How much will next-gen consoles affect the PC?

Gumption

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This shouldn't be news to anyone, but close to the end of 2012 Microsoft and Sony will be releasing their 'next-gen' consoles: the PS4 and Xbox '720' - it has been said that the PS4 alone will be ten times more powerful than the PS3, the Xbox around the same. While that isn't much considering what's inside the PS3 and 360 - game developers will be rubbing their little hands at the possibility of multi-platform 3d gaming and extra power in these consoles. By rote, PCs will need new hardware to keep their place.

So, essentially, how much time before our current gaming rigs are rendered completely obsolete? I have only owned two rigs, both in more or less the same gen, and it has to be said the current run of cards, despite small incremental advances, have been around for a while. My advice is to start saving now.

What do you think?
 
They wont be 10x the power, or even 5x. The only thing I can see coming out of next gen consoles, is just more games will be harder on the PC, which will be ahead of consoles still at that point. I think we will get more console ports we wont be so irritated with on how crap the graphics are, until the consoles have been out for a few years. Other than that, I think everyone kind of exaggerates the next gen consoles to the point where soon we will hear that they will have a love port for lonely gamers
 

foverosiv

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first of all "it has been said that the PS4 alone will be ten times more powerful than the PS3, the Xbox around the same" [citation needed]

second, when the games starts to put in some extreme calculations, like air movements, super-AIs, and perhaps planetary movements and objects behavior based on their gravitational pull. our rigs might be a bit slow then on the CPUs, GPUs? perhaps if they want you to see grass from a mile away or so? or a tank on the moon, idk.
 
The last time I read a overview, PS4 was using a specific type of graphics processing unit, I can't remember the name though. It was said to be 4 times more powerful than the PC GPUs that were released during that time ( i.e the HD 5970 and the GTX 480 ). But still, PC graphics will still beat console graphics once it starts getting outdated.
 

AtomicZ

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At some point in the future it will cost so much to keep up with the hardware that we'll have no choice but to mortgage the farm to stay on the pc or just give in and buy a console. I have many years gaming experience and every year there are less and less PC titles to choose from. Right now it's a niche market for geeks like us that enjoy building these rigs. But why bother dropping a grand on the best hardware to play some retread console crap software, because let's face it most companies are concentrating their marketing on the consoles. PC Gaming is a fading dream...
But that said I still can't wait for Diablo3 :sol:
 

I would like to see an article from a reliable source on that one . They have to be resourceful when they are choosing hardware as to not have a console so expensive nobody would buy it. If they had a thousand bux worth of hardware but charged 500 for the system the prices of the games would be outrageous. The next Gen consoles will be released with dated hardware and us PC gamers will already be able to run the games better.
 

MarkG

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Yeah, because all that console hardware comes free.

Consoles are typically sold below cost price until hardware manufacturing technology advances enough to push the price down to a level where they don't have to rely on overpriced games to subsidise console sales. Where you think those manufacturing advances are going to come from without the massive PC market to push them? And who do you think is going to develop those new console chips without the massive PC market funding the GPU market?
 

+1
 

diellur

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Not sure I agree with that. I built a decent gaming rig about 6 years ago, and built the next one 3 months ago. They cost the same, to within £100, and are broadly similar in capability given the offerings 6 years ago and what's available now. What's more likely to affect the costing of PCs is the tablet market...as their popularity grows, and the popularity of desktops / notebooks dwindles, the hardware will get pricier due to supply and demand, but not due to capability. :)
 
consoles are currently about 8 times less powerfull than a $1000-£700 pc they only have dx9.0c+ gfx. the current dx11 cards at the mid to bottom price range are easily x2 the power so getting to be x10 the power isnt gonna be that hard. the chance are they will contain a 6970 with extras/ cpu wise they will actualy be no more powerfull than a current i5/i5 sandy as the ps4 wont contain a cell chip but rather an off the shelf cpu like the xbox currently has...
the cost will probably be around 600 for the ps4 and 500 for the xbox both will sell for a loss for the first 2-3 years and are likely to have a lifetime that exceeds the current consoles.
overall gaming spec will be 1080p 60fps minimum for all games. 3d ready. up to 8 gigs of ram (modular) and 120-250gigs hdd with bluray compatability...
 

Metwinge

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What we do know is that all 3 consoles will be using AMD GPUs, that much has been confirmed. As for CPUs, i think the PS4 will use a updated Cell chip as that is still a beast of a processor. 3D graphics, yes. Motion contols, Yes, 8GB or ram, no chance. Consoles do not need this amount of RAM, simple! 2GB im guessing, maybe 4.

These companies want to build these consoles as cheaply as possible, the reason the PS3 was expensive was simply the Blu ray drive. Stand alone drive in 2006 were on average £700. The xbox is showing its age worse than the PS3 but its done well for this long even with the RROD **** up!

Can these consoles sell at £500 - £600, i really dont think so and also the price of the games will probably go upto $70, £50 average if the console want to make the same profit
 

julius 85

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True 1080p with 3D at 60FPS? I don't think so. I would be surprised if they could handle 1080p at 60FPS and they're gonna have AMD GPUs so unless AMD comes up with a mature 3D technology, they're not gonna have it.
 

foverosiv

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well lets see, have AMD so it runs smooth, cool, and stable or NVidia so it runs glitchy, hot, and make your PS4 blow up in about 2 months? hmmm.

also, AMD's cards runs just as fast, if not faster than those crappy Nvidia ticking bombs.
 

it was mentioned at e3, that this was the baseline. same as sony have already said they are shelveing the cell cpu.

 

diellur

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It's funny how these debates come around time and again whenever the consoles get renewed. I've said in other threads (and I'm not the only one) that new consoles always seem to raise the spectre of the PC as a gaming platform coming under threat. Things are changing for PC gaming, and consoles do have a negative impact in some regards, but I don't think the end is nigh. It's definitely becoming a more niche market though, which is a shame.
 

julius 85

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I'm saying only that AMD doesn't have a mature 3D technology. *cough*fanboy*cough*
 

julius 85

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OK, could you give me a source?

Sorry for double post.
 

foverosiv

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>implying I don't have valid reason of saying AMD is better
>implying your not a NVidia fanboy
>implying Nvidia's GPU are superior and godly
>implying "mature 3D technology" exists

 

diellur

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I don't think he's implying any of those. You're putting words into his mouth. Pointing out you're a fanboy, or coming across as one (which, to be fair, I was close to doing myself given your post :)) isn't the same as him being an Nvidia fanboy at all. Nor does he make any implication about Nvidia, either.

It's your opinion that AMD are better. Just like someone else's is that Nvidia is better...Googling the subject shows that opinions are divided and that the issue is complex and very often subjective. I've used both brands and like them both. I don't think it's wise to restrict yourself to one or the other if you're a PC enthusiast as you limit yourself needlessly. Look at the facts, form an impartial view and then choose. Stating "crappy Nvidia ticking bombs" is going to provoke some responses, as I suspect you know. If that was the case, then Nvidia wouldn't sell but it is in fact a very reputable and highly recommended brand. Just like AMD.

From my own experience, I've only had one card break-down on me and it was an AMD one. Should I now call them "crappy AMD ticking bombs" as a result?
 

foverosiv

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I'm pretty sure he implied at least two of those but lets just end this argument with a picture that shows my appreciation of NVidia GPUs.

099521.jpg

 
If anything, next gen consoles will have specs simmilar to the Wii U: A AMD-4000 series GPU, and a multicore processor [sounds like IBM Cell for both the next PS and Xbox console].

I doubt we're seeing MS/Sony release before 2013-2014 though, due to Kinnect/Move. Sony especially, since the PS3 still has a bit of life left and can still be pushed a bit more.
 
There was a rumour (it sounds unlikely to me) that the next xbox may have an AMD bulldozer CPU, in which case I would think it could run Windows which could blur the line between PC and console altogether. I doubt it will happen though but with Windows 8 running on ARM CPUs its altogether possible.
 

anwaypasible

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wow..
ya'll arent very bright.
except maybe the person that had some truth to say.
things like gravity.. all sorts of physics really.
that is going to require a lot of horsepower for times when there is like 32 people on each team.


i know one thing for certain..
if the PC gaming community keeps charging $500 every 8 months for a graphics card to persuade customers into buying a console.. we are going to demand something for our $1,000 - $2,000 spent on graphics cards.


be reasonable.
the cost of dirt (when you own it) isnt very much.
selling a console for $600 that costs $20 - $40 to build is beyond the scope of many people who dont have a tight grasp on economics.

and then yes..
consider the facts.
pc graphics cards are always open to being attacked by hackers who try to unlock them and use them for something else.
that means one thing OVERHEAD.
when you put the same hardware into a console.. everything is locked up nice and tight.
no real way to get in there and communicate with the device, except to get yourself into trouble.
when the damn thing wont talk to you without a password.. there is no way to 'sneak by' because the operating system is small and simple.
...the operating system on the pc is much more broad and 'chanceable'

dont be suprised if you do see today or tomorrows graphics hardware inside one of those consoles doing much more than what us PC gamers get out of them.
there comes a time when the connection is no longer software, it is straight up physical without any driver or translation or decoding going on.


video games MUST look better than the very stupid 'colored pencil' and 'oil canvas' we have been seeing.
why?
because it is called 'incentive'

nobody gives a damn about tessellation much at all.
we can get by with the same wires as long as the texture resolution goes up.. the color bit-depth goes up.. the physics go up.. and the light/shadows get improved.
i look at modern warfare 2 and think 'wow.. this is tomorrows atari graphics'

it can never ever get that bad again.
we are opening up our arms for upgrades.
those upgrades are supposed to set a standard that we currently do not have.
crysis 2 cant be said to be that standard with the very low colors in use.
they are oil canvas replicas with a bit of zooming in with a magnifying glass to fade the colors with more accuracy to appear professional.



we are not stupid as a species.. and i think people need to stop 'settling' for things as if we are happy.
a new explosion doesnt excite me one bit.
being forced to play a game that is the same BROWN ON BROWN colors is really diluting my self-esteem.
grey on black isnt going to get you anywhere either.. but it would be a start, and quite frankly 'a relief effort'

looking at crysis 2 ... it looks like you are staring into a bowl of potpouri.
for those of you that dont know what potpouri is..
basically it is a bunch of red, maroon, purple, and green. (perhaps some other non-standard flowers i didnt mention)


i think 2pac said what video games and the audio industry can mean for people in the song 'thugz mansion'

you wanna talk about how 8gB of ram isnt necessary?
not intelligent.
ALL of the code has to be accessed quickly.
where do you think that information is going to go?
i am simply talking first about the mechanics!
that comes before the wires and the textures, but i think the physics will seriously be all apart of the mechanics.

i already know i dont need to have much worry about the hardware.
software implementations are nothing of composure.
the games themselves are limited by the limits imposed.
here you are saying these consoles wont be released until late 2012 ?
look at the garbage already on the market.
a bunch of military junk that is recorded and re-created with a bunch of high and wide bugs, blanketed with graphics that bring me to 8-bit shame.
the mechanics are full of lag and lies.. that make a perfect match to the aim and the movement/firing.

too much algorithms in the way to superceed a selfish mind that only wants to prove a high standing to provide a path to walk on that continues to lure the person deeper into the levels.
spend your time on those algorithms and the rest of the game is cabbage-patch.


how stupid do the rest of us have to be?
a gtx260 that runs at the 88fps cap on modern warfare 2 throughout 90% of the game.
the colors are pathetic.. the wires are there arent they?
they arent tessellation, but the whole scene has come together.
some more colors available to enhance the textures and the game would have pushed us forward.
but instead.. what happens?
games like crysis come out that are an embarassment.
f.e.a.r. comes out in 2006 .. here it is 2011 and nobody is releasing a video game with visual quality that comes close.

where are all of the college graduates that went to school for game and simulation programming?

cache rules everything around me.
and i must say? the steam is stale, and has proven to be made better.
it is overwhelming.
you could render something SLOWLY and have it there and done.. then hire somebody who does flash to record the thing as a video.
hell..
you could record the video yourself and make the entire game a 'hollywood-style activated' movie.
burn in the textures?
burn in the RENDER.
and i believe it has been thought of before.. but who am i to tell you the 8800 ultra was capable to get a single head rendered and colored.
now seriously..
who do you think has all of the hardware before it is ever released?
the government as usual.
meaning the military simulations are all bleeding out and nobody else has had their chance to get in there and compete.

who wants to spend 5-8 years gathering a video game together and might be rejected in the end?

8000 series was released in 2006.
now 2011 and nobody releasing anything.
the same 5 or 6 game studios slapping us around with their concept of entertainment.
i can tell you quickly.. i havent seen anything humane.
as if i have been fed from a bag of powder.
sure, the concept was intricate and interesting at first.
but now the taste of chalk is suck in my throat and sinuses.. all the way down to my feet and out the energy from my back you are implying?


i have been picky with the video games i am interested in.
so very picky, in fact, it feels sleezy.
i am starving.
i dont need disillusion to render my future.
there has already been an extension on the lateness of the new consoles release.
but
LOOK at how bad the games are today.
i have to think the games were made for 3mbit/s - 6mbit/s
and today we have an average of 6mbit/s - 12mbit/s
i simply cannot stomach tomorrow.
the only insurance in life i have is when i crawl out of bed because i cant sleep anymore.
i've put myself into solitude for 70% of my life.
and all i keep seeing is people burning my food.
then when i look up from my plate, i see more leeches sucking the life out of me.
now i know it is my time to cook the food myself, but i dont feel i have the strength or motivation to provide insurance for myself.
it isnt responsible to be walking around a fire with a knife when i am stumbling and tripping over things with spots on my eyes.
and say i do get the food cooked and eaten.. for what?
to remember tomorrow is going to suck the life out of me the same!

the recession hasnt been painful enough for the many idiots out there that abuse their civil rights.
and
the government hasnt provided any way out.
if they think i am going to slowly slide into place and enjoy my new locked position.. they have 70% of my life in slander hammered with queer neglect/abuse as they take my time, embrace it as their own, and expect me to respect the time we share that is halve-productive (or quintessentially non-productive @ all)

i'm left with nothing but notes for my future.
those notes remind me how sick the social concensus is.
i've watched myself get pushed into a corner.. and i've climbed up the wall thereafter.
and i've used the power of gravity to bring me to a sensual death bed.

makes me realize the term 'loose-cannon'
criminal, rebel, and bad-influence are nonchalant compared to the ambience of energy a syndrome has.

i dont wish or stand to see the same people suddenly change their attitude.
i hate confusion to death.

bringing a next generation console onto the market this late in the game is pushing things over an edge that scars people.
we know people are falling asleep and crying like the belittled treatment they receive.
the word succumb is powerful.
and if you dont think the world has already done that.. it would fall in line perfectly to the same stupid commencing, derived from the word comment, that the above posters have managed to display.



what happens when you put out an artists fire?
i am tired of seeing the question.. i am tired of being asked the question.. and i am tired of asking the same question myself.
EVERYBODY who simply breathes, does it in an artistic way.
how they move is their choice of art.
what their actions are and what they say.. a choice of art.
people should be expected to absorb things much less than me.
but
i refuse to live and suffer.
i am seeing hell in water over here.

if the graphics dont get any better, violence will go up again.
that means release-day improvements that make a point to avoid such violence.

when you are starving and dehydrated.. all aspects of humanity are lost as the essence of survival brings out allure that doesnt give a single breath or spark for intelligence.



the release dates have been pathetic.
people forced to buy a game because the old game is boring, and nothing else is available.
the amount of diversity has shown itself, not only with the individual games, but also the artificial intelligence that plagues the games.
hell..
even the movie-type games have been a waste of money.

i really hope they believe all of the internet and cellphone infrastructure is paid for.. because there isnt a single thing on this planet that i am willing to continue paying for.
i have pride and nobody is going to say something to boost it.
but
that doesnt mean you have to test it.. because some of us are ready to riot.


i hope game developers lose all of their earnings and have to pay out of pocket for their damaging mistakes.
lag, bugs, cheats wont be tolerated regardless of how good the game looks.
dont forget most of us who give a damn have been wise enough to not upgrade their computer for the most recent games.
when we foot that bill.. you are going to ask to take more, and we will be.
as we are all innocent and free until captivated.

i cannot count the number of times i have lost my appetite because of the crumbs the entertainment industry has been feeding.
i cant get a conversation with anybody to rest my love at ease.
the times a brief moment does arise.. reality sets in.


as if my heart is already cracked.. and ya'll are talking about spreading the crack open wide with an abundance of more depression.


i dont see how people can take their own lives when other people are taking it for them.
the only chance of a moment they have is to give up, quit, and become a leader rather than a follower.
and if you are doing this new.. nature has truly blessed you, because the rest of us are seeing the limits of our leadership.

the government should have something to say to me.
but they keep their mouths shut and tightly sealed with addendums that are either an abusive hit or a neglecting miss.



think about it people.
if the arcade rooms had better graphics than what you could get at home..
and they still dried up because the industry wasnt refilling the vibrancy..
what makes you think it wont happen at home?
people will start having more sex or working more.. thats about all of it.
 

anwaypasible

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and another thing..

these consoles are supposed to last 6 years.
that means the future has already been planned.
the games for the end of the life of the upcoming consoles should already be finished.
they are MANDATORY to keep the release dates spread out to provide something for the people participating.
the music doesnt stop for a disc jockey.
the processors can get whatever label you are willing to read.
what the actual chip is will obviously have an in-house name the consumer public will never ever know.

but..
if the thing is going to last 6 years.
expect to see improvements along the way.
and that means the processing horsepower is going to sit there in secret.