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U.S. Treasury Department runs out of money

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January 19, 2012 11:25:59 AM

Jeez.

January 19, 2012 10:12:04 PM

We need to park our aircraft carriers. Cut uneeded defence spending. Close European and far Asian bases. Properly fund our employees. Raise taxes progressively an additional 50%, by 100K, your tax bill should be 150% what it is now. THEN the hole won't get deeper ...
Related resources
January 20, 2012 9:40:06 AM

ctbaars said:
Raise taxes progressively an additional 50%, by 100K, your tax bill should be 150% what it is now. THEN the hole won't get deeper ...

That will not work. Give our government more money and they will just spend it.

My idea: Go through our Federal government, and with an eye on our Constitution, cut everything that has no basis in the Constitution. DoEd would go. DoE could be merged into Dept of Interior. EPA could be pruned back and merged with Interior also. BATFE was originally created as a tax agency. Cut it. NLRB has morphed into an anti-business organization. Cut it. Wouldn't save much because they only have about 2000 employees nationwide, but hey, every little bit helps.
January 20, 2012 10:43:22 AM

You will have to adopt some kind of austerity package or annexe some country and sell off its assets and enslave the people.

January 20, 2012 11:11:56 AM

Cutting the department of Education would cripple our future generations.

We should focus on making college cheaper so we are producing high quality workers and not just tollbooth attendants.
January 20, 2012 1:03:42 PM

Department of Educations mission.
1. Distribute funds. $69.9 billion in discretionary appropriations.
2. Collect Data. Promote Education.
3. Law Enforcement.
It helps the poor and disadvantaged. This is a good thing. It does not make "college cheaper" or "high quality workers".

@ jsc - US Constitution
We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.
Your idea is half shot down with these four words. "promote the general Welfare"

January 20, 2012 1:16:51 PM

ctbaars said:

@ jsc - US Constitution
We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.
Your idea is half shot down with these four words. "promote the general Welfare"


Whenever I see the first few paragraphs of teh constitution I cant help but sing it to the tune of schoolhouse rock.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=30OyU4O80i4

@ctbaars I know the limits of the DoE its just my personal oppinion that affordable quality secondary education is a priority. Did you know that India graduates more doctors every year than every college student graduating in the United States?
January 20, 2012 3:01:38 PM

ctbaars said:
Department of Educations mission.
1. Distribute funds. $69.9 billion in discretionary appropriations.
2. Collect Data. Promote Education.
3. Law Enforcement.
It helps the poor and disadvantaged. This is a good thing. It does not make "college cheaper" or "high quality workers".

@ jsc - US Constitution
We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.
Your idea is half shot down with these four words. "promote the general Welfare"



What do you think the word "promote" means in that context?

Here's was dictionary.com says:

pro·mote   /prəˈmoʊt/ Show Spelled[pruh-moht]
verb (used with object), -mot·ed, -mot·ing.

1. to help or encourage to exist or flourish; further: to promote world peace.
2. to advance in rank, dignity, position, etc. ( opposed to demote).
3. Education . to put ahead to the next higher stage or grade of a course or series of classes.
4. to aid in organizing (business undertakings).
5. to encourage the sales, acceptance, etc., of (a product), especially through advertising or other publicity.

Do you have a different definition of that word? I don't see how that phrase in the preamble justifies a federal dept. of education, energy, etc. State level, of course, just not at the federal level.
January 20, 2012 7:05:30 PM

1. to help or encourage to exist or flourish; further
It's crystal clear.
January 20, 2012 11:08:35 PM

You could put all of the unemployed people in one spot ... put a fence around it ... install feed troughs ... minimise spending in that way.

Maybe model it on Guantanamo Bay ... that seems to be working well for you.
January 21, 2012 12:23:17 AM

Start with a new OZ
Ship all our neer do wells there, create opportunity once again in the land down under
Close the prisons
January 21, 2012 12:48:54 AM

ctbaars said:
1. to help or encourage to exist or flourish; further
It's crystal clear.



I'm sorry, that phrase justifies taking half of what someone earns how?
January 21, 2012 2:33:15 AM

Take a look at the history of income taxes in the US OMG, we don't pay much in taxes these days. Until 1980 anyone making over 250k was paying 70% of their income in taxes to the US government, yet far fewer people were complaining about taxes on a weekly basis, funny how we can cut the tax rate in half over a couple decades then every half percentage point you want to add back threatens to start a new civil war....
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Income_tax_in_the_United_S...


There is only one thing we learn from history, we don't learn from history, and we don't remember it unless it works for us.
January 21, 2012 3:09:50 AM

From your link
Hauser's Law is a theory by one economist that postulates that in the United States, federal tax revenues will always be equal to approximately 19.5% of gross domestic product (GDP), regardless of what the top marginal tax rate is. From fiscal year 1946 to fiscal year 2007, federal tax receipts as a percentage of GDP averaged 17.9%, with a range of 14.4% to 20.9%.[34] During the years referred to by Hauser (FY 46 to FY 93), the actual average was 17.7%.

So, taxes paid have gone up since 93
January 21, 2012 3:12:26 AM

Since 47%? dont pay taxes, and others, as in people we know mostly, havnt had tax increases, then maybe the top end have?
January 21, 2012 5:27:59 AM

ctbaars said:
Department of Educations mission.
1. Distribute funds. $69.9 billion in discretionary appropriations.
2. Collect Data. Promote Education.
3. Law Enforcement.
It helps the poor and disadvantaged. This is a good thing. It does not make "college cheaper" or "high quality workers".

But education is not mentioned as one of the Federal responsibilities in the Constitution. Besides, what has it accomplished? Literacy rates have dropped in the 30 years of its existence. Kill it because it has been ineffective.

You know, I am constantly amazed that the US military dependent schools can, on the average, provide a better education at a lower cost per student than the civilian public schools. Can't be student quality. After all, we military, and former military, people are (liberal stereotype) too stupid to get a real job. And intelligence, like skin color, tends to be a heritable characteristic.

So what could the reason be? Enforced standards of conduct? Yes. The DoDDS (DoD Dependent Schools) are run by DoD and not DoEd? YES! :bounce: 

ctbaars said:

@ jsc - US Constitution
...
Your idea is half shot down with these four words. "promote the general Welfare"

The original meaning was not what we believe it is now:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Welfare_clause

Much like the "Commerce Clause", it has been warped to justify government intrusion (primarily taxes) into all kinds of areas.

January 21, 2012 6:59:51 AM

1. repeal NAFTA. It's not benefiting the US like it was envisioned.
2. institute tariffs on all imports. This will encourage buyers to buy local, companies to produce in the US, and manufacturing to hire employees.
3. stop giving away billions in foreign aid, unless in dire straits.
4. get proven businessmen in the government, that will trim the fat where it needs to be. No more of these political scandals that waste $$ on overpaying their friends.
5. stop exporting so much oil, when we are paying a premium for imported oil from the Arab nations.
January 21, 2012 11:47:06 AM

I guess, since things have gone so much better lately, our current enlightened thieves in Washington not only feel our forefathers who wrote the constitution didnt understand it right, but continuously turn away from its true meaning
In 1824 Chief Justice John Marshall described in obiter dictum a further limit on the General Welfare Clause in Gibbons v. Ogden: "Congress is authorized to lay and collect taxes, &c. to pay the debts and provide for the common defence and general welfare of the United States. ... Congress is not empowered to tax for those purposes which are within the exclusive province of the States."[8]

Since having local taxes for education was wrong, and our forefathers didnt do it right, things have gotten much better, and costs of schooling has dropped since our enlightened Washingtonians corrected this grievous error.
Now, keep multiplying this, as we wander away from our constitution, and watch as our enlightened Washingtonians gain consciousness of how it works for all, even them
January 21, 2012 8:14:09 PM

aford10 said:

2. institute tariffs on all imports. This will encourage buyers to buy local, companies to produce in the US, and manufacturing to hire employees.
3. stop giving away billions in foreign aid, unless in dire straits.
4. get proven businessmen in the government, that will trim the fat where it needs to be. No more of these political scandals that waste $$ on overpaying their friends.
5. stop exporting so much oil, when we are paying a premium for imported oil from the Arab nations.


2. May have the side effect of reducing exports to other countries. Other countries may increase tariffs towards the US in kind.
3. Most aid is tied aid, that is special terms and conditions are tied to the aid. Some include buying American good and services for other countries only.
January 22, 2012 4:19:44 AM

amdfangirl said:
2. May have the side effect of reducing exports to other countries. Other countries may increase tariffs towards the US in kind.
3. Most aid is tied aid, that is special terms and conditions are tied to the aid. Some include buying American good and services for other countries only.


2. Since the US doesn't produce much locally anymore, then other countries won't be able to increase tariffs on much. Additionally, the US is one of the biggest consumer bases in the world. Most of the sales would be local here in the US.

3. The US has given Pakistan billions in aid, and what has it done for us? All they do is take the money and hinder the anti terror efforts. Or what about Bangladesh? We've already given them almost $6 billion, and the US is going to give them another billion over the next 5 years. I don't see Bangladesh as being a big importer of anything from the US.
http://news.yahoo.com/u-offers-bangladesh-1-billion-aid...

Edit: Forgot the link
January 22, 2012 5:07:53 AM

Fair enough :) 
January 22, 2012 12:37:26 PM

JAYDEEJOHN said:
Start with a new OZ
Ship all our neer do wells there, create opportunity once again in the land down under
Close the prisons


That theory is sound ... it is how Australia got started.


giggle all you like but we are doing pretty fine thank you.

Unemployment 5%

Koala bears - check.

Beer - check.

Sun - check.

Fine women - check.

Wiggles - check (beta yellow rolled back to 1.0)

Minimal guns - check.

Peace - check.

Few Religious extremists - check.

What more do you want?


:) 
:) 
January 22, 2012 12:53:42 PM

Personally, Id like some of your better beer
January 22, 2012 7:50:32 PM

Better not mean Foster's :D 
January 22, 2012 8:00:45 PM

amdfangirl said:
Better not mean Foster's :D 


And Fosters definitely should not be drank after it has sit in the fridge for about 2 years. :heink: 
January 22, 2012 9:14:07 PM

Ive tried it once, never again
January 22, 2012 9:17:36 PM

Fosters is horrible.

We make our own at home.

I have a nice wheat beer we bottled last week ... extra malt and hops.

I run the water through a filter first.

Very cheap to make ... quality is high.

Bit cloudier than bought beer but I don't like to add the finings as it is more chemicals, and disturbs the wort during primary fementation ... increases likelihood of contamination.
January 22, 2012 9:31:12 PM

Had a GF that did that, and wine as well
Gee, I miss her

























beer
January 22, 2012 11:09:34 PM

aford10 said:
And Fosters definitely should not be drank after it has sit in the fridge for about 2 years. :heink: 


Fosters apparently should not be drunk at all.

Personally I love nothing better than the crisp taste of soda water.

They make glass bottles of soda water you know? It's mighty fun pretending in front of police that you are drunk and underage.

Then they breath test you and it comes out negative and they dismiss you for being a weirdo.
January 22, 2012 11:13:00 PM

Soda water??? Isn't that just carbonated water? Like the stuff that comes out of the soda fountains when the soda syrup has run out? That stuff is nasty.
January 22, 2012 11:41:05 PM

Mhmm :D 

I love that stuff.

There was a topic at some point you know, I forget what.
January 23, 2012 2:20:27 AM

@ aford

what makes you say the United States doesn't produce anything anymore. The US industrial base is still larger than China's with all its might. Now, in 20 years will that be the reality? Up in the air, but i'm leaning towards probably not.

January 23, 2012 2:57:04 AM

Oldmangamer_73 said:
@ aford

what makes you say the United States doesn't produce anything anymore. The US industrial base is still larger than China's with all its might. Now, in 20 years will that be the reality? Up in the air, but i'm leaning towards probably not.


Look at the tags on your shoes, shirts, phones, TVs, etc....rarely do you see made in USA. The US's largest export is oil, and we pale in comparison to the Arab nation's oil exports. Everywhere you look, factories are being shut down.
January 23, 2012 11:35:14 AM

aford10 said:
Look at the tags on your shoes, shirts, phones, TVs, etc....rarely do you see made in USA. The US's largest export is oil, and we pale in comparison to the Arab nation's oil exports. Everywhere you look, factories are being shut down.



I'm not sure about oil being our greatest export, just not sure about that. It all may be true, but the USA's industrial base is still larger than China's. How long that will continue to be true is up for debate.
January 23, 2012 12:17:23 PM

aford10 said:
Look at the tags on your shoes, shirts, phones, TVs, etc....rarely do you see made in USA. The US's largest export is oil, and we pale in comparison to the Arab nation's oil exports. Everywhere you look, factories are being shut down.


I thought that it was mostly scrap metal and agricultural products such as wheat or corn ect. Then again the last thing that this failed nation has exported to Iran was bull seamen and a multimillion dollar drone that wasn't as stealthy as imagined.
January 23, 2012 12:36:54 PM

Oldmangamer_73 said:
I'm not sure about oil being our greatest export, just not sure about that. It all may be true, but the USA's industrial base is still larger than China's. How long that will continue to be true is up for debate.


Only in grain production are we still a world leader, the only real industrial production left is mostly the auto industry and the military industrial complex. Many of our factories are either shut down permanently like Bethlehem steel or outsourced to countries like India.
Can't forget what happened to Detroit and towns surrounding that area. The unemployment numbers are cooked more than a over done than thanksgiving ham. Last but not least pretty much everyone is broke in one way or another and there is no end in sight.

This nation isn't going to turn around when "the people" elect the people of the like of eight years of Bush and four thus far of Obama but then again rumors are starting to go around that Obama in a staged election will be here for a second term.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AsQOJ2TDhyI
January 23, 2012 12:47:19 PM

nforce4max said:
Only in grain production are we still a world leader, the only real industrial production left is mostly the auto industry and the military industrial complex. Many of our factories are either shut down permanently like Bethlehem steel or outsourced to countries like India.
Can't forget what happened to Detroit and towns surrounding that area. The unemployment numbers are cooked more than a over done than thanksgiving ham. Last but not least pretty much everyone is broke in one way or another and there is no end in sight.

This nation isn't going to turn around when "the people" elect the people of the like of eight years of Bush and four thus far of Obama but then again rumors are starting to go around that Obama in a staged election will be here for a second term.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AsQOJ2TDhyI



http://www.lukonewsreview.com/2011/10/american-manufact...
January 23, 2012 3:21:15 PM

Oldmangamer_73 said:
I'm not sure about oil being our greatest export, just not sure about that. It all may be true, but the USA's industrial base is still larger than China's. How long that will continue to be true is up for debate.


Well, it's true.
http://www.usatoday.com/money/industries/energy/story/2...

And it looks like the US is the 3rd largest exporter.
http://www.indexmundi.com/g/r.aspx?t=10&v=85

And the US is ranked 98th in industrial growth, right behind Mauritius. [:aford10]
http://www.indexmundi.com/g/r.aspx?t=0&v=78&l=en
January 25, 2012 9:43:17 PM

amdfangirl said:
There was a topic at some point you know, I forget what.

Found it! :D 

aford10 said:
1. repeal NAFTA. It's not benefiting the US like it was envisioned.
2. institute tariffs on all imports. This will encourage buyers to buy local, companies to produce in the US, and manufacturing to hire employees.
3. stop giving away billions in foreign aid, unless in dire straits.
4. get proven businessmen in the government, that will trim the fat where it needs to be. No more of these political scandals that waste $$ on overpaying their friends.
5. stop exporting so much oil, when we are paying a premium for imported oil from the Arab nations.

Wow, agreed across the board! Good post.

amdfangirl said:
2. May have the side effect of reducing exports to other countries. Other countries may increase tariffs towards the US in kind.
3. Most aid is tied aid, that is special terms and conditions are tied to the aid. Some include buying American good and services for other countries only.


2. Which in turn would bring manufacturing costs on par with costs here rather than using cheap labor abroad, which in turn would bring manufacturing jobs back to the US.
3. Except Israel which gets billions every year because of the underlying evangelical Christian thread throughout our government, which is readily seen in any election as candidates fight over how religious they are over their opponents.

aford10 said:
2. Since the US doesn't produce much locally anymore, then other countries won't be able to increase tariffs on much. Additionally, the US is one of the biggest consumer bases in the world. Most of the sales would be local here in the US.

3. The US has given Pakistan billions in aid, and what has it done for us? All they do is take the money and hinder the anti terror efforts. Or what about Bangladesh? We've already given them almost $6 billion, and the US is going to give them another billion over the next 5 years. I don't see Bangladesh as being a big importer of anything from the US.
http://news.yahoo.com/u-offers-bangladesh-1-billion-aid...

Edit: Forgot the link

^^^^^ Further reasoning.


@OMG

Also working in international shipping, one of the biggest exports we have here at the ports is good ol' California (polluted) air. For clarity, I'm talking about shipping empty containers back to the orient (I work for a Japanese subsidiary).
January 25, 2012 9:53:02 PM

I guess my views only apply to Australia.

We are a special nation.
January 25, 2012 10:52:48 PM

amdfangirl said:
I guess my views only apply to Australia.

We are a special nation.

A special nation for special people! :kaola: 
January 26, 2012 7:12:28 AM

I can see your in the US and hooked through Charter's IP band.

;P
January 26, 2012 9:22:07 PM

Reynod said:
I can see your in the US and hooked through Charter's IP band.

;P


This is true, but also XO Communications and ATT depending on where I'm posting. :) 
!