Does 100% = 100%?

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Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.video (More info?)

Continuing on the CRT/LCD saga...

I would have thought that a Word document that is set to a zoom
setting of "100%" would be more or less the same size on the screen
regardless of the size of the monitor or the resolution setting
(1024x768, 1280x1024, 1600x1200, etc.)?

Apparently, this is not so.

I just ran a test on the brand new Viewsonic VP201S we just bought. I
measured a standard 8.5x11 document in Print Layout View, zoomed to
Page Width, on the screen. The results are:

Setting Actual Width Text
1600 x 1200 8.25" Crisp
1280 x 1024 10.25" Ragged
1152 x 864 11.4" Ragged

What the heck does "100%" mean?

Will this same thing happen on CRTs or is this an anomoly of LCDs? I
don't have one to test on right now.

I think this is a serious problem for buying monitors. An 8.5 x 11
page zoomed to 100% should be very close to 8.5 x 11 no matter what
the hardware settings, in my opinion.

Is that really so hard to do? It seems like just a conversion table.

--
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Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.video (More info?)

On Tue, 03 Aug 2004 22:28:04 -0700, Top Spin <ToppSpin@hotmail.com>
wrote:

>I would have thought that a Word document that is set to a zoom
>setting of "100%" would be more or less the same size on the screen
>regardless of the size of the monitor or the resolution setting
>(1024x768, 1280x1024, 1600x1200, etc.)?
>
>Apparently, this is not so.

>Is that really so hard to do? It seems like just a conversion table.

Word has no idea what kind of monitor you are using and how big the
page image will be for a given resolution. At 1024x768, the monitor
could be a 14.1" LCD (like my ThinkPad), a 17" CRT (like my Mitsubishi
Diamond Plus 70), a 19" CTR (like my NEC MultiSync FE950+), etc. There
is no standard physical dimensions for 1024x768 resolution (even with
LCD panels), so Word cannot set the "100%" view to the size of the
actual physical page.

I used a program some years back called DeScribe that allowed you to
calibrate the screen size. A ruler appeared on the screen and you used
a physical ruler on your monitor to set the screen ruler to exactly 1
inch. After this calibration, the "100%" view was actually pretty
close to the actual page size, since it was calibrated for your
specific monitor. I supposed that Microsoft could add such a feature
to Word if it wanted to. Apparently, Word users have not been
clamoring for this feature.

- -
Gary L.
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On Wed, 04 Aug 2004 14:42:24 -0700, Gary L. <nospam@cox.net> wrote:

>On Tue, 03 Aug 2004 22:28:04 -0700, Top Spin <ToppSpin@hotmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>>I would have thought that a Word document that is set to a zoom
>>setting of "100%" would be more or less the same size on the screen
>>regardless of the size of the monitor or the resolution setting
>>(1024x768, 1280x1024, 1600x1200, etc.)?
>>
>>Apparently, this is not so.
>
>>Is that really so hard to do? It seems like just a conversion table.
>
>Word has no idea what kind of monitor you are using and how big the
>page image will be for a given resolution. At 1024x768, the monitor
>could be a 14.1" LCD (like my ThinkPad), a 17" CRT (like my Mitsubishi
>Diamond Plus 70), a 19" CTR (like my NEC MultiSync FE950+), etc. There
>is no standard physical dimensions for 1024x768 resolution (even with
>LCD panels), so Word cannot set the "100%" view to the size of the
>actual physical page.

I have no idea whether Word knows what size monitor I have, but the OS
knows and it could certainly tell Word.

>I used a program some years back called DeScribe that allowed you to
>calibrate the screen size. A ruler appeared on the screen and you used
>a physical ruler on your monitor to set the screen ruler to exactly 1
>inch. After this calibration, the "100%" view was actually pretty
>close to the actual page size, since it was calibrated for your
>specific monitor.

How was this calibration done? Was it the type of electron gun
calibration available on CRTs? If so, that would be independent of
anything in software. It also would not apply to LCDs which do not
calibrate in that manner.

>I supposed that Microsoft could add such a feature
>to Word if it wanted to. Apparently, Word users have not been
>clamoring for this feature.

This would have to be in trhe OS and independent of any application.

--
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Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.video (More info?)

Top Spin wrote:

> On Wed, 04 Aug 2004 14:42:24 -0700, Gary L. <nospam@cox.net> wrote:
>
>>On Tue, 03 Aug 2004 22:28:04 -0700, Top Spin <ToppSpin@hotmail.com>
>>wrote:
>>
>>>I would have thought that a Word document that is set to a zoom
>>>setting of "100%" would be more or less the same size on the screen
>>>regardless of the size of the monitor or the resolution setting
>>>(1024x768, 1280x1024, 1600x1200, etc.)?
>>>
>>>Apparently, this is not so.
>>
>>>Is that really so hard to do? It seems like just a conversion table.
>>
>>Word has no idea what kind of monitor you are using and how big the
>>page image will be for a given resolution. At 1024x768, the monitor
>>could be a 14.1" LCD (like my ThinkPad), a 17" CRT (like my Mitsubishi
>>Diamond Plus 70), a 19" CTR (like my NEC MultiSync FE950+), etc. There
>>is no standard physical dimensions for 1024x768 resolution (even with
>>LCD panels), so Word cannot set the "100%" view to the size of the
>>actual physical page.
>
> I have no idea whether Word knows what size monitor I have, but the OS
> knows and it could certainly tell Word.

How does it know this? Where is the monitor size setting in Windows?

>>I used a program some years back called DeScribe that allowed you to
>>calibrate the screen size. A ruler appeared on the screen and you used
>>a physical ruler on your monitor to set the screen ruler to exactly 1
>>inch. After this calibration, the "100%" view was actually pretty
>>close to the actual page size, since it was calibrated for your
>>specific monitor.
>
> How was this calibration done? Was it the type of electron gun
> calibration available on CRTs? If so, that would be independent of
> anything in software. It also would not apply to LCDs which do not
> calibrate in that manner.

Huh? It was done in software entirely--Describe displayed a ruler on the
screen, you put a real wooden or metal or plastic ruler against the screen
and moved a control until they matched. From that point on Describe scaled
everything so that one inch in the document was displayed as one inch on
the screen.

I'm a bit puzzled as to how a word processor would go about performing "the
type of electron gun calibration available on CRTs".

>>I supposed that Microsoft could add such a feature
>>to Word if it wanted to. Apparently, Word users have not been
>>clamoring for this feature.
>
> This would have to be in trhe OS and independent of any application.

Funny, the Describe people managed to implement it in an application.
Perhaps you should contact them and inform them that they have done the
impossible--given what happened to Describe they could probably use the
laugh.

--
--John
Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

 

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Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.video (More info?)

On Wed, 04 Aug 2004 21:18:14 -0400, "J. Clarke"
<jclarke@nospam.invalid> wrote:


>>>I used a program some years back called DeScribe that allowed you to
>>>calibrate the screen size. A ruler appeared on the screen and you used
>>>a physical ruler on your monitor to set the screen ruler to exactly 1
>>>inch. After this calibration, the "100%" view was actually pretty
>>>close to the actual page size, since it was calibrated for your
>>>specific monitor.
>>
>> How was this calibration done? Was it the type of electron gun
>> calibration available on CRTs? If so, that would be independent of
>> anything in software. It also would not apply to LCDs which do not
>> calibrate in that manner.
>
>Huh? It was done in software entirely--Describe displayed a ruler on the
>screen, you put a real wooden or metal or plastic ruler against the screen
>and moved a control until they matched. From that point on Describe scaled
>everything so that one inch in the document was displayed as one inch on
>the screen.

Exactly. And you could adjust the scaling if you changed monitors or
resolutions. A simple solution to this problem.

>I'm a bit puzzled as to how a word processor would go about performing "the
>type of electron gun calibration available on CRTs".
>
>>>I supposed that Microsoft could add such a feature
>>>to Word if it wanted to. Apparently, Word users have not been
>>>clamoring for this feature.
>>
>> This would have to be in trhe OS and independent of any application.

No, because it wasn't done automatically. You simply adjusted the
"zoom" in the display window until the ruler displayed on the screen
matched the physical ruler you held up against the screen.

You can do this with Word if you like: hold a ruler against the screen
and adjust the zoom percentage until the screen ruler at the top of
the document matches the physical ruler. It takes some trial and
error, since the screen doesn't rescale until you click "OK." I just
did it with the display on my ThinkPad 14.1" display at 1024x768, and
I found that 92% gave me a pretty close match of screen to paper size.
DeScribe just made this task a little easier.

>Funny, the Describe people managed to implement it in an application.
>Perhaps you should contact them and inform them that they have done the
>impossible--given what happened to Describe they could probably use the
>laugh.

DeScribe was a casualty of the OS/2-Windows war (although they also
had Win16 and Win32 versions on the program CD). DeScribe was a very
nice program in many ways, and it was a shame when the company went
out of business (and the owner refused to sell the program to someone
who would continue to develop it).
- -
Gary L.
Reply to the newsgroup only

 

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Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.video (More info?)

"J. Clarke" <jclarke@nospam.invalid> wrote in message
news:ces2iu0aea@news3.newsguy.com...
> > I have no idea whether Word knows what size monitor I have, but the OS
> > knows and it could certainly tell Word.
>
> How does it know this? Where is the monitor size setting in Windows?

Image size information is available in the display's EDID
data. Whether or not this information is used by the OS
or any given application is, of course, a separate question.

Bob M.