EQ2: Guild changes

[Patrik]

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

From Moorgard, on the official forums:

"Our designers are currently refining a few elements of the guild
system. Chief among the upcoming changes is the fact that decay over
time is going away; we will tune guild advancement rates to take this
change into account. Additionally, status quests will be based on the
player level rather than the guild level, which means you won't need
to farm greys to advance your guild. Also, artisans will be able to
earn status by performing tasks similar to the ones they now perform
for their societies. This will allow artisans to become active and
valuable patrons for their guild.

We believe these changes will benefit all types of guilds, from casual
players to dedicated raiders.

I can't yet announce when these changes will go live, as we want to
spend a good deal of time testing them internally before pushing them
to the live servers. But I wanted to let you all know what was coming
in the near future."

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

<patrik@nordebo.com> wrote in message
news:87ekiatkze.fsf@pluto.elizium.org...
>
> From Moorgard, on the official forums:

Excellent changes, all of them. That one really made my day, thanks for
posting it.

--
Redbeard
<Veritas>
Dwarven Mystic and Alchemist
Loyal Citizen of the Antonia Bayle
Current resident of the Willow Wood, City of Qeynos
http://veritas.everquest2guilds.com

Descendant of the Elder Winterfury Thunderwolf
<Resolution, Retired>
Barbarian Prophet of The Tribunal
Retired Citizen of Firiona Vie

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

On Wed, 1 Dec 2004 01:52:11 -0800, Bob Perez wrote:

> <patrik@nordebo.com> wrote in message
> news:87ekiatkze.fsf@pluto.elizium.org...
>>
>> From Moorgard, on the official forums:
>
> Excellent changes, all of them. That one really made my day, thanks for
> posting it.

I don't know. I don't like the idea of guild decay going completely away.
For roleplaying aspects it just 'fits'. As you complete tasks in the city
your guild is looked upon more favorably (a la NYC firefighters after
9-11), however, when you stop or slow down your tasks the city looks to
others more in the public view (a la NYC firefighters now). I'd rather see
them slow the decay quite a bit than get rid of it completely.
--
RJB
12/1/2004 9:02:52 AM

Income tax has made liars out of more Americans than golf
--Will Rogers

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

On 01 Dec 2004 10:40:21 +0100, patrik@nordebo.com wrote:

> Chief among the upcoming changes is the fact that decay over
>time is going away

Good - this was the worst decision they made regarding guilds.
Imagine if trade or adventuring XP degraded with time - I reesented
doing writs for my guild as, while I was actually earning the guild
xp, I was already calculating how long it would last before I'd have
to earn more.

--

Bunnies aren't just cute like everybody supposes !
They got them hoppy legs and twitchy little noses !
And what's with all the carrots ?
What do they need such good eyesight for anyway ?
Bunnies ! Bunnies ! It must be BUNNIES !

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

Bob Perez wrote:

> <patrik@nordebo.com> wrote in message
> news:87ekiatkze.fsf@pluto.elizium.org...
> >
> > From Moorgard, on the official forums:
>
> Excellent changes, all of them. That one really made my day, thanks for
> posting it.

After grinding out like 10 writs last night I will be happy. Worst thing
is when I had to kill young kodiaks but had to kill a bunch of wolves to
get them to spawn only to have a large group come up and take it away from
me. I did a tell to them advising them to kill wolves but they said they
just wanted the bears and too bad for me. People are stupid.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

Many wootz!

This seems to address most of the major issues with guild status. Of
course, there's that little issue of exactly what they'll put in to
balance it...

Decay itself never struck me as bad, but the RATE of decay was
extreme...
*----------------------------------------------------*
Evolution doesn't take prisoners:Lizard
"I've heard of this thing men call 'empathy', but I've never
once been afflicted with it, thanks the Gods." Bruno The Bandit
http://www.mrlizard.com

 

[user]

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

In article <pgorq0drf66bs51mbntaoslrggg1b43ucr@4ax.com>,
drdpikeuk@aol.com says...
> On 01 Dec 2004 10:40:21 +0100, patrik@nordebo.com wrote:
>
> > Chief among the upcoming changes is the fact that decay over
> >time is going away
>
> Good - this was the worst decision they made regarding guilds.
> Imagine if trade or adventuring XP degraded with time - I reesented
> doing writs for my guild as, while I was actually earning the guild
> xp, I was already calculating how long it would last before I'd have
> to earn more.

Some things decay over time.

PP and Tribute and Food in EQ1 get spent and must reacquired and nobody
has ever blinked about that.

So too does fame and prestige. You must stay in the headlines to stay a
headliner.

I think it may have needed some tuning (farming greys being a good
example... obviously if you can earn fame doing trivial conquests you
should be able to earn it doing more relevant and challenging
conquests), but getting rid of decay altogether is stupid. Looks like
Sony is already backing away from sensible design models to cater to
whining.

EQ2s golden age of 'vision' ends less than a month after release.

Too bad the real world doesn't work like that... you can bet your ass
those 80s/90s has-been rock/pop stars would love to still be famous...

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

On Wed, 01 Dec 2004 21:30:29 GMT, 42 <nospam@nospam.com> wrote:

>Too bad the real world doesn't work like that... you can bet your ass
>those 80s/90s has-been rock/pop stars would love to still be famous...

So you'd have no complaints if your character's xp and skills decayed
over time ?

You log on after a week and find out your sword skill has decayed to
the point where you can't use the sword you'd just bought, and you've
dropped 2 levels.

You wouldn't be saying "Guess what - some things decay over time" then
- you'd be pissed. Same for guild XP - your guild has a bust few days
tradeskilling and getting completing groups quests, and you lose a
guild level as a consequence ?

It was a stupid decision to begin with, and I'm glad it's been fixed.

--

Bunnies aren't just cute like everybody supposes !
They got them hoppy legs and twitchy little noses !
And what's with all the carrots ?
What do they need such good eyesight for anyway ?
Bunnies ! Bunnies ! It must be BUNNIES !

 

[user]

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

In article <34ssq018dqencqha2d4d3k82qq2idhoa0h@4ax.com>,
drdpikeuk@aol.com says...
> On Wed, 01 Dec 2004 21:30:29 GMT, 42 <nospam@nospam.com> wrote:
>
> >Too bad the real world doesn't work like that... you can bet your ass
> >those 80s/90s has-been rock/pop stars would love to still be famous...
>
> So you'd have no complaints if your character's xp and skills decayed
> over time ?

Not necessarily, no.

> You log on after a week and find out your sword skill has decayed to
> the point where you can't use the sword you'd just bought, and you've
> dropped 2 levels.

After *1 week* I've forgotten how to use a sword and lost 2 levels?

That would be a problem with the *rate of decay*.

I haven't spoke french daily in 20 years. Guess what... I don't speak it
very well anymore. Its not 'gone'; it never will be completely gone and
I'd learn it much faster the 2nd time around, but it has decayed
significantly. And note that it took 20 years... I didn't lose my
ability to speak french over the Christmas break. You seem to think the
only way for decay to work is extremely and unrealistically quickly.

> You wouldn't be saying "Guess what - some things decay over time" then
> - you'd be pissed. Same for guild XP - your guild has a bust few days
> tradeskilling and getting completing groups quests, and you lose a
> guild level as a consequence ?

Again *rate of decay* issue.

> It was a stupid decision to begin with, and I'm glad it's been fixed.

/shrug

As usual sony fixed a problem of degree with a solution of elimination.
They've set that precedent a hundred times over in EQ1.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

Mark Morrison wrote:
> You wouldn't be saying "Guess what - some things decay over time" then
> - you'd be pissed. Same for guild XP - your guild has a bust few days
> tradeskilling and getting completing groups quests, and you lose a
> guild level as a consequence ?
>
> It was a stupid decision to begin with, and I'm glad it's been fixed.

I don't think I've ever played a game that had "decay" where I thought it
was implemented correctly.

Perhaps the silliest of all was how it was done in System Shock 2.

--
chainbreaker

If you need to email, then chainbreaker (naturally) at comcast dot
net--that's "net" not "com"--should do it.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

On Thu, 02 Dec 2004 02:07:38 GMT, 42 <nospam@nospam.com> wrote:

>As usual sony fixed a problem of degree with a solution of elimination.
>They've set that precedent a hundred times over in EQ1.

I never played EQ1 so can't commment, but I'm perfectly happy with the
was they addressed this issue in EQ2.

If you're not, too bad.

--

Bunnies aren't just cute like everybody supposes !
They got them hoppy legs and twitchy little noses !
And what's with all the carrots ?
What do they need such good eyesight for anyway ?
Bunnies ! Bunnies ! It must be BUNNIES !

 

[user]

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

In article <alttq0ts809f42iak1lj2e85muh339ffqh@4ax.com>,
drdpikeuk@aol.com says...
> On Thu, 02 Dec 2004 02:07:38 GMT, 42 <nospam@nospam.com> wrote:
>
> >As usual sony fixed a problem of degree with a solution of elimination.
> >They've set that precedent a hundred times over in EQ1.
>
> I never played EQ1 so can't commment, but I'm perfectly happy with the
> was they addressed this issue in EQ2.
>
> If you're not, too bad.

LOL. What a delicious irony.

You see there is a problem with that whole 'if your not happy, too bad'
sentiment, when they *just* changed it because some people said they
'were not happy'.

Evidently 'not being happy' is enough to get SOE to revise mechanics so
its patently not 'too bad'. Now is it?

Goof.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

On Thu, 02 Dec 2004 12:06:48 GMT, 42 <nospam@nospam.com> wrote:

>In article <alttq0ts809f42iak1lj2e85muh339ffqh@4ax.com>,
>drdpikeuk@aol.com says...
>> On Thu, 02 Dec 2004 02:07:38 GMT, 42 <nospam@nospam.com> wrote:
>>
>> >As usual sony fixed a problem of degree with a solution of elimination.
>> >They've set that precedent a hundred times over in EQ1.
>>
>> I never played EQ1 so can't commment, but I'm perfectly happy with the
>> was they addressed this issue in EQ2.
>>
>> If you're not, too bad.
>
>LOL. What a delicious irony.
>
>You see there is a problem with that whole 'if your not happy, too bad'
>sentiment, when they *just* changed it because some people said they
>'were not happy'.
>
>Evidently 'not being happy' is enough to get SOE to revise mechanics so
>its patently not 'too bad'. Now is it?
>
>Goof.

The difference is, this time *I'm* happy. So that's good.

--

Bunnies aren't just cute like everybody supposes !
They got them hoppy legs and twitchy little noses !
And what's with all the carrots ?
What do they need such good eyesight for anyway ?
Bunnies ! Bunnies ! It must be BUNNIES !

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

"chainbreaker" <noone@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:con0nq013rl@news2.newsguy.com...
> Mark Morrison wrote:
> > You wouldn't be saying "Guess what - some things decay over time" then
> > - you'd be pissed. Same for guild XP - your guild has a bust few days
> > tradeskilling and getting completing groups quests, and you lose a
> > guild level as a consequence ?
> >
> > It was a stupid decision to begin with, and I'm glad it's been fixed.
>
> I don't think I've ever played a game that had "decay" where I thought it
> was implemented correctly.
>
> Perhaps the silliest of all was how it was done in System Shock 2.

Yeah, we have nice high-tech, FTL spacecraft, and nano-machine replicators, but
we can't fire a pistol more than ten times without it breaking completely!

Ultima Underworld had a fairly reasonable rate of decay I think, your armour
could take a fair pounding before you had to repair it. And try to break down a
metal door with a longsword... the sword would break pretty quickly.

Rich

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

Richard Wingrove wrote:
> Ultima Underworld had a fairly reasonable rate of decay I think, your
> armour could take a fair pounding before you had to repair it. And
> try to break down a metal door with a longsword... the sword would
> break pretty quickly.
>
> Rich

Yeah, I agree. It was at worst just one more thing to deal with, rather
than something that kept you constantly PO'd.

And Diablo 2 doesn't do that badly either, although in that game the rate of
decay is so slow for most items that it might as well not even be part of
the game.

But UU probably had it closer to "right" than any with which I'm familiar.
--
chainbreaker

If you need to email, then chainbreaker (naturally) at comcast dot
net--that's "net" not "com"--should do it.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

Mark Morrison <drdpikeuk@aol.com> wrote in
news:094uq05caqiplprh16pt9j4gvrkop3m9ie@4ax.com:

> On Thu, 02 Dec 2004 12:06:48 GMT, 42 <nospam@nospam.com> wrote:
>
>>In article <alttq0ts809f42iak1lj2e85muh339ffqh@4ax.com>,
>>drdpikeuk@aol.com says...
>>> On Thu, 02 Dec 2004 02:07:38 GMT, 42 <nospam@nospam.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> >As usual sony fixed a problem of degree with a solution of
>>> >elimination. They've set that precedent a hundred times over in
>>> >EQ1.
>>>
>>> I never played EQ1 so can't commment, but I'm perfectly happy with
>>> the was they addressed this issue in EQ2.
>>>
>>> If you're not, too bad.
>>
>>LOL. What a delicious irony.
>>
>>You see there is a problem with that whole 'if your not happy, too
>>bad' sentiment, when they *just* changed it because some people said
>>they 'were not happy'.
>>
>>Evidently 'not being happy' is enough to get SOE to revise mechanics
>>so its patently not 'too bad'. Now is it?
>>
>>Goof.
>
> The difference is, this time *I'm* happy. So that's good.
>

They have a history of over correcting issues in EQ1, I see that they
will likely continue this tradition in EQ2.

--
On Erollisi Marr in <Sanctuary of Marr>
Ancient Graeme Faelban, Barbarian Prophet of 69 seasons

On Steamfont in <Bane of Evil>
Graeme, 16 Dwarven Shaman, 14 Scholar

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

On 2 Dec 2004 15:39:04 GMT, Graeme Faelban
<RichardRapier@netscape.net> wrotCRIVE_E

>They have a history of over correcting issues in EQ1, I see that they
>will likely continue this tradition in EQ2.

This is endemic to this style of game.

Which is going to go over better with the player base?

"We set blah to be about twice as high as needed, so we're setting it
back down a bit again."

"we raised blah last week, but not enough. We'll raise it a bit more
this week. And next week. And the week after that. Until we get it
right. But, hey, at least we're not over-raising it, right?"

Taking away a lot and then giving some back is an easier "sell" than
taking away a little bit each patch.
*----------------------------------------------------*
Evolution doesn't take prisoners:Lizard
"I've heard of this thing men call 'empathy', but I've never
once been afflicted with it, thanks the Gods." Bruno The Bandit
http://www.mrlizard.com

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

Lizard wrote:
> On 2 Dec 2004 15:39:04 GMT, Graeme Faelban
> <RichardRapier@netscape.net> wrotCRIVE_E
>
>
>>They have a history of over correcting issues in EQ1, I see that they
>>will likely continue this tradition in EQ2.
>
>
> This is endemic to this style of game.
>
> Which is going to go over better with the player base?
>
> "We set blah to be about twice as high as needed, so we're setting it
> back down a bit again."
>
> "we raised blah last week, but not enough. We'll raise it a bit more
> this week. And next week. And the week after that. Until we get it
> right. But, hey, at least we're not over-raising it, right?"
>
> Taking away a lot and then giving some back is an easier "sell" than
> taking away a little bit each patch.

How about just setting blah twice as high as needed, then not addressing
the issue ever again?

Because while your ideas were interesting, neither of them seemed to be
the way SOE actually works.

 

[steve]

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

"42" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.1c18a52849b41d69898f4@shawnews...
> In article <alttq0ts809f42iak1lj2e85muh339ffqh@4ax.com>,
> drdpikeuk@aol.com says...
>> On Thu, 02 Dec 2004 02:07:38 GMT, 42 <nospam@nospam.com> wrote:
>>
>> >As usual sony fixed a problem of degree with a solution of
>> >elimination.
>> >They've set that precedent a hundred times over in EQ1.
>>
>> I never played EQ1 so can't commment, but I'm perfectly happy with
>> the
>> was they addressed this issue in EQ2.
>>
>> If you're not, too bad.
>
> LOL. What a delicious irony.
>
> You see there is a problem with that whole 'if your not happy, too
> bad'
> sentiment, when they *just* changed it because some people said they
> 'were not happy'.
>


Maybe they changed it because they saw it in practice and it just was
not good.

You can stop whining any time now.

 

[user]

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

In article <JP2sd.129392$V41.125386@attbi_s52>, saw2814.remove@mchsi.com
says...
>
> "42" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
> news:MPG.1c18a52849b41d69898f4@shawnews...
> > In article <alttq0ts809f42iak1lj2e85muh339ffqh@4ax.com>,
> > drdpikeuk@aol.com says...
> >> On Thu, 02 Dec 2004 02:07:38 GMT, 42 <nospam@nospam.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> >As usual sony fixed a problem of degree with a solution of
> >> >elimination.
> >> >They've set that precedent a hundred times over in EQ1.
> >>
> >> I never played EQ1 so can't commment, but I'm perfectly happy with
> >> the
> >> was they addressed this issue in EQ2.
> >>
> >> If you're not, too bad.
> >
> > LOL. What a delicious irony.
> >
> > You see there is a problem with that whole 'if your not happy, too
> > bad'
> > sentiment, when they *just* changed it because some people said they
> > 'were not happy'.
> >
>
>
> Maybe they changed it because they saw it in practice and it just was
> not good.

No question they changed it because it was not good. The point of
contention is *how* they changed it.

> You can stop whining any time now.

I wasn't the one whining to have it changed in the first place.

You can stop making stupid accusations any time now.