MSI K7T266 - a flawed board and its review

[chainbolt]

The KT266 chip has received very controversial reviews so far. Most reviews portrait the new VIA chipset as under-performer for the time being. There are exceptions and one was the recent MSIK7T266 Pro review at Acehardware. Now it seems MSI set Acehardware up by delivering a tuned-up board for the review, although at least in Asian markets the MSI K7T266 pro seems to be sold with a design flaw. At www.ocworkbench.com they have posts and pictures showing what went wrong with the MSIK7T266 Pro. Obviously you need to solder resistors here and there to get a better performance. Sorry for the peeps who bought already the board.

It looks like it is better to hold back with KT266 boards and in particular with this MSI board until the things are sorted out. Full amazing story is about how MSI triued to set up another review side is <A HREF="http://www.overclockers.com.au/ubb/Forum2/HTML/005102.html" target="_new"> here</A>




<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by chainbolt on 04/14/01 11:01 PM.</EM></FONT></P>

 

[SERVO]

There is no doubt that the KT266 chipset will be the MB of choice only when they fix the problems {I almost got the a7m266, thanks to keeping up with updated information I did'nt}This chipset even with it's flaws sooner or later will be what I want. I have been trying to decide whats the best MB out there for over a month and it's becoming clearer that the KT266 chipset is the way to go. The only thing I'm waiting for is a hardware site to review the fixed MB's against each other when there released. Only then I will decide which MB to buy. That still may not be the answer because there will be more BIO's updates and more and more.

 

[Ncogneto]

While the bios issue is hardly a design flaw and even MSI admitts further bios updates will improve performance over the shipping bios, Did ace hardware report during there tests as to which bios revision they were testing with? The resistor mod is a bit different story altogether are you sure that the ace hardware board did in fact have this modification done to it or is it just speculation at this point? Furthermore will new boards now have this mod done to them or is MSI shipping boards to the US in the same state as the boards that hit the ASIAN markets.

A little bit of knowledge is a dangerous thing!

 

[IntelConvert]

That was a very interesting piece you posted in the overclockers forum!

IMHO, after a 2-3 months of maturing, the KT266 will be the (AMD) DDR platform of choice. KT266 boards are less expensive to manufacture than AMD761 boards and provides much better features - such as 50% more memory capacity, 4-way memory interleaving, USB 2.0, etc.

While the AMD761 boards continue to receive the best DDR performance ratings by most reviewers, you can't help but spot numerous A7M266 (request-for-help) posts throughout the various forums. Sounds like the AMD761 is still experiencing the stability problems that plagued it from the start! Wouldn't surprise me in the least to see ASUS introduce their KT266 board soon and discontinue the A7M266.

 

[SERVO]

At this time I'm not so concerned about the shortcomings of the MSI MB, but more focused on the chipset itself. When the other MB,s hit the market will the same performance problems be the same or is this just MSI's problem. Being the first on the market and maybe wanting a jump on the competitors sales this is not the standard they were looking for! Now MSI is looking to save face. This does'nt mean all KT266 MB's will face the same problems. I'm sure ASUS and others will solve these problems before they dare to release there product, if they don't something is wrong!
Lets see what happens

 

[IntelConvert]

I couldn't agree more. From what I've read (I believe over at Ace's), the ASUS A7V266 will soon be released, and then we shall see if the premier mobo mfr. has done anything to improve upon the MSI and Gigabyte KT266 boards.

 

[SERVO]

At first I thought the MSI K7 MASTER was the best {WEEKS AGO} now I see the KT266 chipset is even more suited for upgrades later and will be supported by VIA and MB companies far beyond the 761 chipset. This is the new standard like it or not! "I" may not like it, but that's the the way it is. So I will wait for the smoke to clear and then decide which way to go{ASUS,ABIT,GIGABYTE,SHUTTLE,or IWILL}

 

[Ncogneto]

Don't be so quick to jump of the amd 760 wagon just yet. AMD will continue to support there chipset as it nears the introduction of the amd 760MP chipset which should insure support for the 760 chipset as well. The reason for many motherboards manufactorers choice to use the via solution over the amd solution is more a matter of cost and not performance as the amd solution needs a 6 layer pcb as opposed to the 4 layers of the via solution. While yes you can find many a user with problems with the amd solution that is true of any newly released board and how can I politely say this, users with slightly less know how then needed attempting to build there own system with all the newest hardware. While MSI may or may not be guilty of misleading us at least they have showed us that there may indeed be hope for the via solution with a slight modification and bios upgrade.
Additionaly a matter of the utmost importance to AMD is to get there foot in the door of the MP arena. One would tend to think that they are making dam sure that when the 760 mp hits the market it is well past the beta stage and a fully functional product. Business users are far less forgiving as us home users and a misstep here can be a grave error. If you question this look at the bad taste the first released I840-I810 boards left in the mouths of business users.
It would seem logical that all the effort amd is putting into the 760MP chipset the 760 may also be a benefactor as well.

A little bit of knowledge is a dangerous thing!

 

[Guest]

Man, and I JUST bought the MSI K7T266. But everyone I've talked to with this board swears by it, even if benchmarks lean toward the Asus A7M266. Oh well.

 

[SERVO]

OK HERE I GO! There has been something bothering me lately.
I should post this in a new thread but what do you think. The X-BOX will be out this fall and Bill Gates {who rules all} states that the x-box will compete with the PS2. There is BILLIONS to be made in this market!!! Bill Gates wants some {if not all} of the $$$$$. The X-BOX will run at 733MHz and have a hard drive, plus the video chip NIvida will complete the package So this platform can run any game out today with no problem. Almost all gaming companies will be making games for the X-BOX {check out msxbox.com} So why would any gaming company stray from BILL!! He controls directX and alot more. Microsoft is putting in $$$$$ to make sure the X-BOX will succeed and this venture of Bills will not fall no matter how much it costs him. Any company that does'nt follow him is doomed. So why would a company put out a game that will only run at "let's say" 1000MHZ or even better "lose" the X-BOX market.
Please Prove me wrong {this has nothing to do with a business company}

 

[Ncogneto]

Well I am definatly no x-box expert so everything I say after this is mearly a guess. However, the x-box is not a shoe in at all. As popular as windows and microsoft are here in the USA it is despised in the asian countries. You know the countries that make nintendo and ps2? While the x-box is sure to be a success, the amount of that succes will be highly dependent on how well it goes over in other countries. Now correct me if I am wrong but this machine still interfaces with a tv monior correct? How much of a video card does it take to drive a monitor(ie tv) that has considerably less resolution ( somewhere on the 256 color stage at present I beleive) the a computer monitor?

A little bit of knowledge is a dangerous thing!

 

[Guest]

Well, I've been trying to figure out which motherboard I should get in my new system: the Asus A7M 266, MSI K7T 266, the Gigabyte GA7DX, (or I've been hearing good things about IWILL)- so I don't know. My system is for making music. But is this revised MSI K7T 266 going to be a lot better than the other Motherboards out there? Should I go for this board over the others? I don't care to wait to buy my new system, but if it will save me hassle in the long run then I probably will. What do you think (being that this is my first computer)?

P.S. If I wait for this revised MSI K7T 266 MB, should I just wait for AMD's dual processors to come out in July? Or will they be too expensive?

 

[SERVO]

The answer is not the resolution of a monitor or TV. the ? is more where the gaming companies are willing to put there $$$$ into resourses for a new game. Stick with Bill or produce a game only for high end computers. I just can't seem to get over this. I want a good computer to exceed the X-BOX but will it really happen or am I just dreaming {ONLY BILL GATES KNOWS} Maybe I'm optimistic and I hope for the best. is the new KT266 MB's the way to go! or am I blowing my money!!!

 

[Kelledin]

While the AMD761 boards continue to receive the best DDR performance ratings by most reviewers, you can't help but spot numerous A7M266 (request-for-help) posts throughout the various forums. Sounds like the AMD761 is still experiencing the stability problems that plagued it from the start!

I've seen such problems too. Trouble is, they usually seem to be related to AGP, IDE, etc.--problems apparently related to the VIA southbridge.

That's one bit that a lot of people forget when they praise AMD760-based mobos--every one that I've seen out there is actually a hybrid chipset, part VIA, part AMD760. It's no secret that <A HREF="http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/3/18267.html" target="_new">VIA is not such a great chipset manufacturer</A>. The hybridization practice annoys me, because I'd really like to see how the AMD760's southbridge compares to the VIA southbridge.

Kelledin
<font color=red>"Step away from the gimp suit and put your hands on top of your head."</font color=red>

 

[chrisojeda]

What is 4 way interleaving? Also, you said USB 2.0...How will I be impacted if I go with the AMD 760 chipset and it does not have USB 2.0? Finally, what are the other differecnes?

Thanks!

It worked yesterday! :lol:

 

[Crashman]

The worst of both worlds-worse instability than with the AMD northbridge and similar performance to the ALi MAGiK1. You must be masochistic, as you can either go for the best performance (AMD northbridge) or the best stability (ALi) or neither (VIA).

Suicide is painless...........

 

[chainbolt]

I can only say this is not what I know about the A7M266. I have used both the Gigabyte and the Asus. In Decmber 2000 the Giga and then from January this year the Asus A7M266. In all the years I had never a more stable and better overcklable board than the A7M266. I have tried and tortured it, I have modified and soldered the hell: this board (first revison)is the most reliable mobo I remember. The hardcore oc clubs in Japan use this board as reference. With the multiplier and voltage mod, they have their 1.33 Giga TB running at 2100 MHz on the A7M266. The LN guys are also using the A7M266.Sure you will find posts about this board in the forums, but that happens with all kind of hardware, and most posts are simply related to a lack of knowledge.

I know dozens of freins who are using the A7M266, I have never heard anything about stability problems. It's true that the AMD 760 baords are rare and quite expensive. Do you know why?

 

[pvsurfer]

What is 4 way interleaving? Also, you said USB 2.0... How will I be impacted if I go with the AMD 760 chipset and it does not have USB 2.0? Finally, what are the other differences?

I'll try to tackle that.

1. 4-way memory (bank) interleaving is a technique for increasing memory bandwidth (by a factor of 4). It's sort of like having RAID 0 in memory. While some programs are available to invoke memory interleaving (e.g., WPCREDIT), a firmware solution (i.e., BIOS-enabled) is much better.

2. Since there are no peripherals using USB 2.0 (yet), it's advantage boils down to 'future-proofing'. USB 2.0 may not take off because MS has decided to put their support behind Firewire.

3. Other KT266 advantages? Well, the big advantage was (theoretically) touted to be VIA's 'V-link' bus, doubling the AMD760's bandwidth (which uses the PCI bus) between the North and South bridges from 133 MB/s to 266MB/s. It remains to be seen if this results in a performance difference when running real-world apps. As far as the mobo mfrs are concerned, KT266 is a less costly and less complex DDR implemention than AMD760, so they are 100% behind it.

IMHO, there can be no question that 50% more memory capacity (3 DIMM slots vs only 2 on AMD760 mobos) and memory interleaving are the biggest advantages (for consumers). Not to mention that KT266 boards are less expensive and easier to find than their AMD760 counterparts.

 

[Ncogneto]

Errrr......the AGP bus is connected to the northbridge not the south bridge.

A little bit of knowledge is a dangerous thing!

 

[Guest]

You might also want to check out Anandtechs review...

Name: VIA KT266: Second Round K.O.
Date: April 16, 2001

URL: http://www.anandtech.com/showdoc.html?i=1455

 

[Guest]

Just read it, I am increidibly impressed at the Cachemem Latency benchmark, and that the modified K7T266P had lower latency than A7V133! I have got to hand it to VIA, but something is bothering me. It just doesn't seem like MSI to release a product with a problem like this. But than I take that back, they did even if it provided terrible performance, they did stick with what they are known for, Stable Boards so, but the question still remains, what did that resistor do? Well we'll just have to wait and see.

 

[Guest]

I just ordered the K7T266 from Newegg... based on the recent article over at Anandtech I have but one question. If this resistor problem proves to be a mistake on the part of MSI, will there be replacement boards made available? I see that adjusting the reisistor adds a considerable amount of performance improvement, but totaly destroys stability. Almost makes me wish I went KT133a...

 

[Guest]

I think the KT266 has potential, but I would wait for them to work the bugs out of the MSI board before I purchased it I think. At this point you don't really know what you are getting, and even if you get the better performing board it seems there are stability issues. They need some time to resolve this I think.

I'm interested to see the Asus A7V266 come out and see how it stacks up in the reviews... if Asus is still going to produce it!

Falwynn

 

[Booky]

I have the K7T266 Pro and yes it is stable. However I am getting disapointed with whats going on. I read at aceshardware that a recall may happen, which I will be happy with. If it does I will either get a revised K7T266 or the A7V266. I am definetly sticking with the KT266 chipset, I really think it is the winner, once they get it "tweaked".

Crap, all the good ones are already taken.