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Saving old hard disk data

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March 7, 2005 3:19:42 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage (More info?)

This message may be several years late, but I hope someone has a long
memory and can help.

I have an old 486, running Win 3.1 with 2 hard drives (one master and
one slave) which will no longer boot because of CMOS problems (backups
are no longer an option). I have obtained a Pentium II computer and
the plan was to install Win 98, hook up the old hard disks and copy
the data files over to the new computer's hard drive.

Windows 98 installed okay, and when I hooked up the old master hard
drive, I could read it as drive D: and used Windows Explorer to copy
the files to the new C:. However, the same procedure with the old
slave drive doesn't work. And, according to Murphy's Law, everything
that is really important is on the old slave.

When I look in the BIOS, the computer seems to be able to see the
drive (it picks up the size of the disk), but Dos/Windows does not
report it being there. I have tried configuring the hard drive as a
master, but this doesn't seem to help. I have also tried just booting
off of the old master, but get an error "Error loading OS" and the
computer freezes.

Any suggestions on how to get the new computer to play nice with the
old hard drive?

David

Technical stuff that may be important:

New computer: IBM Personal Computer 300GL, Pentium II, 400 MHz, 64MB
Ram
New hard drive: Quantum Fireball, 6.4 GB
Old master drive: Maxtor 71260AT
Old slave drive: Fujitsu MPB3021AT, 2.1 GB
BIOS Machine type/model: 627568U
BIOS Date: 03/16/99
BIOS Mode: Desktop

More about : saving hard disk data

Anonymous
a b G Storage
March 7, 2005 6:24:37 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage (More info?)

In article <bc26ec59.0503071219.48cc2f7f@posting.google.com>,
David <dmarchak@comnet.ca> wrote:
>This message may be several years late, but I hope someone has a long
>memory and can help.
>
>I have an old 486, running Win 3.1 with 2 hard drives (one master and
>one slave) which will no longer boot because of CMOS problems (backups
>are no longer an option). I have obtained a Pentium II computer and
>the plan was to install Win 98, hook up the old hard disks and copy
>the data files over to the new computer's hard drive.
>
>Windows 98 installed okay, and when I hooked up the old master hard
>drive, I could read it as drive D: and used Windows Explorer to copy
>the files to the new C:. However, the same procedure with the old
>slave drive doesn't work. And, according to Murphy's Law, everything
>that is really important is on the old slave.
>
>When I look in the BIOS, the computer seems to be able to see the
>drive (it picks up the size of the disk), but Dos/Windows does not
>report it being there. I have tried configuring the hard drive as a
>master, but this doesn't seem to help. I have also tried just booting
>off of the old master, but get an error "Error loading OS" and the
>computer freezes.
>
>Any suggestions on how to get the new computer to play nice with the
>old hard drive?
>
>David
>
>Technical stuff that may be important:
>
>New computer: IBM Personal Computer 300GL, Pentium II, 400 MHz, 64MB
>Ram
>New hard drive: Quantum Fireball, 6.4 GB
>Old master drive: Maxtor 71260AT
>Old slave drive: Fujitsu MPB3021AT, 2.1 GB
>BIOS Machine type/model: 627568U
>BIOS Date: 03/16/99
>BIOS Mode: Desktop

It's possible that the troublesome disk is so old that it doesn't know
how to autosetup in the CMOS. Look at the make and model # and google
to find the CCHHSS specs and put them in manually.

--

a d y k e s @ p a n i x . c o m

Don't blame me. I voted for Gore.
March 7, 2005 11:53:33 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage (More info?)

Thanks for the idea. Unfortunately, the new computer does not allow
for entry of this information (at least, not that I can see).

>
> It's possible that the troublesome disk is so old that it doesn't know
> how to autosetup in the CMOS. Look at the make and model # and google
> to find the CCHHSS specs and put them in manually.
Related resources
Anonymous
a b G Storage
March 8, 2005 10:32:53 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage (More info?)

In article <bc26ec59.0503072053.790b0a83@posting.google.com>,
David <dmarchak@comnet.ca> wrote:
>Thanks for the idea. Unfortunately, the new computer does not allow
>for entry of this information (at least, not that I can see).
>
>>
>> It's possible that the troublesome disk is so old that it doesn't know
>> how to autosetup in the CMOS. Look at the make and model # and google
>> to find the CCHHSS specs and put them in manually.


I've never seen a PC that doesn't allow entry of diskparameters.
Sometimes I when I get them they don't pause for F2 ro <del> or
whatever, and I have to figure out how to brea in. Generally banging
in ESC during boot does it for me. And there are machines with BIOS
password protection.

Can you get into BIOS setup ? What do you see ?

Post the make and model of the machine and better yet, the mobo model.

Also; Do you have the jumpers set correctly for this disk? Put it on
the secondary cable and remove all other devices.


--

a d y k e s @ p a n i x . c o m

Don't blame me. I voted for Gore.
Anonymous
a b G Storage
March 8, 2005 4:13:37 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage (More info?)

dmarchak@comnet.ca (David) wrote:

> This message may be several years late, but I hope someone has a long
> memory and can help.
>
> I have an old 486, running Win 3.1 with 2 hard drives (one master and
> one slave) which will no longer boot because of CMOS problems (backups
> are no longer an option). I have obtained a Pentium II computer and
> the plan was to install Win 98, hook up the old hard disks and copy
> the data files over to the new computer's hard drive.
>
> Windows 98 installed okay, and when I hooked up the old master hard
> drive, I could read it as drive D: and used Windows Explorer to copy
> the files to the new C:. However, the same procedure with the old
> slave drive doesn't work. And, according to Murphy's Law, everything
> that is really important is on the old slave.
>
> When I look in the BIOS, the computer seems to be able to see the
> drive (it picks up the size of the disk), but Dos/Windows does not
> report it being there. I have tried configuring the hard drive as a
> master, but this doesn't seem to help. I have also tried just booting
> off of the old master, but get an error "Error loading OS" and the
> computer freezes.
>
> Any suggestions on how to get the new computer to play nice with the
> old hard drive?
>
> David
>
> Technical stuff that may be important:
>
> New computer: IBM Personal Computer 300GL, Pentium II, 400 MHz, 64MB
> Ram
> New hard drive: Quantum Fireball, 6.4 GB
> Old master drive: Maxtor 71260AT
> Old slave drive: Fujitsu MPB3021AT, 2.1 GB
> BIOS Machine type/model: 627568U
> BIOS Date: 03/16/99
> BIOS Mode: Desktop

Are you sure you didn't use a boot overlay to access the full capacity of the
2.1 GB drive when in the old machine? The BIOS of such old boards could only
access up to 528 MB drives, unassisted. To access the full capacity you needed
to install a boot overlay or a special driver in the config.sys of the boot
drive (DMDRVR.BIN in case it was the Ontrack boot manager) to see the entire 2.1
GB.

The presence of a DDO partition on the apparently "bad" drive may explain the
problem you are experiencing.

I might be able to help, depending on the results obtained in the following
test. Download www.resq.co.il/download/resq.exe and prepare a RESQ floppy per
the instructions in the welcome box of the program. Hook the 2.1 GB drive as
second to your new board. Boot the computer from its own hard drive, tapping
the F8 key, and start in "command prompt only" mode.

When at the C:\ prompt, Make sure the RESQ floppy is write-enabled, insert it to
drive A:, change to A: and run from it RESQDISK /ASSESS /2 The program will
create a text report on the floppy, named RESQDISK.RPT. Post the report here
in a follow-up (pay attention to NOT wrap lines at less than 80 characters for
the report!).

We'll see from the report how to proceed.

Regards, Zvi
--
NetZ Computing Ltd. ISRAEL www.invircible.com www.ivi.co.il (Hebrew)
InVircible Virus Defense Solutions, ResQ and Data Recovery Utilities
March 8, 2005 4:13:38 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage (More info?)

Zvi

Thanks for the help. Here is the output of the resqdisk / assess
procedure. Note that I just booted from a floppy and the "bad" hard
disk is the only hard disk on the system at the moment (which is why
it shows disk 1). The next section is my summary of the results,
followed by the exact file that was created by the program (sorry, I
couldn't stop the word wrapping).

David

===============================================================

CHS MODE
CHS address: Cyl 0 Head 0 Sector 1
Disk Type: FUJITSU MPB3021ATU
BIOS/CHS IDE/LBA data
Number of Heads: 120 15
Number of Cylinders: 558 4470
Sectors per Track: 63 63
Disk Capacity in Mbytes: 2059 2062
IDE Access Time: 18 msec
Total sectors on drive: 4224150

Partition Starting Ending Reserved Total
Boot Type Head Cyl. Sec. Head Cyl. Sec. Sectors Sectors
Yes 84 0 0 10 14 372 63 9 4223196

EXTENDED

Checking cylinder 0 for FAT pair
First FAT-16 copy starts on sector 127, Cyl 0
Second FAT-16 copy starts on sector 383, Cyl 0
Sectors per FAT copy: 256


===============================================================


8 Mar. 2005 12:44
Evaluation Copy *************************************** CHS mode
******************* * R e s Q d i s k 576 *
********************
* Hard Disk Rescue and Recovery *
Disk 1 * * Copyright (c) '90-04 NetZ Computing *
SeeThru *
ExtBIOS * * Virus Control, Disk & Data Recovery * ON
F9 *
********* ***************************************
*********
* Drive *
AltHelp *
*********
*********

^2:FAT-16*
CHS address: Cyl 0 Head 0 Sector 1
*********
*********************** Setup Diagnostics
************************
* Disk Type: FUJITSU MPB3021ATU
*
* BIOS/CHS IDE/LBA data
*
* Number of Heads: 120 15
*
* Number of Cylinders: 558 4470
*
* Sectors per Track: 63 63
*
* Disk Capacity in Mbytes: 2059 2062
*
* IDE Access Time: 18 msec
*
* Total sectors on drive: 4224150
*
******* Use Space to toggle between IDE and Ext.BIOS mode
********
Disk 1, Master Partition Sector, F6 for Layout



8 Mar. 2005 12:44
Evaluation Copy *************************************** CHS mode
******************* * R e s Q d i s k 576 *
********************
* Hard Disk Rescue and Recovery *
Disk 1 * * Copyright (c) '90-04 NetZ Computing *
SeeThru *
ExtBIOS * * Virus Control, Disk & Data Recovery * ON
F9 *
********* ***************************************
*********
* Drive *
AltHelp *
*********
*********

^2:FAT-16*
CHS address: Cyl 0 Head 0 Sector 1
******************** Partition Table Layout
**********************
*
*
* Partition Starting Ending Reserved Total
*
* Boot Type Head Cyl. Sec. Head Cyl. Sec. Sectors Sectors
*
* Yes 84 0 0 10 14 372 63 9 4223196
*
* 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
*
* 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
*
* 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
*
*
*
******* Press Alt+B to see as boot sector, Alt+M to edit
*********
Disk 1, Master Partition Sector, F6 for Layout



8 Mar. 2005 12:44
Evaluation Copy *************************************** Extended
******************* * R e s Q d i s k 576 *
********************
* Hard Disk Rescue and Recovery *
Disk 1 * * Copyright (c) '90-04 NetZ Computing *
SeeThru *
ExtBIOS * * Virus Control, Disk & Data Recovery * OFF
F9 *
********* ***************************************
*********
* Drive *
AltHelp *
*********
*********

^2:FAT-16*
Checking cylinder 0 for FAT pair
******************************************************************
* Press Space to pause, Esc to stop searching
*
* --------------------------------------------------------------
*
* First FAT-16 copy starts on sector 127, Cyl 0
*
* Second FAT-16 copy starts on sector 383, Cyl 0
*
* Sectors per FAT copy: 256
*
*
*
*
*
*
*
******************************************************************
Searching for existing FAT partitions on drive 1
Anonymous
a b G Storage
March 9, 2005 2:27:44 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage (More info?)

dmarchak@comnet.ca (David) wrote:

> Zvi
>
> Thanks for the help. Here is the output of the resqdisk / assess
> procedure. Note that I just booted from a floppy and the "bad" hard
> disk is the only hard disk on the system at the moment (which is why
> it shows disk 1). The next section is my summary of the results,
> followed by the exact file that was created by the program (sorry, I
> couldn't stop the word wrapping).

David,

I managed with the word wrap, but top-posters alienate me and I normally let
them bleed to death. I'll ignore your top-posting this time, if you promise to
better your ways. ;) 

Usenet posts serve not only the original poster, but also users in general, by
providing them solutions to common problems. Besides, top-posting conveys an
unpleasant and selfish message. Think of it.

Let's assess now the RESQDISK report:

> Disk Type: FUJITSU MPB3021ATU
> BIOS/CHS IDE/LBA data
> Number of Heads: 120 15
> Number of Cylinders: 558 4470
> Sectors per Track: 63 63
> Disk Capacity in Mbytes: 2059 2062
> IDE Access Time: 18 msec
> Total sectors on drive: 4224150

The above frame confirms that the Fujitsu drive is detected properly by the
BIOS.

> Partition Starting Ending Reserved Total
> Boot Type Head Cyl. Sec. Head Cyl. Sec. Sectors Sectors
> Yes 84 0 0 10 14 372 63 9 4223196

This frame confirms what I suspected, that your old computer used a boot
overlay! Partition type 84 belongs to Disk Manager, originally made by Ontrack.

> Checking cylinder 0 for FAT pair
> First FAT-16 copy starts on sector 127, Cyl 0
> Second FAT-16 copy starts on sector 383, Cyl 0
> Sectors per FAT copy: 256

The above is typical to Disk Manager, where the boot sector of the first active
partition is located on logical sector 126 (at CHS 0/2/1) rather than sector 63
(CHS 0/1/1). The number of sectors per FAT copy indicates that the entire drive
capacity is allocated to a single FAT16 partition of maximum size (2.1 GB).

There is one piece of information that is missing to offer a complete solution,
and that is the number of heads that the boot manager set for the drive, in your
old machine. The value 120 detected by the BIOS in the new environment
shouldn;t be relied upon until verified, it could be 64 or 128 just as well!

There are two options to go from here, to restore full access to your Fujitsu
drive:

Option 1: Search google for the file DMDRVR.BIN. It's a driver that made part
of the 6.0x series of Ontrack's Disk Manager. It should be on the utilities
floppy that you received with the Fujitsu drive (DM package), from which you
installed DM in your old machine. Could also be worth searching that file on
your old master drive, maybe it's there. If you download Disk Manager from the
web, then take the OEM one from Fujitsu, or the GP version from Ontrack.
Drivers from other OEM may not work with your drive!

When found, copy DMDRVR.BIN to C:\ of your new boot drive, and add the following
device to your config.sys: DEVICE=C:\DMDRVR.BIN This should mount the DM
partition and you should be able to access the drive normally from both DOS and
Windows 9x/ME. The drawback of this solution is that I am not sure it works
when DM isn't installed on the boot drive too, or with a modern BIOS like the
one you have in your new PC.

Option 2: The following is a better solution and will let you work with the
drive normally, in any new PC, without losing a bit of the data on the drive.
It's drawback is that it requires some skill for implementing.

The idea is to convert the table in the MBR from DM to standard DOS/Windows
notation. For that purpose, you need the data in sectors 0/1/1 and 0/2/1 and
here is how to get it: Start RESQDISK from the RESQ floppy, hit + to switch it
to disk 2, press ^P to enter the "extended" display mode, and move to head 1,
sector 1, cylinder 0 by pressing the right-arrow key once. Press ^A (analyze)
and select "as partition" from the drop menu. Take a snapshot of the table to
file, by pressing Shift~. Go back to sector 0 by pressing Esc, then the Home
key.

Next, go to sector 0/2/1 by pressing the right arrow key twice. Press ^A and
select this time "as boot sector". Take a snapshot of the table, and exit
RESQDISK. Post here the new RESQDISK report created on the floppy.

With the above data, you should now be able to convert the DM partition table to
a standard one that will be recognized by the BIOS and mounted automatically. I
posted the details how to do this, several times, in this group and it should be
easy to find those posts.

Regards, Zvi
--
NetZ Computing Ltd. ISRAEL www.invircible.com www.ivi.co.il (Hebrew)
InVircible Virus Defense Solutions, ResQ and Data Recovery Utilities
Anonymous
a b G Storage
March 9, 2005 2:27:45 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage (More info?)

In article <h19t215m46ist21o6bg8v2hqv4bj888qep@4ax.com>,
Zvi Netiv <support@replace_with_domain.com> wrote:
>dmarchak@comnet.ca (David) wrote:
>
>> Zvi
>>
>> Thanks for the help. Here is the output of the resqdisk / assess
>> procedure. Note that I just booted from a floppy and the "bad" hard
>> disk is the only hard disk on the system at the moment (which is why
>> it shows disk 1). The next section is my summary of the results,
>> followed by the exact file that was created by the program (sorry, I
>> couldn't stop the word wrapping).
>
>David,
>
>I managed with the word wrap, but top-posters alienate me and I normally let
>them bleed to death. I'll ignore your top-posting this time, if you promise to
>better your ways. ;) 
>
>Usenet posts serve not only the original poster, but also users in general, by
>providing them solutions to common problems. Besides, top-posting conveys an
>unpleasant and selfish message. Think of it.
>
>Let's assess now the RESQDISK report:
>
>> Disk Type: FUJITSU MPB3021ATU
>> BIOS/CHS IDE/LBA data
>> Number of Heads: 120 15
>> Number of Cylinders: 558 4470
>> Sectors per Track: 63 63
>> Disk Capacity in Mbytes: 2059 2062
>> IDE Access Time: 18 msec
>> Total sectors on drive: 4224150
>
>The above frame confirms that the Fujitsu drive is detected properly by the
>BIOS.
>
>> Partition Starting Ending Reserved Total
>> Boot Type Head Cyl. Sec. Head Cyl. Sec. Sectors Sectors
>> Yes 84 0 0 10 14 372 63 9 4223196
>
>This frame confirms what I suspected, that your old computer used a boot
>overlay! Partition type 84 belongs to Disk Manager, originally made by Ontrack.
>
>> Checking cylinder 0 for FAT pair
>> First FAT-16 copy starts on sector 127, Cyl 0
>> Second FAT-16 copy starts on sector 383, Cyl 0
>> Sectors per FAT copy: 256
>
>The above is typical to Disk Manager, where the boot sector of the first active
>partition is located on logical sector 126 (at CHS 0/2/1) rather than sector 63
>(CHS 0/1/1). The number of sectors per FAT copy indicates that the entire drive
>capacity is allocated to a single FAT16 partition of maximum size (2.1 GB).
>
>There is one piece of information that is missing to offer a complete solution,
>and that is the number of heads that the boot manager set for the drive, in your
>old machine. The value 120 detected by the BIOS in the new environment
>shouldn;t be relied upon until verified, it could be 64 or 128 just as well!
>
>There are two options to go from here, to restore full access to your Fujitsu
>drive:
>
>Option 1: Search google for the file DMDRVR.BIN. It's a driver that made part
>of the 6.0x series of Ontrack's Disk Manager. It should be on the utilities
>floppy that you received with the Fujitsu drive (DM package), from which you
>installed DM in your old machine. Could also be worth searching that file on
>your old master drive, maybe it's there. If you download Disk Manager from the
>web, then take the OEM one from Fujitsu, or the GP version from Ontrack.
>Drivers from other OEM may not work with your drive!
>
>When found, copy DMDRVR.BIN to C:\ of your new boot drive, and add the following
>device to your config.sys: DEVICE=C:\DMDRVR.BIN This should mount the DM
>partition and you should be able to access the drive normally from both DOS and
>Windows 9x/ME. The drawback of this solution is that I am not sure it works
>when DM isn't installed on the boot drive too, or with a modern BIOS like the
>one you have in your new PC.
>
>Option 2: The following is a better solution and will let you work with the
>drive normally, in any new PC, without losing a bit of the data on the drive.
>It's drawback is that it requires some skill for implementing.
>
>The idea is to convert the table in the MBR from DM to standard DOS/Windows
>notation. For that purpose, you need the data in sectors 0/1/1 and 0/2/1 and
>here is how to get it: Start RESQDISK from the RESQ floppy, hit + to switch it
>to disk 2, press ^P to enter the "extended" display mode, and move to head 1,
>sector 1, cylinder 0 by pressing the right-arrow key once. Press ^A (analyze)
>and select "as partition" from the drop menu. Take a snapshot of the table to
>file, by pressing Shift~. Go back to sector 0 by pressing Esc, then the Home
>key.
>
>Next, go to sector 0/2/1 by pressing the right arrow key twice. Press ^A and
>select this time "as boot sector". Take a snapshot of the table, and exit
>RESQDISK. Post here the new RESQDISK report created on the floppy.
>
>With the above data, you should now be able to convert the DM partition table to
>a standard one that will be recognized by the BIOS and mounted automatically. I
>posted the details how to do this, several times, in this group and it should be
>easy to find those posts.
>
>Regards, Zvi
>--
>NetZ Computing Ltd. ISRAEL www.invircible.com www.ivi.co.il (Hebrew)
>InVircible Virus Defense Solutions, ResQ and Data Recovery Utilities


Sir, I am in awe of your knowledge of arcane information.

--

a d y k e s @ p a n i x . c o m

Don't blame me. I voted for Gore.
March 10, 2005 6:13:36 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage (More info?)

Thank you for your suggestion. Even though I didn't get the result
you expected, it allowed me to fix the problem.

On your suggestion, I tried booting and pressing the ESC key many
times. This did not do anything unusual, except that it distracted me
and I forgot to put in the book diskette. Although the old disk was
not bootable (the computer always prompted me to put in a boot
diskette), *this time* when I put in the boot disk, I could read the
hard drive.

Apparently, the *only* way I could read the drive is if *all* of these
conditions were met:
- The BIOS was set to boot from the hard disk (not floppy)
- The old drive was connected as the primary hard disk (not
secondary/slave)
- The jumper connections were set to master (not slave)
- A boot diskette was available after attempting (and failing) to boot
from the hard disk.

Having met all of those conditions, I was able to proceed with simply
copying the files from the old drive to the new drive. Phew!

David

ps. I had been able to get into -- what I assume was -- the BIOS
settings. It had "System Configuration" at the top and allowed me to
set things like the date and time, but the only options for the hard
drives was some sort of "enhanced" setting. Hopefully, I will never
need to enter the rest of the information.

adykes@panix.com (Al Dykes) wrote in message news:<d0k61l$bjr$1@panix5.panix.com>...
> In article <bc26ec59.0503072053.790b0a83@posting.google.com>,
> David <dmarchak@comnet.ca> wrote:
> >Thanks for the idea. Unfortunately, the new computer does not allow
> >for entry of this information (at least, not that I can see).
> >
> >>
> >> It's possible that the troublesome disk is so old that it doesn't know
> >> how to autosetup in the CMOS. Look at the make and model # and google
> >> to find the CCHHSS specs and put them in manually.
>
>
> I've never seen a PC that doesn't allow entry of diskparameters.
> Sometimes I when I get them they don't pause for F2 ro <del> or
> whatever, and I have to figure out how to brea in. Generally banging
> in ESC during boot does it for me. And there are machines with BIOS
> password protection.
>
> Can you get into BIOS setup ? What do you see ?
>
> Post the make and model of the machine and better yet, the mobo model.
>
> Also; Do you have the jumpers set correctly for this disk? Put it on
> the secondary cable and remove all other devices.
March 10, 2005 6:25:40 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage (More info?)

Zvi Netiv <support@replace_with_domain.com> wrote in message news:<h19t215m46ist21o6bg8v2hqv4bj888qep@4ax.com>...
> dmarchak@comnet.ca (David) wrote:
>
> > Zvi
> >
> > Thanks for the help. Here is the output of the resqdisk / assess
> > procedure. Note that I just booted from a floppy and the "bad" hard
> > disk is the only hard disk on the system at the moment (which is why
> > it shows disk 1). The next section is my summary of the results,
> > followed by the exact file that was created by the program (sorry, I
> > couldn't stop the word wrapping).
>
> David,
>
> I managed with the word wrap, but top-posters alienate me and I normally let
> them bleed to death. I'll ignore your top-posting this time, if you promise to
> better your ways. ;) 
>
> Usenet posts serve not only the original poster, but also users in general, by
> providing them solutions to common problems. Besides, top-posting conveys an
> unpleasant and selfish message. Think of it.
>
> Let's assess now the RESQDISK report:
>
> > Disk Type: FUJITSU MPB3021ATU
> > BIOS/CHS IDE/LBA data
> > Number of Heads: 120 15
> > Number of Cylinders: 558 4470
> > Sectors per Track: 63 63
> > Disk Capacity in Mbytes: 2059 2062
> > IDE Access Time: 18 msec
> > Total sectors on drive: 4224150
>
> The above frame confirms that the Fujitsu drive is detected properly by the
> BIOS.
>
> > Partition Starting Ending Reserved Total
> > Boot Type Head Cyl. Sec. Head Cyl. Sec. Sectors Sectors
> > Yes 84 0 0 10 14 372 63 9 4223196
>
> This frame confirms what I suspected, that your old computer used a boot
> overlay! Partition type 84 belongs to Disk Manager, originally made by Ontrack.
>
> > Checking cylinder 0 for FAT pair
> > First FAT-16 copy starts on sector 127, Cyl 0
> > Second FAT-16 copy starts on sector 383, Cyl 0
> > Sectors per FAT copy: 256
>
> The above is typical to Disk Manager, where the boot sector of the first active
> partition is located on logical sector 126 (at CHS 0/2/1) rather than sector 63
> (CHS 0/1/1). The number of sectors per FAT copy indicates that the entire drive
> capacity is allocated to a single FAT16 partition of maximum size (2.1 GB).
>
> There is one piece of information that is missing to offer a complete solution,
> and that is the number of heads that the boot manager set for the drive, in your
> old machine. The value 120 detected by the BIOS in the new environment
> shouldn;t be relied upon until verified, it could be 64 or 128 just as well!
>
> There are two options to go from here, to restore full access to your Fujitsu
> drive:
>
> Option 1: Search google for the file DMDRVR.BIN. It's a driver that made part
> of the 6.0x series of Ontrack's Disk Manager. It should be on the utilities
> floppy that you received with the Fujitsu drive (DM package), from which you
> installed DM in your old machine. Could also be worth searching that file on
> your old master drive, maybe it's there. If you download Disk Manager from the
> web, then take the OEM one from Fujitsu, or the GP version from Ontrack.
> Drivers from other OEM may not work with your drive!
>
> When found, copy DMDRVR.BIN to C:\ of your new boot drive, and add the following
> device to your config.sys: DEVICE=C:\DMDRVR.BIN This should mount the DM
> partition and you should be able to access the drive normally from both DOS and
> Windows 9x/ME. The drawback of this solution is that I am not sure it works
> when DM isn't installed on the boot drive too, or with a modern BIOS like the
> one you have in your new PC.
>
> Option 2: The following is a better solution and will let you work with the
> drive normally, in any new PC, without losing a bit of the data on the drive.
> It's drawback is that it requires some skill for implementing.
>
> The idea is to convert the table in the MBR from DM to standard DOS/Windows
> notation. For that purpose, you need the data in sectors 0/1/1 and 0/2/1 and
> here is how to get it: Start RESQDISK from the RESQ floppy, hit + to switch it
> to disk 2, press ^P to enter the "extended" display mode, and move to head 1,
> sector 1, cylinder 0 by pressing the right-arrow key once. Press ^A (analyze)
> and select "as partition" from the drop menu. Take a snapshot of the table to
> file, by pressing Shift~. Go back to sector 0 by pressing Esc, then the Home
> key.
>
> Next, go to sector 0/2/1 by pressing the right arrow key twice. Press ^A and
> select this time "as boot sector". Take a snapshot of the table, and exit
> RESQDISK. Post here the new RESQDISK report created on the floppy.
>
> With the above data, you should now be able to convert the DM partition table to
> a standard one that will be recognized by the BIOS and mounted automatically. I
> posted the details how to do this, several times, in this group and it should be
> easy to find those posts.
>
> Regards, Zvi


Zvi

Thanks for the help. I was able to finally read the disk (see my
other follow-up for details). I'm not certain if simply doing the
"assess" did anything to the drive or not, but if it did, then I am
very thankful. I am also very glad that I didn't need to get into the
more detailed suggestions you were making. I was confused just trying
to follow along. You obviously have a great deal of knowledge and
wisdom.

David

ps. Thanks for not letting me "bleed to death". I always try to
research my problems before posting a message and use the Google
Groups to do this (I cannot access UseNet through my ISP). When I
find a thread that looks promising, I read through each message
(Question first, then any answers). Google truncates longer messages,
so I find it annoying to see the same message repeated over and over
again (you have to go to a second screen to see the rest of each
message). However, in my defense, I always include the previous
messages so that if someone does find the posting, they will see both
the question and answer in one article. Thank you for tolerating
those of us who don't do things the right way.
Anonymous
a b G Storage
March 11, 2005 11:59:49 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage (More info?)

dmarchak@comnet.ca (David) wrote:

> Thank you for your suggestion. Even though I didn't get the result
> you expected, it allowed me to fix the problem.
>
> On your suggestion, I tried booting and pressing the ESC key many
> times. This did not do anything unusual, except that it distracted me
> and I forgot to put in the book diskette. Although the old disk was
> not bootable (the computer always prompted me to put in a boot
> diskette), *this time* when I put in the boot disk, I could read the
> hard drive.
>
> Apparently, the *only* way I could read the drive is if *all* of these
> conditions were met:
> - The BIOS was set to boot from the hard disk (not floppy)

I.e. with the DDO loaded (Disk Manager).

> - The old drive was connected as the primary hard disk (not
> secondary/slave)

.... to let load Disk Manager

> - The jumper connections were set to master (not slave)
> - A boot diskette was available after attempting (and failing) to boot
> from the hard disk.
>
> Having met all of those conditions, I was able to proceed with simply
> copying the files from the old drive to the new drive. Phew!

Naturally. Here is what happened, since you haven't figured it out yet. To
your luck, the Disk Manager overlay that was installed to both drives in your
old PC, was kept intact. I dropped that option from my previous post because I
got the impression that you tried it, and failed, possibly having corrupted the
overlay code on track 0 (you can browse through the overlay, by aid of RESQDISK.
Just browse from sector 2, head 0, cyl 0, to sector ~35, that's the overlay).

If satisfied with what you got, then great. The only drawback of copying your
files the way you did is that you lost the long filenames. The above method let
you boot to DOS, which doesn't support LFN.

For further details, see my other post, in reply to yours.

Regards, Zvi
--
NetZ Computing Ltd. ISRAEL www.invircible.com www.ivi.co.il (Hebrew)
InVircible Virus Defense Solutions, ResQ and Data Recovery Utilities
Anonymous
a b G Storage
March 12, 2005 2:19:31 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage (More info?)

dmarchak@comnet.ca (David) wrote:
> Zvi Netiv <support@replace_with_domain.com> wrote in message

[...]
> > Let's assess now the RESQDISK report:

> > > Partition Starting Ending Reserved Total
> > > Boot Type Head Cyl. Sec. Head Cyl. Sec. Sectors Sectors
> > > Yes 84 0 0 10 14 372 63 9 4223196
> >
> > This frame confirms what I suspected, that your old computer used a boot
> > overlay! Partition type 84 belongs to Disk Manager, originally made by Ontrack.

[...]
> > There are two options to go from here, to restore full access to your Fujitsu
> > drive:
> >
> > Option 1: Search google for the file DMDRVR.BIN. It's a driver that made part
> > of the 6.0x series of Ontrack's Disk Manager. It should be on the utilities
> > floppy that you received with the Fujitsu drive (DM package), from which you
> > installed DM in your old machine. Could also be worth searching that file on
> > your old master drive, maybe it's there. If you download Disk Manager from the
> > web, then take the OEM one from Fujitsu, or the GP version from Ontrack.
> > Drivers from other OEM may not work with your drive!
> >
> > When found, copy DMDRVR.BIN to C:\ of your new boot drive, and add the following
> > device to your config.sys: DEVICE=C:\DMDRVR.BIN This should mount the DM
> > partition and you should be able to access the drive normally from both DOS and
> > Windows 9x/ME. The drawback of this solution is that I am not sure it works
> > when DM isn't installed on the boot drive too, or with a modern BIOS like the
> > one you have in your new PC.
> >
> > Option 2: The following is a better solution and will let you work with the
> > drive normally, in any new PC, without losing a bit of the data on the drive.
> > It's drawback is that it requires some skill for implementing.
> >
> > The idea is to convert the table in the MBR from DM to standard DOS/Windows
> > notation. For that purpose, you need the data in sectors 0/1/1 and 0/2/1 and
> > here is how to get it: Start RESQDISK from the RESQ floppy, hit + to switch it
> > to disk 2, press ^P to enter the "extended" display mode, and move to head 1,
> > sector 1, cylinder 0 by pressing the right-arrow key once. Press ^A (analyze)
> > and select "as partition" from the drop menu. Take a snapshot of the table to
> > file, by pressing Shift~. Go back to sector 0 by pressing Esc, then the Home
> > key.
> >
> > Next, go to sector 0/2/1 by pressing the right arrow key twice. Press ^A and
> > select this time "as boot sector". Take a snapshot of the table, and exit
> > RESQDISK. Post here the new RESQDISK report created on the floppy.
> >
> > With the above data, you should now be able to convert the DM partition table to
> > a standard one that will be recognized by the BIOS and mounted automatically. I
> > posted the details how to do this, several times, in this group and it should be
> > easy to find those posts.
>
> Zvi
>
> Thanks for the help. I was able to finally read the disk (see my
> other follow-up for details). I'm not certain if simply doing the
> "assess" did anything to the drive or not, but if it did, then I am
> very thankful.

Running RESQDISK /ASSESS did nothing to the disk but it made you wiser, ;)  and
provided crucial info that let me spare you from ruining your data in result of
ignoring the DDO (dynamic drive overlay, just another name of the DM boot
manager).

I omitted the option of booting with the existing DDO because I got the
impression that you tried that and failed ("I have tried configuring the hard
drive as a master, but this doesn't seem to help.").

> I am also very glad that I didn't need to get into the
> more detailed suggestions you were making. I was confused just trying
> to follow along. You obviously have a great deal of knowledge and
> wisdom.

- |^o Taking a bow. ;)  If you are satisfied with having your data without the
long filenames, great. If OTOH the long filenames are important, then you can
try option 2, above, or a third one: Boot of the HD with DDO, press Esc when
prompted by the DDO and load the system from floppy. The floppy should contain
DOS drivers that will let load Windows (HIMEM.SYS) and support CD-ROM. You can
then load Windows of a CD that you prepared and copy your stuff with its long
filenames. Much more complicated than the suggested in option 2, but only the
diligent will inherit the earth. ;) 

Finally, and after you recovered your important data, here is how to reset the
Fujitsu drive to virgin state (empty), because FDISK won't let you remove the DM
partition:

* Leave just the Fujitsu in your PC, as first drive.

* Boot of the RESQ floppy and run from A:'s command line RESQDISK /KILL

* Run CleanTrack0 from my site, at www.resq.co.il/iv_tools.php#cleantrk to
remove the overlay remains from track zero. Some applications won't run on the
drive with the remains of a DDO on track 0, like Ghost and Partition Magic.

You can now reconfigure the drive as you wish.

Regards, Zvi
--
NetZ Computing Ltd. ISRAEL www.invircible.com www.ivi.co.il (Hebrew)
InVircible Virus Defense Solutions, ResQ and Data Recovery Utilities
!