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VZW -PrePay with Kyocera 2325 - Must double dial

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Anonymous
a b F Wireless
November 9, 2004 4:32:53 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

Hi Folks,

I have prepaid wireless service from Verizon Wireless. I don't vse a
cell phone mvch, and this seemed like a good way to get 30 days
service for only $15.00. If yov renew the service before yovr 30 days
expires, Verizon Wireless will roll over yovr excess minvtes. If yov
let the 30 days expire, yov will lose yovr excess minvtes and yov
might lose yovr phone nvmber.

A year ago, I bovght a package that inclvded a Kyocera 2325 phone. My
first qvestion concerned a problem with adding time and minvtes to my
pre-paid accovnt. According to the Verizon Wireless web site, these
Refills are available:

$15 - $29.99 expires in 30 days
$30 - $74.99 expires in 60 days
$75 - $149.99 expires in 90 days
$150 and above expires in 120 days

I assvmed that my accovnt wovld be extended by 30 days if I added $15
to my accovnt. According to Gwen at Verizon Wireless Cvstomer Service
I was mistaken. When I add $15 to my accovnt the expiration date is
set 30 days ahead.

Lets take an illogical example to see how this can really work against
yov. Lets also assvme every month has 30 days jvst to make this
example easier.

On Jan 1 I start my accovnt with $30. My expiration date is set to
March 1. On Febrvary 1, with 30 days left on my cvrrent expiration
date, I decide to take a trip and I want to "fill vp" my phone before
I leave, so I add $30 to my accovnt. I wovld think that my expiration
date shovld be moved 60 days from March 1 to May 1, bvt that does not
happen. My expiration date is set 60 days from when I added the $30,
so my accovnt is now set to expire on April 1. Any excess minvtes left
when I added money to my accovnt are rolled over, bvt I'm cheated ovt
of 30 days of service.

Here is my original qvestion followed by Verizon Wireless Cvstomer
Service's reply.

Ken - West Union, SC Popvlation 270 + 2 (covnting dogs and chickens)
"If yov only have a hammer, yov tend to see every problem as a nail."
- Abraham H. Maslow

==============[Here is my original qvestion]==============
============[reformatted to improve readability]============

Primary Svbject: Replenishments
Secondary Svbject: Other

Message Body: I have had a Pre-Paid Verizon phone for jvst over a
year. Each time I renew the accovnt by adding $30 to the card, I do
not get a fvll 60 days extension. Here are the new expiration dates
that I received after adding $30 to the accovnt.

Jan 28, 04.
Mar 26, 04;
May 22, 04;
Jvl 18, 04;
Sep 14, 04;
Nov 11, 04;
Jan 8, 05;

As an example: My cvrrent expiration date was Nov 11, 2004. I renewed
today (Nov 8, 2004), and the web site said my new expiration date is
Jan 8, 2005. That is only 58 days after Nov 11, 2004. My new
expiration date shovld have been extended to Jan 10, 2005.

If I had received a fvll 60 days each time I added $30 to my accovnt
my expiration dates wovld be:

Jan 28, 04.
Mar 28, 04;
May 27, 04;
Jvl 26, 04;
Sep 24, 04;
Nov 23, 04;
Jan 22, 05;

Please do two things:
1) Update the expiration date on my accovnt to be Jan 22, 2005.
2) Fix the accovnt vpdate software on yovr web site, so it gives a
fvll 30 day extension for each $15 added to the accovnt. Thank yov,

===============[End of original qvestion]===============

===================[Original Reply]===================

Dear Ken Xxxxxxx,

Thank yov for contacting Verizon Wireless throvgh ovr website.

We appreciate yovr inqviry regarding yovr expiration period when
replenishing yovr pay as yov go accovnt, and we are happy to assist
yov.

I trvly apologize for the confvsion Ken. Each refill card offers a
specific expiration date, when the refill card is loaded to yovr
accovnt yovr expiration date is extended the applicable time period
from the date the time is loaded on yovr accovnt. A $15 refill offers
a 30 day expiration date, $30 and $50 refills offer 60 days expiration
dates, $75 is offer a 90 day expiration date, and with $150 offers 120
day expiration date.

When yovr expiration date arrives yov mvst refill yovr accovnt to keep
it active. If yov do not replenish yovr accovnt within the applicable
expiration period any remaining balance is lost, and yov may lose yovr
cellvlar phone nvmber. As long as yov replenish yovr accovnt before
yovr expiration date any minvtes yov had existing on yovr accovnt will
carry over to yovr next expiration date.

Yov can access yovr prepay accovnt information online at
https://www.verizonwireless.com/vzwapp/prepay/loginform. Yov can also
replenish yovr accovnt throvgh ovr avtomated system by dialing #729
from yovr wireless phone. If yov have any fvrther qvestions please
write to vs again throvgh ovr www.verizonwireless.com website.


Sincerely,

Gwen
Verizon Wireless
Cvstomer Service

"We never stop working for yov!"

The above response is svbject to the terms of yovr Service Agreement
and calling plan, which apply to all lines on yovr accovnt. Please
read those materials for fvll details. Ovr liability is limited. In
the event of a conflict between this response and the terms of yovr
Service Agreement and calling plan, the terms of yovr Service
Agreement and calling plan will govern. Verizon Wireless's calling
plans, rate areas, rates, agreement provisions, bvsiness practices,
procedvres and policies are svbject to change as specified in the
Service Agreement.

==============[End of Original Response]==============
Anonymous
a b F Wireless
November 9, 2004 9:07:47 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

All prepaids work pretty much the same way (there may be some exceptions, such
as the Tracfone one year card). When you add a refill card, the expiration date
is set from the day you added the refill card. You can't add, say, three $15
cards to extend your service for 90 days. You would have to add one $15 card it
at the last minute before expiration to get the maximum time. Yes, they are
banking on the fact that you will forget!

If you are roaming, you have to enter the number twice. That is also pretty
typical of prepaids.
--
Dave
Visit my New England Cell Phone Page at
http://markson.net/cell_phones.htm
(to reply take out the "remove" in my e-mail)

>Hi Folks,
>
>I have prepaid wireless service from Verizon Wireless. I don't use a
>cell phone much, and this seemed like a good way to get 30 days
>service for only $15.00. If you renew the service before your 30 days
>expires, Verizon Wireless will roll over your excess minutes. If you
>let the 30 days expire, you will lose your excess minutes and you
>might lose your phone number.
>
>A year ago, I bought a package that included a Kyocera 2325 phone. My
>first question concerned a problem with adding time and minutes to my
>pre-paid account. According to the Verizon Wireless web site, these
>Refills are available:
>
>$15 - $29.99 expires in 30 days
>$30 - $74.99 expires in 60 days
>$75 - $149.99 expires in 90 days
>$150 and above expires in 120 days
>
>I assumed that my account would be extended by 30 days if I added $15
>to my account. According to Gwen at Verizon Wireless Customer Service
>I was mistaken. When I add $15 to my account the expiration date is
>set 30 days ahead.
Anonymous
a b F Wireless
November 9, 2004 11:36:54 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

On Tue, 09 Nov 2004 18:07:47 -0500, Dave Markson
<dave@markson.removeit.net> wrote:

>All prepaids work pretty much the same way (there may be some exceptions, such
>as the Tracfone one year card). When you add a refill card, the expiration date
>is set from the day you added the refill card. You can't add, say, three $15
>cards to extend your service for 90 days. You would have to add one $15 card it
>at the last minute before expiration to get the maximum time. Yes, they are
>banking on the fact that you will forget!
>
>If you are roaming, you have to enter the number twice. That is also pretty
>typical of prepaids.

Thanks Dave,

The double dialing thing is even more annoying than losing a day or
two off of our service. Like I said earlier, I don't use the phone
very much, so $15.00 for 30 days will roll over minutes is building up
a little cushion for me, as long as I remember to replenish it before
the time expires.

That was going to be my next post. This is the first prepaid phone I
have ever had. When I was employed, I had a company provided monthly
service plan, with lots of available minutes.

This $15 for 30 days service is the least expensive that I have seen,
but I haven't shopped in a year, and things are always changing.

Evidently not many Verizon Wireless stores are familiar with the
operation of their prepaid phones, 'cause every time I'm out of my
local dialing area, and the phone requires the double dial, I stop at
a Verizon Wireless store to see if anyone can fix it. No one has ever
heard of the problem before, so they don't know how to fix it.

Now you are suggesting that it can't be fixed, because that is the way
it is "supposed" to work.

Maybe I'll put every number in twice with a hard pause between them,
and when I'm in my local calling area, I just won't press the OK key
to dial the rest. Outside my local calling area, I will press OK to
release the hold. I'll experiment with that next time I'm on the road.

Thanks again,

Ken
November 10, 2004 2:38:44 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

On Tue, 09 Nov 2004 20:36:54 -0500, RunnerBiker
<username@mailserver.mail> wrote:

>Evidently not many Verizon Wireless stores are familiar with the
>operation of their prepaid phones, 'cause every time I'm out of my
>local dialing area, and the phone requires the double dial, I stop at
>a Verizon Wireless store to see if anyone can fix it. No one has ever
>heard of the problem before, so they don't know how to fix it.

This is indeed "standard" behavior for most prepaid systems.

The reason? VZW (and others) hire out to a third party, which handles
the real-time "billing"/debiting needed to allow prepaid phones to
roam on many different systems. If you're outside of your home SID
(and sometimes even within it), you have to double dial. There are
exceptions to this. When I lived in VZW's SID 502 area (Roanoke, VA),
I never had to dial twice when visiting other parts of VA served by
VZW (i.e. Richmond).

I'm not on prepaid service now, but I assume this hasn't changed.

Mike
Anonymous
a b F Wireless
November 10, 2004 1:56:34 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

The "double dial" issue was already well explained by Mike. However, I
would add that this has only happened to me when I am actually in a
roaming area (non VZW zone). I've used the phone from Maine to
Virginia which is almost completely in zone.

There is no work around since the delay between the first connect and
the second connect (where you have to enter the number a second time)
varies. It is a pain - especially considering the call is costing 99
cents per minute. On the other hand, this often gives me a few seconds
to decide if I really need to make that call.

BTW, I have found the calls received in roaming areas have always been
charged at the regular rate (I'm still on the 30/10 cents system) .
Even when I was in Canada this summer, a call coming from Oregon was
took only 30 cents per minute off the account.

Also, I am still getting 200 minutes of free weekend calls when I add
money to the phone. I never go below 400 minutes. I think it may cap
at 600 minutes. This used to be weekends and holidays, but now it is
just weekends....reminder Christmas is on a Saturday this year ;-)

Regarding your issue with the expiration date.... Make sure you have a
credit card on file - then all you have to do is call in to the
customer service number and add to the phone. It can also be done on
the VZW website. If you do not want to keep a card on file, you can
purchase a $15 card and keep it in your wallet for "emergency." BTW,
they are starting to sell these cards everywhere - even in local
convenience stores around here.

I know the first few times my expiration date was approaching, I got
nervous that I would forget and my account would deactivate and I'd
lose my saved up minutes. I got used to it. When you make calls within
four days of the expiration date there is a aural warning message
reminding of the date. I also put the date in my appointment calendar
as a reminder.

Hey, I figured with the amount I am saving per year, if i lose a few
days here or there it is no great loss.

John B





On Tue, 09 Nov 2004 18:07:47 -0500, Dave Markson
<dave@markson.removeit.net> wrote:

>All prepaids work pretty much the same way (there may be some exceptions, such
>as the Tracfone one year card). When you add a refill card, the expiration date
>is set from the day you added the refill card. You can't add, say, three $15
>cards to extend your service for 90 days. You would have to add one $15 card it
>at the last minute before expiration to get the maximum time. Yes, they are
>banking on the fact that you will forget!
>
>If you are roaming, you have to enter the number twice. That is also pretty
>typical of prepaids.
Anonymous
a b F Wireless
November 11, 2004 8:05:40 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

RunnerBiker wrote:
>
> This $15 for 30 days service is the least expensive that I have seen,
> but I haven't shopped in a year, and things are always changing.

Boost Mobile is more generous with their expiration time. A $20 refill
is good for 90 days. That's the main reason I picked them instead of
Verizon. On the other hand Verizon has much wider coverage, but for me
that's not a factor.

You complained about the way Verizon sets the new expiration date
after a refill, but Boost does the same thing. Therefore it's
advantageous to wait as long as possible before refilling. That's not
a problem, since I can refill by credit card at any time by pushing a
few buttons on the phone.

Regarding the annoying double dialing, I don't know if Boost Mobile
requires that too. Haven't gone outside my home service area yet.

--

Paul Hirose <iszintjv55@earINVALIDthlink.net>
To reply by email delete INVALID from address.
Anonymous
a b F Wireless
November 11, 2004 1:48:37 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

On Wed, 10 Nov 2004 10:56:34 -0500, John Brandt <> wrote:

>The "double dial" issue was already well explained by Mike.

Thanks Mike, John and Dave,

The next time I'm in a double dial area, I'm going to try this
approach:

In the Contacts list, enter the area code and phone number followed by
a Hard-Pause followed by the area code and phone number again.

When I'm in zone, the number should dial. When I'm out of zone, I'll
wait for the redial message and then press OK to release the
Hard-Pause. Might this work???

Curiously, when out of zone, it doesn't seem to matter what number(s)
you dial first. I entered a "1" and pressed dial, when it asked for a
redial, I entered the area code and phone number and I was connected.

Ken
November 12, 2004 12:44:59 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

On Wed, 10 Nov 2004 10:56:34 -0500, John Brandt <> wrote:

>The "double dial" issue was already well explained by Mike. However, I
>would add that this has only happened to me when I am actually in a
>roaming area (non VZW zone). I've used the phone from Maine to
>Virginia which is almost completely in zone.

As I noted in my original reply, I've actually used VZW prepay - based
in Roanoke, VA - without having to "double dial" on VZW's system in
Richmond, VA, despite the fact it's a different SID. But when I was
based in Akron, OH, on SID 21, I had to "double dial" in another SID
21 area, near Sandusky.

I have long thought that the "double dial" behavior corresponded to
"local digital" plans that postpaid customers have, but that wouldn't
explain the latter case (Sandusky is clearly in the same Ohio/Michigan
Local DigitalChoice plan area as Akron). My best guess at this point
is that it has to do with the switch hardware at the various cell
sites.

Anyway, it's not only SIDs, and it's not necessarily needed in a
different SID...or not necessarily NOT needed in the same one! Whew!
Thinking about it is giving me a headache, and making me glad I'm in
postpaid land now... ;) 

Mike
Anonymous
a b F Wireless
November 12, 2004 12:45:00 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

Mike wrote:

> As I noted in my original reply, I've actually used VZW prepay - based
> in Roanoke, VA - without having to "double dial" on VZW's system in
> Richmond, VA, despite the fact it's a different SID. But when I was
> based in Akron, OH, on SID 21, I had to "double dial" in another SID
> 21 area, near Sandusky.

Which you probably wouldn't these days, because that area used to be Alltel,
but the Sandusky network was purchased by Verizon a year or two ago. Should now
be part of the Ohio/Southeast Michigan Super-SID 21.


--
JustThe.net Internet & New Media Services, http://JustThe.net/
Steven J. Sobol, Geek In Charge / 888.480.4NET (4638) / sjsobol@JustThe.net
PGP Key available from your friendly local key server (0xE3AE35ED)
Apple Valley, California Nothing scares me anymore. I have three kids.
November 12, 2004 9:59:30 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

On Thu, 11 Nov 2004 19:56:34 -0800, Steve Sobol <sjsobol@JustThe.net>
wrote:

>Which you probably wouldn't these days, because that area used to be Alltel,
>but the Sandusky network was purchased by Verizon a year or two ago. Should now
>be part of the Ohio/Southeast Michigan Super-SID 21.

But it was back then. I was clearly in VZW SID 21 territory. The
actual location was Huron, OH, not terribly far from Sandusky...

I know Alltel has some coverage up there, but I was on VZW.

This was maybe 2 years ago.

Mike
January 3, 2013 8:01:03 PM

US Cellular also has "double dial" requirement for all roam calls. Totally bogus and not explained by sales rep- we are canceling and demanding refund since virtually all calls are roaming here in VT.



Quote:
Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

On Tue, 09 Nov 2004 18:07:47 -0500, Dave Markson
<dave@markson.removeit.net> wrote:

>All prepaids work pretty much the same way (there may be some exceptions, such
>as the Tracfone one year card). When you add a refill card, the expiration date
>is set from the day you added the refill card. You can't add, say, three $15
>cards to extend your service for 90 days. You would have to add one $15 card it
>at the last minute before expiration to get the maximum time. Yes, they are
>banking on the fact that you will forget!
>
>If you are roaming, you have to enter the number twice. That is also pretty
>typical of prepaids.

Thanks Dave,

The double dialing thing is even more annoying than losing a day or
two off of our service. Like I said earlier, I don't use the phone
very much, so $15.00 for 30 days will roll over minutes is building up
a little cushion for me, as long as I remember to replenish it before
the time expires.

That was going to be my next post. This is the first prepaid phone I
have ever had. When I was employed, I had a company provided monthly
service plan, with lots of available minutes.

This $15 for 30 days service is the least expensive that I have seen,
but I haven't shopped in a year, and things are always changing.

Evidently not many Verizon Wireless stores are familiar with the
operation of their prepaid phones, 'cause every time I'm out of my
local dialing area, and the phone requires the double dial, I stop at
a Verizon Wireless store to see if anyone can fix it. No one has ever
heard of the problem before, so they don't know how to fix it.

Now you are suggesting that it can't be fixed, because that is the way
it is "supposed" to work.

Maybe I'll put every number in twice with a hard pause between them,
and when I'm in my local calling area, I just won't press the OK key
to dial the rest. Outside my local calling area, I will press OK to
release the hold. I'll experiment with that next time I'm on the road.

Thanks again,

Ken

January 3, 2013 8:06:25 PM

I've used cell phones for 20 years and never had to doulble dial-Have tracfone dont have to double dial. US Cellular sucks- Cost cutting BS I'm sure but I can tell you they are getting hordes of complaints on this.


On Tue, 09 Nov 2004 20:36:54 -0500, RunnerBiker
<username@mailserver.mail> wrote:

>Evidently not many Verizon Wireless stores are familiar with the
>operation of their prepaid phones, 'cause every time I'm out of my
>local dialing area, and the phone requires the double dial, I stop at
>a Verizon Wireless store to see if anyone can fix it. No one has ever
>heard of the problem before, so they don't know how to fix it.

This is indeed "standard" behavior for most prepaid systems.

The reason? VZW (and others) hire out to a third party, which handles
the real-time "billing"/debiting needed to allow prepaid phones to
roam on many different systems. If you're outside of your home SID
(and sometimes even within it), you have to double dial. There are
exceptions to this. When I lived in VZW's SID 502 area (Roanoke, VA),
I never had to dial twice when visiting other parts of VA served by
VZW (i.e. Richmond).

I'm not on prepaid service now, but I assume this hasn't changed.

Mike[/quotemsg]
!