Choice of viewfinder

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.dcameras (More info?)

Of two *identical* ultra compact zoom digicams, except one has a small
('tunnel-vision') optical viewfinder (with a 1.8" TTL LCD on its back) and
the other a large (2.5"; not hinged) TTL LCD (with *no* optical viewfinder),
which one do you prefer? More importantly, can you explain the rationale
behind your choice?

This question was brought on by the recent announcement of Ricoh Caplio R1v
and R2, the latter being the one without the optical viewfinder.
http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/specs/Ricoh/ricoh_caplior1v.asp
http://www.dpreview.com/news/0502/05022801ricohr2.asp

I've read the page on viewfinders:
http://www.dpreview.com/learn/?/Glossary/Camera_System/Viewfinder_01.htm

This would be my first purchase of a digital camera, though I have used a
Contaflex SLR, a Cannon EF, and a Fuji Fotonex compact zoom film camera
before. Any personal view would be very much appreciated.

--
Lin Chung.
[The Water Margins of Liang Shan Po were at the time of the Sung dynasty.
Replace that with "ntlworld" for emails.]
11 answers Last reply
More about choice viewfinder
  1. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.dcameras (More info?)

    The optical is good for extreme sunlght when the LCD is washed out and hard
    to see and also for long telephoto shots to stabilize the camera against the
    mass of your head.
    Some cameras last much longer with the LCD turned off. I have a Pentax and
    get about a week out of a charge with the LCD fully on and flash 50%.
    Previous ones I have owned killed the batteries in a few hours. Stick with
    LioN batteries and not AA cells for many reasons.


    "Lin Chung" <lin.chung@the.Water.Margin.com> wrote in message
    news:5DKZd.587$971.483@newsfe5-gui.ntli.net...
    > Of two *identical* ultra compact zoom digicams, except one has a small
    > ('tunnel-vision') optical viewfinder (with a 1.8" TTL LCD on its back) and
    > the other a large (2.5"; not hinged) TTL LCD (with *no* optical
    viewfinder),
    > which one do you prefer? More importantly, can you explain the rationale
    > behind your choice?
    >
    > This question was brought on by the recent announcement of Ricoh Caplio
    R1v
    > and R2, the latter being the one without the optical viewfinder.
    > http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/specs/Ricoh/ricoh_caplior1v.asp
    > http://www.dpreview.com/news/0502/05022801ricohr2.asp
    >
    > I've read the page on viewfinders:
    > http://www.dpreview.com/learn/?/Glossary/Camera_System/Viewfinder_01.htm
    >
    > This would be my first purchase of a digital camera, though I have used a
    > Contaflex SLR, a Cannon EF, and a Fuji Fotonex compact zoom film camera
    > before. Any personal view would be very much appreciated.
    >
    > --
    > Lin Chung.
    > [The Water Margins of Liang Shan Po were at the time of the Sung dynasty.
    > Replace that with "ntlworld" for emails.]
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
  2. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.dcameras (More info?)

    Gìmmìe Bob wrote:
    > Lin Chung wrote:
    > > Of two *identical* ultra compact zoom digicams, except one has
    > > a small ('tunnel-vision') optical viewfinder (with a 1.8" TTL LCD
    > > on its back) and the other a large (2.5"; not hinged) TTL LCD
    > > (with *no* optical viewfinder), which one do you prefer? More
    > > importantly, can you explain the rationale behind your choice?...
    > The optical is good for extreme sunlght when the LCD is washed
    > out and hard to see and also for long telephoto shots to stabilize the
    > camera against the mass of your head. Some cameras last much
    > longer with the LCD turned off. I have a Pentax and get about a
    > week out of a charge with the LCD fully on and flash 50%.
    > Previous ones I have owned killed the batteries in a few hours.
    > Stick with LioN batteries and not AA cells for many reasons.


    Thanks. You are right. The hand shake is always a constant worry in a
    light and small (held up between finger tips) camera. I experienced that
    while playing with a wrist (-watch) digicam; it was not easy to get a shot
    without blur. My recent reading, as a result of your response highlighting
    this issue, directed my attention to the more recently released ultra
    compact models which had some interesting innovative strategies in
    alleviating this problem. I must hold on to my cash and wait!

    As to the issue of battery capacity, there are now 2000, 2300, 2500, and
    even 2800 mAh NiMH AA batteries. The highest Li-Ion rechargeable AAs are
    only about 1700+, I believe. So, the newest NiMH AAs should outperform the
    Li-Ion ones and they are much cheaper too, and more importantly they are
    also less damaging to the environment.

    --
    Lin Chung.
    [The Water Margins of Liang Shan Po were at the time of the Sung dynasty.
    Replace that with "ntlworld" for emails.]
  3. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.dcameras (More info?)

    No! Proprietary format LioN cells are usually cheaper in the end and have
    much higher Ah ratings.
    The contacts are made better, protected against corrosion and finger
    touching, fit in the compartment better and therfore do not bend the
    contacts when vibration occurs. AA batteries are always breaking contact
    with vibration and the springs are usually made cheaply unlike the
    proprietary contacts that are gold plated for low resistance.

    LioN can be charged and pick them up a month later and shoot your camera.
    NiMh or NiCad will be dead within a week and do not like having that done to
    them or they won't last a year. LioN like to be kept on charge, and do not
    have to be cycled. They are much better batteries.

    "Lin Chung" <lin.chung@the.Water.Margin.com> wrote in message
    news:w6l_d.757$g3.343@newsfe4-gui.ntli.net...
    > Glmmle Bob wrote:
    > > Lin Chung wrote:
    > > > Of two *identical* ultra compact zoom digicams, except one has
    > > > a small ('tunnel-vision') optical viewfinder (with a 1.8" TTL LCD
    > > > on its back) and the other a large (2.5"; not hinged) TTL LCD
    > > > (with *no* optical viewfinder), which one do you prefer? More
    > > > importantly, can you explain the rationale behind your choice?...
    > > The optical is good for extreme sunlght when the LCD is washed
    > > out and hard to see and also for long telephoto shots to stabilize the
    > > camera against the mass of your head. Some cameras last much
    > > longer with the LCD turned off. I have a Pentax and get about a
    > > week out of a charge with the LCD fully on and flash 50%.
    > > Previous ones I have owned killed the batteries in a few hours.
    > > Stick with LioN batteries and not AA cells for many reasons.
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > Thanks. You are right. The hand shake is always a constant worry in a
    > light and small (held up between finger tips) camera. I experienced that
    > while playing with a wrist (-watch) digicam; it was not easy to get a shot
    > without blur. My recent reading, as a result of your response
    highlighting
    > this issue, directed my attention to the more recently released ultra
    > compact models which had some interesting innovative strategies in
    > alleviating this problem. I must hold on to my cash and wait!
    >
    > As to the issue of battery capacity, there are now 2000, 2300, 2500, and
    > even 2800 mAh NiMH AA batteries. The highest Li-Ion rechargeable AAs are
    > only about 1700+, I believe. So, the newest NiMH AAs should outperform
    the
    > Li-Ion ones and they are much cheaper too, and more importantly they are
    > also less damaging to the environment.
    >
    > --
    > Lin Chung.
    > [The Water Margins of Liang Shan Po were at the time of the Sung dynasty.
    > Replace that with "ntlworld" for emails.]
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
  4. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.dcameras (More info?)

    > The optical is good for extreme sunlght when the LCD is washed out and
    hard
    > to see and also for long telephoto shots to stabilize the camera against
    the
    > mass of your head.

    It's also good for close-up work, where the lens rarely lines up with the
    viewfinder, and when you want to see what your picture will look like before
    you take it (except in the case of dslr's). They do make universal and
    custom hoods for some cameras to block the sunlight reflecting off the LCD.
    Good point about helping stabilize the camera (viewfinder). It's tough to
    hold a camera out away from your body and keep it stable. And with us old
    farts who's eyes aren't what they used to be, reading an image on an LCD can
    be a pain.
  5. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.dcameras (More info?)

    Sheldon wrote:
    > Gìmmìe Bob wrote:
    > > Lin Chung wrote:
    > > > Of two *identical* ultra compact zoom digicams, except one
    > > > has a small optical viewfinder and the other a large TTL LCD
    > > > which one do you prefer?
    > > The optical is good for extreme sunlght when the LCD is washed
    > > out and hard to see and also for long telephoto shots to stabilize
    > > the camera against the mass of your head.
    > It's also good for close-up work, where the lens rarely lines up with
    > the viewfinder, and when you want to see what your picture will look
    > like before you take it (except in the case of dslr's)....


    Very true. But it is also true that accurate focusing is more assured using
    a TTL optical viewfinder than by the LCD alone which in subcompact/compact
    cameras are invariably of dismal resolution (as defined by the pixel
    number). A large LCD, as against a tiny one, for viewing pictures just
    taken in a social situation is, on the other hand, a great facilitator in
    building friendship/relationship. It really is best to have the unavailable
    combination, a viewfinder and a large LCD! Now I can dream about the
    promised flexible, foldable organic crystal display units, can't I? <g>

    --
    Lin Chung.
    [The Water Margins of Liang Shan Po were at the time of the Sung dynasty.
    Replace that with "ntlworld" for emails.]
  6. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.dcameras (More info?)

    You haven't seen the manual focusing system on a Pentax Optio line camera
    then.
    The resolution in the LCD screen is a piece of the 5 megapixel element
    while focusing.

    The subcompact camera LCD is some Pentax Optios is a 2" LCD, much bigger
    than some of your so-called "pro" cameras from last month.


    "Lin Chung" <lin.chung@the.Water.Margin.com> wrote in message
    news:8MZ0e.2634$R01.2458@newsfe3-win.ntli.net...
    > Sheldon wrote:
    > > Glmmle Bob wrote:
    > > > Lin Chung wrote:
    > > > > Of two *identical* ultra compact zoom digicams, except one
    > > > > has a small optical viewfinder and the other a large TTL LCD
    > > > > which one do you prefer?
    > > > The optical is good for extreme sunlght when the LCD is washed
    > > > out and hard to see and also for long telephoto shots to stabilize
    > > > the camera against the mass of your head.
    > > It's also good for close-up work, where the lens rarely lines up with
    > > the viewfinder, and when you want to see what your picture will look
    > > like before you take it (except in the case of dslr's)....
    >
    >
    > Very true. But it is also true that accurate focusing is more assured
    using
    > a TTL optical viewfinder than by the LCD alone which in subcompact/compact
    > cameras are invariably of dismal resolution (as defined by the pixel
    > number). A large LCD, as against a tiny one, for viewing pictures just
    > taken in a social situation is, on the other hand, a great facilitator in
    > building friendship/relationship. It really is best to have the
    unavailable
    > combination, a viewfinder and a large LCD! Now I can dream about the
    > promised flexible, foldable organic crystal display units, can't I? <g>
    >
    > --
    > Lin Chung.
    > [The Water Margins of Liang Shan Po were at the time of the Sung dynasty.
    > Replace that with "ntlworld" for emails.]
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
  7. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.dcameras (More info?)

    John Bengi wrote:
    > Lin Chung wrote:
    >> Sheldon wrote:
    >> > Glmmle Bob wrote:
    >> > > Lin Chung wrote:
    >> > > > Of two *identical* ultra compact zoom digicams, except one
    >> > > > has a small optical viewfinder and the other a large TTL LCD
    >> > > > which one do you prefer?
    >> > > The optical is good for extreme sunlght when the LCD is washed
    >> > > out and hard to see and also for long telephoto shots to stabilize
    >> > > the camera against the mass of your head.
    >> > It's also good for close-up work, where the lens rarely lines up with
    >> > the viewfinder, and when you want to see what your picture will look
    >> > like before you take it (except in the case of dslr's)....
    >> Very true. But it is also true that accurate focusing is more assured
    > > using a TTL optical viewfinder than by the LCD alone which in
    > > subcompact/compact cameras are invariably of dismal resolution (
    > You haven't seen the manual focusing system on a Pentax Optio
    > line camera then. The resolution in the LCD screen is a piece of the
    > 5 megapixel element while focusing....


    I don't understand your assertion that the LSD resolution is "a piece of the
    5 megapixel element". My view is that for comparison the native resolution
    of a LSD display should be the pixel *density* of the panel expressed in a
    unit of , say, megapixel per square centimeter. Most ultracompact/compact
    cameras have 1.8" screen, some 2.0" and a few 2.5". The number of pixels,
    however, varies between 110 000 and 140 000 per screen. Because this number
    is relatively unchanged, it can even be argued that the larger the screen,
    the poorer the density, i.e. resolution. Admittedly the larger sized pixel
    in the larger LSD panels is easier to the eyes and looks 'sharper'.

    --
    Lin Chung.
    [The Water Margins of Liang Shan Po were at the time of the Sung dynasty.
    Replace that with "ntlworld" for emails.]
  8. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.dcameras (More info?)

    When you manually focus on a Pentax Optio the centre of the picture becomes
    zoomed in some 8 or 16 x and each pixel in the photo is each pixel on the
    LCD display (or close) There is no more resolution to be obtained. This
    works for the sharpest focus you can get. After you stop adjusting focus for
    more than a few seconds the picture zooms back out and you see the whole
    frame. Works like a charm and somebody was quite genius to think of this
    technique.

    "Lin Chung" <lin.chung@the.Water.Margin.com> wrote in message
    news:cC11e.499$go3.129@newsfe3-gui.ntli.net...
    > John Bengi wrote:
    > > Lin Chung wrote:
    > >> Sheldon wrote:
    > >> > Glmmle Bob wrote:
    > >> > > Lin Chung wrote:
    > >> > > > Of two *identical* ultra compact zoom digicams, except one
    > >> > > > has a small optical viewfinder and the other a large TTL LCD
    > >> > > > which one do you prefer?
    > >> > > The optical is good for extreme sunlght when the LCD is washed
    > >> > > out and hard to see and also for long telephoto shots to stabilize
    > >> > > the camera against the mass of your head.
    > >> > It's also good for close-up work, where the lens rarely lines up with
    > >> > the viewfinder, and when you want to see what your picture will look
    > >> > like before you take it (except in the case of dslr's)....
    > >> Very true. But it is also true that accurate focusing is more assured
    > > > using a TTL optical viewfinder than by the LCD alone which in
    > > > subcompact/compact cameras are invariably of dismal resolution (
    > > You haven't seen the manual focusing system on a Pentax Optio
    > > line camera then. The resolution in the LCD screen is a piece of the
    > > 5 megapixel element while focusing....
    >
    >
    >
    > I don't understand your assertion that the LSD resolution is "a piece of
    the
    > 5 megapixel element". My view is that for comparison the native
    resolution
    > of a LSD display should be the pixel *density* of the panel expressed in a
    > unit of , say, megapixel per square centimeter. Most ultracompact/compact
    > cameras have 1.8" screen, some 2.0" and a few 2.5". The number of pixels,
    > however, varies between 110 000 and 140 000 per screen. Because this
    number
    > is relatively unchanged, it can even be argued that the larger the screen,
    > the poorer the density, i.e. resolution. Admittedly the larger sized
    pixel
    > in the larger LSD panels is easier to the eyes and looks 'sharper'.
    >
    > --
    > Lin Chung.
    > [The Water Margins of Liang Shan Po were at the time of the Sung dynasty.
    > Replace that with "ntlworld" for emails.]
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
  9. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.dcameras (More info?)

    John Bengi wrote:
    > Lin Chung wrote:
    > > John Bengi wrote:
    > > > Lin Chung wrote:
    > > > > Sheldon wrote:
    > > > > > Glmmle Bob wrote:
    > > > > > > Lin Chung wrote:
    > > > > > > > Of two *identical* ultra compact zoom digicams, except
    > > > > > > >one has a small optical viewfinder and the other a large
    > > > > > > > TTL LCD... which one do you prefer?
    > > > > > > The optical is good for extreme sunlght when the LCD is
    > > > > > > washed out and hard to see and also for long telephoto shots
    > > > > > > to stabilize the camera against the mass of your head.
    > > > > > It's also good for close-up work, where the lens rarely lines up
    > > > > > with the viewfinder, and when you want to see what your picture
    > > > > > will look like before you take it...
    > > > > ...also true that accurate focusing is more assured using a TTL
    > > > > optical viewfinder than by the LCD alone which in subcompact/
    > > > > compact cameras are invariably of dismal resolution...
    > > > You haven't seen the manual focusing system on a Pentax Optio
    > > > line camera then. The resolution in the LCD screen is a piece of the
    > > > 5 megapixel element while focusing....
    > > I don't understand your assertion that the LSD resolution is "a piece of
    > > the 5 megapixel element". My view is that for comparison the native
    > > resolution of a LSD display should be the pixel *density*...
    > When you manually focus on a Pentax Optio the centre of the picture
    > becomes zoomed in some 8 or 16 x and each pixel in the photo is each
    > pixel on the LCD display (or close) There is no more resolution to be
    > obtained. This works for the sharpest focus you can get. After you stop
    > adjusting focus for more than a few seconds the picture zooms back out
    > and you see the whole frame. Works like a charm and somebody was
    > quite genius to think of this technique.


    Aha....so it's now automated! You see, one technique to get in focus is to
    follow this sequence of steps: compose > zoom in > focus > zoom out >
    re-compose > release shutter. Tedious but it works. Your zoomed in area
    being made the same size as the LCD to maximize its available resolving
    power followed by a restoration of the original frame (zooming back out)
    works in the same principle. Brilliant!

    --
    Lin Chung.
    [The Water Margins of Liang Shan Po were at the time of the Sung dynasty.
    Replace that with "ntlworld" for emails.]
  10. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.dcameras (More info?)

    This process is all automatically done by the camera siftware whenyou touch
    the manual focus joystick.

    "Lin Chung" <lin.chung@the.Water.Margin.com> wrote in message
    news:gg81e.136$n57.72@newsfe1-win.ntli.net...
    > John Bengi wrote:
    > > Lin Chung wrote:
    > > > John Bengi wrote:
    > > > > Lin Chung wrote:
    > > > > > Sheldon wrote:
    > > > > > > Glmmle Bob wrote:
    > > > > > > > Lin Chung wrote:
    > > > > > > > > Of two *identical* ultra compact zoom digicams, except
    > > > > > > > >one has a small optical viewfinder and the other a large
    > > > > > > > > TTL LCD... which one do you prefer?
    > > > > > > > The optical is good for extreme sunlght when the LCD is
    > > > > > > > washed out and hard to see and also for long telephoto shots
    > > > > > > > to stabilize the camera against the mass of your head.
    > > > > > > It's also good for close-up work, where the lens rarely lines up
    > > > > > > with the viewfinder, and when you want to see what your picture
    > > > > > > will look like before you take it...
    > > > > > ...also true that accurate focusing is more assured using a TTL
    > > > > > optical viewfinder than by the LCD alone which in subcompact/
    > > > > > compact cameras are invariably of dismal resolution...
    > > > > You haven't seen the manual focusing system on a Pentax Optio
    > > > > line camera then. The resolution in the LCD screen is a piece of
    the
    > > > > 5 megapixel element while focusing....
    > > > I don't understand your assertion that the LSD resolution is "a piece
    of
    > > > the 5 megapixel element". My view is that for comparison the native
    > > > resolution of a LSD display should be the pixel *density*...
    > > When you manually focus on a Pentax Optio the centre of the picture
    > > becomes zoomed in some 8 or 16 x and each pixel in the photo is each
    > > pixel on the LCD display (or close) There is no more resolution to be
    > > obtained. This works for the sharpest focus you can get. After you stop
    > > adjusting focus for more than a few seconds the picture zooms back out
    > > and you see the whole frame. Works like a charm and somebody was
    > > quite genius to think of this technique.
    >
    >
    >
    > Aha....so it's now automated! You see, one technique to get in focus is
    to
    > follow this sequence of steps: compose > zoom in > focus > zoom out >
    > re-compose > release shutter. Tedious but it works. Your zoomed in area
    > being made the same size as the LCD to maximize its available resolving
    > power followed by a restoration of the original frame (zooming back out)
    > works in the same principle. Brilliant!
    >
    > --
    > Lin Chung.
    > [The Water Margins of Liang Shan Po were at the time of the Sung dynasty.
    > Replace that with "ntlworld" for emails.]
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
  11. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.dcameras (More info?)

    "Sheldon" <sheldon@REMOVEsopris.net> wrote in message
    news:uYydnUx6Y7SaB97fRVn-hw@comcast.com...
    > > The optical is good for extreme sunlght when the LCD is washed out and
    > hard
    > > to see and also for long telephoto shots to stabilize the camera against
    > the
    > > mass of your head.
    >
    > It's also good for close-up work, where the lens rarely lines up with the
    > viewfinder, and when you want to see what your picture will look like
    before
    > you take it (except in the case of dslr's). They do make universal and
    > custom hoods for some cameras to block the sunlight reflecting off the
    LCD.
    > Good point about helping stabilize the camera (viewfinder). It's tough to
    > hold a camera out away from your body and keep it stable. And with us old
    > farts who's eyes aren't what they used to be, reading an image on an LCD
    can
    > be a pain.
    >
    >

    I see through the viewfinder of my Oly 8080 the same image as displayed on
    the rear LCD viewer. Is this usual or a plus feature of this particular non
    SLR digital camera?

    Thanks.


    --
    Build a man a fire and he will be warm for a day; set a man on fire and he
    will be warm the rest of his life. - John Dey


    ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==----
    http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups
    ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =----
Ask a new question

Read More

Cameras Peripherals