Nero & H.264/AVC

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Does anybody know when Nero is set to get the H.264/AVC encoder which
they announced would be coming a few months ago?

If I bought Nero now would I have to pay extra to get the AVC encoder
when it is added?

TIA.


--
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DAB sounds worse than FM wrote:

> Does anybody know when Nero is set to get the H.264/AVC encoder which
> they announced would be coming a few months ago?
>
> If I bought Nero now would I have to pay extra to get the AVC encoder
> when it is added?
>
> TIA.

Just out of curiosity, what do you need H.264 in Nero for? H.264 will
not change the standard for how video is produced on a DVD or how it
currently plays on a DVD player. Other than to possibly eliminate a step
in transcoding? Do you have a source file that's H.264 and your trying
to eliminate a step when making a video DVD?

Several H.264 players are appearing on the market now, but it's still a
data file and you'll be able to play those no matter if Nero supports it
or not.

Just wondering?

-Richard

 

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"Richard Ragon" <bsema04@hananho.com> wrote in message
newsbrnd.46381$QJ3.44819@newssvr21.news.prodigy.com...
> DAB sounds worse than FM wrote:
>
>> Does anybody know when Nero is set to get the H.264/AVC encoder which
>> they announced would be coming a few months ago?
>>
>> If I bought Nero now would I have to pay extra to get the AVC encoder
>> when it is added?
>>
>> TIA.
>
> Just out of curiosity, what do you need H.264 in Nero for? H.264 will not
> change the standard for how video is produced on a DVD or how it currently
> plays on a DVD player. Other than to possibly eliminate a step in
> transcoding? Do you have a source file that's H.264 and your trying to
> eliminate a step when making a video DVD?
>
> Several H.264 players are appearing on the market now, but it's still a
> data file and you'll be able to play those no matter if Nero supports it
> or not.
>
> Just wondering?
>
> -Richard

The OP was asking about the availability of an Encoder, so
the point of your post - is?

Luck;
Ken

 

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Richard Ragon wrote:
> DAB sounds worse than FM wrote:
>
>> Does anybody know when Nero is set to get the H.264/AVC encoder which
>> they announced would be coming a few months ago?
>>
>> If I bought Nero now would I have to pay extra to get the AVC encoder
>> when it is added?
>>
>> TIA.
>
> Just out of curiosity, what do you need H.264 in Nero for?


To compress MPEG-2 files recorded off DVB-T, and also I just want to see
how well it performs. If you look at Figure 5 of this article:

http://www.ebu.ch/trev_293-schaefer.pdf (544 KB)

H.264 (it's marked as H.26L, which was H.264's old name, I think)
significantly outperforms MPEG-4 ASP.

I also want Nero for its AAC and HE AAC encoders, but I don't want to
buy it until I know I'm going to get the H.264 encoder.


--
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Ken Maltby wrote:
> "Richard Ragon" <bsema04@hananho.com> wrote in message
> newsbrnd.46381$QJ3.44819@newssvr21.news.prodigy.com...
>
>>DAB sounds worse than FM wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Does anybody know when Nero is set to get the H.264/AVC encoder which
>>>they announced would be coming a few months ago?
>>>
>>>If I bought Nero now would I have to pay extra to get the AVC encoder
>>>when it is added?
>>>
>>>TIA.
>>
>>Just out of curiosity, what do you need H.264 in Nero for? H.264 will not
>>change the standard for how video is produced on a DVD or how it currently
>>plays on a DVD player. Other than to possibly eliminate a step in
>>transcoding? Do you have a source file that's H.264 and your trying to
>>eliminate a step when making a video DVD?
>>
>>Several H.264 players are appearing on the market now, but it's still a
>>data file and you'll be able to play those no matter if Nero supports it
>>or not.
>>
>>Just wondering?
>>
>>-Richard
>
>
> The OP was asking about the availability of an Encoder, so
> the point of your post - is?
>
> Luck;
> Ken

That's why I marked it as.. "Just our of curiosity". Sometimes we get
people in here asking questions that don't know what they are talking
about.. or worse yet "someone" told him that he needs
<ad_in_Hot_Buzz_word_here>...

If we can ascertain what he's trying to achieve, perhaps we can help him
to achieve that goal provided we know more about what he's trying to do.

Thanks
-Richard

 

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Richard Ragon wrote:
> Ken Maltby wrote:
>> "Richard Ragon" <bsema04@hananho.com> wrote in message
>> newsbrnd.46381$QJ3.44819@newssvr21.news.prodigy.com...
>>
>>> DAB sounds worse than FM wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> Does anybody know when Nero is set to get the H.264/AVC encoder
>>>> which they announced would be coming a few months ago?
>>>>
>>>> If I bought Nero now would I have to pay extra to get the AVC
>>>> encoder when it is added?
>>>>
>>>> TIA.
>>>
>>> Just out of curiosity, what do you need H.264 in Nero for? H.264
>>> will not change the standard for how video is produced on a DVD or
>>> how it currently plays on a DVD player. Other than to possibly
>>> eliminate a step in transcoding? Do you have a source file that's
>>> H.264 and your trying to eliminate a step when making a video DVD?
>>>
>>> Several H.264 players are appearing on the market now, but it's
>>> still a data file and you'll be able to play those no matter if
>>> Nero supports it or not.
>>>
>>> Just wondering?
>>>
>>> -Richard
>>
>>
>> The OP was asking about the availability of an Encoder, so
>> the point of your post - is?
>>
>> Luck;
>> Ken
>
> That's why I marked it as.. "Just our of curiosity". Sometimes we get
> people in here asking questions that don't know what they are talking
> about..


It's best not to assume that people don't know what they're talking
about


>or worse yet "someone" told him that he needs
> <ad_in_Hot_Buzz_word_here>...


In the case of H.264/AVC, then that "someone" would probably be correct
to recommend it, because by all accounts (research papers, articles,
etc) it's a shithot codec.


> If we can ascertain what he's trying to achieve, perhaps we can help
> him to achieve that goal provided we know more about what he's trying
> to do.



Re-reading my original post, I don't think there was any ambiguity with
regards to what I would like information on.


--
Steve - www.digitalradiotech.co.uk - Digital Radio News & Info

Find the cheapest MP3 player, Freeview and DAB prices:
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DAB sounds worse than FM wrote:
>>That's why I marked it as.. "Just our of curiosity". Sometimes we get
>>people in here asking questions that don't know what they are talking
>>about..
>
>
>
> It's best not to assume that people don't know what they're talking
> about

Yes, Hince the reason why I asked.. Way to many people in this group
keep assuming things!


>>or worse yet "someone" told him that he needs
>><ad_in_Hot_Buzz_word_here>...
>
>
>
> In the case of H.264/AVC, then that "someone" would probably be correct
> to recommend it, because by all accounts (research papers, articles,
> etc) it's a shithot codec.

Yes, it looks like the shithot codec, but it doesn't change anything
when were talking about a software such as Nero that makes standardized
disk. For example, H.264 has absolutely no bering on making a standard
DVD..



>>If we can ascertain what he's trying to achieve, perhaps we can help
>>him to achieve that goal provided we know more about what he's trying
>>to do.
>
>
>
>
> Re-reading my original post, I don't think there was any ambiguity with
> regards to what I would like information on.

The entire H.264 standard and where or what it's going to be used on, if
any standard disk making AT ALL is still up in the air.

With that being said, H.264 looks like a great way to archive your
videos, even if it's never used in new standard disc. With lossless
encoding, and scalabilites.. looks to be HOT no doubt. I'm looking
forward to it.

-Richard

 

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Richard Ragon wrote:
> DAB sounds worse than FM wrote:
>>> That's why I marked it as.. "Just our of curiosity". Sometimes we
>>> get people in here asking questions that don't know what they are
>>> talking about..
>>
>>
>>
>> It's best not to assume that people don't know what they're talking
>> about
>
> Yes, Hince the reason why I asked.. Way to many people in this group
> keep assuming things!


No, I said don't assume people DON'T know what they're talking about.
You just assumed that I didn't know what I was talking about, and that
is extremely patronising.


>>> or worse yet "someone" told him that he needs
>>> <ad_in_Hot_Buzz_word_here>...
>>
>>
>>
>> In the case of H.264/AVC, then that "someone" would probably be
>> correct to recommend it, because by all accounts (research papers,
>> articles, etc) it's a shithot codec.
>
> Yes, it looks like the shithot codec, but it doesn't change anything
> when were talking about a software such as Nero that makes
> standardized disk. For example, H.264 has absolutely no bering on
> making a standard DVD..


I didn't ask *anything* about DVDs.


>>> If we can ascertain what he's trying to achieve, perhaps we can help
>>> him to achieve that goal provided we know more about what he's
>>> trying to do.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Re-reading my original post, I don't think there was any ambiguity
>> with regards to what I would like information on.
>
> The entire H.264 standard and where or what it's going to be used on,
> if any standard disk making AT ALL is still up in the air.


http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2004/jun/23quicktime.html

"Apple® today announced that the DVD Forum has ratified the H.264
Advanced Video Codec (AVC) to be included in the next generation High
Definition (HD) DVD format."

http://news.com.com/2100-1041-5330786.html

"The steering committee of the DVD Forum standards group, which is
overseeing the development of HD DVD technology, has mandated the
inclusion of MPEG-2 and MPEG-4 AVC codecs in addition to VC-9 (VC-1)."


> With that being said, H.264 looks like a great way to archive your
> videos, even if it's never used in new standard disc. With lossless
> encoding,


Lossless encoding??? What are you on about?


> and scalabilites.. looks to be HOT no doubt. I'm looking
> forward to it.
>
> -Richard

--
Steve - www.digitalradiotech.co.uk - Digital Radio News & Info

Find the cheapest MP3 player, Freeview and DAB prices:
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DAB sounds worse than FM wrote:

> Richard Ragon wrote:
>
>>DAB sounds worse than FM wrote:
>>
>>>>That's why I marked it as.. "Just our of curiosity". Sometimes we
>>>>get people in here asking questions that don't know what they are
>>>>talking about..
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>It's best not to assume that people don't know what they're talking
>>>about
>>
>>Yes, Hince the reason why I asked.. Way to many people in this group
>>keep assuming things!
>
>
>
> No, I said don't assume people DON'T know what they're talking about.
> You just assumed that I didn't know what I was talking about, and that
> is extremely patronising.

I didn't assume. Hence the reason why I asked the "secondary question",
to clarify what they wanted to do with H.264.



>>>>or worse yet "someone" told him that he needs
>>>><ad_in_Hot_Buzz_word_here>...
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>In the case of H.264/AVC, then that "someone" would probably be
>>>correct to recommend it, because by all accounts (research papers,
>>>articles, etc) it's a shithot codec.
>>
>>Yes, it looks like the shithot codec, but it doesn't change anything
>>when were talking about a software such as Nero that makes
>>standardized disk. For example, H.264 has absolutely no bering on
>>making a standard DVD..
>
>
>
> I didn't ask *anything* about DVDs.

What else would you Nero for then other then to build a disk?



>>>>If we can ascertain what he's trying to achieve, perhaps we can help
>>>>him to achieve that goal provided we know more about what he's
>>>>trying to do.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>Re-reading my original post, I don't think there was any ambiguity
>>>with regards to what I would like information on.
>>
>>The entire H.264 standard and where or what it's going to be used on,
>>if any standard disk making AT ALL is still up in the air.
>
>
>
> http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2004/jun/23quicktime.html
>
> "Apple® today announced that the DVD Forum has ratified the H.264
> Advanced Video Codec (AVC) to be included in the next generation High
> Definition (HD) DVD format."
>
> http://news.com.com/2100-1041-5330786.html
>
> "The steering committee of the DVD Forum standards group, which is
> overseeing the development of HD DVD technology, has mandated the
> inclusion of MPEG-2 and MPEG-4 AVC codecs in addition to VC-9 (VC-1)."


That's nice and everything, but again.. There are multiple standards
being thought up right now for the next generation of DVD's.. HD DVD is
just one. Like I said, it may or may not ever make it to the market,
and even it did make it to the market, the real test would be if
consumers accepted it.


>>With that being said, H.264 looks like a great way to archive your
>>videos, even if it's never used in new standard disc. With lossless
>>encoding,
>
>
>
> Lossless encoding??? What are you on about?

For a better description of what lossless means, check out wikipedia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lossless_data_compression

-Richard

 

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Richard Ragon wrote:
> DAB sounds worse than FM wrote:


>> I didn't ask *anything* about DVDs.
>
> What else would you Nero for then other then to build a disk?


I want Nero to be able to encode MPEG-2 files recorded off digital TV to
a higher compression rate format, which is why I want H.264, and I've
tried Nero with MPEG-4, and it's a very quick encoder.

I don't want to write a DVD, because I view recorded material on my PC
at the moment.

Don't assume that everybody wants to do exactly the same thing as you do
with Nero.



>> http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2004/jun/23quicktime.html
>>
>> "Apple® today announced that the DVD Forum has ratified the H.264
>> Advanced Video Codec (AVC) to be included in the next generation High
>> Definition (HD) DVD format."
>>
>> http://news.com.com/2100-1041-5330786.html
>>
>> "The steering committee of the DVD Forum standards group, which is
>> overseeing the development of HD DVD technology, has mandated the
>> inclusion of MPEG-2 and MPEG-4 AVC codecs in addition to VC-9
>> (VC-1)."
>
>
> That's nice and everything, but again.. There are multiple standards
> being thought up right now for the next generation of DVD's.. HD DVD
> is just one.


There's HD DVD and Blu Ray. Name another > 15 GB disc format.


> Like I said, it may or may not ever make it to the
> market,


No, H.264 WILL make it to the market. You really don't seem to have a
clue about H.264, because it's one of the 2 codecs that will replace
MPEG-2 (the other being WMV). When you don't have a clue about something
then it's best not to dig yourself a hole, which you seem to be doing at
the moment.

Have a read of this:

http://www.macworld.com/news/2004/11/09/avc/index.php/?lsrc=mcrss-1104

I don't know where in the world you're from, but in Europe, all digital
TV transmissions use DVB systems, so the DVB approving H.264/AVC is as
good as them saying that this is the codec that'll likely be used for
what you watch in the future. In Europe at least.

In Europe, we don't have HDTV transmissions like there is in the US,
Australia or Japan, so the European broadcasters are free to choose
which codec they use, because we'll all need new set-top boxes to
receive HDTV. Which would you choose? MPEG-2, or H.264, when H.264
requires about 2 - 2.5 times less bandwidth than MPEG-2 for a given
level of picture quality? AVC isn't called Advanced Video Coding for
nothing.


> and even it did make it to the market, the real test would be
> if consumers accepted it.


Consumers won't even know that it's being used when they watch HDTV / HD
discs.


>>> With that being said, H.264 looks like a great way to archive your
>>> videos, even if it's never used in new standard disc. With lossless
>>> encoding,
>>
>>
>>
>> Lossless encoding??? What are you on about?
>
> For a better description of what lossless means, check out wikipedia.
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lossless_data_compression


Here you go again, you're assuming I don't know what lossless encoding
means. I know exactly what lossless encoding means.

But you said that H.264 uses lossless encoding. It doesn't.


--
Steve - www.digitalradiotech.co.uk - Digital Radio News & Info

Find the cheapest MP3 player, Freeview and DAB prices:
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DAB sounds worse than FM wrote:
> Richard Ragon wrote:
>


>>
>>
>>That's nice and everything, but again.. There are multiple standards
>>being thought up right now for the next generation of DVD's.. HD DVD
>>is just one.
>
>
>
> There's HD DVD and Blu Ray. Name another > 15 GB disc format.

There are currently 5+, with several more formats on the way. HD DVD,
Blu Ray, WMV HD, EVD, and FVD. Pioneer is also working on a 500 GB disk
format, no name for it yet.


>
>>Like I said, it may or may not ever make it to the
>>market,
>
>
>
> No, H.264 WILL make it to the market. You really don't seem to have a
> clue about H.264, because it's one of the 2 codecs that will replace
> MPEG-2 (the other being WMV). When you don't have a clue about something
> then it's best not to dig yourself a hole, which you seem to be doing at
> the moment.
>

Huh?

We were talking about HD DVD formats, and what may or may not make it to
the market is the DVD players.. your responce is "No, H.264 WILL
make.." I think that your a little confused between the Standard of HD
DVD's, and the CODECS.




>
>
>>and even it did make it to the market, the real test would be
>>if consumers accepted it.
>
>
>
> Consumers won't even know that it's being used when they watch HDTV / HD
> discs.
>
>
>
>>>>With that being said, H.264 looks like a great way to archive your
>>>>videos, even if it's never used in new standard disc. With lossless
>>>>encoding,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>Lossless encoding??? What are you on about?
>>
>>For a better description of what lossless means, check out wikipedia.
>>
>>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lossless_data_compression
>
>
>
> Here you go again, you're assuming I don't know what lossless encoding
> means. I know exactly what lossless encoding means.
>
> But you said that H.264 uses lossless encoding. It doesn't.
>

One has to assume a certain amount when talking to people like you. Your
communication skills are somewhat lacking.. shall we say.

-Richard

 

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Richard Ragon wrote:
> DAB sounds worse than FM wrote:
>> Richard Ragon wrote:
>>
>
>
>>>
>>>
>>> That's nice and everything, but again.. There are multiple standards
>>> being thought up right now for the next generation of DVD's.. HD
>>> DVD is just one.
>>
>>
>>
>> There's HD DVD and Blu Ray. Name another > 15 GB disc format.
>
> There are currently 5+, with several more formats on the way. HD DVD,


Correct.


> Blu Ray,


Correct.


> WMV HD,


Er, nah. That's just WMV being used to encode HD:

http://www.wmvhd.com/


> EVD,


You're right. I'm surprised.


> and FVD.


You're right. I'm very surprised.


> Pioneer is also working on a 500 GB
> disk format, no name for it yet.
>
>
>>
>>> Like I said, it may or may not ever make it to the
>>> market,
>>
>>
>>
>> No, H.264 WILL make it to the market. You really don't seem to have a
>> clue about H.264, because it's one of the 2 codecs that will replace
>> MPEG-2 (the other being WMV). When you don't have a clue about
>> something then it's best not to dig yourself a hole, which you seem
>> to be doing at the moment.
>>
>
> Huh?
>
> We were talking about HD DVD formats, and what may or may not make it
> to the market is the DVD players..


You said:

"Like I said, it may or may not ever make it to the market"

The "market" is DVDs, broadcast receivers, home PCs, mobile phones, etc
etc.


> your responce is "No, H.264 WILL
> make.." I think that your a little confused between the Standard of
> HD DVD's, and the CODECS.


I'm not at all confused about any of this.



>>>> Lossless encoding??? What are you on about?
>>>
>>> For a better description of what lossless means, check out
>>> wikipedia. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lossless_data_compression
>>
>>
>>
>> Here you go again, you're assuming I don't know what lossless
>> encoding means. I know exactly what lossless encoding means.
>>
>> But you said that H.264 uses lossless encoding. It doesn't.
>>
>
> One has to assume a certain amount when talking to people like you.
> Your communication skills are somewhat lacking.. shall we say.


Say whatever you like, but if my communication skills were as bad as you
try to make out then I wouldn't have the qualifications that I do have.


--
Steve - www.digitalradiotech.co.uk - Digital Radio News & Info

Find the cheapest MP3 player, Freeview and DAB prices:
http://www.digitalradiotech.co.uk/mp3_players.htm
http://www.digitalradiotech.co.uk/freeview_receivers.htm
http://www.digitalradiotech.co.uk/dab_digital_radios.htm

 

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DAB sounds worse than FM wrote:


>>Huh?
>>
>>We were talking about HD DVD formats, and what may or may not make it
>>to the market is the DVD players..
>
>
>
> You said:
>
> "Like I said, it may or may not ever make it to the market"
>
> The "market" is DVDs, broadcast receivers, home PCs, mobile phones, etc
> etc.

Yes, and what HD DVD player actually makes it too the market, is still
actually iffy at best!

Yes, I believe that H.264 is out on the market, and will do great as a
standard used in multiple ways. And, even if it's NOT used in the latest
round of next generation of DVD players, it's still an awesome viable CODEC.

Personally I'm for HD DVD (with H.264), and getting Microsoft's CODEC
out of the new standards.



>> your responce is "No, H.264 WILL
>>make.." I think that your a little confused between the Standard of
>>HD DVD's, and the CODECS.
>
>
>
> I'm not at all confused about any of this.
>
>
>
>
>>One has to assume a certain amount when talking to people like you.
>>Your communication skills are somewhat lacking.. shall we say.
>
>
>
> Say whatever you like, but if my communication skills were as bad as you
> try to make out then I wouldn't have the qualifications that I do have.

I own my own multimedia company (deepmagicstudios.com) where I do
editing, post production, and motion graphics in Hollywood. I've worked
on multiple films editing and visual effects. I'm also Apple certified
in Final Cut Pro HD, and I teach at 2 Colleges where I have classes in
editing, motion graphics, and digital workflow.

What are your qualifications?

-Richard