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2nd HDD as backup XP OS

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October 7, 2004 1:15:04 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage (More info?)

Hello,

Sort of an odd question: I have this *feeling* that the main HDD on my
PC is about the die. So, I purchased a 2nd Maxtor ATA/EIDE drive to
use primarily to backup important files. But, I'd also like to use it
as a bootable drive in case the main goes down. Is this possible? I
have XP on the main drive, and I also want to install XP on the 2nd.
So, I guess I'm asking about how to setup a dual-boot sytem with XP on
both drives, with the ability to see the 2nd drive from the main drive
to use for file backups. If that makes sense.

Any thoughts?

Thanks,

~ Eric

More about : 2nd hdd backup

October 8, 2004 1:14:13 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage (More info?)

"Eric" <ericsingley@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:9dfbf9a1.0410070815.4408da17@posting.google.com...
> Hello,
>
> Sort of an odd question: I have this *feeling* that the main HDD on my
> PC is about the die. So, I purchased a 2nd Maxtor ATA/EIDE drive to
> use primarily to backup important files. But, I'd also like to use it
> as a bootable drive in case the main goes down. Is this possible? I
> have XP on the main drive, and I also want to install XP on the 2nd.
> So, I guess I'm asking about how to setup a dual-boot sytem with XP on
> both drives, with the ability to see the 2nd drive from the main drive
> to use for file backups. If that makes sense.
>
> Any thoughts?
>
> Thanks,
>
> ~ Eric
I would install the new drive and use Ghost or similar to clone the boot
drive onto it - making it an exact copy of your current boot drive. Then,
leaving it as a non-master drive, you could use it to store any files you
want, and if the worst happened you would then just make the cloned drive
the master and away you go... In fact, most BIOS's these days allow you to
choose which drive to boot from at boot-up, so you would'nt even need to
change anything physically you could choose at will which drive to boot
from....
I ghost image my C: drive to my storage drive once a week anyway, just in
case.
Graham
October 8, 2004 4:46:22 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage (More info?)

"GTS" <gts123NOSPAM@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:Fki9d.1372$Jj4.240@newsfe1-gui.ntli.net...
>
> "Eric" <ericsingley@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:9dfbf9a1.0410070815.4408da17@posting.google.com...
> > Hello,
> >
> > Sort of an odd question: I have this *feeling* that the main HDD on my
> > PC is about the die. So, I purchased a 2nd Maxtor ATA/EIDE drive to
> > use primarily to backup important files. But, I'd also like to use it
> > as a bootable drive in case the main goes down. Is this possible? I
> > have XP on the main drive, and I also want to install XP on the 2nd.
> > So, I guess I'm asking about how to setup a dual-boot sytem with XP on
> > both drives, with the ability to see the 2nd drive from the main drive
> > to use for file backups. If that makes sense.
> >
> > Any thoughts?
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > ~ Eric
> I would install the new drive and use Ghost or similar to clone the boot
> drive onto it - making it an exact copy of your current boot drive. Then,
> leaving it as a non-master drive, you could use it to store any files you
> want, and if the worst happened you would then just make the cloned drive
> the master and away you go... In fact, most BIOS's these days allow you to
> choose which drive to boot from at boot-up, so you would'nt even need to
> change anything physically you could choose at will which drive to boot
> from....
> I ghost image my C: drive to my storage drive once a week anyway, just in
> case.
> Graham
>
>

After the clone, I'd immediately would start the clone as the primary drive.
Why wait for the accident to happen? So clone, power down, swap disks. Use
the unreliable disk as scratch disk.

What is the feeling based on anyway?

--
Joep
Related resources
October 8, 2004 4:46:23 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage (More info?)

Well, my PC is going on 5 years old and is still running fine (knock
on wood), but lately it's been crashing significantly more often.
And, I've gotten a disk error on statup twice. Just little things
like that.

Thanks for these solutions! Will look around for a cheap copy of
Ghost. Any suggestions there?

~ E

"Joep" <j o e p @ d i y d a t a r e c o v e r y . n l> wrote in message news:<c9a3$4165c93f$3eddca68$5499@nf1.news-service-com>...
> "GTS" <gts123NOSPAM@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
> news:Fki9d.1372$Jj4.240@newsfe1-gui.ntli.net...
> >
> > "Eric" <ericsingley@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > news:9dfbf9a1.0410070815.4408da17@posting.google.com...
> > > Hello,
> > >
> > > Sort of an odd question: I have this *feeling* that the main HDD on my
> > > PC is about the die. So, I purchased a 2nd Maxtor ATA/EIDE drive to
> > > use primarily to backup important files. But, I'd also like to use it
> > > as a bootable drive in case the main goes down. Is this possible? I
> > > have XP on the main drive, and I also want to install XP on the 2nd.
> > > So, I guess I'm asking about how to setup a dual-boot sytem with XP on
> > > both drives, with the ability to see the 2nd drive from the main drive
> > > to use for file backups. If that makes sense.
> > >
> > > Any thoughts?
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > >
> > > ~ Eric
> > I would install the new drive and use Ghost or similar to clone the boot
> > drive onto it - making it an exact copy of your current boot drive. Then,
> > leaving it as a non-master drive, you could use it to store any files you
> > want, and if the worst happened you would then just make the cloned drive
> > the master and away you go... In fact, most BIOS's these days allow you to
> > choose which drive to boot from at boot-up, so you would'nt even need to
> > change anything physically you could choose at will which drive to boot
> > from....
> > I ghost image my C: drive to my storage drive once a week anyway, just in
> > case.
> > Graham
> >
> >
>
> After the clone, I'd immediately would start the clone as the primary drive.
> Why wait for the accident to happen? So clone, power down, swap disks. Use
> the unreliable disk as scratch disk.
>
> What is the feeling based on anyway?
October 8, 2004 10:05:54 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage (More info?)

"Eric" <ericsingley@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:9dfbf9a1.0410072039.16ea3a81@posting.google.com...
> Well, my PC is going on 5 years old and is still running fine (knock
> on wood), but lately it's been crashing significantly more often.
> And, I've gotten a disk error on statup twice. Just little things
> like that.
>
> Thanks for these solutions! Will look around for a cheap copy of
> Ghost. Any suggestions there?
>
Well all you actually need is the DOS Ghost executable - about 1mb - and a
boot disk. The retail package of Ghost contains a Windows version of it plus
all sorts of tools you won't need. The CD does contain the DOS .exe file
though, so I would get it off a freinds CD or check the disks that came with
your mobo as they often provide Ghost for free. Alternatively, Maxtor
provide their own cloning utility on their website for free, and it's meant
to work as good as Ghost anyway...
a.. Creates a bootable MaxBlast 3 installation diskette.
b.. Compatible with Windows 95, 95B, 98, Me, Windows NT 4.0, Windows 2000,
and Windows XP.
c.. Breaks the 528 MB, 2.1 GB, 4.2 GB, 8.4 GB, 32 GB, 64 GB and 137 GB
capacity barriers.
d.. Support both FAT32 and NTFS drive partitions.
e.. Easy to use, Graphical Interface (GUI) with mouse and printer support.
f.. Supports up to four ATA devices in the same system*.
g.. The copy feature lets you make an exact duplicate of your existing
hard drive.
h.. Fast ATA and Serial ATA compatible.
i.. The installation tutorial option allows you to view the installation
process before physically installing your Maxtor ATA hard drive.
Note: There must be at least one Maxtor ATA Disk Drive installed in the
system for MaxBlast 3 to run.
Anonymous
a b G Storage
October 11, 2004 2:15:27 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage (More info?)

"Eric" <ericsingley@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:9dfbf9a1.0410070815.4408da17@posting.google.com...

> Sort of an odd question: I have this *feeling* that the main HDD on my
> PC is about the die. So, I purchased a 2nd Maxtor ATA/EIDE drive to
> use primarily to backup important files. But, I'd also like to use it
> as a bootable drive in case the main goes down. Is this possible? I
> have XP on the main drive, and I also want to install XP on the 2nd.
> So, I guess I'm asking about how to setup a dual-boot sytem with XP on
> both drives, with the ability to see the 2nd drive from the main drive
> to use for file backups. If that makes sense.

I followed that logic on my old Win98SE machine with no trouble, doing a
clone every week and keeping the important files updated through a batch
file run once per hour.
It worked great, but when I moved to XP Pro I was advised by M$ and Symantec
not to keep another drive in the system with an identical copy of the OS.
The consensus was that although it may work fine for a day, week, or month,
eventually it would become confused and write something to the wrong drive.
See page 8 of this link:

http://radified.com/Ghost/ghost_1.htm

Here there is a clear warning that to boot with the clone in place and
running is an invitation to instantaneous disaster with any OS. I disagree
in that I've accessed these drives for short periods of time to retrieve a
file, or whatever, with no trouble in XP--and as I said ran a clone
full-time in Win98SE. But I take Symantec's caveats seriously:

"CAUTION: Do not start the computer after cloning until the instructions say
to do so. Starting a computer from the hard drive when the computer has two
Active partitions can damage program installations and trigger configuration
changes that you might not be able to reverse without restoring backups."

This came from:
http://service1.symantec.com/SUPPORT/ghost.nsf/8f7dc138...

So now I have a permanent D: drive that is in place only to house these
hourly backups. The clones are done once per week, rotating six drives in
mobil racks, removing them before rebooting into XP.
Anonymous
a b G Storage
October 11, 2004 7:12:08 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage (More info?)

"Bob Davis" wrote:
>
>
> "Eric" wrote:
>
>> Sort of an odd question: I have this *feeling* that the main
>> HDD on my PC is about the die. So, I purchased a 2nd
>> Maxtor ATA/EIDE drive to use primarily to backup important
>> files. But, I'd also like to use it as a bootable drive in case
>> the main goes down. Is this possible? I have XP on the
>> main drive, and I also want to install XP on the 2nd. So,
>> I guess I'm asking about how to setup a dual-boot sytem
>> with XP on both drives, with the ability to see the 2nd drive
>> from the main drive to use for file backups. If that makes
>> sense.
>
> I followed that logic on my old Win98SE machine with no trouble,
> doing a clone every week and keeping the important files up-
> dated through a batch file run once per hour. It worked great,
> but when I moved to XP Pro I was advised by M$ and Symantec not to keep another drive in the system with an identical copy of
> the OS. The consensus was that although it may work fine for
> a day, week, or month, eventually it would become confused
> and write something to the wrong drive. See page 8 of this link:
>
> http://radified.com/Ghost/ghost_1.htm
>
> Here there is a clear warning that to boot with the clone in place
> and running is an invitation to instantaneous disaster with any OS.
> I disagree in that I've accessed these drives for short periods of
> time to retrieve a file, or whatever, with no trouble in XP--and as
> I said ran a clone full-time in Win98SE. But I take Symantec's
> caveats seriously:
>
> "CAUTION: Do not start the computer after cloning until the
> instructions say to do so. Starting a computer from the hard
> drive when the computer has two Active partitions can damage
> program installations and trigger configuration changes that
> you might not be able to reverse without restoring backups."
>
> This came from:
> http://service1.symantec.com/SUPPORT/ghost.nsf/8f7dc138...
>
> So now I have a permanent D: drive that is in place only
> to house these hourly backups. The clones are done once
> per week, rotating six drives in mobil racks, removing them
> before rebooting into XP.


Follow the tip from Rod Speed/Folkert Rientra/et al and just
disconnect the source HD before booting up the clone HD
for the first time. Once that is done, both can be connected
while you boot up one or the other. The one not booting will
merely be seen as a Local Disk with an accessible file
structure.

In my system, I also have a removable IDE hard drive that
I use to do backups of 2 internal hard drives, but I put
*multiple* clones on the same backup hard drive. All that
is necessary to keep them from getting melded together
is to remember to boot the clone for the 1st time in isolation
from the source drive.

But the frequent physical disconnection of the source drive
gets tedious, and it ages the connectors and my aching back.
Right now I'm trying to figure a way to do that without having
to physically disconnect the source hard drive. Merely
removing power to the source drive does the trick if it's on a
dedicated IDE channel, or, if the clone shares a channel with
the source drive, it works if the clone is the Master. Otherwise,
the "dead" Master doesn't allow the Slave on the same channel
to boot.

*TimDaniels*
Anonymous
a b G Storage
October 11, 2004 8:10:52 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage (More info?)

"Timothy Daniels" wrote:
> But the frequent physical disconnection of the source drive
> gets tedious, and it ages the connectors and my aching back.
> Right now I'm trying to figure a way to do that without having
> to physically disconnect the source hard drive. Merely
> removing power to the source drive does the trick if it's on a
> dedicated IDE channel, or, if the clone shares a channel with
> the source drive, it works if the clone is the Master. Otherwise,
> the "dead" Master doesn't allow the Slave on the same channel
> to boot.


I'm coming around to the conclusion that the simplest
approach is to assume that the clone will always be on
the removable HD and just toggle-switch off the power
to ALL the internal HDs before booting up the clone on
the removable HD for the 1st time. That would require
just one toggle switch and no extra software to run.

*TimDaniels*
Anonymous
a b G Storage
October 11, 2004 8:34:28 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage (More info?)

"Timothy Daniels" commented:
> "Timothy Daniels" wrote:
>> But the frequent physical disconnection of the source drive
>> gets tedious, and it ages the connectors and my aching back.
>> Right now I'm trying to figure a way to do that without having
>> to physically disconnect the source hard drive. Merely
>> removing power to the source drive does the trick if it's on a
>> dedicated IDE channel, or, if the clone shares a channel with
>> the source drive, it works if the clone is the Master. Otherwise,
>> the "dead" Master doesn't allow the Slave on the same channel
>> to boot.
>
>
> I'm coming around to the conclusion that the simplest
> approach is to assume that the clone will always be on
> the removable HD and just toggle-switch off the power
> to ALL the internal HDs before booting up the clone on
> the removable HD for the 1st time. That would require
> just one toggle switch and no extra software to run.


I should have mentioned that the removable HD is jumpered
as "Master", and regardless of whether the cloned HD is a
Slave on the same IDE channel or either Master or Slave on
the other IDE channel, the power on the cloned HD could
always be cut and still allow the clone on the removable HD
to boot up for the 1st time in isolation.

*TimDaniels*
Anonymous
a b G Storage
October 12, 2004 4:11:32 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage (More info?)

"Timothy Daniels" <TDaniels@NoSpamDot.com> wrote in message news:W7udne4zp6Ai8vfcRVn-rg@comcast.com
> "Timothy Daniels" commented:
> > "Timothy Daniels" wrote:
> > > But the frequent physical disconnection of the source drive
> > > gets tedious, and it ages the connectors and my aching back.
> > > Right now I'm trying to figure a way to do that without having
> > > to physically disconnect the source hard drive. Merely
> > > removing power to the source drive does the trick if it's on a
> > > dedicated IDE channel, or, if the clone shares a channel with
> > > the source drive, it works if the clone is the Master. Otherwise,
> > > the "dead" Master doesn't allow the Slave on the same channel
> > > to boot.
> >
> >
> > I'm coming around to the conclusion that the simplest
> > approach is to assume that the clone will always be on
> > the removable HD and just toggle-switch off the power
> > to ALL the internal HDs before booting up the clone on
> > the removable HD for the 1st time. That would require
> > just one toggle switch and no extra software to run.
>
>
> I should have mentioned that the removable HD is jumpered
> as "Master", and regardless of whether the cloned HD is a
> Slave on the same IDE channel or either Master or Slave on
> the other IDE channel, the power on the cloned HD could
> always be cut and still allow the clone on the removable HD
> to boot up for the 1st time in isolation.

Three attempts and still can't get it right. I rest my case.

>
> *TimDaniels*
Anonymous
a b G Storage
October 12, 2004 4:39:03 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage (More info?)

"Timothy Daniels" <TDaniels@NoSpamDot.com> wrote in message news:B8idnQU3H-_uwffcRVn-gg@comcast.com
> "Bob Davis" wrote:
> >
> >
> > "Eric" wrote:
> >
> > > Sort of an odd question: I have this *feeling* that the main
> > > HDD on my PC is about the die. So, I purchased a 2nd
> > > Maxtor ATA/EIDE drive to use primarily to backup important
> > > files. But, I'd also like to use it as a bootable drive in case
> > > the main goes down. Is this possible? I have XP on the
> > > main drive, and I also want to install XP on the 2nd. So,
> > > I guess I'm asking about how to setup a dual-boot sytem
> > > with XP on both drives, with the ability to see the 2nd drive
> > > from the main drive to use for file backups. If that makes
> > > sense.
> >
> > I followed that logic on my old Win98SE machine with no trouble,
> > doing a clone every week and keeping the important files up-
> > dated through a batch file run once per hour. It worked great,
> > but when I moved to XP Pro I was advised by M$ and Symantec not to keep another drive in the system with an identical copy of
> > the OS. The consensus was that although it may work fine for
> > a day, week, or month, eventually it would become confused
> > and write something to the wrong drive. See page 8 of this link:
> >
> > http://radified.com/Ghost/ghost_1.htm
> >
> > Here there is a clear warning that to boot with the clone in place
> > and running is an invitation to instantaneous disaster with any OS.
> > I disagree in that I've accessed these drives for short periods of
> > time to retrieve a file, or whatever, with no trouble in XP--and as
> > I said ran a clone full-time in Win98SE. But I take Symantec's
> > caveats seriously:
> >
> > "CAUTION: Do not start the computer after cloning until the
> > instructions say to do so. Starting a computer from the hard
> > drive when the computer has two Active partitions can damage
> > program installations and trigger configuration changes that
> > you might not be able to reverse without restoring backups."
> >
> > This came from:
> >
http://service1.symantec.com/SUPPORT/ghost.nsf/8f7dc138...
> >
> > So now I have a permanent D: drive that is in place only
> > to house these hourly backups. The clones are done once
> > per week, rotating six drives in mobil racks, removing them
> > before rebooting into XP.
>
>
> Follow the tip from Rod Speed/Folkert Rientra/et al and just
> disconnect the source HD before booting up the clone HD
> for the first time. Once that is done, both can be connected
> while you boot up one or the other. The one not booting will
> merely be seen as a Local Disk with an accessible file
> structure.
>
> In my system, I also have a removable IDE hard drive that
> I use to do backups of 2 internal hard drives, but I put
> *multiple* clones on the same backup hard drive. All that
> is necessary to keep them from getting melded together
> is to remember to boot the clone for the 1st time in isolation
> from the source drive.
>
> But the frequent physical disconnection of the source drive
> gets tedious, and it ages the connectors and my aching back.
> Right now I'm trying to figure a way to do that without having
> to physically disconnect the source hard drive.

> Merely removing power to the source drive does the trick if it's
> on a dedicated IDE channel, or, if the clone shares a channel with
> the source drive, it works if the clone is the Master. Otherwise,
> the "dead" Master doesn't allow the Slave on the same channel
> to boot.

Ignore the clueless troll.

>
> *TimDaniels*
!