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Newbie Question regarding ripping DVD to hard disk...

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Anonymous
September 12, 2004 8:47:40 PM

Archived from groups: rec.video.desktop (More info?)

.....Now I've looked on Google and places like Videohelp.com but I'm confused
by the number of different answers I'm getting
..

Here is what I am trying to achieve.

About a year ago I burnt a Holiday video onto DVD - no problem. However, I
now want to include the contents of that DVD onto another DVD along with
other domestic video footage.

So my workflow is this.

1) I want to rip the DVD onto hard disk so I can edit parts of it with
Premier Pro 1.5

2) I then want to burn this modified video (along with new sequences from
Premier) onto a new DVD I will be using DVD workshop 2.0 to do this bit.

I only want to do this once. I'm not interested in duplicating commercial
DVD's so if anyone could recommend a utility to do the ripping and
conversion back to a format PP can understand I would appreciate it. As I
only want to do this once I dont really want to spend alot of money on
software I wont use again.


many thanks,

Dave
Anonymous
September 12, 2004 8:47:41 PM

Archived from groups: rec.video.desktop (More info?)

"bugsy57" <bugsy57@spammer.spam> wrote in message
news:ci1ujc$pg3$1@titan.btinternet.com...
> ....Now I've looked on Google and places like Videohelp.com but I'm
> confused by the number of different answers I'm getting
> .
>
> Here is what I am trying to achieve.
>
> About a year ago I burnt a Holiday video onto DVD - no problem. However, I
> now want to include the contents of that DVD onto another DVD along with
> other domestic video footage.
>
> So my workflow is this.
>
> 1) I want to rip the DVD onto hard disk so I can edit parts of it with
> Premier Pro 1.5
>

What would be my first consideration is whether the "editing"
that I wanted to do will require re-encoding the MPEG2 video
from my existing DVD. If you just want to cut out parts or
rearrange the video then you can do that without re-encoding.
If "Premier Pro 1.5" can't do MPEG without a mandatory
re-encoding, then you should use another "Editor" or do the
cut and paste in your authoring program (DVD workshop 2.0).


> 2) I then want to burn this modified video (along with new sequences from
> Premier) onto a new DVD I will be using DVD workshop 2.0 to do this bit.
>
> I only want to do this once. I'm not interested in duplicating commercial
> DVD's so if anyone could recommend a utility to do the ripping and
> conversion back to a format PP can understand I would appreciate it. As I
> only want to do this once I dont really want to spend alot of money on
> software I wont use again.
>

You could use the 30day trial of TMPGEnc DVD Author to
extract the DVD into a sequentially listed series of MPEG files.
Just close TDA after you have used the "Add DVD video"
button and it has created the files in the directory you specify.
If you checked the box, the files will be the video&audio of
each chapter in your original DVD. If you had 10 chapters
you'll have 10 MPEG.

Your "DVD workshop 2.0" should be able to "edit" and
integrate whatever of these files you want, with your new
material. Hopefully it won't re-encode your existing DVD
compliant MPEG files. (If it dose, you can use TDA to make
your new DVD)
/Ken
>
> many thanks,
>
> Dave
>
Anonymous
September 12, 2004 10:32:28 PM

Archived from groups: rec.video.desktop (More info?)

"bugsy57" <bugsy57@spammer.spam> wrote in message
news:ci1ujc$pg3$1@titan.btinternet.com...
> ....Now I've looked on Google and places like Videohelp.com but I'm
> confused by the number of different answers I'm getting
> .
>
> Here is what I am trying to achieve.
>
> About a year ago I burnt a Holiday video onto DVD - no problem. However, I
> now want to include the contents of that DVD onto another DVD along with
> other domestic video footage.
>
> So my workflow is this.
>
> 1) I want to rip the DVD onto hard disk so I can edit parts of it with
> Premier Pro 1.5
>
> 2) I then want to burn this modified video (along with new sequences from
> Premier) onto a new DVD I will be using DVD workshop 2.0 to do this bit.
>
> I only want to do this once. I'm not interested in duplicating commercial
> DVD's so if anyone could recommend a utility to do the ripping and
> conversion back to a format PP can understand I would appreciate it. As I
> only want to do this once I dont really want to spend alot of money on
> software I wont use again.

The files with a .vob extension on the DVD are nothing more than mpeg2
files. If it's a commercial DVD, they'll almost certainly be encrypted, but
for one you burned yourself, they're not. All you have to do is copy them
to your hard drive and rename them with a .mpg extension.

This will allow you to pull them into any video editor which can handle the
mpeg format. Note that, unless you're doing straight cuts editing, you'll
degrade the image somewhat when you edit. Also, editing mpgs is, generally,
a pain for most editors. Premiere can do it, with some difficulty, and,
from what I've heard, Vegas can do it as well.

Once it's edited, treat it as you would any video that you want to burn to
DVD, i.e. export it as mpg (or avi and transcode, but you'll degrade the
image somewhat), pull it into an authoring package, and then burn your DVD.

>
>
> many thanks,
>
> Dave
>
Related resources
September 13, 2004 6:49:44 PM

Archived from groups: rec.video.desktop (More info?)

"bugsy57" <bugsy57@spammer.spam> wrote in message
news:ci1ujc$pg3$1@titan.btinternet.com...
> ....Now I've looked on Google and places like Videohelp.com but I'm
> confused by the number of different answers I'm getting
> .
>
> Here is what I am trying to achieve.
>
> About a year ago I burnt a Holiday video onto DVD - no problem. However, I
> now want to include the contents of that DVD onto another DVD along with
> other domestic video footage.
>
> So my workflow is this.
>
> 1) I want to rip the DVD onto hard disk so I can edit parts of it with
> Premier Pro 1.5
>
> 2) I then want to burn this modified video (along with new sequences from
> Premier) onto a new DVD I will be using DVD workshop 2.0 to do this bit.
>
> I only want to do this once. I'm not interested in duplicating commercial
> DVD's so if anyone could recommend a utility to do the ripping and
> conversion back to a format PP can understand I would appreciate it. As I
> only want to do this once I dont really want to spend alot of money on
> software I wont use again.
>
>
> many thanks,
>
> Dave
>
Dave,
Chances are you are going to want to edit the existing mpeg video a bit, if
so you will need to re-encode it.
And if you want to use Premiere you need to convert it to a DV-AVI and back
again also, so my advice is
just play the video on an external dvd player and capture it fresh into your
computer as a new dv-avi file either using your camcorders pass-thru feature
or whatever other analog capture utility you have.
Then treat it as your other video, edit in premiere and encode the final
output.
I've done this and it comes out pretty good.

AnthonyR
Anonymous
September 13, 2004 11:52:28 PM

Archived from groups: rec.video.desktop (More info?)

Thanks for all of your suggestions- KNowing that VOB's can be renamed to
Mpegs was very useful !!


Thanks,,
Dave
September 14, 2004 5:31:06 PM

Archived from groups: rec.video.desktop (More info?)

"bugsy57" <bugsy57@spammer.spam> wrote in message
news:ci4tps$ali$1@hercules.btinternet.com...
> Thanks for all of your suggestions- KNowing that VOB's can be renamed to
> Mpegs was very useful !!
>
>
> Thanks,,
> Dave
>

I'm not 100% that is true, I mean I've tried it myself and thought it works
but the mpgs acted strangely.
They were off sync and just didn't play right for some strange reason.
So I thought to myself it has to be more to it than that, but maybe it was
just my bad experience that
time I tried it. Let us know if that works for you.
Any one else have a comment on just renaming unencoded vob files to mpg?

AnthonyR
Anonymous
September 14, 2004 5:31:07 PM

Archived from groups: rec.video.desktop (More info?)

"AnthonyR" <toomuchspam@tolisthere.com> wrote in message
news:uoC1d.36423$Ot3.15702@twister.nyc.rr.com...
>
> "bugsy57" <bugsy57@spammer.spam> wrote in message
> news:ci4tps$ali$1@hercules.btinternet.com...
>> Thanks for all of your suggestions- KNowing that VOB's can be renamed to
>> Mpegs was very useful !!
>>
>>
>> Thanks,,
>> Dave
>>
>
> I'm not 100% that is true, I mean I've tried it myself and thought it
> works but the mpgs acted strangely.
> They were off sync and just didn't play right for some strange reason.
> So I thought to myself it has to be more to it than that, but maybe it was
> just my bad experience that
> time I tried it. Let us know if that works for you.
> Any one else have a comment on just renaming unencoded vob files to mpg?
>
> AnthonyR
>

This is one of those issues where anecdotal evidence can
lead you astray. I've found that if you are dealing with something
that works under some circumstances but not under others:
Then those who tried it and it worked, believe it will always work.
Those who try it and it fails, believe it can never work. Attempting
to modify such belief, is futile.

So, rather than trying to ferret out the exact circumstances facing
the poster (often over many postings, as the poster may not know
what info to include) I often just provide a method that works,
without trying to cover all the other methods that could also work,
(under the proper circumstances). Of course there could always be
a better answer than what my limited experience and knowledge
provides. I'll remain satisfied with providing approaches that have
worked for me, "best" or not.

Luck;
Ken
Anonymous
September 15, 2004 4:48:22 AM

Archived from groups: rec.video.desktop (More info?)

On Tue, 14 Sep 2004 13:31:06 GMT, "AnthonyR"
<toomuchspam@tolisthere.com> wrote:

>Any one else have a comment on just renaming unencoded vob files to mpg?

Unencoded vob? I assume you mean decrypted vob. Anyway: I won't do
that. Instead, for making a .vob into an .mpg, I would open it in
mpeg-vcr, then save it -the program can handle .vob, but saves as .mpg
September 15, 2004 9:11:24 PM

Archived from groups: rec.video.desktop (More info?)

"Bariloche" <bariloche@bariloche.com> wrote in message
news:m5tek0p1m03c65jajoei0lncpb5e5ckpjo@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 14 Sep 2004 13:31:06 GMT, "AnthonyR"
> <toomuchspam@tolisthere.com> wrote:
>
>>Any one else have a comment on just renaming unencoded vob files to mpg?
>
> Unencoded vob? I assume you mean decrypted vob. Anyway: I won't do
> that. Instead, for making a .vob into an .mpg, I would open it in
> mpeg-vcr, then save it -the program can handle .vob, but saves as .mpg

Well sort of, I mean a vob form a home made dvd, which has no css copy
protection incorporated in it.
So for arguments sake a decrypted vob will do.
I have used mpeg-vcr also for this purpose too, it works but was just
curious
as to a more technical explanation why just renaming it would or wouldn't
always work.
Thanks for the replies.
:) 

AnthonyR
Anonymous
September 16, 2004 2:21:15 AM

Archived from groups: rec.video.desktop (More info?)

On Wed, 15 Sep 2004 17:11:24 GMT, "AnthonyR"
<toomuchspam@tolisthere.com> wrote:

>just
>curious
>as to a more technical explanation why just renaming it would or wouldn't
>always work.

First, a .vob file is different from an .mpg file -and it shall remain
different, even if you rename it as .mpg

Second, you might perhaps rename the .vob as .abc, and still work -it
just depends on the software, wether it's smart enough not to be
deluded by the extension. IOW, when you rename a .vob as .mpg, it's
still actually a VOB, and shall be handled by the software as a VOB,
not as an mpeg.
September 16, 2004 9:05:38 AM

Archived from groups: rec.video.desktop (More info?)

Bariloche <bariloche@bariloche.com> wrote:

>On Wed, 15 Sep 2004 17:11:24 GMT, "AnthonyR"
><toomuchspam@tolisthere.com> wrote:
>
>>just
>>curious
>>as to a more technical explanation why just renaming it would or wouldn't
>>always work.
>
>First, a .vob file is different from an .mpg file -and it shall remain
>different, even if you rename it as .mpg
>
>Second, you might perhaps rename the .vob as .abc, and still work -it
>just depends on the software, wether it's smart enough not to be
>deluded by the extension. IOW, when you rename a .vob as .mpg, it's
>still actually a VOB, and shall be handled by the software as a VOB,
>not as an mpeg.

Hi,

Believe it or not, a VOB file is definately an MPG file. Just as WAV
PCM files are are given a different extension when they are burned to
an Audio CD, MPG files are renamed when they are burned to a DVD.

Where the confusion and problems come in is that there are dozens of
varieties of MPG files, with the major differences depending upon how
the audio is encoded and stored.

When you change the extension of VOB to MPG, you will almost always be
able to read the video portion of the file with a program that can
play most standard MPG video. However, if the video is from a
commercial DVD, the video frame rate may be 24, 25, 29.97 or 30 fps
and your player may or may not be able to understand what to do once
you have changed the extension, since most of us don't deal with
anything but 25 or 29.97 fps, depending upon where we live and which
TV system we use.

The audio is even more complex in that the audio can be "locked"
(i.e., a part of the video stream) or as a separate sub-file wrapped
in the VOB/MPG wrapper. In addition, the audio may have been encoded
as PCM (WAV) or as one of a dozen sub-sets of MPG, or as AC3 or DTS or
god only knows what else. If the program you are using to play/edit
the renamed VOB/MPG file doesn't have the proper codec to decode both
the audio and video, you will probably get video but not audio, or the
audio may have to be run through a separate audio codec which might
result in the audio getting out of sync with the video.

A quite common problem with changing the extension of a VOB from a
commercial DVD of a movie that was encoded at 24 fps is that the video
will be changed from 24 fps to 29.97 (in NTSC lands) while the audio
might be decoded a 24 fps (since it will sound identical at either
frame rate), which will soon lead to huge sync problems.

Hope this helps.

Susan
Anonymous
September 16, 2004 3:21:14 PM

Archived from groups: rec.video.desktop (More info?)

"AnthonyR" <toomuchspam@tolisthere.com> wrote in message news:<uoC1d.36423$Ot3.15702@twister.nyc.rr.com>...
> "bugsy57" <bugsy57@spammer.spam> wrote in message
> news:ci4tps$ali$1@hercules.btinternet.com...
> > Thanks for all of your suggestions- KNowing that VOB's can be renamed to
> > Mpegs was very useful !!
> >
> >
> > Thanks,,
> > Dave
> >
>
> I'm not 100% that is true, I mean I've tried it myself and thought it works
> but the mpgs acted strangely.
> They were off sync and just didn't play right for some strange reason.
> So I thought to myself it has to be more to it than that, but maybe it was
> just my bad experience that
> time I tried it. Let us know if that works for you.
> Any one else have a comment on just renaming unencoded vob files to mpg?


I agree, it seems like it works, but I have had playack sync problems
also, and the other thing I've seen is that the file cuts off after
10-15 minutes event though the orignal vob was much longer.

I don't think it's that simple and I think simply renaming the file
can cause problems down the line


STRATEGY



>
> AnthonyR
September 16, 2004 9:34:32 PM

Archived from groups: rec.video.desktop (More info?)

"Susan" <nospam@nospam.net> wrote in message
news:rj6ik0p19pnng07brehgs3ufbo9rc0c8l5@4ax.com...
> Bariloche <bariloche@bariloche.com> wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> Believe it or not, a VOB file is definately an MPG file. Just as WAV
> PCM files are are given a different extension when they are burned to
> an Audio CD, MPG files are renamed when they are burned to a DVD.
>
> Where the confusion and problems come in is that there are dozens of
> varieties of MPG files, with the major differences depending upon how
> the audio is encoded and stored.
>
> When you change the extension of VOB to MPG, you will almost always be
> able to read the video portion of the file with a program that can
> play most standard MPG video. However, if the video is from a
> commercial DVD, the video frame rate may be 24, 25, 29.97 or 30 fps
> and your player may or may not be able to understand what to do once
> you have changed the extension, since most of us don't deal with
> anything but 25 or 29.97 fps, depending upon where we live and which
> TV system we use.
>
> The audio is even more complex in that the audio can be "locked"
> (i.e., a part of the video stream) or as a separate sub-file wrapped
> in the VOB/MPG wrapper. In addition, the audio may have been encoded
> as PCM (WAV) or as one of a dozen sub-sets of MPG, or as AC3 or DTS or
> god only knows what else. If the program you are using to play/edit
> the renamed VOB/MPG file doesn't have the proper codec to decode both
> the audio and video, you will probably get video but not audio, or the
> audio may have to be run through a separate audio codec which might
> result in the audio getting out of sync with the video.
>
> A quite common problem with changing the extension of a VOB from a
> commercial DVD of a movie that was encoded at 24 fps is that the video
> will be changed from 24 fps to 29.97 (in NTSC lands) while the audio
> might be decoded a 24 fps (since it will sound identical at either
> frame rate), which will soon lead to huge sync problems.
>
> Hope this helps.
>
> Susan
>

Susan,
Thank You!
Yes that does help and explains to me what is happening when a vob is
renamed to mpg and played on a PC.
Now I know why sometimes it plays fine while other times it is all out of
sync with the audio.
I will save this explanation cause it's the best I've read on here.
:) 
AnthonyR
Anonymous
September 17, 2004 1:55:03 AM

Archived from groups: rec.video.desktop (More info?)

On Thu, 16 Sep 2004 17:34:32 GMT, "AnthonyR"
<toomuchspam@tolisthere.com> wrote:

>
>"Susan" <nospam@nospam.net> wrote in message
>news:rj6ik0p19pnng07brehgs3ufbo9rc0c8l5@4ax.com...
>> Bariloche <bariloche@bariloche.com> wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> Believe it or not, a VOB file is definately an MPG file. Just as WAV
>> PCM files are are given a different extension when they are burned to
>> an Audio CD, MPG files are renamed when they are burned to a DVD.
>>
>> Where the confusion and problems come in is that there are dozens of
>> varieties of MPG files, with the major differences depending upon how
>> the audio is encoded and stored.
>>
>> When you change the extension of VOB to MPG, you will almost always be
>> able to read the video portion of the file with a program that can
>> play most standard MPG video. However, if the video is from a
>> commercial DVD, the video frame rate may be 24, 25, 29.97 or 30 fps
>> and your player may or may not be able to understand what to do once
>> you have changed the extension, since most of us don't deal with
>> anything but 25 or 29.97 fps, depending upon where we live and which
>> TV system we use.
>>
>> The audio is even more complex in that the audio can be "locked"
>> (i.e., a part of the video stream) or as a separate sub-file wrapped
>> in the VOB/MPG wrapper. In addition, the audio may have been encoded
>> as PCM (WAV) or as one of a dozen sub-sets of MPG, or as AC3 or DTS or
>> god only knows what else. If the program you are using to play/edit
>> the renamed VOB/MPG file doesn't have the proper codec to decode both
>> the audio and video, you will probably get video but not audio, or the
>> audio may have to be run through a separate audio codec which might
>> result in the audio getting out of sync with the video.
>>
>> A quite common problem with changing the extension of a VOB from a
>> commercial DVD of a movie that was encoded at 24 fps is that the video
>> will be changed from 24 fps to 29.97 (in NTSC lands) while the audio
>> might be decoded a 24 fps (since it will sound identical at either
>> frame rate), which will soon lead to huge sync problems.
>>
>> Hope this helps.
>>
>> Susan
>>
>
>Susan,
>Thank You!
>Yes that does help and explains to me what is happening when a vob is
>renamed to mpg and played on a PC.
>Now I know why sometimes it plays fine while other times it is all out of
>sync with the audio.
>I will save this explanation cause it's the best I've read on here.
>:) 
>AnthonyR

The explanation may be bright -but I'm not sure if it's true. I'm no
expert at these formats, but I would say a VOB is not an mpeg file
-not an ordinary one, at least. At most, you can understand it as an
extension to the mpeg format. The mpeg format was meant for
video+audio, while a VOB carries aditional data (subtitles, sector
positioning). Also, what's said about fps is nonsense (no pun
intended). Both VOB and mpeg carry the information on the fps at which
they should be played, it is never a matter of guessing on the part of
the player!
!