Best Dual P3 Mobo?
- Thread starter victorcao
- Start date
Asus CUR-DLS or Intel STL2 (both with onboard LAN and SCSI controller) or if you want a very cost effective solution (and you are less concerened about the stability) get the Asus CUV-4XD or CUV-4XDLS (for onboard LAN and SCSI controller)
girish
<font color=blue>die-hard fans don't have heat-sinks!</font color=blue>
girish
<font color=blue>die-hard fans don't have heat-sinks!</font color=blue>
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I hear the latest version of the P2B-DS will go up to 133FSB in BIOS. This motherboard uses the venerable BX chipset. Finding a Dual CPU BX motherboard that supports a 133FSB is VERY difficult, but I would advise the BX over VIA any time.
Video killed my Radio Card!
Video killed my Radio Card!
P2B is slot1 board, you wont get many slot1 processors these days, and slot1 133MHz FSB processors are too rare. i've only seen them on <A HREF="http://developer.intel.com/design/PentiumIII/prodbref/#product" target="_new">intel developer pages</A>.
and still, if it does work at 133, its the BX chipset overclocked, and yet still if it will support socket370 (like the CUBX) it should be called CU2B something.
I wont go for it for sure.
BTW I read somewhere Intel has already stopped producing the BX chipsets in most of their fabs and is producing it in very small quantities for some OEMs - I guess its going into the embedded market and not desktop motherboards.
girish
<font color=blue>die-hard fans don't have heat-sinks!</font color=blue>
and still, if it does work at 133, its the BX chipset overclocked, and yet still if it will support socket370 (like the CUBX) it should be called CU2B something.
I wont go for it for sure.
BTW I read somewhere Intel has already stopped producing the BX chipsets in most of their fabs and is producing it in very small quantities for some OEMs - I guess its going into the embedded market and not desktop motherboards.
girish
<font color=blue>die-hard fans don't have heat-sinks!</font color=blue>
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Consider the alternatives:
The BX is hard to find in a daul mobo that supports 133FSB. But we know that the BX will go to 133 with stability.
The i820's that were not recalled use RDRAM
The i840's use RDRAM
VIA has enough problems in typical desktops already
The i815, although not officially supporting dual processors, does so in an Acorp board. This board is poorly designed to the point that it does not offer comparable performance to other solutions.
The Serverset chipset to the best of my knowlege is expensive and does not support high end graphics, should this machine get used for more than one purpose.
So that brings me back to the BX. If you know of any dual CPU BX boards that will support a 133FSB and are Socket 370, lead the way.
The P2B-DS in it's latest version is supposed to be capable of doing 133. Asus also has their own slotkets that are SMP compatable. As cheap as I am, this sounds like a reasonable solution. I would use two PIII 700's at 933. This is known to be a very stable processor settup. It is available in both slot 1 and socket 370 versions. The only bus that gets overclocked besides the FSB is the AGP, and most modern cards will accept the 89MHz speed that results. PCI remains standard at 33MHz.
Video killed my Radio Card!
The BX is hard to find in a daul mobo that supports 133FSB. But we know that the BX will go to 133 with stability.
The i820's that were not recalled use RDRAM
The i840's use RDRAM
VIA has enough problems in typical desktops already
The i815, although not officially supporting dual processors, does so in an Acorp board. This board is poorly designed to the point that it does not offer comparable performance to other solutions.
The Serverset chipset to the best of my knowlege is expensive and does not support high end graphics, should this machine get used for more than one purpose.
So that brings me back to the BX. If you know of any dual CPU BX boards that will support a 133FSB and are Socket 370, lead the way.
The P2B-DS in it's latest version is supposed to be capable of doing 133. Asus also has their own slotkets that are SMP compatable. As cheap as I am, this sounds like a reasonable solution. I would use two PIII 700's at 933. This is known to be a very stable processor settup. It is available in both slot 1 and socket 370 versions. The only bus that gets overclocked besides the FSB is the AGP, and most modern cards will accept the 89MHz speed that results. PCI remains standard at 33MHz.
Video killed my Radio Card!
stability is the key for a BX board. thats the 11th comandment. and that the other alternatives are either unstable or expensive.
but since Intel itself is not producing BX chipsets anymore, I find it very very difficult even for a company like Asus to procure BX chips to revive the P2B-D line of boards just to get 133 MHz support. if they could do it, they could even supply free slotkets along with the board to mount any socket370 133 MHz FSB processor available freely. and if at all they do it, why cant they just produce a CUBX-D board with two Zif370 sockets?
and the Serverset chipset is a server chipset already (it has all server class hardware like Ultra160 SCSI, server management, 10/100 Mbps multiple LAN adapters, and other hardware for legacy support - like the ATA/33 IDE and AGP2X), and I do see a lot of options on the Supermicro site for Serverset chipset dual P-III boards - that support socket370, Tualatins, AGP2X, ATA/33 as well as optional Ultra160 SCSI and single/dual Intel LAN controllers. one with Tualatin support, AGP2X slot maybe a SCSI controller and LAN as a option it would make a good workstation. unless the user goes for SCSI drives.
the BX too supports only 2X AGP, while the Serverset supporting Ultra ATA/33 is too bad, it should have been at least ATA/66 if not 100.
got a link for i815E dual board?
as for BX dual board with 133 MHz support, I'd say its just a wishful thinking although I'd be delighted if it does show up!
I guess the bottom line is: there are no decent boards for implementation of dual P-III systems, that have both 13 MHz support as well as AGP4X/Pro slots. the only one with all these features is the VIA694D but I wont say that.
girish
<font color=blue>die-hard fans don't have heat-sinks!</font color=blue>
but since Intel itself is not producing BX chipsets anymore, I find it very very difficult even for a company like Asus to procure BX chips to revive the P2B-D line of boards just to get 133 MHz support. if they could do it, they could even supply free slotkets along with the board to mount any socket370 133 MHz FSB processor available freely. and if at all they do it, why cant they just produce a CUBX-D board with two Zif370 sockets?
and the Serverset chipset is a server chipset already (it has all server class hardware like Ultra160 SCSI, server management, 10/100 Mbps multiple LAN adapters, and other hardware for legacy support - like the ATA/33 IDE and AGP2X), and I do see a lot of options on the Supermicro site for Serverset chipset dual P-III boards - that support socket370, Tualatins, AGP2X, ATA/33 as well as optional Ultra160 SCSI and single/dual Intel LAN controllers. one with Tualatin support, AGP2X slot maybe a SCSI controller and LAN as a option it would make a good workstation. unless the user goes for SCSI drives.
the BX too supports only 2X AGP, while the Serverset supporting Ultra ATA/33 is too bad, it should have been at least ATA/66 if not 100.
got a link for i815E dual board?
as for BX dual board with 133 MHz support, I'd say its just a wishful thinking although I'd be delighted if it does show up!
I guess the bottom line is: there are no decent boards for implementation of dual P-III systems, that have both 13 MHz support as well as AGP4X/Pro slots. the only one with all these features is the VIA694D but I wont say that.
girish
<font color=blue>die-hard fans don't have heat-sinks!</font color=blue>
i just got the new link on the <A HREF="http://www.acorp.com.tw" target="_new">acorp site</A> they have just a small mention of it being the world's first dual processor board based on the i815 chipset. do you any details on it?
i did'nt know the 815 supports multiprocessor configurations, I have been through almost all the 815 datasheets and never had a clue!!! seemd intel had it undocumented all the way and acorp was suddenly the only one enlightened about it. its funny!!!
and here is what I found on the way looking for dual processor configurations on 815 chipset:
<A HREF="http://www.helloalert.com/products_dvr.htm" target="_new">http://www.helloalert.com/products_dvr.htm</A> says it has a Intel OR840 board with i815 chipset!
and I missed it - the BP6! the Abit BP6 rev 2.0 supports two socket370 Coppermine processors, it uses the i440BX chipset, supports FSB overclocking right from 66 to 133 MHz in decent steps and also changing core voltage right from 1.4 V to 2.3 in half volt increments!!!
that is all what we need!!! and the Abit BP6 rev 2.0 may well be the answer to the question!
girish
<font color=blue>die-hard fans don't have heat-sinks!</font color=blue>
i did'nt know the 815 supports multiprocessor configurations, I have been through almost all the 815 datasheets and never had a clue!!! seemd intel had it undocumented all the way and acorp was suddenly the only one enlightened about it. its funny!!!
and here is what I found on the way looking for dual processor configurations on 815 chipset:
<A HREF="http://www.helloalert.com/products_dvr.htm" target="_new">http://www.helloalert.com/products_dvr.htm</A> says it has a Intel OR840 board with i815 chipset!
and I missed it - the BP6! the Abit BP6 rev 2.0 supports two socket370 Coppermine processors, it uses the i440BX chipset, supports FSB overclocking right from 66 to 133 MHz in decent steps and also changing core voltage right from 1.4 V to 2.3 in half volt increments!!!
that is all what we need!!! and the Abit BP6 rev 2.0 may well be the answer to the question!
girish
<font color=blue>die-hard fans don't have heat-sinks!</font color=blue>
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My guesses are that:
1.) Asus already was aware of the phazout of the BX and procured a large enough supply to last them through the phazout of the board.
2.) The latest revision of the board is probably a year or more old. I was told by a user of it that he has the 133 option.
Here's a comparison of a VIA chipset board to the beta version of the Acorp i815 board <A HREF="http://www.tomshardware.com/mainboard/01q1/010201/index.html" target="_new">http://www.tomshardware.com/mainboard/01q1/010201/index.html</A> You can see that the i815 looses, but that both processors are used effectively. Acorp does not have a good reputation in the industry for performance, so the fact that it is edged out by a VIA equiped board from a reputable company does little to discredit the i815 as a dual solution, but rather shows the typical lackluster performance this company provides. Still, it would be interesting to find out how the finished product did.
BTW, the board they put it up against was the Asus CUV4X-D. The fact that no reasonable company has tried the i815 dual is proabaly do to it's 512MB memory limmitation.
A supplier for Acorp boards in the U.S. is at <A HREF="http://store.yahoo.com/newtech/" target="_new">http://store.yahoo.com/newtech/</A>. While it is not listed on their website, maybe they would order it for you!
Video killed my Radio Card!
1.) Asus already was aware of the phazout of the BX and procured a large enough supply to last them through the phazout of the board.
2.) The latest revision of the board is probably a year or more old. I was told by a user of it that he has the 133 option.
Here's a comparison of a VIA chipset board to the beta version of the Acorp i815 board <A HREF="http://www.tomshardware.com/mainboard/01q1/010201/index.html" target="_new">http://www.tomshardware.com/mainboard/01q1/010201/index.html</A> You can see that the i815 looses, but that both processors are used effectively. Acorp does not have a good reputation in the industry for performance, so the fact that it is edged out by a VIA equiped board from a reputable company does little to discredit the i815 as a dual solution, but rather shows the typical lackluster performance this company provides. Still, it would be interesting to find out how the finished product did.
BTW, the board they put it up against was the Asus CUV4X-D. The fact that no reasonable company has tried the i815 dual is proabaly do to it's 512MB memory limmitation.
A supplier for Acorp boards in the U.S. is at <A HREF="http://store.yahoo.com/newtech/" target="_new">http://store.yahoo.com/newtech/</A>. While it is not listed on their website, maybe they would order it for you!
Video killed my Radio Card!
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Revision 2.0 supports coppermines? That's great! Last I checked (about a year ago) that board was limmited to Celerons, unless you used a Powerleap adapter. Problem was, the Powerleap adapter was not SMP compatable. Some guys were hotwiring two Powerleaps to make them work in SMP, but with limmited success. So if it IS true that revision 2.0 offers true support for Coppermines, why am I still using a single processor?
Video killed my Radio Card!
Video killed my Radio Card!
well, if it is so, then Asus execs are too shrewd getting the BX chips ahead of production.
i got the link on <A HREF="http://shop.store.yahoo.com/brimarcomp/ac6a8dualsoc.html" target="_new">http://shop.store.yahoo.com/brimarcomp/ac6a8dualsoc.html</A> and it says the Acorp 6A815EPD board is just $127!
i also got the THG link comparing the two boards and too bad for acorp their board was compared against Asus. the Asus board beats the Acorp by a ton! maybe a dual 815 Asus board will do much better!
maybe true that dual 815 boards were avoided due to its 512 MB memory limit, but 815 isnt targetted towards servers anyway and a dual 815 with 512 MB memory will make a very good workstation. afterall, 512 MB is not too small a memory!
anyway, who knew 815 supported dual processors? if at all better companies do make such boards, we will have all the luxaries of ATA/100, onboard IDE RAID, AGP Pro, maybe onboard LAN and SCSI and even integrated display (that might not contribute to making a decent dual workstation) to make a perfect workstation with the proven 815 chipset, the successor to the BX! but for 512 MB!!!
i am really expecting an Asus CUSL2-D or TUSL2-D now...
girish
<font color=blue>die-hard fans don't have heat-sinks!</font color=blue>
i got the link on <A HREF="http://shop.store.yahoo.com/brimarcomp/ac6a8dualsoc.html" target="_new">http://shop.store.yahoo.com/brimarcomp/ac6a8dualsoc.html</A> and it says the Acorp 6A815EPD board is just $127!
i also got the THG link comparing the two boards and too bad for acorp their board was compared against Asus. the Asus board beats the Acorp by a ton! maybe a dual 815 Asus board will do much better!
maybe true that dual 815 boards were avoided due to its 512 MB memory limit, but 815 isnt targetted towards servers anyway and a dual 815 with 512 MB memory will make a very good workstation. afterall, 512 MB is not too small a memory!
anyway, who knew 815 supported dual processors? if at all better companies do make such boards, we will have all the luxaries of ATA/100, onboard IDE RAID, AGP Pro, maybe onboard LAN and SCSI and even integrated display (that might not contribute to making a decent dual workstation) to make a perfect workstation with the proven 815 chipset, the successor to the BX! but for 512 MB!!!
i am really expecting an Asus CUSL2-D or TUSL2-D now...
girish
<font color=blue>die-hard fans don't have heat-sinks!</font color=blue>
well, the Anandtech review of BP6 rev 2.0 used Celerons, and P-III support is disputed see <A HREF="http://www.anandtech.com/mb/showdoc.html?i=1002&p=2" target="_new">http://www.anandtech.com/mb/showdoc.html?i=1002&p=2</A> but it supports upto Celeron 533s and Pentium-IIIs in single mode. I guess those Celerons are Coppermine128. so I might have been wrong in saying just Coppermine support.
and that means, our problem is still unansewered!
girish
<font color=blue>die-hard fans don't have heat-sinks!</font color=blue>
and that means, our problem is still unansewered!
girish
<font color=blue>die-hard fans don't have heat-sinks!</font color=blue>
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Developement cost for a motherboard is fairly high. Do you think that Asus would go through that expense just for you and me? I think not! Besides, it probably violates Intel's architecture rules to the point that a manufacturer might have to get their chips from a third party!
I wish someone would try the Acorp board now that it's had time to mature-will you be the one?
Video killed my Radio Card!
I wish someone would try the Acorp board now that it's had time to mature-will you be the one?
Video killed my Radio Card!
hello crash, I do have a P-III 700E with one my client and I can get it from him anytime trading it for some P-III 8xxEB.
but we will have to wait for somebody to figure out running two P-IIIs on the BP6r2!!!
btw I already have a CUSL2 and I generally prefer AMD systems so see if you can get a TUSL2 or get that CUSL2 run a Tualatin ... just kiddin!
girish
<font color=blue>die-hard fans don't have heat-sinks!</font color=blue>
but we will have to wait for somebody to figure out running two P-IIIs on the BP6r2!!!
btw I already have a CUSL2 and I generally prefer AMD systems so see if you can get a TUSL2 or get that CUSL2 run a Tualatin
... just kiddin!girish
<font color=blue>die-hard fans don't have heat-sinks!</font color=blue>
well, thats right. but if Asus does spend a bit on developing a dual 815 board, they will have many more customers. see, they already have two! you and me!!
a limit of 512MB is not too much of a taboo since not too many such systems will will go beyond 512. maybe 80% at 512, 15% at 256~512 and rest of them upto 256. I havent seen anything like dual processor support in the 815 datasheets, or maybe I was sure it didnt, I didnt notice it.I wonder how Acorp is doing interprocessor communication on their boards!
btw tom has already tried the Acorp board and declared it bad, of course he compared it to a Asus board, but many people will want to buy it just for its price and dual support for a home system. not me. I need stability as well as performance, and maybe I'd rather stay at 512MB anyway.
girish
<font color=blue>die-hard fans don't have heat-sinks!</font color=blue>
a limit of 512MB is not too much of a taboo since not too many such systems will will go beyond 512. maybe 80% at 512, 15% at 256~512 and rest of them upto 256. I havent seen anything like dual processor support in the 815 datasheets, or maybe I was sure it didnt, I didnt notice it.I wonder how Acorp is doing interprocessor communication on their boards!
btw tom has already tried the Acorp board and declared it bad, of course he compared it to a Asus board, but many people will want to buy it just for its price and dual support for a home system. not me. I need stability as well as performance, and maybe I'd rather stay at 512MB anyway.
girish
<font color=blue>die-hard fans don't have heat-sinks!</font color=blue>
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Dang dude, you do know that the review you linked was TWO YEARS OLD and probably refered to revision 1.1 or something!
About the Celeron. NO, when they say "Celeron up to 533" they mean the old PPGA Celerons only! The HIGHEST speed PPGA Celeron was 533. There was also a Coppermine Celeron 533, which was the slowest of the Celeron 2's. So that's no clue either, except to say that at least the earlier revisions of the board did not take dual Coppermines.
Video killed my Radio Card!
About the Celeron. NO, when they say "Celeron up to 533" they mean the old PPGA Celerons only! The HIGHEST speed PPGA Celeron was 533. There was also a Coppermine Celeron 533, which was the slowest of the Celeron 2's. So that's no clue either, except to say that at least the earlier revisions of the board did not take dual Coppermines.
Video killed my Radio Card!
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Remember that Tom tested a BETA version, chances are fairly good that the final version of the Acorp board was well improved....
Of course I would prefer the BP6 r2.0 if someone can confirm it's ability to support dual Coppermines!
Video killed my Radio Card!
Of course I would prefer the BP6 r2.0 if someone can confirm it's ability to support dual Coppermines!
Video killed my Radio Card!
well the Acorp final version might be good enough, but I still wish Asus made one such board!
btw i dint notice the date on the review, I was too busy doing many things and just sprung up seeing the <i>Dual Socket370 BX board</i>! hehe...
and now I'd had my lunch and investigated further, I'd also like to bring to your and others' notice that the link I gave reviewed the BP6 board only and mentioned the BX6 slot1 dual processor board in its rev 2.0! I also just checked out the Abit site and found that there is no such BP6 rev 2.0, but they might as well make one.
and i guess its just the power requirements that makes Coppermines incompatible with the BX chipset. what did the guys who did get their Coppermines working do? what makes CUBX work with Coppermines? guess Asus builtthe Coppermine support onto the board itself, and we might need to make a socket370 adapter to fit in a 370 pin socket to support coppermines on the BP6!
what a goof up! sorry guys...
girish
<font color=blue>die-hard fans don't have heat-sinks!</font color=blue>
btw i dint notice the date on the review, I was too busy doing many things and just sprung up seeing the <i>Dual Socket370 BX board</i>! hehe...
and now I'd had my lunch and investigated further, I'd also like to bring to your and others' notice that the link I gave reviewed the BP6 board only and mentioned the BX6 slot1 dual processor board in its rev 2.0! I also just checked out the Abit site and found that there is no such BP6 rev 2.0, but they might as well make one.
and i guess its just the power requirements that makes Coppermines incompatible with the BX chipset. what did the guys who did get their Coppermines working do? what makes CUBX work with Coppermines? guess Asus builtthe Coppermine support onto the board itself, and we might need to make a socket370 adapter to fit in a 370 pin socket to support coppermines on the BP6!
what a goof up! sorry guys...
girish
<font color=blue>die-hard fans don't have heat-sinks!</font color=blue>
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I think it has to do with the MODIFUCKATIONS Abit made to the BP6 procesor bus. They had to modify something to make the Celerons capable of dual use. In doing that, they may have ruined it for dual Coppermine use. Befor I jump the gun on this, I would like someone else to confirm it. Meanwhile, this brings us back to the Asus P2B-D. Dual slotkets anyone?
Or maybe the retail version of the Acorp board is a worthwhile unit?
Video killed my Radio Card!
Or maybe the retail version of the Acorp board is a worthwhile unit?
Video killed my Radio Card!
here is what i found at <A HREF="http://www.friendtech.com/S370.htm" target="_new">http://www.friendtech.com/S370.htm</A> its a FCFGA to PPGA convertor, that will allow coppermines to work on PPGA boards, but it isnt documented to support SMP. its also has a <A HREF="http://www.friendtech.com/NeoBp6.htm" target="_new">special note on BP6 use</A> and <A HREF="http://www.friendtech.com/NeoBP6Updated.htm" target="_new">its update</A>, and that they HAVE WORKED dual Coppermine P-IIIs with this adapter! it needs some tweaking with the BP6 as well as the Neo S370 adapter, that not many would appreciate. not too complicated ones but a bit delicate operations. the updated procedure it intimidating.
note here that the FSB is still limited to 100 MHz and operation above that isnt guaranteed (but possible), but you are running dual Coppermines and that too upto 1 GHz on the BP6 nevertheless!
girish
<font color=blue>die-hard fans don't have heat-sinks!</font color=blue>
note here that the FSB is still limited to 100 MHz and operation above that isnt guaranteed (but possible), but you are running dual Coppermines and that too upto 1 GHz on the BP6 nevertheless!
girish
<font color=blue>die-hard fans don't have heat-sinks!</font color=blue>
they also have a <A HREF="http://" target="_new">slotket</A> that can use Coppermine socket processors in a SC242 slot1 and it supports SMP too! so now you can go for the Asus P2B-D all the way and thats well known support without doing any mods and tweaks!!! except for changing the crystal to get it work at 133 MHz!
and they also plan to support Tualatin processor on both the slot and socket adapters!
girish
<font color=blue>die-hard fans don't have heat-sinks!</font color=blue>
and they also plan to support Tualatin processor on both the slot and socket adapters!
girish
<font color=blue>die-hard fans don't have heat-sinks!</font color=blue>
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I kind of figured they'd come out with a Tualatin adapter. But still the Neo needs to be hotwired to work with the PIII and BP6.
Now the P2B-D supports dual PIII's to begin with. I've been told that the latest bios on the latest board revision supports 133MHz FSB in BIOS. An many inexpensive slotkets are available for SMP, Asus even sells one. So why don't you buy one and tell me if it supports the 133MHz FSB?
Video killed my Radio Card!
Now the P2B-D supports dual PIII's to begin with. I've been told that the latest bios on the latest board revision supports 133MHz FSB in BIOS. An many inexpensive slotkets are available for SMP, Asus even sells one. So why don't you buy one and tell me if it supports the 133MHz FSB?
Video killed my Radio Card!
Pettytheft
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You want a good board, check out
<A HREF="http://www.supermicro.com" target="_new">Supermicro</A> or
<A HREF="http://www.tyan.com/products/html/pentium.html" target="_new">Tyan</A>
Stick with the Serverworks chipsets.
They make the best dual boards, what I mean by best is the most stable platform available. No Frills and such but you'll be getting a good solid system. If you want to tweak and overclock go Via: Asus, Iwill, ECS or Abit.
Blah, Blah Blahh, Blahh, blahh blah blahh, blah blah.<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by pettytheft on 08/12/01 01:47 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
<A HREF="http://www.supermicro.com" target="_new">Supermicro</A> or
<A HREF="http://www.tyan.com/products/html/pentium.html" target="_new">Tyan</A>
Stick with the Serverworks chipsets.
They make the best dual boards, what I mean by best is the most stable platform available. No Frills and such but you'll be getting a good solid system. If you want to tweak and overclock go Via: Asus, Iwill, ECS or Abit.
Blah, Blah Blahh, Blahh, blahh blah blahh, blah blah.<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by pettytheft on 08/12/01 01:47 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
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