6800 price update...straight dope on what's up...

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia (More info?)

Please correct me where I'm wrong...
pixel pipelines is the key to card performance, but many times
(purposefully?) kept off the product description on sellers' websites.

I use epinions for reviews, but pricewatch usually has the lowest price
links even if they allow the sellers sometimes to place their products
into the wrong categories.

6800 LE, many times mixed up with the 6800 vanilla/NU
8 pixel pipes overclockable to 12?
250$ on newegg.com or many other sites.

6800 OC,
8 pipes overclockable to 12, sometimes 16?
315$ on monarch
http://www.monarchcomputer.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=190477&AFFIL=bizr&NR=1

I've read there is about a 20% chance of NOT unlocking the 4 pixels
when overclocking, but I estimate the failure rate at lower than that.
Use Riva tuner to "unlock"/overclock, as described here
http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview.cfm?catid=31&threadid=1500237

6800 NU or "vanilla", or just "6800"
It's called many things, but most of all 'confusing'. The reason is
described in my previous post, but comes down to this being a tool for
nvidia and the resellers to get people to believe they're buying a 6800
when they're only getting an "LE" - big difference. Just do a "geforce
6800" search on newegg.com - over a dozen returns, with the LE coming
within 15$ of a "6800" no one can tell is the LE or the NU(again the
term "NU" is a term made up by users in an attempt to form order out of
the confusion, but no sellers use it or any other clear identifier for
the standard 6800!!)
Is this a 6800NU or LE? There are no pixel pipelines outlined in the
tech specs, so you guess because I can't tell!
http://www.newegg.com/app/viewproductdesc.asp?description=14-122-193&DEPA=1

6800 GT,
16 pipes,
350-400$
http://www.gameve.com/gve/Store/ProductDetails.aspx?sku=VC-PNY-005
(349$)

6800 Ultra
16 pipes,
about 500$
http://www.buyxg.com/store/item.asp?key=VC-129-101 (463$)

I don't blame nvidia for their marketing plan of confusion. Business
is business, and the way it's laid out now may allow for some of us to
get cards cheaper than others. The 6800 cards are great...even the
6800 LE - no one can deny(why would I be writing so much on this if it
wasn't a notable product!). There is a lot of time wasted searching
for info on the cards, though, for those that do eventually (try
to)find out. If Nvidia is watching this post(I bet they are!) please
email me, I have ideas on how we both can benefit. I'm putting up a
website to clarify things, and nvidia, the sellers like newegg, the
manufacturers like BFG, and the rest all can benefit if we all
coordinate bill371@twmi.rr.com

 

[DaveL]

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia (More info?)

The only one confused is you. Nvidia is not trying to fool anybody. 6800
cards are typically called "NU" by us usenet people. 6800LE cards are
clearly called 6800LE. Newegg clearly states in all their ads for 6800LE
cards, "Pixel Pipelines: 8". If you come across any e-tailer not being
clear about which cards are LE and which aren't, then don't buy from them.

Nowhere on Monarch's site does it say "8 pipes overclockable to 12,
sometimes 16?" It does say for the BFG OC card, "Core Clock 350MHz (vs.
325MHZ standard)"

Sorry, I just don't understand what your beef is.

DaveL




"Chezwick T. Feeglebrox III esquire" <bill371@twmi.rr.com> wrote in message
news:1107365190.369003.316170@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
> Please correct me where I'm wrong...
> pixel pipelines is the key to card performance, but many times
> (purposefully?) kept off the product description on sellers' websites.
>
> I use epinions for reviews, but pricewatch usually has the lowest price
> links even if they allow the sellers sometimes to place their products
> into the wrong categories.
>
> 6800 LE, many times mixed up with the 6800 vanilla/NU
> 8 pixel pipes overclockable to 12?
> 250$ on newegg.com or many other sites.
>
> 6800 OC,
> 8 pipes overclockable to 12, sometimes 16?
> 315$ on monarch
> http://www.monarchcomputer.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=190477&AFFIL=bizr&NR=1
>
> I've read there is about a 20% chance of NOT unlocking the 4 pixels
> when overclocking, but I estimate the failure rate at lower than that.
> Use Riva tuner to "unlock"/overclock, as described here
> http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview.cfm?catid=31&threadid=1500237
>
> 6800 NU or "vanilla", or just "6800"
> It's called many things, but most of all 'confusing'. The reason is
> described in my previous post, but comes down to this being a tool for
> nvidia and the resellers to get people to believe they're buying a 6800
> when they're only getting an "LE" - big difference. Just do a "geforce
> 6800" search on newegg.com - over a dozen returns, with the LE coming
> within 15$ of a "6800" no one can tell is the LE or the NU(again the
> term "NU" is a term made up by users in an attempt to form order out of
> the confusion, but no sellers use it or any other clear identifier for
> the standard 6800!!)
> Is this a 6800NU or LE? There are no pixel pipelines outlined in the
> tech specs, so you guess because I can't tell!
> http://www.newegg.com/app/viewproductdesc.asp?description=14-122-193&DEPA=1
>
> 6800 GT,
> 16 pipes,
> 350-400$
> http://www.gameve.com/gve/Store/ProductDetails.aspx?sku=VC-PNY-005
> (349$)
>
> 6800 Ultra
> 16 pipes,
> about 500$
> http://www.buyxg.com/store/item.asp?key=VC-129-101 (463$)
>
> I don't blame nvidia for their marketing plan of confusion. Business
> is business, and the way it's laid out now may allow for some of us to
> get cards cheaper than others. The 6800 cards are great...even the
> 6800 LE - no one can deny(why would I be writing so much on this if it
> wasn't a notable product!). There is a lot of time wasted searching
> for info on the cards, though, for those that do eventually (try
> to)find out. If Nvidia is watching this post(I bet they are!) please
> email me, I have ideas on how we both can benefit. I'm putting up a
> website to clarify things, and nvidia, the sellers like newegg, the
> manufacturers like BFG, and the rest all can benefit if we all
> coordinate bill371@twmi.rr.com
>

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia (More info?)

I never said I had a beef - that is an incorrect characterization.
I stated, clearly, facts that you have confirmed.

"6800 cards are typically called "NU" by us usenet people."
-yes, of course, I think I made this clear also. Me: 'the
term "NU" is a term made up by users...'

"Nowhere on Monarch's site does it say.." I never meant to attribute
anything to monarch's site, other than price. The 8-12 overclocking
was just common knowledge added.

"Newegg clearly states in all their a­ds for 6800LE
cards, "Pixel Pipelines: 8". "
Thanks for bringing this up, I will reiterate what I've already said in
hope to clarify...
Newegg does not clearly, or at all, state how many pixel pipelines in
most of their offerings. I guess you did a specific search on newegg
to find the one lonely buried LE offering they have, not on the search
that most would do "geforce 6800", which is the one I referred you to.
There is only one offering of LE, and it curiously does say 8 pipes. I
say 'curiously', because the many many other offerings, the ones buyers
looking for a 6800NU would find, very clearly DON'T have ANY reference
to pipes.
tell me what card is this!:
http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=14-140-045&depa=1

or this?
http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=14-170-056&depa=1
or maybe...[well, i could go on, and you get the idea - THEY'RE ALL LE
CARDS MASQUERADING AS STRAIGHT 6800 CARDS]
oh dear, still no reference to pixel pipes after they clearly showed
the pipes for the one lonely clear LE offering, that most of those
searching for a new nvidia card wouldn't go to...
Ahah!, why would they do such a thing...hmmm,...would it be because
those looking for the 6800 vanilla would buy that 275$ card thinking
they were getting a straight 12 pipe 6800 "NU"?

Again, I don't hold this marketing technique against newegg or
nvidia,... it's simply business. I've got ideas on how nvidia can do
better, though, for themselves, thier customers, vendors, etc. so they
might do well to contact me!

 

[DaveL]

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia (More info?)

Because you have an odd setting in your email program I can't quote you.

Newegg has three 6800LEs for sale. This is how to search. Click on "Video
cards". Under the search critiea, in the chipset selection menu, choose
6800LE. They all say "Pixel Pipelines: 8"

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=14-140-045&depa=1
Easy. It's a 6800.

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=14-170-056&depa=1
Another 6800.

No need to say how many pipes they have since all 6800s have 12. Newegg is
cool and tells people up front that the LE cards only have 8 pipes. That
way some dipshit who buys one can't come back claiming false advertising.

DaveL

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia (More info?)

You're right, I just checked the Rosewill site...and it clearly states
it's 12 pixel pipes. But why would they sell an 8 bit card for 15$
less than the 12 bit better card? That doesn't make sense.

I'll post a public apology to everyone I implicated, next post. Sorry,
it simply didn't make sense, and I was involved in two almost identical
situation where the companies were pawning off their products as
different products, but obviously I made a mistake here. In those
other two cases, though, which didn't involve computer products, I
found out the hard way the product was fraudulent.

Newegg has always been a good site, but im still curious about the 15$
price difference. That means the 6800OC is about 70$ more expensive
than the 6800NU?

 

[DaveL]

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia (More info?)

"Chezwick T. Feeglebrox III esquire" <bill371@twmi.rr.com> wrote in message
news:1107372637.972893.108650@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
> You're right, I just checked the Rosewill site...and it clearly states
> it's 12 pixel pipes. But why would they sell an 8 bit card for 15$
> less than the 12 bit better card? That doesn't make sense.
>
> I'll post a public apology to everyone I implicated, next post. Sorry,
> it simply didn't make sense, and I was involved in two almost identical
> situation where the companies were pawning off their products as
> different products, but obviously I made a mistake here. In those
> other two cases, though, which didn't involve computer products, I
> found out the hard way the product was fraudulent.
>
> Newegg has always been a good site, but im still curious about the 15$
> price difference. That means the 6800OC is about 70$ more expensive
> than the 6800NU?
>
I see the price difference between the 6800LE and 6800 at about $30. Some
people are buying the LEs with the hopes of unlocking extra pipes. I would
think this could artificially inflate the demand and consequently the price.


The extra price BFG is charging is not only for factory over-clocking but
also for better, quieter cooling.
http://techreport.com/reviews/2005q1/6600gt-agp-comparo/index.x?pg=1

Some people have bought 6600GT cards only to upgrade the cooling when they
could have even saved money by buying the BFG in the first place.

DaveL

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia (More info?)

unlocking extra LE pipes beyond the 12?
newegg difference is 249 vs 265$, about 16$

Is the OC 8 pipes or 12?

 

[DaveL]

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia (More info?)

"Chezwick T. Feeglebrox III esquire" <bill371@twmi.rr.com> wrote in message
news:1107374859.999062.248550@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
> unlocking extra LE pipes beyond the 12?

It's possible. But no manufacture in their right mind will advocate
trying.

> newegg difference is 249 vs 265$, about 16$

In my $30 estimation, I was comparing cards of the same manufacturer, ie,
Apollo 6800 vs Apollo 6800LE.

>
> Is the OC 8 pipes or 12?

It being a 6800, it's has 12 pipes. The OC is not from Nvidia. It's a BFG
marketing thing. They take a standard card, in this case the 6800, slap on
enhanced cooling, clock it up some and then slap the "OC" moniker on the box
and there you have it.

DaveL

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia (More info?)

On 2 Feb 2005 09:26:30 -0800, "Chezwick T. Feeglebrox III esquire"
<bill371@twmi.rr.com> wrote:

>Please correct me where I'm wrong...
>pixel pipelines is the key to card performance, but many times
>(purposefully?) kept off the product description on sellers' websites.
>


No substitute for taking a significant chunk of time to do advance
learning before purchase. For example with video cards -- reading
AND UNDERSTANDING the reviews on sites such as Anandtech
and Tom's Hardware would be a great start.

Or for those without the time, technical ability or inclination,
having a technically-knowledgeable friend with a good track
record <in the specific area> help you choose.

NEVER take Marketing blurb or Specs at face-value.
Understand exactly what they mean... and recognize what
may be MISSING from the specs.

Also NEVERr believe newsgroup/forum technical "gossip", unless
such "gossip" come from people recognized <<over a significant
period of time>> to be always correct in their technical judgements.

Caveat Emptor ( let the buyer beware ) ALWAYS...
expecially in the case of purchases having technical complexity.

John Lewis