Proper clip storage format.

G

Guest

Guest
Archived from groups: rec.video.desktop (More info?)

I want to create a video on my computer using footage
off a VCR.

I'm having trouble determining the best format
to use when pulling the clips off the VCR onto my HDD. I have choices
of AVI or MPEG2, MPEG3, MPEG4 and some others. I want the best size and
quality that I can get, is viewable by itself and can be brought into as
many editors as possible as I have several choices and have not decided
which one to use yet.

Same with my final output. Several choices as to format.
I want it to be portable, and as large as possible with good quality.


This will all be on a PC with XP.

Thanks,
Don
 
G

Guest

Guest
Archived from groups: rec.video.desktop (More info?)

On Tue, 10 Aug 2004 14:00:58 GMT, Don Knight <notreal@fake.com> wrote:
>I'm having trouble determining the best format
>to use when pulling the clips off the VCR onto my HDD. I have choices
>of AVI or MPEG2, MPEG3, MPEG4 and some others. I want the best size and
>quality that I can get, is viewable by itself and can be brought into as
>many editors as possible as I have several choices and have not decided
>which one to use yet.

Have you read the tutorials at http://www.videoguys.com/dtvhome.html ?

Mpeg of any flavor is an output format, not suitable for editing

Avi (about 13 Gig per hour) is better for editing, then select as
appropriate (Mpeg-1 for VideoCD Mpeg-2 for Dvd) for output

John Thomas Smith
http://www.direct2usales.com
http://www.pacifier.com/~jtsmith
 
G

Guest

Guest
Archived from groups: rec.video.desktop (More info?)

John Thomas Smith wrote:
> On Tue, 10 Aug 2004 14:00:58 GMT, Don Knight <notreal@fake.com> wrote:
>
>>I'm having trouble determining the best format
>>to use when pulling the clips off the VCR onto my HDD. I have choices
>>of AVI or MPEG2, MPEG3, MPEG4 and some others. I want the best size and
>>quality that I can get, is viewable by itself and can be brought into as
>>many editors as possible as I have several choices and have not decided
>>which one to use yet.
>
>
> Have you read the tutorials at http://www.videoguys.com/dtvhome.html ?
>
> Mpeg of any flavor is an output format, not suitable for editing
>
> Avi (about 13 Gig per hour) is better for editing, then select as
> appropriate (Mpeg-1 for VideoCD Mpeg-2 for Dvd) for output
>
> John Thomas Smith
> http://www.direct2usales.com
> http://www.pacifier.com/~jtsmith

Haven't been to that link yet
 
G

Guest

Guest
Archived from groups: rec.video.desktop (More info?)

On Tue, 10 Aug 2004 14:00:58 GMT, Don Knight <notreal@fake.com> wrote:

>I want to create a video on my computer using footage
>off a VCR.
>
>I'm having trouble determining the best format
>to use when pulling the clips off the VCR onto my HDD. I have choices
>of AVI or MPEG2, MPEG3, MPEG4 and some others. I want the best size and
>quality that I can get, is viewable by itself and can be brought into as
>many editors as possible as I have several choices and have not decided
>which one to use yet.
>
>Same with my final output. Several choices as to format.
>I want it to be portable, and as large as possible with good quality.
>
>
>This will all be on a PC with XP.

The most common format for editing digital video is DV. The codec
comes with the OS or with the editing app, so no other software is
needed. Also, no conversion is needed in order to mix it with other
DV material. So for editing "video clip art" DV (which goes in an AVI
wrapper) is the way to go. The quality is pretty good. If your VCR
is VHS, the quality of DV is well above that. If your VCR is DV,
well, then the choice is obvious and simple: use the native format.

mpeg2 is the most popular, most effective format for higher
compression video. That is why it is used on DVD. It isn't ideal for
editing, but it is viable for clips which will be incorporated into
another video unchanged (no overlays or effects applied). Using it in
editing is inconvenient because it must be uncompressed in order to
allow editing at all (that applies for the normal format; there are
mpeg2 settings which are better for editing but if you are going to
drop the degree of compression, you may as well switch to DV format
which does that naturally).

Good quality is very much a matter of bitrates. DV is 25mbps, and
DVD video is 7mpbs. You can do half D1 (lower resolution) mpeg2 and
halve the data rate (4 mbps), or simply reduce quality a bit, and
still have something which is better than VHS. Note that Broadcast
digital is often lower than this.

But broadcast digital and commercial movies have two big advantages:
First, the source material is extremely sharp and clear. Most
consumer sources can't match this -- the only things which are
normally comparable are computer generated graphics. Second, the
mpeg2 processing done on them is very high quality, a combination of
expensive hardware and software and skilled operators to tweak the
results.


Go less than 4 mpbs, with any format, and you're going to lose
quality. The mpeg4 formats are experimental -- there is no single
standard and codecs to play/edit them aren't installed by default on
all editing systems (or even home PCs to play them). They are good
when you need lower bit rates than DVD -- a lot lower -- and don't
want to lose quite as much quality as mpeg2 at those rates. Or use as
much CPU rendering time, or processing time to play them.

Other codecs work for AVI but not all systems have them installed.
It isn't too hard to find them online if you have to, but not everyone
wants to be bothered doing that. The stuff which comes with their
editing software or PC is all they want, and for the industry
standards -- mpeg, mpeg2, and DV -- are all you usually need.
--
*-__Jeffery Jones__________| *Starfire* |____________________-*
** Muskego WI Access Channel 14/25 <http://www.execpc.com/~jeffsj/mach7/>
*Starfire Design Studio* <http://www.starfiredesign.com/>
 
G

Guest

Guest
Archived from groups: rec.video.desktop (More info?)

On Tue, 10 Aug 2004 14:00:58 GMT, Don Knight <notreal@fake.com> wrote:

>I want to create a video on my computer using footage
>off a VCR.

>I'm having trouble determining the best format
>to use when pulling the clips off the VCR onto my HDD. I have choices
>of AVI or MPEG2, MPEG3, MPEG4 and some others. I want the best size and
>quality that I can get, is viewable by itself and can be brought into as
>many editors as possible as I have several choices and have not decided
>which one to use yet.

The best of the best, as sought by you, is AVI encoded by Huffyuv
(this is a lossless codec, and thus the same quality as uncompressed
video, but at 1/3 of the size). I have an AIW card, and I capture
easily as Huffyuv AVI. AVI is the most manageable format, and the one
with more supporting software.

Mpeg2 is a way to encode video, but never goes in the AVI format (and
I wonder why...). Mpeg3 is audio codec. A very good one, but for the
best quality, you would capture in PCM. Mpeg-4 is the "prototype" of a
series of AVI codecs, the most popular being DivX and XviD -the latter
giving much better quality than the first one. They allow you to
reduce the file size considerably, while keeping good quality, but not
as much quality as Huffyuv, nor even as mpeg-2 (which occupies more,
but gives you very good quality).

Anyway, I would advise you to get the tapes into your drive with a
capture card, as Huffyuv AVI. Trim, edit the footage. Then would be
the time for you to decide wether to compress them further, because
Huffyuv takes a lot of disk space.

Several capture cards get the video as DV, which is very good, but
already lossy. If you want the best, then go for Huffyuv, which is
lossless.
 
G

Guest

Guest
Archived from groups: rec.video.desktop (More info?)

> Don Knight wrote:
> >I want to create a video on my computer using footage
> >off a VCR.

"Bariloche" wrote ...
> Several capture cards get the video as DV, which is very
> good, but already lossy. If you want the best, then go for
> Huffyuv, which is lossless.

Huffyuv is vast overkill for any consumer tape format.
It is the electronic equivalent of polishing a turd.

Even AVI/DV is overkill for most consumer VHS tapes.
MPEG2 at a high rate (low compression) is generally
regarded as roughly equivalent to the resolution of
consumer VHS tape.