Upgraded HSF but no improvement

[Guest]

OK This is weird.

I went and bought a Thermoengine and installed that over my previous stock AMD heatsink/fan combo and I have the same results..what gives?

I have a 1.33 (266fsb)Axion and with seti running at full load I am hitting 60C. The same thing I got with the stock cooler.

Now I have the thermoengine and I put a bigger fan on it. The YS tech fan. I believe its the same one that comes on the fop32. I used artic silver2, I even started using the TIM that came with it..same thing. I am also using a non-conductive shim.

I have now mounted this thing 2 times and get the same results as the stock Heatsink. Room temp is about 80F so yes its warm but I expected my new heatsink to do MUCH better than the stock one.

Any suggestions? Try to remount? Ditch the shim? It even runs this hot with the case open. It seems to make no difference.
For case fans I have this going in. 2 40mm in a 5 1/4 bay , 2 80s below. Out I have a slot fan, powersupply fan, and a 3.5 drive bay system cooler.

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[peteb]

I think you are low on your exhaust fans - you should get at least 1 80mm exhaust preferably near the cpu. What are your system temps? If your room is 80F (27C or so) your system/mobo should really stay below 86F (30C).

Does the shim do anything for athermoengine? From the pics I thought the base of the thermoengine was angled up anyway so it would not make contact with a shim unless you _really_ tilted it... Shims don't cool cpus.

I'd have thought a thermoengine properly installed should keep a loaded 1.33 within 20 degrees C (at least) of your system temperature, so unless your mobo temps are 40 or higher, there is a problem with your installation or the thermoengine....

I take it your voltage is 1.75 and the cpu is stock? Also, how are you measuring temps? MBM tends to be much more accurate than Asus Probe if you are using the latter.

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[Crashman]

I hear that the Thermoengine has been cheapened up and is now considered a poor performer. Just a thought. I think maybe rcf84 posted a link.

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[Guest]

Well I am using MBM to measure temps. Unfortunately I don't know what my system temps are. My MB (aopen mk7a) didn't come with a temp sensor for that. I guess I could buy one though.

I got the shim mainly so I would have less of a chance of breaking anything but perhaps it is insulating the cpu a little or not allowing the thermoengine to make as good of a contact as it can. Not sure. I wasn't an expert at moving/removing heatsinks so I was trying to be carefull. Think I should take it off and try?

I did try reseating the heatsink and followed the arctic silver guidlines to the tee but nope nothing.

I am pretty sure you are right about needing another exaust fan. I am going to have to cut the case or get a new PS (with 2 fans) to have one though. Would it make a difference though if I have the case open? I thought about seeing what temps I get if I take the MB out of the case.

Oh and CPU is stock but my voltage is set to 1.79v and I can't change it. Unfortunatly my MB has no adjustments for overclocking.

I know the thermoengine was "cheapened" but it wasn't mutch from what I read. Only like a .5C difference from the original. Still I would think I should expect to see 50C or below, especially with the bigger fan that I put on it. These guys did several reviews on it. http://www.hardocp.com/ and they tested the origional and current thermoengine. When they tested it in their roundup they got the thermoengine 1.33@1.4 with a delta to run at around 49C under load.

I am getting like 60C under load at 1.33@1.33 with a YS fan. I think I would be happy if I would be seeing 55C..maybe.

Things I might try.
Lap bottom of HS and try again.
Ditch Shim.
Scream.

Any other suggestions are appreciated

"Sorry Sir we can't replace your Toshiba cup holder....Toshiba does not make cup holders."

 

[lamer_gamer]

I've got to ask this question because I've been interested in improving my case circulation. The only intake fan I have is on the front bottom of my case. In your post, you refered to a 5 1/4 bay fan and a 3.5 drive bay system cooler. Does that mean you're cooling your floppy drives, or that your using the bays as a place to put fans? I'm just wondering, because I'd really like to put an intake fan in a place higher in my case that would blow more directly across the mobo and especially my cpu.

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[Guest]

Yea I am using a HD bay cooler ( it has 2 40mm fans) in my 5 1/4 bay to suck in air. I can actually flip the fans to blow out too if I want. No HD in that bay I am just using it for fans.

The 3.5 bay fan thing I actually have two different ones. I have been tinkering. I bought a couple st-900 coolermaster 3.5 bay system coolers. They are basically a big exaust fan that fits in the 3.5 bay. It looks just like one of those slot coolers but fits in the 3.5 bays. I also modified one of those st-900 to fit an antec pc circulator(its a slot fan) to fit in a 3.5 bay. I can set that to intake or exaust. The benefit of that one is it has adjustable fans. Just trying to get a little more air in the case and I wasn't using the other bays anyway.

I actually have an extra 3.5 bay fan I was going to sell on ebay or something if you are interested. Its an exaust only though so I don't know if thats what you are looking for. I could also show you how to mod the cooler to fit the antec thing as well. I don't know of any other 3.5 bay coolers that will direcly put air on the cpu etc.

I have a microatx case so I am having to be a little creative.

"Sorry Sir we can't replace your Toshiba cup holder....Toshiba does not make cup holders."

 

[peteb]

I would not rely on using the PS to exhaust air, the PS usually only draws enough air to cool itself, it s not intended to cool the whole case!

It sounds like you should really consider getting that extra exhaust fan cut it. You could test this by opening the case. When you do, all the cooling will go to heck, so try blowing a regular house cooling fan into the side to provide a good circulation of fresh air.

Even the dumbed down thermoengines were only a few degrees off I think. The reviews I saw stated lapping and even ASII didn't help much over stock and the TIM seemd pretty good on them.

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[Guest]

Yea I think I may have to cut..bummer. I have room for a 60 in the back. I was also thinking I would replace the YS fan with the dreaded delta. Sucks paying an extra 10 spot for the YS fan and it isn't doing it. I got the YS in hopes that it would perform in between the stock fan and the delta. So far though and it looks like it is either delta or nothing.

I know most reviews said that lapping didn't much but gotta at least try I suppose before I spring for a bigger fan.
TIM is already used. But it performed the same as ASII.
Too bad the swiftys weigh a metric ton. I would be worried that in travel it might break the core.

"Sorry Sir we can't replace your Toshiba cup holder....Toshiba does not make cup holders."

 

[peteb]

does your aopen board have the mounting holes for the 462 swifty - they do NOT fall off!!! They are also very good coolers, if expensive.

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[kanute]

Just out of curiousity, have you ever tried the hsf without the shim? Maybe the shim is crappy and preventing good contact between the heatsink and the core. I'd try without and see if there is any improvement.

That oughta void your warrenty!

 

[Guest]

Yes my MB does have the mounting holes for the swifty. I am just afraid that if I am moving this thing a lot. (car rides, plane trips) That the vibration of something that heavy might break the core? Is this possible at all? Doesn't the swifty have some problems mounting on certain MB? Mine isn't in the list of don'ts but its not on of list of do's either.


Oh and I lapped it..and remounted without the shim and..nope. I dropped about 1C with case open(59C). I did for grins put a big 12" x 12" box fan over the opening of the case to see what temps I would get. Figure airflow isn't going to get any better than that. That dropped my temp down to 55C. So with the current HSF setup I have I figure the best I can hope for is 55C at load and 51C idle.
I just don't see me hooking a box fan up to the side of my computer.

So my options are now to
A) Buy a Delta black to put on the HS
B) Buy a new HS
I think...
Plus put a blow hole in the case.

"Sorry Sir we can't replace your Toshiba cup holder....Toshiba does not make cup holders."

 

[peteb]

swiftech did some gimmiky stuff with the 462, dropped a case out of a window and the cpu was undamaged with the 462 installed - everything else was pretty much screwed of course, but you follow their logic - it is pretty solid and stable.

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[Guest]

I have a AXIA 1.33 ghz Atlon, and when I first Got it going at 1.33Ghz it was generating a Temp of 57Deg Centigrade (measured with ASUS prope) using a Globalwin FOP32-1 and Arctic Silver 2. I have since then Modified a few things, and managed to get the temp down to 49Deg running at 1.33Ghz or 51 deg at 1.56Ghz full load.

The first thing I did (after reading all the posts) was to lap the Heat Sink and use Artic Silver 2, this managed to lower the temp by about 1 deg.

With the case open I noticed that the heat that was being generated by the CPU was circulating back through the HSF as the distance between where the heatsink and the fan intake is only about 4cm.
To experiment with this I made a tube out of some A4 paper, and held it in front of the fan (so that the hot air was'nt circulating back through the fan) within 1 min the temp droped 2 Deg.

By adding an arrangement of a 8cm fan and a 8cm plastic pipe to a frame over the top of the existing HSF, effectively drawing fresh cool air from the outside of the case and the 8cm fan in series with the HSF I got the CPU temp down to 49 deg.

The rpm of the HSF actually icreased from 4200 to 4800 rpm indicating that not only is the air cooler but also that more air is getting pushed over the heatsink.

Hope this help.

 

[Guest]

Since I am going to cut a blowhole in the back of the case I had actually thought of using that blowhole to run a pipe directly to the cpu fan and just suck more outside air in from the new hole. Its an idea anyway. A friend of mine did that with his case using one of those 1 liter coke bottles cut to fit.

Delta fan is on its way though. If this doesn't work I am going to need a major yard sale of cooling products.

"Sorry Sir we can't replace your Toshiba cup holder....Toshiba does not make cup holders."

 

[Guest]

Well major improvement here. I cut the exaust into the back of the case and stuck in a 60x10 fan in there. That little fan can push some air. My CPU now runs 1-2 C lower with the case closed up. Ok its still 53C/58C but its improving. I did get that by putting the YS fan on my stock heatsink..what the heck right. It was running 55/59 with case open.
Tonite I will put the Thermoengine back on and see what I get with the YS fan.
I should get the Delta in the mail today. So I'll give that a go.

I tell you though they made my case out of some serious aluminium. Inwin must make beefy cases. Took a while to cut the hole with my dremel and carbide cutting bits. The sparks were kind of fun. But it looks like it always was there after I put the chrome grill on.

Thanks for the suggestions anyway. Case cooling is definetly key.

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[phsstpok]

Here is a comparison of the versions of Thermoengine.

<A HREF="http://www.frostytech.com/articleview.cfm?ArticleID=674" target="_new">http://www.frostytech.com/articleview.cfm?ArticleID=674</A>

Equiped with the stock fans (which are also different) the new, solid-core ThermoEngine is inferior.

However, notice that upgraded with a 7K Delta fan the two ThermoEngines perform almost identically.

 

[Bud]

LOL...Aluminum?? Your case is probably .06THK CRS sheet. That's why it's so hard to cut.

I'm not in touch with my feeings, and I like it that way!

 

[Crashman]

Inwin doesn't make aluminum cases, they make heavy duty stell cases. Stick a magnet to it and see for yourself!

Cast not thine pearls before the swine

 

[Guest]

I believe you are correct. Yikes no wonder it was hard to cut. Oh well that helps to explain why the case is super strong. Just wasn't thinking. I know you can make some pretty hard aluminium but thats with heat treating etc.. I am sure Steel is much cheaper than that.

Final temps.. are with the delta 49/53 case closed 47/51 open case. I guess with the delta it sucks enough air to make a difference. I could improve my airflow by cutting more holes..but geez I think I can live with 53. On a warm day it gets up to 56 after about 6 hours of full load. But overheat problems are gone now.

Interesting thing though was I put the delta on the stock heatsink and I actually had results of 1-2C of the Thermoengine. A little surpising but I guess if you push enough air through almost anything you can get ok cooling.

The delta does whine though...Last Lan I went to I got some comments like .."what the heck you got in that thing"

Its not super loud but you know its on.


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[FatBurger]

Yeah, I don't have a problem since a good friend of mine at the LANs has the same thing on his (with an FOP32/FOP38, he can't remember which).

But it is a bit loud. You just have to crank the speakers a bit more.

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