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Buying new PC

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Anonymous
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January 4, 2005 3:33:21 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips (More info?)

Hello all,

I need some guidance in choosing components for building a top of the
line PC for personal use. If you have suggestions and/or can suggest
web sites/links, it would help me a lot.
I follow this group frequently - so I' am familiar with the tech terms
but have never put together a system myself
Thanks and HAPPY NEW YEAR,
Vinny

More about : buying

Anonymous
a b à CPUs
January 4, 2005 10:27:19 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips (More info?)

Hi again,

Applications: Office, moderate to high amount of gaming, home video
editing, DVD burning, MP3, movie watching(home theatre)
(am I describing a typical "Media center"
appliation here?)
Links: To sites having information about various system configurations
based on Intel as well as AMD,
sites with comparisons, technology, trends, etc
DIY: Well, yes and no, Yes because what I need is advice on good choice
and combination of components which make a great, stable system
No - because, I have never built a system myself, I' am posting from
India, here we have a fair amount of choice in hardware and trained
people who custom build the systems on commercial basis but they
generally do not provide good choices or do not experiment beyond
standard setups.

My personal liking is for an AMD Athlon 64 based system but the lack of
software and Windows support is a worrying factor.
How does Athlon 64 and/or Athlon 64 FX based system compare with the
latest Intel systems in the 32 bit environment?

Thanks again,
Vinny
Anonymous
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January 4, 2005 1:12:19 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips (More info?)

<vinayvb2@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1104827601.680330.292830@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
> Hello all,
>
> I need some guidance in choosing components for building a top of the
> line PC for personal use.

Personal use for what kind of applications?

> If you have suggestions and/or can suggest
> web sites/links,

You mean links to suppliers? Just type in NewEgg.Com and for most things
you're done.

> it would help me a lot.
> I follow this group frequently - so I' am familiar with the tech terms
> but have never put together a system myself.

So what you really need is a DIY guide?
Related resources
January 4, 2005 1:18:47 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips (More info?)

since many of you seem very knowledgable about processors, i'm going to
go a bit off topic with a question of my own. excuse my ignorance if
the answer to this is common knowledge. i have a p4 2.8A with a 533fsb
and 1mb cache. which i believe is the one and only intel p4 prescott
without hyper-threading. does this mean my mobo is the same as those
prescotts with ht? and if so, how so? also since i believe it's a 478
socket job, can i throw an ht enabled p4 on it without any fuss? also,
is this a task i can do myself as a relative novice? usually i google
it to find these answers, but i can't come up with anything quick and
i'm a bit pressed for time (aren't we all) these days. so these message
boards are a great conveniance for me. thanks alot for any replys : )
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
January 4, 2005 8:50:03 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips (More info?)

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Hash: SHA1

In article <1104852439.798080.289100@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,
<vinayvb2@hotmail.com> wrote:
>My personal liking is for an AMD Athlon 64 based system but the lack of
>software and Windows support is a worrying factor.

What lack of software? It runs all the same stuff that any Intel processor
does, and then some (like 64-bit Linux) that AFAIK no current Intel
processor (except maybe an Itanic) will run.

I can't believe this "AMD has compatibility issues" meme is still in
circulation. It was debunked years ago. (Then again, if I looked hard
enough, I'd probably find someone still asking for get-well cards for Craig
Shergold, or David Rhodes' MAKE_MONEY_FAST spam.)

_/_
/ v \ Scott Alfter (remove the obvious to send mail)
(IIGS( http://alfter.us/ Top-posting!
\_^_/ rm -rf /bin/laden >What's the most annoying thing on Usenet?

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Anonymous
a b à CPUs
January 4, 2005 10:04:30 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips (More info?)

jd wrote:
> since many of you seem very knowledgable about processors, i'm going to
> go a bit off topic with a question of my own. excuse my ignorance if
> the answer to this is common knowledge. i have a p4 2.8A with a 533fsb
> and 1mb cache. which i believe is the one and only intel p4 prescott
> without hyper-threading. does this mean my mobo is the same as those
> prescotts with ht? and if so, how so? also since i believe it's a 478
> socket job, can i throw an ht enabled p4 on it without any fuss? also,
> is this a task i can do myself as a relative novice? usually i google
> it to find these answers, but i can't come up with anything quick and
> i'm a bit pressed for time (aren't we all) these days. so these message
> boards are a great conveniance for me. thanks alot for any replys : )
>

An HT-capable motherboard will work with both
HT-capable P4's and non-HT P4's - so long as
the motherboard has the right socket and can
give the CPU the clocks and voltages it needs.

A non-HT motherboard will also work with both
HT and non-HT P4's - you simply won't have the
option of enabling HT in an HT-capable P4.

If you don't have a manual for your motherboard
you can download one - typically as a PDF - from
the manufacturer's web site. The manual will
tell you whether the mobo supports HT. Alternatively,
just look in your BIOS setup for a setting that lets
you enable/disable HT. The manual and/or the web
site should also have a processor compatibility list
for your mobo.
January 5, 2005 6:42:29 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips (More info?)

thanks for the info, rob : )
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
January 5, 2005 10:35:01 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips (More info?)

vinayvb2@hotmail.com wrote:
> My personal liking is for an AMD Athlon 64 based system but the lack of
> software and Windows support is a worrying factor.
> How does Athlon 64 and/or Athlon 64 FX based system compare with the
> latest Intel systems in the 32 bit environment?

You'll find that the whole idea of the Athlon 64-series is that it runs
the regular old 32-bit Windows with no changes, and it doesn't need a
special 64-bit version of Windows at all. That's why it's become so
popular compared to something like the Intel Itanium which cannot run
without its own specially-designed version of Windows.

When the 64-bit version of Windows that's specially designed for Athlon
64 comes out, it's likely to run much faster, and it can still continue
to run the old 32-bit programs that run under 32-bit Windows.

Yousuf Khan
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
January 8, 2005 10:04:31 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips (More info?)

vinayvb2@hotmail.com schrieb:

> I need some guidance in choosing components for building a top of the
> line PC for personal use. If you have suggestions and/or can suggest
> web sites/links, it would help me a lot.
....

Go to www.google.com and enter: how to build a pc - and you will
immediately gain a wide choice of hyperlinks to documents among which
you may choose according to your preferences and taste.

The main 'guidance' cannot be but: READ... the mainboard manual, the
mainboard manufacturer's web site (BIOS and driver updates, RAM
compatibility...) et cetera.

HTH - Roy
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
January 10, 2005 8:10:58 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips (More info?)

On 4 Jan 2005 07:27:19 -0800, vinayvb2@hotmail.com wrote:

>Hi again,
>
>Applications: Office, moderate to high amount of gaming, home video
>editing, DVD burning, MP3, movie watching(home theatre)
>(am I describing a typical "Media center"
>appliation here?)

To a fair degree, yes. Some of these are fairly easy to handle. MP3
playing, for example, is trivial for any processor out there and any
halfway decent sound card (even most integrated sound cards on
motherboards) will do the trick, though you might want to invest in
speakers. DVD burning is even easier, as again any processor will be
able to handle it, all you need is a DVD burner, though here you have
some choice.

For office applications you should have no trouble once the
requirements for the others are satisfied. Same goes for movie
watching, once you've got a setup that can do even simple video
editing you should have no trouble at all playing back very complex
movies.

So, the real trick here will be gaming and video editing.

>Links: To sites having information about various system configurations
>based on Intel as well as AMD,
>sites with comparisons, technology, trends, etc

You might want to check out some of the comparisons at
www.anandtech.com They do a reasonably good job at comparing how
current setups using a variety of hardware compare for some common
tasks. There are plenty of others as well, though always take
anything you read on ANY site (and this newsgroup for that matter!)
with a *LARGE* grain of salt. Some people have their own agenda that
their trying to push. Some are writing articles for the sole purpose
of getting page hits and advertising money. But by far the biggest
problem is that a lot of people out there just plain don't know what
the hell they are talking about but will scream and yell as if they
do.

>DIY: Well, yes and no, Yes because what I need is advice on good choice
>and combination of components which make a great, stable system
>No - because, I have never built a system myself, I' am posting from
>India, here we have a fair amount of choice in hardware and trained
>people who custom build the systems on commercial basis but they
>generally do not provide good choices or do not experiment beyond
>standard setups.

Fair enough. FWIW choosing the right components is about 99% of
building a system. Actually assembling the things is fairly trivial
(only one step beyond your common kids puzzle... if the pieces fit,
that's almost certainly where they go!).

>My personal liking is for an AMD Athlon 64 based system but the lack of
>software and Windows support is a worrying factor.

By "lack of software and Windows support" are you specifically
referring to 64-bit support? If so, it's on it's way, though I
wouldn't hold my breath for Microsoft to deliver anything if I were
you. There is PLENTY of 64-bit software available for Linux, in fact
nearly ALL software running under Linux has been successfully ported
over to AMD64.

If you're worrying more about software compatibility on the 32-bit
side of things than it's a total non-issue. AMD's Opteron and
Athlon64 processors are fully compatible with all existing 32-bit x86
software.

>How does Athlon 64 and/or Athlon 64 FX based system compare with the
>latest Intel systems in the 32 bit environment?

VERY well. Generally speaking the Athlon64 FX is the fastest 32-bit
x86 processor you can buy, followed closely by the regular Athlon64.
Intel's Pentium4 and Pentium4 Extremely Expensive Edition tend to fall
behind for the most part, though obviously this will vary from one
application to another. Unless you have a specific application in
mind which you know runs better on a P4 than an Athlon64, I can't
think of any reason to put much thought into a Intel-based system.
They tend to be slower, more expensive and they consume more power.
Given that the average temp. in most of India is rather high, I would
guess that added heat Intel's chips is generally not very beneficial
(I, on the other hand, could probably use it right about now as it's
currently about -15C where I'm living :> ).


You did forget one rather important thing though: what kind of budget
are you working with? Pretty much any mid-ranged PC (and even a well
designed low-end PC) out there today should be able to handle the
tasks you're looking at, throwing a bit of money at the task can help
in some areas. There are a few general rules I would mention to start
with though:

1. IMO, a Socket 939 Athlon64 processor is pretty clearly the choice
for moment. The performance and price of these chips makes them a
pretty obvious candidate to base a system around. The only exception
to this rule is if you have a fairly substantial budget and are
looking at a dual-processor system, in which case a dual Socket 940
Opteron 2xx setup is the clear choice.

2. Get a minimum of 1GB of memory in the form of 2 x 512MB DIMMs.
Memory is fairly cheap and for video editing having lots of memory is
your most important step. If you're going to be doing at all heavy
video editing than 2GB would probably be the minimum I'd recommend and
here a dual-processor setup would be something to strongly consider
(again, budget permitting).

3. Put some money behind a good video card. This is critical for
gaming, where the video card has a bigger impact on performance than
the processor.

4. Be sure to factor into the budget all the external stuff, in
particular a monitor and speakers. It sounds like one of your main
goals involves playing music and watching movies on this system, so it
will probably be a good idea to invest some money in a good monitor
(or alternatively a TV and a video card with TV-output if you want to
go that route), some good speakers and a decent amp. Here is one
place where your budget will play a BIG role, since you can go from
small time for a couple of hundred US$ to the HIGH tens of thousands
of dollars for a top-end setup. It's important to remember though
that speaker and monitor/TV technology are moving forward at a MUCH
slower rate than computer technology. On my own system, which is
hardly top-of-the-line, virtually every component inside the computer
is less than 2 years old (most are less than 1 year old), but my
monitor is going on 5 years old now and the speakers are older still.
It might be worthwhile to get a lower-end computer now and put a bit
more money towards the monitor and speakers with a view to upgrading
the computer a year or two down the road.

-------------
Tony Hill
hilla <underscore> 20 <at> yahoo <dot> ca
Anonymous
a b à CPUs
January 10, 2005 8:10:58 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips (More info?)

On 4 Jan 2005 10:18:47 -0800, "jd" <sickboy2all@aol.com> wrote:

>since many of you seem very knowledgable about processors, i'm going to
>go a bit off topic with a question of my own. excuse my ignorance if
>the answer to this is common knowledge. i have a p4 2.8A with a 533fsb
>and 1mb cache. which i believe is the one and only intel p4 prescott
>without hyper-threading.

Just about. There is also a P4 2.93A processor that is essentially
identical to the chip you have but with a slightly higher clock speed.

> does this mean my mobo is the same as those
>prescotts with ht?

That's a definite "maybe".

The big difference is actually NOT Hyperthreading so much as the bus
speed. All the Prescott chips with Hyperthreading (and I believe all
the Northwoods with Hyperthreading as well, though I wouldn't swear to
that) have an 800MT/s bus speed. With your processor you are only
using a 533MT/s bus speed. Now, that's not to say that your board
definitely could or could not use a processor with the faster bus
speed, in fact we don't know at all.

> and if so, how so? also since i believe it's a 478
>socket job, can i throw an ht enabled p4 on it without any fuss? also,

Again, it will really depend on the bus speed of the processor and
what bus speed your system board supports. There is little to nothing
required from a system board as far as Hyperthreading is concerned
(which is good since HT provides little to no benefit).

>is this a task i can do myself as a relative novice?

Yes. Just a few simple steps involved:

1. Run your computer for a bit with the old chip installed.

2. Turn off the computer and remove the heatsink while it's still warm
(when it cools the heatsink compound tends to act a bit like a glue
and the heatsink becomes rather difficult to remove).

3. Clean off the thermal compound from the base of the heatsink (this
is the only time-consume step.. a bit of rubbing alcohol does wonders
here).

4. Remove the old processor from the socket (really easy, just lift
the leaver and the chip can be easily removed).

5. Place new processor in the socket (it will only fit one way... if
you have to use a hammer to get it in place, you're doing it wrong),
lower the lever to secure it.

6. Apply new thermal compound (probably included with the processor).

7. Replace heatsink (or use new heatsink if one was included with the
processor). Follow the directions included with the heatsink, they
should be quite straight-forward.


The whole process, if you take your time and read the directions,
should take you about 15 minutes.


As hinted at above though, I REALLY wouldn't worry about
hyperthreading unless you have a very specific application that you
know will benefit from it. Typically HT results in virtually no
improvement.

-------------
Tony Hill
hilla <underscore> 20 <at> yahoo <dot> ca
January 10, 2005 9:51:39 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.chips (More info?)

thanks for all the info, tony. very useful : )
!