth (Dell
Axim, v. nice machine) and thought I would set up an ad-hoc wireless network
so I can do the usual wireless network things.

I blagged a couple of USB dongles from a mate (WiFi and Bluetooth) and
set-to. To cut a very long story short the Blutooth one works fine (after
the usual pigging about with drivers) but the WiFi one doesn't. Everything
installs and XP (SP2 pre-installed) reports no problems (as in "this device
is working OK") but clicking on the Networks icon shows the device with a
cross through it and the message "not connected". I have tried a second
dongle (different brand) and it gave the same negative results as the first.
I tried the second dongle in the older machine (XP SP1 + numerous updates
but no SP2) and it didn't work there either. I have tried the XP drivers,
the supplied drivers and some updated drivers from the manufacturer's
website. Nothing (and this is the short version!). I tried numerous
combinations of system roll-back, or not, prior to each install.

I have seen no mention of these problems anywhere on the internet (I have
surfed 'til my skin is wrinkled) and the fact that it's both Pavilions and
two dongles (whilst Bluetooth is fine) has me stumped.

The newer machine is under warranty and the dealer has said they will take
it in and send it back to HP but this means at least three weeks without the
machine and, let's face it, they're never the same when they come back. The
older machine, of course, stands no chance.

So, any ideas what is happening and any ideas whether it's fixable
(particularly on the older machine)? Would a PCI card work?

Paul ============}
o o

// Live fast, die old //

PaulsPages are at http://homepage.ntlworld.com/pcbradley/
Anonymous
a b α HP
April 14, 2005 1:59:10 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.hp.hardware (More info?)

For any networking, wired or wireless, I've always used PCI cards rather than
USB devices whenever possible. I've been forced to use USB Ethernet on some
all-in-one integrated personal computers with USB ports and no board slots.

It seems to me that Ethernet over USB is a bad idea... Ben Myers

On Wed, 13 Apr 2005 21:05:04 GMT, "Pb" <pcbradley.removethis@.lineone.net>
wrote:

>I have two Pavilion desktop PCs (a 400 series and a 700 series, both UK
>models. The 700 is around four months old - so it's already pretty-much out
>of date <g>). I have just bought a PDA with wireless and Bluetooth (Dell
>Axim, v. nice machine) and thought I would set up an ad-hoc wireless network
>so I can do the usual wireless network things.
>
>I blagged a couple of USB dongles from a mate (WiFi and Bluetooth) and
>set-to. To cut a very long story short the Blutooth one works fine (after
>the usual pigging about with drivers) but the WiFi one doesn't. Everything
>installs and XP (SP2 pre-installed) reports no problems (as in "this device
>is working OK") but clicking on the Networks icon shows the device with a
>cross through it and the message "not connected". I have tried a second
>dongle (different brand) and it gave the same negative results as the first.
>I tried the second dongle in the older machine (XP SP1 + numerous updates
>but no SP2) and it didn't work there either. I have tried the XP drivers,
>the supplied drivers and some updated drivers from the manufacturer's
>website. Nothing (and this is the short version!). I tried numerous
>combinations of system roll-back, or not, prior to each install.
>
>I have seen no mention of these problems anywhere on the internet (I have
>surfed 'til my skin is wrinkled) and the fact that it's both Pavilions and
>two dongles (whilst Bluetooth is fine) has me stumped.
>
>The newer machine is under warranty and the dealer has said they will take
>it in and send it back to HP but this means at least three weeks without the
>machine and, let's face it, they're never the same when they come back. The
>older machine, of course, stands no chance.
>
>So, any ideas what is happening and any ideas whether it's fixable
>(particularly on the older machine)? Would a PCI card work?
>
> Paul ============}
> o o
>
>// Live fast, die old //
>
>PaulsPages are at http://homepage.ntlworld.com/pcbradley/
>
>
Anonymous
a b α HP
April 14, 2005 2:39:28 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.hp.hardware (More info?)

Sounds like you don't have the network configured properly to me. I
never connected by ad-hoc before, just to an Infrastructure access
point. But I still believe you still have to create a new network and
set them up the same of course. Then I think for ad-hoc, you might have
to manually enter local IP addresses.


Cheers!


______________________________________________
Bill (using a Toshiba 2595XDVD & Windows 2000)
-- written and edited within Word 2000



"Pb" <pcbradley.removethis@.lineone.net> wrote in message
news:4Qf7e.11528$C2.4234@newsfe3-win.ntli.net...
Date: Wed, 13 Apr 2005 21:05:04 GMT

I have two Pavilion desktop PCs (a 400 series and a 700 series, both UK
models. The 700 is around four months old - so it's already pretty-much out
of date <g>). I have just bought a PDA with wireless and Bluetooth (Dell
Axim, v. nice machine) and thought I would set up an ad-hoc wireless network
so I can do the usual wireless network things.

I blagged a couple of USB dongles from a mate (WiFi and Bluetooth) and
set-to. To cut a very long story short the Blutooth one works fine (after
the usual pigging about with drivers) but the WiFi one doesn't. Everything
installs and XP (SP2 pre-installed) reports no problems (as in "this device
is working OK") but clicking on the Networks icon shows the device with a
cross through it and the message "not connected". I have tried a second
dongle (different brand) and it gave the same negative results as the first.
I tried the second dongle in the older machine (XP SP1 + numerous updates
but no SP2) and it didn't work there either. I have tried the XP drivers,
the supplied drivers and some updated drivers from the manufacturer's
website. Nothing (and this is the short version!). I tried numerous
combinations of system roll-back, or not, prior to each install.

I have seen no mention of these problems anywhere on the internet (I have
surfed 'til my skin is wrinkled) and the fact that it's both Pavilions and
two dongles (whilst Bluetooth is fine) has me stumped.

The newer machine is under warranty and the dealer has said they will take
it in and send it back to HP but this means at least three weeks without the
machine and, let's face it, they're never the same when they come back. The
older machine, of course, stands no chance.

So, any ideas what is happening and any ideas whether it's fixable
(particularly on the older machine)? Would a PCI card work?

Paul ============}
o o

// Live fast, die old //

PaulsPages are at http://homepage.ntlworld.com/pcbradley/
Related resources
Anonymous
a b α HP
April 14, 2005 3:57:47 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.hp.hardware (More info?)

Pb <pcbradley.removethis@.lineone.net> wrote:
> I have two Pavilion desktop PCs (a 400 series and a 700 series, both UK
> models. The 700 is around four months old - so it's already pretty-much out
> of date <g>). I have just bought a PDA with wireless and Bluetooth (Dell
> Axim, v. nice machine) and thought I would set up an ad-hoc wireless network
> so I can do the usual wireless network things.
>
> I blagged a couple of USB dongles from a mate (WiFi and Bluetooth) and
> set-to. To cut a very long story short the Blutooth one works fine (after
> the usual pigging about with drivers) but the WiFi one doesn't. Everything
> installs and XP (SP2 pre-installed) reports no problems (as in "this device
> is working OK") but clicking on the Networks icon shows the device with a
> cross through it and the message "not connected".
[deleted]

Probably stating the obvious, but have you done this? :

Right-click on the (non) connection icon -> Status -> Properties (or
go to Properties via any other path) -> Wireless Networks -> Available
networks click on the name of the PDA's wireless network -> Configure ->
tick the "This is a computer-to-computer (ad hoc) network; wireless
access points are not uses" setting.
Anonymous
a b α HP
April 14, 2005 9:42:34 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.hp.hardware (More info?)

<ben_myers_spam_me_not @ charter.net (Ben Myers)> wrote in message
news:425d95b3.4184609@nntp.charter.net...
Date: Wed, 13 Apr 2005 21:59:10 GMT

For any networking, wired or wireless, I've always used PCI cards
rather than USB devices whenever possible. I've been forced to use
USB Ethernet on some all-in-one integrated personal computers with
USB ports and no board slots.

It seems to me that Ethernet over USB is a bad idea... Ben Myers

I've had very good luck with Ethernet over USB, if the USB ports are
individually controlled with their own processor (many of these are PCI
cards with USB ports). If not, it shouldn't be too bad if it is the only
USB device plugged into the computer.


Cheers!


___________________________________________
Bill (using a HP AMD 1.2GHZ & Windows 2000)
-- written and edited within Word 2000
April 14, 2005 10:44:02 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.hp.hardware (More info?)

<<Sounds like you don't have the network configured properly to me. >>

Problem is I *can't* configure the network as XP can't connect to the
device.

P

--
Paul ============}
o o

// Live fast, die old //
PaulsPages are at http://homepage.ntlworld.com/pcbradley/
Anonymous
a b α HP
April 14, 2005 11:26:15 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.hp.hardware (More info?)

"Pb" <pcbradley.removethis@.lineone.net> wrote in message
news:SRy7e.918$v82.735@newsfe5-gui.ntli.net...
Date: Thu, 14 Apr 2005 18:44:02 GMT

<<Sounds like you don't have the network configured properly to me. >>

Problem is I *can't* configure the network as XP can't connect to
the device.

Well you can setup the network on each computer without any wireless or
wired connection to anything yet. As I don't even connect up a wireless,
Ethernet, PhonePNA, install drivers or whatever to a network until I get
the network settings setup on all of the computers first. Sounds like
you are trying to do this backwards. At least backwards to the way I do
it anyway. As when I do it backwards, some devices will show up as
disabled (or not connected). Just like what you are experiencing.


Cheers!


___________________________________________
Bill (using a HP AMD 1.2GHZ & Windows 2000)
-- written and edited within Word 2000
Anonymous
a b α HP
April 15, 2005 12:46:41 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.hp.hardware (More info?)

Pb <pcbradley.removethis@.lineone.net> wrote:
> <<Sounds like you don't have the network configured properly to me. >>
>
> Problem is I *can't* configure the network as XP can't connect to the
> device.

Is the network listed under "Available: networks" or/and "Preferred
networks:"? If not, there is likely a problem on the PDA side, i.e. does
*its* network advertize itself?

But even if the network is not listed, you should still be able to
configure it in the "Preferred networks:" section. Contrary to the
"Available networks:" section, the former has an "Add..." button where
you can add and configure a network which is not (yet) available (i.e.
for example for configuring a WiFi hot-spot, while you're still at
home).
April 17, 2005 1:25:48 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.hp.hardware (More info?)

I'm not sure we understand each other here. It's not that XP or the PC can't
connect to the network; the problem is that XP or the PC can't connect to
the network adapter. In order to see the network I've got to get the system
to see the adapter.

I did try your other suggestions but without success.

Paul ============}
o o

// Live fast, die old //
PaulsPages are at http://homepage.ntlworld.com/pcbradley/
Anonymous
a b α HP
April 17, 2005 2:26:37 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.hp.hardware (More info?)

"Pb" <pcbradley.removethis@.lineone.net> wrote in message
news:wpf8e.24477$il.10184@newsfe5-win.ntli.net...
Date: Sat, 16 Apr 2005 21:25:48 GMT

I'm not sure we understand each other here. It's not that XP or the
PC can't connect to the network; the problem is that XP or the PC
can't connect to the network adapter. In order to see the network
I've got to get the system to see the adapter.

I did try your other suggestions but without success.

Hi Paul... Yes I know it sounds weird, but my laptop sometimes cannot
find the WiFi device either. This happens when I have the network
connection set to disabled (like hanging up a dialup modem). Or I
haven't configured the network connection on the computer yet.

Coming out of sleep or hibernation is the worst! As I have a hard time
getting things to work correctly once again. Although two things works
the best. One is to disable the network connection before hibernation or
sleep mode. Then reverse when coming back out of it.

Another thing that seems to work well for me is to turn off the radio
before going to sleep or hibernation. Then turn it back on when coming
out of it. Both of these two tricks work very well for me. Rebooting
also works well, but that takes a much longer time.

So seems to me, the computer won't detect the WiFi card (or device)
until it can access it through the network connection first. And I am
not talking about connecting to the whole network itself, but just the
computer itself through its network settings.

I've never seen this undetected device with say an Ethernet card (or
basically anything else). Well assuming that the correct drivers are
installed anyway. But just WiFi devices.

Of course you are thinking that your problem is do to a wrong driver and
your computer can't detect it. While this maybe true, but it is more
often or not, there is no network configured on the computer (or it is
disabled). As I believe without the network being configured, the
computer can't communicate with the WiFi device at all. Thus the major
reason why it can't be seen, in my humble opinion.

My setup is like this:

2Wire HomePortal 1000HG (with a built in wireless router 802.11b/g)
US Robotics USR5410 (WiFi 802.11g)



Cheers!


___________________________________________
Bill (using a HP AMD 1.2GHZ & Windows 2000)
-- written and edited within Word 2000
April 18, 2005 1:15:50 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.hp.hardware (More info?)

Hi Bill,

Ah, this is starting to make sense (as far as PCs can make sense). The PC
can't see the adapter since there is no network for it to recognise, but the
network will only exist when the PC can see it as the PDA is also looking
for a network (ad-hoc, remember).

I guess this is a dead-end, then. Maybe a PCI card would fare better or
maybe I have to wait until I move to broadband and get a wireless-capable
router, when all of my troubles will disappear. Or I go the Bluetooth route
as that did seem to work OK.

Paul ============}
o o

// Live fast, die old //
PaulsPages are at http://homepage.ntlworld.com/pcbradley/
Anonymous
a b α HP
April 18, 2005 7:27:15 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.hp.hardware (More info?)

FWIW, I have used Linksys routers, wired and wifi, for 3+ years and had nothing
except rock-solid performance. I also have a Linksys access point in use here,
added after I installed a wired-only router... Ben Myers

On Sun, 17 Apr 2005 21:15:50 GMT, "Pb" <pcbradley.removethis@.lineone.net>
wrote:

>Hi Bill,
>
>Ah, this is starting to make sense (as far as PCs can make sense). The PC
>can't see the adapter since there is no network for it to recognise, but the
>network will only exist when the PC can see it as the PDA is also looking
>for a network (ad-hoc, remember).
>
>I guess this is a dead-end, then. Maybe a PCI card would fare better or
>maybe I have to wait until I move to broadband and get a wireless-capable
>router, when all of my troubles will disappear. Or I go the Bluetooth route
>as that did seem to work OK.
>
> Paul ============}
> o o
>
>// Live fast, die old //
>PaulsPages are at http://homepage.ntlworld.com/pcbradley/
>
>
Anonymous
a b α HP
April 18, 2005 4:14:16 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.hp.hardware (More info?)

"Pb" <pcbradley.removethis@.lineone.net> wrote in message
news:amA8e.21421$JO6.20756@newsfe6-win.ntli.net...
Date: Sun, 17 Apr 2005 21:15:50 GMT

Hi Bill,

Ah, this is starting to make sense (as far as PCs can make sense).
The PC can't see the adapter since there is no network for it to
recognise, but the network will only exist when the PC can see it
as the PDA is also looking for a network (ad-hoc, remember).

I guess this is a dead-end, then. Maybe a PCI card would fare
better or maybe I have to wait until I move to broadband and get a
wireless-capable router, when all of my troubles will disappear. Or
I go the Bluetooth route as that did seem to work OK.

Hi Paul... Btw, are you getting any of Frank Slootweg's messages? Since
he has done a fine job of telling you how to configure your computers to
be networked. And you can indeed use WiFi to network both computers, so
it isn't a dead end.

Although it isn't as simple as connecting up two WiFi USB devices and
installing the drivers and away you go. No there is more to it than
that. You have to configure both computers to be networked.

For example, if you have your computers configured for Windows Logon
(this is the default), you will never get WiFi working period. You
probably want Client for Microsoft Networks. Then also configure at
least File and Printer Sharing for Microsoft Networks. Then at least the
Internet Protocol (TCP/IP).

And you're not done yet. Both computers have to be assigned the same
Workgroup name. Although both computers can't share the same Computer
name. Also unless you are using the same user name and password for both
computers, you are going to have to create a new user account on one or
both computers.

Next, are you using a Firewall? If so, this could block your ability to
see the other computer, unless it is configured properly. You might want
to disable it until you get the two computers talking to each other
first. Then worry about configuring the Firewalls later on.

Next, you probably want to share a folder or two. Careful about sharing
a whole drive. As you may have noticed each drive already has a share
name like C$, D$, etc. And you leave these alone, but you are free to
add another share name for drives and they can't end with a $ sign.

If you are logged on as a user with administrator privileges, you can
access drives and there contents with the following syntax.

\\{computer name}\c$

Now do you see by what we mean by configuring each computer to be
networked?


Cheers!


______________________________________________
Bill (using a Toshiba 2595XDVD & Windows 2000)
-- written and edited within Word 2000
April 18, 2005 10:33:57 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.hp.hardware (More info?)

Thanks again, quite an exhaustive set of instructions which even I can
follow <g>.

<<configured for Windows Logon (this is the default)>> indeed it will be. I
will get this changed.
<<configure at least File and Printer Sharing for Microsoft Networks>> this
was already done.
<<Internet Protocol (TCP/IP)>> would have to revisit but I'm sure this was
done.
<<assigned the same Workgroup name>> already done.
<<create a new user account on one or both computers>> I never got as far as
this but will create a new account.
<<You might want to disable [the firewall] until you get the two computers
talking to each other>> yeah,did this.
<<probably want to share a folder or two>> didn't have this explicitly set
but already have some generic shared folders.
<<user with administrator privileges>> indeed I am.
<<see by what we mean by configuring>> beginning to see that I knew nothing.

I guess my mistake was in thinking that an "ad-hoc" network was inherently
more simplistic than it really is and than the Bluetooth network was. If you
don't mind I may call on your advice again in the near future when I can get
the dongle back .....

And yes, I have seen Frank's messages (2 received), though my newsgroup
server is rather temperamental about what it will download to my PC.

Thanks again guys.

Paul ============}
o o

// Live fast, die old //
PaulsPages are at http://homepage.ntlworld.com/pcbradley/
Anonymous
a b α HP
April 19, 2005 7:14:16 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.hp.hardware (More info?)

"Pb" <pcbradley.removethis@.lineone.net> wrote in message
news:p 4T8e.26892$Uc7.18303@newsfe2-win.ntli.net...
Date: Mon, 18 Apr 2005 18:33:57 GMT

Thanks again, quite an exhaustive set of instructions which even I
can follow <g>.

Hi Paul... Oh good deal!

... I guess my mistake was in thinking that an "ad-hoc" network was
inherently more simplistic than it really is and than the Bluetooth
network was.

One would think so. But I remember my first time and I totally agree
with you. Although I never used Bluetooth yet. What's that like?

If you don't mind I may call on your advice again in the near
future when I can get the dongle back .....

Sure no problem, we'll be here.

And yes, I have seen Frank's messages (2 received), though my
newsgroup server is rather temperamental about what it will
download to my PC. Thanks again guys.

Yes same here.


Cheers!


______________________________________________
Bill (using a Toshiba 2595XDVD & Windows 2000)
-- written and edited within Word 2000
!