ATI going to make any more high-end AGP cards?

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

I'm really happy w/my present system (Barton @ 2.33Ghz, NF7s v2.0, 1GB DDR3200,
9800Pro) but it would be nice to get a faster video card. What I mean by faster
here is a vid-card at least twice as fast as my overclocked 9800 Pro. Has ATI
officially abandoned AGP for it's high-end vid cards? Has Nvidia also obsoleted
AGP?
-Bill (remove "botizer" to reply via email)

 

[ME]

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

It seems like the new PCs are all going to PCI Express, and if so I
think AGP is doomed.

That said, you do have some head room to grow, the ATI X800XT PE is AGP
and it's a good 2x faster than what you have depending on what you are
doing (that's what Tomshardware.com 3DMark2003 tests show anyway). I
splurged and got one since my former video card was very old, and I
love it. They even have it doing automatic overclocking based on
temperature sensing!

The price will drop in the next 6 months for it, as it's a little hard
to get now (I got mine at allstarshop.com), I got an OEM one it was in
stock.

 

[Glitch]

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

Wblane wrote:
>Has ATI officially abandoned AGP for it's high-end vid cards? Has Nvidia also obsoleted
> AGP?

No both companies will continue to make high-end cards but they will be
bridged PCI-Express>AGP.But nVidia uses a low-quality bridge that they
developed in 2 months and ATI is trying to create the best bridge
possible.The bridge is due to come out in late February and all ATIs
high-end cards are going to become AGP ready.
My recommendation is a Radeon X800 XL.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

> It seems like the new PCs are all going to PCI Express, and if so I
> think AGP is doomed.

Ya think?

 

[rms]

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

>They even have it doing automatic overclocking based on
> temperature sensing!

This feature is mostly useless by most accounts. I'd overclock it
manually.

rms

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

"me" <donawalt@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1105653782.132739.260010@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
> It seems like the new PCs are all going to PCI Express, and if so I
> think AGP is doomed.
>
> That said, you do have some head room to grow, the ATI X800XT PE is AGP
> and it's a good 2x faster than what you have depending on what you are
> doing (that's what Tomshardware.com 3DMark2003 tests show anyway). I
> splurged and got one since my former video card was very old, and I
> love it. They even have it doing automatic overclocking based on
> temperature sensing!
>
> The price will drop in the next 6 months for it, as it's a little hard
> to get now (I got mine at allstarshop.com), I got an OEM one it was in
> stock.
>

I wouldn't say doomed as much as will slowly be grandfathered out. Virtually
every PC out there has an AGP slot in it, so there's still lots of people
willing to upgrade, which in business terms means a profitable opportunity.
From the sounds of it, it may be possible to add a bridge chip to make the
PCI-Express video card architecture compatible with AGP architecture. In
short, this basically means manufacturers won't have to develop a separate
AGP and PCI-E card. Just add the bridge chip to an AGP PCB and away you go.
Cheap for manufacturers, and they can offer the best of both worlds. See the
article at Tom's Hardware:

http://graphics.tomshardware.com/graphic/20040310/pcie-10.html

 

[minotaur]

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

McQualude wrote:
>>It seems like the new PCs are all going to PCI Express, and if so I
>>think AGP is doomed.
>
>
> Ya think?

Not any time soon, still have 99.9% of users to upgrade to PCI Express
from AGP. Why rush? Don't see any X800XT PE PCI Express cards, nor many
6800 Ultra solutions either. Not going to downgrade the graphics, just
to jump on the nForce4 SLI bandwagon, either are many others IMHO

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

Minotaur wrote:

> McQualude wrote:
>>>It seems like the new PCs are all going to PCI Express, and if so I
>>>think AGP is doomed.
>>
>>
>> Ya think?
>
> Not any time soon, still have 99.9% of users to upgrade to PCI Express
> from AGP. Why rush? Don't see any X800XT PE PCI Express cards, nor many
> 6800 Ultra solutions either.

Huh? Froogle shows about 270 hits for "6800 Ultra AGP" and about 460 for
"6800 Ultra PCI Express", and about the same number of "X800XT PE PCI
Express" as "X800XT PE AGP".

> Not going to downgrade the graphics, just
> to jump on the nForce4 SLI bandwagon, either are many others IMHO

What does "the nForce4 SLI bandwagon" have to do with anything? Intel has
decreed that AGP is dead, and unless something radical happens in the PC
market that's the way it's going to be. Nforce4 is a reaction to Intel,
nothing more--the SLI capability is probably an afterthought--they just
split one PCI x16 slot into 2 x8s.

--
--John
Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

That's some good news. So I won't have to dump my NF7s v2.0 just yet? I do have
a Mobile Athlon 2600+ I just bought for the system, but I haven't bothered to
put it in.

Is Doom2 bottlenecked more by the vid-card or the CPU in my system (I have a
gig of dual channel RAM @ 200 Mhz. and a Barton @ 2.33Ghz and an overclocked
9800Pro)

>That said, you do have some head room to grow, the ATI X800XT PE is AGP
>and it's a good 2x faster than what you have depending on what you are
>doing (that's what Tomshardware.com 3DMark2003 tests show anyway). I
>splurged and got one since my former video card was very old, and I
>love it. They even have it doing automatic overclocking based on
>temperature sensing!
>
>The price will drop in the next 6 months for it, as it's a little hard
>to get now (I got mine at allstarshop.com), I got an OEM one it was in
>stock.


-Bill (remove "botizer" to reply via email)

 

[rts_fan]

I don't know if you know that the ATI X1950 Pro is coming out with AGP. Limited supply but that should change

 

[SuperFly03]

I don't know if you know that the ATI X1950 Pro is coming out with AGP. Limited supply but that should change

Why would the X1950 come out in AGP if the X1900 isn't in AGP? X1650 is about as new as it comes form the ATi camp (now AMD of course).

I haven't seen any new AGP cards in a good while. Quadro with standing, the newest AGP car is the 7800 GS.... nVidia has gone through the 79 and 8 series since then. No new chipsets come with AGP, they are an after thought that *few* manufacturers put in as a hook to budget conscious people. In reality you are going ot have to bite the bullet and upgrade to a PCI-e system. It made its debut nearly 3 years ago and has swept through the market place. Notebooks are based on PCI-e now, all new cards are designed for PCI-e.

I really wouldn't bet on any new AGP cards. A stray 8600 may hit AGP, but I severely doubt it. The AGP socket just can't provide enough power and bandwidth to the card. I'm sorry to say... AGP is dead.

 

[rts_fan]

The X1950 PRO is out on AGP.
http://www.powercolor.com/global/main_product_detail.asp?id=137
http://www.visiontek.com/products/cards/retail/x1950pro_AGP.html
http://www.sapphiretech.com/us/products/products_overview.php?gpid=168&grp=2
http://www.gecube.com/products-detail.php?prod_cat_pid=9&prod_cat_id=166&prod_id=63640
http://www.firingsquad.com/hardware/powercolor_radeon_x1950_pro_agp_review/

If you read the review at Firingsquad, they make some good points as to why a person might want such a card as this. I don't know why ATI has come back to the AGP slot with a performance card, only they know how many requests they've received. They don't do something like this because they're nice, they saw a profit point and went after it. With all of the flux in the platforms, why upgrade a (then) high end AGP system with one that you won't be able to upgrade. Like many of the reviews have said, this card will get you another year on your AGP system....then....AM3, C2D w/1333, GDDR3, quad cores, etc......

As to why there were no cards based on the X1900, maybe because those were high end cards, not ~$200 cards?

BTW, the X1950 Pro AGP kicks the 7800 GS AGP around except for Quake4. While the 7800 GS is a "crippled" card, the 1950 Pro is a full featured, up-to-date card.

 

[SuperFly03]

Good spot, I stand corrected.

I honestly just browsed newegg and didn't see anything really that new for sale under the AGP section. Clearly, I was wrong.

ATi has made some weird decisions as of late, this X9150 Pro AGP being one of them. I am not sure why we can't just get rid of AGP 8O

 

[rts_fan]

I am not sure why we can't just get rid of AGP

AGP IS dead, but for many of us, it's easier to come up with $200 then to replace our ENTIRE system.

(edit) BTW, this test seems to show that there is no performance boost (at this level) from AGP to PCI-e. There are advantages to PCI-e, I know, and it has more room to grow. Did Intel change the interface just to make people buy new??????????? Could they not have accomplished the same thing with AGP 4.0????????????

I'd love to see a test of a OC'd Athlon XP system vs. say a X2 3800+ with similar RAM amounts and the X1950 Pro.

 

[SuperFly03]

There may not be any performance gain per se, but I know the power draw on the AGP slot was very limited. Also, SLI/CF would have been impossible on AGP, and there are a few more things. THG did a break down of it all in the spring of 2004 I think, after lunch I'll try and find it, because I clearly can't remember all the reasons for the move . :lol:

 

[crazypyro]

CrossFire and SLi are way overrated and overhyped and not needed YET. There will be a day when adding a second GPU will become more cost effective then continously pushing hardware design. But i don't see that happening for quite a few years away, not untill CPUs can surpass the GPU.

Workstations are another thing, and i can understand them needing SLi/CF or a cluster of Quadro's/FireGL

 

[rts_fan]

THG did a break down of it all in the spring of 2004 I think, after lunch I'll try and find it

No thanks, I don't need to be dazzled by the specs, I'm already baffled by the test results. 8O I'm not arguing for AGP, just the timeing seems suspect. When PCI came out, it had clear advantages over ISA. ATX is much better than AT. This is not the case with PCI-e vs. AGP, at least not to the end user.
I'm just musing.

 

[Rhinofart]

I sure hope there is a little bit of life left in the AGP bus. I don't think I could pull off a full system upgrade infront of the wife again. I currently have an overclocked AIWx800 and I can play HL2 at 16x12 with everything turned on with very playable frame rates. I'm talking usually over 100 FPS. Mind you I'm running a DC Opteron oc'ed to 2650. I wouldnl't mind a 1950Pro as long as there is a noticable improvement over what I am running now.

 

[SuperFly03]

CrossFire and SLi are way overrated and overhyped and not needed YET. There will be a day when adding a second GPU will become more cost effective then continously pushing hardware design. But i don't see that happening for quite a few years away, not untill CPUs can surpass the GPU.

Workstations are another thing, and i can understand them needing SLi/CF or a cluster of Quadro's/FireGL

Nice Avatar....

SLI/CF are necessary for those people who use 30" monitors, 24" widescreen, or hook up their PC to their HDTV for HiDef on huge arse screens. I agree it is not mainstream at all, but it has its place. By necessary I mean, they want full eye candy at full resolutions.

 

[jaxstraww]

I was feeling pretty good about finding this thread at the top of the forum until I saw that it was started in 2004. Running a P4 2.6 with 2 gigs of RAM and a 9800 PRO 128MB. The Egg has a 3.0 Prescott for $78.00. Not bad price wise and a little jump CPU wise. I would like to max it out at 3.2 but I see the 478 socket is pretty much dead and the 3.0 is about it. I want to update the 9800PRO to another AGP card and ride this out until 2008. Reason is that as far as gaming its BF2 and the Valve games pretty much. If FH ever comes out for BF2 that will be my core game. Right now I can play but I'm thinking I could maximize some gameplay. Problem is that I can't find any graphs showing the 9800PRO against some of the newer AGP cards. I would like to stick with ATI. Always had luck. Anyone with a link to an updated graph? Or any suggestions for an AGP under $200 that is better than the 9800PRO. I mean if its a marginal increase in framerates I can stay pat. But I can't believe that there isn't an AGP out there that is younger than the 9800PRO with better everything for $200.00.

Any suggestions?

 

[rts_fan]

The MSRP for the Powercolor X1950 Pro is $209! IMHO, the X1950 Pro is the ONLY upgrade option. If you can find a X850 card, the price is almost the same. Read the review above. I also have 9800 Pros and I have not found comparisons between them and today's cards.

 

[jaxstraww]

You keep going back to Powercooler. CompUSA has the Visiontek AGP on sale tomorrow. $227 after rebates. Just a few dollars over your $209. Going to do it unless you found something out in your research that would say no. Just got the new 3.0 Northwood in for my 2.6. Get the card tomorrow and I'll let the dual cores and DX10 cards kick each others asses for 2007.

I did want to breakdown and get some of the HP specials that are on sale this week. 6300's with 300gb HD's and 2gigs of RAM for a grand? Sounds ok to me. Once I started adding on the PCI card I figure I can wait.

 

[rts_fan]

I like the cooler on the Powercolor.

Where'd you see that add? I don't even see that CompUSA has the X1950 Pro in AGP.

 

[jaxstraww]

Philadelphia Inquirer aka Sunday Paper. Goes on sale tomorrow. AGP or PCI for the same price.

 

[littlebigman]

I purchased a 1950agp card and replaced my 6800 ultra. It is a very big jump in performance.

2006 scores went from 2512 to 3933.

I didn't feel like replacing my mother board and memory, not to mention the cost. Plus,fast ddr really isn't that much slower than fast ddr2. The cost difference is huge though.

I believe this is why AGP is hanging in there. If you're running an AMD system the difference in speed just isn't worth cost of changing over.

If you are moving to a Core 2 setup then it's debatable. There is a major speed increase, but you do have to shell out some money to get it. I want a Core 2 system, but just can't quite make the jump until daycare costs drop.