CPU cooling troubles

[jon_west_uk]

I have posted recently asking what i should do about my aquarius II cooling system not cooling my CPU properly (<A HREF="http://forumz.tomshardware.com/hardware/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&p=671796#671796" target="_new">See post and my system spec </A>).

As LtBlue recommended and after a bit of research i bought the Thermalright SLK-947U and vantec Stealth 92mm fan.

However, i installed it last night (after polishing my cpu etc) with as little arctic silver 3 thermal compound as i could get away with, whilst still leaving the surfaces covered and smooth but i am still getting idle temps of 38 - 40 in a 25 degree room!

So my question is what is going on?

My questions:

I have plugged the fan into the cpu fan slot. Is this wrong? as i am only getting fan speeds of 1500rpm.

I have turned smart fan off on the bios (not that it made any difference) is there somewhere else i need to go to turn the fan speed up?

I am assuming that the thermal compound has been applied properly. Arctic silver 3 - put a little on both surfaces and rubbed it in with lint free cloth until the surface looked clean again (to fill cavities). Then i applied a little bit onto cpu and used a credit card to gently spread the material over the whole surface. Added little amounts until the whole surface has a smooth very very thin layer of compound. I then did the same for the heatsink. I then carefully aligned the heatsink over the cpu before putting it onto the cpu and fastening with the sprung screws (which i did up reasonably tight). IS THIS CORRECT?

The case has 7 fans. Front 2 blowing towards the back, rear blowing out of the case, top blowing out of the case and side blowing onto the cpu and graphics card so i dont think that the case is getting too hot + the temps are the same even with the side panel off!

So what the hell is going on and how should i proceed? My gut feeling is that the MB is not providing enough power to the fan and thus the fan is not running at full capacity and thus not cooling the system properly! - oh and in case you are wondering if it is a Power supply issue i have a Enermax 550watt EG651P-VE which should have more than enough juice for my needs!

Please please help me. My CPU got up to 62 degrees running 3 instances of internet explorer which is not funny at all!

Thanks for you help

Jon

Someone please unwire me...the gadgets are taking over!

 

[LtBlue14]

your TIM (thermal interface material) application was correct, except that there's no reason to put a thin layer on the heatsink the 2nd time. that shouldn't be your problem though, it should really only cause a minor increase in temps. 62C while running 3 instances of IE is a mystery to me...it really sounds like the HSF is just not mounted properly, or the retention clips are not putting enough pressure or even pressure on the cpu.
How long does it take for the cpu to reach 60C or so, from 40C idle? Is it a matter of seconds? because if so, it sounds like the problem is what I described above.
If it takes 5-10 minutes for the temperature to rise that high, then the vantec stealth may not be powerful enough. What are your case fans? They're probably 80mm, and if they're adjustable, try putting one of them on maximum power over the heatsink, and see how that affects temps.

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[jon_west_uk]

Thanks for your reply. I am happy that my Heat sink is mounted properly as i spent a lot of time ensuring that the contact was perfect. Also when i removed it the last time and looked at the bottom you could see that the pressure on the thermal compound was completely even. I also noted that a tiny amount of the thermal material had been squeezed out of the sides.

My problem is therefore the fan speed! Tonight i will try plugging the fan into one of the power sockets that come directly from the psu to see what happens.

thanks for your suggestion. If anyone reading this knows of a reason for a 8knxp mb to reduce fan speed please let me know!

Jon

Someone please unwire me...the gadgets are taking over!

 

[Guest]

Plugging fans into external (to the motherboard) receptacles is always a good idea. Less power through the PCB means less heat build up within it. This is not to mention that often the power traces/connectors that motherboard manufacturers use are severely undersized for high power fan applications.

 

[LtBlue14]

I'm still curious about how fast your temperatures jump

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[jon_west_uk]

Thanks for your interest. It is really helpful to have someone who is actually interested in fixing my problem!

Just to update you. I have now attached my cpu fan to the main power supply and this has dropped my idle temp down to 37-38 (from motherboard) or 35-36 (from heat sensor under the cpu), which is much better! However, if i run complex graphics packages my cpu temp still rises to over 60 celcius so my problem still exists!

You asked how quickly my temps rise, i would say that they rise approximately 0.75 degrees every second so in my humble opinion the rise is relatively slow. I am guessing that this would mean my heatsink is okay??

What are my options now? Should i just ignore the fact that my system seems to run hot, buy a large capacity fan like a Vantec tornado and rock on or should i investigate the two problems (1 the mb with a lack of power, 2 the cpu that runs hot?)

It has been suggested to me that the cause of all my problems could be that i have a faulty CPU. Is it possible that this is correct?

What would be your recommendations?

Thank you for all your help on this, It really is appreciatted.

Jon

Someone please unwire me...the gadgets are taking over!

 

[LtBlue14]

not gonna be a faulty cpu

it still sounds like the heatsink is not seated properly, i don't know what to tell you. It's been a while since I was aircooled, but temps rising 20C in less than 30 seconds is not normal no matter WHAT the cooling, and especially not with an SLK-947U.

Are you mounting with the 4 motherboard holes, or on the plastic mounting bracket provided with the motherboard? The more stable, and hopefully a more even-pressured method is with the motherboard holes. Also, was there a thin piece of plastic on the bottom of the heatsink that you may have forgotten to remove?

You can go ahead and buy a tornado, but I don't think airflow is the problem here. Try it to be sure, if you like.

The power supply isn't the culprit either

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[jon_west_uk]

I really dont know. I am fairly positive that the heatsink is ok. The plastic from the bottom of the heatsink has been removed and so has the plastic mounting bracket from the motherboard.

I am not sure that it necessarily is a heatsink mounting problem as the heatink temp seems to rise at the same time (i judge this with my finger! The same also happened with the watercooling which really suprised me as if i had let the temp continue to rise the water temp would have reached boiling before my kettle!

I am going to take the pc down the road to a PC repair shop to see what they say but i my gut feeling is that there will be nothing that they can do.

I am also sure that i am getting accuruate temp readings as i am using two different systems to measure the temp. - just a thought...having my thermaltake temperature sensor underneath the chip wouldnt be part of the trouble would it? Where is the mb temp sensor usually? could it be that the temp sensor is touching both the chip and the mb temp sensor thus conducting the heat (it is wrapped in plastic so it would only conduct heat!) making the temp readings seem higher. If the mb sensor is usually under chip then i assume that there would usually be a small gap of air between it and the chip thus reducing all of the temps slighty. I would therefor read 60 when everyone else would only get 50, it would also explain why my temps rise so quickly as the senosors would be much more sensitive to any cpu temp change - i dont know just a thought! Is it worth taking the pc apart again to check this or am i talking rubbish! If I do take it apart i will attach the thermaltake heat probe to the side of the heatsink so that i can monitor the difference in cpu and heatsink temp!

thanks

Jon




Someone please unwire me...the gadgets are taking over!

 

[LtBlue14]

How did you mount the sensor under the CPU? Did you cut a line through the socket so the wire could get under there? I've seen that done before...
Just making sure THAT'S not your problem

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[jon_west_uk]

I followed the instructions given by thermaltake.

Basically, the wires to the heat probe are so small that you can feed them between the legs of the cpu. You then use a piece of adhesive to attach the sensor under the chip. In order to get the probe to fit though the probe has to be folded so that it will fit.

So what do you think. Time to get shot of the sensor? Could this be the cause of my increase in temp? Didnt think that this would matter that much as it is underneath the cpu.

Jon

Someone please unwire me...the gadgets are taking over!

 

[LtBlue14]

the only thing the sensor could do is screw up the mounting mechanism some, not sure if it actually is though. It's something to try. Did you take your comp to the computer store yet?

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[jon_west_uk]

I cant take it to the store until next week as i use it for my job and need it to do some video editing. The temps whilst running adobe premier are only 40 so i can do that quite happily but i will have to do all the rendering in the office!

I have also just set up my old aquarius cooling system on my old system (amd 1.2ghz) and that is running ice cold. This says to me that my troubles have nothing to do with the way i mounted the cpu. Anyway i shall remove the thermal probe from under the cpu over the weekend (i cant face doing it again too soon as it will be the 5th time this week!) This had better be one of the last times as i am fast running out of arctic silver!

Just thought that i would mention that I find it very difficult to get the heatsink off the cpu when once the screws are undone. The seal onto the cpu is really tight. I dont want to slide the heatsink off as i am worried i might leave tiny scratched on the heatsink. Is this a common thing?

Jon

Someone please unwire me...the gadgets are taking over!

 

[HardWareBoss]

Room temp 25 whats that in F?

 

[jon_west_uk]

25c = 77F (Room temp)
37c = 99F (idle temp)
60c = 140 (full capacity temp) i close it down when it get this hot.

Do you have any clue what is happening?

Someone please unwire me...the gadgets are taking over!

 

[LtBlue14]

It's really weird that your 1.2ghz is now running ice cold with that wc system. I really have no idea any more.

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[jon_west_uk]

I'll let you know what happens after i remove my temperature probe.

So there is no possibility of it being a faulty CPU? One of the IT guys at work said it might be a possibility. I dont trust him however as the firm is over 5000 people and they still run windows nt and office 97 :-0 on prehistoric pc's. It is quite amusing really cause they are just upgrading to XP and they forgot - until i pointed it out - that they would need servers with a bit more grunt than the 4 yr old machines they have currently to push the network round to all 5000 employees in 26 offices worldwide!!!!

But then they are the experts!!!

Someone please unwire me...the gadgets are taking over!

 

[LtBlue14]

loll

well, the only way i can see it being a "faulty cpu" is if the IHS (integrated heat spreader, the metal thing that you see on top of the chip) is not making good contact with the core, or if it's not as flat (or isn't flexing to become flat) as it should be. Either of those could cause a problem - but neither is likely. If you could mount the chip in another system with that system's cooler, then you could be sure it wasn't the chip...but you probably don't have access to a system like that. The computer store you're talking about would, though...

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[jon_west_uk]

I still cant work this think out. I just tried turning my Case fans down (all 7 of them in the thermaltake case) and the temp on my cpu rose by 8c. When i turned them back on the temp fell by 8c in 30seconds!!

Is my pc supersensitive to temp changes or what! Will try removing the temp sensor as soon as i can.

Weird!

Someone please unwire me...the gadgets are taking over!

 

[HardWareBoss]

My room temp with AC on 78F I have P4 2.4C OC to 3.0. Antec 1080AMG Case with 430 Psu 3 fans. CPU now 47C System 33C

 

[HardWareBoss]

With AC on during day with FLA sun beating on my house. CPU will hit 55C+ I ordered 3 Enermax fans. I'm going to replace the 3 stock fans with these to see if those lower my CPU temp. They should.

 

[HardWareBoss]

Send a PM to Crashman about your Kooling problem . He's a puter tech.

 

[LtBlue14]

send him a link to this thread, in the PM

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[LCARS]

Then send him waffles as an offering.

 

[LtBlue14]

lolll

yeah jon in the UK, i really don't know why your temps vary SO MUCH in doing something like that. I'd say I'm pretty much exhausted as a resource, unless any new information comes up

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[HardWareBoss]

The UK is alot cooler than I am this time of the year. That's why I told him to PM Crash. Unless it's a bad CPU.