Dear Bethesda... - page 2

176 answers Last reply
  1. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    chainbreaker wrote:
    >
    > But there are still plenty of "real" Latin names with no more than a couple
    > of syllables. And probably those that did have the tonguetwisters had much
    > shorter nicknames.

    "Caius Cosades" was a pretty standard Cyrodiilic name in Morrowind. The
    polysyballic names are Daedric or Dunmer. That is to say, expecting
    non-Dunmer to have Dunmer names is silly, and asking Bethesda to not
    give Cyrodiils Morrowindesque names is like asking water to be wet.

    None of the Latinesque names were particularly long or "tongue
    twisterish", but then, outside some shrine names, none of the Morrowind
    names were tongue twisterish, either.

    --
    Elizabeth D. Brooks | kali.magdalene@comcast.net | US2002021724
    Listowner: Aberrants_Worldwide, Fading_Suns_Games, TrinityRPG
    AeonAdventure | "Dobby likes us!" -- Smeagol
    -- http://www.theonering.net/scrapbook/view/6856
  2. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    Julie d'Aubigny wrote:
    > chainbreaker wrote:
    >>
    >> But there are still plenty of "real" Latin names with no more than a
    >> couple of syllables. And probably those that did have the
    >> tonguetwisters had much shorter nicknames.
    >
    > "Caius Cosades" was a pretty standard Cyrodiilic name in Morrowind.
    > The polysyballic names are Daedric or Dunmer. That is to say,
    > expecting non-Dunmer to have Dunmer names is silly, and asking
    > Bethesda to not
    > give Cyrodiils Morrowindesque names is like asking water to be wet.

    Oh, I agree that their naming conventions isn't a particularly shattering
    problem. And I've already mentioned how I handle names, not just in MW but
    anywhere, that I think are a bit much to bite off.

    But I do see the point a bit--but IMO that's easily handled by giving the
    character in question your own nickname. <shrug>
    --
    chainbreaker
  3. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    McGrandpa wrote:
    >
    > For myself, it's just part of the adventure, trying out all the new
    > names of people and places. I still have to look up how to spell Ald
    > Runh (sp?) and I've been keeping my stash there for the last 2 1/2
    > years! :)

    Ald'Ruhn. :) Which is really a corruption of "Old Run," IIRC.

    --
    Elizabeth D. Brooks | kali.magdalene@comcast.net | US2002021724
    Listowner: Aberrants_Worldwide, Fading_Suns_Games, TrinityRPG
    AeonAdventure | "Dobby likes us!" -- Smeagol
    -- http://www.theonering.net/scrapbook/view/6856
  4. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    On Fri, 29 Oct 2004 05:10:04 GMT, Julie d'Aubigny
    <kali.magdalene@comcast.net> wrote:

    >Yeah, 'cause names like Caius Cosades, Nibani Maesa, Ra'Virr, and the
    >like are so impossible to recall.

    Actually the ones that threw me were places with VERY similar names
    like Ainat / Ainab or the Hlervi Ancestral Tomb vs the Hlervu
    Ancentral Tomb. Probably the hardest for me to keep straight was
    Zaintirari vs Zaintiraris which are two quite different (and
    moderately important) places.

    The similarity of the two names as opposed to the exoticness of them
    in other words.
  5. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    On Fri, 29 Oct 2004 16:58:15 GMT, sethra <azoblue@myrealboxDOT.com>
    wrote:

    >Back in the good 'ole days, the days of Heart of the Maelstrom, The Bard's
    >Tale and the Quest of the Avatar, before the era of giga-whatsit-fast
    >machines and automap, when we played our RPGs on 25 *mega*hertz 16-color
    >coal-burning computers (electricity hadn't been invented yet!) when we
    >came across somebody or something important,
    >
    >We
    >
    >*GASP*
    >
    >*Wrote* *It* *Down*
    >
    >;)

    I'm sure I've still got my old maps from Wizardry I somewhere. What I
    disliked about that game was that the elevators from levels 1-5 and
    5-10 were too easy to access so that in each of my games my characters
    got the 5-10 key too early meaning that levels 6-9 didn't get the
    attention they probably deserved. I _DID_ play them but mostly I
    wanted to get down to the basement to kill Werdna and his hordes which
    you were able to do again and again and was a far greater challenge
    than the 6-9 monsters.

    I remember well the time I got back to the surface having killed
    Werdna and having my entire party dead except for one character with
    two hit points left...I _really_ felt I ruled that night - certainly
    far more than my alchemy induced 27000 strength mage killed Dagoth Ur
    in two strokes.
  6. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    "Julie d'Aubigny" <kali.magdalene@comcast.net> wrote in message
    news:4183689C.17A57B5D@comcast.net
    > McGrandpa wrote:
    >>
    >> For myself, it's just part of the adventure, trying out all the new
    >> names of people and places. I still have to look up how to spell Ald
    >> Runh (sp?) and I've been keeping my stash there for the last 2 1/2
    >> years! :)
    >
    > Ald'Ruhn. :) Which is really a corruption of "Old Run," IIRC.

    See! You can be an old fart with slipping memory and still enjoy the
    game fine :) Oh I can't wait for Oblivion! Hm...that didn't sound
    right...
    McG :o\
  7. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    "chainbreaker" <noone@nowhere.com> wrote in message
    news:cm020601ogb@news4.newsguy.com
    > Julie d'Aubigny wrote:
    >> chainbreaker wrote:
    >>>
    >>> But there are still plenty of "real" Latin names with no more than a
    >>> couple of syllables. And probably those that did have the
    >>> tonguetwisters had much shorter nicknames.
    >>
    >> "Caius Cosades" was a pretty standard Cyrodiilic name in Morrowind.
    >> The polysyballic names are Daedric or Dunmer. That is to say,
    >> expecting non-Dunmer to have Dunmer names is silly, and asking
    >> Bethesda to not
    >> give Cyrodiils Morrowindesque names is like asking water to be wet.
    >
    > Oh, I agree that their naming conventions isn't a particularly
    > shattering problem. And I've already mentioned how I handle names,
    > not just in MW but anywhere, that I think are a bit much to bite off.
    >
    > But I do see the point a bit--but IMO that's easily handled by giving
    > the character in question your own nickname. <shrug>

    Ha! I do that! It's kinda automatic. Ijust think of anyones long or
    hard to pronounce name and I come up with a short version. Some RL folk
    don't much like that tho.
    McG.
  8. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    toolstech scrawled the following into the Great Almanac of
    comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg:

    > I can see Bethesda's stance on this, though. The names of most of
    > the Imperial characters have Latin(ish) sounding names and much of
    > the character style is reminiscent of the Roman empire. So if you
    > see a character named Cadisius Whatshisnameisticus or some-such, it
    > fits with the setting.

    Exactly. I enjoyed the variety of names in Morrowind -- it's fun when a
    character tells you to find XYZ and you immediately realize what race
    XYY is. Nor did I find the names hard to remember, and from what I
    remember of my time on the official forums, neither did most others.
    (Some of the shrines/ruins are an exception, but I think they are
    *meant* to have weird tongue-twister names to emphasize the alien nature
    of the Dwemer and the Daedra and their worshippers.) My guess is that
    people who write "that guy who blah blah blah" are often just plan lazy,
    the type who can't be arsed to read manuals, take notes or use a forum's
    search function.


    --
    Sarah Jaernecke
    Nightfire --==(UDIC)==--
    "There are two means of refuge from the miseries of life -- music and
    cats."
    - Albert Schweitzer
  9. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    drocket scrawled the following into the Great Almanac of
    comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg:

    > I'd like to break in with a different theory:
    >
    > In my opinion, the character names in Morrowind aren't that difficult
    > to pronounce and remember (with the exception of the Daedra, but hey,
    > they're Daedra...) The problem is just that there's so many NPCs
    > that its impossible to keep them all straight.

    Hmm. I think you have a point, especially since there's a little NPC
    characterization. Most people look the same and say exactly the same
    things. Still, I don't think it's much of a feat to at least remember
    the faction leaders and other important quest givers, at least not more
    than in other games.


    --
    Sarah Jaernecke
    Nightfire --==(UDIC)==--
    "There are two means of refuge from the miseries of life -- music and
    cats."
    - Albert Schweitzer
  10. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    Julie d'Aubigny scrawled the following into the Great Almanac of
    comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg:

    > Ald'Ruhn. :) Which is really a corruption of "Old Run," IIRC.

    It means "Old Home", actually. "Balmora" is "Stone Wood" and Sadrith
    Mora means "Forest of Mushrooms". "Vvardenfell", the name of the island
    Morrowind takes place on, is the Dwemer term for "City of the Strong
    Shield". All in all, there are about twenty Dunmer or Dwemer words in
    the game. I love this kind of attention to detail in worldbuilding. :)


    --
    Sarah Jaernecke
    Nightfire --==(UDIC)==--
    "Real life, while superior in graphics, lacks a reliable and tested
    reload option. It is also somewhat slow on most hardware."
    - Magnus Itland on alt.games.elder-scrolls
  11. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    On Fri, 29 Oct 2004 17:46:36 GMT, "Flingel Bunt" <none@none.none>
    wrote:

    >Yo
    >
    >"Opticreep" <opticreep@yahoo.com> wrote in message
    >news:9e1f277e.0410290918.69142469@posting.google.com...
    >
    ><snipped>
    >
    >> No, apparently you did not. The game plays quite differently when
    >> you're sitting in that high and mighty chair of yours.
    >
    >Ooooooooooooooooooh. Handbags at 20 paces!

    <twitch>
  12. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    But they have so many NPC's they can't possibly find normal names for them
    all...

    "joe~V~3838" <jms2@gbronline.com> wrote in message
    news:vpKdnTxoKt0UYh3cRVn-tg@gbronline.com...
    I agree with you Opticreep, I complained about this years ago.
    I dislike all these long assed names that very few can pronounce
    in games too. Especially when you have so many NPCs as
    morrowind did. There are tons of easy to remember, easy to
    pronounce names out there, but no, Bethesda has to have a
    random name generator running to get some of those names
    they used... Fatretzulata Kortintuquaipz
    lol........


    "Opticreep" <opticreep@yahoo.com> wrote in message
    news:9e1f277e.0410280336.31d84096@posting.google.com...
    > Dear Bethesda,
    >
    > When you make Elder Scrolls IV, please make sure that the inhabitants
    > of the virtual land have names that are easy to remember. Please try
    > to refrain from making your loyal customers try to remember the names
    > of hundreds of names that are seemingly composed of 25+ strange
    > letters seemingly arranged at random, often including four or five
    > consonants in a row.
    >
    > Here's a hint: If the name is unpronounceable by an adult American,
    > then you should probably choose a simpler name. Frodo. Gandalf.
    > Kulgan. Arthur. I'd even settle for a John Smith. But enough with
    > all the "Deaxythol Arsthruoxal".
    >
    > Thank you for listening.
  13. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    > Dear Bethesda,
    >
    > Just give us a journal that keeps track of all the individual NPCs
    > that we've spoken with, what they said and where they're located.
    > If you do that, we won't need to remember much, it'll all be there
    > in the journal. You've done a good job with the present journal,
    > just increase it's capabilities a bit and make it easier to use.
    > Thanks.

    I could get behind that idea. Also, another suggestion is to do what a lot
    of other games do, and for any character who is unimportant, as in, not
    related to any quest, doesn't offer any services, doesn't give you any
    information you can't get from everyone else, etc., don't bother naming
    them. They got this partially right, by not naming all the Ordinators and
    other guards in the various cities, but there's still so many useless extras
    that they wasted the time to give names to that it does get a bit confusing.
    I mean, if I go into some random cave, and there's a bunch of bandits there
    that attack me and I kill them all, I don't need to know what their names
    were. I don't need to know the names of every slave I free, or every
    peasant and every minor noble in every village. Heck, I really don't need
    to know the names of most of the merchants, but I'll live with that. Just
    label them as "Bandit" or "Slave" or "Peasant", and that would be enough.
    Only give names to the characters that matter. It saves time for the
    developpers, and saves frustration for the players.
  14. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    > When you make Elder Scrolls IV, please make sure that the inhabitants
    > of the virtual land have names that are easy to remember. Please try
    > to refrain from making your loyal customers try to remember the names
    > of hundreds of names that are seemingly composed of 25+ strange
    > letters seemingly arranged at random, often including four or five
    > consonants in a row.
    >
    > Here's a hint: If the name is unpronounceable by an adult American,
    > then you should probably choose a simpler name. Frodo. Gandalf.
    > Kulgan. Arthur. I'd even settle for a John Smith. But enough with
    > all the "Deaxythol Arsthruoxal".

    Also, if your game world is as huge and widely populated as this one is, and
    you're given a quest that says "Find XXX and make him give me back my
    pants"*, it would help if you gave the player even a vague clue where one
    might go about finding him.

    *An actual quest. There's a guy in the river just south of Gnisis whose
    pants were stolen. I've searched every building in town and still can't
    seem to find the notorious pants thief. I even found what I assumed to be
    his house, as it has the same name, but I had to pick the lock to get in,
    and neither him nor the pants were anywhere to be found. I finally decided
    that it probably just wasn't worth the effort, as I'd probably get
    next-to-nothing for it, like most of the side-quests in the game...
  15. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls (More info?)

    On Sun, 31 Oct 2004 11:19:23 -0500, "Darrel Hoffman" <i.dont@think.so>
    wrote:

    >Also, if your game world is as huge and widely populated as this one is, and
    >you're given a quest that says "Find XXX and make him give me back my
    >pants"*, it would help if you gave the player even a vague clue where one
    >might go about finding him.

    That bugs me, too. There are several quests where you have to go to a
    town and locate a certain person and sometimes you are given no clue
    as to where that person is. The real problem is that you are not
    given the option to ask anyone where they are, either. I miss the
    "Where is . . . Person" option in Daggerfall.

    >*An actual quest. There's a guy in the river just south of Gnisis whose
    >pants were stolen. I've searched every building in town and still can't
    >seem to find the notorious pants thief. I even found what I assumed to be
    >his house, as it has the same name, but I had to pick the lock to get in,
    >and neither him nor the pants were anywhere to be found. I finally decided
    >that it probably just wasn't worth the effort, as I'd probably get
    >next-to-nothing for it, like most of the side-quests in the game...
    >
    Actually the guy is walking around outside not far from the river.
    Though he can wander pretty far, he is usually somewhere between the
    river and the merchants' stalls. You don't get much for the quest --
    some Hackle-Lo leaves, I think.
    --
    Nyctolops
  16. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    Darrel Hoffman wrote:
    > know the names of most of the merchants, but I'll live with that.
    > Just label them as "Bandit" or "Slave" or "Peasant", and that would
    > be enough. Only give names to the characters that matter. It saves
    > time for the developpers, and saves frustration for the players.

    Great idea.

    --
    chainbreaker
  17. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    "Matthew Shaw" <matted@[REMOVETHIS]bigpond.net.au> wrote in message
    news:Di3hd.5341$K7.4848@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
    > But they have so many NPC's they can't possibly find normal names for
    > them all...
    >

    Ahh you mean unlike the 240 million people in the USA
    with (mostly) pronounceable names :-)

    Funny enough there is a guy at Molag Mar with a really plebby
    name like Bill Jones or similar. It made me do a double take.


    --

    Edward Cowling - London - UK
  18. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls (More info?)

    >> Well, ever since Tolkien, Dwarvish language has been extremely difficult
    >> to pronounce, even harder to decipher, filled with far too many
    >> consonants
    >
    > So Dwarves speak Croat?

    Actually Croat (particularly the dalmatian dialect) is the most vocal of all
    former Yugoslav languages. It has a definite melodic accent ;-)

    Btw. I was recently playing around with an online name generator. My goal
    was to simulate the feel of the Shona language spoken in Zimbabwe. Some of
    the How about names like this:

    (Note that in Shona you pronounce 'sv' as 'sh', and 'zv' is its voiced
    counterpart. A,e,i,o,u like in Latin/Spanish).

    Zvasembwore
    Chimangwisenda
    Mungwevisire
    Chatebira
    Mungoforai
    Kutobore
    Tavagire
    Munotirwenda
    Ndivopora
    Musekorwai
    Mufatidze
    Kwatedoranga
    Kuzejorwa
    Chibukora
    Chipikororwa
    Chasatirwai
    Chanabidzai
    Chimopisire
    Vasowidzire
    Musabisenda
    Kutinabe
    Zvagofirenda
    Chaduma
    Tingopabe
    Tideporai
    Ndasvinga
    Vanegwai
    Chapuka
    Tavekire
    Tsvajude
    Tsvakwopai
    Chizide
    Mufosa
    Charafidze
    Chabangwise
    Vakege
    Vawure
    Tabeweshe
    Tamugora
    Tigwinorai
    Ndapinge
    Chajokwa
    Ndisafai
    Chagome
    Chinatabe
    Tigwasai
    Zvamopanga
    Kuwapore
    Tividai
    Ndatifanga
    Muvakwa
    Ndabosvire
    Vawapwa
    Kudimanga
    Tamojire
    Zvaferanga
    Chigere
    Vamofai
    Tadima
    Chakiborai
    Zvapoma
    Kutepe
    Kusvingwa
    Tsvamuda
    Kwafarire
    Zvajupirwai
    Vadubwai
    Kwadisva
    Kunagwai
    Tsvavekirwa
    Tirofise
    Mutuvirai
    Tizafenda
    Vatunge
    Kunudabe
    Tivegidza
    Tasaga
    Zvajogwe
    Mugwesire
    Kukwazvirai
    Tinaja
    Chifasirwa
    Ndazana
    Ndimanwa
    Tigomisa
    Chawikorora
    Kwarasai
    Tikanisa
    Tifankwa
    Chatuve
    Chisiridze
    Zvasembwa
    Vawasai
    Kwawaranga
    Mugifai
    Ndisoka
    Tibankwira
    Kufegai
    Tadonkwa
    Tingwape
    Tazovire
    Zvabuka
    Ndizegwe
    Kusurai
    Tanumenda
    Ndingapira
    Tibuzvanga
    Zvasifai
    Kugwosve
    Chisoda
    Zvanegwisai
    Chisingwai
    Vadarwa
    Zvabasire
    Chiwaneshe
    Chizinge
    Chibezve
    Kumedenda
    Tagewanga
    Chikuda
    Kwarewai
    Zvaneme
    Tsvavanise
    Timankwire
    Chizabe
    Ndavoga
    Kumifanga
    Chidede
    Chakasenda
    Chabaneshe
    Ndivarabe
    Tasvugai
    Kwasakanga
    Tsvamite
    Titunge
    Vajewe
    Kuroja
    Chikozvirire
    Chinevabe
    Chiwenkwai
    Timadenda
    Vapuja
    Chasvikwai
    Mufena
    Chavewanga
    Murigwai
    Kwasvuma
    Chiwowe
    Chakwife
    Tamasvidzwe
    Kuriwe
    Tamozvisa
    Tibakidza
    Kugwewai
    Chigasire
    Chakava
    Chaguridzai
    Tapesire
    Chizigorai
    Tafobai
    Tsvadara
    Kujapanga
    Chimenabe
    Tingwovore
    Kupodire
    Vaneme
    Tavedai
    Vakogwa
    Kwabate
    Chiwereshe
    Tinkwisorwai
    Tsvatungwe
    Chajamisai
    Chabera
    Ndasverai
    Kuzokai
    Musirenda
    Chimakwa
    Zvajanwenda
    Tameme

    That's all folks!

    Szczepan Holyszewski
    (pronounce THAT!)
  19. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    "Edward Cowling" <ec015g7081@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote in message
    news:9_4hd.20199$cn.7729@fe1.news.blueyonder.co.uk
    > "Matthew Shaw" <matted@[REMOVETHIS]bigpond.net.au> wrote in message
    > news:Di3hd.5341$K7.4848@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
    >> But they have so many NPC's they can't possibly find normal names for
    >> them all...
    >>
    >
    > Ahh you mean unlike the 240 million people in the USA
    > with (mostly) pronounceable names :-)
    >
    > Funny enough there is a guy at Molag Mar with a really plebby
    > name like Bill Jones or similar. It made me do a double take.

    Hey, what about Gentleman Jim, he's in there! That's the one that woke
    me up :)
    McG.
  20. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    On Sun, 31 Oct 2004 12:35:17 GMT, "Edward Cowling"
    <ec015g7081@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:

    >Ahh you mean unlike the 240 million people in the USA
    >with (mostly) pronounceable names :-)

    And all unique, yes? Oh, wait...

    Seriously, do you really want to have to figure out which one of 5
    John Smiths you're supposed to talk to in any one given town? It
    would certainly be more realistic, but from a gameplay perspective, it
    would drive me crazy...
  21. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    Darrel Hoffman wrote:
    >
    > *An actual quest. There's a guy in the river just south of Gnisis whose
    > pants were stolen. I've searched every building in town and still can't
    > seem to find the notorious pants thief. I even found what I assumed to be
    > his house, as it has the same name, but I had to pick the lock to get in,
    > and neither him nor the pants were anywhere to be found. I finally decided
    > that it probably just wasn't worth the effort, as I'd probably get
    > next-to-nothing for it, like most of the side-quests in the game...

    Hainab stole his pants, and Hainab's not in any building. I found him
    wandering around near the silt strider.

    --
    Elizabeth D. Brooks | kali.magdalene@comcast.net | US2002021724
    Listowner: Aberrants_Worldwide, Fading_Suns_Games, TrinityRPG
    AeonAdventure | "Dobby likes us!" -- Smeagol
    -- http://www.theonering.net/scrapbook/view/6856
  22. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    McGrandpa wrote:
    >
    > "Edward Cowling" <ec015g7081@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote in message
    > news:9_4hd.20199$cn.7729@fe1.news.blueyonder.co.uk
    > > "Matthew Shaw" <matted@[REMOVETHIS]bigpond.net.au> wrote in message
    > > news:Di3hd.5341$K7.4848@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
    > >> But they have so many NPC's they can't possibly find normal names for
    > >> them all...
    > >>
    > >
    > > Ahh you mean unlike the 240 million people in the USA
    > > with (mostly) pronounceable names :-)
    > >
    > > Funny enough there is a guy at Molag Mar with a really plebby
    > > name like Bill Jones or similar. It made me do a double take.
    >
    > Hey, what about Gentleman Jim, he's in there! That's the one that woke
    > me up :)

    Gentleman Jim Stacey is great. :)

    --
    Elizabeth D. Brooks | kali.magdalene@comcast.net | US2002021724
    Listowner: Aberrants_Worldwide, Fading_Suns_Games, TrinityRPG
    AeonAdventure | "Dobby likes us!" -- Smeagol
    -- http://www.theonering.net/scrapbook/view/6856
  23. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    Opticreep wrote:

    > Try having someone read the words "Adondasi Sadalvel" and "Athyn
    > Sarethi" today. Try having them say the same words tomorrow from
    > memory. See if they can pronounce it properly.

    Try having someone read the names of two random "real life" people and
    then have them say the same words tomorrow. 99% of people won't even
    remember anything vaguely about the names. What's your point again?
    --

    -Bill
  24. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    Alan wrote:

    > Then there are neighborhoods in the US with street names like Blackberry Ln, Blackberry
    > Cir, Blackberry Pl, Blackberry Av, and Blackberry St all within a few blocks of each other.
    > Throw in the E W N S variants and you've got quite a maze of twisty little passages, all
    > alike. What's a FedEx delivery person to do?

    Get fricking confused. I live on White Bridge Lane which was built off
    of what used to be White Bridge Road before they tore down the actual
    White Bridge and built a new bridge a mile thataway. They renamed the
    White Bridge Road near me to 125th Street and the bit of it up the road
    a ways to 19th Avenue and I forget what the bit on the other side of the
    river is named. And the road over the new bridge is now White Bridge
    Road although the bridge is anything but white.

    And over in town there is a 1st Street NW and NE and SW and SE and
    there's a 1st Avenue NW and NE and SW and SE.
    --

    -Bill
  25. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    Julie d'Aubigny wrote:

    > Darrel Hoffman wrote:
    >
    >>*An actual quest. There's a guy in the river just south of Gnisis whose
    >>pants were stolen. I've searched every building in town and still can't
    >>seem to find the notorious pants thief. I even found what I assumed to be
    >>his house, as it has the same name, but I had to pick the lock to get in,
    >>and neither him nor the pants were anywhere to be found. I finally decided
    >>that it probably just wasn't worth the effort, as I'd probably get
    >>next-to-nothing for it, like most of the side-quests in the game...
    >
    >
    > Hainab stole his pants, and Hainab's not in any building. I found him
    > wandering around near the silt strider.
    >

    About 100 feet from the guy in the river actually, probably less.
    --

    -Bill
  26. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    Julie d'Aubigny wrote:
    > chainbreaker wrote:
    >
    >>But there are still plenty of "real" Latin names with no more than a couple
    >>of syllables. And probably those that did have the tonguetwisters had much
    >>shorter nicknames.
    >
    >
    > "Caius Cosades" was a pretty standard Cyrodiilic name in Morrowind. The
    > polysyballic names are Daedric or Dunmer. That is to say, expecting
    > non-Dunmer to have Dunmer names is silly, and asking Bethesda to not
    > give Cyrodiils Morrowindesque names is like asking water to be wet.

    I had difficulty with the Dunmer/Daedric/Dwemer names as well. While
    they certainly were pronounceable, I found them very hard to remember
    without writing down.

    Having the different cultures of Tamriel have different types of names
    is internally consistent. Having one culture choose names that are
    extremely hard for English speakers to remember - well, maybe that's
    "realistic", but it can be very frustrating for the player.

    b*
  27. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    Bill Seurer wrote:

    > And over in town there is a 1st Street NW and NE and SW and SE and
    > there's a 1st Avenue NW and NE and SW and SE.

    This, in most towns, is usually done in a way that's very
    organized actually. All streets are east/west, all avenues
    are north/south, w/'blvd's', 'place' and others for more
    weird type roads/directions.

    Same w/the NW, NE, SW, and SE ya mention, usually
    indicating the quadrant of the town the street is in -
    everything north of x is 'whatever st. N', and at point 'x'
    the numbers reset (so yet another 1st street, but this being
    the first street north of point x is '1st st. N'),
    everything west of z is 'whatever avenue W' and again the
    numbers reset (so yet another 1st ave, but this one being
    1st ave W). You don't even really need to know where point
    x and z are (and sometimes rather than points, a natural or
    artificial barrier will be used, such as a river or freeway).

    Once you know this you can find anyone's house or any place
    of business by simply having an address, even in areas
    you've never been and w/out having consulted a map.
    Assuming they've properly used this system.

    Of course, there are the occasional towns that don't adhere
    to this system which is real annoying. And even w/those
    that do, there's named streets 'white bridge street N.' -
    its a street so still east/west, but is it the first or the
    8th or 50th street north of point x? Ya don't know. So ya
    pick an avenue and drive north of point X for you don't know
    how long till ya come across it.

    And of course there are cities that adhere to the system,
    but have unique oddities/exceptions, such as my city of
    Seattle (at yesler, suddenly everything is at an angle to
    everything north of it. And its all because when the city
    was originally being platted out of the wilderness by 3
    people, the one doing the southern part was *drunk*, and for
    some reason they just kept it the way he did it anyhow).
    Another oddity in seattle that,this time, is shared by many
    other places is - one way streets. Sure ya know by the
    address right where to go, but once ya get there ya find it
    kinda fun to get right in front of the building as ya never
    seem to be able to turn the direction ya want to turn
    because the one way streets are always going the *wrong*
    way, hehe.

    Now, do cities in video games use such an organized method
    for their streets? Probably not, though I do remember a mud
    once that did.
    Leo
  28. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    "Julie d'Aubigny" <kali.magdalene@comcast.net> wrote in message
    news:4181D09E.7F826A36@comcast.net...
    > Opticreep wrote:

    >> go to a shrine whose name is somewhere along the lines of dsyraxola or
    >> dsyrxoltt or somesuch.

    I don't remember any names with Aztec or Mayan roots in the game...
  29. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    "sethra" <azoblue@myrealboxDOT.com> wrote in message
    news:Xns959165A1B5587be83ec93f4a@68.1.17.6...
    > drocket <drocket@hotmail.com> wrote in

    > coal-burning computers (electricity hadn't been invented yet!) when we
    > came across somebody or something important,
    >
    > We
    >
    > *GASP*
    >
    > *Wrote* *It* *Down*

    Not to mention the reams and reams of graph paper spent on meticulously
    drawing out maps of dungeons so we could find the way out again... Or back
    in if the location was important...
  30. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    To each his (or her) own....

    The names didn't bother me at all, in fact I kind of liked the way
    they did it. Anyway, I always keep a written journal handy when
    role-playing and there is the in-game journal for that, too. Ever
    been to a foreign country? Or, Hawaii even? Try pronouncing, or
    remembering those long crazy, all-consonant Hawaiian road names,
    especially those that are abbreviated! I was just as confused there
    as I've ever been in Morrowind.

    To me, there are other more puzzling design decisions in the game,
    than the naming conventions. Although, not nearly as many as there
    were in Daggerfall. DF almost seemed to be designed/programmed by a
    group of people who never talked to each other.

    Anode
    *** Yes, I'm positive! ***


    Leo <Anonymous@Anonymous.com> wrote in message news:<henhd.4549$pY6.1921@trnddc04>...
    > Bill Seurer wrote:
    >
    > > And over in town there is a 1st Street NW and NE and SW and SE and
    > > there's a 1st Avenue NW and NE and SW and SE.
    >
    > This, in most towns, is usually done in a way that's very
    > organized actually. All streets are east/west, all avenues
    > are north/south, w/'blvd's', 'place' and others for more
    > weird type roads/directions.
    >
    > Same w/the NW, NE, SW, and SE ya mention, usually
    > indicating the quadrant of the town the street is in -
    > everything north of x is 'whatever st. N', and at point 'x'
    > the numbers reset (so yet another 1st street, but this being
    > the first street north of point x is '1st st. N'),
    > everything west of z is 'whatever avenue W' and again the
    > numbers reset (so yet another 1st ave, but this one being
    > 1st ave W). You don't even really need to know where point
    > x and z are (and sometimes rather than points, a natural or
    > artificial barrier will be used, such as a river or freeway).
    >
    > Once you know this you can find anyone's house or any place
    > of business by simply having an address, even in areas
    > you've never been and w/out having consulted a map.
    > Assuming they've properly used this system.
    >
    > Of course, there are the occasional towns that don't adhere
    > to this system which is real annoying. And even w/those
    > that do, there's named streets 'white bridge street N.' -
    > its a street so still east/west, but is it the first or the
    > 8th or 50th street north of point x? Ya don't know. So ya
    > pick an avenue and drive north of point X for you don't know
    > how long till ya come across it.
    >
    > And of course there are cities that adhere to the system,
    > but have unique oddities/exceptions, such as my city of
    > Seattle (at yesler, suddenly everything is at an angle to
    > everything north of it. And its all because when the city
    > was originally being platted out of the wilderness by 3
    > people, the one doing the southern part was *drunk*, and for
    > some reason they just kept it the way he did it anyhow).
    > Another oddity in seattle that,this time, is shared by many
    > other places is - one way streets. Sure ya know by the
    > address right where to go, but once ya get there ya find it
    > kinda fun to get right in front of the building as ya never
    > seem to be able to turn the direction ya want to turn
    > because the one way streets are always going the *wrong*
    > way, hehe.
    >
    > Now, do cities in video games use such an organized method
    > for their streets? Probably not, though I do remember a mud
    > once that did.
    > Leo
  31. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    Paul Fedorenko wrote:
    > "sethra" <azoblue@myrealboxDOT.com> wrote in message
    > news:Xns959165A1B5587be83ec93f4a@68.1.17.6...
    >> drocket <drocket@hotmail.com> wrote in
    >
    >> coal-burning computers (electricity hadn't been invented yet!) when
    >> we came across somebody or something important,
    >>
    >> We
    >>
    >> *GASP*
    >>
    >> *Wrote* *It* *Down*
    >
    > Not to mention the reams and reams of graph paper spent on
    > meticulously drawing out maps of dungeons so we could find the way
    > out again... Or back in if the location was important...


    Yeah, and I hated those days too, may they be lost forever. Blah.

    I always felt that the main reason most of that stuff was there was simply
    to artificially make the game last longer.

    You run out of decent content?

    No problem--just add a couple of mazes. Yuck.

    Very few games did mazes "right" IMO--one that did was Lands of Lore. Great
    game, that.

    --
    chainbreaker

    If you need to email, then chainbreaker (naturally) at comcast dot
    net--that's "net" not "com"--should do it.
  32. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls (More info?)

    "Szczepan Holyszewski" <rulatir@wp.pl> skrev i meddelelsen
    news:cL5hd.47073$z77.27582@news.chello.at:

    > Szczepan Holyszewski
    > (pronounce THAT!)

    Well - Stefan? :-)

    --
    "We all have private ails. The troublemakers are they
    who need public cures for their private ails." Eric Hoffer
    Med venlig hilsen
    Georg
  33. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    > Or, Hawaii even? Try pronouncing, or
    > remembering those long crazy, all-consonant Hawaiian road names,
    > especially those that are abbreviated!

    Aren't most Hawaiian words made of mostly vowels, not consonants?
  34. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    Darrel Hoffman wrote:
    >>Or, Hawaii even? Try pronouncing, or
    >>remembering those long crazy, all-consonant Hawaiian road names,
    >>especially those that are abbreviated!
    >
    >
    > Aren't most Hawaiian words made of mostly vowels, not consonants?

    Dredging up my vague memories from phonology class, I think that
    Hawaiian syllables are all either vowel or constant-vowel, with a very
    short list of them to choose from. If I recall correctly, it is
    phonetically one of the simplest languages in the world.

    MSH
  35. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    Opticreep wrote:
    > Dear Bethesda,
    >
    > When you make Elder Scrolls IV, please make sure that the inhabitants
    > of the virtual land have names that are easy to remember. Please try
    > to refrain from making your loyal customers try to remember the names
    > of hundreds of names that are seemingly composed of 25+ strange
    > letters seemingly arranged at random, often including four or five
    > consonants in a row.
    >
    > Here's a hint: If the name is unpronounceable by an adult American,
    > then you should probably choose a simpler name. Frodo. Gandalf.
    > Kulgan. Arthur. I'd even settle for a John Smith. But enough with
    > all the "Deaxythol Arsthruoxal".
    >
    > Thank you for listening.

    While I am an American myself, I really don't see why you think the
    names should cater to Americans.
  36. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    mark foster wrote:
    > "Opticreep" <opticreep@yahoo.com> wrote in message
    > news:9e1f277e.0410280336.31d84096@posting.google.com...
    >
    >>Dear Bethesda,
    >
    >
    >>Here's a hint: If the name is unpronounceable by an adult American,
    >>then you should probably choose a simpler name. Frodo. Gandalf.
    >>Kulgan. Arthur. I'd even settle for a John Smith. But enough with
    >>all the "Deaxythol Arsthruoxal".
    >>
    >
    > p'ah, just because you Americans don't like learning new languages. Take an
    > evening class learning Welsh and you'll be fine with the names and they'll
    > be easy to remember because they all sound like nearby villages, or that's
    > what I've found at least.
    >
    >

    LOL, Although my ancestors were from Wales, I haven't dared attempt
    Welsh. I have tried to teach myself Gaelic. Not an easy task. I have
    found Japanese easier to learn. :)
  37. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    sandtiger wrote:
    > Opticreep wrote:
    >
    >> Dear Bethesda,
    >>
    >> When you make Elder Scrolls IV, please make sure that the inhabitants
    >> of the virtual land have names that are easy to remember. Please try
    >> to refrain from making your loyal customers try to remember the names
    >> of hundreds of names that are seemingly composed of 25+ strange
    >> letters seemingly arranged at random, often including four or five
    >> consonants in a row.
    >>
    >> Here's a hint: If the name is unpronounceable by an adult American,
    >> then you should probably choose a simpler name. Frodo. Gandalf.
    >> Kulgan. Arthur. I'd even settle for a John Smith. But enough with
    >> all the "Deaxythol Arsthruoxal".
    >>
    >> Thank you for listening.
    >
    >
    > Dear Valued Customer,
    >
    > Thank you for your recent feedback. We will be taking your advice and
    > renaming all of our NPC's "Leslie" - this will eliminate the need to
    > remember any names at all. Additionally, so as to minimize the need to
    > remember what they look like, we will make them all identical.
    >
    > We're also pleased to announce that, with our new FontBlaster2005
    > rendering engine, we will be able to take advantage of both ATi and
    > nVidia's latest graphics technology when we render the letters of those
    > Leslies. Each letter will be lovingly hand-crafted and then traced by
    > Ray, our in-house letterer before being placed into the exciting new
    > game that is Elder Scrolls: IV.
    >
    > Thank you, and please continue purchasing Bethesda products.

    LOL! Makes me want to rush out and buy it. :)
  38. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    Edward Cowling wrote:
    > "Matthew Shaw" <matted@[REMOVETHIS]bigpond.net.au> wrote in message
    > news:Di3hd.5341$K7.4848@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
    >
    >>But they have so many NPC's they can't possibly find normal names for
    >>them all...
    >>
    >
    >
    > Ahh you mean unlike the 240 million people in the USA
    > with (mostly) pronounceable names :-)
    >
    > Funny enough there is a guy at Molag Mar with a really plebby
    > name like Bill Jones or similar. It made me do a double take.
    >
    >
    >

    We may have 240 million unique names in the USA...Heck, 140 million are
    probably John or James Smith. :)
  39. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    "Darrel Hoffman" <i.dont@think.so> skrev i en meddelelse
    news:Cf6dnYONX8fpkRjcRVn-hg@giganews.com...
    > > Dear Bethesda,
    > >
    > > Just give us a journal that keeps track of all the individual NPCs
    > > that we've spoken with, what they said and where they're located.
    > > If you do that, we won't need to remember much, it'll all be there
    > > in the journal. You've done a good job with the present journal,
    > > just increase it's capabilities a bit and make it easier to use.
    > > Thanks.
    >
    > I could get behind that idea. Also, another suggestion is to do what a
    lot
    > of other games do, and for any character who is unimportant, as in, not
    > related to any quest, doesn't offer any services, doesn't give you any
    > information you can't get from everyone else, etc., don't bother naming
    > them. They got this partially right, by not naming all the Ordinators
    and
    > other guards in the various cities, but there's still so many useless
    extras
    > that they wasted the time to give names to that it does get a bit
    confusing.
    > I mean, if I go into some random cave, and there's a bunch of bandits
    there
    > that attack me and I kill them all, I don't need to know what their
    names
    > were. I don't need to know the names of every slave I free, or every
    > peasant and every minor noble in every village. Heck, I really don't
    need
    > to know the names of most of the merchants, but I'll live with that.
    Just
    > label them as "Bandit" or "Slave" or "Peasant", and that would be
    enough.
    > Only give names to the characters that matter. It saves time for the
    > developpers, and saves frustration for the players.
    >
    >

    You might get used to the idea, because Oblivion will very possibly have
    even more individual names. It add to the real-world feeling.

    merlin
  40. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    "Werner Arend" <nefar@arcor.de> skrev i en meddelelse
    news:clt9p8$lrf$1@news1.rz.uni-duesseldorf.de...
    > Jonathan Ellis wrote:
    > >
    > > Well, ever since Tolkien, Dwarvish language has been extremely
    difficult
    > > to pronounce, even harder to decipher, filled with far too many
    > > consonants, and kept pretty secret among the Dwarves (who are also
    > > invariably good at metalwork), in god only knows how many different
    > > universes. Was there ever any reason to suppose Tamriel might be
    > > different?
    >
    > What about "Tamriel isn't Middle Earth"?
    >
    > Anway, I had no problems whatsoever with almost all Morrowind
    > names. I liked them because they are, for the most part, exotic
    > but pronounceable. And for those that were not, well, I never
    > needed to pronounce them, I only needed to type them occasionally.
    > I can see how some people may have had difficulties - after all,
    > from what people tell me I gather I'm unusally good at remembering
    > exotic words. Simplifying the names in a way would be OK with me -
    > but please don't anglicize them. The exotic names were a big plus
    > in Morrowind and added to immersion quite a lot, especially since
    > NPC interaction, animation and pose didn't.
    >
    > Werner
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > >
    > > Jonathan.
    > >
    > >

    I haven't had cause to remember any name yet, let alone pronounce it.
    I very seldom pay attention to the names of the npc,s I tallk to anyway.
    And if I do need to keep them apart, I remember the location and not
    their name

    merlin
  41. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    "McGrandpa" <McGrandpaNOT@NOThotmail.com> skrev i en meddelelse
    news:iECgd.12970$lM1.46@fe2.texas.rr.com...
    > "Opticreep" <opticreep@yahoo.com> wrote in message
    > news:9e1f277e.0410290932.374bc888@posting.google.com
    > > Troll <newstroll@shaw.ca> wrote in message
    > > news:<a1jgd.47447$%k.46848@pd7tw2no>...
    > >>
    > >> Of course! It would add so much to the atmosphere of a game to cross
    > >> swords with the dreaded fighter-mage Mike Johnson, or the Goblin King
    > >> Bill Hancock....
    > >>
    > >
    > >
    > > Well, you *could* give them names like that if you were a moron.
    > >
    > > Alternatively, you could use names that are no less exotic, but still
    > > easy to remember. Names like Dupre, Shamino, Iolo, Minsc, Tarzak,
    > > Frodo, Kulgan, Gandalf, Milamber, and so forth. Too many names that
    > > are too difficult to remember, like those in the Elder Scrolls games,
    > > tend to take away from the immersion factor. IMHO, of course.
    >
    > It looks that it's the rythm of the names/words that's giving you
    > problems. Morrowind does seem to use a basic rythm throughout.
    > Then, there's Maik the Liar. Several peoples, and several semblances to
    > languages, the differences seem distinct. Orcish names in Morrowind
    > seem similar to what you asked for and gave a few examples to. And the
    > Elvish and Dwarven names the problems.
    > Frankly, I like the variety of names, all the differences. Even those I
    > know I wouldn't pronounce right.
    > It's a game. It's about a world and its populace, all of which only
    > exist in imagination of the people who develop and play it. It's far
    > better than television! It is, to me, as good as a good fantasy
    > adventure novel.
    > If Bethesda were to ask a vote on it, I'd say just keep on like you are.
    > It's great like it is. But I'm only one voice, and millions bought and
    > play the game.
    > Still and all, I do understand your irritation with the naming scheme.
    > McG.
    >
    >

    If you need company, I am all behind you there

    merlin
  42. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    "Sarah Jaernecke" <nightfire.udic@web.de> skrev i en meddelelse
    news:8il6o05qfkvga8tobvlh6cbbhv3fhqfo09@4ax.com...
    > drocket scrawled the following into the Great Almanac of
    > comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg:
    >
    > > I'd like to break in with a different theory:
    > >
    > > In my opinion, the character names in Morrowind aren't that difficult
    > > to pronounce and remember (with the exception of the Daedra, but hey,
    > > they're Daedra...) The problem is just that there's so many NPCs
    > > that its impossible to keep them all straight.
    >
    > Hmm. I think you have a point, especially since there's a little NPC
    > characterization. Most people look the same and say exactly the same
    > things. Still, I don't think it's much of a feat to at least remember
    > the faction leaders and other important quest givers, at least not more
    > than in other games.
    >
    >
    > --
    > Sarah Jaernecke
    > Nightfire --==(UDIC)==--
    > "There are two means of refuge from the miseries of life -- music and
    > cats."
    > - Albert Schweitzer

    I am curious. Have you at any time had a problem with progressing in a
    quest because you couldn't pronounce the questgivers name, or because
    you had forgotten it? Remembering their location, which they never leave,
    is good enough for me.
    There will be other, more disconcerting problems in Oblivion. Most
    npc's will have a schedule of their own. Which means, that they will
    not always be 'at home' when you need them, so you have to search
    for them. I think, remembering or pronouncing their names will be
    the least of our problems then

    merlin
  43. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    Todd Carnes <tcarnes@tds.net> looked up from reading the entrails of the
    porn spammer to utter "The Augury is good, the signs say:

    >mark foster wrote:
    >> "Opticreep" <opticreep@yahoo.com> wrote in message
    >> news:9e1f277e.0410280336.31d84096@posting.google.com...
    >>
    >>>Dear Bethesda,
    >>
    >>
    >>>Here's a hint: If the name is unpronounceable by an adult American,
    >>>then you should probably choose a simpler name. Frodo. Gandalf.
    >>>Kulgan. Arthur. I'd even settle for a John Smith. But enough with
    >>>all the "Deaxythol Arsthruoxal".
    >>>
    >>
    >> p'ah, just because you Americans don't like learning new languages. Take an
    >> evening class learning Welsh and you'll be fine with the names and they'll
    >> be easy to remember because they all sound like nearby villages, or that's
    >> what I've found at least.
    >>
    >>
    >
    >LOL, Although my ancestors were from Wales, I haven't dared attempt
    >Welsh. I have tried to teach myself Gaelic. Not an easy task. I have
    >found Japanese easier to learn. :)

    It's funny that you mention Gaelic and Japanese together.
    A while back I heard a demo recording of a song in Gaelic (O Ro Se Do
    Bheata Bhaile by Cruachan.)
    Maybe it's just the tone of voice and the rhythm the singer was using,
    but it sounded Japanese to me (like on an Anime soundtrack.)

    Xocyll
    --
    I don't particularly want you to FOAD, myself. You'll be more of
    a cautionary example if you'll FO And Get Chronically, Incurably,
    Painfully, Progressively, Expensively, Debilitatingly Ill. So
    FOAGCIPPEDI. -- Mike Andrews responding to an idiot in asr
  44. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    Merlin scrawled the following into the Great Almanac of
    comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg:

    > I am curious. Have you at any time had a problem with progressing
    > in a quest because you couldn't pronounce the questgivers name, or
    > because you had forgotten it?

    Nope. I have a pretty good memory for such things ... in games, at least
    .... I always have to think for a second or three to remember the last
    name of one of our neighboring families. :p Besides, there's the
    journal, and a thing called "taking notes".

    > Remembering their location, which they never leave, is good enough
    > for me. There will be other, more disconcerting problems in Oblivion. Most
    > npc's will have a schedule of their own. Which means, that they will
    > not always be 'at home' when you need them, so you have to search
    > for them.

    Good! The more "alive" a game is, the better. I really enjoyed KotOR,
    but in many ways it's utterly static, dead and boring. It's just a game.
    The old Ultimas, however, created a dynamic, unique world. I grew up
    with those games and others with similar features, and have missed them
    in the newer games.

    Oblivion looks promising. I'd better hold off upgrading my rig for
    awhile or I'll have to upgrade *again* when it comes out. ;)


    --
    Sarah Jaernecke
    Nightfire --==(UDIC)==--
    "Pre-menstrual syndrome: The five days a month when women act the way
    men act all the time."
    - Robert Heinlein
  45. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    Merlin wrote:
    >
    > There will be other, more disconcerting problems in Oblivion. Most
    > npc's will have a schedule of their own. Which means, that they will
    > not always be 'at home' when you need them, so you have to search
    > for them. I think, remembering or pronouncing their names will be
    > the least of our problems then

    I think that's a good thing personally, and adds to the realism. I'm
    running the NPCSchedules mod in Morrowind to add that functionality in
    atm.
  46. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    Pete MC <nomorespam@youbastids.com> wrote in message news:<41A5BA61.6ACD3D11@youbastids.com>...
    > Merlin wrote:
    > >
    > > There will be other, more disconcerting problems in Oblivion. Most
    > > npc's will have a schedule of their own. Which means, that they will
    > > not always be 'at home' when you need them, so you have to search
    > > for them. I think, remembering or pronouncing their names will be
    > > the least of our problems then
    >
    > I think that's a good thing personally, and adds to the realism. I'm
    > running the NPCSchedules mod in Morrowind to add that functionality in
    > atm.

    Yes, well, about the 108th time you have to wander around looking for
    an NPC, you will get tired of this.

    I've already done it 108 times in other games and am already tired of
    it.
  47. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    DeAnn wrote:
    >
    > Pete MC <nomorespam@youbastids.com> wrote in message news:<41A5BA61.6ACD3D11@youbastids.com>...
    > > Merlin wrote:
    > > >
    > > > There will be other, more disconcerting problems in Oblivion. Most
    > > > npc's will have a schedule of their own. Which means, that they will
    > > > not always be 'at home' when you need them, so you have to search
    > > > for them. I think, remembering or pronouncing their names will be
    > > > the least of our problems then
    > >
    > > I think that's a good thing personally, and adds to the realism. I'm
    > > running the NPCSchedules mod in Morrowind to add that functionality in
    > > atm.
    >
    > Yes, well, about the 108th time you have to wander around looking for
    > an NPC, you will get tired of this.
    >
    > I've already done it 108 times in other games and am already tired of
    > it.

    Nah, I prefer it. Anyway, if I'm in a rush there's always "placeatpc"
  48. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    DeAnn wrote:
    > Pete MC <nomorespam@youbastids.com> wrote in message news:<41A5BA61.6ACD3D11@youbastids.com>...
    >
    >>Merlin wrote:
    >>
    >>> There will be other, more disconcerting problems in Oblivion. Most
    >>> npc's will have a schedule of their own. Which means, that they will
    >>> not always be 'at home' when you need them, so you have to search
    >>> for them. I think, remembering or pronouncing their names will be
    >>> the least of our problems then
    >>
    >>I think that's a good thing personally, and adds to the realism. I'm
    >>running the NPCSchedules mod in Morrowind to add that functionality in
    >>atm.
    >
    >
    > Yes, well, about the 108th time you have to wander around looking for
    > an NPC, you will get tired of this.
    >
    > I've already done it 108 times in other games and am already tired of
    > it.


    So maybe they need to extend the reality by being able to ask the NPC's
    friends and neighbours where they are? Or, as you imply, have them stay
    in one place.
  49. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    > So maybe they need to extend the reality by being able to ask the NPC's
    > friends and neighbours where they are? Or, as you imply, have them stay
    > in one place.

    That would be really helpful, actually. I'm really sick of missions where
    somebody says "Find XXX and get him to give me back my YYY" or something
    like that, and they only give you a hopelessly vague clue where the
    character can be found. It's even worse when it's an escort mission, and
    you have to bring somebody to find somebody else, but the person you're
    escorting has no idea where they are, and will just follow you around
    forever until you find them. (BTW, never agree to do an escort mission when
    you're already escorting somebody else. It really screws up the AI.) I had
    one mission where I found this woman in a Daedric ruin somewhere, and you
    had to escort her back to her husband, and the only thing she said was "He's
    east of here.", without giving the slightest clue how FAR east he was. (And
    it was VERY far.) I kept thinking I'd missed him, because I walked for so
    far without finding him. (Which was especially tedious because the stupid
    woman kept getting lost and wandering all over the place instead of
    following me the way she's supposed to. They really need to fix that.) My
    character's Speed attribute is so high that I had to take off my Boots of
    Blinding Speed and walk instead of running in order not to keep losing her
    every 5 seconds. I finally told her to wait somewhere, placed a marker on
    the map so I could find her again, put my boots back on and searched at full
    running speed. Even then it took ages to find the guy, and when I did, it
    gave me a quest success entry, even though I hadn't actually reuinited the
    couple. (She was miles back where I left her, but when I went back she
    still thanked me for bringing them together, and then proceeded to just sit
    around there forever instead of actually going back to the guy. She waits
    there still, but I got my quest success, so I'm satisfied.)
  50. Archived from groups: alt.games.elder-scrolls,comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    "Pete MC" <nomorespam@youbastids.com> wrote in message
    news:41A73179.ECCFD6C1@youbastids.com...
    > DeAnn wrote:
    >> Yes, well, about the 108th time you have to wander around looking for
    >> an NPC, you will get tired of this.
    >>
    >> I've already done it 108 times in other games and am already tired of
    >> it.
    >
    > Nah, I prefer it. Anyway, if I'm in a rush there's always "placeatpc"

    I sort of agree with DeAnn. As long as the NPC schedules aren't buggy then
    it might work out. But if they're buggy in any way, it could turn out to be
    a nightmare. I read a short article about Oblivion in Computer Games in
    which Todd Howard stated that they've already had to turn down the AI a
    notch because:

    1. NPCs were buying up all the goods in town
    2. Guards were starting to arrest each other.

    It sounds funny, but if they don't get the NPC schedules and AI right, it
    could ruin the game. Between NPCs that are up 24 hours a day or a screwed
    up game, I'll take the first, though I'm hoping they'll have worked out all
    the kinks by the time it ships.
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