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Advice Please: Changing Boot Drive By Disconnecting Power ..

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Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 17, 2005 2:06:43 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

If one has multiple drives, in a single system, and the normal boot(C)
drive's power plug is disconnected, will the other(D) drive
automatically become the boot drive if it also has an operating system
installed?
Are there any short or long term negative effects to switching between
boot drives this way on a regular basis?
Thanks a lot.

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.

More about : advice changing boot drive disconnecting power

Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 17, 2005 3:10:20 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

Searcher7@mail.con2.com wrote:
> If one has multiple drives, in a single system, and the normal boot(C)
> drive's power plug is disconnected, will the other(D) drive
> automatically become the boot drive if it also has an operating system
> installed?
> Are there any short or long term negative effects to switching between
> boot drives this way on a regular basis?
> Thanks a lot.
>
> Darren Harris
> Staten Island, New York.

You are proposing a sledge hammer approach to an easy to solve problem.
Google: dual boot windows for many step-by-step instructions.

Q
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 17, 2005 5:41:06 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

I was thinking of some kind of bootloader. Even if you use the Linux Lilo
just to switch between two windows systems, it would be better.
"Quaoar" <quaoar@tenthplanet.net> wrote in message
news:5rKdnZ__k9sAkHHcRVn-2w@comcast.com...
> Searcher7@mail.con2.com wrote:
> > If one has multiple drives, in a single system, and the normal boot(C)
> > drive's power plug is disconnected, will the other(D) drive
> > automatically become the boot drive if it also has an operating system
> > installed?
> > Are there any short or long term negative effects to switching between
> > boot drives this way on a regular basis?
> > Thanks a lot.
> >
> > Darren Harris
> > Staten Island, New York.
>
> You are proposing a sledge hammer approach to an easy to solve problem.
> Google: dual boot windows for many step-by-step instructions.
>
> Q
>
>
Related resources
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 17, 2005 5:52:45 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

Robbie McFerren wrote:
> I was thinking of some kind of bootloader. Even if you use the Linux Lilo
> just to switch between two windows systems, it would be better.
> "Quaoar" <quaoar@tenthplanet.net> wrote in message
> news:5rKdnZ__k9sAkHHcRVn-2w@comcast.com...
>
>>Searcher7@mail.con2.com wrote:
>>
>>>If one has multiple drives, in a single system, and the normal boot(C)
>>>drive's power plug is disconnected, will the other(D) drive
>>>automatically become the boot drive if it also has an operating system
>>>installed?
>>>Are there any short or long term negative effects to switching between
>>>boot drives this way on a regular basis?
>>>Thanks a lot.
>>>
>>>Darren Harris
>>>Staten Island, New York.
>>
>>You are proposing a sledge hammer approach to an easy to solve problem.
>>Google: dual boot windows for many step-by-step instructions.
>
My Abit motherboard has a BIOS setup selection to switch A: and B: .
January 17, 2005 5:59:11 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

William W. Plummer wrote:
> Robbie McFerren wrote:
>
>> I was thinking of some kind of bootloader. Even if you use the Linux
>> Lilo
>> just to switch between two windows systems, it would be better.
>> "Quaoar" <quaoar@tenthplanet.net> wrote in message
>> news:5rKdnZ__k9sAkHHcRVn-2w@comcast.com...
>>
>>> Searcher7@mail.con2.com wrote:
>>>
>>>> If one has multiple drives, in a single system, and the normal boot(C)
>>>> drive's power plug is disconnected, will the other(D) drive
>>>> automatically become the boot drive if it also has an operating system
>>>> installed?
>>>> Are there any short or long term negative effects to switching between
>>>> boot drives this way on a regular basis?
>>>> Thanks a lot.
>>>>
>>>> Darren Harris
>>>> Staten Island, New York.
>>>
>>>
>>> You are proposing a sledge hammer approach to an easy to solve problem.
>>> Google: dual boot windows for many step-by-step instructions.
>>
>>
> My Abit motherboard has a BIOS setup selection to switch A: and B: .

He's wanting to switch between hard drives C & D, not floppies A & B.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 17, 2005 6:17:37 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

<Searcher7@mail.con2.com> wrote:
> If one has multiple drives, in a single system, and the normal boot(C)
> drive's power plug is disconnected, will the other(D) drive
> automatically become the boot drive if it also has an operating system
> installed?
> Are there any short or long term negative effects to switching between
> boot drives this way on a regular basis?

I looked at this strategy last year, but eventually decided on a different
approach. Instead of switching the power off of one drive (and losing
accesibility), I built a switch (located on one of the empty floppy covers)
that was connected to each drives' Master/Slave jumper. By flipping the
switch, I can choose which drive is the boot drive, while at the same time
keeping the other drive hooked up so I can access the data - basically, the
switch takes the place of manually switching the Master/Slave jumpers on the
drives, which gets old real fast.

Here is a commercial site with a similar idea, just a different switch
configuration:
http://www.g4techtv.com/screensavers/features/43190/Bui...

Here's yet another approach, this one is a product that you buy:
http://www.dansdata.com/nicklock.htm

Jon
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 17, 2005 7:07:22 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

Thanks everyone.

Perhaps I'm getting closer to a solution.

My hardware is as follows: ASUS CUV4X motherboard, Adaptec AHA-2940U2W
SCSI controller, 18.21g Seagate(ST118202LC), 36.4g Fujitsu(MAF3364LC),
and 73.4G
Seagate(ST173404LCV).

I guess what I'm looking for comes down to a scenario that involves
isolating my largest drive whenever I'm connected to the internet, by
making sure it is "off" when I boot from the second drive. Hence the
idea of disconnecting the power cable. Dual booting would actually be
another issue.(But I'd like that option also).

I believe thesse are hot-swappable drives, but I was also wondering if
it were possible to rig a switch to their jumpers to turn off the
"write to" function of any of the drives instead. I have no idea if
this is possible/plausible, and if so, whether or not turning off write
function can be done while the PC is on.

Thanks.

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.
**************************************************************************************
Jon Danniken wrote:
> <Searcher7@mail.con2.com> wrote:
> > If one has multiple drives, in a single system, and the normal
boot(C)
> > drive's power plug is disconnected, will the other(D) drive
> > automatically become the boot drive if it also has an operating
system
> > installed?
> > Are there any short or long term negative effects to switching
between
> > boot drives this way on a regular basis?
>
> I looked at this strategy last year, but eventually decided on a
different
> approach. Instead of switching the power off of one drive (and
losing
> accesibility), I built a switch (located on one of the empty floppy
covers)
> that was connected to each drives' Master/Slave jumper. By flipping
the
> switch, I can choose which drive is the boot drive, while at the same
time
> keeping the other drive hooked up so I can access the data -
basically, the
> switch takes the place of manually switching the Master/Slave jumpers
on the
> drives, which gets old real fast.
>
> Here is a commercial site with a similar idea, just a different
switch
> configuration:
>
http://www.g4techtv.com/screensavers/features/43190/Bui...
>
> Here's yet another approach, this one is a product that you buy:
> http://www.dansdata.com/nicklock.htm
>
> Jon
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 17, 2005 9:05:59 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

<Searcher7@mail.con2.com> wrote:
> Thanks everyone.


The jumper switch is a copy of the Nicklock switch,
offered on a Swedish website until about a year of two
ago when it got bought out by an American company
that discontinued it. It only works with 2 HDs, though,
and making a connector yourself out of a jumper is really
tedious.

Regarding using a switch on your HD's power cable -
that is what I do. I have DPST switches (made from DPDT
toggle switches) that mount in 1/4" vent holes in the front of
the chassis under the plastic fascia. To switch off a HD,
with the PC unpowered(!), I reach in with a bent paperclip
and throw the switch ON or OFF. With the power OFF, the
HDs (Maxtor DiamondMax Plus 9s) are invisible to the BIOS
and the next HD in the boot sequence is given control at startup,
regardless of whether or not it's a Master or Slave. I also
use a removable HD in a "mobile tray" that has an OFF/ON
switch that has the same function as my DPST toggle switches.
Here are the details on the mobile tray:
http://kingwin.com/pdut_detail.asp?LineID=&CateID=35&ID...

I use the power cut-off toggle switches to reduce stress on
the power supply and on the bearings and electronics of the
HD when the HD is un-needed. But the primary reason is
to isolate the cloned OS from its clone when the clone is
booted up for its first time. Opening the case and unplugging
cables or the entire HD got old real fast, and it was causing
wear on the connectors. Now I just power down and flip
a toggle switch, and backing up the entire system by making
archived bootable clones is quite simple.

Since I run multiple installations of Windows XP Pro, I
also use WinXP's built-in multi-boot manager which allows
loading any Windows OS from any partition on any of several
HD in the system. All it takes is an understanding of the
syntax of the boot.ini file.

As a backup to the boot.ini multi-boot manager, I also
sometimes manually adjust the BIOS's boot sequence to
select which HD boots (actually which HD's boot.ini file
is used).

Between all three of these methods, managing a system
consisting of 7 OSes installed on 3 HDs (as I have) becomes
quite simple, but for some reason, not much has been written
about it.

*TimDaniels*
January 17, 2005 11:06:25 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

Searcher7@mail.con2.com wrote:
> If one has multiple drives, in a single system, and the normal boot(C)
> drive's power plug is disconnected, will the other(D) drive
> automatically become the boot drive if it also has an operating system
> installed?
> Are there any short or long term negative effects to switching between
> boot drives this way on a regular basis?
> Thanks a lot.
>
> Darren Harris
> Staten Island, New York.
>
I think it's a bad idea electrically (especially with IDE drives).

--
The e-mail address in our reply-to line is reversed in an attempt to
minimize spam. Our true address is of the form che...@prodigy.net.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 17, 2005 11:06:26 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

Not only is it a bad idea some hard drives and bioses will not support a
slave without a master or a boot from a secondary master. Use a bootloader.
"CJT" <abujlehc@prodigy.net> wrote in message
news:41EC1AC1.5020705@prodigy.net...
> Searcher7@mail.con2.com wrote:
> > If one has multiple drives, in a single system, and the normal boot(C)
> > drive's power plug is disconnected, will the other(D) drive
> > automatically become the boot drive if it also has an operating system
> > installed?
> > Are there any short or long term negative effects to switching between
> > boot drives this way on a regular basis?
> > Thanks a lot.
> >
> > Darren Harris
> > Staten Island, New York.
> >
> I think it's a bad idea electrically (especially with IDE drives).
>
> --
> The e-mail address in our reply-to line is reversed in an attempt to
> minimize spam. Our true address is of the form che...@prodigy.net.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 17, 2005 11:58:44 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

On 17 Jan 2005 11:06:43 -0800, Searcher7@mail.con2.com
wrote:

>If one has multiple drives, in a single system, and the normal boot(C)
>drive's power plug is disconnected, will the other(D) drive
>automatically become the boot drive if it also has an operating system
>installed?
>Are there any short or long term negative effects to switching between
>boot drives this way on a regular basis?
>Thanks a lot.
>
>Darren Harris
>Staten Island, New York.

Is it PATA or some other drive/interface type?
The answer is "Maybe" but no you can't generally assume it
will work because boards often look at a specific channel
and (for parallel, master/slave position) to attempt boot.
If your bios is set to try this device and it fails, it may
then stop without booting. It is also possible that the
bios "try other boot devices" setting will overcome this
instead of ignoring other (PATA?) drives but it is not
guaranteed.

In other words, you'll have to try it and see per your
board... easily enough done even if you dont' want to go to
the trouble of setting up windows on the 2nd drive, you
could still throw a FAT32 drive in with DOS on it.

The other issue is whether you're disconnecting a master or
slave if PATA. It would be better to use a drive with
single (master & single drive) jumper setting, being the
drive always connected, with the drive being unplugged being
the slave, such that the jumpering remains correct and you
always have a master device... of course it doesn't apply
for SATA.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 18, 2005 3:16:52 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

<Searcher7@mail.con2.com> wrote in message news:1105986599.357291.202090@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
> If one has multiple drives, in a single system, and the normal boot(C)
> drive's power plug is disconnected, will the other(D) drive
> automatically become the boot drive if it also has an operating
> system installed?
> Are there any short or long term negative effects to switching
> between boot drives this way on a regular basis?
> Thanks a lot.
>
> Darren Harris
> Staten Island, New York.
>
That works with SCSI because most SCSI host adapters will
just go to the next ID searching for a boot drive, but I don't
think it will work for IDE. One negative effect is the extra
wear and tear on the drive's power connector. It would be
better to use a double-pole switch (for the 12v and 5v).
I've never seen a switch made for switching drive power.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 18, 2005 3:16:53 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

If I understand your setup you seem to have 3 SCSI drives attached to the Adaptec
2940, correct? Why not just go into the Adaptec BIOS (CTL-A) and change the boot drive from 8 to 9 or
whatever? I have XP on SCSI drive 8 and Linux on SCSI drive 9 and just alternate which SCSI ID to load
from...

L David Matheny wrote:

> <Searcher7@mail.con2.com> wrote in message news:1105986599.357291.202090@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
> > If one has multiple drives, in a single system, and the normal boot(C)
> > drive's power plug is disconnected, will the other(D) drive
> > automatically become the boot drive if it also has an operating
> > system installed?
> > Are there any short or long term negative effects to switching
> > between boot drives this way on a regular basis?
> > Thanks a lot.
> >
> > Darren Harris
> > Staten Island, New York.
> >
> That works with SCSI because most SCSI host adapters will
> just go to the next ID searching for a boot drive, but I don't
> think it will work for IDE. One negative effect is the extra
> wear and tear on the drive's power connector. It would be
> better to use a double-pole switch (for the 12v and 5v).
> I've never seen a switch made for switching drive power.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 18, 2005 3:58:02 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

Oh look, Dirwin is back.

<Searcher7@mail.con2.com> wrote in message news:1105986599.357291.202090@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com
> If one has multiple drives, in a single system, and the normal boot(C)
> drive's power plug is disconnected, will the other(D) drive
> automatically become the boot drive if it also has an operating system
> installed?
> Are there any short or long term negative effects to switching between
> boot drives this way on a regular basis?
> Thanks a lot.
>
> Darren Harris
> Staten Island, New York.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 18, 2005 5:49:02 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

On Mon, 17 Jan 2005 18:05:59 -0800, "Timothy Daniels"
<TDaniels@NoSpamDot.com> wrote:

><Searcher7@mail.con2.com> wrote:
>> Thanks everyone.
>
>
> The jumper switch is a copy of the Nicklock switch,
>offered on a Swedish website until about a year of two
>ago when it got bought out by an American company
>that discontinued it. It only works with 2 HDs, though,
>and making a connector yourself out of a jumper is really
>tedious.

Who needs to make a connector?
Grab any abandoned AT case and pull the reset, LED cables
out... or if you're lucky enough to find an abandoned ATX,
you'll have the power switch cable too. Although, it's not
much of a solution since there are boot managers and that it
does not safeguard the drive.

>
> Regarding using a switch on your HD's power cable -
>that is what I do. I have DPST switches (made from DPDT

<snip>

> Between all three of these methods, managing a system
>consisting of 7 OSes installed on 3 HDs (as I have) becomes
>quite simple, but for some reason, not much has been written
>about it.


Because most people don't need 7 OS?
Better safe than sorry though, if you find your use really
warrants that setup.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 18, 2005 11:35:10 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

<Searcher7@mail.con2.com> wrote in message
news:1105986599.357291.202090@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...

> If one has multiple drives, in a single system, and the
> normal boot(C) drive's power plug is disconnected,
> will the other(D) drive automatically become the boot
> drive if it also has an operating system installed?

Depends on the motherboard bios. Most modern bios will go thru
the specified sequence of devices to boot from until it finds one
thats bootable so the one with the power unplugged will be skipped.

It also varys a bit with the drives too. If you have them setup
as master and slave on the same ribbon cable and unplug the
power from the master, most drives will come up as slave
fine with no master, but not all drives will. There are a few
drives around still that have a different jumper setting for
master in a pair and single drive on a cable.

Not a problem if you are using cable select.

> Are there any short or long term negative effects to
> switching between boot drives this way on a regular basis?

Yes, some systems dont work reliably with an unpowered
drive on the ribbon cable. Doesnt damage anything but you
can get data errors in that config.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 18, 2005 12:14:19 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

> The original poster didn't mention SCSI, so we are assuming that he
> is using IDE drives. I said that what he wants to do works with SCSI
> but probably not with IDE. In my case, I remove power from my
> primary SCSI drive because I want to boot to my secondary (test)
drive
> *without* having the primary drive online (to be infected or
whatever).

That was the original and primary purpose of keeping only a single
drive in my system connected to the internet.

There is less power consumption and less noise when two out of three
drives are unplugged.(They're 10K rpm SCSI drives). But I still wonder
if it is more plausible to rig some sort of jumper switch to turn
off/on the write to my "D" and "E" drives.

If anyone knows for certain, and how to do this, I would appreciate any
pointers.

Thanks a lot.

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 18, 2005 1:44:14 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

On 17 Jan 2005 11:06:43 -0800, Searcher7@mail.con2.com wrote:

>If one has multiple drives, in a single system, and the normal boot(C)
>drive's power plug is disconnected, will the other(D) drive
>automatically become the boot drive if it also has an operating system
>installed?

If the IDE remains conencted, and the power is turned off, then the other drive
on that cable won't work.

FWIW, I used to have a system with two HDs, and I made a switch to toggle the
master/slave settings of them. It worked perfectly.

If you want to use a hardware solution, that might be an option for you.

--
Chris Pollard


CG Internet café, Tagum City, Philippines
http://www.cginternet.net
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 18, 2005 2:01:34 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

"John Smith" <jsmith@aol.com> wrote in message news:41ECAC36.217D15C0@aol.com...
> If I understand your setup you seem to have 3 SCSI drives attached
> to the Adaptec 2940, correct? Why not just go into the Adaptec BIOS
> (CTL-A) and change the boot drive from 8 to 9 or whatever? I have
> XP on SCSI drive 8 and Linux on SCSI drive 9 and just alternate
> which SCSI ID to load from...
>
The original poster didn't mention SCSI, so we are assuming that he
is using IDE drives. I said that what he wants to do works with SCSI
but probably not with IDE. In my case, I remove power from my
primary SCSI drive because I want to boot to my secondary (test) drive
*without* having the primary drive online (to be infected or whatever).
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 18, 2005 3:12:55 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

Franc Zabkar wrote:
> On 18 Jan 2005 09:14:19 -0800, Searcher7@mail.con2.com put finger to
> keyboard and composed:
>
> >> The original poster didn't mention SCSI, so we are assuming that
he
> >> is using IDE drives. I said that what he wants to do works with
SCSI
> >> but probably not with IDE. In my case, I remove power from my
> >> primary SCSI drive because I want to boot to my secondary (test)
> >drive
> >> *without* having the primary drive online (to be infected or
> >whatever).
> >
> >That was the original and primary purpose of keeping only a single
> >drive in my system connected to the internet.
> >
> >There is less power consumption and less noise when two out of three
> >drives are unplugged.(They're 10K rpm SCSI drives). But I still
wonder
> >if it is more plausible to rig some sort of jumper switch to turn
> >off/on the write to my "D" and "E" drives.
> >
> >If anyone knows for certain, and how to do this, I would appreciate
any
> >pointers.
>
> Huh? Didn't you see my first post to this thread?
>
> Place a jumper over the Write Protect pin of a particular drive and
> then test whether you can write to it. Do it with power disconnected.
> Many intelligent devices only look at their jumper settings at
> power-up time.

Easier said than done. I've been to the Seagate site and could not find
specifics on what jumper is for write protect.(That ASCII is pretty
confusing).

I'm assuming that if I can find a way to partition my "D" and "E"
drives(two and four partitions respectively), all six resulting
partitions still would nbot write between each other, or does the write
protect just block "outside the drive" data?
Thanks.

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 18, 2005 4:57:35 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

"Christopher Pollard" <rubbish@cginternet.net> wrote in message
news:cstou0l8vjrrgln4mjkd347hsmmhnv9u3s@4ax.com...
> On 17 Jan 2005 11:06:43 -0800, Searcher7@mail.con2.com wrote:
>
>>If one has multiple drives, in a single system, and the normal boot(C)
>>drive's power plug is disconnected, will the other(D) drive
>>automatically become the boot drive if it also has an operating system
>>installed?

> If the IDE remains conencted, and the power is turned
> off, then the other drive on that cable won't work.

They usually do, actually.

> FWIW, I used to have a system with two HDs, and I made a switch to toggle the
> master/slave settings of them. It worked perfectly.
>
> If you want to use a hardware solution, that might be an option for you.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 18, 2005 7:10:32 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

On 17 Jan 2005 16:07:22 -0800, Searcher7@mail.con2.com put finger to
keyboard and composed:

>I was also wondering if
>it were possible to rig a switch to their jumpers to turn off the
>"write to" function of any of the drives instead.

I believe most (all?) SCSI drives have a write protect (WP) jumper.

See the following URLs:
http://www.fujitsu.com/global/support/computing/storage...
http://www.seagate.com/support/disc/scsi/st118202lc.htm...
http://www.seagate.com/support/disc/specs/scsi/st173404...

Locate the appropriate jumper and wire a SPST switch to it.


- Franc Zabkar
--
Please remove one 's' from my address when replying by email.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 18, 2005 8:19:14 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 00:16:52 -0500, "L David Matheny"
<ldmnews1@netassoc.net> put finger to keyboard and composed:

><Searcher7@mail.con2.com> wrote in message news:1105986599.357291.202090@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
>> If one has multiple drives, in a single system, and the normal boot(C)
>> drive's power plug is disconnected, will the other(D) drive
>> automatically become the boot drive if it also has an operating
>> system installed?
>> Are there any short or long term negative effects to switching
>> between boot drives this way on a regular basis?
>> Thanks a lot.
>>
>> Darren Harris
>> Staten Island, New York.
>>
>That works with SCSI because most SCSI host adapters will
>just go to the next ID searching for a boot drive, ...

Then why not connect SCSI ID bit 3 to a switch? When the switch is
closed, drive 0 becomes drive 8, or drive 1 becomes 9, or drive 2
becomes 10. An additional write protect switch would give added
security. A single DPST switch would handle both functions.


- Franc Zabkar
--
Please remove one 's' from my address when replying by email.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 18, 2005 8:19:15 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

"Franc Zabkar" <fzabkar@optussnet.com.au> wrote in message news:v1apu0dd7v3pba6mr9n7sgnptqt4eq184j@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 18 Jan 2005 00:16:52 -0500, "L David Matheny"
> <ldmnews1@netassoc.net> put finger to keyboard and composed:
<snip>
> >That works with SCSI because most SCSI host adapters will
> >just go to the next ID searching for a boot drive, ...
>
> Then why not connect SCSI ID bit 3 to a switch? When the switch is
> closed, drive 0 becomes drive 8, or drive 1 becomes 9, or drive 2
> becomes 10. An additional write protect switch would give added
> security. A single DPST switch would handle both functions.
>
When I boot my backup (test) drive I don't really need or want my
primary drive online for security reasons, but your idea of also switching
a write-protect line sounds interesting. Thanks. I just haven't gone to
that much trouble because I don't switch between drives very often.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 19, 2005 3:40:34 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

"L David Matheny" <ldmnews1@netassoc.net> wrote in message news:354pvlF4hgbj2U1@individual.net
> "John Smith" <jsmith@aol.com> wrote in message news:41ECAC36.217D15C0@aol.com...
> > If I understand your setup you seem to have 3 SCSI drives attached
> > to the Adaptec 2940, correct? Why not just go into the Adaptec BIOS
> > (CTL-A) and change the boot drive from 8 to 9 or whatever? I have
> > XP on SCSI drive 8 and Linux on SCSI drive 9 and just alternate
> > which SCSI ID to load from...
> >
> The original poster didn't mention SCSI,

OP did, just not in his OP.

> so we are assuming that he
> is using IDE drives. I said that what he wants to do works with SCSI
> but probably not with IDE. In my case, I remove power from my
> primary SCSI drive because I want to boot to my secondary (test) drive
> *without* having the primary drive online (to be infected or whatever).
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 19, 2005 4:01:02 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

"L David Matheny" <ldmnews1@netassoc.net> wrote in message news:353k6lF4g1og4U1@individual.net
> <Searcher7@mail.con2.com> wrote in message news:1105986599.357291.202090@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
> > If one has multiple drives, in a single system, and the normal boot(C)
> > drive's power plug is disconnected, will the other(D) drive
> > automatically become the boot drive if it also has an operating
> > system installed?
> > Are there any short or long term negative effects to switching
> > between boot drives this way on a regular basis?
> > Thanks a lot.
> >
> > Darren Harris
> > Staten Island, New York.
> >
> That works with SCSI because most SCSI host adapters will
> just go to the next ID searching for a boot drive,

Actually, their bios enumerates devices starting with the boot ID and
then from ID0 up to ID15 (or in reverse if LSI and if so ordered).
(You can also remove devices from bios inclusion so they can't boot).

> but I don't think it will work for IDE.

Actually, it is a function of the MB bios, so not IDE or SCSI dependent.
It just looks for the first bootable or possibly bootable drive using the
MB bootsequence order.
If you have a possibly bootable drive but that isn't made bootable, the
bootsequence just stops there, if it's a non boot-able drive it just goes
to the next in sequence.

> One negative effect is the extra wear and tear on the
> drive's power connector. It would be better to use a
> double-pole switch (for the 12v and 5v).
> I've never seen a switch made for switching drive power.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 19, 2005 4:47:21 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

Folkert Rienstra wrote:
> "Franc Zabkar" <fzabkar@optussnet.com.au> wrote in message
news:7aoqu0lu29li383g3l7mh82sufv275qfou@4ax.com
> > On 18 Jan 2005 09:14:19 -0800, Searcher7@mail.con2.com put finger
to
> > keyboard and composed:
> >
> > > > The original poster didn't mention SCSI, so we are assuming
that he
> > > > is using IDE drives. I said that what he wants to do works
with SCSI
> > > > but probably not with IDE. In my case, I remove power from my
> > > > primary SCSI drive because I want to boot to my secondary
(test) drive
> > > > *without* having the primary drive online (to be infected or
whatever).
> > >
> > > That was the original and primary purpose of keeping only a
single
> > > drive in my system connected to the internet.
> > >
> > > There is less power consumption and less noise when two out of
three
> > > drives are unplugged.(They're 10K rpm SCSI drives). But I still
wonder
> > > if it is more plausible to rig some sort of jumper switch to turn
> > > off/on the write to my "D" and "E" drives.
> > >
> > > If anyone knows for certain, and how to do this, I would
appreciate any
> > > pointers.
> >
> > Huh? Didn't you see my first post to this thread?
>
> Of course he did, but he is Dirwin. Dirwin is into trick questions.
> He will now try and make you look foolish, as if you gave stupid
advice.
> He did it before in other threads.

No. You didn't need my help whats0oever in looking foolish.
Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 19, 2005 9:24:16 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

On 18 Jan 2005 09:14:19 -0800, Searcher7@mail.con2.com put finger to
keyboard and composed:

>> The original poster didn't mention SCSI, so we are assuming that he
>> is using IDE drives. I said that what he wants to do works with SCSI
>> but probably not with IDE. In my case, I remove power from my
>> primary SCSI drive because I want to boot to my secondary (test)
>drive
>> *without* having the primary drive online (to be infected or
>whatever).
>
>That was the original and primary purpose of keeping only a single
>drive in my system connected to the internet.
>
>There is less power consumption and less noise when two out of three
>drives are unplugged.(They're 10K rpm SCSI drives). But I still wonder
>if it is more plausible to rig some sort of jumper switch to turn
>off/on the write to my "D" and "E" drives.
>
>If anyone knows for certain, and how to do this, I would appreciate any
>pointers.

Huh? Didn't you see my first post to this thread?

Place a jumper over the Write Protect pin of a particular drive and
then test whether you can write to it. Do it with power disconnected.
Many intelligent devices only look at their jumper settings at
power-up time.


- Franc Zabkar
--
Please remove one 's' from my address when replying by email.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 19, 2005 9:24:17 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

"Franc Zabkar" <fzabkar@optussnet.com.au> wrote in message news:7aoqu0lu29li383g3l7mh82sufv275qfou@4ax.com
> On 18 Jan 2005 09:14:19 -0800, Searcher7@mail.con2.com put finger to
> keyboard and composed:
>
> > > The original poster didn't mention SCSI, so we are assuming that he
> > > is using IDE drives. I said that what he wants to do works with SCSI
> > > but probably not with IDE. In my case, I remove power from my
> > > primary SCSI drive because I want to boot to my secondary (test) drive
> > > *without* having the primary drive online (to be infected or whatever).
> >
> > That was the original and primary purpose of keeping only a single
> > drive in my system connected to the internet.
> >
> > There is less power consumption and less noise when two out of three
> > drives are unplugged.(They're 10K rpm SCSI drives). But I still wonder
> > if it is more plausible to rig some sort of jumper switch to turn
> > off/on the write to my "D" and "E" drives.
> >
> > If anyone knows for certain, and how to do this, I would appreciate any
> > pointers.
>
> Huh? Didn't you see my first post to this thread?

Of course he did, but he is Dirwin. Dirwin is into trick questions.
He will now try and make you look foolish, as if you gave stupid advice.
He did it before in other threads.

>
> Place a jumper over the Write Protect pin of a particular drive and
> then test whether you can write to it. Do it with power disconnected.
> Many intelligent devices only look at their jumper settings at
> power-up time.
>
>
> - Franc Zabkar
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 19, 2005 5:02:31 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

On 18 Jan 2005 12:12:55 -0800, Searcher7@mail.con2.com put finger to
keyboard and composed:

>
>Franc Zabkar wrote:
>> On 18 Jan 2005 09:14:19 -0800, Searcher7@mail.con2.com put finger to
>> keyboard and composed:
>>
>> >> The original poster didn't mention SCSI, so we are assuming that
>he
>> >> is using IDE drives. I said that what he wants to do works with
>SCSI
>> >> but probably not with IDE. In my case, I remove power from my
>> >> primary SCSI drive because I want to boot to my secondary (test)
>> >drive
>> >> *without* having the primary drive online (to be infected or
>> >whatever).
>> >
>> >That was the original and primary purpose of keeping only a single
>> >drive in my system connected to the internet.
>> >
>> >There is less power consumption and less noise when two out of three
>> >drives are unplugged.(They're 10K rpm SCSI drives). But I still
>wonder
>> >if it is more plausible to rig some sort of jumper switch to turn
>> >off/on the write to my "D" and "E" drives.
>> >
>> >If anyone knows for certain, and how to do this, I would appreciate
>any
>> >pointers.
>>
>> Huh? Didn't you see my first post to this thread?
>>
>> Place a jumper over the Write Protect pin of a particular drive and
>> then test whether you can write to it. Do it with power disconnected.
>> Many intelligent devices only look at their jumper settings at
>> power-up time.
>
>Easier said than done. I've been to the Seagate site and could not find
>specifics on what jumper is for write protect.(That ASCII is pretty
>confusing).

If you mean Seagate's "letter gothic" font, then follow the "Odd
characters?" link on the ST173404LCV page:
http://www.seagate.com/support/disc/specs/fonts.html

The Write Protect jumper is at position 5 of connector J2 on the side
of the drive. Position 1 is toward the rear of the HD. Installing the
jumper write protects the HD, leaving it open enables it.

>I'm assuming that if I can find a way to partition my "D" and "E"
>drives(two and four partitions respectively), all six resulting
>partitions still would nbot write between each other, or does the write
>protect just block "outside the drive" data?

The WP jumper write disables the entire physical drive. You can
"disable" individual partitions across multiple drives by using an
intelligent boot manager that hides selected partitions. It does this
by changing the partition type byte in the relevant partition
table(s).


- Franc Zabkar
--
Please remove one 's' from my address when replying by email.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 19, 2005 5:02:32 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

"Franc Zabkar" <fzabkar@optussnet.com.au> wrote in message news:D cdru09d87624oo9hlt2ajdvu6v5gacc9o@4ax.com...
<snip>
> The WP jumper write disables the entire physical drive.

I would trust this SCSI hardware solution completely.

> You can "disable" individual partitions across multiple
> drives by using an intelligent boot manager that hides
> selected partitions. It does this by changing the partition
> type byte in the relevant partition table(s).
>
But this could possibly be undone by a malicious program.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 19, 2005 8:47:27 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

"CJT" wrote:
>>The original question that started this thread was
>> geared towards finding any possible negatives
>> in switching boot drives by cutting power completely.
>
> ... and the short answer is : don't do it.


Why?

*TimDan*
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 20, 2005 3:38:52 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

"Franc Zabkar" <fzabkar@optussnet.com.au> wrote in message news:D cdru09d87624oo9hlt2ajdvu6v5gacc9o@4ax.com
> On 18 Jan 2005 12:12:55 -0800, Searcher7@mail.con2.com put finger to keyboard and composed:
> > Franc Zabkar wrote:
> > > On 18 Jan 2005 09:14:19 -0800, Searcher7@mail.con2.com put finger to keyboard and composed:
> > >
> > > > > The original poster didn't mention SCSI, so we are assuming that he
> > > > > is using IDE drives. I said that what he wants to do works with SCSI
> > > > > but probably not with IDE. In my case, I remove power from my
> > > > > primary SCSI drive because I want to boot to my secondary (test) drive
> > > > > *without* having the primary drive online (to be infected or whatever).
> > > >
> > > > That was the original and primary purpose of keeping only a single
> > > > drive in my system connected to the internet.
> > > >
> > > > There is less power consumption and less noise when two out of three
> > > > drives are unplugged.(They're 10K rpm SCSI drives). But I still wonder
> > > > if it is more plausible to rig some sort of jumper switch to turn
> > > > off/on the write to my "D" and "E" drives.
> > > >
> > > > If anyone knows for certain, and how to do this, I would appreciate any
> > > > pointers.
> > >
> > > Huh? Didn't you see my first post to this thread?
> > >
> > > Place a jumper over the Write Protect pin of a particular drive and
> > > then test whether you can write to it. Do it with power disconnected.
> > > Many intelligent devices only look at their jumper settings at
> > > power-up time.
> >
> > Easier said than done. I've been to the Seagate site and could not find
> > specifics on what jumper is for write protect.(That ASCII is pretty
> > confusing).
>
> If you mean Seagate's "letter gothic" font, then follow the "Odd
> characters?" link on the ST173404LCV page:
> http://www.seagate.com/support/disc/specs/fonts.html
>
> The Write Protect jumper is at position 5

> of connector J2 on the side of the drive.

You forgot to tell Dirwin which side of the drive.
Now he will be looking for it at the side(s) instead of the underside
and be wondering what this J2 pictorial on the label of the drive is
all about. Please, do not confuse Dirwin.

> Position 1 is toward the rear of the HD.
> Installing the jumper write protects the HD,

> leaving it open enables it.

Now Dirwin is completely confused.

>
> > I'm assuming that if I can find a way to partition my "D" and "E"
> > drives (two and four partitions respectively), all six resulting
> > partitions still would not write between each other, or does the
> > write protect just block "outside the drive" data?

What an intelligent question, Dirwin, you make me proud.

>
> The WP jumper write disables the entire physical drive. You can
> "disable" individual partitions across multiple drives by using an
> intelligent boot manager that hides selected partitions. It does this
> by changing the partition type byte in the relevant partitiontable(s).
>
>
> - Franc Zabkar
January 20, 2005 6:56:58 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

Timothy Daniels wrote:
> "CJT" wrote:
>
>>> The original question that started this thread was
>>> geared towards finding any possible negatives
>>> in switching boot drives by cutting power completely.
>>
>>
>> ... and the short answer is : don't do it.
>
>
>
> Why?
>
> *TimDan*

At best it creates an electrical situation that is undefined and can
lead to errors, perhaps via excess loading or reflections (but, being
undefined, who can say?). At worst it will blow the line drivers on
either the drive(s) or controller or both (unlikely, but again, it's
behavior that's undefined, so who knows?).

--
The e-mail address in our reply-to line is reversed in an attempt to
minimize spam. Our true address is of the form che...@prodigy.net.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 20, 2005 12:27:58 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

Eric Gisin wrote:
> <puss@purrpurr.com> wrote in message
> news:3cruu090jkv9hjabtckglk5scjkl1m9nlh@4ax.com...
> > On 17 Jan 2005 11:06:43 -0800, Searcher7@mail.con2.com wrote:
> >
> > >If one has multiple drives, in a single system, and the normal
boot(C)
> > >drive's power plug is disconnected, will the other(D) drive
> > >automatically become the boot drive if it also has an operating
system
> > >installed?
> > >Are there any short or long term negative effects to switching
between
> > >boot drives this way on a regular basis?
> >
> > My MoBo Gigabyte has a ATA/RAID ITE Controller chip, and my new
Bios lets me
> > select what drive out of the 4 to boot from..
> >
> Forget it, Dirwin is a well known troll. He is not listening.
>
> I believe he's been told to use boot managers in a previous thread,
but it was
> way to difficult for him.

Back with your lies. I see.

You and Folkert are the well known instigators here, and it is common
knowledge to regular posters.

I exposed you already for what you are, so go find another thread to
troll.

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 20, 2005 8:56:05 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

CBFalconer wrote:
> Searcher7@mail.con2.com wrote:
> > Timothy Daniels wrote:
> >> <Searcher7@mail.con2.com> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> I have no idea what that was referring to.
> >>
> >> It means stop responding to the trolls. They are
> >> playing with you.
> >
> > And I can't play back? :-)
> >
> > Just about every newsgroup has it's jackasses. This one has three.
> > I'm sure that the third one will also post something stupid if he
> > sees this, but I won't mention his name until he does.
> >
> > Anyway, whenever they(especially Eric) see a thread I start they
> > post a statement "warning" the other legit posters that I am a
> > troll.(As if other posters are incapable of determining who is a
> > troll). From there the thread becomes garbage, because I have to
> > fire back.
>
> No you don't. You are just amusing them and annoying others,
> especially on a foully crossposted thread such as this. If you
> have them identified, simply PLONK them.

No such option. I read and post via Goolge.

Anyway, I'll handle it my way. Perhaps I'm the one who is amused.

And what is annoying is someone unrelated to the discussion(or
argument) has to put their two cents in on the worng side. "Advise"
those who *instigate*, and perhaps you will accomplish something.
Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 20, 2005 9:10:39 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

"CJT" <abujlehc@prodigy.net> wrote in message news:41EF2C08.8000301@prodigy.net
> Timothy Daniels wrote:
> > "CJT" wrote:
> >
> > > > The original question that started this thread was
> > > > geared towards finding any possible negatives
> > > > in switching boot drives by cutting power completely.
> > >
> > > ... and the short answer is : don't do it.
> >
> > Why?
> >
> > *TimDan*
>

> At best it creates an electrical situation that is undefined

Not with SCSI and SATA.

> and can lead to errors, perhaps via excess loading or reflections

Not with SCSI and SATA.

> (but, being undefined, who can say?).

With SCSI it is not undefined.
With IDE the specs don't say anything about it.

> At worst it will blow the line drivers on
> either the drive(s) or controller or both

So drive caddies with power switches on them are inherently dangerous!?!
Sigh!

> (unlikely, but again, it's behavior that's undefined, so who knows?).
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 21, 2005 12:37:39 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

On 17 Jan 2005 11:06:43 -0800, Searcher7@mail.con2.com wrote:

>If one has multiple drives, in a single system, and the normal boot(C)
>drive's power plug is disconnected, will the other(D) drive
>automatically become the boot drive if it also has an operating system
>installed?
>Are there any short or long term negative effects to switching between
>boot drives this way on a regular basis?
>Thanks a lot.
>
>Darren Harris
>Staten Island, New York.



My MoBo Gigabyte has a ATA/RAID ITE Controller chip, and my new Bios lets me
select what drive out of the 4 to boot from..
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 21, 2005 12:37:40 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

<puss@purrpurr.com> wrote in message
news:3cruu090jkv9hjabtckglk5scjkl1m9nlh@4ax.com...
> On 17 Jan 2005 11:06:43 -0800, Searcher7@mail.con2.com wrote:
>
> >If one has multiple drives, in a single system, and the normal boot(C)
> >drive's power plug is disconnected, will the other(D) drive
> >automatically become the boot drive if it also has an operating system
> >installed?
> >Are there any short or long term negative effects to switching between
> >boot drives this way on a regular basis?
>
> My MoBo Gigabyte has a ATA/RAID ITE Controller chip, and my new Bios lets me
> select what drive out of the 4 to boot from..
>
Forget it, Dirwin is a well known troll. He is not listening.

I believe he's been told to use boot managers in a previous thread, but it was
way to difficult for him.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 21, 2005 4:26:06 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

Searcher7@mail.con2.com wrote:
> Timothy Daniels wrote:
>> <Searcher7@mail.con2.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> I have no idea what that was referring to.
>>
>> It means stop responding to the trolls. They are
>> playing with you.
>
> And I can't play back? :-)
>
> Just about every newsgroup has it's jackasses. This one has three.
> I'm sure that the third one will also post something stupid if he
> sees this, but I won't mention his name until he does.
>
> Anyway, whenever they(especially Eric) see a thread I start they
> post a statement "warning" the other legit posters that I am a
> troll.(As if other posters are incapable of determining who is a
> troll). From there the thread becomes garbage, because I have to
> fire back.

No you don't. You are just amusing them and annoying others,
especially on a foully crossposted thread such as this. If you
have them identified, simply PLONK them.

--
"If you want to post a followup via groups.google.com, don't use
the broken "Reply" link at the bottom of the article. Click on
"show options" at the top of the article, then click on the
"Reply" at the bottom of the article headers." - Keith Thompson
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 21, 2005 10:54:06 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

>>>
>>> ... and the short answer is : don't do it.
>>
>>
>>
>> Why?
>>
>> *TimDan*
>
>At best it creates an electrical situation that is undefined and can
>lead to errors, perhaps via excess loading or reflections (but, being
>undefined, who can say?). At worst it will blow the line drivers on
>either the drive(s) or controller or both (unlikely, but again, it's
>behavior that's undefined, so who knows?).

It would be a wonderful situation if people only posted what they know
about! I have 3 three bay hard drive enclosures, 1 five bay, 2 sata
units and about 7 indivdual drives mostly with systems on them
connected to the mother board at various times by the ide and a
couple of drive controller cards. Control is by which have power
connected/disconnected and with bios choice. Guess what??? works
fine!!!!!
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 21, 2005 12:37:24 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

Take you meds, Dirwin. We have seen many a troll round here, and you surely are
one of them. One only has to look at the inappropriate cross-posting.

Tell us Dirwin, what is an instigator? We would like to hear more of your
delusions about trolls.

<Searcher7@mail.con2.com> wrote in message
news:1106242078.400971.261990@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
>
> > Forget it, Dirwin is a well known troll. He is not listening.
> >
> > I believe he's been told to use boot managers in a previous thread,
> but it was
> > way to difficult for him.
>
> Back with your lies. I see.
>
> You and Folkert are the well known instigators here, and it is common
> knowledge to regular posters.
>
> I exposed you already for what you are, so go find another thread to
> troll.
>
> Darren Harris
> Staten Island, New York.
>
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 21, 2005 12:45:25 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

"IDIDIT" <VISCH@EVASION.COM> wrote in message
news:jgc1v0pcbi1njalskmfj0qtl3sfd5i4hag@4ax.com...
>
> >At best it creates an electrical situation that is undefined and can
> >lead to errors, perhaps via excess loading or reflections (but, being
> >undefined, who can say?). At worst it will blow the line drivers on
> >either the drive(s) or controller or both (unlikely, but again, it's
> >behavior that's undefined, so who knows?).
>
> It would be a wonderful situation if people only posted what they know
> about! I have 3 three bay hard drive enclosures, 1 five bay, 2 sata
> units and about 7 indivdual drives mostly with systems on them
> connected to the mother board at various times by the ide and a
> couple of drive controller cards. Control is by which have power
> connected/disconnected and with bios choice. Guess what??? works
> fine!!!!!

And you know all about it based on one experience?

Those of us with more experience know it can cause data corruption.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 21, 2005 6:02:58 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

Eric Gisin wrote:
> Take you meds, Dirwin. We have seen many a troll round here, and you
surely are
> one of them. One only has to look at the inappropriate cross-posting.
>
> Tell us Dirwin, what is an instigator? We would like to hear more of
your
> delusions about trolls.

Definition of Troll: Eric Gisin

The normal posters here are smart enough to know who the trolls are.
They don't need you to jump on all my threads whenever I post in an
effort to convince them to take your point of view.

Everything was fine until you arrived. But this is how it always goes,
doesn't it?

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 22, 2005 12:15:29 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

> UNTIL you'd received all the useful replies one could expect
> given the circumstances, but then didnt' just go about
> implementing your plan for the power-off backup.
> Considering that it's been awhile since that last post, I
> question whether you really have a pressing need to leave a
> drive in off-state, else you'd have found a solution already
> and this thread wouldn't exist.
>
> What I'm suggesting, is that you go ahead and try it, with a
> drive NOT yet holding valuable data. Make it a test case,
> and if it's working to your satisfaction, report back the
> result. There isn't anything more this thread can do for
> you, nor that you can do for the thread, other than snip
> back and forth with those who would taunt you.

Thanks. I agree.

>From what I see all bases were covered.

The best solution is actually a combination of options.

Two toggle switches for all but the "C" drive. One for manipulating the
write protect, and the other for turning on/off power.(Then there is
also supposed to be some SCSI utilty that spins down drives that have
not been accesses in a while, and back up when polled).

This is going to be a huge project.(Perhaps one day the manufacturers
will ge smart and make these switches options standard on all pcs. But
I don't expect that to happen in this decade).
Thanks again.

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 22, 2005 11:29:50 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

Like all your past threads, you have yet to explain what you are doing and why.

So no one can answer your questions, you just waste our time.

Like I said last time, answer questions when you are asked. Quit your trolling.

<Searcher7@mail.con2.com> wrote in message
news:1106370929.797003.174170@c13g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
>
> >From what I see all bases were covered.
>
> The best solution is actually a combination of options.
>
> Two toggle switches for all but the "C" drive. One for manipulating the
> write protect, and the other for turning on/off power.(Then there is
> also supposed to be some SCSI utilty that spins down drives that have
> not been accesses in a while, and back up when polled).
>
> This is going to be a huge project.(Perhaps one day the manufacturers
> will ge smart and make these switches options standard on all pcs. But
> I don't expect that to happen in this decade).
> Thanks again.
>
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 22, 2005 12:23:19 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

Eric Gisin wrote:
> Like all your past threads, you have yet to explain what you are
doing and why.
>
> So no one can answer your questions, you just waste our time.
>
> Like I said last time, answer questions when you are asked. Quit your
trolling.

Eric Gisin = Super Troll

We will be at this forever until you leave me alone.

You are nobody. You know nothing. You do nothing but provoke.

If you think your time is being wasted, then don't post attacks on me
when I am have a discussion with normal intelligent people.
Moron.

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 22, 2005 1:17:11 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

Eric Gisin wrote
> Now you are spamming, cross posting and duplicate posting.
>
> Complaint sent to groups-abuse@google.com for three posts to four
groups.

You need to *learn* what spam is. And I have every right to cross post
as long as I'm on topic and what I post is pertinant to the newsgroup.

Since you are violating the Google Terms of Service I am sending a
complaint with referrences to the threads that I started where you have
without provocation displayed your immaturity and abusive behavior.(ie:
"Darren Harris, rabid psycho troll").

Terms of Service
****************
"defame, abuse, harass, stalk, threaten or otherwise violate the legal
rights (such as rights of privacy and publicity) of others;"

I'm also gathering the online evidence that you are harrassing others,
and will contact them to gather and send a collective complaint about
you. You obvious have a habit of going around calling people trolls(and
other things) for no reason.

And again for the record, here are some "Eric Gisin" hits in Google
Groups:
1) Eric Gisin Sodomizes Sheep
2) An open letter to Eric Gisin
3) Eric Gisin, Aubsiive Newsgroup Cyberpunk
4) Eric Gisin, Newsgroup Faggot Punk
5) Troll Alert: Eric Gisin
6) Eric Gisin in BC
7) "Eric Gisin" <ericg@netidea-com> is a seriously
8) The TRUTH about Eric Gisin
9) Troll Elimination: Eric Gisin
10) Let's Stop the Troll Eric Gisin!

They are all negative and that was just the first ten.(There is a good
reason for why you inspire threads like these).
Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 25, 2005 11:33:07 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

On Fri, 21 Jan 2005 09:45:25 -0800, "Eric Gisin"
<ericgisin@hotmail.com> wrote:

>"IDIDIT" <VISCH@EVASION.COM> wrote in message
>news:jgc1v0pcbi1njalskmfj0qtl3sfd5i4hag@4ax.com...
>>
>> >At best it creates an electrical situation that is undefined and can
>> >lead to errors, perhaps via excess loading or reflections (but, being
>> >undefined, who can say?). At worst it will blow the line drivers on
>> >either the drive(s) or controller or both (unlikely, but again, it's
>> >behavior that's undefined, so who knows?).
>>
>> It would be a wonderful situation if people only posted what they know
>> about! I have 3 three bay hard drive enclosures, 1 five bay, 2 sata
>> units and about 7 indivdual drives mostly with systems on them
>> connected to the mother board at various times by the ide and a
>> couple of drive controller cards. Control is by which have power
>> connected/disconnected and with bios choice. Guess what??? works
>> fine!!!!!
>
>And you know all about it based on one experience?
>
>Those of us with more experience know it can cause data corruption.
Ya I know, I'm just another "act as if" know it all thats around here.
I'll just say I serviced small systems when they had tubes and multi
contact mech. relays, punch card and paper tape input. Things from
mechanical adding machines to ATMs and high speed check sorters.
Fixing engineers mistakes to make things work was part of a normal
day. NUF SAID
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b G Storage
January 30, 2005 12:36:18 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage (More info?)

<Searcher7@mail.con2.com> wrote in message
news:1107061250.189644.150550@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
>
> J. Clarke wrote:
> >
> > Running with the signal cable plugged in and the power unplugged is
> > something that works sometimes--if it is working for you you are
> "getting
> > away" with something that's not documented as working. The trouble
> with
> > this is that you'll get away with it and think it's something you can
> do
> > and then one day you'll change drives or go to a new motherboard or
> > whatever and it will no longer work and you'll end up with a huge
> mess on
> > your hands.
>
> I guess that means that power *and* data connections would have to be
> physically disconnected. :-)
>
How many times have you been told that already? You must be really dense.
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