setting up SATA nonRAID pair of drives

[MikeSp]

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.asus (More info?)

After thoroughly reading the thread about RAID drives, it got me to thinking
that, for my REAL needs (and not psychological ones), that my RAID 0
configuration of Raptors really is not necessary and offers me little
advantage. Since I will need to remove the partition anyway to do a virgin
install after spending a zillion hours chasing a conflict between Norton
Systemworks (NAV) 2004 and my Audigy 2ZS sound card software as well as a
conflict with Roxio Easy Media Creator causing Windows Installer to attempt
to install DAO.msi every time Roxio 7 is started), I have tweaked the
registry and installed and uninstalled and reinstalled and patched until my
XP registry is less than perfect (I wonder if many people know how many
entries Norton puts into the registry and are there even when it is
uninstalled?) Thus, although this new build is running fine and there are
no crashes, I plan to set up a virgin install of XP-Pro (leaving out Norton
software!!!!) and am wondering how to do so with both SATA drives connected
to the South bridge Intel chipset (controller) on my P4C800E-D--I would want
one drive for programs and the other one for data storage. Since these
drives are not "C" and "D," how will their drive letters be assigned (there
is a backup IDE HDD and two optical drives too)? Will I be given a choice
of which one of the two SATA drives on which to install WinXP during set
up--or will it be decided when I install a partition on one of the two
Raptors? (BTW--my Promise controller is disabled in BIOS since I don't need
it). Then perhaps go into storage management and set up the other raptor as
drive D??

MikeSp

 

[d]

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.asus (More info?)

So why not use the advantage of raid1?

"MikeSp" <mspurgeon5@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:a4WdnacSG8KjWXDdRVn-tA@comcast.com...
> After thoroughly reading the thread about RAID drives, it got me to
thinking
> that, for my REAL needs (and not psychological ones), that my RAID 0
> configuration of Raptors really is not necessary and offers me little
> advantage. Since I will need to remove the partition anyway to do a
virgin
> install after spending a zillion hours chasing a conflict between Norton
> Systemworks (NAV) 2004 and my Audigy 2ZS sound card software as well as a
> conflict with Roxio Easy Media Creator causing Windows Installer to
attempt
> to install DAO.msi every time Roxio 7 is started), I have tweaked the
> registry and installed and uninstalled and reinstalled and patched until
my
> XP registry is less than perfect (I wonder if many people know how many
> entries Norton puts into the registry and are there even when it is
> uninstalled?) Thus, although this new build is running fine and there are
> no crashes, I plan to set up a virgin install of XP-Pro (leaving out
Norton
> software!!!!) and am wondering how to do so with both SATA drives
connected
> to the South bridge Intel chipset (controller) on my P4C800E-D--I would
want
> one drive for programs and the other one for data storage. Since these
> drives are not "C" and "D," how will their drive letters be assigned
(there
> is a backup IDE HDD and two optical drives too)? Will I be given a choice
> of which one of the two SATA drives on which to install WinXP during set
> up--or will it be decided when I install a partition on one of the two
> Raptors? (BTW--my Promise controller is disabled in BIOS since I don't
need
> it). Then perhaps go into storage management and set up the other raptor
as
> drive D??
>
> MikeSp
>
>

 

[MikeSp]

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.asus (More info?)

Help me out here--but I was under the impression that RAID 1 would add
overhead to the CPU as it writes info to a second drive and slow the entire
system down slightly.

BTW--Questions--in RAID 1--is the information copied to the second drive
able to be accessed in My Computer in identical files (as doc or mp3 etc) or
is it encoded and must be recovered somehow? Will the second RAID 0 drive
boot if the first one fails?

MikeSp
-------------------------------
"D" <anon@spoof.com> wrote in message
news:BXlHc.1000$Tr2.362@newsfe2-gui.ntli.net...
> So why not use the advantage of raid1?
>
> "MikeSp" <mspurgeon5@comcast.net> wrote in message
> news:a4WdnacSG8KjWXDdRVn-tA@comcast.com...
> > After thoroughly reading the thread about RAID drives, it got me to
> thinking
> > that, for my REAL needs (and not psychological ones), that my RAID 0
> > configuration of Raptors really is not necessary and offers me little
> > advantage. Since I will need to remove the partition anyway to do a
> virgin
> > install after spending a zillion hours chasing a conflict between Norton
> > Systemworks (NAV) 2004 and my Audigy 2ZS sound card software as well as
a
> > conflict with Roxio Easy Media Creator causing Windows Installer to
> attempt
> > to install DAO.msi every time Roxio 7 is started), I have tweaked the
> > registry and installed and uninstalled and reinstalled and patched until
> my
> > XP registry is less than perfect (I wonder if many people know how many
> > entries Norton puts into the registry and are there even when it is
> > uninstalled?) Thus, although this new build is running fine and there
are
> > no crashes, I plan to set up a virgin install of XP-Pro (leaving out
> Norton
> > software!!!!) and am wondering how to do so with both SATA drives
> connected
> > to the South bridge Intel chipset (controller) on my P4C800E-D--I would
> want
> > one drive for programs and the other one for data storage. Since these
> > drives are not "C" and "D," how will their drive letters be assigned
> (there
> > is a backup IDE HDD and two optical drives too)? Will I be given a
choice
> > of which one of the two SATA drives on which to install WinXP during set
> > up--or will it be decided when I install a partition on one of the two
> > Raptors? (BTW--my Promise controller is disabled in BIOS since I don't
> need
> > it). Then perhaps go into storage management and set up the other
raptor
> as
> > drive D??
> >
> > MikeSp
> >
> >
>
>

 

[MikeSp]

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.asus (More info?)

OOPS--correction--Will the second RAID 1 drive boot if the first one fails?
---------------------------------------
"MikeSp" <mspurgeon5@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:zPKdnaWwB_Q1Z3DdRVn-ug@comcast.com...
> Help me out here--but I was under the impression that RAID 1 would add
> overhead to the CPU as it writes info to a second drive and slow the
entire
> system down slightly.
>
> BTW--Questions--in RAID 1--is the information copied to the second drive
> able to be accessed in My Computer in identical files (as doc or mp3 etc)
or
> is it encoded and must be recovered somehow? Will the second RAID 0 drive
> boot if the first one fails?
>
> MikeSp
> -------------------------------
> "D" <anon@spoof.com> wrote in message
> news:BXlHc.1000$Tr2.362@newsfe2-gui.ntli.net...
> > So why not use the advantage of raid1?
> >
> > "MikeSp" <mspurgeon5@comcast.net> wrote in message
> > news:a4WdnacSG8KjWXDdRVn-tA@comcast.com...
> > > After thoroughly reading the thread about RAID drives, it got me to
> > thinking
> > > that, for my REAL needs (and not psychological ones), that my RAID 0
> > > configuration of Raptors really is not necessary and offers me little
> > > advantage. Since I will need to remove the partition anyway to do a
> > virgin
> > > install after spending a zillion hours chasing a conflict between
Norton
> > > Systemworks (NAV) 2004 and my Audigy 2ZS sound card software as well
as
> a
> > > conflict with Roxio Easy Media Creator causing Windows Installer to
> > attempt
> > > to install DAO.msi every time Roxio 7 is started), I have tweaked the
> > > registry and installed and uninstalled and reinstalled and patched
until
> > my
> > > XP registry is less than perfect (I wonder if many people know how
many
> > > entries Norton puts into the registry and are there even when it is
> > > uninstalled?) Thus, although this new build is running fine and there
> are
> > > no crashes, I plan to set up a virgin install of XP-Pro (leaving out
> > Norton
> > > software!!!!) and am wondering how to do so with both SATA drives
> > connected
> > > to the South bridge Intel chipset (controller) on my P4C800E-D--I
would
> > want
> > > one drive for programs and the other one for data storage. Since
these
> > > drives are not "C" and "D," how will their drive letters be assigned
> > (there
> > > is a backup IDE HDD and two optical drives too)? Will I be given a
> choice
> > > of which one of the two SATA drives on which to install WinXP during
set
> > > up--or will it be decided when I install a partition on one of the two
> > > Raptors? (BTW--my Promise controller is disabled in BIOS since I don't
> > need
> > > it). Then perhaps go into storage management and set up the other
> raptor
> > as
> > > drive D??
> > >
> > > MikeSp
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.asus (More info?)

"MikeSp" <mspurgeon5@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:zPKdnaWwB_Q1Z3DdRVn-ug@comcast.com...
> Help me out here--but I was under the impression that RAID 1 would add
> overhead to the CPU as it writes info to a second drive and slow the
entire
> system down slightly.

There is a very small extra write overhead and the proportions of writes is
generally small and therefore it's a non-issue; no slowdown. The small
extra load is not to the CPU in any case but to the system I/O bus
structure.

> BTW--Questions--in RAID 1--is the information copied to the second drive
> able to be accessed in My Computer in identical files (as doc or mp3 etc)
or
> is it encoded and must be recovered somehow?

No, the 2nd drive is identical to the first. In fact during multitasked
reads it'll spread the load over both drives for a non-trivial performance
improvement.

> Will the second RAID 0 drive
> boot if the first one fails?

NO, if any member of a RAID 0 set fails the you lose everything on all the
drives.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.asus (More info?)

"MikeSp" <mspurgeon5@comcast.net> wrote in message
newsoednRBynI6Fj3PdRVn-gQ@comcast.com...
> OOPS--correction--Will the second RAID 1 drive boot if the first one
fails?

In most situations yes.

> ---------------------------------------
> "MikeSp" <mspurgeon5@comcast.net> wrote in message
> news:zPKdnaWwB_Q1Z3DdRVn-ug@comcast.com...
> > Help me out here--but I was under the impression that RAID 1 would add
> > overhead to the CPU as it writes info to a second drive and slow the
> entire
> > system down slightly.
> >
> > BTW--Questions--in RAID 1--is the information copied to the second drive
> > able to be accessed in My Computer in identical files (as doc or mp3
etc)
> or
> > is it encoded and must be recovered somehow? Will the second RAID 0
drive
> > boot if the first one fails?
> >
> > MikeSp
> > -------------------------------
> > "D" <anon@spoof.com> wrote in message
> > news:BXlHc.1000$Tr2.362@newsfe2-gui.ntli.net...
> > > So why not use the advantage of raid1?
> > >
> > > "MikeSp" <mspurgeon5@comcast.net> wrote in message
> > > news:a4WdnacSG8KjWXDdRVn-tA@comcast.com...
> > > > After thoroughly reading the thread about RAID drives, it got me to
> > > thinking
> > > > that, for my REAL needs (and not psychological ones), that my RAID 0
> > > > configuration of Raptors really is not necessary and offers me
little
> > > > advantage. Since I will need to remove the partition anyway to do a
> > > virgin
> > > > install after spending a zillion hours chasing a conflict between
> Norton
> > > > Systemworks (NAV) 2004 and my Audigy 2ZS sound card software as well
> as
> > a
> > > > conflict with Roxio Easy Media Creator causing Windows Installer to
> > > attempt
> > > > to install DAO.msi every time Roxio 7 is started), I have tweaked
the
> > > > registry and installed and uninstalled and reinstalled and patched
> until
> > > my
> > > > XP registry is less than perfect (I wonder if many people know how
> many
> > > > entries Norton puts into the registry and are there even when it is
> > > > uninstalled?) Thus, although this new build is running fine and
there
> > are
> > > > no crashes, I plan to set up a virgin install of XP-Pro (leaving out
> > > Norton
> > > > software!!!!) and am wondering how to do so with both SATA drives
> > > connected
> > > > to the South bridge Intel chipset (controller) on my P4C800E-D--I
> would
> > > want
> > > > one drive for programs and the other one for data storage. Since
> these
> > > > drives are not "C" and "D," how will their drive letters be assigned
> > > (there
> > > > is a backup IDE HDD and two optical drives too)? Will I be given a
> > choice
> > > > of which one of the two SATA drives on which to install WinXP during
> set
> > > > up--or will it be decided when I install a partition on one of the
two
> > > > Raptors? (BTW--my Promise controller is disabled in BIOS since I
don't
> > > need
> > > > it). Then perhaps go into storage management and set up the other
> > raptor
> > > as
> > > > drive D??
> > > >
> > > > MikeSp
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.asus (More info?)

"Tim" <Tim@NoSpam.com> wrote in message news:cclgas$hbt$1@lust.ihug.co.nz...
> Mike,
>
> Any over head in writing is imperceptable - unless you benchmark it of
> course.

You wont even see any SW/firmware RAID 1 overhead in most benchmarks.

>If performance is an issue then it would still be an issue with
> Raptors in RAID 0

Just a modest(smaller) issue with SW/firmware RAID 0.

> - Ultra 320 SCSI would be the next way forward.

In the RAID and overhead issues U320 SCSI is no different than any other
interface.

> Intel has
> some stats on its web site that show that reads are faster, writes a tad
> slower.
>
> The objective in RAID 1 is for both drives to be identical, so if one of
the
> drives is bootable, both will be - they are identical in all aspects
except
> for some information somewhere on the very front of the disc where the
> unique ID's / drive serial numbers and whatever else for each disc is
stored
> by the raid controller - this is transparent.
>
> The cost of RAID 1 is obvious 2 x 1 drive. Performance, well it is not
worse
> and if anything better (optimism rings in here) than a single drive.

There no special optimizations in RAID 1 EXCEPT that multitasked reads are
split over both drives so that both drives can share the load.

> I can't
> say I can produce any stats to support this at all. SATA helps, 3GHz
> processor helps... last system was dual processor and SCSI, so I was very
> very suprised to find the "IDE" based system as good as it is.

Why?

> With a RAID 1 assembly, you can pull out either drive, boot, see that the
> system notices the missing drive, continue booting and use the system,
> shutdown, put the drive back in and then watch the system recreate the
drive
> image at run time while you continue using the system - albeit with a
> degradation in performance while the controller does cylinder by cylinder
> synchronisation (copy live to other). You can simulate failures at run
time
> by pulling the power on one of the drives... Note that ICH5R connected
> drives are not Hot Swap.

Who says for SATA drives? Cite a reference.

> I believe that ICH6R are.
>
> One way to answer questions about how RAID 1 should work is to ask
yourself
> how Should it work. Thats how.
>
> The most common situation where people have boot problems with RAID 1
comes
> about not with hardware RAID as you are using,

Actually it's not hardware RAID but firmware RAID and there's a big
difference between the two.

> but with Software RAID -
> Windows provides the ability to mirror two partitions on two drives.
Because
> it only mirrors the contents of partitions, it does not mirror boot
sectors
> and the other stuff at the front of hte disc since they are not in
> partitions.

That's overall inaccurate.