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firona vie moving servers exploit

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Anonymous
April 22, 2005 10:15:14 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

I was reading that there used to be an issue with people moving to FV,
buying up bigtime, and moving back, despite the fact that they weren't
supposed to be able to. Can anyone confirm or refute this? It seems relevant
to the exchange server project.

More about : firona vie moving servers exploit

Anonymous
April 22, 2005 1:22:07 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

>I hope this whole exchange server fizzles out, or that i don't get
blocked
>from content by bots and twinks.

I'm not sure if it will turn out to be a big deal. Buying and selling
items for real money happens now on all servers. Legitimising it will
encourage more people to do it but many won't

And if it's just on a few servers those servers will end up as gettos
where I won't play on.

As for crafting not having to make all the sub combines will help. As a
provisioner you used to be able to buy them, you can't now. If you
have to make them, make it so the trivials ones take no time at all to
make.
Anonymous
April 22, 2005 6:35:23 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

"Shadow" <kitchen@fis.org.nz> wrote in
news:SD0ae.19525$5F3.14182@news-server.bigpond.net.au:

> I was reading that there used to be an issue with people moving to FV,
> buying up bigtime, and moving back, despite the fact that they weren't
> supposed to be able to. Can anyone confirm or refute this? It seems
> relevant to the exchange server project.
>

As I understand it, it involved an intermediate transfer to Stormhammer, so
not really an issue with regards to EQ2.

--
On Erollisi Marr in <Sanctuary of Marr>
Ancient Graeme Faelban, Barbarian Soothsayer of 70 seasons

On Steamfont in <Insanity Plea>
Graeme, 28 Dwarven Mystic, 24 Sage, Retired
Aviv, 15 Gnome Brawler, 30 Provisioner, Retired
Related resources
Anonymous
April 22, 2005 7:24:59 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

"Graeme Faelban" <RichardRapier@netscape.net> wrote in message
news:Xns96405760B758Crichardrapiernetscap@130.133.1.4...
> "Shadow" <kitchen@fis.org.nz> wrote in
> news:SD0ae.19525$5F3.14182@news-server.bigpond.net.au:
>
> > I was reading that there used to be an issue with people moving to FV,
> > buying up bigtime, and moving back, despite the fact that they weren't
> > supposed to be able to. Can anyone confirm or refute this? It seems
> > relevant to the exchange server project.
> >
>
> As I understand it, it involved an intermediate transfer to Stormhammer,
so
> not really an issue with regards to EQ2.
>
> --
> On Erollisi Marr in <Sanctuary of Marr>
> Ancient Graeme Faelban, Barbarian Soothsayer of 70 seasons
>
> On Steamfont in <Insanity Plea>
> Graeme, 28 Dwarven Mystic, 24 Sage, Retired
> Aviv, 15 Gnome Brawler, 30 Provisioner, Retired

The argument was that people had worked out an exploit to equip characters
in such a way they were not supposed to. I am not sure whether an equivalent
will be found but if it is (and a lot of money would ride on it if the $200
000 000 figure quoted was correct) then the consequences would be that all
servers would be de-facto exchange servers, albeit not to the same degree.

It seems another major problem is that MMOGs can be played by bots with a
very limited AI. Crafting, for example, is largely something i imagine a
programmer could solve in an afternoon... if event (symbol(x)), match symbol
x with ascii character ("3", else return "1", "2") or something similar.

I think a good game is one that would not be easily scriptable, but i don't
think anyone has a crafting system like that ... but if they did i'd love it
if SOE adopted it. I liked crafting initially but it's so cumbersome, clunky
and repetitious, and i don't clearly see how to fix it, so I've stopped
doing it despite diverse characters covering many of the tradeskill areas. I
think the provisioner is the best because theres less interdependence, but
even then the inventory space has to be huge, which mean lots of bags with
lots of slots, and i find that distances me from feeling i'm cooking
things... chefs don't stick the food in their pockets, if it's in the
kitchen they can use it ;-)

I hope this whole exchange server fizzles out, or that i don't get blocked
from content by bots and twinks. I don't really want to go back to CRPG's,
the ones that grabbed me are long gone, like baldur's gate 2 (I wanted to be
the god but have the dark elf chick as my partner) and Planescape (I wanted
the succubus to fight her way in to hell and rescue him as the sequel!).

Ah well, I guess I can find something else for thrills, like smuggling
marijuana into Bali.
Anonymous
April 22, 2005 8:36:29 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

"BombayMix" <bombaymix@altavista.co.uk> wrote in
news:1114186927.238529.267240@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com:

>>I hope this whole exchange server fizzles out, or that i don't get
> blocked
>>from content by bots and twinks.
>
> I'm not sure if it will turn out to be a big deal. Buying and selling
> items for real money happens now on all servers. Legitimising it will
> encourage more people to do it but many won't

Right now, the brand new EQ player is all but forced to buy plat just to be
on a level playing field with 95% of the other players. There have been
many factors that have contributed to this over the years, but what SoE is
doing with EQ2 is accellerating this downward spiral by facilitating that
which erodes the game.

> And if it's just on a few servers those servers will end up as gettos
> where I won't play on.

It won't be just on a few servers. Sure, they will only facilitate it on a
few, but their 180-degree spin on their previous stance that denounced this
sort of activity as harmful to the game will only increase the pollution of
the non-Exchange servers by the IGE's of the world.

People are misunderstanding SoE's vows to continue to seek out and
eliminate botters and farmers. They only care about those who *monopolize
content*. They don't do a thing about those who market their in-game items
otherwise.

This is a very bad direction for them to take, philosophically speaking.

--
Rumble
"Write something worth reading, or do something worth writing."
-- Benjamin Franklin
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 12:00:01 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

"Shadow" <kitchen@fis.org.nz> wrote in
news:fH8ae.20192$5F3.4645@news-server.bigpond.net.au:
> I think a good game is one that would not be easily scriptable, but i
> don't think anyone has a crafting system like that ... but if they did
> i'd love it if SOE adopted it. I liked crafting initially but it's so
> cumbersome, clunky and repetitious, and i don't clearly see how to fix
> it, so I've stopped doing it despite diverse characters covering many
> of the tradeskill areas. I think the provisioner is the best because
> theres less interdependence, but even then the inventory space has to
> be huge, which mean lots of bags with lots of slots, and i find that
> distances me from feeling i'm cooking things... chefs don't stick the
> food in their pockets, if it's in the kitchen they can use it ;-)

There is no zero interdendence between the tradeskills, unless you choose
to purchase intermediate combines that you can create on your own now.

I still was doing my provisioning, although I had hit the wall of not
having tier 4 access to harvest tier 4 items, and it was right around
that time that I took a break from eq2, only to be coming back just as
the exchange server was announced, causing me to immediately cancel my
account.

--
On Erollisi Marr in <Sanctuary of Marr>
Ancient Graeme Faelban, Barbarian Soothsayer of 70 seasons

On Steamfont in <Insanity Plea>
Graeme, 28 Dwarven Mystic, 24 Sage, Retired
Aviv, 15 Gnome Brawler, 30 Provisioner, Retired
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 7:43:18 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

On Fri, 22 Apr 2005 16:36:29 GMT, Rumbledor
<Rumbledor@hotspamsuxmail.com> wrote:

>"BombayMix" <bombaymix@altavista.co.uk> wrote in
>news:1114186927.238529.267240@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com:
>
>>>I hope this whole exchange server fizzles out, or that i don't get
>> blocked
>>>from content by bots and twinks.
>>
>> I'm not sure if it will turn out to be a big deal. Buying and selling
>> items for real money happens now on all servers. Legitimising it will
>> encourage more people to do it but many won't
>
>Right now, the brand new EQ player is all but forced to buy plat just to be
>on a level playing field with 95% of the other players. There have been
>many factors that have contributed to this over the years, but what SoE is
>doing with EQ2 is accellerating this downward spiral by facilitating that
>which erodes the game.

Is this really true? Sure, a brand new EQ player couldn't "compete"
with a twink, but they really don't have to compete. And in some
sense newbie players have it easier than they did before. Lots of
really good gear is now available in the bazaar far cheaper than it
ever was in the past. At the higher levels where a mob can kill you
with one swipe people may get picky about your gear, but I bet up to
level 40 people don't have to buy plat just to be able to play.
April 24, 2005 6:07:36 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

In article <amgj61h6d5a1bflqn5t2llgl54r2qv5mbo@4ax.com>,
murdocj@hotmail.com says...
> On Fri, 22 Apr 2005 16:36:29 GMT, Rumbledor
> <Rumbledor@hotspamsuxmail.com> wrote:
>
> >"BombayMix" <bombaymix@altavista.co.uk> wrote in
> >news:1114186927.238529.267240@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com:
> >
> >>>I hope this whole exchange server fizzles out, or that i don't get
> >> blocked
> >>>from content by bots and twinks.
> >>
> >> I'm not sure if it will turn out to be a big deal. Buying and selling
> >> items for real money happens now on all servers. Legitimising it will
> >> encourage more people to do it but many won't
> >
> >Right now, the brand new EQ player is all but forced to buy plat just to be
> >on a level playing field with 95% of the other players. There have been
> >many factors that have contributed to this over the years, but what SoE is
> >doing with EQ2 is accellerating this downward spiral by facilitating that
> >which erodes the game.
>
> Is this really true? Sure, a brand new EQ player couldn't "compete"
> with a twink, but they really don't have to compete. And in some
> sense newbie players have it easier than they did before. Lots of
> really good gear is now available in the bazaar far cheaper than it
> ever was in the past. At the higher levels where a mob can kill you
> with one swipe people may get picky about your gear, but I bet up to
> level 40 people don't have to buy plat just to be able to play.
>

Join nearly any guild and you'd have to have discipline and a steel will
to -avoid- being twinked up with gear that's better than the very best
stuff that existed in the original game, at any level.

New players don't need to compete, they are handed more than they need
well into their 60s. And on top of that, they can buy stuff in the
bazaar for a song that used to be the best stuff in the game.

They can play just fine without buying plat!!!
Anonymous
April 24, 2005 3:21:14 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

On Sat, 23 Apr 2005 03:43:18 GMT in
<amgj61h6d5a1bflqn5t2llgl54r2qv5mbo@4ax.com>, murdocj
<murdocj@hotmail.com> graced the world with this thought:

> And in some
>sense newbie players have it easier than they did before.

oh, go on... ya think?
Anonymous
April 24, 2005 6:32:32 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

42 <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in
news:MPG.1cd49f4ffec0de6f989ad7@shawnews:

> In article <amgj61h6d5a1bflqn5t2llgl54r2qv5mbo@4ax.com>,
> murdocj@hotmail.com says...
>> On Fri, 22 Apr 2005 16:36:29 GMT, Rumbledor
>> <Rumbledor@hotspamsuxmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> >"BombayMix" <bombaymix@altavista.co.uk> wrote in
>> >news:1114186927.238529.267240@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com:
>> >
>> >>>I hope this whole exchange server fizzles out, or that i don't get
>> >> blocked
>> >>>from content by bots and twinks.
>> >>
>> >> I'm not sure if it will turn out to be a big deal. Buying and
>> >> selling items for real money happens now on all servers.
>> >> Legitimising it will encourage more people to do it but many won't
>> >
>> >Right now, the brand new EQ player is all but forced to buy plat
>> >just to be on a level playing field with 95% of the other players.
>> >There have been many factors that have contributed to this over the
>> >years, but what SoE is doing with EQ2 is accellerating this downward
>> >spiral by facilitating that which erodes the game.
>>
>> Is this really true? Sure, a brand new EQ player couldn't "compete"
>> with a twink, but they really don't have to compete. And in some
>> sense newbie players have it easier than they did before. Lots of
>> really good gear is now available in the bazaar far cheaper than it
>> ever was in the past. At the higher levels where a mob can kill you
>> with one swipe people may get picky about your gear, but I bet up to
>> level 40 people don't have to buy plat just to be able to play.
>>
>
> Join nearly any guild and you'd have to have discipline and a steel
> will to -avoid- being twinked up with gear that's better than the very
> best stuff that existed in the original game, at any level.
>
> New players don't need to compete, they are handed more than they need
> well into their 60s. And on top of that, they can buy stuff in the
> bazaar for a song that used to be the best stuff in the game.
>
> They can play just fine without buying plat!!!

I don't see it so much as competing as just keeping up. The new player
will play levels 1-20, watching so many of those players they happen to
group with along the way leave them in the dust due to much better gear.
Granted, a knowledge of the game contributes as well, but the benefits
of grossly exaggerated mana/hp levels cannot be overstated.

I can certainly see where that would be discouraging to many new
players. It would be tough to trudge through the game while everyone you
see around you (briefly) at the same level has it so much better.

The standard has plainly been raised.

--
Rumble
"Write something worth reading, or do something worth writing."
-- Benjamin Franklin
Anonymous
April 25, 2005 9:44:27 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

42 <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in
news:MPG.1cd6c56e3088117c989adb@shawnews:

> In article <Xns9642D84A71A11Rumbledorhotmailcom@63.240.76.16>,
> Rumbledor@hotspamsuxmail.com says...

< snip >
>>
>> You're preaching to the choir regarding the merits of *not* buying
>> plat and twinking out of the gate.
>>
>> However, the fact remains that a new player does feel at a notable
>> disadvantage playing this game as it comes out of the box after they
>> see the advantages the "average" player enjoys.
>>
>> For a change of scenery, I started a brand new player on a different
>> server a while back. It was fun for a while, until I realized that
>> the people I met and grouped with would and did easily outpace me. I
>> didn't care that it took me longer to kill a particular mob than
>> others, or that I didn't have enough coin to even keep me in bandages
>> much of the time. What I did care about was the fact that I wasn't
>> able to group with the same people more than a couple of times before
>> they became too high of level for that to be reasonable. Nor did I
>> care for being a mana sponge, comparatively speaking, as a relatively
>> far under-equipped tank, or constantly running OOM as a healer with a
>> tiny mana pool. Someone else was always the better option for tank or
>> healer or just about anything else. As such, I didn't play on that
>> server for long.
>>
>> So, back to my original point, SoE appears to be accellerating that
>> effect with EQ2.
>
> I think one solution is to provide new players ways to find each
> other, instead of looking for ways to strap them onto the backs of the
> uberalts.

Agreed. That's a good idea, but how would one qualify as meeting the
criteria for inclusion in any sort of search results? Merely highest
character level on the account? That in itself would be an ineffective
filter, once secondary accounts and guild-twinked new players are
concerned.

Possibly something to simply draw that demographic to a central
location. The various newbie areas may be a bit too wide-spread. Perhaps
some more centralized content on each continent?

> Alternatively, I think the -degree- to which you can be twinked is
> grossly excessive... it may be too late to fix that though, unless
> they got really aggressive with recommended level gear. Its plainly
> unbalanced, none of the level 10 encounters are tuned around being
> taken by level 10 tanks with 2000 hits and weapons that hit for the
> cap, etc etc etc. And as you yourself demonstrated it literally ruins
> the game for the people they are with.

Yup. People just starting out in EQ (yes, I'm certain they do exist)
don't need to be rushed through content the way the typical alt will be.
They just need people of similar level and abilities to group with and
keep it interesting.


--
Rumble
"Write something worth reading, or do something worth writing."
-- Benjamin Franklin
April 25, 2005 10:39:34 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

In article <Xns964381A0FF90CRumbledorhotmailcom@204.127.199.17>,
Rumbledor@hotspamsuxmail.com says...
>
> Agreed. That's a good idea, but how would one qualify as meeting the
> criteria for inclusion in any sort of search results? Merely highest
> character level on the account? That in itself would be an ineffective
> filter, once secondary accounts and guild-twinked new players are
> concerned.

I think perhaps opt in all players, and let those who know how to play
(e.g. uberalts) opt out.

> Possibly something to simply draw that demographic to a central
> location. The various newbie areas may be a bit too wide-spread. Perhaps
> some more centralized content on each continent?

I think that could work. I don't know what the influx of true newbies
is, nor the percentage of experienced players that rolls their alts
untwinked, or at least comparatively so.

Maybe a more formalized system in the lfg tool to simply say: "untwinked
player looking to group with same for adventure". Provide some
structure to it...

Anarchy Online has a series of autojoin chat channels players get
dropped in as they join the game and get started. Experienced players
would just drop them and rush to their friends, but it might be quite
beneficial to newbies to have them all autojoin 'newbie' channels by
level range, to make finding eachother easier. It would almost be like
logging in and finding yourself in a guild of level 1-15 characters,
with newbie chatter going on all over the place... and when you turn
12th you autojoin a 10-20th channel as well... etc

Its FAR better than finding yourself in gukta cold and alone...so very
very alone ;) 

I think stuff like this would help, but its going to take more than that
to solve the problem. EQ culture has to change, and it has to be done at
the developer level, by designing a game that allows people who PL to 60
grind 100 AAs, PL to 70 and THEN play EQ to exist without utterly
dominating the landscape as the 'best way to play eq'... because it
isn't.


> > Alternatively, I think the -degree- to which you can be twinked is
> > grossly excessive... it may be too late to fix that though, unless
> > they got really aggressive with recommended level gear. Its plainly
> > unbalanced, none of the level 10 encounters are tuned around being
> > taken by level 10 tanks with 2000 hits and weapons that hit for the
> > cap, etc etc etc. And as you yourself demonstrated it literally ruins
> > the game for the people they are with.
>
> Yup. People just starting out in EQ (yes, I'm certain they do exist)
> don't need to be rushed through content the way the typical alt will be.
> They just need people of similar level and abilities to group with and
> keep it interesting.
>
Anonymous
April 30, 2005 8:13:46 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

On Mon, 25 Apr 2005 02:15:37 GMT, Rumbledor
>For a change of scenery, I started a brand new player on a different
>server a while back. It was fun for a while, until I realized that the
>people I met and grouped with would and did easily outpace me. I didn't
>care that it took me longer to kill a particular mob than others, or
>that I didn't have enough coin to even keep me in bandages much of the
>time. What I did care about was the fact that I wasn't able to group
>with the same people more than a couple of times before they became too
>high of level for that to be reasonable. Nor did I care for being a mana
>sponge, comparatively speaking, as a relatively far under-equipped tank,
>or constantly running OOM as a healer with a tiny mana pool. Someone
>else was always the better option for tank or healer or just about
>anything else. As such, I didn't play on that server for long.

Excuse me,but I did exactly the same,started on a new server to avoid
twinking,Ranger there is 55 now,has Ornate tunic,legs,gloves,Cloak of
Flames,Belt of turtle,Eyepatch of Plunder,etc,etc,and 3k unbuffed hps.
Most people I meet in this level range are worse equipped.
Maybe you should rethink your strategy,plat is very easy to come by,
surprises me to read about your problems as experienced as you are.

Melforge 55 Ranger
Anonymous
May 2, 2005 6:02:36 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

Meldur <Meldur@t-online.de> wrote in
news:o o3771tbru8bap72i2miq3drdncuevv8b8@4ax.com:

> On Mon, 25 Apr 2005 02:15:37 GMT, Rumbledor
>>For a change of scenery, I started a brand new player on a different
>>server a while back. It was fun for a while, until I realized that the
>>people I met and grouped with would and did easily outpace me. I didn't
>>care that it took me longer to kill a particular mob than others, or
>>that I didn't have enough coin to even keep me in bandages much of the
>>time. What I did care about was the fact that I wasn't able to group
>>with the same people more than a couple of times before they became too
>>high of level for that to be reasonable. Nor did I care for being a mana
>>sponge, comparatively speaking, as a relatively far under-equipped tank,
>>or constantly running OOM as a healer with a tiny mana pool. Someone
>>else was always the better option for tank or healer or just about
>>anything else. As such, I didn't play on that server for long.
>
> Excuse me,but I did exactly the same,started on a new server to avoid
> twinking,Ranger there is 55 now,has Ornate tunic,legs,gloves,Cloak of
> Flames,Belt of turtle,Eyepatch of Plunder,etc,etc,and 3k unbuffed hps.
> Most people I meet in this level range are worse equipped.
> Maybe you should rethink your strategy,plat is very easy to come by,
> surprises me to read about your problems as experienced as you are.
>

Well, the fact that I tried it with the warrior class didn't help. Aside
from that, I've farmed my share of spider(ling) silks and animal hides in
my time to have developed a strong aversion to it at this point.

My problem didn't stem from the fact that I didn't know how to go about
obtaining the funds to purchase the level-inappropriate gear, but more the
fact that I had to do that in order to be on a level playing field. It's no
wonder so many people buy plat in EQ these days.

--
Rumble
"Write something worth reading, or do something worth writing."
-- Benjamin Franklin
!