I have an Athlon XP 3000+ 333fsb on a Gigabyte GA7E400EL single channel nForce2 with a PowerSupply EG465 from Enermax.
My cpu is running with more than 60C at idle and get sometimes up to 70C at load. System is at 43C. My case is opened! I have Artic Ceramique between the cpu and cooler. It is the cooler that came bundled with an Athlon XP 2600+ Barton (think it is the same as the bundled 3000+).
It is kind of hot in my room, ~25C so I need a better hsf. I don't want to spend a lot, no more than 25$CAN. I'm asking myself how good is the Barton stock HSF compared with hsf around that price(25$) from quality brands? Moreover, noise is a primary concern for me. I won't o/c it.
I've read Heatsinks buyers guide from scottchen and it is good, but I think that they are too expansive for me, and I don't want to unmount my mobo.
So what do you think should be good for me?
Thanks all for your patience!
<font color=red>The good Smoked Meat Maple Leaf Extra-Fat!
Yeah my guide, it's no where near done, i've been very busy lately, haven't got time to bother with the budget heatsinks, 25CAD, let's see, there's the Vantec Aeroflow which is about 30, that's probably the best deal. But wait no, temps shouldn't be that high, 2 possibilities:
1. Bad HSF installations, fixed by properly reinstalling heatsink.
2. Gigabyte's a wh0re, they tend to report temps 10C hotter than they actually are.
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Well you are running a little warm (you already knew that). You system seems a little warm with the case open, first, are you sure you are getting optimium airflow? In a few of the tests I have run have a case side off, isn't always better.
As for the stock heat sink, AMD wouldn't include it if it wasn't good enough under normal circumstances. I recently purchased a 2800 XP chip and was trying to decide wether to use the AMD heatsink or a Volcano 10+ I had lying around.
After measuring both the Volcano 10+, being almost half the size, still had twice the surface area, making it a little better cooler.
It is my understanding/expeirence that 2800+ and up chips run pretty hot. I finally got my CPU temperature under control by using a heatpipe cooler. I purchased the Gigabyte 3D Cooler Pro (Mainly because it was in stock at the local computer store).
This is $27 USD, which is just over what you wanted to spend, but what I was seriously thinking about getting.
Anyways, whats in your case? Like how many case fans/ where are they/ and are they intake or exhuast? Do you have a lot of drives?
Relistically it will be hard to get a heatsink that is going to cool you down in your enviroment that isn't noisy.
I would try and get your case temps down a little first if possible. Is your case exposed to outside air, or is tucked in some cubby hole that is closed most of the time?
It will be hard to get your CPU below 60° just becuase your case temp is so high. Keep in mind to cool the CPU you need to move air, and the more air your move the more noise you will have, so how important is noise? Do you really want the thing to be whisper quiet, or would you tolerate some noise to run cooler.
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1. Bad HSF installations, fixed by properly reinstalling heatsink.
scottchen has a good point here, a lot of machines that I see that have over heating problems are just becuase the person, has not applied thermal compund correctly (Either not enough, To much, tried to re-use thermal pad).
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2. Gigabyte's a wh0re, they tend to report temps 10C hotter than they actually are.
Actually my expeirence has been the opposite, one of my previous BIOS updates was to fix a problem with the motherboard giving temps that were to low.
<b>However</b>, this is not to say they are correct, it is possible that they are still wrong, and actually high, never actually tried checking by any other means.
<b>Anyways</b>, here is the Giga-byte FAQ on the temperature issue I expeirenced:
<A HREF="http://www.giga-byte.com/Motherboard/Support/FAQ/FAQ_414.htm" target="_new">http://www.giga-byte.com/Motherboard/Support/FAQ/FAQ_414.htm</A> , note this is for my a board 7n400Pro2, and not your particular board, might check to see about updates for yours.
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Thanks for the replies, I will try to cover everything that has been said in this message.
My case doesn't have any fan built-in, it is the same case as it was with my Tbird 1.2 GHz. I upgraded lot of things since then.
For the FAQ, it is also for my mobo, but I bought it with the F8 BIOS, so it is much more up to date than the F2 version. I don't know if there is an easy way to test the temperature said by the mobo?
For the installation of the thermal compound, I indeed tried first to "reuse" the crapy thermal pad that was on the HS. I got an alarm for 80C few minutes after booting so I shut it up as soon as the alarm rang knowing that over 85C, the cpu melts :-S. I then bought Artic Céramique, so it really helped a lot as you can see! Another thing is that with the case closed, it is 5C more than what it is now, so I temporarily keep it open.
As for the installation of the thermal compound itself, I followed the instructions on the artic website step by step EXCEPT that I wasn't able to wash the cpu and heatsink of the thermal pad because I didn't have acetone or other kind of alcohol things they are talking about. I just tried to remove the most I could with a credit card. I'm aware that the microfissures are not washed, but I can't believe that it is the cause of such a high temp.
The cpu fan is said to run at 3800 rpm, I don't know if it is ok for that kind of HSF.
I have one hard disk WD 40GB 7200, 2 CD/DVD drives and one floppy. I also have a softmodded Radeon 9500 @ 9700 o/c 346/285 MHz (so great!!! :-) )
I can send pictures if it could help... just email me at pzkfwg[at]yahoo[dot]ca
My case is in an open room with the air conditionner 6000BTU (not much) in the same room. It is the coolest room of the appartment, but with the high temperatures of the summer at Montreal, it is still hot in there.
Maybe, with all the factors I have listed, the temperature is normal for my cpu and system? The only question is : is it safe to run the computer at those temperature considering AMD only tells a maximum temperature of 85C and saying that there is no "normal" working temperature condition because it depends of so much factors? The other question is how much of temperature drop can I expect of another HSF compared to the stock fan? I just don't like the idea to run it case open in the middle of the room forever... Hey, I just noticed another 3-4C drop when I pull it from under my desk.
For the noise, I don't think I would appreciate more noise than what I get from my stock fan. BTW, I can't find the specs of the bundled fan that comes with a Barton. Do you have any idea where I can get it? Like what is the noise rating of it?
Thanks again very much!
<font color=red>The good Smoked Meat Maple Leaf Extra-Fat!
Thats probably hurting you the most. Without fans in the case you can't move air. Older cases used to rely on the power supply to pull the heat of the CPU out of the case. Now that you are using a 3000+ chip that runs hot anyways. So you will have all that heat surrounding thte CPU, that is leaving the case rather slowly.
I consider anything under 60° to be acceptable, on my machine I would want the temps even lower.
My computer room is roughly 23° C. The inside of my computer case is 27° C (With more drives and such than you have). My processor idles at about 48° and even at continous 100% load, it sits at 55°. Now my case is a very, very poor design for proper airflow, however at least it is still moving air.
Its obvisuly impossible to get your CPU temperature down to the case temperature. Adding some carefully placed fans to your case would probably cure your problem. As soon as you cool the air down inside your case, your CPU temp will drop.
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Ok, that's interresting, I never thought fan cases were so efficient. When I bought my computer in 2001, I have read reviews that said that case fans were only marketing things and didn't have significant impact on temperature. So I never look again if they have been improved.
But if I get someting like Aero7+ or Aeroflow2, do you think it could make a significant difference considering everything else being equals?
<font color=red>The good Smoked Meat Maple Leaf Extra-Fat!
Proper airflow is very important in newer machines. If you change nothing else, yes the Aero7+ and the Aeroflow2 will reduce your temps a little, but don't expect it to be huge drop in temperature. Also note that the Aeroflow2 is going to be a little louder than your current heatsink, and a little louder than the Aero7+. Both of these fans are going to have to run at full speed to make a difference.
Your CPU temperature just isn't going to drop much in temperature until your case temperature drops. Think of it this way, your heatsinnk is using the air in your case to cool the CPU, but the air in your case is already hot. Even with the case panel off your temperatures are still a little high, which means you have hot air lingering inside your case, a case fan would help this. Does your case have a spot where you could hook up an exhaust fan in the rear of the case just to expierement? You can get a cheap fan for a couple of dollars just to try. Figure it this way, my computer room is a roughly 2° cooler than yours, however my case is 16° cooler than yours.
My opinion is that you need to A. modify your case or B. get a better case.
A better case would cost your about the same as a new heatsink, however modifing your case would end up primarliy costing you time. My thoughts are, the heat sink is only going to help you minmally at this point, I think case fan setup would be more helpful. Just my opinion, I would wait and see if anyone else comes up with something?
Just for an ideal, this was a case I had a few machines ago, I relocated the power supply to the front, and then relocated the plug for the power cord to the back of the case again. <A HREF="http://Mr5oh.tripod.com/redcase.jpg" target="_new">http://Mr5oh.tripod.com/redcase.jpg</A>
Also I mean the heat sink that comes with the processors aren't great, but AMD wouldn't give you something that would overheat your machine.
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My case is not designed at all to put fan in it, so I can't try it.
What if I put a domestic fan blowing air by the open side of my case? Of course it is not elegant and I didn't expect to end up doing expensive purchases, but I realize that I have to do someting about it and maybe it is my best bet.
<font color=red>The good Smoked Meat Maple Leaf Extra-Fat!
I am afraid I don't understand what you mean by domestic fan? Try some way of cooling your case temps down, maybe temporarily try setting it up so that the air conditioner can blow into it, and see what happens. Don't bring your case temp down to far (keep it at a realistic temperature), just see what happens with your CPU temp with a cooler case temp.
A new computer case without power supply can be had for as little as $13 USD, with power supply is about $20, and for a even a relatively fancy case such as this for $35.
Do some expeirmenting before you decide to buy anything, find a way to bring down that case temp, and see what happens. If it helps a lot, then maybe look into a new style case.
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I mean a big fan that we use for ourselves when it is hot and we don't have an air conditionner... it gives wind. "Ventilator", maybe?
Hey, I try to find specs for stock hsf for Barton and I can't find them. However, I see some reviews and they say that it runs at 5000 rpm, 6000 rpm, etc. I'm at 3850 rpm. I know that it is not always the same model, but...
<font color=red>The good Smoked Meat Maple Leaf Extra-Fat!
I have a 2600+ barton with the AMD hsf, and it runs at about 4100 rpm, so I'd say your 3850 is probably about right. I've got mine oc'd to 2.24ghz (195fsb) (about 3000+ to 3200+ speed) and with a case fan right behind the cpu, the cpu doesn't go over 48c (43 on the software monitor in windows). It's in the back bedroom and that room gets warm in the summer even with central air.
A 'domestic' fan blowing on the side would blow the hot air out of the case and should get you a good reduction in temps as a temporary fix.
If that works to reduce your temps, I would put your $ into a new case and a couple case fans (may be hard to get it as cool as with the side open and a big fan blowing the air around though). Most cases I've seen (even the cheap $22US with 350w PS one I have) have a spot to put an 80 or 120mm fan right below the PS, which usually (depending on mobo design) is right beside the CPU, so if you blow your air in right there (or suck it out - probably less efficient that way though) that's going to get you the best airflow, even with the stock hsf.
That is what I was thinking you were meaning, but wasn't sure. Yeah give it a try. Anything to get those case temps down, and I think you'll see your CPU temps start dropping also.
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Ok guys,
I tried to use a big domestic fan to blow air right on my motherboard. The wind covered all the case and I aligned it so that the air could get out by the holes at the rear of the case, so the air couldn't bounce of.
The good news is that system temp came down from 40C to 31C. That means that the fan is effective and moving air in the case.
The big bad suprise is that the cpu came down from 60 to 59 degrees! Only one degree down! So, we have to realize that a small 80mm case fan won't be effective at all if a very big fan (about a feet large) at top speed couldn't make cpu temp go down.
BTW, I was suprised to see that indeed the case has a place to put an 80mm fan at the rear, approximately aligned with the cpu to suck up warm air around the cpu.
Does that leave me with the only solution of changing the cpu's hsf?
What do you think?
Thanks all!
<font color=red>The good Smoked Meat Maple Leaf Extra-Fat!
I agree with you and Mr5. A new HSF, probably a heatpipe, sounds like a requirement.
I would also get a case fan to put in the spot behind the CPU. That will get fresh, cool air into the cpu area to help, and may let you close the case back up with reasonable temps. (31 is great, but even if it's 36, 37 or so, as long as the cpu hsf/heatsink is doing it's job, your cpu temps should be ok.)
I'm convinced to get another hsf, but I still don't know which one to get.
Coolermaster has 2 hsf with heatpipes, but they doesn't seem so great: 34CAN$ each, model HHC-001 having a fan with 6800 rpm (noise!, but claims to be 40.5db) and Rtherm of 0.48 C/W which is fair.
Other model is HHC-L61, very silent 25.5db as I like them, but has a very bad claimed Rtherm of 0.65 C/W. I've seen a review where it was significantly worst than competitors.
Aeroflow from Vantec has a noise level claimed to be 38dB which is two times less loud than HHC-001 at 30$CAN. I can't see the claimed Rtherm, but it seems to me that the reviews were good.
The Aero7+ is very expansive at 53$CAN, but the fan can be sold separately for an inexpansive 20$. Does it worth installing it on my current heatsink?
I really don't know what's the best $/db/Rtherm ratio!
<font color=red>The good Smoked Meat Maple Leaf Extra-Fat!
