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No more Holiday Minutes on VZW

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Anonymous
July 14, 2005 7:40:03 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

According to my 7/3/05 invoice, "Beginning on September 1, all calls
sent and received on national holidays - New Year's Day, Memorial Day,
Independence Day, Labor Day, Thanksgiving Day, and Christmas Day - will
be billed according to the time of day, and the day of the week, they
occur..."

I think they did this so that they never have to see this question in
the newsgroups ever again.

More about : holiday minutes vzw

Anonymous
July 14, 2005 11:11:58 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

<stannc@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1121380803.934100.181380@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
| According to my 7/3/05 invoice, "Beginning on September 1, all calls
| sent and received on national holidays - New Year's Day, Memorial Day,
| Independence Day, Labor Day, Thanksgiving Day, and Christmas Day - will
| be billed according to the time of day, and the day of the week, they
| occur..."

Were those holidays ever named as having special nights/weekend rates in any
contract?
Anonymous
July 14, 2005 11:15:40 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

Joe Kaffe wrote:
> <stannc@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1121380803.934100.181380@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
> | According to my 7/3/05 invoice, "Beginning on September 1, all calls
> | sent and received on national holidays - New Year's Day, Memorial Day,
> | Independence Day, Labor Day, Thanksgiving Day, and Christmas Day - will
> | be billed according to the time of day, and the day of the week, they
> | occur..."
>
> Were those holidays ever named as having special nights/weekend rates in any
> contract?

They've traditionally been billed off-peak, as weekend minutes IIRC, which
for many people means "free" because they have free weekends.


--
JustThe.net - Steve Sobol / sjsobol@JustThe.net / PGP: 0xE3AE35ED
Coming to you from Southern California's High Desert, where the
temperatures are as high as the gas prices! / 888.480.4NET (4638)

"Life's like an hourglass glued to the table" --Anna Nalick, "Breathe"
Related resources
Anonymous
July 14, 2005 11:28:03 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

<stannc@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1121380803.934100.181380@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
> According to my 7/3/05 invoice, "Beginning on September 1, all calls
> sent and received on national holidays - New Year's Day, Memorial Day,
> Independence Day, Labor Day, Thanksgiving Day, and Christmas Day - will
> be billed according to the time of day, and the day of the week, they
> occur..."
>
> I think they did this so that they never have to see this question in
> the newsgroups ever again.
>

If that's true, it's yet *another* VZW take-away. What kind of marketing
dunderheads are making those decisions?

Just keep pissing off your loyal customer base, boys and soon you'll have
all the state of the art infrastructure in the world--- and no one to use
it!!

Ex
Anonymous
July 14, 2005 11:28:04 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

Expert Witness wrote:

> If that's true, it's yet *another* VZW take-away. What kind of marketing
> dunderheads are making those decisions?

The same morons that are at Sprint right now, I think. Sprint's done some of
this too, over the past month.



--
JustThe.net - Steve Sobol / sjsobol@JustThe.net / PGP: 0xE3AE35ED
Coming to you from Southern California's High Desert, where the
temperatures are as high as the gas prices! / 888.480.4NET (4638)

"Life's like an hourglass glued to the table" --Anna Nalick, "Breathe"
Anonymous
July 14, 2005 11:28:05 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

Steve Sobol wrote:
>
> Expert Witness wrote:
>
> > If that's true, it's yet *another* VZW take-away. What kind of marketing
> > dunderheads are making those decisions?
>
> The same morons that are at Sprint right now, I think. Sprint's done some of
> this too, over the past month.

Y'all have seen the "We'll match our competitor's price" advertisements.

I guess Verizon is trying to match Sprint's services, in a real Bizarro
kind of way! <g>

Notan
Anonymous
July 14, 2005 11:28:06 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

Notan wrote:

> I guess Verizon is trying to match Sprint's services, in a real Bizarro
> kind of way! <g>

Verizon's still ahead in the "ignoring pieces of their network that break"
category, in this part of SoCal. In other words, they're more likely to
ignore brokenness than Sprint. :) 

--
JustThe.net - Steve Sobol / sjsobol@JustThe.net / PGP: 0xE3AE35ED
Coming to you from Southern California's High Desert, where the
temperatures are as high as the gas prices! / 888.480.4NET (4638)

"Life's like an hourglass glued to the table" --Anna Nalick, "Breathe"
Anonymous
July 14, 2005 11:28:07 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

As viewed from alt.cellular.verizon, Steve Sobol wrote:

>Verizon's still ahead in the "ignoring pieces of their network that
>break" category, in this part of SoCal. In other words, they're more
>likely to ignore brokenness than Sprint. :) 

My experience is exactly the opposite. One of the several reasons
that I moved to Verizon from Cingular (actually Pac Bell Wireless
when I had it) was the excellent coverage at my home and in my
immediate neighborhood here in the San Gabriel Valley.

On a Thursday some three or four weeks ago, my signal strength here at
home became erratic as hell, varying from a three-bar digital signal
down to a no-bar analog signal, and I'd never seen analog around here
before. If I called the cellphone from my landline, I'd get voice-
mail more often than not.

I let it slide until Friday and called VZW and explained the problem,
telling them that I could drive 3-5 miles in any direction and get a
solid four-bar signal. The person who answered put me through to a
technician, and I suggested to him that I try to make a call so that
he could determine exactly what cell site I was using.

I woke up Saturday morning to a solid four-bar signal and it's been
fine ever since. The following Monday or Tuesday, someone from VZW
called and said that there had indeed been a problem with the site.

--
Jafo
Anonymous
July 14, 2005 11:28:08 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

Jafo wrote:

> As viewed from alt.cellular.verizon, Steve Sobol wrote:
>
>>Verizon's still ahead in the "ignoring pieces of their network that
>>break" category, in this part of SoCal. In other words, they're more
>>likely to ignore brokenness than Sprint. :) 
>
> My experience is exactly the opposite. One of the several reasons
> that I moved to Verizon from Cingular (actually Pac Bell Wireless
> when I had it) was the excellent coverage at my home and in my
> immediate neighborhood here in the San Gabriel Valley.

Indeed. Visit http://stevesobol.com/goodbye_vzw/ for my comments on that.

I don't expect you to have any problems. You live in the Los Angeles metro area.

Although I'm not even 70 miles from Los Angeles, I *don't.* (unless Greater
Los Angeles has expanded lately, to include the Victor Valley)

I live in the High Desert, and the sum total of the population of all of the
major cities in this region - INCLUDING the Victor Valley *AND* the Antelope
Valley, and everything north of the Victor Valley along I-15 to the Nevada
line - is far less than the population of LA alone.

The population of the four biggest Victor Valley cities - Apple Valley,
Victorville, Hesperia, and Adelanto - oh, let's make it six and include
Barstow and Phelan - well, we're lucky if it's 400,000 (I actually believe
it's a little less, and I estimated 250K-300K in my original "Goodbye VZW"
post).

So we get ignored. Visit that link for details - it's a link to a post I
made when I finally dumped Verizon Wireless for Sprint PCS in June of 2004.

VZW coverage is mostly quite solid across SoCal (including most of the area
where I live), and I don't doubt the customer service/repair end of things
is MUCH better for you down in the San Gabriel Valley. It's just not the
same up here.

> I let it slide until Friday and called VZW and explained the problem,
> telling them that I could drive 3-5 miles in any direction and get a
> solid four-bar signal. The person who answered put me through to a
> technician, and I suggested to him that I try to make a call so that
> he could determine exactly what cell site I was using.

> I woke up Saturday morning to a solid four-bar signal and it's been
> fine ever since. The following Monday or Tuesday, someone from VZW
> called and said that there had indeed been a problem with the site.

Well, they didn't for me. I'm sure they would rather service an area with
millions of customers than ours, which is further away and harder to get to
and from. If the Cajon Pass is closed or there's an accident on the 15, or
there's tons of northbound traffic to Vegas on a Thursday or Friday, forget
about getting up here in a timely manner (although usually it's not that bad).

You'd think Victorville wouldn't be ignored, since Verizon (not VZW) employs
hundreds of people here. There's a huge Verizon 411 call center on La Paz,
and a big operations office on Mojave Drive, both right off the freeway...
(They're always looking for 411 operators to work in Victorville.)

Anyhow, go check out that link - http://stevesobol.com/goodbye_vzw/ - it'll
forward you to Google Groups. Let me know what you think after reading my
comments.

--
JustThe.net - Steve Sobol / sjsobol@JustThe.net / PGP: 0xE3AE35ED
Coming to you from Southern California's High Desert, where the
temperatures are as high as the gas prices! / 888.480.4NET (4638)

"Life's like an hourglass glued to the table" --Anna Nalick, "Breathe"
Anonymous
July 14, 2005 11:43:38 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

"Steve Sobol" <sjsobol@JustThe.net> wrote in message
news:D b75kr$b3m$1@ratbert.glorb.com...
| Joe Kaffe wrote:
| > <stannc@gmail.com> wrote in message
| > news:1121380803.934100.181380@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
| > | According to my 7/3/05 invoice, "Beginning on September 1, all calls
| > | sent and received on national holidays - New Year's Day, Memorial Day,
| > | Independence Day, Labor Day, Thanksgiving Day, and Christmas Day -
will
| > | be billed according to the time of day, and the day of the week, they
| > | occur..."
| >
| > Were those holidays ever named as having special nights/weekend rates in
any
| > contract?
|
| They've traditionally been billed off-peak, as weekend minutes IIRC, which
| for many people means "free" because they have free weekends.

I'm not a lawyer, so I won't even pretend to be able to answer the following
question:

Even if the off peak rates weren't in a written contract, did Verizon's
actions constitute a contract? If so, it would appear they are materially
changing the terms and would have to release people from their obligation
without an ETF.
Anonymous
July 15, 2005 12:29:35 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

Joe Kaffe wrote:

> Even if the off peak rates weren't in a written contract, did Verizon's
> actions constitute a contract? If so, it would appear they are materially
> changing the terms and would have to release people from their obligation
> without an ETF.

I'm not a lawyer either. But I suspect the answer lies somewhere in the
federal Universal Commercial Code, especially the part about implied
warranties (that *is* part of the UCC, right?)


--
JustThe.net - Steve Sobol / sjsobol@JustThe.net / PGP: 0xE3AE35ED
Coming to you from Southern California's High Desert, where the
temperatures are as high as the gas prices! / 888.480.4NET (4638)

"Life's like an hourglass glued to the table" --Anna Nalick, "Breathe"
Anonymous
July 15, 2005 12:54:37 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

Joe Kaffe wrote:
>
> "Steve Sobol" <sjsobol@JustThe.net> wrote in message
> news:D b75kr$b3m$1@ratbert.glorb.com...
> | Joe Kaffe wrote:
> | > <stannc@gmail.com> wrote in message
> | > news:1121380803.934100.181380@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
> | > | According to my 7/3/05 invoice, "Beginning on September 1, all calls
> | > | sent and received on national holidays - New Year's Day, Memorial Day,
> | > | Independence Day, Labor Day, Thanksgiving Day, and Christmas Day -
> will
> | > | be billed according to the time of day, and the day of the week, they
> | > | occur..."
> | >
> | > Were those holidays ever named as having special nights/weekend rates in
> any
> | > contract?
> |
> | They've traditionally been billed off-peak, as weekend minutes IIRC, which
> | for many people means "free" because they have free weekends.
>
> I'm not a lawyer, so I won't even pretend to be able to answer the following
> question:
>
> Even if the off peak rates weren't in a written contract, did Verizon's
> actions constitute a contract? If so, it would appear they are materially
> changing the terms and would have to release people from their obligation
> without an ETF.

I'm not a lawyer, so I won't even pretend to be able to answer the following
question:

Doesn't virtually every contract (in this case, Verizon's) have a "We have
the right to change this contract" clause?

Notan
Anonymous
July 15, 2005 12:54:38 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

"Notan" <notan@ddress.com> wrote in message
news:42D7256D.DA849D41@ddress.com...
---snip---snip---snip---

| Doesn't virtually every contract (in this case, Verizon's) have a "We have
| the right to change this contract" clause?

Yes, at least in this case.

Our Rights To Make Changes
Your service is subject to our business policies, practices, and procedures,
which we can change without notice. UNLESS OTHERWISE PROHIBITED BY LAW, WE
CAN ALSO CHANGE PRICES AND ANY OTHER CONDITIONS IN THIS AGREEMENT AT ANY
TIME BY SENDING YOU WRITTEN NOTICE PRIOR TO THE BILLING PERIOD IN WHICH THE
CHANGES WOULD GO INTO EFFECT. IF YOU CHOOSE TO USE YOUR SERVICE AFTER THAT
POINT, YOU'RE ACCEPTING THE CHANGES. IF THE CHANGES HAVE A MATERIAL ADVERSE
EFFECT ON YOU, HOWEVER, YOU CAN END THE AFFECTED SERVICE, WITHOUT ANY EARLY
TERMINATION FEE, JUST BY CALLING US WITHIN 60 DAYS AFTER WE SEND NOTICE OF
THE CHANGE.

http://www.verizonwireless.com/b2c/globalText?textName=...

The agreement (at least this one) makes no written mention of rates on
holidays.
Anonymous
July 15, 2005 4:53:24 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

On Thu, 14 Jul 2005 20:34:39 -0700, "Joe Kaffe" <kaffejoe@yahoo.com>
wrote:

>
>"Notan" <notan@ddress.com> wrote in message
>news:42D7256D.DA849D41@ddress.com...
>---snip---snip---snip---
>
>| Doesn't virtually every contract (in this case, Verizon's) have a "We have
>| the right to change this contract" clause?
>
>Yes, at least in this case.
>
>Our Rights To Make Changes
>Your service is subject to our business policies, practices, and procedures,
>which we can change without notice. UNLESS OTHERWISE PROHIBITED BY LAW, WE
>CAN ALSO CHANGE PRICES AND ANY OTHER CONDITIONS IN THIS AGREEMENT AT ANY
>TIME BY SENDING YOU WRITTEN NOTICE PRIOR TO THE BILLING PERIOD IN WHICH THE
>CHANGES WOULD GO INTO EFFECT. IF YOU CHOOSE TO USE YOUR SERVICE AFTER THAT
>POINT, YOU'RE ACCEPTING THE CHANGES. IF THE CHANGES HAVE A MATERIAL ADVERSE
>EFFECT ON YOU, HOWEVER, YOU CAN END THE AFFECTED SERVICE, WITHOUT ANY EARLY
>TERMINATION FEE, JUST BY CALLING US WITHIN 60 DAYS AFTER WE SEND NOTICE OF
>THE CHANGE.
>
>http://www.verizonwireless.com/b2c/globalText?textName=...
>
>The agreement (at least this one) makes no written mention of rates on
>holidays.
>

But, since they provided written notice of the change, one must
presume VZW considers it a possible "material adverse effect", and
those who object should be able to cancel within the 60 days without
ETF. But in reality, I don't think it'll be *that* big of a deal to
most people. The only people who would cancel over this are likely
going to be people who wanted out of their contract for other reasons.
If someone reading this falls in that category, then call VZW's hand
on it and see what they say.

If true, 'theclearanceguy' is not going to like this dent in his
short-term "business" prospects.

--
I'm not a lawyer either, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last
night.:-)
Anonymous
July 15, 2005 12:58:39 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

In article <otfed1hjn0meq4jaai5912sg69vescqjo1@4ax.com>,
The Ghost of General Lee <ghost@general.lee> wrote:

> But, since they provided written notice of the change, one must
> presume VZW considers it a possible "material adverse effect", and
> those who object should be able to cancel within the 60 days without
> ETF. But in reality, I don't think it'll be *that* big of a deal to
> most people. The only people who would cancel over this are likely
> going to be people who wanted out of their contract for other
> reasons.

I'd like to get out of my contract to switch to a carrier who allows me
to transfer my phone book to my car. However, the three people I speak
with the most on my cell phone all have Verizon Wireless, so we all use
In Calling. My minutes per month typically run about 200 prime time,
100-150 nights and weekends, and 1,000 or more in calling.

--
Stop Mad Cowboy Disease: Impeach the son of a Bush.
Anonymous
July 15, 2005 1:23:56 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

On 14 Jul 2005 15:40:03 -0700, "stannc@gmail.com" <stannc@gmail.com>
wrote:
>According to my 7/3/05 invoice, "Beginning on September 1, all calls
>sent and received on national holidays - New Year's Day, Memorial Day,
>Independence Day, Labor Day, Thanksgiving Day, and Christmas Day - will
>be billed according to the time of day, and the day of the week, they
>occur..."
>I think they did this so that they never have to see this question in
>the newsgroups ever again.

Yup, my bill too:

"Calls on Holidays: Beginning on September 1, all calls sent and
received on national holidays - New Years Day, Memorial Day, Independence
Day, Labor Day, Thanksgiving Day and Christmas Day - will be billed
according to the time of day, and the day of the week, they occur.
Airtime charges will apply to such calls in accordance with your calling
plan. With IN, calls to other Verizon Wireless customers will remain
free, and so will calls on nights and weekends if your calling plan
includes that feature. Please consult your Customer Agreement for
information about changes to your service."
Anonymous
July 15, 2005 1:40:31 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

"The Ghost of General Lee" <ghost@general.lee> wrote in message
news:o tfed1hjn0meq4jaai5912sg69vescqjo1@4ax.com...
| But, since they provided written notice of the change, one must
| presume VZW considers it a possible "material adverse effect", and
| those who object should be able to cancel within the 60 days without
| ETF. But in reality, I don't think it'll be *that* big of a deal to
| most people. The only people who would cancel over this are likely
| going to be people who wanted out of their contract for other reasons.

Well, if this turns out to be an opportunity to cancel without incurring an
ETF, I'm one of those who might seize it. My usage has dropped dramatically
and I'd be better served with a prepaid plan.
Anonymous
July 15, 2005 3:23:48 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

This will give people an out if their original contract states
that these are days with Holiday minutes.

Changing the contract allows them to call up, complain, and drop
out without a termination fee.

On 2005-07-14, stannc@gmail.com <stannc@gmail.com> wrote:
> According to my 7/3/05 invoice, "Beginning on September 1, all calls
> sent and received on national holidays - New Year's Day, Memorial Day,
> Independence Day, Labor Day, Thanksgiving Day, and Christmas Day - will
> be billed according to the time of day, and the day of the week, they
> occur..."
>
> I think they did this so that they never have to see this question in
> the newsgroups ever again.
>


--
Sick of USENET postwhores? Trolls? Flamers?
Read the Killfile FAQ for Newsgroups to learn
how to filter their drivel straight to /dev/null
http://www.hyphenologist.co.uk/killfile/killfilefaqhtm....
Anonymous
July 15, 2005 5:22:13 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

Steve Sobol <sjsobol@JustThe.net> wrote:
>Joe Kaffe wrote:
>
>> Even if the off peak rates weren't in a written contract,
>> did Verizon's actions constitute a contract? If so, it would
>> appear they are materially changing the terms and would have
>> to release people from their obligation without an ETF.
>
>I'm not a lawyer either. But I suspect the answer lies somewhere
>in the federal Universal Commercial Code, especially the part
>about implied warranties (that *is* part of the UCC, right?)

Maybe I can cancel my service and come back without a contract
while deciding whether or not I should switch to Sprint to save
$30 a month on data usage charges.
July 15, 2005 6:11:48 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

Well, like they say...Monkey see, Monkey do.

"Steve Sobol" <sjsobol@JustThe.net> wrote in message
news:D b6ubi$9qi$1@ratbert.glorb.com...
> Expert Witness wrote:
>
>> If that's true, it's yet *another* VZW take-away. What kind of marketing
>> dunderheads are making those decisions?
>
> The same morons that are at Sprint right now, I think. Sprint's done some
> of this too, over the past month.
Anonymous
July 15, 2005 6:46:05 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

On Fri, 15 Jul 2005 08:58:39 -0700, Michelle Steiner
<michelle@michelle.org> wrote:

>In article <otfed1hjn0meq4jaai5912sg69vescqjo1@4ax.com>,
> The Ghost of General Lee <ghost@general.lee> wrote:
>
>> But, since they provided written notice of the change, one must
>> presume VZW considers it a possible "material adverse effect", and
>> those who object should be able to cancel within the 60 days without
>> ETF. But in reality, I don't think it'll be *that* big of a deal to
>> most people. The only people who would cancel over this are likely
>> going to be people who wanted out of their contract for other
>> reasons.
>
>I'd like to get out of my contract to switch to a carrier who allows me
>to transfer my phone book to my car. However, the three people I speak
>with the most on my cell phone all have Verizon Wireless, so we all use
>In Calling. My minutes per month typically run about 200 prime time,
>100-150 nights and weekends, and 1,000 or more in calling.

Every carrier has its advantages and disadvantages. I have found the
same to be true of phones. The bottom line is coverage and in your
case "in"
Anonymous
July 15, 2005 8:04:50 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

stannc@gmail.com wrote:
> According to my 7/3/05 invoice, "Beginning on September 1, all calls
> sent and received on national holidays - New Year's Day, Memorial Day,
> Independence Day, Labor Day, Thanksgiving Day, and Christmas Day -
> will be billed according to the time of day, and the day of the week,
> they occur..."
>
Now watch them turn around in December and offer free holidays as a
promotion!
Anonymous
July 15, 2005 11:37:39 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

On Fri, 15 Jul 2005 16:04:50 GMT, "Slobby Don" <reply@thru.ng> wrote:

>stannc@gmail.com wrote:
>> According to my 7/3/05 invoice, "Beginning on September 1, all calls
>> sent and received on national holidays - New Year's Day, Memorial Day,
>> Independence Day, Labor Day, Thanksgiving Day, and Christmas Day -
>> will be billed according to the time of day, and the day of the week,
>> they occur..."
>>
>Now watch them turn around in December and offer free holidays as a
>promotion!
>

I'm going to mark your post as 'kept', just because it sounds like
something they would do.
Anonymous
July 20, 2005 8:33:11 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

I was recently corrected: VZW doesn't offer "holidays" but does offer
specific days that are treated as off-peak. I have not seen this in my
bill, but if you have, then it must be true. VZW is trying to max revenue,
and this fits into their plan. Talk with your wallet, if YOU believe this a
material take away, then it would be grounds for asking (repeat asking) for
early termination without penalty. The other majors still offer the
holidays as off-peak. dr
--
dr.news Better Price? (not better than you deserve, just more than you are
used to)
If I can help: dr.news@better-price.biz.delete-the-obvious or thru this
notes forum.
home of the better priced phone and service:
http://free.better-price.biz

"Expert Witness" <x@nospamcourt> wrote in message
news:rf2dnWGZx_CeaEvfRVn-2Q@comcast.com...
> <stannc@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1121380803.934100.181380@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
>> According to my 7/3/05 invoice, "Beginning on September 1, all calls
>> sent and received on national holidays - New Year's Day, Memorial Day,
>> Independence Day, Labor Day, Thanksgiving Day, and Christmas Day - will
>> be billed according to the time of day, and the day of the week, they
>> occur..."
>>
>> I think they did this so that they never have to see this question in
>> the newsgroups ever again.
>>
>
> If that's true, it's yet *another* VZW take-away. What kind of marketing
> dunderheads are making those decisions?
>
> Just keep pissing off your loyal customer base, boys and soon you'll have
> all the state of the art infrastructure in the world--- and no one to use
> it!!
>
> Ex
>
>
Anonymous
July 20, 2005 8:40:29 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

Humm: They haven't made a change to the agreement, they've change a plan
which is referenced by the agreement. So, with this "rumored" change in
holiday minutes, they haven't materialized changed the agreement. Can
anyone "imagine" that vzw has contracts that in addition to saying they "can
change them when they want" might also have contracts that say they are
under no obligation to act "best and fair" or in "good faith." IMHO, not a
change to the agreement, but a good point. dr
--
dr.news Better Price? (not better than you deserve, just more than you are
used to)
If I can help: dr.news@better-price.biz.delete-the-obvious or thru this
notes forum.
home of the better priced phone and service:
http://free.better-price.biz

"Joe Kaffe" <kaffejoe@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:6aGBe.56104$iU.30636@lakeread05...
>
> "Notan" <notan@ddress.com> wrote in message
> news:42D7256D.DA849D41@ddress.com...
> ---snip---snip---snip---
>
> | Doesn't virtually every contract (in this case, Verizon's) have a "We
> have
> | the right to change this contract" clause?
>
> Yes, at least in this case.
>
> Our Rights To Make Changes
> Your service is subject to our business policies, practices, and
> procedures,
> which we can change without notice. UNLESS OTHERWISE PROHIBITED BY LAW, WE
> CAN ALSO CHANGE PRICES AND ANY OTHER CONDITIONS IN THIS AGREEMENT AT ANY
> TIME BY SENDING YOU WRITTEN NOTICE PRIOR TO THE BILLING PERIOD IN WHICH
> THE
> CHANGES WOULD GO INTO EFFECT. IF YOU CHOOSE TO USE YOUR SERVICE AFTER THAT
> POINT, YOU'RE ACCEPTING THE CHANGES. IF THE CHANGES HAVE A MATERIAL
> ADVERSE
> EFFECT ON YOU, HOWEVER, YOU CAN END THE AFFECTED SERVICE, WITHOUT ANY
> EARLY
> TERMINATION FEE, JUST BY CALLING US WITHIN 60 DAYS AFTER WE SEND NOTICE OF
> THE CHANGE.
>
> http://www.verizonwireless.com/b2c/globalText?textName=...
>
> The agreement (at least this one) makes no written mention of rates on
> holidays.
>
>
>
Anonymous
July 20, 2005 1:24:51 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

On Wed, 20 Jul 2005 04:40:29 GMT, "dr.news"
<dr.news@better-price.biz.delete-the-obvious> wrote:
>this "rumored" change in holiday minutes

It's not a rumor, it's in my bill:

"Calls on Holidays: Beginning on September 1, all calls sent and
received on national holidays - New Years Day, Memorial Day, Independence
Day, Labor Day, Thanksgiving Day and Christmas Day - will be billed
according to the time of day, and the day of the week, they occur.
Airtime charges will apply to such calls in accordance with your calling
plan. With IN, calls to other Verizon Wireless customers will remain
free, and so will calls on nights and weekends if your calling plan
includes that feature. Please consult your Customer Agreement for
information about changes to your service."

--
Bob Scheurle | "There's nobody getting
njtbob@X-verizon-X.net | rich writing software."
Remove X's and dashes | -- Bill Gates, March 1980
Anonymous
July 20, 2005 7:32:21 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

yes this happened to me and i was really hopping to use that weekends
minutes for holidays and call family but not no more :(  :( 


--
acdc123metal
------------------------------------------------------------------------
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View this thread: http://cellphoneforums.net/t181808.html
Anonymous
July 21, 2005 12:07:25 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

Bob Scheurle wrote:
> On Wed, 20 Jul 2005 04:40:29 GMT, "dr.news"
> <dr.news@better-price.biz.delete-the-obvious> wrote:
>> this "rumored" change in holiday minutes
>
> It's not a rumor, it's in my bill:
>
> "Calls on Holidays: Beginning on September 1, all calls sent and
> received on national holidays - New Years Day, Memorial Day,
> Independence Day, Labor Day, Thanksgiving Day and Christmas Day -
> will be billed according to the time of day, and the day of the week,
> they occur. Airtime charges will apply to such calls in accordance
> with your calling plan. With IN, calls to other Verizon Wireless
> customers will remain free, and so will calls on nights and weekends
> if your calling plan includes that feature. Please consult your
> Customer Agreement for information about changes to your service."

I'm not a lawyer, but my gut feeling is that VZW could be called on it as a
material breach of contract regardless of whether it is specifically
promised or not. It is a long established benefit that was known to the
contracting party. Contract clauses that allow one party to change terms at
will are usually not enforceable. They are mainly there to scare
non-lawyers. My hunch is that when the VZW lawyers look at the above more
closely they will advise VZW to back off and that they are opening
themselves up for successful contract termination challenges by those who
may not even care about holidays, but realize they can successfully cite the
takeaway as a breach. Holidays will likely be grandfathered into existing
contracts and offered as a "promotion" on some of the new ones from time to
time.
Anonymous
July 21, 2005 3:47:34 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

dr.news wrote:
> The other majors still offer the
> holidays as off-peak. dr

Really? I had always thought that Verizon was the hold-out on this.
Does Cingular offer weekday holdidays as off-peak? T-Mobile? And I
know Sprint has NEVER counted national holidays as off-peak, unless they
fall on a weekend.


--
E-mail fudged to thwart spammers.
Transpose the c's and a's in my e-mail address to reply.
Anonymous
July 21, 2005 3:51:13 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

dr.news wrote:
> Humm: They haven't made a change to the agreement, they've change a plan
> which is referenced by the agreement. So, with this "rumored" change in
> holiday minutes, they haven't materialized changed the agreement.

Actually, the mere fact that they bothered to notify people in writing
of the change is in effect a change in the agreement. An amednment to
the agreement to include language that wasn't there before is indeed a
change.


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July 21, 2005 9:39:56 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

Steve Sobol <sjsobol@JustThe.net> wrote in
news:D b74ve$b05$1@ratbert.glorb.com:

> Let me know what you think after reading my
> comments.
>

Wow! Glad you finally came to your senses, Steve.....

Alltel rocks in Charleston on 800B....(c;

--
Larry
Anonymous
July 21, 2005 9:39:57 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

Larry wrote:

> Wow! Glad you finally came to your senses, Steve.....

Yes. However, the issue wasn't coverage. VZW has good coverage here in the
Victor Valley. The issue was repairs that didn't get done.

In this newsgroup, a couple people keyed on coverage, like Proconsul who
also lives in Southern California and said "well what do you expect living
out in the sticks, great coverage?" --Coverage was never my issue with
Verizon, it was part of the network breaking and not getting fixed for over
eight months.

> Alltel rocks in Charleston on 800B....(c;

Well, you probably wouldn't know this as you don't read the relevant
newsgroups, but I just flipped carriers *again.* You might be surprised
about the reason why, though.

--
Steve Sobol, Professional Geek 888-480-4638 PGP: 0xE3AE35ED
Company website: http://JustThe.net/
Personal blog, resume, portfolio: http://SteveSobol.com/
E: sjsobol@JustThe.net Snail: 22674 Motnocab Road, Apple Valley, CA 92307
July 21, 2005 9:41:45 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

"Joe Kaffe" <kaffejoe@yahoo.com> wrote in
news:6aGBe.56104$iU.30636@lakeread05:

> UNLESS OTHERWISE PROHIBITED BY LAW

Precisely why the goddamned FCC needs to DO ITS JOB!

--
Larry
Anonymous
July 22, 2005 1:37:06 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.verizon (More info?)

On Thu, 21 Jul 2005 14:58:38 -0700, Steve Sobol <sjsobol@JustThe.net>
wrote:

>Well, you probably wouldn't know this as you don't read the relevant
>newsgroups, but I just flipped carriers *again.* You might be surprised
>about the reason why, though.

You send your MIL a thank you card?;-)
!