Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips (
More info?)
On Mon, 15 Nov 2004 20:10:10 -0000, "Kate"
<kate@REMOVEbillkath.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>Greets all,
>Well, we finally decided on preferred vendor for our new Athlon 64 Skt 939
>CPU and Asus A8V Wireless M'Board system and today visited the shop to
>order.
>
>To our astonishment the, helpful and apparently knowledgeable, sales person
>advised us not to buy AMD or Asus at all but to go for Intel Skt 775 instead
>and MSI M'board. He said there have been countless problems with
>incompatibilities with the AMD and memory chips -- even with the expensive
>Corsair Modules -- so much so that he thinks it may take a coupla months
>before these can be reliable and stable.
That's a gross exaggeration and I've been following all this quite closely.
>This has thrown us right off course --- we came home with a recommendation
>list but no new puter :-(
>Can anyone comment on what he's going on about, I've read and read on this
>issue and heard nothing before about this problem. What have I been
>missing?
Have you visited any Forum for the AMD mbrd in question? Start by looking
at the recommended memory modules for the mbrd at the mfr Web site. Much
of the "problems" I've seen are stories from disappointed overclockers;
there's also a "story" (check the Forum at www.msi.com.tw) that the AMD
memory channel(s) needs slightly looser timings than what is generally
spec'd in the module SPDs... in particular the Trcd, so that instead of say
2-2-2-6, the BIOS Setup needs to be tweaked to 2-3-2-6 for *some* modules
and especially the performance ones like this with such tight timing.
Apparently overclockers get very peeved at having to back off timing on
their high priced "fashion" DIMMs.
I can relate my experience: I've done a couple of Skt 754 systems with the
MSI K8T Neo-FSR and noticed that in the recommended modules list, the
Kingmax ones were consistently mentioned by MSI for several different
mbrds. They're well priced so I gave them a go and found they work fine
with standard SPD timings - checked that two 512MB modules (double sided)
worked together too. I went with the Kingmax PC3500, running at standard
DDR400 in the hope that it'd give a bit of extra headroom, so I can't say
definitely if the Kingmax PC3200s would do as well.
I just did a MSI K8T Neo2-F Skt 939 system with a 3500+ Newcastle and used
the Kingmax PC3500 modules again - two 256MBs this time, double sided.
Those are spec'd at the same 2.5-4-4-8 and they work fine in the Skt 939
dual channel config too. I played a bit more with the timings on this
system to see what'd work and not: turns out that they need 2T command
rate to work, the 1T would pass memtest86+ but caused minor probs in
installing WinXP and would fail within minutes of starting Prime95.
Kingmax does not specify a command rate so don't know what is to be
expected here, nor whether the 2T is due to the modules, mbrd or CPU.
I also tried reducing the other timings... just to see: here I found that
those modules work fine at 2.5-3-3-7-2T with DDR400 clocking. When I say
"work fine", I've really pounded on this system at those settings by
running Prime95 for hours and 3DMark2001se and 3DMark03. I'm convinced
it's as stable as any I've ever seen and it scores ~5GB/s with Sandra's
memory benchmark. Now I suspect that if I loaded up both channels with
DIMMs, I might have to back off to 2.5-4-4-8-2T but I'm not about to try
that any time soon.
I'm just getting ready to do a MSI K8N Neo2 Platinum with a 3500+
Winchester - already received the CPU, memory and some other stuff; still
waiting on the mbrd and case. I decided to try Crucial DIMMs (regular
ones, not the Ballistix) this time, since I've never had trouble with
Crucial memory modules and I've found they are often underspec'd - I want
to see what I can get out of them in the way of timings but will *not*
overclock. I'll report back when it's working... in a couple of days.
As for your "sales person", it's possible he has a better mark-up on Intel
based systems or he may not be clued up on AMD systems in general and just
be parroting the usual FUD. Another thought: socket 939 mbrds are in short
supply right now - the nForce3 ones in particular are just flying out of
the dealers and e-tailers.
Finally, a word of warning: if you install WinXP SP2, either as an SP2
update or streamlined in, on a VIA K8 mbrd, do *NOT* use the VIA AGP driver
- IOW from the VIA 4-in-1 install, refuse the AGP selection. In SP2, M$
has new "unified AGP drivers" for AGP 3.0 and 3.5 compliant chipsets and
you *must* use them to avoid trouble. In particular they have two drivers:
for AGP 3.0 and 3.5, the first specific to K8 systems; funny thing is that
for me, it did not install automatically with the WinXP SP2 install and I
had to go to "Update Driver" for the VIA CPU to AGP Bridge and manually
tell it to use the "VIA AGP driver (Microsoft)" version. This caused it to
install a driver called GAGP30KX.SYS and it seems to work fine - without it
the SBA and Fast Writes don't get enabled; with a AGP 3.5 chipset the
corresponding driver is UAGP35.SYS.
Rgds, George Macdonald
"Just because they're paranoid doesn't mean you're not psychotic" - Who, me??
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