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Spire FalconRock 2 retailer

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March 14, 2003 8:07:24 PM

I've decided, finally, on the FalconRock 2 but I can't seem to find anyone who sells it.

Does anyone know where I can get it? (Preferably UK retailer)
March 14, 2003 8:10:55 PM

Look for the same thing, with a different model number under the Speeze name. Same company... US and international divisions... both owned by Fanner Tech.





--->It ain't better if it don't work<---
March 14, 2003 11:48:19 PM

The Falcon Rock II also goes under the name Speeze RaptorCool 1.

I couldn't find either in the USA. I decided to go with the GlacialTech Igloo 2500.

Good luck!

Link
<A HREF="http://www.speeze.com" target="_new">www.speeze.com&lt;/A>

<b>99% is great, unless you are talking about system stability</b><P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by phsstpok on 03/14/03 08:52 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
Related resources
March 14, 2003 11:57:03 PM

p.s.

<A HREF="http://www.speeze.com/products/fcc.asp?ProdID=84" target="_new">Speeze RaptorCool 1</A>

Branch office U.K
16 Quay Lane Ind Estate
PO 12 4LJ Hampshire
United Kingdom
Tel.: +44-239-2581111
Fax: +44-239-2581441
E-mail: uk@speeze.com

<b>99% is great, unless you are talking about system stability</b>
March 15, 2003 2:23:32 AM

Have you tried the part number on places like Price Watch and EBay?

Few, if any, vendors that I know of use the product names, all work from the part number...5F273B1L3



--->It ain't better if it don't work<---
March 15, 2003 2:31:12 AM

I did...zip...

<b>99% is great, unless you are talking about system stability</b>
March 15, 2003 2:57:00 AM

Bummer... Tried any international dealers to see if they will mail it to you?

For that matter, write to Spire and ask for their nearest distributor, contact them and explain your wishes... you might be surprised.



--->It ain't better if it don't work<---
March 15, 2003 3:22:19 AM

No I didn't. I emailed Newegg.com who sells other Speeze coolers but I didn't get a response. SVOL volunteered to ship it from europe but in the end I decided to go with the GlacialTech Igloo 2500.

<b>99% is great, unless you are talking about system stability</b>
March 15, 2003 2:03:17 PM

I can send you one from The Netherlands. €15,- exclusive shipping.

My dual-PSU PC is so powerfull that the neighbourhood dims when I turn it on :eek: 
March 15, 2003 2:19:49 PM

I looked at Glacial's website... that's an all copper cooler. Looks well enough made, nice straightforward design, etc. Probably an OK choice.

But keep in mind Copper's tendency to acquire heat better than it releases it. Despite the low thermal resistence it does tend to keep a CPU warmer. Aluminum doesn't acquire heat as well as copper but it releases it far better than copper does. Combine them, copper bottom aluminum fins and you get a winning combination. Which is why I've been recommending hybrids of late.

Unfortnately Glacial doesn't give much information for us to go on... no thermal resistence specs, not even photos of the bottoms... so we really can't be sure what we are buying.



--->It ain't better if it don't work<---
March 15, 2003 3:33:52 PM

I pretty much based my decision on one review, this one,

<A HREF="http://www.digit-life.com/articles2/cooling-systems/soc..." target="_new">http://www.digit-life.com/articles2/cooling-systems/soc...;/A>

I would prefer a review at Dansdata.com because he tests with a die simulator under more controlled conditions but the Igloo 2500 seems be efficient and takes a 70mm fan. This is good because I already have a couple of 70mm fans to play with.

80mm HSF's are probably better for my application but they won't fit my present motherboard.

<b>99% is great, unless you are talking about system stability</b>
March 15, 2003 5:50:22 PM

In all respect, most of these reviews are crap...

Think of the position the reviewer is in. He begs samples from a dozen sources, gathers them together, does some testing... but now he's got a problem. If he comes out with the truth about some of these coolers he's never going to see a free sample again, even if the model he pans is replaced by a praise worthy design. When's the last time you read a review that said "This cooler is crap"?

Moreover, when you ask others you will constantly be advised to buy the products they own. Look at the other boards here, see all the people having trouble with the A7n8X motherboards... half of the motherboards forum is occupied with that board and people aren't bragging! Still people continue promoting that board saying how nifty it's features are. It's a natural thing to not want to tell people "I got suckered into buying one of those, it's garbage, and now I'm stuck with it", because it boils down to admitting you made a buying mistake. Pride cancels truth.

Think about it...

Glacial Tech does not publish specifications for their coolers: Why?

I will confess that I've never used Glacial Tech coolers. I probably won't given that I have no valid basis upon which to compare them to other coolers... no Thermal Resistence information, no information about construction, etc. Just a nice little PDF page that is 1/4 picture 2/3 installation instructions and a little panel with the measurements. Heck, they gave more space to certification trademarks than the specifications of the cooler itself. It may be a good product, but I won't even bother with them if I can't get the engineering specs to work with.

By way of explaining my positions on these things...

I build systems for a living and I charge a pretty price for them too! I provide my customers with computers that should never need service during the 3 year extended warranty (free service) period included with all my systems. I also visit all my customers twice a year and clean the machines, check voltages, etc. and I talk to my customers to see if there are any problems. Needless to say, this would kill your average computer store where their success is based on price not quality. Quality is important, these systems have to keep going or I will be service called into bankruptcy. I test everything before I put it on my products list and I am very careful to remove anything that gives people more than the expected trouble. That's why you can't buy an A7N8X motherboard from me... they're crap!

I advise the hybrid coolers because I've tested aluminum and copper and to the best of my ability to tell, the hybrids do work best.

Of course your buying decisions are your own, unfortunately we are all limited by availability. No matter how good something is, it's useless to you if you can't get one. All I am saying is that you should keep in mind where the buying advice is coming from. Does your advisor (i.e. the reviewer) have cause to hedge his bets? Does your advisor (i.e. the user) have his pride to protect?

I strongly advise you not to take these reviews on faith.




--->It ain't better if it don't work<---
March 15, 2003 6:30:35 PM

Quote:
Think of the position the reviewer is in. He begs samples from a dozen sources, gathers them together, does some testing... but now he's got a problem. If he comes out with the truth about some of these coolers he's never going to see a free sample again, even if the model he pans is replaced by a praise worthy design. When's the last time you read a review that said "This cooler is crap"?

This is exactly why I like <A HREF="http://www.dansdata.com/coolercomp_p3.htm#v5" target="_new">Dansdata.com's cooler comparison</A>. Dan tells it the way he sees it. For example some excerpts from one cooler review,

<i><font color=purple>But the result of all the sound and fury was a score of... 0.73°C/W.
.
.
.
Here, it would appear, is another product that looks great but doesn't work. Who knows how these things make it to market.
.
.
.
As it stands, this thing's a white elephant. Don't buy one, and question the motives of anyone who gives you one as a gift.</i></font color=purple>

Yes, he does accept freebies but his terms are basically if he doesn't like the product it will be hammered in his review. He does this often.

As for not getting donated products from disgruntled manufacturers, no problem, he has plenty of friends in Australia that bring him products to review, often just to get the word out on how bad the products are.

His site is devoid of manufacturer advertising.

Unfortunately, he hasn't gotten around to reviewing the Igloo 2500.


<b>99% is great, unless you are talking about system stability</b>
March 15, 2003 8:42:09 PM

Ok, I going to email Spire/Speeze see where I can get one.
If not the A7N8X which mobo do you recommend.
I want to use my new system for gaming, 3d drawing and dvd playing plus normal apps.
March 15, 2003 9:11:07 PM

First let me say that if my earlier responce came on a bit strong, I apologize. I'm having a really bad day here.

Spire isn't the only company making hybrids. There are quite a few others, Thermaltake's Volcano 7 is a good example. It's not necessarily the brand and model I'm hawking... it's the idea. I have used Thermaltake's Volcano 7 with good results and I've used others when supply problems demanded. The thing you want is copper bottom, aluminum fins, thermal resistence under .6 I don't think the brand is all that important so long as you stay away with the well proven fan-on-fins design.

I really don't get why Spire (Speeze, Cidicom, Fanner or whatever their name is this week) isn't marketing in the US. They have a good product at a good price... it doesn't make much sense, does it?

Motherboard wise, MSI has an Nforce2 board that seems to have licked some of the A7n8X problems. I haven't tested one yet so I won't say if it's better or worse. Also take a look at the Gigabyte line, they're a little less expensive than ASUS, they aren't red hot performers but they are generally very stable and easy to set up. I use them a lot and haven't run into any real problems. Got a dead one about a month ago but my supplier replaced it no questions asked.

Hope this helps...

--->It ain't better if it don't work<---
March 15, 2003 9:13:09 PM

Kewl! Got a link to Dan's homepage?



--->It ain't better if it don't work<---
March 15, 2003 10:08:16 PM

Sorry, didn't think it was necessary.

The "back to Dan's homepage" link at the page to which I did provide a link would have put you there.

<b>For Dan's homepage, DANSDATA.COM, please click link below.</b>

<font color=green>Right here >>> <b><A HREF="http://www.dansdata.com" target="_new">www.dansdata.com&lt;/A></b> <<< Don't miss it! </font color=green>










<font color=purple>^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^</font color=purple>
<font color=red><b> You went past it! </b></font color=red>

<b>99% is great, unless you are talking about system stability</b>
March 15, 2003 10:21:43 PM

You're right. GlacialTech does need more specs.

Although the product page has the caption, "copper bottom", under the picture of the Igloo 2500, this information should have been in the specification page. If I had read the comments of the Digit-Life Igloo 2500 review more carefully I would have learned that IT IS indeed a copper/aluminum hybrid HSF. (Reviews may be biased but they often contain useful information as well).

I was wondering about the 280 gram weight. It sounded low for what I assummed was an all copper heatsink. [I wonder why a manufacturer would giver an aluminum heatsink a copper color]. Since they have a gold plated heatsink as well I won't dwell on the thought.

Oh well, I'll know how the Igloo 2500 does when it gets here.

Incidentally, I don't usually take reviews on faith, although I admit reviews often point me in a direction.

In the end though, we as consumers, don't have the advantage of seeing all products in action for ourselves. We have to believe someone.

So I read reviews. I read what other people say. I especially pay attention to negative comments. I try not to be overly swayed by positive comments. I do pay attention to the amount of praises vs complaints. Sometimes, all the information leads me to something that I can't or can't obtain, in which case I have to chose an alternate. Sometimes I just chose something because I want it.

This time I chose something, the Igloo 2500, because (pretty much in the order given) 1) My top choice, the Spire Falconrock II, won't fit my motherboard and it's not readily available in my country. 2) My next best choices are too heavy. I won't put a 500+ gram heatsink in my system. 3)The Igloo 2500 is a 70mm heatsink and I have 70mm fans with which I can experiment. 4) It's pretty cheap, $15 USD. 5)The included fan is quiet. 6) I admit it! The one review that I could find claims high efficiency and has me curious about the product. 7) I'm presently using an all-aluminum heatsink on a highly overclocked CPU. I would prefer an all copper or copper bottomed heatsink. I would prefer this simply because AMD recommends it and because I fully believe it can't hurt (not because I have seen proof that copper bottomed is better). Call it, "insurance".

By the way,
Quote:
In all respect, most of these reviews are crap...

That blanket statement is very biased on it's own. I seriously doubt that you have read the majority of all review sites, never mind having researched and disproved (or confirmed) the veracity of each one.

You lose one respect point for your statement.


<b>99% is great, unless you are talking about system stability</b>
March 15, 2003 11:00:44 PM

Well, actually it says "copper based" with an all copper coloured cooler.

The review you pointed me to says it's a hybrid... now I'm wondering why the copper colour on top? Does it interfere with or assist cooling?

Hmmmmm.... Now I'm completely confused about this thing.

As for me reading review sites, you bet I read quite a few of them... Tom's has become the main one but I try not to miss the major articles on others. It's my job to keep up to date on the best gear...




--->It ain't better if it don't work<---
March 15, 2003 11:44:05 PM

Quote:
Well, actually it says "copper based"

LOL! So it does but wouldn't "copper base" be clearer than "copper based". You could interpret the latter as meaning the heatsink is based on copper metal (which is what I did).

They have a gold plated heatsink as well. I don't think anyone is going assume it's based on gold.

I thought I read somewhere that electroplating does not significantly affect cooling efficiency. Not sure much extensive testing has been done on this, though.

<b>99% is great, unless you are talking about system stability</b>
March 16, 2003 12:35:50 AM

Well, it does leave me wondering if they aren't trying to window-dress a mediocre product...



--->It ain't better if it don't work<---
March 16, 2003 12:45:55 AM

Quote:
Well, it does leave me wondering if they aren't trying to window-dress a mediocre product...

I thought of that. That's partly why I mentioned it.

Nothing I can do about it. It's already been shipped.

I'll know soon and then you will too.

<b>99% is great, unless you are talking about system stability</b>
March 16, 2003 1:46:53 AM

Sounds good.. also, can you let me know if there's more information in the package than on the website?



--->It ain't better if it don't work<---
March 16, 2003 9:10:04 PM

Will do.

<b>99% is great, unless you are talking about system stability</b>
March 19, 2003 8:28:32 PM

No specs. What you saw in the PDF was exactly what's in the packaging.

The heatsink works really well but I can't recommend it because of a huge problem.

The clip uses far too much tension. There is absolutely no give in the clip. Instead of a bent piece of metal it is contructed like a "U" beam. Once one end is fastened the clip does not bend enough to fast the other end. It comes up about 3 mm short when putting a lot of force on it.

I gave up trying to fasten it. I took the clip out of heatsink and used my mini roto tool to grind down the fulcrum a few of hairs. Now I can fasten the heatsink fairly easily.

Too bad because it works well.



<b>99% is great, unless you are talking about system stability</b><P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by phsstpok on 03/19/03 05:37 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
!