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video editing on a laptop? Yes it's feasible

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  • Tuner Cards
  • Laptops
  • Video
  • Graphics
Last response: in Graphics Cards
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 11, 2004 3:07:31 AM

Archived from groups: rec.video,rec.video.production,rec.video.desktop (More info?)

Since Crow's original post got hijacked, I figured we owe him/her the
courtesy of trying to answer the original questions which were:
*************************************
I need to buy a computer to edit a video documentary and it would be
easier if I could use a laptop. This will be my first documentary and
I'm still not sure what software or hardware that I'll use?
I've been reading about real-time pci editing cards such as the Matrox
RT.X10(0) and wondering how useful such a card would be? If they make
the editing process much quicker and intuitive, then I'll forgo the
convenience of a laptop and build myself a desktop.

If I do go for a laptop then I'm considering a Pentium M or Athlon 64
based unit. Any ideas on which of these would be more suitable for
video editing? I don't want a P4 based machine as I'd like a lower
power CPU for the usual reasons.
I'd basically like a laptop that can run cool, quiet & long from the
battery, but can still kick ass when running at full speed from the
mains. An Athlon XP-M is another option to as they are fairly low
power.

In many reviews that I've read of laptops, it's not clear whether the
benchmarks are done from battery power, with the associated loss of
performance. I'm only interested in the video editing performance
when utilising the full system performance from the mains.
*************************************

I'm strictly a desktop user so I can only speak about the laptop comments
from respected users on the various Vegas forums I subscribe to.
The answer is a very definite yes. The very fact that the DV format puts so
little strain on drives has allowed folks to edit using Vegas without any
problems whatsoever. It's real-time preview is a definite bonus compared to
other apps.
Douglas Spotted Eagle (aka DSE aka Spot) and Tim Duncan are hosts on the DMN
forums at http://tinyurl.com/cg3t and are doing workshops literally all over
the world using laptops.

You might find the posts from the May 5/04 thread titled "Vegas rules at
30,000 feet" at http://tinyurl.com/24l3t interesting. Here's the lead post
from Tim Duncan:

"Today I had the pleasure of editing a Sheryl Crow video on a United
Airlines flight from Chicago to LA. Not only did the editing take place on
the plane, but the performance was recorded as well. This concert in the sky
was a shot on five Sony XDCam cameras then the discs were handed to me with
less than an hour before landing. I was able to digitize five camera angles
of almost five minutes each and do a multi-camera edit on my lap-top
delivering a four and a half minute finished video on both DV and Hi-8
including showing the video to Sheryl for approval. Just after landing, the
tape was uplinked via satellite as part of a huge press event for Sony
Connect and United Airlines.
No one could believe that it could be done and delivered that quickly.
Then during the cab ride over to Sony Music for a grand finalle party, I did
color correction on one of the camera angles and delivered a DVD that was
shown during the party. Our team worked together very well to make this
possible. Can you imagine a steadycam on a plane? Plus lights and portable
sound system? It was amazing.
I'll post more details perhaps tomorrow.
Thanks to Vegas and Excalibur!
Keep your eyes open for some great press about this. Media was everywhere
and there were many shots taken of Vegas running on my laptop."

Do a search on "laptops" on this forum and the Sony Vegas forum at
http://tinyurl.com/2kjms and I you'll find out that laptop editing is being
done on a daily basis.

Please don't get the idea that I'm a Vegas sales rep. It's just that it's
the first inexpensive NLE (compared to the cost of the dps Velocity I use at
work) I used and I've stayed with it ever since.
I strongly urge you to try out both Vegas and Premiere, read the various
forums and make up your own mind.

Mike

More about : video editing laptop feasible

Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 11, 2004 7:28:38 AM

Archived from groups: rec.video,rec.video.production,rec.video.desktop (More info?)

I didn't really read your post, but I find it feasible to edit video on my lowly
Celeron 1 GHz notebook with 512MB of PC133 memory. While I can use the internal
drive perfectly fine, I like to have a high speed USB 2 or firewire drive if
possible. A bigger problem than the slowness of the computer is the resolution
of the 14" display, which is 1024. This is pretty tight when working with Adobe
Premiere.

It is fairly slow rendering complex effects, especially compared to my desktop
2500XP, but it works. The people that say it isn't practical, or it doesn't
work, are just stuck up snobs.
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 11, 2004 10:30:48 AM

Archived from groups: rec.video,rec.video.production,rec.video.desktop (More info?)

Mike Kujbida wrote:

> Since Crow's original post got hijacked, I figured we owe him/her the
> courtesy of trying to answer the original questions which were:
> *************************************
> I need to buy a computer to edit a video documentary and it would be
> easier if I could use a laptop. This will be my first documentary and
> I'm still not sure what software or hardware that I'll use?
> I've been reading about real-time pci editing cards such as the Matrox
> RT.X10(0) and wondering how useful such a card would be? If they make
> the editing process much quicker and intuitive, then I'll forgo the
> convenience of a laptop and build myself a desktop.
>
> If I do go for a laptop then I'm considering a Pentium M or Athlon 64
> based unit. Any ideas on which of these would be more suitable for
> video editing? I don't want a P4 based machine as I'd like a lower
> power CPU for the usual reasons.
> I'd basically like a laptop that can run cool, quiet & long from the
> battery, but can still kick ass when running at full speed from the
> mains. An Athlon XP-M is another option to as they are fairly low
> power.
>
> In many reviews that I've read of laptops, it's not clear whether the
> benchmarks are done from battery power, with the associated loss of
> performance. I'm only interested in the video editing performance
> when utilising the full system performance from the mains.
> *************************************
>
> I'm strictly a desktop user so I can only speak about the laptop comments
> from respected users on the various Vegas forums I subscribe to.
> The answer is a very definite yes. The very fact that the DV format puts so
> little strain on drives has allowed folks to edit using Vegas without any
> problems whatsoever. It's real-time preview is a definite bonus compared to
> other apps.
> Douglas Spotted Eagle (aka DSE aka Spot) and Tim Duncan are hosts on the DMN
> forums at http://tinyurl.com/cg3t and are doing workshops literally all over
> the world using laptops.
>
> You might find the posts from the May 5/04 thread titled "Vegas rules at
> 30,000 feet" at http://tinyurl.com/24l3t interesting. Here's the lead post
> from Tim Duncan:
>
> "Today I had the pleasure of editing a Sheryl Crow video on a United
> Airlines flight from Chicago to LA. Not only did the editing take place on
> the plane, but the performance was recorded as well. This concert in the sky
> was a shot on five Sony XDCam cameras then the discs were handed to me with
> less than an hour before landing. I was able to digitize five camera angles
> of almost five minutes each and do a multi-camera edit on my lap-top
> delivering a four and a half minute finished video on both DV and Hi-8
> including showing the video to Sheryl for approval. Just after landing, the
> tape was uplinked via satellite as part of a huge press event for Sony
> Connect and United Airlines.
> No one could believe that it could be done and delivered that quickly.
> Then during the cab ride over to Sony Music for a grand finalle party, I did
> color correction on one of the camera angles and delivered a DVD that was
> shown during the party. Our team worked together very well to make this
> possible. Can you imagine a steadycam on a plane? Plus lights and portable
> sound system? It was amazing.
> I'll post more details perhaps tomorrow.
> Thanks to Vegas and Excalibur!
> Keep your eyes open for some great press about this. Media was everywhere
> and there were many shots taken of Vegas running on my laptop."
>
> Do a search on "laptops" on this forum and the Sony Vegas forum at
> http://tinyurl.com/2kjms and I you'll find out that laptop editing is being
> done on a daily basis.
>
> Please don't get the idea that I'm a Vegas sales rep. It's just that it's
> the first inexpensive NLE (compared to the cost of the dps Velocity I use at
> work) I used and I've stayed with it ever since.
> I strongly urge you to try out both Vegas and Premiere, read the various
> forums and make up your own mind.
>
> Mike
>


This is all very nice, Mike, and we're all suitably impressed. Of
course, what you describe above amounts to little more than wedding
photography, but that's alright because most of the slobs reading are
wedding photographers.

Me? I'm a writer, not a picture-snapper like you. I quit being a
picture-snapper because I didn't like the way people treated
picture-snappers. People treat picture-snappers the way you and I try
auto-mechanics. Yeah, Kubuki, picture-snapper is kind of like calling a
guy a grease monkey.

prof marvel
Related resources
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 11, 2004 11:48:52 AM

Archived from groups: rec.video,rec.video.production,rec.video.desktop (More info?)

"Mike Kujbida" <kujfam-misleadingspam@sympatico.ca> wrote in
news:2islvlFr5mrmU1@uni-berlin.de:

> I'm strictly a desktop user so I can only speak about the
> laptop comments from respected users on the various Vegas
> forums I subscribe to. The answer is a very definite yes.
> The very fact that the DV format puts so little strain on
> drives has allowed folks to edit using Vegas without any
> problems whatsoever. It's real-time preview is a definite
> bonus compared to other apps.

Can it do dissolves/mixes? I was shown a laptop editor a few
years ago by a BBC news team. But I do remember the comment, "It
won't do dissolves". But that was a few years ago.

Derry
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 11, 2004 11:48:53 AM

Archived from groups: rec.video,rec.video.production,rec.video.desktop (More info?)

Derry Argue wrote:
> "Mike Kujbida" <kujfam-misleadingspam@sympatico.ca> wrote in
> news:2islvlFr5mrmU1@uni-berlin.de:
>
>> I'm strictly a desktop user so I can only speak about the
>> laptop comments from respected users on the various Vegas
>> forums I subscribe to. The answer is a very definite yes.
>> The very fact that the DV format puts so little strain on
>> drives has allowed folks to edit using Vegas without any
>> problems whatsoever. It's real-time preview is a definite
>> bonus compared to other apps.
>
> Can it do dissolves/mixes? I was shown a laptop editor a few
> years ago by a BBC news team. But I do remember the comment, "It
> won't do dissolves". But that was a few years ago.
>
> Derry


You must have been shown an early Avid. As I recall, a common complaint
back then was that absolutely everything had to be rendered.
One of the big advantages of Vegas is it's real-time preview capability.
Not full screen mind you but large enough (mine is currently set to 360 X
240 on a 19" monitor) to show you whether it's what you want before you
commit to a render.
As an example, my first project with Vegas had a 30 sec. segment with a quad
split. Each quad was a separate quicktime movie (320 X 240). On top of
each of that was a title with drop shadow. All of this easily previewed in
real-time.
Trust me Derry, software (and, fortunately, computer power) has come a long
way just in the past few years. Things that could, at one time, only be
done on a 4-channel ADO are now being done by grade school kids with
inexpensive software.

Mike
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 11, 2004 4:43:16 PM

Archived from groups: rec.video,rec.video.production,rec.video.desktop (More info?)

On Thu, 10 Jun 2004 23:07:31 -0400, "Mike Kujbida"
<kujfam-misleadingspam@sympatico.ca> wrote:


>
>Do a search on "laptops" on this forum and the Sony Vegas forum at
>http://tinyurl.com/2kjms and I you'll find out that laptop editing is being
>done on a daily basis.
>
>Please don't get the idea that I'm a Vegas sales rep. It's just that it's
>the first inexpensive NLE (compared to the cost of the dps Velocity I use at
>work) I used and I've stayed with it ever since.
>I strongly urge you to try out both Vegas and Premiere, read the various
>forums and make up your own mind.
>
>Mike


Yes, you can download demo versions of both software. I'm partial to
Premiere Pro out of both of those two. I guess it's from using
Premiere on and off for years. It's a shame Edit* is no longer in
development and the Toaster3 TED isn't standalone as I really loved
both of those.

(From portions I snipped that don't appear here).... As for Matrox
boards.. I've found more problems with them over the years than their
competitors. It always seems there's bugs in their drivers. I've
used a DigisuiteLE, RT2000 and a X100... all of which seemed kind of
flaky. Canopus has gotten better over the years and people highly
recommend the DVStorm series as well as the DVRex.
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 11, 2004 4:45:21 PM

Archived from groups: rec.video,rec.video.production,rec.video.desktop (More info?)

On Fri, 11 Jun 2004 06:30:48 GMT, Prof Marvel
<garee_remove_@cinci.rr.com> wrote:

>
>
>This is all very nice, Mike, and we're all suitably impressed. Of
>course, what you describe above amounts to little more than wedding
>photography, but that's alright because most of the slobs reading are
>wedding photographers.
>
>Me? I'm a writer, not a picture-snapper like you. I quit being a
>picture-snapper because I didn't like the way people treated
>picture-snappers. People treat picture-snappers the way you and I try
>auto-mechanics. Yeah, Kubuki, picture-snapper is kind of like calling a
>guy a grease monkey.
>
>prof marvel
>


That's an interesting take on this on-topic post. You do realize
we're talking about video and not photography? I guess now that you
are a "writer", that means you can treat the "picture-snappers" like
the way you were supposidly treated? Poor fella. You really do have
a self-loathing passive aggressive, war-vet shell-shocked syndrome.
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 11, 2004 6:22:32 PM

Archived from groups: rec.video,rec.video.production,rec.video.desktop (More info?)

I run AVID XPRESSDV on a VAIO 1Ghz PIII with 256MB RAM. An internal
partitioned hard drive. For nearly 2 years now.
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 11, 2004 6:31:18 PM

Archived from groups: rec.video,rec.video.production,rec.video.desktop (More info?)

"Prof Marvel" <garee_remove_@cinci.rr.com> wrote in message news:skcyc.77482
> This is all very nice, Mike, and we're all suitably impressed. Of
> course, what you describe above amounts to little more than wedding
> photography, but that's alright because most of the slobs reading are
> wedding photographers.
>

Bad form Professor
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 11, 2004 6:32:33 PM

Archived from groups: rec.video,rec.video.production,rec.video.desktop (More info?)

"Mike Kujbida" <kujfam-misleadingspam@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:2itghkFr8p6uU1@uni-berlin.de...
> Derry Argue wrote:
> > "Mike Kujbida" <kujfam-misleadingspam@sympatico.ca> wrote in
> > news:2islvlFr5mrmU1@uni-berlin.de:
> >
> >> I'm strictly a desktop user so I can only speak about the
> >> laptop comments from respected users on the various Vegas
> >> forums I subscribe to. The answer is a very definite yes.
> >> The very fact that the DV format puts so little strain on
> >> drives has allowed folks to edit using Vegas without any
> >> problems whatsoever. It's real-time preview is a definite
> >> bonus compared to other apps.
> >
> > Can it do dissolves/mixes? I was shown a laptop editor a few
> > years ago by a BBC news team. But I do remember the comment, "It
> > won't do dissolves". But that was a few years ago.
> >
> > Derry
>
>
> You must have been shown an early Avid. As I recall, a common complaint
> back then was that absolutely everything had to be rendered.
> One of the big advantages of Vegas is it's real-time preview capability.

An advantage shared by most NLE software, e.g. Premiere, Edition, even
Studio.

I'm running Premiere Pro on my Sony Vaio laptop, and it runs just fine (with
preview). It's not my primary editing machine, but it's good out in the
field.




> Not full screen mind you but large enough (mine is currently set to 360 X
> 240 on a 19" monitor) to show you whether it's what you want before you
> commit to a render.
> As an example, my first project with Vegas had a 30 sec. segment with a
quad
> split. Each quad was a separate quicktime movie (320 X 240). On top of
> each of that was a title with drop shadow. All of this easily previewed
in
> real-time.
> Trust me Derry, software (and, fortunately, computer power) has come a
long
> way just in the past few years. Things that could, at one time, only be
> done on a 4-channel ADO are now being done by grade school kids with
> inexpensive software.
>
> Mike
>
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 11, 2004 10:10:58 PM

Archived from groups: rec.video,rec.video.production,rec.video.desktop (More info?)

Come on now, Jack. Let it lie this time. Don't ruin this thread too.

Copy/past it into the other thread, please if you must respond.

Steve



"Jack Slopehead" <Jack_Sloan@jewbienation.com> wrote in message
news:s9ojc0dtapa2jh493teb118q6qh132qos4@4ax.com...
> On Fri, 11 Jun 2004 06:30:48 GMT, Prof Marvel
> <garee_remove_@cinci.rr.com> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> >This is all very nice, Mike, and we're all suitably impressed. Of
> >course, what you describe above amounts to little more than wedding
> >photography, but that's alright because most of the slobs reading are
> >wedding photographers.
> >
> >Me? I'm a writer, not a picture-snapper like you. I quit being a
> >picture-snapper because I didn't like the way people treated
> >picture-snappers. People treat picture-snappers the way you and I try
> >auto-mechanics. Yeah, Kubuki, picture-snapper is kind of like calling a
> >guy a grease monkey.
> >
> >prof marvel
> >
>
>
> That's an interesting take on this on-topic post. You do realize
> we're talking about video and not photography? I guess now that you
> are a "writer", that means you can treat the "picture-snappers" like
> the way you were supposidly treated? Poor fella. You really do have
> a self-loathing passive aggressive, war-vet shell-shocked syndrome.
>
>
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 11, 2004 10:10:59 PM

Archived from groups: rec.video,rec.video.production,rec.video.desktop (More info?)

On Fri, 11 Jun 2004 18:10:58 GMT, "Steve Guidry"
<steveguidrynospam@earthlink.net> wrote:

>Come on now, Jack. Let it lie this time. Don't ruin this thread too.
>
>Copy/past it into the other thread, please if you must respond.
>
>Steve
>
nah... I posted on-topic too.
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 11, 2004 10:13:05 PM

Archived from groups: rec.video,rec.video.production,rec.video.desktop (More info?)

The thing I found surprising is that so many of us are in our
> 50s.


Damn ! You're getting old ! <<GG>>

Steve
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 11, 2004 10:39:16 PM

Archived from groups: rec.video,rec.video.production,rec.video.desktop (More info?)

"Steve Guidry" <steveguidrynospam@earthlink.net> wrote in
news:RCmyc.10437$uX2.4909@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net:

> The thing I found surprising is that so many of us are in our
>> 50s.
>
>
> Damn ! You're getting old ! <<GG>>
>
> Steve
>
>
>

Oh gawd! I've wandered into the kiddies group!<VBG>

But, on a serious note, I don't see the great divide between
writing, photography, and film making that is implied. I suppose
I've been all three. It is just story telling, after all. Same
thing -- whether you use a word processor or a sit-up-and-beg
Remington.

Now, children, play nice.
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 11, 2004 10:39:17 PM

Archived from groups: rec.video,rec.video.production,rec.video.desktop (More info?)

On 11 Jun 2004 18:39:16 GMT, Derry Argue
<derry(delete)@adviegundogs.co.uk> wrote:

>
>Oh gawd! I've wandered into the kiddies group!<VBG>
>
>But, on a serious note, I don't see the great divide between
>writing, photography, and film making that is implied. I suppose
>I've been all three. It is just story telling, after all. Same
>thing -- whether you use a word processor or a sit-up-and-beg
>Remington.
>
>Now, children, play nice.

well a few perceive they are holier-than-thou just because they gave
up on film and decided to become a "writer". I agree with you.
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 12, 2004 1:40:50 AM

Archived from groups: rec.video,rec.video.production,rec.video.desktop (More info?)

"david.mccall" <david.mccallUNDERLINE@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:Xcmyc.17930$0y.1768@attbi_s03...
>
> "nappy" <no_spam_@sorry.com> wrote in message
> news:Wmjyc.743$Wl1.122@newssvr27.news.prodigy.com...
> >
> > "Prof Marvel" <garee_remove_@cinci.rr.com> wrote in message
> news:skcyc.77482
> > > This is all very nice, Mike, and we're all suitably impressed. Of
> > > course, what you describe above amounts to little more than wedding
> > > photography, but that's alright because most of the slobs reading are
> > > wedding photographers.
> > >
> >
> > Bad form Professor
> >
> I agree Nappy. The Professor is far worse than you when it comes to tact.


Finally. I kinda hope he sticks around.. ;) 
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 12, 2004 2:40:30 AM

Archived from groups: rec.video,rec.video.production,rec.video.desktop (More info?)

"nappy" <no_spam_@sorry.com> wrote in message
news:CFpyc.69745$r81.46019@newssvr29.news.prodigy.com...
>
> "david.mccall" <david.mccallUNDERLINE@comcast.net> wrote in message
> news:Xcmyc.17930$0y.1768@attbi_s03...
> > I agree Nappy. The Professor is far worse than you when it comes to
tact.
>
>
> Finally. I kinda hope he sticks around.. ;) 
>
Hmm, sometimes being "out done" is a good thing :-)
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 12, 2004 3:16:52 AM

Archived from groups: rec.video,rec.video.production,rec.video.desktop (More info?)

Is that a _compliment_ ?

It's kinda like being the slimmest one in your weight watcher's group !
<<GG>>

Steve




> I agree Nappy. The Professor is far worse than you when it comes to tact.
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 12, 2004 4:44:00 AM

Archived from groups: rec.video,rec.video.production,rec.video.desktop (More info?)

nappy wrote:

>>I agree Nappy. The Professor is far worse than you when it comes to tact.
>
> Finally. I kinda hope he sticks around.. ;) 


LOL! Well, "it's an ill wind...." and "every cloud...."
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 12, 2004 5:23:39 AM

Archived from groups: rec.video,rec.video.production,rec.video.desktop (More info?)

One piece of software I forgot to mention in my original post and that's
Avid. Even the folks on the Vegas forums admit that one of its weaknesses
is poor media bin management and that this is where Avid shines. To a
documentary editor, this could potentially be a maor concern. Not sure if
Avid gas a demo version of their software or not but it's something else to
consider.

Mike
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 12, 2004 6:10:35 AM

Archived from groups: rec.video,rec.video.production,rec.video.desktop (More info?)

most certainly ..

!


"Steve Guidry" <steveguidrynospam@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:E3ryc.2075$Wr.447@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> Is that a _compliment_ ?
>
> It's kinda like being the slimmest one in your weight watcher's group !
> <<GG>>
>
> Steve
>
>
>
>
> > I agree Nappy. The Professor is far worse than you when it comes to
tact.
>
>
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 12, 2004 3:50:31 PM

Archived from groups: rec.video,rec.video.production,rec.video.desktop (More info?)

On Sat, 12 Jun 2004 01:23:39 -0400, "Mike Kujbida"
<kujfam-misleadingspam@sympatico.ca> wrote:

>One piece of software I forgot to mention in my original post and that's
>Avid. Even the folks on the Vegas forums admit that one of its weaknesses
>is poor media bin management and that this is where Avid shines. To a
>documentary editor, this could potentially be a maor concern. Not sure if
>Avid gas a demo version of their software or not but it's something else to
>consider.
>
>Mike

Avid has a demo called AVX Pro, but it's lacking in features of a full
blown Avid system. Avid does recommend that software for laptops.
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 12, 2004 6:33:26 PM

Archived from groups: rec.video,rec.video.production,rec.video.desktop (More info?)

"Steve Guidry" <steveguidrynospam@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:E3ryc.2075$Wr.447@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> Is that a _compliment_ ?
>
> It's kinda like being the slimmest one in your weight watcher's group !
> <<GG>>
>
Good one Steve :-)

I've been giving Nappy a hard time over being rude to people.
People that lash out at others by being overly rude usually just
get added to my blocked sender list, but Nappy often has very
useful things to say here, so I thought I might take a different
approach with him :-)

David
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 12, 2004 8:49:19 PM

Archived from groups: rec.video,rec.video.production,rec.video.desktop (More info?)

Last week I spent way too much on a new G4 1.5 laptop and set up FCP on
it. I needed it to impress a client with graphic changes on a long car
ride we had to take to shoot more footage. Unlike my office set up it
does not have the matrox card. I did not have a tough time with the
difference. The laptop renders so quickly that it was not a problem. I
got the 17 inch monitor model and needed every inch for viewing. Also we
were in and out of sunlight for most of the trip and I gotta say the
automatic screen to ambient light adjusting worked great.

me .02

Jack Slopehead wrote:
> On Sat, 12 Jun 2004 01:23:39 -0400, "Mike Kujbida"
> <kujfam-misleadingspam@sympatico.ca> wrote:
>
>
>>One piece of software I forgot to mention in my original post and that's
>>Avid. Even the folks on the Vegas forums admit that one of its weaknesses
>>is poor media bin management and that this is where Avid shines. To a
>>documentary editor, this could potentially be a maor concern. Not sure if
>>Avid gas a demo version of their software or not but it's something else to
>>consider.
>>
>>Mike
>
>
> Avid has a demo called AVX Pro, but it's lacking in features of a full
> blown Avid system. Avid does recommend that software for laptops.
>
>
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 13, 2004 9:25:09 PM

Archived from groups: rec.video,rec.video.production,rec.video.desktop (More info?)

On Thu, 10 Jun 2004 23:07:31 -0400, "Mike Kujbida"
<kujfam-misleadingspam@sympatico.ca> wrote:

>Since Crow's original post got hijacked, I figured we owe him/her the
>courtesy of trying to answer the original questions which were:

Thanks Mike,

A new thread just on-topic, and what happens? Anyway, life would be
boring if it was controllable.

After some thought I figure I'm gonna build a desktop. I'm trying to
live in the moment and I don't need a laptop now so I won't buy one.
I figure that when you buy a good spec laptop and add an external hard
disk and DVD writer, the price gets so high that I could build myself
a good spec desktop and buy a basic laptop for the same price. So
I'll build the desktop and buy a laptop if I need it later.
So now I just have to do some more research on what components make a
good video editing suite, in hard and soft terms.
Vegas keeps coming up, so I will download a demo and check it out. The
place I'm renting has a 2 Mb cable connection, which is very sweet
after using a modem for most of my Internet life. 100 MB demos, no
problemo :) 

Now that I've found digs in Amsterdam, I can get this documentary
process started. I've been put in contact with 2 people who are
filming related projects and another person who is interested in being
the camera operator on my project, in the 2 weeks since I've been
here. Things are flowing well a ce moment.

There's also a branch of SAE in Amsterdam. They run 15 month courses
in digital film making. I figure if I can't get this project off the
ground without serious training, it's good to know there's another
option.

Love

Crow
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 13, 2004 9:25:10 PM

Archived from groups: rec.video,rec.video.production,rec.video.desktop (More info?)

Crow wrote:
> On Thu, 10 Jun 2004 23:07:31 -0400, "Mike Kujbida"
> <kujfam-misleadingspam@sympatico.ca> wrote:
>
>> Since Crow's original post got hijacked, I figured we owe him/her the
>> courtesy of trying to answer the original questions which were:
>
> Thanks Mike,
>
> A new thread just on-topic, and what happens? Anyway, life would be
> boring if it was controllable.
>
> After some thought I figure I'm gonna build a desktop. I'm trying to
> live in the moment and I don't need a laptop now so I won't buy one.
> I figure that when you buy a good spec laptop and add an external hard
> disk and DVD writer, the price gets so high that I could build myself
> a good spec desktop and buy a basic laptop for the same price. So
> I'll build the desktop and buy a laptop if I need it later.
> So now I just have to do some more research on what components make a
> good video editing suite, in hard and soft terms.
> Vegas keeps coming up, so I will download a demo and check it out. The
> place I'm renting has a 2 Mb cable connection, which is very sweet
> after using a modem for most of my Internet life. 100 MB demos, no
> problemo :) 
>
> Now that I've found digs in Amsterdam, I can get this documentary
> process started. I've been put in contact with 2 people who are
> filming related projects and another person who is interested in being
> the camera operator on my project, in the 2 weeks since I've been
> here. Things are flowing well a ce moment.
>
> There's also a branch of SAE in Amsterdam. They run 15 month courses
> in digital film making. I figure if I can't get this project off the
> ground without serious training, it's good to know there's another
> option.
>
> Love
>
> Crow


First of all, best of luck with your project.
On the issue of building your own, there's a pretty good article at
http://www.videoguys.com/DIY.html
If you want to see what a high-end machine is built from, check out the the
machines at www.alienware.com and then build your own using their specs.
All prices are in U.S. dollars.

Mike
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 13, 2004 11:47:31 PM

Archived from groups: rec.video,rec.video.production,rec.video.desktop (More info?)

On Sun, 13 Jun 2004 14:46:57 -0400, "Mike Kujbida"
<kujfam-misleadingspam@sympatico.ca> wrote:

>First of all, best of luck with your project.
>On the issue of building your own, there's a pretty good article at
>http://www.videoguys.com/DIY.html
>If you want to see what a high-end machine is built from, check out the the
>machines at www.alienware.com and then build your own using their specs.
>All prices are in U.S. dollars.
>
>Mike

Thanks again,

You preempted me, as my next question was going to be asking for a
recommendation on a site that gives me the skinny on what the most
important aspects of a PC are for editing. I.e. Is it really
essential to use a separate drive for the video when using enough RAM
so that paging isn't an issue. That kinda thing.

Love

Crow
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 13, 2004 11:47:32 PM

Archived from groups: rec.video,rec.video.production,rec.video.desktop (More info?)

Crow wrote:
> On Sun, 13 Jun 2004 14:46:57 -0400, "Mike Kujbida"
> <kujfam-misleadingspam@sympatico.ca> wrote:
>
>> First of all, best of luck with your project.
>> On the issue of building your own, there's a pretty good article at
>> http://www.videoguys.com/DIY.html
>> If you want to see what a high-end machine is built from, check out
>> the the machines at www.alienware.com and then build your own using
>> their specs. All prices are in U.S. dollars.
>>
>> Mike
>
> Thanks again,
>
> You preempted me, as my next question was going to be asking for a
> recommendation on a site that gives me the skinny on what the most
> important aspects of a PC are for editing. I.e. Is it really
> essential to use a separate drive for the video when using enough RAM
> so that paging isn't an issue. That kinda thing.
>
> Love
>
> Crow


The videoguys site is a good one for explaining what's recommended as far as
an NLE sytem is concerned. You'll find that separate drives are strongly
recommended for video editing. My home system has a 40 gig system drive and
a 120 gig video drive. If I was doing this for a living, I'd have 2 even
larger video drives - one for the captured material and the second for the
edited project. Some folks have even more than that. It all depends on
what you needs are and what you can afford.
I know that if you browse the various Vegas forums, the question of an
"ideal" system comes up on a regular basis. I'm sure this is the case on
the Premiere and Avid forums as well.
When you get a parts list together, post it here for opinions. I'm sure
you'll get several.

Mike
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
June 14, 2004 3:22:01 PM

Archived from groups: rec.video,rec.video.production,rec.video.desktop (More info?)

It's quite easy to edit a full movie on a laptop, even slower older ones
running CPUs like the older Athlon XP 2400+ CPU on the eMachines M5310.

Real-time cards are great as long as you stick with the effects they can
render in real-time, and have only a limited number of video tracks to
mix together. At some point, you will exceed the capacity of the card
with too many tracks/effects and you won't be previewing the video in
real-time.

Of couse, most of these cards will lock you into the Premiere platform
(one or two devices for the Avid platform)

Most video editors (eg. Vegas Video) can show live, real-time previews
of your work as long as you have sufficient CPU power and a limited
number of effects/tracks in play in software w/o HW assist today.

---

However, the ultimate limits of the final rendering process are CPU
power & HD speed.

Here, HD speed limits the ability to pull the original video off the HD
for encoding and effects processing by the CPU, and the rate at which
the final video can be written to the HD.

Naturally, if the 1) pull video off HD 2) effects and video processing
by CPU 3) write final video to HD steps takes longer than the usual
30fps frame rate of standard video playback rate, then you'll be
effectively processing in non-realtime (ie. 1 hour of original video
will take longer than 1 hour to process and output as final video).

As far as anybody has cared to show or prove for the common PC (whether
desktop or laptop), it can't be done with software alone, so here,
faster is better! With hardware, often, you'll have to get an
optimized, high-end system running a solid HW card to attempt this
(which excludes laptops unless you're using Avid & Mojo.).

Of course, you'll have to test to see whether any of these devices
provide the features (eg. effects) you need.

---

Typically, if you're rendering a 2 hour video in Vegas Video 4.0 with
cross-fade transitions between video clips, and basic audio level
adjustments, then it'll take about 3-4 hours to render on a 2Ghz P4 with
512MB, 7200rpm 120GB HD, XP PC desktop.

This is a 2:1 ratio limited by both CPU speed and HD speed (it's only a
single HD).

A fast Athlon 64+ laptop such as that made by eMachines should match
this performance easily (here, you may want to upgrade slower 4200/5400
rpm laptop HDs to 7200rpm models).

A PC desktop that has an overclocked P4 processor at 4.1Ghz (or multiple
processors for those video editing programs that support this) +
quadruple 15,000 rpm SCSI HDs in RAID 0 configuration (or solid-state
RAM HD) should sufficiently speed things up to be of value to those
wanting significantly faster.

---

This chart provides an indirect example of CPU speed vs. encoding times
(here, to MPEG-2 for DVD output):

http://www6.tomshardware.com/cpu/20040322/prescott-13.h...
http://www6.tomshardware.com/cpu/20040517/northwood_pre...
http://www6.tomshardware.com/cpu/20030217/cpu_charts-26...

Here, 4.1Ghz P4 does the job in ~140 seconds, a standard 3.4Ghz P4 at
~157 seconds, Athlon 64+ 3200+ at ~185 seconds (although desktop CPU,
compare vs. laptop use, usually slower).