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ACII vs. Sprint Free and Clear (w/no roaming)

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Anonymous
March 25, 2005 6:59:38 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

Has anyone done any sort of comparison between the coverage areas on
the new ACII plan and Sprint's Free and Clear plan (where you pay an
extra $5 a month for no roaming anywhere in their system)? Given the
restrictions of the ACII plan, I'm curious to see which provider
actually has a wider coverage area without roaming.

I'm not necessarily looking to switch to Sprint from Verizon, but it
seems to me this would be a valuable comparison, for the customer's
benefit. (I'll leave it to the experts here in the newsgroup to do the
comparison, I'm absolutely hopeless when it comes to reading maps).

Thanks!
Cathy
March 25, 2005 6:59:39 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

This may be of some help:

http://www.mountainwireless.com/3netmap.htm

Rich

cathy wrote:
> Has anyone done any sort of comparison between the coverage areas on
> the new ACII plan and Sprint's Free and Clear plan (where you pay an
> extra $5 a month for no roaming anywhere in their system)? Given the
> restrictions of the ACII plan, I'm curious to see which provider
> actually has a wider coverage area without roaming.
>
> I'm not necessarily looking to switch to Sprint from Verizon, but it
> seems to me this would be a valuable comparison, for the customer's
> benefit. (I'll leave it to the experts here in the newsgroup to do the
> comparison, I'm absolutely hopeless when it comes to reading maps).
>
> Thanks!
> Cathy
Anonymous
March 25, 2005 6:59:39 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

cathy wrote:
>
> Has anyone done any sort of comparison between the coverage areas on
> the new ACII plan and Sprint's Free and Clear plan (where you pay an
> extra $5 a month for no roaming anywhere in their system)? Given the
> restrictions of the ACII plan, I'm curious to see which provider
> actually has a wider coverage area without roaming.

One caveat... The plan says that your roaming minutes must not exceed
50% of your total minutes used.

Notan
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March 25, 2005 6:59:39 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

The key here is which service has the widest coverage, native or
roaming, since all allowed roaming is included in the price plans.

Having both Sprint F&CA (work) and Verizon AC (personal), I can report
that on rare occasions I've had service roaming on Sprint when
service was not available on my VZW phone. I haven't traveled to the
specific areas not covered by ACII, but assume that Sprint does have
roaming in at least some of those areas. So theoretically, Sprint would
give you a larger footprint.

Reality is a bit different, though. I have found numerous areas on the
edges of Sprint native coverage where my phone would not roam unless
forced to analog, then not very well. Since Verizon tends to have
broader coverage due to the majority of legacy cellular band service,
their coverage is much less spotty. These problem areas include
suburban Boston, New York, Washington DC, Dallas-Ft. Worth, Los Angeles
and Denver.

Don't get me wrong-there are some great things about Sprint
services (we actually sell SPCS along with other telecom and computer
products), but for voice connectivity I'd choose Verizon (which I
don't sell!) if I could carry only one phone.
Anonymous
March 25, 2005 6:59:40 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

Rich wrote:
> This may be of some help:
>
> http://www.mountainwireless.com/3netmap.htm

By chance, does anyone have a similar map for Sprint that shows only
CDMA digital roaming on F&CA? Some of us are unfortunately stuck with
non-AMPS capable phones, and I would bet those are going to become more
common as time passes.


--
E-mail fudged to thwart spammers.
Transpose the c's and a's in my e-mail address to reply.
Anonymous
March 25, 2005 8:05:01 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

On Fri, 25 Mar 2005 11:03:04 -0500, Rich <mathwhiz@mathwhiz.org>
wrote:

>This may be of some help:
>
>http://www.mountainwireless.com/3netmap.htm
>
>Rich
>
>cathy wrote:
>> Has anyone done any sort of comparison between the coverage areas on
>> the new ACII plan and Sprint's Free and Clear plan (where you pay an
>> extra $5 a month for no roaming anywhere in their system)? Given the
>> restrictions of the ACII plan, I'm curious to see which provider
>> actually has a wider coverage area without roaming.
>>
>> I'm not necessarily looking to switch to Sprint from Verizon, but it
>> seems to me this would be a valuable comparison, for the customer's
>> benefit. (I'll leave it to the experts here in the newsgroup to do the
>> comparison, I'm absolutely hopeless when it comes to reading maps).
>>
>> Thanks!
>> Cathy

OK....I've looked at the maps, and as far as I can tell (please
correct me if I'm wrong, as I said, I'm pretty bad at reading maps),
Sprint has better/wider coverage than Verizon. Is this really the
case? Or are there some drawbacks to Sprint that I'm just not seeing?

Cathy
Anonymous
March 25, 2005 8:05:02 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

cathy wrote:

> OK....I've looked at the maps, and as far as I can tell (please
> correct me if I'm wrong, as I said, I'm pretty bad at reading maps),
> Sprint has better/wider coverage than Verizon. Is this really the
> case? Or are there some drawbacks to Sprint that I'm just not seeing?

Sprint has service where Verizon has none. (Oklahoma and Arkansas, for
example.) I'm not sure if the converse is true, although it probably is.

--
JustThe.net - Apple Valley, CA - http://JustThe.net/ - 888.480.4NET (4638)
Steven J. Sobol, Geek In Charge / sjsobol@JustThe.net / PGP: 0xE3AE35ED

"The wisdom of a fool won't set you free"
--New Order, "Bizarre Love Triangle"
Anonymous
March 25, 2005 9:45:12 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

Yes, Sprint with F&CA option is *by far and away* superior to Verizon for
basic voice coverage.
Likely thousands or even hundreds of thousands of square miles included with
Sprint where
Verizon users would pay roaming or have no service.

*** -> But, that doesn't tell the whole story....

CDMA carriers tend to offer a number of services that *only* work when on
the native system.
For this reason, it's not clear cut to choose Sprint. For example, when you
roam with Sprint
you will not be able to do data, and in some cases this means SMS text
messaging and even
simple features like voicemail waiting indication or caller ID are not
available.

Sprint roams in analog in some locations, which in and of itself isn't bad,
but battery life is
terrible on most modern phones when in analog mode, assuming they support
analog at all.

Cingular actually has good coverage. Not as good as Sprint for basic voice
coverage
but close, and note that *all features work* seemlessly even when roaming.

So why choose Verizon? My local area -- where I live and really use my
phone the most
has excellent Verizon service with no "all system busy." Cingular in my
area is basically
dead-last when it comes to local coverage and system availability where I
live.

Anyway, the whole thing gets pretty complex. If all I cared is best voice
coverage (say
RV traveller) and I did not care one bit about data, then Sprint seems to
have the best deal.

Once you say you want seemless roaming or access to data on the road, Sprint
becomes
less viable as their native coverage is specific to highways and cities.
Not much rural coverage
to speak of at all-- at least here in the West. i.e. Data and all enchanced
services are not available
when roaming even if you are willing to pay for them.

Verizon, for the moment, provides me with:
- Excellent specific local coverage
- Decent national coverage (but not the best)
- At the moment, I have free access to data (just the cost of minutes).

Rumor mill has it Verizon is removing free data. When that day comes, and I
actually get billed
for data (which some say is coming sooner rather than later), then I'll
switch carriers.

Anyway, It's all about finding the best value for your needs. Each carrier
has advantages
to a particular audience. But yes, if you simply mean who can give me the
*largest* voice
coverage area at the best price (all other issues ignored), Sprint is the
answer.

-Dan

PS: Cingular and Verizon can offer a "Digital One Rate" or "Single-Rate"
plan similar to Sprint's
F&CA which even allows you to use 100% of your minutes roaming. This is,
however,
offered at an extreme price increase. Again, not the best value.

Digital one Rate may or may not be currently available.

SingleRate is currently available as a National Access plan...

--

=======================
Oregon and the Pacific Northwest
http://cell.uoregon.edu

--

"cathy" <cwells21@NOSPAMhotmail.com> wrote in message
news:q2d841tjoehfeale44h4crbua89qb7qhuv@4ax.com...
> Has anyone done any sort of comparison between the coverage areas on
> the new ACII plan and Sprint's Free and Clear plan (where you pay an
> extra $5 a month for no roaming anywhere in their system)? Given the
> restrictions of the ACII plan, I'm curious to see which provider
> actually has a wider coverage area without roaming.
>
> I'm not necessarily looking to switch to Sprint from Verizon, but it
> seems to me this would be a valuable comparison, for the customer's
> benefit. (I'll leave it to the experts here in the newsgroup to do the
> comparison, I'm absolutely hopeless when it comes to reading maps).
>
> Thanks!
> Cathy
Anonymous
March 26, 2005 3:45:17 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

In the office where I work - near the Wichita, KS airport - Sprint phones
will ring but when you try to answer it will not connect - VZW phones can
make and receive calls. Both phones have a good signal and work fine
outside the building.

In news:MvGdndOt9sYoUdnfRVn-ow@comcast.com,
Dan Albrich <dalbrich@uoregon.edui> typed:
> Yes, Sprint with F&CA option is *by far and away* superior to Verizon
> for basic voice coverage.
> Likely thousands or even hundreds of thousands of square miles
> included with Sprint where
> Verizon users would pay roaming or have no service.
>
> *** -> But, that doesn't tell the whole story....
>
> CDMA carriers tend to offer a number of services that *only* work
> when on the native system.
> For this reason, it's not clear cut to choose Sprint. For example,
> when you roam with Sprint
> you will not be able to do data, and in some cases this means SMS text
> messaging and even
> simple features like voicemail waiting indication or caller ID are not
> available.
>
> Sprint roams in analog in some locations, which in and of itself
> isn't bad, but battery life is
> terrible on most modern phones when in analog mode, assuming they
> support analog at all.
>
> Cingular actually has good coverage. Not as good as Sprint for basic
> voice coverage
> but close, and note that *all features work* seemlessly even when
> roaming.
> So why choose Verizon? My local area -- where I live and really use
> my phone the most
> has excellent Verizon service with no "all system busy." Cingular in
> my area is basically
> dead-last when it comes to local coverage and system availability
> where I live.
>
> Anyway, the whole thing gets pretty complex. If all I cared is best
> voice coverage (say
> RV traveller) and I did not care one bit about data, then Sprint
> seems to have the best deal.
>
> Once you say you want seemless roaming or access to data on the road,
> Sprint becomes
> less viable as their native coverage is specific to highways and
> cities. Not much rural coverage
> to speak of at all-- at least here in the West. i.e. Data and all
> enchanced services are not available
> when roaming even if you are willing to pay for them.
>
> Verizon, for the moment, provides me with:
> - Excellent specific local coverage
> - Decent national coverage (but not the best)
> - At the moment, I have free access to data (just the cost of
> minutes).
> Rumor mill has it Verizon is removing free data. When that day
> comes, and I actually get billed
> for data (which some say is coming sooner rather than later), then
> I'll switch carriers.
>
> Anyway, It's all about finding the best value for your needs. Each
> carrier has advantages
> to a particular audience. But yes, if you simply mean who can give
> me the *largest* voice
> coverage area at the best price (all other issues ignored), Sprint is
> the answer.
>
> -Dan
>
> PS: Cingular and Verizon can offer a "Digital One Rate" or
> "Single-Rate" plan similar to Sprint's
> F&CA which even allows you to use 100% of your minutes roaming. This is,
> however,
> offered at an extreme price increase. Again, not the best value.
>
> Digital one Rate may or may not be currently available.
>
> SingleRate is currently available as a National Access plan...
>
> --
>
> =======================
> Oregon and the Pacific Northwest
> http://cell.uoregon.edu
>
>
> "cathy" <cwells21@NOSPAMhotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:q2d841tjoehfeale44h4crbua89qb7qhuv@4ax.com...
>> Has anyone done any sort of comparison between the coverage areas on
>> the new ACII plan and Sprint's Free and Clear plan (where you pay an
>> extra $5 a month for no roaming anywhere in their system)? Given the
>> restrictions of the ACII plan, I'm curious to see which provider
>> actually has a wider coverage area without roaming.
>>
>> I'm not necessarily looking to switch to Sprint from Verizon, but it
>> seems to me this would be a valuable comparison, for the customer's
>> benefit. (I'll leave it to the experts here in the newsgroup to do
>> the comparison, I'm absolutely hopeless when it comes to reading
>> maps). Thanks!
>> Cathy
Anonymous
March 26, 2005 6:53:49 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

It depends on location. In some states like WI and I think MN, Sprint
PCS has more area and more people covered than verizon. It is extremely
likely that verizon customers in those areas will have a roaming
partner, like USCellular or maybe Sprint PCS.
Anonymous
March 26, 2005 1:48:55 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

Dan Albrich wrote:

> CDMA carriers tend to offer a number of services that *only* work when on
> the native system.
> For this reason, it's not clear cut to choose Sprint. For example, when you
> roam with Sprint
> you will not be able to do data, and in some cases this means SMS text
> messaging and even
> simple features like voicemail waiting indication or caller ID are not
> available.

Same with Verizon.


--
JustThe.net - Apple Valley, CA - http://JustThe.net/ - 888.480.4NET (4638)
Steven J. Sobol, Geek In Charge / sjsobol@JustThe.net / PGP: 0xE3AE35ED

"The wisdom of a fool won't set you free"
--New Order, "Bizarre Love Triangle"
Anonymous
March 27, 2005 11:48:46 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

On Sat, 26 Mar 2005 10:48:55 -0800, Steve Sobol <sjsobol@JustThe.net>
wrote:

>Dan Albrich wrote:
>
>> CDMA carriers tend to offer a number of services that *only* work when on
>> the native system.
>> For this reason, it's not clear cut to choose Sprint. For example, when you
>> roam with Sprint
>> you will not be able to do data, and in some cases this means SMS text
>> messaging and even
>> simple features like voicemail waiting indication or caller ID are not
>> available.
>
>Same with Verizon.

Alltel (my provider) on Verizon maintains full, AFAIK, features. I
strongly suspect that Verizon on Alltel does also. Several associates
with Verizon have no problem in Alltel areas. I'm speaking here of
the NC/SC/VA/TN areas.

George
Anonymous
March 28, 2005 1:53:56 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

Yes, a few years ago Alltel and Verizon did a press release indicating their
efforts to have features be transparent including circuit switched data.
It's unclear to me if 1X data would work, but my understanding is that
circuit switched will.

Here in Oregon, there's no Alltel, and not going to be one soon (our
Cellular One is not related to Western Wireless).

Anyway, here in Oregon, Verizon loses almost all features when roaming on
available CDMA carriers even when roaming digitally-- which I consider
somewhat pathetic given that AT&T had seemless roaming here years ago even
with TDMA, and that has only improved with GSM (adds data roaming).

Our available CDMA partners are Ramcell, Sprint and US Cellular, none of
which enable your features when roaming. I mean even things like voice mail
waiting indicators do not work -- which seems like something very basic.

-Dan

--

=======================
Oregon and the Pacific Northwest
http://cell.uoregon.edu

--

"GeorgeB" <nospam@att.net> wrote in message
news:joad41lugrq64oca2ic3fvts1ta8roejgi@4ax.com...
> On Sat, 26 Mar 2005 10:48:55 -0800, Steve Sobol <sjsobol@JustThe.net>
> wrote:
>
>>Dan Albrich wrote:
>>
>>> CDMA carriers tend to offer a number of services that *only* work when
>>> on
>>> the native system.
>>> For this reason, it's not clear cut to choose Sprint. For example, when
>>> you
>>> roam with Sprint
>>> you will not be able to do data, and in some cases this means SMS text
>>> messaging and even
>>> simple features like voicemail waiting indication or caller ID are not
>>> available.
>>
>>Same with Verizon.
>
> Alltel (my provider) on Verizon maintains full, AFAIK, features. I
> strongly suspect that Verizon on Alltel does also. Several associates
> with Verizon have no problem in Alltel areas. I'm speaking here of
> the NC/SC/VA/TN areas.
>
> George
Anonymous
March 28, 2005 4:31:32 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

In news:Y7adnVjUUf1yBtrfRVn-ow@comcast.com,
Dan Albrich <dalbrich@uoregon.edui> typed:
> Yes, a few years ago Alltel and Verizon did a press release
> indicating their efforts to have features be transparent including
> circuit switched data. It's unclear to me if 1X data would work, but
> my understanding is that circuit switched will.
>
> Here in Oregon, there's no Alltel, and not going to be one soon (our
> Cellular One is not related to Western Wireless).
>
> Anyway, here in Oregon, Verizon loses almost all features when
> roaming on available CDMA carriers even when roaming digitally--
> which I consider somewhat pathetic given that AT&T had seemless
> roaming here years ago even with TDMA, and that has only improved
> with GSM (adds data roaming).
> Our available CDMA partners are Ramcell, Sprint and US Cellular, none
> of which enable your features when roaming. I mean even things like
> voice mail waiting indicators do not work -- which seems like
> something very basic.
> -Dan
>
> --
>
> =======================
> Oregon and the Pacific Northwest
> http://cell.uoregon.edu
>
>
Here in Kansas, VZW is mostly Extended Network on Alltel, and the only thing
that did not work the last time I tried was 1X data (#777,
1113335555@vzw3g.com, vzw), but circuit switched (#777, qnc, qnc) worked
just like when in a native VZW area.
Anonymous
March 28, 2005 10:55:41 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 21:53:56 -0800, "Dan Albrich"
<dalbrich@uoregon.edui> wrote:

>Here in Oregon, there's no Alltel, and not going to be one soon (our
>Cellular One is not related to Western Wireless).
>
>Anyway, here in Oregon, Verizon loses almost all features when roaming on
>available CDMA carriers even when roaming digitally-- which I consider
>somewhat pathetic given that AT&T had seemless roaming here years ago even
>with TDMA, and that has only improved with GSM (adds data roaming).
>
>Our available CDMA partners are Ramcell, Sprint and US Cellular, none of
>which enable your features when roaming. I mean even things like voice mail
>waiting indicators do not work -- which seems like something very basic.

My wife and I went to Ashland and Medford last summer; my Alltel phone
showed that if I hadn't had the Total Freedom plan, I would have been
roaming. Current maps look like the I-5 corridor is covered in the
National Freedom.

I BELIEVE that I had voice mail notification, but am not sure.
Anonymous
March 28, 2005 1:33:11 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

Dan Albrich Wrote:
> PS: Cingular and Verizon can offer a "Digital One Rate" or "Single-Rate"
> plan similar to Sprint's F&CA which even allows you to use 100% of your
> minutes roaming. This is, however, offered at an extreme price
> increase. Again, not the best value.
>
> Digital one Rate may or may not be currently available.
>
> SingleRate is currently available as a National Access plan...
AT&T Digital one rate is gone and National Single-Rate with Verizon for
new plans. People still on them are grandfathered in and get to stay on
them until they change plans or providers.
I would not call National Access as SingleRate since it is a data only
plan. It costs ¢25 to do a voice call and ¢69 if you do 1XRTT on a non
roaming partner.
Since Verizon has a network or a roaming partner in almost every market
of the US they decided to get rid of National Single Rate to save money
on higher roaming fees.


--
agentHibby
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Cell Phone Forums: http://cellphoneforums.net
View this thread: http://cellphoneforums.net/t170630.html
Anonymous
March 28, 2005 6:19:25 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

One possibility is that verizon is not paying them for those features.
Another is at least Sprint PCS and maybe the others as well are
running java instead of brew.
Anonymous
March 28, 2005 8:13:16 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

Jerome Zelinske wrote:
> One possibility is that verizon is not paying them for those
> features. Another is at least Sprint PCS and maybe the others as well
> are running java instead of brew.

Actually, Alltel and Verizon are the only two major carriers I know of that use
BREW. Cingular, T-Mobile, Nextel and Sprint all use Java.

--
JustThe.net - Apple Valley, CA - http://JustThe.net/ - 888.480.4NET (4638)
Steven J. Sobol, Geek In Charge / sjsobol@JustThe.net / PGP: 0xE3AE35ED

"The wisdom of a fool won't set you free"
--New Order, "Bizarre Love Triangle"
Anonymous
March 28, 2005 10:10:29 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

> I would not call National Access as SingleRate since it is a data only
> plan. It costs ¢25 to do a voice call and ¢69 if you do 1XRTT on a non
> roaming partner.
> Since Verizon has a network or a roaming partner in almost every market
> of the US they decided to get rid of National Single Rate to save money
> on higher roaming fees.

Oops- - I see you are right. SingleRate really is gone for new customers.

A while back there was a "National Access" plan that only included peak
minutes, and both data and voice usage came out of that bucket. While
expensive it seemed like the same thing as SingleRate, with the exception
that minutes could also be used for voice.

Anyway, it's a moot point now because that plan has been removed from
the website (maybe for some time). I just noticed.

Thanks for the update,

-Dan
Anonymous
March 29, 2005 7:52:11 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

> A while back there was a "National Access" plan that only included peak
> minutes, and both data and voice usage came out of that bucket. While
> expensive it seemed like the same thing as SingleRate, with the exception
> that minutes could also be used for voice.

I was on that plan when i first switched to Verizon - i paid $40 a month for
400 anytime minutes, no free nights or weekends were included in the plan,
although i think they occassionally had promos that tossed in a few free n&w
min. I could use the phone anywhere i had a signal and didn't have to worry
about roaming fees. When i realized 95% of the places i traveled (large
cities mostly) were covered by AC anyway, i switched to it to get the free
n&w minutes.

I think they got rid of it for new subscribers maybe a year ago?
Anonymous
March 30, 2005 8:02:09 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

On Mon, 28 Mar 2005 16:13:16 -0800, Steve Sobol <sjsobol@JustThe.net> chose
to add this to the great equation of life, the universe, and everything:

>Jerome Zelinske wrote:
>> One possibility is that verizon is not paying them for those
>> features. Another is at least Sprint PCS and maybe the others as well
>> are running java instead of brew.
>
>Actually, Alltel and Verizon are the only two major carriers I know of that use
>BREW. Cingular, T-Mobile, Nextel and Sprint all use Java.

USCC?

--
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http://home.att.net/~dwstreeter
Remove the naughty bit from my address to reply
Expect a train on ANY track at ANY time.
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Anonymous
March 30, 2005 8:02:10 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

David S wrote:
>>Actually, Alltel and Verizon are the only two major carriers I know of that use
>>BREW. Cingular, T-Mobile, Nextel and Sprint all use Java.
>
> USCC?

I don't know either way about USCC.



--
JustThe.net - Apple Valley, CA - http://JustThe.net/ - 888.480.4NET (4638)
Steven J. Sobol, Geek In Charge / sjsobol@JustThe.net / PGP: 0xE3AE35ED

"The wisdom of a fool won't set you free"
--New Order, "Bizarre Love Triangle"
Anonymous
April 27, 2005 10:14:59 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

In article <UpidnS2ruuqTJNXfRVn-iA@comcast.com>,
Dan Albrich <dalbrich@uoregon.edui> wrote:
>Oops- - I see you are right. SingleRate really is gone for new customers...


SingleRate isn't on the website, but it is still available for new customers
who ask for it.
!