FRANCE CHINA SYRIA - THE SECRET IS OUT OF THE BAG

can be got <A HREF="http://www.afacerionline.com/index.php/ShowRoom/showDetails/1496" target="_new"> here </A>

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The point here, Svol, is that the main dissenters to UN action in Iraq might be revealed to have connections to Iraq's attempts at creating WMD. Now, in France, companies are privately held, so if there are Iraqi sympathizers in France, they would be willing and able to launder arms and whatnot to Syria, where it is then imported to Iraq. China, on the other hand, is completely state run, so any "activities" such as these should be known to the government.

I read this article originally in the NY Times Op/Ed section. It's quite plausible. And even if said materials were not going to Iraq, they are still in violation of UN sanctions regarding the sale and export of these two rocket fuels, as prior consent was not given.

Israel has a nuclear weapons program, we gave it to them with the blessing of the UN. It is a remanent of the Cold War, but Israel still gets enough money from the US and other sources to keep it going. Put it this way, we know it exists, always have known it exists, and Israel proudly tells the world it is armed with nuclear weapons. Nevermind that originally (1947), it was only s'posed to be the 5 permenant members of the Security Council that were allowed to produce and stockpile nuclear weapons. Israel has nuclear weapons. Period.

Let's not muddy the waters too much here, as France, China, and Syria voted in favor of sending inspectors back to Iraq to destroy all weapons that are in violation of international treaties, UN resolutions, and UN sanctions. As such, such activites by those counties that may help further Saddam's ambitions at creating said weapons would be in violation of their own previously stated positions. The current problem in Iraq and N. Korea. Iraq (stupidly as it looks) is being dealt with.

By the way, war, if it starts without UN sanction, will probably start tomorrow. May God have mercy on all of our souls.

-SammyBoy

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Some day, THG-willing, I shall obtain the coveted "Old Hand" title.

Though, that implies that the neighbors have the military to do anything. Last I checked, though, Syria has almost no military, and what it does have is equipped with old Cold War-era toys, while Israel is blessed with many new US and European made toys. Jordan and Egypt both profit handsomely from the peace treaties they signed with Israel, both in diplomatic and economic (Egypt gets about $2 billion a year for the peace treaty with Israel) terms. Lebanon is even less equipped than Syria. True, you have Iraq, but the only move Saddam can really make without causing the whole Mideast to descend on him, is to give money to the families of suicide bombers. Saudi Arabia, many times in the past decade, has made offers at the Arab Summit to recognize Israel's statehood as well as protection (economically and diplomatically) if they cede the West Bank to Palestine. So really, Israel has no powerful enemies in the Mideast, and there is as much cohesiveness among the various nations as there was in Europe during the 20th century. So, even without the nukes, Israel would be fine. They have among the best Air Forces in the world, and highly (American) trained Army and Special Forces.

-SammyBoy

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Some day, THG-willing, I shall obtain the coveted "Old Hand" title.

Speaking as a chemist... waht is that HTB...stuff.

<b>Paying for Sex didn’t mean you couldn’t get it any other way – it meant that you could afford the convenience option, same as any other service.</b>

While the first is true, Israel has some pretty damn good pilots. Americans haven't trained Israelies in a long time. It's more the other way around. The only time we train Israelies is when we have some new toy for them to play with.

Beauty is in the eye of the beer holder.

There are people that sell stuff to terrorists in every Western country... including America. I bert we have them in Holland too. Most of the time the government doesn't even know it or is observing them to get more information about the terrorist groups.
As for China being totally government controlled... I don't think so. They have a combination between kapitalism and plan economy. Now plan economy doesn't mean that the state directly controlls every single factory. They just tell the factories what to produce, when and for how many... atleast that is how it should work.

Israel is also one of the few countries that didn't sign the agreement to stop increasing nuclear forces and even decrease them... not a very nice thing of them. Especially if you considder the fact that Charon is mad enough to trow a nuke at his neighbour countries.

I just find is so strange that American media/government tries to do everything to make the countries that don't agree with war look bad.

My dual-PSU PC is so powerfull that the neighbourhood dims when I turn it on

give me some evidence. put up or shut up

In battle Israel uses F-16's and big ass tanks, Palestine uses small children strapped to bombs. Which do you support?

Evidence about what? That Israel didn't sign that agreement... it was in the opinion-paper in an interview with the former UN secretary-general.

My dual-PSU PC is so powerfull that the neighbourhood dims when I turn it on

If the US and UK had made a resolution for more diplomatic actions without an ultimatum they would have voted for it... they just vote against everything America can later use as a reason to start war.

What is it with you hating every country that doesn't agree with the UK/US?

My dual-PSU PC is so powerfull that the neighbourhood dims when I turn it on

what? isreal? aggreement? what the [-peep-] are you talking about? evidence about this:

"It wouldn't suprise me if America or Brittain companies also sell weapons to dictators and terrorists... but we never hear about that."

you know, the thing I asked you for evidence on...


I love how you jump everywhere, if your arguement is not working you switch it over to something else.

In battle Israel uses F-16's and big ass tanks, Palestine uses small children strapped to bombs. Which do you support?

As I said that is only an assumption made by logic... better read next time.

My dual-PSU PC is so powerfull that the neighbourhood dims when I turn it on

America does realize that they need the rest of teh world. Go ahead and boycott the USA. See how well it works without us.

<A HREF="http://forums.btvillarin.com/index.php?act=ST&f=41&t=324&s=58e94ba84a16bedfebbf0f416d5bac48" target="_new">I reckon all women should learn how to do an engine re-build so they can get the right to vote.</A>

12 years svol! 12 years! 17 resolutions!

Iraq did not disarm. Iraq did not comply.

<font color=red>GOD</font color=red> <font color=blue>BLESS</font color=blue> <font color=red>AMERICA</font color=red>

Svol, Hitler even said once that if France had stepped in and used force, that his whole movement would have been crushed and never gotten anywhere.

In this day and age of massive weapons and terroist networks, we can no longer appease dictators who's only wish is to rule with an iron fist. We can no longer coddle to the anti-western ideals crowd. The people you say we have no right in moving on are murderers with no concience, no higher athourity that holds human life as the pinnacle. Stop listening to your media, your teachers. Look up facts. In the 90's Bill Clinton went after Slobodan Milosevic, for many of the same reasons. There was no UN approval, there was no crys in the streets by well organised marchers. Not a peep. Same when he said he wanted to go after Saddam Hussien himself. No problem from "the world community". Why? Because the world could see that he was one of their own, a socialist that heald the same ideas of much of the leaders in Europe. Go look up history, go look up facts. Look up who is planning the peace rallys, who is calling for appeasement. Look for groups like The world Workers Party, and ones like The Young Socialist Party. See what your point of view has brought and will continue to bring to the world.

2 hours ago, the curtain fell and many of my country's bravest went forth into battle, to defend someone they dont know, and to free a people who might not even speek their language. They have a goal, to free an oppressed state. To protect the world (yes, and that means you too Svol) aginst madmen like Saddam. They have the help of 30 countries to achieve their stated goal.

I try not to post in the others section on polotics. I know, that no matter how much people like myself try, we cant get others to see the world for what it is. We cant get them to realise what they try has been tried before, and it failed horribly. I was once a very liberal guy. Then I had to face the real world, one of good and evil. Someone once told me that a conservative is a liberal who was mugged. I hope you dont have to learn the hard way some day.

<font color=red>*</font color=red><font color=white>*</font color=white><font color=blue>*</font color=blue>
... And I'm proud to be an American, where at least I know I'm free, and I won't forget the men who died, who gave that right to me.

As for not complying being a valid reason to attack a country... when does America start attacking Israel? They didn't comply to several UN resolutions in more then 12 year.

America seems to have a strange double moral... as more countries have BTW.

My dual-PSU PC is so powerfull that the neighbourhood dims when I turn it on

Why? The country doesn't exist yet and I don't know about the Palestinians (<b>as a government</b> ) breaking any UN resolution.

My dual-PSU PC is so powerfull that the neighbourhood dims when I turn it on

"Though, that implies that the neighbors have the military to do anything. Last I checked, though, Syria has almost no military, and what it does have is equipped with old Cold War-era toys, while Israel is blessed with many new US and European made toys. Jordan and Egypt both profit handsomely from the peace treaties they signed with Israel, both in diplomatic and economic (Egypt gets about $2 billion a year for the peace treaty with Israel) terms. Lebanon is even less equipped than Syria."

Syria has a standing army of around 500,000
It has double the quantity of tanks that Israel has. Of course, it's T-72's and T-80's don't hold a candle to Israel's Merkavas, but stil, Syria has a HUGE standing army.

As for Navy, Syria has more and larger surface warships than Israel has. Israel relies on their ships being more maneuverable and generally faster. They are mostly light attack boats.. smaller than a Frigate in the US navy.

In Air power, Syria really is in poor shape. It has 60-100 latest model MiGs and Sukhoi planes, however. Where Syra is pinning their hopes is on missiles to damage Israel's air base runways, limiting Israel's ability to use it's strike aircraft. Israel, in turn has their new anti missile missile that is supposed to be quite effective and accurate.

Egypt gets similar military aid to Israel's military loans and grants. Egypt has similar modern aircraft that Israel has. The main difference being that Israeli planes use Israeli designed and developed avionics, while the Egyptian planes get the dumbed down avionics kits the US sends to foreign countries in the F16 and F15's.

Jordan has a relatively small military, mostly subsidized by the US. Israel's military budget, including aid from teh US is around 10-12 billion US$ Teir standing armyu is around 100-150,000, which, with their reserve system can grow to 500,000 in a matter of hours with a full call up.

Mark-

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