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The Xbox360 backward-compatibility mess....

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Anonymous
June 16, 2005 7:48:47 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

See:-

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/content_page.php?aid=9562

The PC certainly has its advantages - not having to throw out
all the applications with every upgrade....

John Lewis
Anonymous
June 16, 2005 7:48:48 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

i own a yacht wrote:
> In comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action Inglo <ioo@??.???> wrote:
>
> > Like no one's ever had PC game compatibility issues.
>
> john lewis even keeps old hardware around just so he can play old games.
>
> what a friggin' moron. i'm starting to suspect multiple personality
> disorder.

Hehe.
Anonymous
June 16, 2005 8:07:06 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

I would've said that who cares if you can't play older games, but I have
been playing Red Alert: Yuri's Revenge lately as well as Ravenshield.
Ultimately though, don't PC's with MS OS's still have the same problem?
Let's see you run Duke Nuke 'Em, Terminator: Future Shock or even the
original Doom on any NT-based MS OS -- especially if you're using NTFS.

--
there is no .sig
"John Lewis" <john.dsl@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:42b19df4.973660@news.verizon.net...
> See:-
>
> http://www.gamesindustry.biz/content_page.php?aid=9562
>
> The PC certainly has its advantages - not having to throw out
> all the applications with every upgrade....
>
> John Lewis
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Anonymous
June 16, 2005 8:07:07 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

"Doug" <pigdos@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:Kshse.2666$NU5.88@newssvr13.news.prodigy.com...
> I would've said that who cares if you can't play older games, but I have
> been playing Red Alert: Yuri's Revenge lately as well as Ravenshield.
> Ultimately though, don't PC's with MS OS's still have the same problem?
> Let's see you run Duke Nuke 'Em, Terminator: Future Shock or even the
> original Doom on any NT-based MS OS -- especially if you're using NTFS.

I can still run many games that are over 5 years old on a PC. Sometimes
it does take a little tinkering, though.
Anonymous
June 16, 2005 8:25:31 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

On 6/16/2005 8:48 AM John Lewis brightened our day with:

>See:-
>
>http://www.gamesindustry.biz/content_page.php?aid=9562
>
>The PC certainly has its advantages - not having to throw out
>all the applications with every upgrade....
>
>John Lewis
>
>
I don't get your point, the article is about how they're going about
getting backwards compatibility to work. I'm pretty confident games
like Halo 1&2, KotoR 1&2 and other XBox games I own will play fine on
the XBox360.
Like no one's ever had PC game compatibility issues. There are games
I've given up on for months waiting for driver issues to be resolved.

--
"I don't feel tardy"

Steve ¤»Inglo«¤
www.inglostadt.com
Anonymous
June 16, 2005 11:17:30 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

"Magnulus" <magnulus@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:Ewhse.102482$8S5.98617@bignews3.bellsouth.net...
>
> "Doug" <pigdos@nospam.com> wrote in message
> news:Kshse.2666$NU5.88@newssvr13.news.prodigy.com...
>> I would've said that who cares if you can't play older games, but I have
>> been playing Red Alert: Yuri's Revenge lately as well as Ravenshield.
>> Ultimately though, don't PC's with MS OS's still have the same problem?
>> Let's see you run Duke Nuke 'Em, Terminator: Future Shock or even the
>> original Doom on any NT-based MS OS -- especially if you're using NTFS.
>
> I can still run many games that are over 5 years old on a PC. Sometimes
> it does take a little tinkering, though.
>
>

Start>All Programs>Accessories>Program Compatibility Wizard

Tinker around here. You'll be surprised at what you can get to run doing
this.
Anonymous
June 16, 2005 11:17:31 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

>
>Start>All Programs>Accessories>Program Compatibility Wizard
>
>Tinker around here. You'll be surprised at what you can get to run doing
>this.
>
I've done that myself quite a few times, and it worked most of the
time. I even got "Syndicate" using (I believe) NT emulation. For those
that are unfimiliar, Syndicate was out when the fastest IBM clone
available was a 486. I played it on a 486-sx25 with 4 meg of ram and
512k of video memory.
Anonymous
June 17, 2005 12:02:45 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

John Lewis wrote:
> I would suggest that you
> adopt the "SHOW ME"
> attitude to any Xbox360
> purchase

Here, here! Let's wait and see whether the Xbox360 is capable of
backwards compability at launch before we start harping on about it
like you are now.

--
Best Regards, mattchu
np:
June 17, 2005 9:01:40 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

On Thu, 16 Jun 2005 16:07:06 GMT, "Doug" <pigdos@nospam.com> wrote:

>I would've said that who cares if you can't play older games, but I have
>been playing Red Alert: Yuri's Revenge lately as well as Ravenshield.
>Ultimately though, don't PC's with MS OS's still have the same problem?
>Let's see you run Duke Nuke 'Em, Terminator: Future Shock or even the
>original Doom on any NT-based MS OS -- especially if you're using NTFS.

You are comparing 13 years old PC games to previous-generation (0-5
years) console games.
Anonymous
June 17, 2005 9:27:15 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

On 16 Jun 2005 12:38:04 -0700, flightlessvacuum@gmail.com wrote:

>
>
>i own a yacht wrote:
>> In comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action Inglo <ioo@??.???> wrote:
>>
>> > Like no one's ever had PC game compatibility issues.
>>
>> john lewis even keeps old hardware around just so he can play old games.
>>
>> what a friggin' moron. i'm starting to suspect multiple personality
>> disorder.
>
>Hehe.
>

Is mindlessvacuum@gmail.com a cousin to Sailor ?

John Lewis
Anonymous
June 17, 2005 10:28:55 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

> See:-
>
> http://www.gamesindustry.biz/content_page.php?aid=9562
>
> The PC certainly has its advantages - not having to throw out
> all the applications with every upgrade....
>
> John Lewis

who cares? i'm buying xbox 2 for xbox 2 games, not xbox games.
June 17, 2005 10:49:18 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

On Fri, 17 Jun 2005 05:01:40 GMT, jussi <jussi@hopmail.com> wrote:

>On Thu, 16 Jun 2005 16:07:06 GMT, "Doug" <pigdos@nospam.com> wrote:
>
>>I would've said that who cares if you can't play older games, but I have
>>been playing Red Alert: Yuri's Revenge lately as well as Ravenshield.
>>Ultimately though, don't PC's with MS OS's still have the same problem?
>>Let's see you run Duke Nuke 'Em, Terminator: Future Shock or even the
>>original Doom on any NT-based MS OS -- especially if you're using NTFS.
>
>You are comparing 13 years old PC games to previous-generation (0-5
>years) console games.

That's the point, his PC is backwards compatible.
Anonymous
June 17, 2005 8:23:42 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

On Fri, 17 Jun 2005 14:44:14 GMT, i own a yacht <me@privacy.net>
wrote:

>In comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action jussi <jussi@hopmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Who pissed in your flakes? It is not uncommon for gamers, who also
>> like older games, to keep their older PC or console around in order to
>> play them properly. PC DOS game emulators still don't emulate Roland
>> MT-32 or SCC-1 properly, for example.
>
>thanks for the history lesson. it's also fairly common for blowhards
>like john lewis to whine when they need to use special software or older
>hardware to use older software even though they keep 4+ computers
>around just to do the same thing.

Actually, I really only need the 2 PCs, since the PC Amiga emulator
runs most of the Amiga games just fine in which I have any interest.
However, parallelism is very convenient and I have spare Amiga
monitors that double up as TV monitors :-) :-)

Got any consoles with great emulators ?

2 PCs spanning 20 years of great gaming --- not bad. Tell me
about the 2 consoles that do that.....

John Lewis
Anonymous
June 18, 2005 8:53:38 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati,alt.games.video.xbox,alt.games.video.sony-playstation2 (More info?)

It's not important. Keep your old XFLop for backward compatibility.

It's important. What if the XFLop dies and you don't want an ebay
ripoff replacement since XFLop isn't made anymore.

It's not important. Just get the new games.

It's important. There aren't many new games at the beginning plus there
are older games worth keeping and playing.

It's not important. The PowerPC and ATI GPU won't be able to run the
Intel and Nvidia GPU code natively, so forget it.

It's important. It is so important, xflop 1.5 full circle will pay
Nvidia royalty rights to use GPU code for the life of the console plus
develop an emulator and provide patches for the original games to run
under the emulator.

It's not important. The emulator and patched games won't run all the
games perfectly, so don't expect much.

It's important. Since the emulator and patching won't allow full
compatibility, some of the top seller titles will be ported over
completely to the PowerPC and ATI GPU. People will be willing to re-buy
these games to have "backward" compatibility.

And so on... It might help if the xflop 1.5 full circle could make up
its mind but that would be expecting too much. This situation doesn't
apply to the Playstation3 or the Nintendo Revolution. The Playstation2
was backwardly compatible with the Playstation and the Playstation 3
will be backwardly compatible with the Playstation 2 and the
Playstation. Plain and simple.

> See:-
>
> http://www.gamesindustry.biz/content_page.php?aid=9562
>
> The PC certainly has its advantages - not having to throw out
> all the applications with every upgrade....
Anonymous
June 18, 2005 8:30:37 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

On Thu, 16 Jun 2005 15:48:47 GMT, john.dsl@verizon.net (John Lewis)
wrote:

>See:-
>
>http://www.gamesindustry.biz/content_page.php?aid=9562
>
>The PC certainly has its advantages - not having to throw out
>all the applications with every upgrade....
>
>John Lewis


Here is a followup article:-

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/feature.php?aid=9591

M$$ has got themselves a real Catch22 of their own making.
They set the launch for the Christmas season. There will be very few
Xbox360 titles of any note available by that time.

If M$$ continues with their flaky backward-compatibility plans, many
Thanksgiving/Christmas shoppers will buy new Xbox game titles
expecting them to also work perfectly on the Xbox360. And when they
don't, expect a huge backlash.

Just before the buying season, M$$ should issue a definitive list
of Xbox games, both current and upcoming GUARANTEED to work
on the Xbox360. Then buyers can make the ultimate decision
themselves --- of course those games not on the list will potentially

have negatively-impacted sales.

And how could M$$ guarantee compatibility ?. Junk the download
patch-emulation nonsense and just make replacement compatible
DVDs available on a free-exchange basis to current purchasers
of games on the list. Also they could sell the Xbox360 version
of the most popular existing Xbox titles ( Halo, Halo2, Jade Empire
etc ) as Platinum ( budget) Xbox 360 titles.

Recompiling Microsoft Studios Xbox games for the Xbox360
should be easy, with nVidia's license and access to source.
For the most popular 3rd-party titles, M$$ could provide the
trancoding tools for free to the developers and subsidize the
disc exchange.

The proposal to try to patch the Xbox360 with downloadable
profiles is technical nonsense and fraught with practical problems.

Meanwhile Sony can sit back and learn from M$$'s mess.
Sony have very wisely chosen to release the PS3 during the
slack season... so if the schedule slips a month or two little harm is
done. If the Xbox360 slips Thanksgiving after all the advance
publicity ( and expectation in the software retail channel ) M$$ will
have major egg on its face. And a bunch of very angry retailers.

Nice to have a PC for gaming and be insulated from all this nonsense.

John Lewis
Anonymous
June 19, 2005 6:02:42 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

On Sat, 18 Jun 2005 17:54:54 -0600, "Hank the Rapper"
<xflopgoon@REMOVEyahoo.com> wrote:

>John Lewis wrote:
>
>> M$$
>> M$$
>> M$$
>> M$$
>> M$$
>> M$$'s
>> M$$
>
>http://www.penny-arcade.com/images/2002/20020722l.gif
>

LOL..........

Think of the bandwidth that I save. Maybe I'll reduce it to M$, as
suggested --- to save some more.

Not that I have too much personally against Microsoft. I am just
a lazy typist -- and their Xbox360 strategy currently sux. It won't
even have any form of HDTV-rom or -video player, in spite of it
claiming to be a HDTV-compatible machine.



John Lewis

>
>

--

John Lewis

"Technology early-birds always turn out to be flying guinea-pigs"
Anonymous
June 19, 2005 4:02:09 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati,alt.games.video.xbox,alt.games.video.sony-playstation2 (More info?)

Quoth The Raven "Blig Merk"<blig_murk@yahoo.com> in
1119095618.025833.211000@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com
> It's not important. Keep your old XFLop for backward compatibility.

to me its important, I never bought the original xbox even though I wanted
the buffy games, I waited to see if there was a pc emulator for xbox, but
that never happened, but I will definitely buy the xbox360 so I want those
games to be compatible with the new box

--
One of the penalties for refusing to participate in politics is that
you end up being governed by your inferiors. - (Plato)

Take out the _CURSEING to reply to me
Anonymous
June 19, 2005 4:02:10 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati,alt.games.video.xbox,alt.games.video.sony-playstation2 (More info?)

On Sun, 19 Jun 2005 12:02:09 +1000, "Highlandish"
<ckreskay_CURSEING@dodo.com.au> wrote:

>Quoth The Raven "Blig Merk"<blig_murk@yahoo.com> in
>1119095618.025833.211000@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com
>> It's not important. Keep your old XFLop for backward compatibility.
>
>to me its important, I never bought the original xbox even though I wanted
>the buffy games, I waited to see if there was a pc emulator for xbox, but
>that never happened, but I will definitely buy the xbox360 so I want those
>games to be compatible with the new box
>

Won't, except with a few current Xbox games... read between the lines
of the articles and Microsoft's posturing... they are in deep trouble
with backward compatibility, ever since they parted company with
nVidia and Intel and now they are flip-flopping frantically....

And Sony is probably grinning from ear-to-ear, because at the
minimum they will only need to offer their customers the same level
of compatibility that the Xbox achieves. They may actually do
much better, since they have more-or-less planned PS3
backward-compatibility from the beginning. And since Sony is
intimately technically familiar with the PS2 hardware design, the
transition should be easier than for Microsoft who effectively
contracted out the hardware and driver design of the Xbox.


--

John Lewis

"Technology early-birds always turn out to be flying guinea-pigs"
Anonymous
June 22, 2005 7:18:48 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

john.dsl@verizon.net (John Lewis) thought that a good way to
threaten somebody was to light a stick of dynamite, then call the
guy and hold the burning fuse up to the phone and say:

> Got any consoles with great emulators ?

Well, the XBox runs a ton of emulators. :-)
http://www.xbox-emulation.co.uk/Downloads.shtml

--
Ajay Tanwar | MCSE | ajtanwar@spam.yahoo.com
"Never underestimate the power of stupid people
in large groups." -Despair.com
Anonymous
June 23, 2005 10:34:14 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

On Wed, 22 Jun 2005 15:18:48 GMT, Ajay Tanwar <ajtanwar@yahoo.com>
wrote:

>john.dsl@verizon.net (John Lewis) thought that a good way to
>threaten somebody was to light a stick of dynamite, then call the
>guy and hold the burning fuse up to the phone and say:
>
>> Got any consoles with great emulators ?
>
>Well, the XBox runs a ton of emulators. :-)

>http://www.xbox-emulation.co.uk/Downloads.shtml
>

after modding to a pretend-PC.... life is too short........

>--
>Ajay Tanwar | MCSE | ajtanwar@spam.yahoo.com
>"Never underestimate the power of stupid people
>in large groups." -Despair.com

--

John Lewis

"Technology early-birds always turn out to be flying guinea-pigs"
Anonymous
June 24, 2005 12:05:34 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

john.dsl@verizon.net (John Lewis) thought that a good way to threaten
somebody was to light a stick of dynamite, then call the guy and hold
the burning fuse up to the phone and say:

> On Wed, 22 Jun 2005 15:18:48 GMT, Ajay Tanwar <ajtanwar@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>
>>john.dsl@verizon.net (John Lewis) thought that a good way to
>>threaten somebody was to light a stick of dynamite, then call the
>>guy and hold the burning fuse up to the phone and say:
>>
>>> Got any consoles with great emulators ?
>>
>>Well, the XBox runs a ton of emulators. :-)
>
>>http://www.xbox-emulation.co.uk/Downloads.shtml
>>
>
> after modding to a pretend-PC.... life is too short........

Yet it's long enough to build your own PC and install and maintain
your software and drivers?

If you don't enjoy mucking about with hardware, you might want to
check into console gaming <grin>.

--
Ajay Tanwar | MCSE | ajtanwar@spam.yahoo.com
"Never underestimate the power of stupid people
in large groups." -Despair.com
Anonymous
June 24, 2005 5:27:29 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia,alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

i own a yacht <me@privacy.net> thought that a good way to threaten
somebody was to light a stick of dynamite, then call the guy and
hold the burning fuse up to the phone and say:

> In comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action Ajay Tanwar <ajtanwar@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>> john.dsl@verizon.net (John Lewis) thought that a good way to
>> threaten
>>>
>>> after modding to a pretend-PC.... life is too short........
>>
>> Yet it's long enough to build your own PC and install and
>> maintain your software and drivers?
>
> owned. john lewis's inconsistency strikes again.

Sorry, not trying to 0wn anyone, just making friendly little jab at
John's PC-centric gaming. See the <grin>?

BTW, your mother is a gerbil and your father smells of cabbage
<grin>. See how that works? :-D

--
Ajay Tanwar | MCSE | ajtanwar@spam.yahoo.com
"Never underestimate the power of stupid people
in large groups." -Despair.com
!