P4C800-E or P4P800-E

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.asus (More info?)

I'm looking for either a 875p or 865PE chipset since these are the last two
to support AGP. Can't really tell the difference between these two chipsets
but have decided on either of these boards.

What is the difference between these two boards because there is a $60-$70
price difference? Is one much more superior than the other to warrant the
price difference? Spec wise they appear to be identical. Am I missing
something.

Also is one more reliable than the other?

Thanks for any pointers.
9 answers Last reply
More about p4c800 p4p800
  1. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.asus (More info?)

    In article <2zIOc.21303$mg6.19228@fed1read02>, "Martin Hirsch"
    <martinhirschREMOVEspam@cox.net> wrote:

    > I'm looking for either a 875p or 865PE chipset since these are the last two
    > to support AGP. Can't really tell the difference between these two chipsets
    > but have decided on either of these boards.
    >
    > What is the difference between these two boards because there is a $60-$70
    > price difference? Is one much more superior than the other to warrant the
    > price difference? Spec wise they appear to be identical. Am I missing
    > something.
    >
    > Also is one more reliable than the other?
    >
    > Thanks for any pointers.

    This is one of the differences:

    http://abxzone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=62275&highlight=video+artifacts

    If you are an avid overclocker, the P4C800-E is the board to get.

    The P4C800-E has its gigabit ethernet connected to the CSA bus, so
    LAN traffic doesn't load down the PCI bus. That helps in server
    applications.

    Don't know what to tell you on reliability. You need to know how many
    dead boards there are, out of how many total boards shipped, and that
    is hard to estimate from just USENET postings.

    HTH,
    Paul
  2. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.asus (More info?)

    Additional comment....

    I set the BIOS on my P4P800-E Deluxe for 10% overclocking and have had no
    problems.

    John
  3. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.asus (More info?)

    Here's my two cents (Canadian that is);

    I own both boards the P4C800-E Deluxe is mine, the P4P800 Deluxe a recent
    upgrade to my son's old computer
    (called the Doom 3 incident) both with Northwood CPU first with a 3.2GHz
    second with 3 Ghz,
    none of the boards are overclocked.
    The difference here in Canada between them was about $70.
    Performance wise the first one a bit faster due to the fact I have 1Ghz of
    RAM compared with 512MB
    and I also run a RAID on P4C800.
    Both boards are very stable.
    Now so far the P4C800-E has the following problems:
    1. Firewire on board is not working properly even after installing the
    Hotfix from Microsoft
    I ended up using the firewire port from the Audigy 2 with my Digital
    camcorder, the
    P4P800 does not have this issue.
    2. I have lost the RAID after upgrading the BIOS (P4C800) to 1016, and I
    had to go back to 1014.

    Technical support from Asus equals 0 not even an answer on my e-mails.

    I hope this helps,
    Marius


    "Martin Hirsch" <martinhirschREMOVEspam@cox.net> wrote in message
    news:2zIOc.21303$mg6.19228@fed1read02...
    > I'm looking for either a 875p or 865PE chipset since these are the last
    two
    > to support AGP. Can't really tell the difference between these two
    chipsets
    > but have decided on either of these boards.
    >
    > What is the difference between these two boards because there is a $60-$70
    > price difference? Is one much more superior than the other to warrant the
    > price difference? Spec wise they appear to be identical. Am I missing
    > something.
    >
    > Also is one more reliable than the other?
    >
    > Thanks for any pointers.
    >
    >
  4. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.asus (More info?)

    >John Blaustein wrote in message ...
    >Additional comment....
    >
    >I set the BIOS on my P4P800-E Deluxe for 10% overclocking and have had no
    >problems.
    >
    >John
    >
    I totally agree with John's research and results.
    I did a similar quest. Ended-up with a P4P800Edeluxe and could not be happier.
    Not that a P4C800Edelux is any less for that matter.

    One of the only reason I see someone need a P4C800xxx is for the ECC, which
    is something of great importance for professionnal users like, Medical research,
    security, finance or; Whatever field that implies you can spend extra $$ for ECC.

    I run the original BIOS, and can easily overclock the CPU from 2.8Ghz to 3Ghz,
    on Kingston Value RAM (approved on the ASUS memory list).
    One comment to John Blaustein though... Overclocking 10% from the BIOS is
    the easy way; but that should result in decreasing your RAM performance...
    I did my overclock manually, (CPU 220Mhz, resulting in an FSB of 880Mhz).
    and I recommend SANDRA 2004 SP1 for benchmarking the real performance
    increase. That should be a goot tip for you John.

    Not to mention that my Linux Mandrake loves this motherboard too.. 8)

    Regards,
    Art.
  5. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.asus (More info?)

    Art,

    See comments below...

    > I totally agree with John's research and results.
    > I did a similar quest. Ended-up with a P4P800Edeluxe and could not be
    happier.
    > Not that a P4C800Edelux is any less for that matter.

    No question that the P4C800xx is a great board too -- lots of good comments
    about it and the P4Pxx. I chose the P4P800xx because a few comments in the
    NG suggested it was perhaps a bit more stable than the P4Cxx and I have no
    need to use ECC memory.

    <snip>

    > I run the original BIOS, and can easily overclock the CPU from 2.8Ghz to
    3Ghz,
    > on Kingston Value RAM (approved on the ASUS memory list).

    I am using the original BIOS too -- 1002. I read too many posts here about
    flashing disasters.

    > One comment to John Blaustein though... Overclocking 10% from the BIOS is
    > the easy way; but that should result in decreasing your RAM performance...
    > I did my overclock manually, (CPU 220Mhz, resulting in an FSB of 880Mhz).
    > and I recommend SANDRA 2004 SP1 for benchmarking the real performance
    > increase. That should be a goot tip for you John.

    While I've been using PCs since 1982, this is the first time I've built my
    own machine and I still have a lot to learn about how they work and how to
    modify the default settings. Several posts warned against using the AI
    Booster program, so simply setting the AI Overclock in BIOS from Standard to
    +10% was all I was comfortable with. I'd hate to change something that
    would screw things up.

    If my setting the BIOS to overclock by 10% has reduced the RAM performance,
    I will set it back to "Standard." My main use of this PC is for Photoshop
    (I'm a photographer), and PS is very RAM intensive. It's my impression that
    for PS, RAM performance is more important than CPU speed. I have to say,
    this PC is so fast already compared to my previous machine -- PIII/1Ghz
    w/1GB RAM -- that I'm happy with it as-is.

    I see that there is now a Sandra 2004 SP2a (9.131). I assume I should get
    that version if I decide to start fooling around with more sophisticated
    overclocking. Are you familiar with a benchmarking utility called PC
    Wizard? Does it do the same thing?

    If it's not too complicated, can you tell me how to go about manually
    setting the overclocking in BIOS? (My RAM is Mushkin, PC3200 Blue, 4x512MB
    DIMMS DDRAM -- total 2GB RAM.)

    Best,

    John
  6. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.asus (More info?)

    "Paul" <nospam@needed.com> wrote in message
    news:nospam-3107040726380001@192.168.1.177...

    > The P4C800-E has its gigabit ethernet connected to the CSA bus, so
    > LAN traffic doesn't load down the PCI bus. That helps in server
    > applications.

    I ended up with the P4P800E-Deluxe. For me, the fairly esoteric advantage
    above wouldn't mean much -- don't have GigE on my LAN and all the other
    boxes I talk to are ancient PIIs and 60Mbit/sec is about what they can do
    from a performance perspective, anyway.

    I thought of it this way -- for not much more than the price difference
    between the P4P and the P4C you can buy a new SATA drive that will give you
    day-day performance bennies way beyond the rather limited benefit provided
    by the Intel NIC integration in the P4C.
  7. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.asus (More info?)

    John Blaustein wrote in message ...
    >Art,
    >
    >See comments below...
    >
    (SNIP)
    >> One comment to John Blaustein though... Overclocking 10% from the BIOS is
    >> the easy way; but that should result in decreasing your RAM performance...
    >> I did my overclock manually, (CPU 220Mhz, resulting in an FSB of 880Mhz).
    >> and I recommend SANDRA 2004 SP1 for benchmarking the real performance
    >> increase. That should be a goot tip for you John.
    >
    >While I've been using PCs since 1982, this is the first time I've built my
    >own machine and I still have a lot to learn about how they work and how to
    >modify the default settings.
    >
    It's funny you mention this John,
    I too run PC since 1982. Even before that, I had a nice OhioScientific computer,
    running 6502.. Before that, it was an RCA proto board; Cosmac VIP, and
    I learned my baby steps at a RadioShack Store with the friendly manager,
    and a TRS80.. What memories.

    I never doubted your skills.. I just point out something I learned for myself,
    on a same board. And this too is the first one I build from scratch; Previous
    ones I would just pick components and let the store assemble them.
    Too busy with my engineering job I guess; Not anymore. :)

    > Several posts warned against using the AI
    >Booster program, so simply setting the AI Overclock in BIOS from Standard to
    >+10% was all I was comfortable with. I'd hate to change something that
    >would screw things up.
    >
    >If my setting the BIOS to overclock by 10% has reduced the RAM performance,
    >I will set it back to "Standard." My main use of this PC is for Photoshop
    >(I'm a photographer), and PS is very RAM intensive. It's my impression that
    >for PS, RAM performance is more important than CPU speed. I have to say,
    >this PC is so fast already compared to my previous machine -- PIII/1Ghz
    >w/1GB RAM -- that I'm happy with it as-is.
    >
    Samething here;
    Except that I did notice a difference with that slight overclocking.
    It's been years since I overclocked anything. Never much worth the trouble of
    adding superior HS and ventilation. I run a stock Intel HS and I would never
    up the CPU or RAM voltage to get better results. Stability is very important
    here also... That's what SANDRA is also good for. Testing in loop (burning) mode;
    performance areas you wish. As well as giving you a very detailed view of your
    hardware and associated performance.

    That's how I discovered that upping the CPU clock using AI booster resulted
    in slightly less ram bandwidth. Doing it directly to the CPU clock which can be
    increased in 1Mhz steps; I just went for 210Mhz (x8=840Mhz fsb).. That was fine
    but I could even up this up to 220 and pass all my stability tests...
    It's really simple to do, no hassle and stability is easy to validate since the
    ASUS temperature monitor is an excellent marker to determine the upper
    temperature limit the CPU reach under stress tests. If it can run hours like that,
    chances are you'll never experience a problem, and since the voltages are untouched,
    I feel very safe with it... Upping CPU voltage is something I would not recommend
    at all since it increases the diode reverse current in every transistors of the chip.
    and that can really get the silicion hotter. Increasing the CPU clock should also
    increase temperature from increasing the switching rate of all transistors, thus
    also dissipating more heat. But that's still well within the limits of the Intel P4C
    core design. In fact; The CPU's at Intel's factory are mostly made aiming for
    that 3+Ghz, and some batches perform better than others; Then are marked
    accordingly. In other situations, the CPU wafer contains some chips that can
    break the barrier and get well beyond specs. Intel can't test each and everyone.
    Even more, sometimes Intel has to fill the market demand even though it could have
    loads of 3Ghz ready P4.. It's marked and sold as P4 2.4, or 2.6 or 2.8 ...
    I can't prove this for the current P4.. But this happened for older P3 technology.

    Bottom line is that using such an ASUS board and tools; Knowing a bit about
    the technology can make you feel safe about a slight overclocking that can
    be easily monitored for a couple of days under stress. Then you decide if your
    hardware integration is stable enough.

    I recommend that you take a peek at this article:
    http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/mainboards/display/asus-p4p800_7.html
    That's an eye opener for P4P800 / P4C800 interested dudes.
    But it explains the PAT technology a little and tips.

    What's important is to enable MAM in the BIOS.
    Then there is another setting that helps to gain RAM speed as well.
    The options are AUTO, STANDARD, and TURBO.
    Don't go TURBO.. STANDARD would be nice if it worked, but it's better
    to set it AUTO (default), and go right in the next section to manually get
    the CPU about 10% faster clock.. The first thing to check is if it posts and
    boots. Then monitor the temparature; Then SANDRA bench and stability tests.
    That's certainly easy for an experienced photographer.

    >I see that there is now a Sandra 2004 SP2a (9.131). I assume I should get
    >that version if I decide to start fooling around with more sophisticated
    >overclocking. Are you familiar with a benchmarking utility called PC
    >Wizard? Does it do the same thing?
    >
    Not familiar with PC Wizard as I'm very cautious about shareware and freeware
    around that could carry trojans or viris (not to implie PC Wizard is). I just know
    for a fact how great SANDRA works and widely used and known from the community.
    Available also from sites such as download dot com... I not an overclocking maniac either.
    SANDRA is without nags, free to use in the basic version and excellent.

    I'm not a benchamrking freak anymore.. And you'll agree that with a P4C in the 3Ghz
    range and 800+Mhz FSB, and a great HD capable of 45Mb/s STR on that motherboard;
    I'm not worried, nor interested in downloading these 178MB video bench tools.
    I read everything in tons of article to correlate the reviewers results. I'm satisfied.
    SANDRA gives graphical performance curves as well; Then I use it mostly to determine
    if it's working within specs before I try a little overclock.

    I would recommend SANDRA even blindfolded. :)

    >If it's not too complicated, can you tell me how to go about manually
    >setting the overclocking in BIOS? (My RAM is Mushkin, PC3200 Blue, 4x512MB
    >DIMMS DDRAM -- total 2GB RAM.)
    >
    I did it above; Really... There is nothing else than getting all the AI boosting OFF,
    and default.. Then get the CPU clock to 220Mhz 1:1 ratio means 8x to the FSB.
    If your system is not stable at 220Mhz CPU.. Lower it to 210... It could be the video
    that does not hold the 881Mhz speed... Better luck next time then... No big deal I agree.
    But a 10% stable overclock, no hassle, for FREE is something great to use.
    BTW; Vid card is Radeon 9800Pro (with DVI/TV out) here...Like a charm with stock
    drivers on CD; All under win2KPro + Linux... Linux also runs with flying colors at this overclock
    speed...Oh, don't forget to turn MAM ON !.. Although I don't know if PAT is working with four sticks.
    SANDRA tests would tell.

    Running 2Gigs (4 sticks) is a bit trickier to get stable overclocked system (some specialist say).
    But I don't think it's gonna matter much, Mushkin as an excellent brand. My ram is in theory
    of lesser quality. but I use only two slots (blue) for a total of 1GB.

    If you take a little time to setup the 'geek' details now; You'll enjoy a better system for the years
    to come... Running Sandra will show you if that 10% AI overclock cripples the bandwidth and if
    my recommendation does better. If the overclock does not work; You'll still be able to 'TUNE'
    your machine with SANDRA's precious infos, to perfection.. The heck with overclocking if it
    does not work.. I agree this BOARd and current P4 and 800Mhz FSB technology rocks...

    P.S.. I also use CANON camera for my photos; SONY Digital8 firewire video on 8mm tapes,
    and a truckload of video applications for DvD authoring. We do have lots in common John;
    I'll be watching your posts in this forum for a while... Any questions; I'm here. !

    >Best,
    >
    >John

    No.. You the best :)
    Art,
  8. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.asus (More info?)

    Art,

    Thanks for all the additional information!

    John


    "Art Simpson" <Alfred@NOSPAM.ever> wrote in message
    news:aMKdnUBHNL2eDJPcRVn-gA@look.ca...
    > John Blaustein wrote in message ...
    > >Art,
    > >
    > >See comments below...
    > >
    > (SNIP)
    > >> One comment to John Blaustein though... Overclocking 10% from the BIOS
    is
    > >> the easy way; but that should result in decreasing your RAM
    performance...
    > >> I did my overclock manually, (CPU 220Mhz, resulting in an FSB of
    880Mhz).
    > >> and I recommend SANDRA 2004 SP1 for benchmarking the real performance
    > >> increase. That should be a goot tip for you John.
    > >
    > >While I've been using PCs since 1982, this is the first time I've built
    my
    > >own machine and I still have a lot to learn about how they work and how
    to
    > >modify the default settings.
    > >
    > It's funny you mention this John,
    > I too run PC since 1982. Even before that, I had a nice OhioScientific
    computer,
    > running 6502.. Before that, it was an RCA proto board; Cosmac VIP, and
    > I learned my baby steps at a RadioShack Store with the friendly manager,
    > and a TRS80.. What memories.
    >
    > I never doubted your skills.. I just point out something I learned for
    myself,
    > on a same board. And this too is the first one I build from scratch;
    Previous
    > ones I would just pick components and let the store assemble them.
    > Too busy with my engineering job I guess; Not anymore. :)
    >
    > > Several posts warned against using the AI
    > >Booster program, so simply setting the AI Overclock in BIOS from Standard
    to
    > >+10% was all I was comfortable with. I'd hate to change something that
    > >would screw things up.
    > >
    > >If my setting the BIOS to overclock by 10% has reduced the RAM
    performance,
    > >I will set it back to "Standard." My main use of this PC is for
    Photoshop
    > >(I'm a photographer), and PS is very RAM intensive. It's my impression
    that
    > >for PS, RAM performance is more important than CPU speed. I have to say,
    > >this PC is so fast already compared to my previous machine -- PIII/1Ghz
    > >w/1GB RAM -- that I'm happy with it as-is.
    > >
    > Samething here;
    > Except that I did notice a difference with that slight overclocking.
    > It's been years since I overclocked anything. Never much worth the trouble
    of
    > adding superior HS and ventilation. I run a stock Intel HS and I would
    never
    > up the CPU or RAM voltage to get better results. Stability is very
    important
    > here also... That's what SANDRA is also good for. Testing in loop
    (burning) mode;
    > performance areas you wish. As well as giving you a very detailed view of
    your
    > hardware and associated performance.
    >
    > That's how I discovered that upping the CPU clock using AI booster
    resulted
    > in slightly less ram bandwidth. Doing it directly to the CPU clock which
    can be
    > increased in 1Mhz steps; I just went for 210Mhz (x8=840Mhz fsb).. That was
    fine
    > but I could even up this up to 220 and pass all my stability tests...
    > It's really simple to do, no hassle and stability is easy to validate
    since the
    > ASUS temperature monitor is an excellent marker to determine the upper
    > temperature limit the CPU reach under stress tests. If it can run hours
    like that,
    > chances are you'll never experience a problem, and since the voltages are
    untouched,
    > I feel very safe with it... Upping CPU voltage is something I would not
    recommend
    > at all since it increases the diode reverse current in every transistors
    of the chip.
    > and that can really get the silicion hotter. Increasing the CPU clock
    should also
    > increase temperature from increasing the switching rate of all
    transistors, thus
    > also dissipating more heat. But that's still well within the limits of the
    Intel P4C
    > core design. In fact; The CPU's at Intel's factory are mostly made aiming
    for
    > that 3+Ghz, and some batches perform better than others; Then are marked
    > accordingly. In other situations, the CPU wafer contains some chips that
    can
    > break the barrier and get well beyond specs. Intel can't test each and
    everyone.
    > Even more, sometimes Intel has to fill the market demand even though it
    could have
    > loads of 3Ghz ready P4.. It's marked and sold as P4 2.4, or 2.6 or 2.8 ...
    > I can't prove this for the current P4.. But this happened for older P3
    technology.
    >
    > Bottom line is that using such an ASUS board and tools; Knowing a bit
    about
    > the technology can make you feel safe about a slight overclocking that can
    > be easily monitored for a couple of days under stress. Then you decide if
    your
    > hardware integration is stable enough.
    >
    > I recommend that you take a peek at this article:
    > http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/mainboards/display/asus-p4p800_7.html
    > That's an eye opener for P4P800 / P4C800 interested dudes.
    > But it explains the PAT technology a little and tips.
    >
    > What's important is to enable MAM in the BIOS.
    > Then there is another setting that helps to gain RAM speed as well.
    > The options are AUTO, STANDARD, and TURBO.
    > Don't go TURBO.. STANDARD would be nice if it worked, but it's better
    > to set it AUTO (default), and go right in the next section to manually get
    > the CPU about 10% faster clock.. The first thing to check is if it posts
    and
    > boots. Then monitor the temparature; Then SANDRA bench and stability
    tests.
    > That's certainly easy for an experienced photographer.
    >
    > >I see that there is now a Sandra 2004 SP2a (9.131). I assume I should
    get
    > >that version if I decide to start fooling around with more sophisticated
    > >overclocking. Are you familiar with a benchmarking utility called PC
    > >Wizard? Does it do the same thing?
    > >
    > Not familiar with PC Wizard as I'm very cautious about shareware and
    freeware
    > around that could carry trojans or viris (not to implie PC Wizard is). I
    just know
    > for a fact how great SANDRA works and widely used and known from the
    community.
    > Available also from sites such as download dot com... I not an
    overclocking maniac either.
    > SANDRA is without nags, free to use in the basic version and excellent.
    >
    > I'm not a benchamrking freak anymore.. And you'll agree that with a P4C in
    the 3Ghz
    > range and 800+Mhz FSB, and a great HD capable of 45Mb/s STR on that
    motherboard;
    > I'm not worried, nor interested in downloading these 178MB video bench
    tools.
    > I read everything in tons of article to correlate the reviewers results.
    I'm satisfied.
    > SANDRA gives graphical performance curves as well; Then I use it mostly to
    determine
    > if it's working within specs before I try a little overclock.
    >
    > I would recommend SANDRA even blindfolded. :)
    >
    > >If it's not too complicated, can you tell me how to go about manually
    > >setting the overclocking in BIOS? (My RAM is Mushkin, PC3200 Blue,
    4x512MB
    > >DIMMS DDRAM -- total 2GB RAM.)
    > >
    > I did it above; Really... There is nothing else than getting all the AI
    boosting OFF,
    > and default.. Then get the CPU clock to 220Mhz 1:1 ratio means 8x to the
    FSB.
    > If your system is not stable at 220Mhz CPU.. Lower it to 210... It could
    be the video
    > that does not hold the 881Mhz speed... Better luck next time then... No
    big deal I agree.
    > But a 10% stable overclock, no hassle, for FREE is something great to use.
    > BTW; Vid card is Radeon 9800Pro (with DVI/TV out) here...Like a charm with
    stock
    > drivers on CD; All under win2KPro + Linux... Linux also runs with flying
    colors at this overclock
    > speed...Oh, don't forget to turn MAM ON !.. Although I don't know if PAT
    is working with four sticks.
    > SANDRA tests would tell.
    >
    > Running 2Gigs (4 sticks) is a bit trickier to get stable overclocked
    system (some specialist say).
    > But I don't think it's gonna matter much, Mushkin as an excellent brand.
    My ram is in theory
    > of lesser quality. but I use only two slots (blue) for a total of 1GB.
    >
    > If you take a little time to setup the 'geek' details now; You'll enjoy a
    better system for the years
    > to come... Running Sandra will show you if that 10% AI overclock cripples
    the bandwidth and if
    > my recommendation does better. If the overclock does not work; You'll
    still be able to 'TUNE'
    > your machine with SANDRA's precious infos, to perfection.. The heck with
    overclocking if it
    > does not work.. I agree this BOARd and current P4 and 800Mhz FSB
    technology rocks...
    >
    > P.S.. I also use CANON camera for my photos; SONY Digital8 firewire video
    on 8mm tapes,
    > and a truckload of video applications for DvD authoring. We do have lots
    in common John;
    > I'll be watching your posts in this forum for a while... Any questions;
    I'm here. !
    >
    > >Best,
    > >
    > >John
    >
    > No.. You the best :)
    > Art,
    >
    >
  9. Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.asus (More info?)

    >John Blaustein wrote in message ...
    >Art,
    >
    >Thanks for all the additional information!
    >
    >John
    >
    My pleasure,
    Art
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