new P4 northwood system plans

[Col_Kiwi]

I'm planning a new P4 system to build shortly. These are the parts I have chosen:

-ASUS P4S 333 mobo
-Intel P4 1.8A GHz (Northwood)
-single 512MB module of DDR333 memory (non-ECC)
-MSI GeForce 4 Ti 4400 (MS-8871)
-an old 28GB HDD i already have, for price reasons. i know this will perform slowly, i plan to replace it ASAP.
-56X CDROM, floppy, case w/350 watt PS.

My plan is to overclock the cpu to 122MHz FSB (488MHz QDR) to obtain a clock speed of 2196MHz. I'm going to put in one or two chassis fans (what would you reccomend on that?), plus a cool fan I have lying around that goes into a 5.25 inch bay, originally intended for hot hard drives.

To obtain 122MHz FSB, do i really need to replace the CPU cooler and use a better one then intel's, or will the chassis fans do the job? (I'd prefer not to replace the cpu cooler if possible)

As for voltage, how much if at all should I increase it?

Does anyone have any suggestions about the parts I chose?

One last question, how does the FSB overclock effect the RAM clock?

Many thanks in advance to anyone who can assist me with my questions.

-Col.Kiwi

 

[Stiffler]

I am afraid to say (don't want to tempt fate) but you are being very conservitive with your goals...

That chip should hit the 133 point -possibly beyond with the default HSF (which is very good from my experiance) as long as the case temp is not overly high and you have some ok airflow in there... it doesn't have to sound like a 747 taking off either !

I think all your parts are good choices although I am a RDRAM person and have been for the past 2 years on a few different systems, so I don't really know any more about DDR I am sure others will comment.

The hard drive is gonna be a hit, but keep it as a 2ndry storage device when you get a new one - 28gig of junk that won't fill up and clog your nice new drive.

The voltage increases should always be as small as possible... try booting without increases, if it fails or you get errors or instability increase the voltage by the smallest incriment you can... repeat this until your system is stable and will run as normal. It is likely you will need extra juice though... Just remember don't put too much on !

Tim

I can call you Betty, and Betty when you call me... You can call me Al

 

[camieabz]

I plan to take the same CPU to 133MHz on stock HSF. Just make sure you have a PSU which can cope with all the kit + the oc'ing.

<b><font color=blue>~ BIOS SETTINGS: Fast, Hot, Unstable...That ought to work. ~</font color=blue></b>

 

[Col_Kiwi]

Thanks guys for your input!

I had heard that a chip like that should be able to reach 133MHz FSB, or maybe even more if you go crazy on cooling, but I was originally planning conservatively.

I suppose going evenly to 133MHz would make the PCI and DRAM frequencies easier to handle. I suppose... (correct any of this if its wrong please)

Defaults:
FSB 100MHz (x18 = 1800MHz)
PCI set to ratio of 1:3, for 33MHz bus
DRAM set to ratio of 5:3, for 166MHz bus

Overclocked:
FSB of 133MHz (x18 = 2394 MHz)
PCI set to ratio 1:4, for bus of 33.25MHz (close enough..)
DRAM set to ratio 5:4, for bus of 166MHz

Do all those ratios exist and match correctly? Any further suggestions?

I'm thinking now of doing the 133MHz FSB (533MHz QDR, whee) to reach 2.4GHz, using the intel cpu cooler plus 1 added chassis fan and the fan i have in the front 5.25 inch bay.

camieabz, will a 350 watt PS (officially enough for a P4) be enough to handle all this?

Comments? Suggestions?


Thanks again.

-Col.Kiwi<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by Col_Kiwi on 08/08/02 12:16 PM.</EM></FONT></P>

 

[pr497]

I suppose going evenly to 133MHz would make the PCI and DRAM frequencies easier to handle. I suppose... (correct any of this if its wrong please)

Defaults:
FSB 100MHz (x18 = 1800MHz)
PCI set to ratio of 1:3, for 33MHz bus
DRAM set to ratio of 5:3, for 166MHz bus

Overclocked:
FSB of 133MHz (x18 = 2394 MHz)
PCI set to ratio 1:4, for bus of 33.25MHz (close enough..)
DRAM set to ratio 5:4, for bus of 166MHz

Do all those ratios exist and match correctly? Any further suggestions?

yes...going to 133 FSB would be a nice number...anyways...there might be one problem...the motherboard you're planning on getting (P4S333)...it doesnt lock the PCI/AGP freq....so when you overclock to 133 FSB...your PCI/AGP will be way out of specs...
solution:
get the "updated" P4S<font color=red><b>5</b></font color=red>33...its exactly the same as the P4S333 except that it has the slightly revised sis645DX chipset (P4S333 had the sis645...no DX) and support for 133 FSB...the P4S533 doesnt lock the PCI/AGP either but...when you hit 133 FSB...it will reset the PCI/AGP back to defaults (33/66 respectively)...so problem solved...
and 350w should be fine for your system...

<b>L <font color=red>A</font color=red> e <font color=red>T</font color=red> a <font color=red>I</font color=red> K</b>

 

[Col_Kiwi]

What do ya know, the computer store I got the price quotes from a few weeks ago has pulled the P4S333 from sale, and now has the P4S533 for $15 less!

That makes it nice and simple. I can get the P4S533 then set the FSB up to 133MHz in BIOS, ignore all the PCI ratios, set the RAM to DDR333, and I'm set. Mobo handles all the PCI stuff. Perfect. Right?

Thanks to all who helped.

-Col.Kiwi

 

[Crashman]

You're totally wrong. AT 133MHz FSB, PCI will get the 1/4 divider and run at stock spec. AGP gets 1/2 divider, dito.

<font color=blue>By now you're probably wishing you had asked more questions first!</font color=blue>

 

[Crashman]

What pr497 told you was wrong. Both boards will operate PCI/AGP at 33/66 with the 133MHz FSB. But the P4S533 is a nicer board because it overclocks further and offers more memory ratios, from what I'm told. It's a great board, a lot of people in here use it without problems, and it outperforms boards with the i845 chipset.

Don't get confused with the fractions, 33MHz is not ACTUAL speed, actual speed is 100/3 which is 33.333 continuous. Same with 133MHz, it's 100MHz + 100/3. And 66MHz is twice that.

So everything will work fine. Well over 90% of 1.8A processors hit 2400MHz at 1.65v core or less. And the rest of your system stays within spec.

<font color=blue>By now you're probably wishing you had asked more questions first!</font color=blue>

 

[pr497]

perhaps you're right...but i dont know...i can check if i reflash my P4S333 back to its original BIOS (im using the P4S533 BIOS right now)....but i dont want to deal with loosing the use of my mouse again (one of the curable symptoms of flashing the P4S333 with the P4S533 BIOS)...
lemme double check...

<b>L <font color=red>A</font color=red> e <font color=red>T</font color=red> a <font color=red>I</font color=red> K</b>

 

[pr497]

yea...you're right <b>Crashman</b>...there is a divider when FSB>=133 (1/4 to be exact)...i just did a search on <A HREF="http://www.asusboards.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=15865&perpage=15&pagenumber=7" target="_new">AsusBoards</A> and i found this:

bigtoe says:

<i>The p4s333 has the 1/4 pci divider at 133 so the bus will be bang on spec at 33.Trying to boot at this speed will not damage the hdd as the bus is at 33 but booting with a high pci bus may damage the hdd.
If you are unsure keep the fsb below 120 and all will be fine, but I would give it a go at 133 with the ven1 jumper and the vcore in bios set to 1.575 to give a true vcore of around 1.65v.Make sure the mem ratio is at 1:1 to begin with and set the timings to spd.</i>

anyways...my mistake... :frown:

<b>L <font color=red>A</font color=red> e <font color=red>T</font color=red> a <font color=red>I</font color=red> K</b>

EDIT: wrong link...<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by pr497 on 08/08/02 06:32 PM.</EM></FONT></P>

 

[Col_Kiwi]

Well, I do know now that the P4S333 would have worked too, but the P4S533 is available cheaper, so why not get the newer one.

One other question, I checked with the store, and the brands of memory they stock are Samsung, Infineon (spelling?), and Micron. Which is the best quality for theorhetical overclocking and stability?

-Col.Kiwi

 

[pr497]

One other question, I checked with the store, and the brands of memory they stock are Samsung, Infineon (spelling?), and Micron. Which is the best quality for theorhetical overclocking and stability?

i hear samsung ram has been working very nicely with the P4S333/533...but the later versions of samsung pc2700 (mainly...the one with "DTL" in the model number) hasnt been overclocking well...the ones with "CTL" seem to be the better overclockers though...so...if you do go with samsung...make sure "CTL" is included in the model number...

<b>L <font color=red>A</font color=red> e <font color=red>T</font color=red> a <font color=red>I</font color=red> K</b>

 

[Col_Kiwi]

Okay. Also, will the usage of a single 512MB module cause compatibility problems? The ASUS website's manual for the P4S533 has a list of qualified memory modules, including samsung, but only lists 128 and 256MB modules... but not being able to use a 512MB module seems rediculous since the motherboard allows up to 1024MB per DIMM...

-Col.Kiwi

 

[Col_Kiwi]

another question I didn't think of until right now, in the quote that was made, it mentioned stuff about jumpers..

I was under the impression that simply changing the FSB in BIOS to 133MHz and setting RAM speed in BIOS would be sufficient.. do I actually need to change jumper settings as well?

-Col.Kiwi

 

[Crashman]

I recommend the P4S533 anyway. As far as memory goes, I'd go with the one that has the best spec (smallest Cas Latency, fewest ns cycle time)

<font color=blue>By now you're probably wishing you had asked more questions first!</font color=blue>