All latest-gen cards a kludge-job on AGP bus?

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

After giving up on making my X800XL work in my motherboard, I'm
wondering if I'd have the same problem with a 6800GT. I understand the
X800 has a bridge chip to connect to the AGP bus - this seems to be
what breaks AGP Writes (NOT fastwrites!) on my system. For most modern
games - Doom3, FarCry, etc. - this seems to have no noticable effect.
They ran great on the card, and 3dmark benches were right up there as
well. The graphics engine used in my favorite 2 racing sims seems to
rely on this feature heavily, and gives noticably worse performance
than my 9700Pro did (which shows AGP Writes on).
I'm wondering if all these latest-gen cards were engineered with PCI
Express in mind, making it a bad idea to get an AGP version from ATI or
nVidia - even though I could get a dual-core x64 mb with AGP.
Anyone have more technical insight? Seems like AGP is well and truly
dead if you have any hope of using the latest stuff. I think the only
thing I'll be able to transition on to the next gaming rig is the
400Mhz CL2 memory and SATA drives :(.

Kendt

PS - On the bright side, it does give me an excuse to go 64-bit in the
near future ;).
13 answers Last reply
More about latest cards kludge
  1. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

    Thanks, did all that, no go.
    Seems like a particular problem between the card and the VIA KT600
    chipset on my board. I even tried forcibly disabling smartgart and
    editing the registry to indicate that AGP Writes tested OK and should
    be on - the driver still disables the feature.
    I just put my 9700Pro back in - AGP Writes back on!

    Thanks anyway,
    Kendt

    PS - no digs at VIA, please ;). Next MB will be an nForce x64.
  2. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

    I've got an asus p4c800 (i875 chipset w/ agp) and an X800XL agp.. AGP Writes
    are on when i run smartgart (and yes i know the diff between this and and
    fast writes)


    i'd recommend uninstalling your graphics drivers, installing the latest
    chipset drivers (like the intel inf package)
    make sure you got Directx 9 latest installed.. and then reinstall graphics
    drivers.


    <eventerke@hotmail.com> wrote in message
    news:1122778725.248136.116510@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
    > After giving up on making my X800XL work in my motherboard, I'm
    > wondering if I'd have the same problem with a 6800GT. I understand the
    > X800 has a bridge chip to connect to the AGP bus - this seems to be
    > what breaks AGP Writes (NOT fastwrites!) on my system. For most modern
    > games - Doom3, FarCry, etc. - this seems to have no noticable effect.
    > They ran great on the card, and 3dmark benches were right up there as
    > well. The graphics engine used in my favorite 2 racing sims seems to
    > rely on this feature heavily, and gives noticably worse performance
    > than my 9700Pro did (which shows AGP Writes on).
    > I'm wondering if all these latest-gen cards were engineered with PCI
    > Express in mind, making it a bad idea to get an AGP version from ATI or
    > nVidia - even though I could get a dual-core x64 mb with AGP.
    > Anyone have more technical insight? Seems like AGP is well and truly
    > dead if you have any hope of using the latest stuff. I think the only
    > thing I'll be able to transition on to the next gaming rig is the
    > 400Mhz CL2 memory and SATA drives :(.
    >
    > Kendt
    >
    > PS - On the bright side, it does give me an excuse to go 64-bit in the
    > near future ;).
    >
  3. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

    <eventerke@hotmail.com> wrote in message
    news:1122778725.248136.116510@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
    > After giving up on making my X800XL work in my motherboard, I'm
    > wondering if I'd have the same problem with a 6800GT. I understand the
    > X800 has a bridge chip to connect to the AGP bus - this seems to be
    > what breaks AGP Writes (NOT fastwrites!) on my system. For most modern
    > games - Doom3, FarCry, etc. - this seems to have no noticable effect.
    > They ran great on the card, and 3dmark benches were right up there as
    > well. The graphics engine used in my favorite 2 racing sims seems to
    > rely on this feature heavily, and gives noticably worse performance
    > than my 9700Pro did (which shows AGP Writes on).
    > I'm wondering if all these latest-gen cards were engineered with PCI
    > Express in mind, making it a bad idea to get an AGP version from ATI or
    > nVidia - even though I could get a dual-core x64 mb with AGP.
    > Anyone have more technical insight? Seems like AGP is well and truly
    > dead if you have any hope of using the latest stuff. I think the only
    > thing I'll be able to transition on to the next gaming rig is the
    > 400Mhz CL2 memory and SATA drives :(.
    >
    > Kendt
    >
    > PS - On the bright side, it does give me an excuse to go 64-bit in the
    > near future ;).
    >


    Heh, well, I saw your previous posts on this topic, and if you plan to
    upgrade to 64-bit CPU and a new PCI-E motherboard later this year, I don't
    think it would kill you to just stick with the 9700 Pro until then. That's
    what I'd do. In fact, I have a 9800 Pro 128MB in my main computer (not much
    faster than your card) and I'm not upgrading until next year. Chances are
    I'll end up with a whole new system though given all of the changes that
    have happened to the PC in the last two years since I last built a gaming
    box. I hope you were able to return your X800XL for a refund at least!
  4. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

    Which is exactly what I'm going to do. The card was enough of a
    bargain that if it had worked flawlessly I would have got my money's
    worth out of 6mos gameplay. But I at least learned a lesson - no more
    VIA!

    Thanks,
    Kendt
  5. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

    Special circumstances - there was a sale that made this X800XL AGP
    cheaper than the PCIe version. And your second paragraph supports my
    plan (returning the X800XL) - rather than buy an nVidia next-gen AGP
    card, just live with what I have and build a system designed to take
    advantage of a high-end card later this year.

    Kendt
  6. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

    <eventerke@hotmail.com> wrote in message
    news:1122778725.248136.116510@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
    > After giving up on making my X800XL work in my motherboard, I'm
    > wondering if I'd have the same problem with a 6800GT. I understand the
    > X800 has a bridge chip to connect to the AGP bus - this seems to be
    > what breaks AGP Writes (NOT fastwrites!) on my system. For most modern
    > games - Doom3, FarCry, etc. - this seems to have no noticable effect.
    > They ran great on the card, and 3dmark benches were right up there as
    > well. The graphics engine used in my favorite 2 racing sims seems to
    > rely on this feature heavily, and gives noticably worse performance
    > than my 9700Pro did (which shows AGP Writes on).
    > I'm wondering if all these latest-gen cards were engineered with PCI
    > Express in mind, making it a bad idea to get an AGP version from ATI or
    > nVidia - even though I could get a dual-core x64 mb with AGP.
    > Anyone have more technical insight? Seems like AGP is well and truly
    > dead if you have any hope of using the latest stuff. I think the only
    > thing I'll be able to transition on to the next gaming rig is the
    > 400Mhz CL2 memory and SATA drives :(.
    >
    > Kendt
    >
    > PS - On the bright side, it does give me an excuse to go 64-bit in the
    > near future ;).
    >

    Never mind the kludge factor, what about the cost? AGP versions of
    PCI-express cards usually cost more. You should have saved the money and put
    it to a system upgrade.
  7. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

    <eventerke@hotmail.com> wrote in message
    news:1122819803.139958.144560@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
    > Which is exactly what I'm going to do. The card was enough of a
    > bargain that if it had worked flawlessly I would have got my money's
    > worth out of 6mos gameplay. But I at least learned a lesson - no more
    > VIA!
    >
    > Thanks,
    > Kendt
    >

    But you've already paid the extra for the AGP version? Your now going to
    have to buy a new pci-express card as part of the upgrade.

    Also the PCI-express "generation" cards, even if equipped with an AGP bridge
    chip, needed a more powerful CPU to keep them busy. They are crying out
    for a new top end motherbaord/cpu. not last years technology.
  8. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

    "John Russell" <john_e_russell@hotmail.com> wrote in message
    news:42ece3f2$1_1@mk-nntp-2.news.uk.tiscali.com...
    >
    > <eventerke@hotmail.com> wrote in message
    > news:1122819803.139958.144560@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
    >> Which is exactly what I'm going to do. The card was enough of a
    >> bargain that if it had worked flawlessly I would have got my money's
    >> worth out of 6mos gameplay. But I at least learned a lesson - no more
    >> VIA!
    >>
    >> Thanks,
    >> Kendt
    >>
    >
    > But you've already paid the extra for the AGP version? Your now going to
    > have to buy a new pci-express card as part of the upgrade.

    Around here the AGP versions are cheaper then the PCI Express versions of
    many video cards. X800XL & 6600 GT are examples.

    > Also the PCI-express "generation" cards, even if equipped with an AGP
    > bridge chip, needed a more powerful CPU to keep them busy. They are
    > crying out for a new top end motherbaord/cpu. not last years technology.

    I hope you're not implying AGP motherboards & CPUs aren't good enough for
    the PCI-Express generation cards. I have an Athlon 64 4000 running my
    X800XL and it's more than enough.

    This setup will be enough for at least a year and by then I figure IBM will
    have decided PCI-Express isn't fast enough ( or that they need to sell more
    motherboards) and developed a new technology. My money is on them calling
    it AGP Express.

    Tom
  9. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

    >
    > This setup will be enough for at least a year and by then I figure IBM
    > will have decided PCI-Express isn't fast enough ( or that they need to
    > sell more motherboards) and developed a new technology. My money is on
    > them calling it AGP Express.

    Typo - I meant Intel not IBM.

    Tom
  10. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

    "Tom" <Tom@nowhere.ca> wrote in message
    news:A_WdnZLaKrAHanHfRVn-rg@rogers.com...
    >
    > "John Russell" <john_e_russell@hotmail.com> wrote in message
    > news:42ece3f2$1_1@mk-nntp-2.news.uk.tiscali.com...
    >>
    >> <eventerke@hotmail.com> wrote in message
    >> news:1122819803.139958.144560@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
    >>> Which is exactly what I'm going to do. The card was enough of a
    >>> bargain that if it had worked flawlessly I would have got my money's
    >>> worth out of 6mos gameplay. But I at least learned a lesson - no more
    >>> VIA!
    >>>
    >>> Thanks,
    >>> Kendt
    >>>
    >>
    >> But you've already paid the extra for the AGP version? Your now going to
    >> have to buy a new pci-express card as part of the upgrade.
    >
    > Around here the AGP versions are cheaper then the PCI Express versions of
    > many video cards. X800XL & 6600 GT are examples.
    >
    >> Also the PCI-express "generation" cards, even if equipped with an AGP
    >> bridge chip, needed a more powerful CPU to keep them busy. They are
    >> crying out for a new top end motherbaord/cpu. not last years technology.
    >
    > I hope you're not implying AGP motherboards & CPUs aren't good enough for
    > the PCI-Express generation cards. I have an Athlon 64 4000 running my
    > X800XL and it's more than enough.
    >
    > This setup will be enough for at least a year and by then I figure IBM
    > will have decided PCI-Express isn't fast enough ( or that they need to
    > sell more motherboards) and developed a new technology. My money is on
    > them calling it AGP Express.
    >
    > Tom
    >
    There are more 32bit CPU AGP systems out there than 64 bit systems!
  11. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

    According to pricewatch you're completely assbackwards as far as that
    statement.

    --
    there is no .sig
    "John Russell" <john_e_russell@hotmail.com> wrote in message
    news:42ecbaa8$1_1@mk-nntp-2.news.uk.tiscali.com...
    >
    > <eventerke@hotmail.com> wrote in message
    > news:1122778725.248136.116510@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
    >> After giving up on making my X800XL work in my motherboard, I'm
    >> wondering if I'd have the same problem with a 6800GT. I understand the
    >> X800 has a bridge chip to connect to the AGP bus - this seems to be
    >> what breaks AGP Writes (NOT fastwrites!) on my system. For most modern
    >> games - Doom3, FarCry, etc. - this seems to have no noticable effect.
    >> They ran great on the card, and 3dmark benches were right up there as
    >> well. The graphics engine used in my favorite 2 racing sims seems to
    >> rely on this feature heavily, and gives noticably worse performance
    >> than my 9700Pro did (which shows AGP Writes on).
    >> I'm wondering if all these latest-gen cards were engineered with PCI
    >> Express in mind, making it a bad idea to get an AGP version from ATI or
    >> nVidia - even though I could get a dual-core x64 mb with AGP.
    >> Anyone have more technical insight? Seems like AGP is well and truly
    >> dead if you have any hope of using the latest stuff. I think the only
    >> thing I'll be able to transition on to the next gaming rig is the
    >> 400Mhz CL2 memory and SATA drives :(.
    >>
    >> Kendt
    >>
    >> PS - On the bright side, it does give me an excuse to go 64-bit in the
    >> near future ;).
    >>
    >
    > Never mind the kludge factor, what about the cost? AGP versions of
    > PCI-express cards usually cost more. You should have saved the money and
    > put it to a system upgrade.
    >
    >
  12. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

    "Doug" <pigdos@nospam.com> wrote in message
    news:a5UIe.2626$fJ1.1403@newssvr13.news.prodigy.com...
    > According to pricewatch you're completely assbackwards as far as that
    > statement.

    At low end of the market where GPU and memory costs are low, and PCI-express
    sales are slow, then AGP card costs more.
  13. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.ati (More info?)

    You're right, but even on the high-end certain PCIe parts are cheaper than
    AGP. Actually I don't see how you can say this phenomenon is relegated to
    high-end or low-end, it seems the prices differ all over the place for the
    same part (mem capacity/speed, GPU speed).

    --
    there is no .sig
    "John Russell" <john_e_russell@hotmail.com> wrote in message
    news:42fa241e$1_3@mk-nntp-2.news.uk.tiscali.com...
    >
    > "Doug" <pigdos@nospam.com> wrote in message
    > news:a5UIe.2626$fJ1.1403@newssvr13.news.prodigy.com...
    >> According to pricewatch you're completely assbackwards as far as that
    >> statement.
    >
    > At low end of the market where GPU and memory costs are low, and
    > PCI-express sales are slow, then AGP card costs more.
    >
    >
Ask a new question

Read More

Radeon Graphics