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T-Bred 'B' works, but not T-Bred 'A'?

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June 3, 2003 9:38:11 AM

O.K. I'll get you in the know first.

I got an A-Bit KG7-RAID (yeah I know, shut-up :p ) and was happy with it because now I have DDR RAM. I overclocked my T-Bred 'B' 1800 that I stole from the KT7E I have in the closet now. Everything is hunky dory. Then I decide, ah what the heck, I can't push this T-Bred 'B' high enough (it only goes to 1776 on 1.85 volts), time to get a better processor that I can garentee 1800 MHz or more. So I E-Bay an XP2200 T-Bred. It turns out to be a T-Bred 'A', but who really cares? I just wanted 1800 MHz or better. I got it cheap anyways (55 bucks).

Now for the problem:

When I try to get the chip to work with multipliers higher than 12.5 (5th L3 bridge cut is stock anyways) it wont post. If I paint the bridge, it posts fine and I can use all the multipliers below 13. Well that doesn't help me much, I want the high multipliers. NOTHING I do allows for high multipliers. So I repaint my T-Bred 'B' 1800 to have the high multipliers, it posts fine and dandy. But of course that doesn't let me go above 1800 MHz, the CPU is too lame.

Any suggestions on getting this T-Bred 'A' to work with higher multipliers? (if it involves the basic cutting and painting of the L3 bridges, I've done it, unless there is a work around that involve another trick)

What are we going to do tonight Brain?
The same thing we do every night Pinky; <b>Try to take over the world!</b>

More about : bred works bred

June 3, 2003 10:58:41 AM

Have you tried installing the latest BIOS?

My CPU fan spins so fast that it creates a wormhole :eek: 
June 3, 2003 3:13:45 PM

Apparently KG7 will only work with up to XP2100+ in stock trim. You need a factory rework to go higher.

Found this post in the Abit NG.

<i>Message 1 in thread
From: cdm (cmustl2@direcway.com)
Subject: kg7 and xp2200 and RMA fix


View this article only
Newsgroups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.abit
Date: 2002-08-29 15:22:21 PST


Ok i emailed Abit on this and this is what they emailed me back
surprizingly:

Dear Customer,

Sorry, KG7 can only support XP up to 2100+. A rework service is require for
KG7 to work with XP 2200+. For the rework service, please fill out the RMA
form online at www.abitusa-rma.com. I believe they charge $25 for the
rework service.

Thank you.

Regards

Has anyone sent there boards in? and does it fix the problem with Xp2200?</i>

<b>56K, slow and steady does not win the race on internet!</b>
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June 3, 2003 8:16:59 PM

Then why does my T-Bred 'B' 1800, when setup as an AXP 2200 work fine? My point is, what is the difference between the T-Bred 'B' and the 'A' so that only one works with higher multipliers? His problem is different than mine as I have repainted the XP2200 as a 2400 and it does not work. I repainted the 1800 as a 2400 and it does work. So it isn't an issue on the processor, unless they built the 2200 different from the rest, instead of just bridge configuration.

What are we going to do tonight Brain?
The same thing we do every night Pinky; <b>Try to take over the world!</b>
June 3, 2003 11:54:10 PM

All I can say is that the reply appeared to contain a quote from Abit tech support. I don't know any details beyond what was stated.

Getting a Tbred A to run at 2000 Mhz (XP2400+) could be tricky. You might need increase the default voltage on the chip. Don't really know.

<b>56K, slow and steady does not win the race on internet!</b>
June 4, 2003 7:25:00 AM

I set it to default 1.85 volts via thew L11 bridge, which it does. I can't get it to run at stock XP2200 speeds either. Actually, right now it is at xp2200 speed (a little more) on pure FSB overclocking.

What are we going to do tonight Brain?
The same thing we do every night Pinky; <b>Try to take over the world!</b>
June 4, 2003 3:15:16 PM

I found some more info. Someone at the same NG suggests slew rate settings of 6 05 06 for XP2400+ I have no idea what this means on a PC. To me slew rate means how quickly current can ramp up.

<b>56K, slow and steady does not win the race on internet!</b>
June 4, 2003 8:19:54 PM

Looking at your problem I have some more ideas but I need to be clear on what you have obtained so far.

Have you tested the new XP2200+ at 100 Mhz FSB. Do the high multipliers work with this bus setting? Can you run at 16x, 16.5x, 17x, 18x, 19x, 20x?

If the above work then you are probably running into POST timing issues at FSB speeds 133 Mhz and higher.

Read about the workarounds at this link. Especially KF traced the Red Circuit.

<A HREF="http://www.beachlink.com/candjac/Workarounds.htm" target="_new">http://www.beachlink.com/candjac/Workarounds.htm&lt;/A>

The issue is some legacy boards have timing issues with high mulitipliers below 15x, meaning 13x, 13.5x, 14x, and 14.5x. These multipliers usually do not work on legacy boards (hence the need for the workarounds) unless the processor is locked, meaning the L1 bridges are cut.

At 15x you can run into a different problem. This is overclocking headroom. At 15 x 133 Mhz you are at 2000 Mhz. If your CPU isn't capable of this then you're stuck in a jam because of the timining issues above and the overclocking headroom then nothing would work, not 13x-14.5x and not 15x and certainly not higher. [<-edited for clarity]

I came close to this problem with my KT133A mobo. 13x-14.5x not available for above reasons. 16x and higher would be too much of an overclock for my CPU [<- Edited for typos]. I was lucky and 15x worked with my Tbred B XP1700+ because it can overclock to 2000 Mhz.

I've seen lots of confirmation (in print, not personally) of these problems with VIA mobos. I've not seen it confirmed for mobos with an AMD chipset such as your KG7. However, you might want to investiate this.

If you still have your XP2200+ mod'd to be an XP2400+ then you can try the same mod I used. Connect pin AL25 (4X bit) to pin AM26 (Vcc). You can solder, use the painting trick, or one of the wire tricks to do this. I used a fine wire strand to connect the holes on the CPU socket.

Anyway the result of the mod will give you access (hopefully) to 13x (11x in BIOS), 13.5x (11.5x in BIOS), and 14x (12x in BIOS). You also get 21x but this is only useful at 100 Mhz FSB.

You lose all other remappings but you can still get decent range from these, 13 x 133 = 1733 Mhz up to 14 x 150 = 2100 Mhz (your results may vary, depends on how high your FSB will go)

<b>56K, slow and steady does not win the race on internet!</b><P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by phsstpok on 06/04/03 04:28 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
June 4, 2003 9:37:05 PM

Cool, very nice post.

I will have to try the wire trick (for 13x, 13.5x and 14x). I haven't got this CPU to post above the 1X-13X standard multipliers, so I'm limited to the 13X. I'm still not quite sure why the 1800 T-Bred 'B' will, but not this T-Bred 'A'.

Thanks again, you also helped me with my KT7E and the T-Bred 'B' that I have now.

What are we going to do tonight Brain?
The same thing we do every night Pinky; <b>Try to take over the world!</b>
June 4, 2003 10:29:40 PM

I remember helping you but I didn't realize your XP1700+ was stuck below 1800 Mhz. Your KT7E probably has all the problems I mentioned.

Quote:
I'm limited to the 13X. I'm still not quite sure why the 1800 T-Bred 'B' will, but not this T-Bred 'A'.


That's another thing that has me confused. Are you saying you've been able to get 13x and higher on your KG7 with the Tbred B but not the Tbred A, including 13x, 13.5x, 14x?

Getting 13x-14x to work is the tricky part. I would not think you could get this with either chip.


<b>56K, slow and steady does not win the race on internet!</b>
June 4, 2003 11:01:29 PM

Yes, my t-bred 'B' 1800+ works fine. I can get it to all the multipliers I want, except 13.5, 14 and 14.5, but I think I could if I would just re-mod it to do that (as it was modded to do so previously).

I can't get the T-Bred 'A' to do any of that, it will only work on multipliers below 13X. When I have it set to 13x100, it posts at 1248 MHz, so it doesn't even do the full 13.

If my XP1800 would overclock more, I would stick with it, but it wasn't going high enough for me, so I got this XP2200 T-Bred 'A', which wont do anything good.

What are we going to do tonight Brain?
The same thing we do every night Pinky; <b>Try to take over the world!</b><P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by Skligmund on 06/04/03 07:04 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
June 4, 2003 11:16:33 PM

After doing some modding, including some from above, and some I came up with, I'm gonna leave it here.

The problem with here is: 1833 MHz (only because I can't go any higher than 147 with the FSB).
The other problem/weirdness with here is: According to my bios and Window Properties, I have an AMD Athlon 4 Mobile in my computer.....

I think that is funny, so I'm gonna leave it here. I couldn't get the higher multipliers to work though.

What are we going to do tonight Brain?
The same thing we do every night Pinky; <b>Try to take over the world!</b>
June 5, 2003 2:06:56 PM

You have a Mobile XP?

Guess you won't do much overclocking with that.

What's the default voltage on that processor?

Have you tried playing with low voltage configurations, not for overclocking but to run a cool and nearly silent PC.



<b>56K, slow and steady does not win the race on internet!</b>
June 5, 2003 2:29:16 PM

I'm wondering if mobile Athlons only have low multipliers.

Well, as a last test, you could do a full manual multiplier mod.

You can use the wire trick to set all five multiplier bits. Connect each pin as desired. This overides BIOS and chip multipliers.

Connect each bit pin to a Vss pin (Ground) if you want to pull the bit LO (similar to painting the bridge) or to Vcc (VCore) if you want to pull it HI.

The multiplier combinations are the same as L3 bridges. Remember a cut bridge equals bit HI and a connected bridge is bit LO.

<b>56K, slow and steady does not win the race on internet!</b>

[edited for typos]
<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by phsstpok on 06/05/03 10:34 AM.</EM></FONT></P>
June 6, 2003 6:06:09 PM

No, I don't have a mobil XP. :p  My bios just THINKS I do. So does winblows. But I don't. :D 

I think I read in that link something about multipliers reserved for mobile XP's, and mine must be set to one.

I think I'll just run it as is, and stick it in my old KT7E when I built it for my dad, as it seems to handle faster processors better.

What are we going to do tonight Brain?
The same thing we do every night Pinky; <b>Try to take over the world!</b>
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