Power Psu & Ups FAQ: !DRAFT!

I'd also throw in something about suggested manufactuers of PSU's, as well as a generic list of the watt consumption that individual parts use up, so people can make a general guage of how many they should get. Make sure to mention too, no crappy below 300 watters, nothing generic, all that good stuff. If you want, I could write this up for you.

Instead of Rdram, why not just merge 4 Sdram channels...
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More about power draft
  1. How about we put a link to the power supply article that we did? It has a ton of good information on the subject and continues to have a good amount of reference material in it.
  2. yes... links are good.
    PSU article that you guys did wasnt bad :)

    I even bet you had fun burning out crappy ones :wink:

    <b>Anyone claiming they can see the difference
    between 450 and 500 FPS in Quake3 deserves to
    be severely beaten with a rock. :smile: </b>
  3. <A HREF="http://www.apcc.com/resource/include/techspec_index.cfm?base_sku=BP500UC&language=EN&country_code=US" target="_new">APC Back-Ups LS500 (BP500UC)</A> rated for 500VA/315Watts

    My sys. specs under info.
    With 17" monitor on: 170 Watts load, battery time 14 minutes.
    Monitor off: 103 Watts load, battery time 25 minutes.

    <b><font color=blue>Press 1 if you want to be on hold, 2 for disconnect, 3 for a representative who will put you on hold before disconnecting.</font color=blue></b>
  4. For a good look at some Power Supply Units (PSU) please see the article that David Stelmack, Frank Volkel, Bert Topelt, Nicole Ott, and Dirk Jonischkiet of THG wrote.

    <A HREF="http://www6.tomshardware.com/howto/20021021/index.html" target="_new">Inadequate and Deceptive Product Labeling: Comparison of 21 Power Supplies</A>

    <b><font color=red>Fredi</font color=red> <font color=red>Fredi</font color=red> He's our man! If he can't do it no one can!</b>
  5. If you have the time, go for it :smile:

    <b>Anyone claiming they can see the difference
    between 450 and 500 FPS in Quake3 deserves to
    be severely beaten with a rock. :smile: </b>
  6. alright, i'll type one up tomorrow in school, mwahaha, study halls rock ^_^

    Instead of Rdram, why not just merge 4 Sdram channels...
  7. [shocking french accent]

    Le' Bump

    [/shocking french accent]

    <i>"Revenues were less than robust"</i> - QWEST
    <i>"The company applied its accounting policies incorrectly"</i> - WORLDCOM
    <i>"Certian financial adjustments may be required"</i> - AOL+TW.
  8. almost done, did half of it in Comp Sci2, i'll upload it tomorrow

    Instead of Rdram, why not just merge 4 Sdram channels...
  9. How about giving people some tips on how to test a power supply suspected to have gone bad. The equipment needed for this and how to use it.
  10. Read <font color=red><b>Dstell</font color=red></b>'s article that I posted above. There is too much equipment involved to do it yourself if you are only a hobbyist. That is why I leave stuff like that up to people like David.

    <b><font color=red>Fredi</font color=red> <font color=red>Fredi</font color=red> He's our man! If he can't do it no one can!</b>
  11. best way for the home enthusiast is to monitor your voltages.

    <i>"Revenues were less than robust"</i> - QWEST
    <i>"The company applied its accounting policies incorrectly"</i> - WORLDCOM
    <i>"Certian financial adjustments may be required"</i> - AOL+TW.
  12. PooBah, how about stressing the importance of properly grounded outlets, some older home wiring setups, have people thinking they're safe with the by-pass ground adapters, when they're not.

    Details, Details, Its all in the Details, If you need help, Don't leave out the Details.
  13. i guess... but it sounds like we are getting a bit technical for a basic faq dontcha think?

    <i>"Revenues were less than robust"</i> - QWEST
    <i>"The company applied its accounting policies incorrectly"</i> - WORLDCOM
    <i>"Certian financial adjustments may be required"</i> - AOL+TW.
  14. Probably but its frequently a missed disaster especially in the US.

    Details, Details, Its all in the Details, If you need help, Don't leave out the Details.
  15. <font color=blue><b>Power Supply FAQ</b></font color=blue>
    Version 1.10, 22 February, 2003

    <font color=red>01.How much power do I need in my system?</font color=red>
    It all depends on what parts you have in your system. The generic standard size for a good power supply is normally thought of as 300 watts, although with the newer parts having a greater drain on the power, I would recommend a minimum of 350-365 watts. A basic computer requiring 350-365 watts would include a motherboard, processor, 256-512mb of ram, one hard drive, a Cdrom/Dvdrom/Cdrw, a floppy drive, several case fans, an Agp graphics card, and perhaps a couple Pci cards. Beyond this, you may want to consider buying a larger one in upwards of 400-520 watts.

    <font color=red>02.What are good manufacturers for PSU's (power supplies)?</font color=red>
    I would invest money in the following, broken up into two categories, higher end and value. Power supplies cost between $30 and $120
    Higher end PSU's
    • Enermax
    • TTGI
    • Vantec Stealth
    • Channelwell Technology
    • Achme
    • Seasonic
    • Top Power

    Value PSU's
    • Enlight
    • Thermaltake
    • L & C Technology
    • Allied Components
    • Powerup
    • Antec Performance Plus

    <font color=red>03.What are bad manufacturers for PSU's?</font color=red>
    The worst companies i've used are in the following list

    Bad PSU's
    • Any generic or unlabeled brand
    • Antec Truepower
    • Sparkle
    • Compucase
    • Raidmax
    • Codegan
    • Omni

    <font color=red>04.Can I use a power supply that comes with my case?</font color=red>
    Yes and no. Realistically, you can, although you run the risk of having an unstable system due to fluctuating voltages. Look inside your case amd see if you can identify the manufacturer. While you may be lucky with a no name brand, chances are the power supply will castrate your entire system.

    <font color=red>05.Do new power supplies have all the necessary connectors?</font color=red>
    Yes and no again. The main 20 pin power connector (P10) provides current for all versions of ATX motherboards. However, the newer power supplies do not support the older AT type motherboards with P6 connectors. Additionally, all power supplies have at least 3 or 4 molex Connectors for Cd drives/hard drives/ect, as well as 1 or 2 floppy drive plugs. Also, just about every new power supply has the square 4 pin connector (12 volt) for Pentium4/Celeron motherboards, as well as limited AMD boards with additional load input.

    <font color=red>06.Is there an advantage of PSU's with multiple fans?</font color=red>
    Every power supply has at least one fan (except ultra quiet one's with passive heatsinks). A good balanced power supply has two fans, one intake fan on the bottom, and one exhaust fan in the back facing outwards. Even if you have minimal case fans, your power supply can be used for air circulation in your case. Generally, most power supplies are stable with two fans, although some can get by with just one exhaust and grates for air intake.

    <font color=red>07.What is the lowest and highest voltages a power supply can have?</font color=red>
    Power supplies can't be judged entirely by their rated wattage. The watts shown are the combined total of watts between the three rails, 3.3 volt, 5 volt, and 12 volt. During usage, these values are likely to drop or rise above the exact amount, depending on the load the other rails have. The most important factors of a good power supply are a clean non fluctuating current, and a low variation in voltage. The voltage in a stable system is usually tolerant to roughly 1 to 3 percent of the average voltage. For an example-

    3.3 volt rail-3.13 volts 5.4 percent deviation
    5 volt rail-4.78 volts 4.6 percent deviation
    12 volt rail-11.23 volts 6.9 percent deviation

    While these voltages aren't too terrible, they are also erratic enough to cause system instability.

    3.3 volt rail-3.25 volts 1.5 percent deviation
    5 volt rail-4.98 volts .4 percent deviation
    12 volt rail-11.78 volts 1.8 percent deviation

    These voltages are much closer to a systems reasonable tolerance

    If anyone has any suggestions or comments, or fixing my errors which are undoubtedly in there ^_^, feel free to reply

    Edit-update to power supply listings
    version 1.10

    Instead of Rdram, why not just merge 4 Sdram channels...<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by Quetzacoatl on 02/22/03 02:21 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
  16. a few additions: put toptower in the quality list... on par just about with enermax, dan @ dans data have done a few reviews on em.

    as for bad PSU's
    Codegen and OMNI

    also dont forget to mention that the prices are in US dollars :smile:

    <i>"Revenues were less than robust"</i> - QWEST
    <i>"The company applied its accounting policies incorrectly"</i> - WORLDCOM
    <i>"Certian financial adjustments may be required"</i> - AOL+TW.
  17. I don't understand how you can list Channel Well among the best power supplies but at the same time list Antec Truepower and Compucase among the worst when they're also made by Channel Well and are of very similar designs. I don't know who makes Antec's Performance Series, but their Solution Series and their predecessor, Smartpower, are also Channel Well, and this company's products tend to be reliable.

    Similarly, I don't understand how you can rate Allied and L&C well among the value brands but Codegen badly since they too are all from the same parent company, Deer, which is known for poor quality (bad or even missing components).

    Sparkle, also known as Fortron, Source, and Powerman, is one of the best built and designed makes available.
  18. Channel Well technology make's the power supplies, but has nothing to do with the housing or included cording and such. Antec Truepowers tend to have lower ratings, and my guess is that they receive relabeled or poor yeilds from CWT. Allied and L&C have come to an acceptable level that have put out better power supplies that i've had experience using on myself. Codegan is rather poor, as is Sparkle. Have YOU ever even used a Sparkle power supply? I have, and they run hot, very poorly designed, with bad airflow and cooling. I've actually USED all the power supplies I listed, and don't speak for brands I don't know of. Unless you can back up your quotes, i'm not making changes without first using them.

    edit-minor typos

    Instead of Rdram, why not just merge 4 Sdram channels...<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by Quetzacoatl on 02/23/03 01:05 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
  19. I'd be very surprised if Channel Well was sending its inferior products to Antec, and I've never heard of Truepowers having lower ratings. If anything, they're rated more conservatively than other Antecs or Channel Wells. I've used Sparkle and its cousins, Fortron and Powerman, and they are robust, as Tom has shown, and have heavier components than almost anything else but Astec and Delta. I didn't measure efficiency, but almost all ATX power supplies are rated for 65-70% efficiency, and I didn't notice the FSP/Sparkle supplies running any warmer than others.
  20. You still haven't answered my question. Of what of the listed power supplies have you actually used?

    Instead of Rdram, why not just merge 4 Sdram channels...
  21. Whoa so Antec is bad? I thought Antec had the best value and performance in the psu field?
    Are you saying that I would probably be better off with a Channelwell Technology psu than Antec? because I was going to go out and buy an Antec Trueblue 480W psu at the beginning of next month but now I'm not sure what to buy anymore.
  22. Well...i'm not sure, I wouldn't doubt they have some good products, but they're just not the same Antec I thought of as the best before. I just know Channelwell Techology is reliable, and inexpensive.

    Instead of Rdram, why not just merge 4 Sdram channels...
  23. Oh I see.
    Well I'm not really looking at the price. What I really want is something quiet yet have a lot of power. I chose the Antec Trueblue 480W because I seen a couple reviews and they had no con's to them and I saw that everyone voted on the Antec Trueblue 480W psu over at ocworkbench so I'm thinking it can't be a bad product. But you listed Antec as a bad psu manufacturer so not sure anymore.

    What would you recommend in getting as a quiet yet a high end power PSU? I'm wanting something at least 400W but at the same time as quiet as can be.
  24. i dont think antec are bad. In the past they have had some mediocre PSU's but their true power line and modern units seem to be damn beefy.

    <i>"Revenues were less than robust"</i> - QWEST
    <i>"The company applied its accounting policies incorrectly"</i> - WORLDCOM
    <i>"Certian financial adjustments may be required"</i> - AOL+TW.
  25. Err, i'm just not a big fan of Antec anymore, and neither does Crashman, it would seem

    Instead of Rdram, why not just merge 4 Sdram channels...
  26. I think it all comes down to personal experience. If you've had a certain manu crap out on you, then it taints you against that company. I upgraded to an Antec TruePower 480 several weeks back, and I love it.

    Your best bet is to read other posts and check reviews on THG and Anandtech. I did a lot of checking before I took the plunge.
  27. I got a barebones from infinity systems plus that came with a 400w duro that burnt out within 6 hours of use had like 11amps on its 12v line that is way too low so it burnt out.I called tech support and he told me to swap power supplys if i had an extra layin around.I told him I had a Sparkle 250w on my Athlon 750.He asked how many amps was on the 12v rail and it was 13.He Told me to swap em out and see if it would work,and it did.I noticed on my asus probe that my 5 and 3.3 volt rails were low so I went out and got(after reading good reviews on the 380w True power on THG) an Antec sl350 from compusa for 49.95(after rebate hehe)Well the 12v-12.096 5-4.811 3.3-3.216...Thats almost identical to the numbers from the Sparkle hmmmm.I was thinking about ordering a Antec 430 True till I did some reading and saw in several places(Dont ask me where trust me)that the 12v rail is unusually low,now I dont know what to get.
    Athlon 2400-o/c ta 2700(Can go farther but getting a little warm with stock heatsink/fan
    2(256)Corsair xms2700
    Gainward 4200 that crashes everyother frame that I need to RMA
  28. Just giving this a bump.

    Are you still updating this?

    <i><font color=blue>There is no failure when you believe in success.</font color=blue></i>
  29. heh thanx... been meaning to find time to finish it.

    just gotta find time and NOT play freelancer.

    <b>Melb_angel: PooBaa's <A HREF="http://www.secretarythemovie.com" target="_new">Secretary!</A></b>
  30. All of my FSP power supplies have been of the highest quality. Better in fact than anything else I've owned. The only one that could compete is my old 200W Newtons (comparing well with my old 200W FSP supplies), but I haven't seen Newton around in a while.

    Sparkle Power uses FSP supplies. I'll admit that they might have some of FSP's cheaper units, but then again, I've never owned a Sparkle. What I can say in Sparkle's defense is that when the model number matches up with a Fortron model number, it's the same supply. And the 400W Sparkle Power supply newegg sells is the same model as the 400W Fortron supply Tom's praised so highly. At newegg it costs $7 more than the Fortron, so it's not the greatest value, but still a good supply.

    <font color=blue>Watts mean squat if you don't have quality!</font color=blue>
  31. Well, I had to dud Sparkle power supplies, that I had used on an k6-2 box and a Tbird box, neither matched up to 300 watts. In the same sense though, I didn't have any luck at all using Antec psu's either. Best i've seen are Enlights (which they don't seem to be relabled), Aopens, and Enermax. I'll pick up a Fortron when I next upgrade my computer, and i'll give it a go

    Instead of Rdram, why not just merge 4 Sdram channels...
  32. I'm not certain, but I think Sparkle used to get their power supplies from a different source around 5 years ago...

    You can tell the recent Sparkel power supplies are made by Fortron by their design, weight, etc. Most have the same model numbers. If your supply was a lightweight, it probably wasn't a Fortron. But their supplies have been made by Fortron for at least 2 years now.

    <font color=blue>Watts mean squat if you don't have quality!</font color=blue>
  33. By the way, do you know if Enlight and Aopen manufacture their own power supplies?

    Instead of Rdram, why not just merge 4 Sdram channels...
  34. Aopen uses a lot of FPS power supplies, hence the same model numbers. I don't know if all Aopen's power supplies are FPS, but the ones that have a part number FPS-xxxx are.

    I don't know who makes Enlight power supplies, but they are en...light and yet seem to work perfectly.

    <font color=blue>Watts mean squat if you don't have quality!</font color=blue>
  35. Why do you give the Antec TruePower a bad rating?

    I have the Antec True480. I replaced the Antec PP352 in my Antec SX635 minitower with the True480 to power my P4 3.06.
    It's overkill but I have peace of mind knowing that I have power for future video card upgrades.

    I bought the True480 because of the review it received from the High Power article that came out earlier this month here on Tom's.

    Article <A HREF="http://www4.tomshardware.com/howto/20030609/index.html" target="_new">Link</A>.

    Article Conclusion:
    In the power-use class, the 450- to 520-Watt league, the THG lab technicians only arrived at one recommendation: the Antec True 480P, which produced the most power in the test. This power supply also delivers stable voltages on all lines and comes with a good equipment package. The Antec True 480P is the power supply we recommend for high demands, and is especially suited to extreme overclockers.

    <font color=red><i>Doctor Hooter</i></font color=red> <A HREF="http://www.page3.com/" target="_new"><b>(·Y·)</b></A>
  36. I've never heard of anyone grouping Sparkle (Fortron) and Antec Truepower among the worst brands. Did you consider the total number of samples for each brand, both the good and bad samples? Otherwise a popular brand will be overrepresented among the defective supplies.
  37. He doesn't give it a bad rating anymore... but he had some really bad experience with the old Antec PSUs a couple of years ago. Now Antec seems to have changed into a high-quality PSU manufactuer.

    My CPU fan spins so fast that it creates a wormhole :eek:
  38. Assuming that you've installed an Antec PSU with the amperages capable of the task(s), there's no reason for it to be bad.

    They're decent PSU's, if a little expensive.

    Nice FAQ Poobaa.

    Maybe I should publicise my PSU spreadsheet soon?

    <b><font color=blue>~ <A HREF="http://forums.btvillarin.com/index.php?act=ST&f=41&t=324&s=58e94ba84a16bedfebbf0f416d5bac48" target="_new">System Specs</A> ~<font color=blue></b> :wink:
  39. First draft, anything wellcome, but bear in mind im trying not to let it get bloatish.
    And i prefer constructive criticism rather than "it sux man"

    <b>PSU, UPS & Power FAQ
    Ver 0.1 11 Feb 2003</b></font color=orange>

    For those beginners out there, some terms and definitions to help you out:
    <b>AC - Alternating current -</b> Mains power basically.
    <b>DC - Direct current -</b> That which the PC uses.
    <b>PSU - Power Supply Unit -</b> The metal box in the back of the PC that converts AC mains powe into useful DC power.
    <b>A 'Rail' -</b> Power is supplied as a number of different DC voltage lines. 12V, 5V, 3.3V etc. These voltage lines are called 'Rails'.
    <b>Surge Protector -</b> Does just that, provides limited protection against mains power surges.
    <b>UPS - Uninterruptable Power Supply -</b> A UPS can protect the system against all things the surge protector can, as well alot more. (see Q7.)

    <b>The author STRONGLY reccomends the use of a UPS if you live in an area known to have frequent power problems</b>

    <b><font color=red>Q1. What are the symptoms of a overloaded/poor/failing/bad PSU?</b></font color=red>

    The problem with detecting a bad PSU is that the symptoms can be so varied and intermittant, and often look as if they are cauzed by something else entirely.
    The following list of problems <b>CAN</b> be cauzed by a overloaded/bad PSU, depending on severity:
    A. PC Failing to Boot reliably, either Warm or Cold boots or Any bootup at all.
    B. Drives not being detected properly or at all on bootup or taking a long time to do so.
    C. Drives or devices failing to run reliably or 'dissapearing' from windows in a random fashion.
    D. Random lockups, crashes or spontaneous reboots. Usually more common while the system is under heavy use, but not allways.
    E. More problems on days where the room is very hot or cold.
    F. Inability to overclock reliably despite repeated attempts.
    G. Underclocked systems at 100FSb run ok, but fail to boot or run stabily at a normal 133FSB.
    H. Sudden system instability upon the addition of new hardware (especially power hungry CPU's or graphics cards)
    I. The PSU running excessivly hot or loud
    J. Components mysteriously burning out or dying.
    K. Voltage monitoring software reporting dipping voltage rails or fluctuations.
    L. System suddenly dies with a <b><font color=red>POP, CRACKLE</font color=red></b> and a cloud of<b><font color=blue>BLUE SMOKE</font color=blue></b>

    <b><font color=red>Q2. OK... So whats the easiest way to diagnose that ive got a bad PSU?</b></font color=red>

    1. Put your hand over the rear PSU air exhaust vent. Is it very hot or just warm to cool? If its hot your PSU is undoubtedly running near its design limits.
    2. Run a system monitoring program like <b>Motherboard Monitor 5</b>. Watch the voltage rails, especially the 5v rail for AMD systems and teh 12V rail for P4 systems. They should be within 5% of optimal, and they shouldnt fluctuate or drop significantly when the cpu goes from idle to full load. If your voltages are very low or high or fluctuate they your PSU is in trouble.

    <b><font color=red>Q3. Then what?</b></font color=red>

    IF you are pretty sure its the PSU, you should replace it.
    For medium to high end systems the author <b>STRONGLY</b> reccomends you invest in a quality brand name PSU like Antec, Enermax or TopTower. 350W is accpetable for most medium to high end systems, maybe more if you plan to overclock or expand greatly in the future.
    You can get Cheaper PSU's, but there is ALOT of crap out there. Just becauze it says '350W PSU' doesnt necessarily mean its good. ive seen 300W enermax units that are way better than a generic 350W unit... and more reliable too!
    If you dont know how, get a pro to do it.
    If you have a OEM dell/gateway/compac/whatever computer, you may have to get a specially designed PSU from the company... that will most likely cost more.

    <b><font color=red>Q4. So what has mains power got to do with all of this???</font color=red></b>

    Unfortunatly in some cases its not just the PSU at fault. Some people also experience dirty/crap mains power, and that can cauze problems even if you DO have a good quality PSU.
    The only way to conclusivly prove that you have dirty power is to get a qualified power company electrician in to check out the house or streets power.

    <b><font color=red>Q5. So what then are the symptoms of bad mains power?</font color=red></b>

    You MIGHT have poor mains power if:
    A. You get a quality PSU and your system still keeps crashing.
    B. You find your PSU's burning out in rapid sucession (one poor guy on tomshardware had 3 in 6 months)
    C. You experience frequent blackouts or brownouts (It happens alot where the Author lives - possums on the powerlines)
    D. You notice the lights dimm from time to time for no reason.
    E. You live in an old house with questionable wiring.
    F. You live in remote suburbs that suffer lots of blackouts or lightning strikes.

    <b><font color=red>Q6. OK, so im worried about my power reliability... What should i do?</font color=red></b>

    A. Move to a different house/suburb/country HAHA
    B. At the minimum, get a cheap Surge protector... that should protect you from small surges and power spikes. Unfortunately cheap surge protector powerboards have been known to fail completely in the case of a direct lightning strike with nasty consequences.
    C. Spend some money and buy some proper protection for you expensive computer in the form of a UPS.

    <b><font color=red>Q7. So whats a UPS, and what should i look for?</font color=red></b>

    A UPS is basically an input power monitoring device, some fancy circutry and a battery for backup. The battery is typically a smallish sealed lead acid battery neededin the event that mains power becomes too dirty unreliable or you get a complete blackout.
    So not only does a UPS protect agains surges and power spikes, it also keeps your system up and running in the event that you have a blackout.
    Of course as its only a small battery it will only last a few minutes, depending on the power draw of your system and the rating of the UPS you purchanced.
    For a standard PC a 250VA UPS should keep it going for 5-15minutes. If you have a top of the line beast, the author reccomends a more expensive and powerful 300 to 500VA UPS.
    The authors AMD system has been saved many times over with his APC 500VA UPS. A very worthy inventment.

    <b><font color=red>Q8. This FAQ is fantastic... how can i send you huge wads of cash as payment???</font color=red></b>

    The author accepts cash donations, checks, money orders, gold bars and chocolate as payment for writing this FAQ. You can Private message him for more details

    <b><font color=red>THE END... FOR NOW</font color=red></b>

    <b><font color=red>ACKNOWLEDGEMENTS</font color=red></b>
    LHGPooBaa</font color=blue>
    Anyone else who add stuff or comments

    <b><font color=red>REVISION HISTORY</b></font color=red>
    First Draft - Ver 0.1 11 Feb 2003

    <b>Anyone claiming they can see the difference
    between 450 and 500 FPS in Quake3 deserves to
    be severely beaten with a rock. :smile: </b>
  40. Am now :)
    gonna move it to the PSU/case forum hehehe

    <b>I am not a AMD fanboy.
    I am not a Via fanboy.
    I am not a ATI fanboy.
    I AM a performance fanboy.
    And a low price fanboy. :smile:
    Mr no integrity coward.</b>
  41. And here it is. Nice one PooBaa.

    <font color=blue>"Some people believe football is a matter of life and death. I'm very disappointed with that attitude. I can assure you it is much, much more important than that" - Bill Shankly</font color=blue>
  42. you can thank our local Deity Fredi for the shiftaroonie that was done :)

    <b>I am not a AMD fanboy.
    I am not a Via fanboy.
    I am not a ATI fanboy.
    I AM a performance fanboy.
    And a low price fanboy. :smile:
    Mr no integrity coward.</b>
  43. I might add if you want to know wheather or not you got a good PSU just pick it up. I had one of those cheap (10 dollars) PSU, says PowerMax on it, feels like picking up an empty steel box, made in China, made my comp crash all the time, DVD drive would spin slowly from time to time (when installing stuff the drive would suddenly slow down its spinning rate for no reason at all then start back up), when connecting stuff to both IDE ports comp would crash. Replaced it with an Aopen PSU, cost me like around 30 bucks, I think its made in Japan cause the box has japanese written all over it... After installing the PSU the system crashed less and less. However its still crashing.. but only when playing sound, so I got a cheap 10 dollar soundcard and that fixed it... (that integrated sound really sucks)
  44. Indeed. Physical weight is a good indicator of quality.

    If the PSU feels like an empty steel box then it probably hasnt got good components inside.

    <b>I am not a AMD fanboy.
    I am not a Via fanboy.
    I am not a ATI fanboy.
    I AM a performance fanboy.
    And a low price fanboy. :smile:
    Mr no integrity coward.</b>
  45. Not replying to you pooy (too lazy to scroll and stuff).

    But quetzalcoatal (are you mayan or something btw) you dont know what you are talking about. I have a 230w powerman powersupply and it is running my overclocked tully (1.6ghz) and overclocked radeon 9500 just fine. Remember this is ONLY 230w and the 9500 guzzles power, but the thing is 100% stable! Sparkle does make good psus in fact i just put a sparkle 350w in a system i made for a freind, which consisted of 2 wd JB hard drives (raid 0) a radeon 9600, p4 2.6ghz @ 3.0, 2 optical drives, and 3 fans; again 100% stable from only a 350w rated psu.

    If it isn't a P6 then it isn't a procesor
    110% BX fanboy
  46. I asked here before how to start an ATS PSU with no motherboard and Crash told me that you need to short the green wire and any black one, might wanna add it, could be useful to others.

    I know what everyone's been wondering - 2^33634943-1 IS NOT PRIME. Now, wasn't that worth running <A HREF="http://www.mersenne.com" target="_new">Prime95</A> for a month to know?
  47. heh. some generics are quite good, some are quite bad. You got lucky :smile:

    Also ive seen systems that were very stable, but mysteriously the PSU would die within a year. Cauze? While the PSU was supplying stable voltages, it was doing so near its limit, and was essentially worn out very quickly.

    <b>My Computer is so powerful Sauron Desires
    it and mortal men covet it, My Precioussssssss!
    Mr no integrity coward.</b>
  48. powerman is fortron...so it's not luck

    If it isn't a P6 then it isn't a procesor
    110% BX fanboy
  49. Well, did you use one of the newer Sparkle PSU's, or is it older than 3 or so years? I speak for only the ones they packaged in some OEM branded towers, and a few ones sold off newegg. Still, hard to believe you manage a 1.6 tually and 9500 on a 230 powman. Have any piccies of voltage? Just for consistency, do you check with a multimeter directly off the lines?

    :cool: I run my AthlonXfx at 7.65 Exahertz :cool:
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