Any else have (has had) a faulty 6800 graphics card?

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia (More info?)

My motherboard is a DFI LanParty nForce2 chipset + Athlon processor.
Standard processor settings and voltages (i.e. no overclocking).

The first thing I noticed after installing my Galaxy 6800 GT graphics card was
that the LanParty splash screen was corrupted with white pixels.

I was able to boot into Windows XP, but the graphics screen was covered in
random sometimes regular blocks of pixels of the wrong colour. Thankfully I
could still use the system to shutdown cleanly.

Resetting and going into the BIOS, the text screen was completely garbled as
if it was a graphics screen rather than a text screen. Only a tiny handful of
characters were recognisable.

I've now tried the card in a second PC (also a nForce2 chipset). The screen
corruption was identical. I've searched and can find no reference to
incompatibility between nForce2 and the 6800.

I suspect a faulty card and I am going through the painful(?) process of
RMAing the card. Of course the person I need to speak to is away until Tuesday
:-(.

I've searched various web sites and forums and I have come across similar
descriptions of faulty card, including some specific postings about the Galaxy
card. Some postings mention the extra power connector being important - I have
checked this connection carefully.

Am I just very unlucky or has anyone else had a faulty 6800 card?

I considered installing the drivers (even with the screen corruption it is
still just about usable) and *under*clocking the GPU and RAM. This may
invalidate the warranty so I am now reluctant to do this. I'd be fascinated to
know whether it fixed the problem.

Do the symtoms suggest faulty GPU or faulty RAM?
Or is it possible that there is a magic setting in my BIOS?
Or is the card just duff?

regards...

--Gary
16 answers Last reply
More about faulty 6800 graphics card
  1. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia (More info?)

    Review previous post - scroll down.

    The system you describe seem to be faulty card.
    Strange RMA department person will back on Tuesday? Curiously strange.
    During the meantime, are you using a 350W PSU and under with your PC rig? If
    so, try another PSU like about 350 or higher wattage and see if it making
    any differences. If problem remain the same, continue the RMA on Tuesday
    when that person come back. Or if you got that card locally, return to the
    place of purchase and exchange for another.

    CapFusion,...


    "Gary Morton" <gary@alma.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
    news:TAK2d.1200$wM7.14466144@news-text.cableinet.net...
    > My motherboard is a DFI LanParty nForce2 chipset + Athlon processor.
    > Standard processor settings and voltages (i.e. no overclocking).
    >
    > The first thing I noticed after installing my Galaxy 6800 GT graphics card
    > was that the LanParty splash screen was corrupted with white pixels.
    >
    > I was able to boot into Windows XP, but the graphics screen was covered in
    > random sometimes regular blocks of pixels of the wrong colour. Thankfully
    > I could still use the system to shutdown cleanly.
    >
    > Resetting and going into the BIOS, the text screen was completely garbled
    > as if it was a graphics screen rather than a text screen. Only a tiny
    > handful of characters were recognisable.
    >
    > I've now tried the card in a second PC (also a nForce2 chipset). The
    > screen corruption was identical. I've searched and can find no reference
    > to incompatibility between nForce2 and the 6800.
    >
    > I suspect a faulty card and I am going through the painful(?) process of
    > RMAing the card. Of course the person I need to speak to is away until
    > Tuesday :-(.
    >
    > I've searched various web sites and forums and I have come across similar
    > descriptions of faulty card, including some specific postings about the
    > Galaxy card. Some postings mention the extra power connector being
    > important - I have checked this connection carefully.
    >
    > Am I just very unlucky or has anyone else had a faulty 6800 card?
    >
    > I considered installing the drivers (even with the screen corruption it is
    > still just about usable) and *under*clocking the GPU and RAM. This may
    > invalidate the warranty so I am now reluctant to do this. I'd be
    > fascinated to know whether it fixed the problem.
    >
    > Do the symtoms suggest faulty GPU or faulty RAM?
    > Or is it possible that there is a magic setting in my BIOS?
    > Or is the card just duff?
    >
    > regards...
    >
    > --Gary
    >
  2. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia (More info?)

    CapFusion wrote:

    > Review previous post - scroll down.
    >
    > The system you describe seem to be faulty card.
    > Strange RMA department person will back on Tuesday? Curiously strange.
    > During the meantime, are you using a 350W PSU and under with your PC rig? If
    > so, try another PSU like about 350 or higher wattage and see if it making
    > any differences. If problem remain the same, continue the RMA on Tuesday
    > when that person come back. Or if you got that card locally, return to the
    > place of purchase and exchange for another.
    >
    > CapFusion,...
    >

    I have a new 400W (450W peak) Seasonic "Super Tornado" PSU. This is much
    quieter than my Q-Tek 500W PSU, despite the "Tornado" name!

    Note that the 500W rating of the Q-Tek is peak and this brand seems to have a
    very poor reputation. My friend also had the same Q-Tek PSU until it blew up.

    I bought the card from a small company which has a good reputation according
    to my research on the web. The downside appears to be that the person who
    needs to agree that the card is faulty is away for a few days. This also
    explains why my email was unanswered. Thankfully I was able to get through on
    the phone.

    There is little chance of finding such a high spec graphics card locally, so
    mail order was my only choice. This is my first Nvidia card - not a good start.

    They say never buy something that is leading edge and has only just been
    released to the market - let other people find the teething problems.

    regards...

    --Gary
  3. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia (More info?)

    "Gary Morton" <gary@alma.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
    news:TAK2d.1200$wM7.14466144@news-text.cableinet.net...
    > My motherboard is a DFI LanParty nForce2 chipset + Athlon processor.
    > Standard processor settings and voltages (i.e. no overclocking).
    >
    > The first thing I noticed after installing my Galaxy 6800 GT graphics card
    was
    > that the LanParty splash screen was corrupted with white pixels.
    >
    > I was able to boot into Windows XP, but the graphics screen was covered in
    > random sometimes regular blocks of pixels of the wrong colour. Thankfully
    I
    > could still use the system to shutdown cleanly.
    >
    > Resetting and going into the BIOS, the text screen was completely garbled
    as
    > if it was a graphics screen rather than a text screen. Only a tiny handful
    of
    > characters were recognisable.
    >
    > I've now tried the card in a second PC (also a nForce2 chipset). The
    screen
    > corruption was identical. I've searched and can find no reference to
    > incompatibility between nForce2 and the 6800.
    >
    > I suspect a faulty card and I am going through the painful(?) process of
    > RMAing the card. Of course the person I need to speak to is away until
    Tuesday
    > :-(.
    >
    > I've searched various web sites and forums and I have come across similar
    > descriptions of faulty card, including some specific postings about the
    Galaxy
    > card. Some postings mention the extra power connector being important - I
    have
    > checked this connection carefully.
    >
    > Am I just very unlucky or has anyone else had a faulty 6800 card?
    >
    > I considered installing the drivers (even with the screen corruption it is
    > still just about usable) and *under*clocking the GPU and RAM. This may
    > invalidate the warranty so I am now reluctant to do this. I'd be
    fascinated to
    > know whether it fixed the problem.
    >
    > Do the symtoms suggest faulty GPU or faulty RAM?
    > Or is it possible that there is a magic setting in my BIOS?
    > Or is the card just duff?

    Dude, what a horror story...

    Anyway.

    Maybe this is the start of a 6800 fiasco...

    OUCH

    Expensive card.. gone bad... wasted... destroyed... overheated... YIKES

    Oh my god... warranty gone... because of overclocking (idiots)

    Well not you ofcourse....

    Few...
  4. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia (More info?)

    Skybuck Flying wrote:


    >
    > Dude, what a horror story...
    >
    > Anyway.
    >
    > Maybe this is the start of a 6800 fiasco...
    >
    > OUCH
    >
    > Expensive card.. gone bad... wasted... destroyed... overheated... YIKES

    I think that you are being a little dramatic.

    The card works but has symptoms which suggest a faulty memory chip or chips.
    The fan on the Galaxy card is working and it is relatively quiet.
    I'm not convinced that it is a heat problem, but I have read postings where
    heat does appear to be a factor which pushes a marginal card over the edge.

    > Oh my god... warranty gone... because of overclocking (idiots)
    >
    > Well not you ofcourse....
    >
    > Few...
    >

    I haven't even installed the Windows drivers, let alone overclocked the card.
    My old ATI card is back in the machine.

    BTW the Galaxy comes as standard at 370MHz core which is 20MHz more than normal.

    I look forward to other postings to find out whether 6800 cards in general
    have a higher than normal failure rate, or whether only certain brands have a
    problem.

    regards...

    --Gary
  5. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia (More info?)

    I had the exact problem with an MSI 6800NX which was a vanilla 6800. I
    wasn't the only one with the problem, there was a whole thread about it
    on the MSI website.

    I RMAed my card and got my money back. So 'twas definitely a dodgy card.

    Gary Morton wrote:
    > Skybuck Flying wrote:
    >
    >
    >>
    >> Dude, what a horror story...
    >>
    >> Anyway.
    >>
    >> Maybe this is the start of a 6800 fiasco...
    >>
    >> OUCH
    >>
    >> Expensive card.. gone bad... wasted... destroyed... overheated... YIKES
    >
    >
    > I think that you are being a little dramatic.
    >
    > The card works but has symptoms which suggest a faulty memory chip or
    > chips. The fan on the Galaxy card is working and it is relatively quiet.
    > I'm not convinced that it is a heat problem, but I have read postings
    > where heat does appear to be a factor which pushes a marginal card over
    > the edge.
    >
    >> Oh my god... warranty gone... because of overclocking (idiots)
    >>
    >> Well not you ofcourse....
    >>
    >> Few...
    >>
    >
    > I haven't even installed the Windows drivers, let alone overclocked the
    > card.
    > My old ATI card is back in the machine.
    >
    > BTW the Galaxy comes as standard at 370MHz core which is 20MHz more than
    > normal.
    >
    > I look forward to other postings to find out whether 6800 cards in
    > general have a higher than normal failure rate, or whether only certain
    > brands have a problem.
    >
    > regards...
    >
    > --Gary
    >
  6. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia (More info?)

    "Gary Morton" <gary@alma.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
    news:dVM2d.1232$S7.14633074@news-text.cableinet.net...
    >
    > I look forward to other postings to find out whether 6800 cards in general
    > have a higher than normal failure rate, or whether only certain brands
    > have a problem.
    >

    Did you plug both power connectors into the video card?

    To be honest, I think you would need at least an Antec Tru Power 480 for
    this card. What other components do you have in your PC? These cards are
    very power hungry.
  7. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia (More info?)

    Gary Morton <gary@alma.demon.co.uk> wrote in
    news:TAK2d.1200$wM7.14466144@news-text.cableinet.net:

    > My motherboard is a DFI LanParty nForce2 chipset + Athlon processor.
    > Standard processor settings and voltages (i.e. no overclocking).
    >
    > The first thing I noticed after installing my Galaxy 6800 GT graphics
    > card was that the LanParty splash screen was corrupted with white
    > pixels.
    >
    > I was able to boot into Windows XP, but the graphics screen was
    > covered in random sometimes regular blocks of pixels of the wrong
    > colour. Thankfully I could still use the system to shutdown cleanly.
    >
    > Resetting and going into the BIOS, the text screen was completely
    > garbled as if it was a graphics screen rather than a text screen. Only
    > a tiny handful of characters were recognisable.
    >
    > I've now tried the card in a second PC (also a nForce2 chipset). The
    > screen corruption was identical. I've searched and can find no
    > reference to incompatibility between nForce2 and the 6800.
    >
    > I suspect a faulty card and I am going through the painful(?) process
    > of RMAing the card. Of course the person I need to speak to is away
    > until Tuesday
    >:-(.
    >
    > I've searched various web sites and forums and I have come across
    > similar descriptions of faulty card, including some specific postings
    > about the Galaxy card. Some postings mention the extra power connector
    > being important - I have checked this connection carefully.
    >
    > Am I just very unlucky or has anyone else had a faulty 6800 card?
    >
    > I considered installing the drivers (even with the screen corruption
    > it is still just about usable) and *under*clocking the GPU and RAM.
    > This may invalidate the warranty so I am now reluctant to do this. I'd
    > be fascinated to know whether it fixed the problem.
    >
    > Do the symtoms suggest faulty GPU or faulty RAM?
    > Or is it possible that there is a magic setting in my BIOS?
    > Or is the card just duff?
    >
    > regards...
    >
    > --Gary

    I too had a bad 6800GT (PNY). It was horrible. BIOS screen dump
    corruptions, and/or random Windows XP crashes out of the blue,
    constantly.

    I returned the card and received a new PNY 6800GT, which interestingly,
    was physically different - it was a different color PCB and had a metal
    bar running the length of the top of the card. No crashes since.

    So I say the card is "duff". You should try to exchange it if at all
    possible, and look for the new card having a metal bar (if that's not
    just a PNY thing).

    Bill M.
  8. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia (More info?)

    Wilhelm wrote:


    >
    >
    > I too had a bad 6800GT (PNY). It was horrible. BIOS screen dump
    > corruptions, and/or random Windows XP crashes out of the blue,
    > constantly.
    >
    > I returned the card and received a new PNY 6800GT, which interestingly,
    > was physically different - it was a different color PCB and had a metal
    > bar running the length of the top of the card. No crashes since.
    >
    > So I say the card is "duff". You should try to exchange it if at all
    > possible, and look for the new card having a metal bar (if that's not
    > just a PNY thing).
    >
    > Bill M.

    Hi Bill,

    thanks for the posting. The Galaxy already has a metal bar along the top.
    I have never seen this before and wondered if it was for decoration or served
    some useful purpose.

    I hear on Tuesday what the RMA person says, but I'm pretty much convinced that
    the card is duff.

    regards...

    --Gary
  9. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia (More info?)

    "Gary Morton" <gary@alma.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
    news:eOM2d.1230$Ny.14759983@news-text.cableinet.net...
    >

    [snip]
    > I have a new 400W (450W peak) Seasonic "Super Tornado" PSU. This is much
    > quieter than my Q-Tek 500W PSU, despite the "Tornado" name!
    >
    > Note that the 500W rating of the Q-Tek is peak and this brand seems to
    > have a very poor reputation. My friend also had the same Q-Tek PSU until
    > it blew up.
    [/snip]

    Did you try with the Seasonic PSU? Did it make any difference? Otherwise,
    RMA is in order.
    Sorry, Q-Tek and Seasonic brand PSU, I have not used or experience with
    them. I mostly use Antec / Enermax type for testing and personal use.


    [snip]
    >
    > I bought the card from a small company which has a good reputation
    > according to my research on the web. The downside appears to be that the
    > person who needs to agree that the card is faulty is away for a few days.
    > This also explains why my email was unanswered. Thankfully I was able to
    > get through on the phone.
    >
    [/snip]
    Still interesting. One person will take care and verify protential bad card
    prior for accepting return?
    Anyway, hope everything on Tuesday will work out for you.


    [snip]
    > There is little chance of finding such a high spec graphics card locally,
    > so mail order was my only choice. This is my first Nvidia card - not a
    > good start.
    >
    > They say never buy something that is leading edge and has only just been
    > released to the market - let other people find the teething problems.

    [/snip]
    Sorry to hear your unfortunate occurance for your first try on nVidia type
    product. Newer release card normally will have quirk that will need to be
    address as it mature.Normally gamer / tester or similar will take this path
    since they seem to have more resources to handle these unexpected or should
    I say "may expect".

    CapFusion,...
  10. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia (More info?)

    "Gary Morton" <gary@alma.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
    news:TAK2d.1200$wM7.14466144@news-text.cableinet.net...
    > My motherboard is a DFI LanParty nForce2 chipset + Athlon processor.
    > Standard processor settings and voltages (i.e. no overclocking).
    >
    > The first thing I noticed after installing my Galaxy 6800 GT graphics card
    > was that the LanParty splash screen was corrupted with white pixels.
    >
    > I was able to boot into Windows XP, but the graphics screen was covered in
    > random sometimes regular blocks of pixels of the wrong colour. Thankfully
    > I could still use the system to shutdown cleanly.
    >
    > Resetting and going into the BIOS, the text screen was completely garbled
    > as if it was a graphics screen rather than a text screen. Only a tiny
    > handful of characters were recognisable.
    >
    > I've now tried the card in a second PC (also a nForce2 chipset). The
    > screen corruption was identical. I've searched and can find no reference
    > to incompatibility between nForce2 and the 6800.
    >
    > I suspect a faulty card and I am going through the painful(?) process of
    > RMAing the card. Of course the person I need to speak to is away until
    > Tuesday :-(.
    >
    > I've searched various web sites and forums and I have come across similar
    > descriptions of faulty card, including some specific postings about the
    > Galaxy card. Some postings mention the extra power connector being
    > important - I have checked this connection carefully.
    >
    > Am I just very unlucky or has anyone else had a faulty 6800 card?
    >
    > I considered installing the drivers (even with the screen corruption it is
    > still just about usable) and *under*clocking the GPU and RAM. This may
    > invalidate the warranty so I am now reluctant to do this. I'd be
    > fascinated to know whether it fixed the problem.
    >
    > Do the symtoms suggest faulty GPU or faulty RAM?
    > Or is it possible that there is a magic setting in my BIOS?
    > Or is the card just duff?
    >
    > regards...
    >
    > --Gary

    My BFG 6800oc went out after 3 weeks.

    Ozman
    >
  11. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia (More info?)

    yes, i had a gigabyte 6800 card die 2 weeks after i got it, they exchanged
    it for a new one.
    this card does not have a fan on the heatsink and just today i noticed that
    it was so hot that i cant touch the heatsink.

    the heatsink temp is 63c, using a multimeter temp probe.


    "CapFusion" <CapFusion.Yo.@hotmail.Hehe.Com> wrote in message
    news:nq-dnbCmdofAndLcRVn-sA@megapath.net...
    >
    > "Gary Morton" <gary@alma.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
    > news:eOM2d.1230$Ny.14759983@news-text.cableinet.net...
    > >
    >
    > [snip]
    > > I have a new 400W (450W peak) Seasonic "Super Tornado" PSU. This is much
    > > quieter than my Q-Tek 500W PSU, despite the "Tornado" name!
    > >
    > > Note that the 500W rating of the Q-Tek is peak and this brand seems to
    > > have a very poor reputation. My friend also had the same Q-Tek PSU until
    > > it blew up.
    > [/snip]
    >
    > Did you try with the Seasonic PSU? Did it make any difference? Otherwise,
    > RMA is in order.
    > Sorry, Q-Tek and Seasonic brand PSU, I have not used or experience with
    > them. I mostly use Antec / Enermax type for testing and personal use.
    >
    >
    > [snip]
    > >
    > > I bought the card from a small company which has a good reputation
    > > according to my research on the web. The downside appears to be that the
    > > person who needs to agree that the card is faulty is away for a few
    days.
    > > This also explains why my email was unanswered. Thankfully I was able to
    > > get through on the phone.
    > >
    > [/snip]
    > Still interesting. One person will take care and verify protential bad
    card
    > prior for accepting return?
    > Anyway, hope everything on Tuesday will work out for you.
    >
    >
    > [snip]
    > > There is little chance of finding such a high spec graphics card
    locally,
    > > so mail order was my only choice. This is my first Nvidia card - not a
    > > good start.
    > >
    > > They say never buy something that is leading edge and has only just been
    > > released to the market - let other people find the teething problems.
    >
    > [/snip]
    > Sorry to hear your unfortunate occurance for your first try on nVidia type
    > product. Newer release card normally will have quirk that will need to be
    > address as it mature.Normally gamer / tester or similar will take this
    path
    > since they seem to have more resources to handle these unexpected or
    should
    > I say "may expect".
    >
    > CapFusion,...
    >
    >
  12. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia (More info?)

    "rob" <robert67759@_optusnet.com.au> wrote in message
    news:4150e5be$0$20124$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
    > yes, i had a gigabyte 6800 card die 2 weeks after i got it, they exchanged
    > it for a new one.
    > this card does not have a fan on the heatsink and just today i noticed
    > that
    > it was so hot that i cant touch the heatsink.
    >
    > the heatsink temp is 63c, using a multimeter temp probe.
    >

    That interesting..... All 6800 series card have somekind of HSF.
    This card should have a HSF and not just HS only.
    According to this site -
    http://www.gfe.com.hk/product/Geforce_6800.htm

    You may need to check with them if they have change the design or simply
    forgotten.
    Is there a space where a fan should be?

    CapFusion,...
  13. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia (More info?)

    "CapFusion" <CapFusion.Yo.@hotmail.Hehe.Com> wrote in message
    news:lr-dne7IZbz1UszcRVn-vg@megapath.net...
    >
    > "rob" <robert67759@_optusnet.com.au> wrote in message
    > news:4150e5be$0$20124$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
    >> yes, i had a gigabyte 6800 card die 2 weeks after i got it, they
    >> exchanged
    >> it for a new one.
    >> this card does not have a fan on the heatsink and just today i noticed
    >> that
    >> it was so hot that i cant touch the heatsink.
    >>
    >> the heatsink temp is 63c, using a multimeter temp probe.
    >>
    >
    > That interesting..... All 6800 series card have somekind of HSF.
    > This card should have a HSF and not just HS only.
    > According to this site -
    > http://www.gfe.com.hk/product/Geforce_6800.htm
    >
    > You may need to check with them if they have change the design or simply
    > forgotten.
    > Is there a space where a fan should be?
    >
    > CapFusion,...
    >
    There's no way that card is even running without a fan. It just isn't
    feasible anymore.
  14. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia (More info?)

    "Kill Bill" <a@b.c> wrote in message
    news:4Rk4d.16775$XW.11751@twister.socal.rr.com...
    >
    > "CapFusion" <CapFusion.Yo.@hotmail.Hehe.Com> wrote in message
    > news:lr-dne7IZbz1UszcRVn-vg@megapath.net...
    > >
    > > "rob" <robert67759@_optusnet.com.au> wrote in message
    > > news:4150e5be$0$20124$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
    > >> yes, i had a gigabyte 6800 card die 2 weeks after i got it, they
    > >> exchanged
    > >> it for a new one.
    > >> this card does not have a fan on the heatsink and just today i noticed
    > >> that
    > >> it was so hot that i cant touch the heatsink.
    > >>
    > >> the heatsink temp is 63c, using a multimeter temp probe.
    > >>
    > >
    > > That interesting..... All 6800 series card have somekind of HSF.
    > > This card should have a HSF and not just HS only.
    > > According to this site -
    > > http://www.gfe.com.hk/product/Geforce_6800.htm
    > >
    > > You may need to check with them if they have change the design or simply
    > > forgotten.
    > > Is there a space where a fan should be?
    > >
    > > CapFusion,...
    > >
    > There's no way that card is even running without a fan. It just isn't
    > feasible anymore.
    >
    >
    no it uses passive cooling, no fan at all.
  15. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia (More info?)

    "rob" <robert67759@_optusnet.com.au> wrote in message
    news:41521a9f$0$20125$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
    >>
    >>
    > no it uses passive cooling, no fan at all.
    >

    Oh wow, 6800 series without a fan is like asking for trouble.

    CapFusion,...
  16. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia (More info?)

    Just a quick note to say that I have finally received the replacement graphics
    card and it is A-OK.

    I can finally play Doom3 ;-).

    On the downside - the original package contained a games bundle, whereas the
    replacement box did not bundle any games (it's the exact same Galaxy 6800 GT
    package). I'll take this up with the vendor.

    Also I stumbled across a review on www.hexus.net of a vanilla 6800 graphics
    card. The reviewer said that they had been sent two faulty cards before
    receiving a good one. Seems like Galaxy may have had some kind of quality
    problem. In the same review it is claimed that Galaxy have resolved this, but
    possibly not otherwise my first card would have been OK (I'm assuming that
    newer cards come with the games bundle).

    regards...

    --Gary
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