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Signal inside an apartment????

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Anonymous
February 27, 2005 10:16:19 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

I have a question about 3 phones. I have 2 friends....one has an
audiovox 8900, the other an audiovox 9900, and me a lg vx7000.

My phone works great everywhere but at home. Inside my apartment I can
rarely receive or place a call....Oddly enough, my 2 friends with the
audiovox phones get as clear a signal and can carry on a conversation
with no problem in my apartment. We did some comparing....

On a 3 min timed call, while moving around my apartment from room to
room in 10 call attempts they both had a 100% success rate with their
vox phones and mine was 10%. Based on 10 attempted 3 min calls....I
had 1 not drop in the 10 tries. I should mention that I have a friend
with a motorola v400 on cingular who went 0% when he tried the same
test. Why is my 7000 and the motorola having such a hard time getting
signal in the apartment? I think my software is up to date and I do
*228 monthly but no use.


J.H.
Anonymous
February 28, 2005 6:36:14 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

Jeff Hodges wrote:
> I have a question about 3 phones. I have 2 friends....one has an
> audiovox 8900, the other an audiovox 9900, and me a lg vx7000.
>
> My phone works great everywhere but at home. Inside my apartment I can
> rarely receive or place a call....Oddly enough, my 2 friends with the
> audiovox phones get as clear a signal and can carry on a conversation
> with no problem in my apartment. We did some comparing....
>
> On a 3 min timed call, while moving around my apartment from room to
> room in 10 call attempts they both had a 100% success rate with their
> vox phones and mine was 10%. Based on 10 attempted 3 min calls....I
> had 1 not drop in the 10 tries. I should mention that I have a friend
> with a motorola v400 on cingular who went 0% when he tried the same
> test. Why is my 7000 and the motorola having such a hard time getting
> signal in the apartment? I think my software is up to date and I do
> *228 monthly but no use.
>
>
> J.H.

Both those audiovox phones can do analog (they are tri mode), while your's
is digital only.
Chances are your apartment has one of the deadly things to digital (stuff
like metal screen for plaster, aluminized/reflector covering on insulation,
metal siding, etc).

If that is the reason (have them set their phones to digital only and try
again), there are solutions (not exactly cheap though), one such is at
http://www.cellantenna.com/repeater/building_repeater.h...
February 28, 2005 6:36:15 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

Did you notice the cheapest antenna on that site is $500? Heck, he may as
well get a landline installed with a package for unlimited and that would be
cheaper for the whole year then spending it on one antenna only while he's
home. Doesn't make sense to me.

My suggestion is to get an external vehicle antenna and mount it some where
outside your window, porch, or where ever you can mount it. That would give
you the signal you need without spending a small fortune.


"Peter Pan" <Marcs1102NOSPAM@HotmailNOSPAM.com> wrote in message
news:o kwUd.7537$873.106@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> Jeff Hodges wrote:
> > I have a question about 3 phones. I have 2 friends....one has an
> > audiovox 8900, the other an audiovox 9900, and me a lg vx7000.
> >
> > My phone works great everywhere but at home. Inside my apartment I can
> > rarely receive or place a call....Oddly enough, my 2 friends with the
> > audiovox phones get as clear a signal and can carry on a conversation
> > with no problem in my apartment. We did some comparing....
> >
> > On a 3 min timed call, while moving around my apartment from room to
> > room in 10 call attempts they both had a 100% success rate with their
> > vox phones and mine was 10%. Based on 10 attempted 3 min calls....I
> > had 1 not drop in the 10 tries. I should mention that I have a friend
> > with a motorola v400 on cingular who went 0% when he tried the same
> > test. Why is my 7000 and the motorola having such a hard time getting
> > signal in the apartment? I think my software is up to date and I do
> > *228 monthly but no use.
> >
> >
> > J.H.
>
> Both those audiovox phones can do analog (they are tri mode), while your's
> is digital only.
> Chances are your apartment has one of the deadly things to digital (stuff
> like metal screen for plaster, aluminized/reflector covering on
insulation,
> metal siding, etc).
>
> If that is the reason (have them set their phones to digital only and try
> again), there are solutions (not exactly cheap though), one such is at
> http://www.cellantenna.com/repeater/building_repeater.h...
>
>
Related resources
Anonymous
February 28, 2005 12:06:42 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 19:16:19 -0600, Jeff Hodges <> wrote:

>I have a question about 3 phones. I have 2 friends....one has an
>audiovox 8900, the other an audiovox 9900, and me a lg vx7000.
>
>My phone works great everywhere but at home. Inside my apartment I can
>rarely receive or place a call....Oddly enough, my 2 friends with the
>audiovox phones get as clear a signal and can carry on a conversation
>with no problem in my apartment. We did some comparing....
>
>On a 3 min timed call, while moving around my apartment from room to
>room in 10 call attempts they both had a 100% success rate with their
>vox phones and mine was 10%. Based on 10 attempted 3 min calls....I
>had 1 not drop in the 10 tries. I should mention that I have a friend
>with a motorola v400 on cingular who went 0% when he tried the same
>test. Why is my 7000 and the motorola having such a hard time getting
>signal in the apartment? I think my software is up to date and I do
>*228 monthly but no use.
>
>
>J.H.

Could have something to do with the antenna on the phones. Audiovox
phones have extendable antennas while the 7000 does not. CDMA
reception is dependent on antenna length.
Anonymous
February 28, 2005 12:06:43 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

Just a slight correction....

Antenna length is a function of FREQUENCY.
If a signal is 800MHz (which analog is), it wouldn't matter if it is
analog or digital, CDMA, GSM, iDEN or whatever....

Your assertion that CDMA needs "antenna length" with the implication
that analog or another digital technology doesn't, is false.

Hypothetical situation: a signal is being broadcast from the same antenna
in 800 MHz analog, CDMA, GSM and iDEN. Same wattage, ERP, etc.

Optimal antenna length would maximize ALL of the above signals equally.
The particular modulation scheme is not effected by the length of the
antenna.


"TeddeLI" <nospam@nospam.net> wrote in message
news:579621d3s08aqg008etgih6ikc4p9cj1oe@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 19:16:19 -0600, Jeff Hodges <> wrote:
>
>>I have a question about 3 phones. I have 2 friends....one has an
>>audiovox 8900, the other an audiovox 9900, and me a lg vx7000.
>>
>>My phone works great everywhere but at home. Inside my apartment I can
>>rarely receive or place a call....Oddly enough, my 2 friends with the
>>audiovox phones get as clear a signal and can carry on a conversation
>>with no problem in my apartment. We did some comparing....
>>
>>On a 3 min timed call, while moving around my apartment from room to
>>room in 10 call attempts they both had a 100% success rate with their
>>vox phones and mine was 10%. Based on 10 attempted 3 min calls....I
>>had 1 not drop in the 10 tries. I should mention that I have a friend
>>with a motorola v400 on cingular who went 0% when he tried the same
>>test. Why is my 7000 and the motorola having such a hard time getting
>>signal in the apartment? I think my software is up to date and I do
>>*228 monthly but no use.
>>
>>
>>J.H.
>
> Could have something to do with the antenna on the phones. Audiovox
> phones have extendable antennas while the 7000 does not. CDMA
> reception is dependent on antenna length.
Anonymous
February 28, 2005 2:55:18 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 08:47:25 -0800, "Richard Ness"
<richard.no@gamn.spam.nessnet.com> wrote:

>Just a slight correction....
>
>Antenna length is a function of FREQUENCY.
>If a signal is 800MHz (which analog is), it wouldn't matter if it is
>analog or digital, CDMA, GSM, iDEN or whatever....
>
>Your assertion that CDMA needs "antenna length" with the implication
>that analog or another digital technology doesn't, is false.
>
>Hypothetical situation: a signal is being broadcast from the same antenna
>in 800 MHz analog, CDMA, GSM and iDEN. Same wattage, ERP, etc.
>
>Optimal antenna length would maximize ALL of the above signals equally.
>The particular modulation scheme is not effected by the length of the
>antenna.
>
>
>"TeddeLI" <nospam@nospam.net> wrote in message
>news:579621d3s08aqg008etgih6ikc4p9cj1oe@4ax.com...
>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 19:16:19 -0600, Jeff Hodges <> wrote:
>>
>>>I have a question about 3 phones. I have 2 friends....one has an
>>>audiovox 8900, the other an audiovox 9900, and me a lg vx7000.
>>>
>>>My phone works great everywhere but at home. Inside my apartment I can
>>>rarely receive or place a call....Oddly enough, my 2 friends with the
>>>audiovox phones get as clear a signal and can carry on a conversation
>>>with no problem in my apartment. We did some comparing....
>>>
>>>On a 3 min timed call, while moving around my apartment from room to
>>>room in 10 call attempts they both had a 100% success rate with their
>>>vox phones and mine was 10%. Based on 10 attempted 3 min calls....I
>>>had 1 not drop in the 10 tries. I should mention that I have a friend
>>>with a motorola v400 on cingular who went 0% when he tried the same
>>>test. Why is my 7000 and the motorola having such a hard time getting
>>>signal in the apartment? I think my software is up to date and I do
>>>*228 monthly but no use.
>>>
>>>
>>>J.H.
>>
>> Could have something to do with the antenna on the phones. Audiovox
>> phones have extendable antennas while the 7000 does not. CDMA
>> reception is dependent on antenna length.
>

While all you say is true, size matters.

http://home.san.rr.com/denbeste/antenna.html
Anonymous
February 28, 2005 2:55:19 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

"TeddeLI" <nospam@nospam.net> wrote in message
news:k3j621ltlijigjpj7m0pbd67qdu45uqil0@4ax.com...
> On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 08:47:25 -0800, "Richard Ness"
> <richard.no@gamn.spam.nessnet.com> wrote:
>
>>Just a slight correction....
>>
>>Antenna length is a function of FREQUENCY.
>>If a signal is 800MHz (which analog is), it wouldn't matter if it is
>>analog or digital, CDMA, GSM, iDEN or whatever....
>>
>>Your assertion that CDMA needs "antenna length" with the implication
>>that analog or another digital technology doesn't, is false.
>>
>>Hypothetical situation: a signal is being broadcast from the same antenna
>>in 800 MHz analog, CDMA, GSM and iDEN. Same wattage, ERP, etc.
>>
>>Optimal antenna length would maximize ALL of the above signals equally.
>>The particular modulation scheme is not effected by the length of the
>>antenna.
>>
>>
>>"TeddeLI" <nospam@nospam.net> wrote in message
>>news:579621d3s08aqg008etgih6ikc4p9cj1oe@4ax.com...
>>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 19:16:19 -0600, Jeff Hodges <> wrote:
>>>
>>>>I have a question about 3 phones. I have 2 friends....one has an
>>>>audiovox 8900, the other an audiovox 9900, and me a lg vx7000.
>>>>
>>>>My phone works great everywhere but at home. Inside my apartment I can
>>>>rarely receive or place a call....Oddly enough, my 2 friends with the
>>>>audiovox phones get as clear a signal and can carry on a conversation
>>>>with no problem in my apartment. We did some comparing....
>>>>
>>>>On a 3 min timed call, while moving around my apartment from room to
>>>>room in 10 call attempts they both had a 100% success rate with their
>>>>vox phones and mine was 10%. Based on 10 attempted 3 min calls....I
>>>>had 1 not drop in the 10 tries. I should mention that I have a friend
>>>>with a motorola v400 on cingular who went 0% when he tried the same
>>>>test. Why is my 7000 and the motorola having such a hard time getting
>>>>signal in the apartment? I think my software is up to date and I do
>>>>*228 monthly but no use.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>J.H.
>>>
>>> Could have something to do with the antenna on the phones. Audiovox
>>> phones have extendable antennas while the 7000 does not. CDMA
>>> reception is dependent on antenna length.
>>
>
> While all you say is true, size matters.
>
> http://home.san.rr.com/denbeste/antenna.html


On that, I will not disagree.....

Antenna gain and optimal length will always pull in a signal better.
But..... no matter if it is analog, CDMA, GSM or iDEN.... Given all
other factors (freq, ERP, etc) were the same.

In my above hypothetical, all signals were of equal strength. Now, if
one type of signal, (let's say CDMA in theory), were broadcast with
ERPs (effective radiated power) that were lower than the other types
of digital modulation, then antenna would definitly become a factor....




>
Anonymous
February 28, 2005 2:55:20 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

Richard Ness wrote:
>>
>>> Just a slight correction....
>>>
>>> Antenna length is a function of FREQUENCY.
>>> If a signal is 800MHz (which analog is), it wouldn't
>>> matter if it is analog or digital, CDMA, GSM, iDEN or
>>> whatever....
>>>
>>> Your assertion that CDMA needs "antenna length" with
>>> the implication that analog or another digital
>>> technology doesn't, is false.

Absolutely.

>>> Hypothetical situation: a signal is being broadcast
>>> from the same antenna in 800 MHz analog, CDMA, GSM and
>>> iDEN. Same wattage, ERP, etc.
>>>
>>> Optimal antenna length would maximize ALL of the above
>>> signals equally. The particular modulation scheme is
>>> not effected by the length of the antenna.
>
> Antenna gain and optimal length will always pull in a
> signal better. But..... no matter if it is analog, CDMA,
> GSM or iDEN.... Given all other factors (freq, ERP, etc)
> were the same.
>
> In my above hypothetical, all signals were of equal
> strength. Now, if one type of signal, (let's say CDMA in
> theory), were broadcast with ERPs (effective radiated
> power) that were lower than the other types of digital
> modulation, then antenna would definitly become a
> factor....

I believe that the original mis-statement came from:
VZW is mostly CDMA in the 850 band. Because of
this most all VZW phones require longer antennas
and because of that they are almost all extendable.
The GSM providers are mostly using 1900 and so
many of their phones have non extendable stubs
or completely internal antennas.

I figured I could be clever and pick a nit with your
statements above but I forgot some facts and then
my brain blew a fuse thinking about it but there has
to be something here....

CDMA is the only technique that relies on contention
or noise and does not statically allocate bandwidth
for each call (kind of like "shared media"). To further
enable this they have the tower dictate power
adjustments to the handset.

Do they do this in support of the other techniques
as well? Does the tower adjust as well (or is that only
to shrink or grow the size of the cell)?

I guess when they get to adaptive arrays the tower
will effective adjust power towards a handset. When
that happens does this have any effect on adjacent
units? So if you had a group of CDMA handsets that
all worked fine with antennas extended and then you
retracted half of them, would the remaining extended
half be effected?

(I suspect none of the above makes any sense but
I just had the feeling that something was there...)

-Quick
Anonymous
March 1, 2005 2:27:11 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

Ok, I have ordered an extendable antenna, with hopes that this will
correct my problem, or at least help it. I guess my fear now is that
all the newer nicer phones are not going to pick up as well as the
older tri-mode phones in situations like mine? Which makes me think
that maybe tri-mode may be going the way of the dinosaur and that I
may have to go back a couple of generations to get a phone that will
work in my apartment. This really stinks, and I hope that i am wrong
because I would figure, that the non-tri-mode phones just may not work
in my home or at least not for what 2-3 years? I have been looking at
the 3 new v-cast phones, but I would guess they would be the same as
what I have now as far as reception. Oh well, we'll see how my antenna
does when it gets here. I hate to admit it, but i ordered the little
stick in the phone plastic strip thing too....I know it's cheesy but I
am at a loss.

On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 21:20:11 +0100 (CET), George Orwell
<nobody@mixmaster.it> wrote:

>In article <2or421tsk2mk47lonctf1361p7n72smcro@4ax.com>
>Jeff Hodges <> wrote:
>
>Had the same trouble with an LG3100. Loved the phone but only had 50%
>coverage inside the condo. Others with bar phones or extendable antennas
>had coverage everywhere. Techs told me I needed a tri mode phone etc etc.
>I went back to an old Nokia and even with the antenna down, had more bars
>everywhere than the LG. Since it was a flip phone and a small one at
>that, I estimated the stub antenna was only half the size of the bar-type
>Nokia, again, even with the Nokia ant. down. Extend it and you had an
>ant. that was almost 3 times the length of the LG. Since going to the
>Nokia, it has never switched over to analog and always shows the "D"
>indicating its in digital mode so the tri-mode solution would not have
>been the answer anyway. I will always stick to a bar phone OR a flip with
>an extendable antenna.
March 1, 2005 5:02:38 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

Where i live in Las Vegas the signal is spotty in my apt. I ordered
one of those 3 watt power boosters. It can also be used in the car.
I have no problems with any signals with that. Just plugs into the
back of the phone near the antenna....

On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 23:27:11 -0600, Jeff Hodges <> wrote:

>Ok, I have ordered an extendable antenna, with hopes that this will
>correct my problem, or at least help it. I guess my fear now is that
>all the newer nicer phones are not going to pick up as well as the
>older tri-mode phones in situations like mine? Which makes me think
>that maybe tri-mode may be going the way of the dinosaur and that I
>may have to go back a couple of generations to get a phone that will
>work in my apartment. This really stinks, and I hope that i am wrong
>because I would figure, that the non-tri-mode phones just may not work
>in my home or at least not for what 2-3 years? I have been looking at
>the 3 new v-cast phones, but I would guess they would be the same as
>what I have now as far as reception. Oh well, we'll see how my antenna
>does when it gets here. I hate to admit it, but i ordered the little
>stick in the phone plastic strip thing too....I know it's cheesy but I
>am at a loss.
>
>On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 21:20:11 +0100 (CET), George Orwell
><nobody@mixmaster.it> wrote:
>
>>In article <2or421tsk2mk47lonctf1361p7n72smcro@4ax.com>
>>Jeff Hodges <> wrote:
>>
>>Had the same trouble with an LG3100. Loved the phone but only had 50%
>>coverage inside the condo. Others with bar phones or extendable antennas
>>had coverage everywhere. Techs told me I needed a tri mode phone etc etc.
>>I went back to an old Nokia and even with the antenna down, had more bars
>>everywhere than the LG. Since it was a flip phone and a small one at
>>that, I estimated the stub antenna was only half the size of the bar-type
>>Nokia, again, even with the Nokia ant. down. Extend it and you had an
>>ant. that was almost 3 times the length of the LG. Since going to the
>>Nokia, it has never switched over to analog and always shows the "D"
>>indicating its in digital mode so the tri-mode solution would not have
>>been the answer anyway. I will always stick to a bar phone OR a flip with
>>an extendable antenna.
March 1, 2005 8:47:08 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

On Tue, 1 Mar 2005 20:24:55 +0100 (CET), George Orwell
<nobody@mixmaster.it> wrote:

>Good luck but that little stick on thing is not the definition of an
>"extendable." You need the type, if available for your phone that
>actually will take the place of the stub you have, screwed inside the
>unit, that extends out like a "popup" antenna. Some phones don't have add
>ons like this. My LG didn't and I had to go to another phone that did.
>Many of the Samsungs have extendables.

Generally extendable antennas will only be found on CDMA operators'
phones (Verizon and Sprint PCS.) TDMA and GSM phones generally do not
have extendable antennas and usually have either stub antennas or
internal antennas.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Anonymous
March 1, 2005 9:36:33 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

I ordered both...I ordered a true...extendable antenna, and that stick
on thing...just as a last resort

On Tue, 1 Mar 2005 20:24:55 +0100 (CET), George Orwell
<nobody@mixmaster.it> wrote:

>In article <vuu721tiols6p2960h49rmkavcgb24i0jg@4ax.com>
>Jeff Hodges <> wrote:
>
>Good luck but that little stick on thing is not the definition of an
>"extendable." You need the type, if available for your phone that
>actually will take the place of the stub you have, screwed inside the
>unit, that extends out like a "popup" antenna. Some phones don't have add
>ons like this. My LG didn't and I had to go to another phone that did.
>Many of the Samsungs have extendables.
March 1, 2005 9:36:34 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 18:36:33 -0600, Jeff Hodges <> wrote:

>I ordered both...I ordered a true...extendable antenna, and that stick
>on thing...just as a last resort

The only thing that the stick on thing does is relieve you of excess
money. They are entirely worthless.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Anonymous
March 2, 2005 1:35:04 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

I am already looking at the kyopcera koi kx2. i notice it is tri-mode
and still has some of the latest features similar to my 7000. I have
never owned a kyocera, and am not crazy about the design on the koi,
but I may need it if I can't place a call.....or my new antenna does
not solve some of my problem.




On Tue, 01 Mar 2005 17:47:08 -0800, Joseph <JoeOfSeattle@yahoo.com>
wrote:

>On Tue, 1 Mar 2005 20:24:55 +0100 (CET), George Orwell
><nobody@mixmaster.it> wrote:
>
>>Good luck but that little stick on thing is not the definition of an
>>"extendable." You need the type, if available for your phone that
>>actually will take the place of the stub you have, screwed inside the
>>unit, that extends out like a "popup" antenna. Some phones don't have add
>>ons like this. My LG didn't and I had to go to another phone that did.
>>Many of the Samsungs have extendables.
>
>Generally extendable antennas will only be found on CDMA operators'
>phones (Verizon and Sprint PCS.) TDMA and GSM phones generally do not
>have extendable antennas and usually have either stub antennas or
>internal antennas.
>
>- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>
Anonymous
March 4, 2005 5:33:46 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

> I believe that the original mis-statement came from:
> VZW is mostly CDMA in the 850 band. Because of
> this most all VZW phones require longer antennas
> and because of that they are almost all extendable.
> The GSM providers are mostly using 1900 and so
> many of their phones have non extendable stubs
> or completely internal antennas.

I don't think that's necessarily all of it for GSM. In most of the
world, GSM is a mature technology, and therefore coverage is saturated.
Most GSM phones do not have retractable antennae. However, there are
thousands of cell sites that use the 900 mHz band, and they do not have
retractable antennae. Many U.S. handsets are derivatives of foreign
made ones...which I mean if LG releases Model X1 in Europe/Asia, most
likely a similar model, Model X2 will appear in U.S. frequencies, and
Model X2 is actually a modified Model X1 to support the other
frequencies (many times the phone is quad band by design, and certain
bands are blocked in certain countries.)

TH
!