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Asus PC-DL raid controller won't see parallel IDE drives

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Anonymous
a b V Motherboard
September 22, 2004 3:03:29 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.asus (More info?)

I am installing a Raid on my Asus PC-DL Mobo.
Everything is installing nicely except the Parallel ATA part of the
raid.
I must have installed the FastTrak 378 (tm) BIOS properly, as it
recognized the SATA drives and allowed me to create them into a
mirrored Raid.
I was even able to format them in win XP.
But the parallel ATA drives will not appear in the FastTrak 378
BIOS.
I have triple checked my drive connections and Bios settings on the
parallel ATAs and all seems to be the way it should be.
eg in the main Bios
1) OnChip Serial ATA is set to [Combined Mode]
3) Onboard Promise Controller is [Enabled]
2) Operating Mode (for the promise controller) is set to [Raid]

They are attached to the to the FastTrak 378 controller.
I confimred that they are working and properly master/slaved by
temporarily connecting them to the IDE chain 1 and saw them appear in
the boot list. But for some mysterious reason, the promise controller
will not see them.
Must I do something to get the parallel drives to be recognized by the
promise controller?

thanks

Thomas
Anonymous
a b V Motherboard
September 22, 2004 2:29:18 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.asus (More info?)

In article <4150eb81$1_1@alt.athenanews.com>, t@biomorphica-dot-com.no-
spam.invalid says...
> I am installing a Raid on my Asus PC-DL Mobo.
> Everything is installing nicely except the Parallel ATA part of the
> raid.
> I must have installed the FastTrak 378 (tm) BIOS properly, as it
> recognized the SATA drives and allowed me to create them into a
> mirrored Raid.

This is good, the Promise 378 only does SATA on this board.

> I was even able to format them in win XP.
> But the parallel ATA drives will not appear in the FastTrak 378
> BIOS.
> I have triple checked my drive connections and Bios settings on the
> parallel ATAs and all seems to be the way it should be.
> eg in the main Bios
> 1) OnChip Serial ATA is set to [Combined Mode]
> 3) Onboard Promise Controller is [Enabled]
> 2) Operating Mode (for the promise controller) is set to [Raid]

The Promise 378 only does 2 of the SATA connectors, it does not have
anything to do with IDE drives connected to the old style IDE
Connectors.

> They are attached to the to the FastTrak 378 controller.

Nope, the 378 only has 2 SATA connectors. The Intel SATA only has 2
connectors. The IDE drive connectors (old style) don't do onboard RAID.

> I confimred that they are working and properly master/slaved by
> temporarily connecting them to the IDE chain 1 and saw them appear in
> the boot list. But for some mysterious reason, the promise controller
> will not see them.
> Must I do something to get the parallel drives to be recognized by the
> promise controller

The Promise 378 only sees drives connected to it's two connectors
The Intel only sees drives connected to it's two connectors
The PATA IDE connectors are not seen by the 378 or the Intel.

--
--
spamfree999@rrohio.com
(Remove 999 to reply to me)
September 22, 2004 5:30:08 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.asus (More info?)

In article <4150eb81$1_1@alt.athenanews.com>,
t@biomorphica-dot-com.no-spam.invalid (biomorphic) wrote:

> I am installing a Raid on my Asus PC-DL Mobo.
> Everything is installing nicely except the Parallel ATA part of the
> raid.
> I must have installed the FastTrak 378 (tm) BIOS properly, as it
> recognized the SATA drives and allowed me to create them into a
> mirrored Raid.
> I was even able to format them in win XP.
> But the parallel ATA drives will not appear in the FastTrak 378
> BIOS.
> I have triple checked my drive connections and Bios settings on the
> parallel ATAs and all seems to be the way it should be.
> eg in the main Bios
> 1) OnChip Serial ATA is set to [Combined Mode]
> 3) Onboard Promise Controller is [Enabled]
> 2) Operating Mode (for the promise controller) is set to [Raid]
>
> They are attached to the to the FastTrak 378 controller.
> I confimred that they are working and properly master/slaved by
> temporarily connecting them to the IDE chain 1 and saw them appear in
> the boot list. But for some mysterious reason, the promise controller
> will not see them.
> Must I do something to get the parallel drives to be recognized by the
> promise controller?
>
> thanks
>
> Thomas

There is something strange about the BIOS.

The PC-DL is a 875 based board with PDC20378 controller on it.
The P4C800-E Deluxe is a 875 based board with PDC20378 controller on it.

The PC-DL has an Award BIOS.
The P4C800-E Deluxe uses an AMI BIOS.

The P4C800-E has a RAID ROM that says:

"FastTrak 378 (tm) BIOS Version 1.00.0.37
(c) 2003 Promise Technology, Inc. All rights reserved"

The PC-DL has a RAID ROM with file name SATA378.bin that says:

"SATA378 TX2plus(tm) BIOS Version 1.00.0.33
(c) 2002-2005 Promise Technology, Inc. All rights reserved"

Now, I could be very mistaken, but the TX2plus board from Promise
is a PATA/SATA controller without RAID on it. (That means the TX2plus
board from Promise uses the non-RAID 20378 BIOS.) Maybe if you use the
Promise ATA driver for 20378 instead of the RAID driver, you'll
pick up the two IDE drives ? (Note: That doesn't solve your failure
to RAID the two PATA drives, but it _might_ gain access to them
for vanilla PATA operation.)

In any case, I don't understand what the SATA378 module is doing
in the PC-DL BIOS. The manual states that RAID modes are supported.
Perhaps you can ask Asus tech support why the other module (FastTrak)
isn't there. I would hope that there is no difference in the object
format of included modules between Award and AMI, so that will not
be an excuse for using the SATA378 module.

HTH,
Paul
Related resources
Anonymous
a b V Motherboard
September 22, 2004 8:06:53 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.asus (More info?)

> The P4C800-E has a RAID ROM that says:
>
> "FastTrak 378 (tm) BIOS Version 1.00.0.37
> (c) 2003 Promise Technology, Inc. All rights reserved"
>
> The PC-DL has a RAID ROM with file name SATA378.bin that says:
>
> "SATA378 TX2plus(tm) BIOS Version 1.00.0.33
> (c) 2002-2005 Promise Technology, Inc. All rights reserved"

Actaully, my PC-DL Raid Rom says
"FastTrak 378 (tm) BIOS version 1.00.0.37"
(c) 2003 Promise Technology, Inc...
Scanning IDE drives..."
but it only finds teh SATA drives, not the PATA drives that
ARE attached to the fastTrak 378 RAID controller port (_NOT_ the
traditional IDE channels).




> Now, I could be very mistaken, but the TX2plus board from Promise
> is a PATA/SATA controller without RAID on it. (That means the
TX2plus
> board from Promise uses the non-RAID 20378 BIOS.) Maybe if you use
the Promise ATA driver for 20378 instead of the RAID driver, you'll
> pick up the two IDE drives ? (Note: That doesn't solve your failure
> to RAID the two PATA drives, but it _might_ gain access to them
> for vanilla PATA operation.)

first of all, how would I 'use the Promise ATA driver for 20378
instead of the RAID driver'?
Would I in the BIOS choose:
1) Onboard Promise Controller is [Disbled]
2) Operating Mode (for the promise controller) is set to [IDE]

or are you suggesting that I download the driver for the TX2plus and
install that?

secondly, you are right that this doesn't solve the RAID issue, cos
what I really need is for the Fastrak 378 RAID Adapter to see the
drives so I can merge both the SATA and the PATA drives into a single
0+1 raid in XP.
If I want plain vanilla IDE, I can simply hook them up to the
traditional IDE Channel 1. I am about to just do this out of
frustration, but the manual says the SATA and PATA (plugged into the
RAID adapter) is the ideal combo. It is maddeneing that their
instructions do not work.


> In any case, I don't understand what the SATA378 module is doing
> in the PC-DL BIOS. The manual states that RAID modes are supported.
> Perhaps you can ask Asus tech support why the other module
(FastTrak)
> isn't there.

There is no such thing that I can find online as ASUS tech support.
I went to their site and went to a page titled 'how to get support'
http://www.asus.com/support/english/techref/getsupport/...
They told me to look on their FAQ and Knwledge base (which SUX!!) or
else:
' we will strongly suggest you to contact any authorized ASUS dealer
or ASUS Royal Club member to serve you in a professional manner.'
I ordered my board online so that nullifies my Royal Club membership.
LOL!



> I would hope that there is no difference in the object
> format of included modules between Award and AMI, so that will not
> be an excuse for using the SATA378 module.

My PC-DL is indeed using Award Bios. I don't see how I can benefit
from the AMI bios settings or the driver 'to use the Promise ATA
driver for 20378 instead of the RAID driver'. I still don't quite
get what you mean by 'using the SATA378 module'. I am trying to use
it. I am plugged into it. I have enabled it in the bios. what else
can i possibly do to make it work like it is supposed to?

thanks for your suggestions.

Thomas
September 22, 2004 10:43:47 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.asus (More info?)

In article <4151db5d$1_4@alt.athenanews.com>,
t@biomorphica-dot-com.no-spam.invalid (biomorphic) wrote:

> > The P4C800-E has a RAID ROM that says:
> >
> > "FastTrak 378 (tm) BIOS Version 1.00.0.37
> > (c) 2003 Promise Technology, Inc. All rights reserved"
> >
> > The PC-DL has a RAID ROM with file name SATA378.bin that says:
> >
> > "SATA378 TX2plus(tm) BIOS Version 1.00.0.33
> > (c) 2002-2005 Promise Technology, Inc. All rights reserved"
>
> Actaully, my PC-DL Raid Rom says
> "FastTrak 378 (tm) BIOS version 1.00.0.37"
> (c) 2003 Promise Technology, Inc...
> Scanning IDE drives..."
> but it only finds teh SATA drives, not the PATA drives that
> ARE attached to the fastTrak 378 RAID controller port (_NOT_ the
> traditional IDE channels).
>
> > Now, I could be very mistaken, but the TX2plus board from Promise
> > is a PATA/SATA controller without RAID on it. (That means the
> > TX2plus board from Promise uses the non-RAID 20378 BIOS.) Maybe
> > if you use the Promise ATA driver for 20378 instead of the RAID
> > driver, you'll pick up the two IDE drives ? (Note: That doesn't
> > solve your failure to RAID the two PATA drives, but it _might_
> > gain access to them for vanilla PATA operation.)
>
> first of all, how would I 'use the Promise ATA driver for 20378
> instead of the RAID driver'?
> Would I in the BIOS choose:
> 1) Onboard Promise Controller is [Disbled]
> 2) Operating Mode (for the promise controller) is set to [IDE]
>
> or are you suggesting that I download the driver for the TX2plus and
> install that?
>
> secondly, you are right that this doesn't solve the RAID issue, cos
> what I really need is for the Fastrak 378 RAID Adapter to see the
> drives so I can merge both the SATA and the PATA drives into a single
> 0+1 raid in XP.
> If I want plain vanilla IDE, I can simply hook them up to the
> traditional IDE Channel 1. I am about to just do this out of
> frustration, but the manual says the SATA and PATA (plugged into the
> RAID adapter) is the ideal combo. It is maddeneing that their
> instructions do not work.
>
>
> > In any case, I don't understand what the SATA378 module is doing
> > in the PC-DL BIOS. The manual states that RAID modes are supported.
> > Perhaps you can ask Asus tech support why the other module
> > (FastTrak) isn't there.
>
> There is no such thing that I can find online as ASUS tech support.
> I went to their site and went to a page titled 'how to get support'
> http://www.asus.com/support/english/techref/getsupport/...
> They told me to look on their FAQ and Knwledge base (which SUX!!) or
> else:
> ' we will strongly suggest you to contact any authorized ASUS dealer
> or ASUS Royal Club member to serve you in a professional manner.'
> I ordered my board online so that nullifies my Royal Club membership.
> LOL!
>
> > I would hope that there is no difference in the object
> > format of included modules between Award and AMI, so that will not
> > be an excuse for using the SATA378 module.
>
> My PC-DL is indeed using Award Bios. I don't see how I can benefit
> from the AMI bios settings or the driver 'to use the Promise ATA
> driver for 20378 instead of the RAID driver'. I still don't quite
> get what you mean by 'using the SATA378 module'. I am trying to use
> it. I am plugged into it. I have enabled it in the bios. what else
> can i possibly do to make it work like it is supposed to?
>
> thanks for your suggestions.
>
> Thomas

I started with Leythos comment, that the PC-DL would not work with
the Promise IDE connector. The manual states basically the same
info for the Promise PDC20378 that it does for the P4C800-E Deluxe.
And, as far as I'm concerned, the manual that comes with the product
is your contract - if a feature is stated in the manual, then Asus
has to deliver on their end of the bargain.

So, I was looking for a root cause as to why the 378 IDE port is dead.
Leythos owns enough of these motherboards to state a fact with
authority. I tried to extract the BIOS module from each of the
two boards, the PC-DL and P4C800-E Deluxe, to see how they differ.
The reason I do this, is I've found a couple of other boards, where
a problem with the way the BIOS is assembled, was the source of a
poster's problems.

Now, I find it strange that you are getting a Fasttrak message on
the screen, when the SATA378 module in the PC-DL doesn't have that
text string inside it ? I didn't disassemble all the different
versions of the BIOS, so maybe you are using a version of the BIOS
that has the Fasttrak BIOS module in it ?

The download page for the P4C800-E has two drivers for the 20378.
It has an ATA driver and it has a RAID driver. I would expect
putting the 20378 in IDE mode, then installing the ATA driver,
would do the trick. But, since I haven't even touched the
Promise 20378 on my P4C800-E, I cannot say what combo of motherboard
setting and driver, installs and/or works.

So, what we do agree on, is your Promise IDE port doesn't work.
The Asus tech support is available as a toll phone call (you
pay the bill), so you can go that route. If tech support is
busy, they will do call-backs. They will take your number and
give you a call when they get to your entry in the queue.
Filling out the web page with the trouble ticket info, speeds
up the call, so you shouldn't have to answer as many fool
questions.

Here are the components and possible problem areas:

1) Promise chip will have config pins on it. If the config pin
is wired to a logic level that declares the chip as having
only SATA ports or only running in ATA mode and not RAID
mode, then the config pin will cause the enumeration inside
the chip to declare the chip differently to the software.
That is how the driver installer knows whether it should work
or not - the enumeration does that.
2) If the Promise chip is sitting on a PCI card, there is a flash
memory sitting next to it. The flash memory contains a code
module that loads during POST. The code either contains
a RAID setup program, or ATA program code. In both cases, the
code will support INT13. The INT13 service in that code, is
how the BIOS can boot from the device. If the code is disabled,
then you cannot boot from the device, but you can still use
the disks in data-only mode when the OS is booted. As in (1),
if the chip is strapped via a config pin, to only do a particular
function, then only a certain driver type will install in the OS.
3) When the OS is finally running, the call after the last INT13
read/write operation, will require a Windows driver. If the right
driver is installed, and it matches the enumeration and device
type, then, voila, you get a disk or disks appearing in
Disk Management, ready for formatting.

Your problem could be type (1) - chip is strapped such that
portions of the chip will never work. Or it could be (2), the
a code module of the right type is not included inside the Asus
BIOS - the Asus BIOS in the flash chip is a tiny file system,
and currently there are 14 files inside it, one of which I see
is SATA378.bin. If you have installed the Windows RAID driver
and utilities for the 20378, and you still cannot see
anything on the IDE port, then again, that points to (1).
I don't understand why Asus would do this, when every other
board that uses the 20378 supports full chip operation.
I cannot see a reason why a dual processor board would prevent
this chip from working, as a P4C800-E with a HyperThreaded
processor running WinXP Pro would also look like a dual processor
to any software.

HTH,
Paul
Anonymous
a b V Motherboard
September 23, 2004 2:04:07 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.asus (More info?)

Simply put, I am just trying to do what the PC-DL manual says is
possible, and that is to make a 0+1 RAID USING 4 IDE drives, 2 SATAs
(attached to the onboard SATA chan 0 and 1) AND the PATAs attached
to the FastTrak IDE RAID controller (the blue IDE port that sticks
out of the sid of the motherboard). The manual says this is not only
possible, but describes (in fair detail) how to set this up. My
problem of course is that the FastTrak IDE RAID controller does not
recgnize my drives. I know my drives and cables are fine, cos when I
put them on the traditional IDE port, they are recognized and
displayed in the boot. Also, I am not interested in booting from this
Raid, only in using it as a secondary drive.

> Quote Leythos:
> The Promise 378 only does 2 of the SATA connectors, it does not have
anything to do with IDE drives connected to the old style IDE
Connectors.
>
> Quote biomorphic:
> They are attached to the to the FastTrak 378 controller.
>
> Quote Leythos:
> Nope, the 378 only has 2 SATA connectors. The Intel SATA only has 2

> connectors. The IDE drive connectors (old style) don't do onboard
RAID.
>
> Quote biomorphic:
> I confimred that they are working and properly master/slaved by
> temporarily connecting them to the IDE chain 1 and saw them appear
in
> the boot list. But for some mysterious reason, the promise
controller
> will not see them.
> Must I do something to get the parallel drives to be recognized by
the
> promise controller
>
> Quote Leythos:
> The Promise 378 only sees drives connected to it's two connectors
> The Intel only sees drives connected to it's two connectors
> The PATA IDE connectors are not seen by the 378 or the Intel.

So just to be clear, you are saying that the Promise 378 controller
controls ONLY 2 of the SATA channels AND the PATA IDE RAID controller
(which is the blue IDE port sticking out sideways off the
motherboard).
The fastTrak start guide indicates this:
"These 3 channels (it might be channel 3, 4, 5 on MB) that PDC20378
support only connect HDD. "

We are assuming that the IDE RAID controller is dead on this board,
although that does seem absurd to me that they would make a special
port and not support it.

This board has 4 SATA ports. Can all 4 be used in a RAID
configuration? I was lead to believe (by a friend who has the same
moboard) that the best RAID config was to use 2 SATAs and 2 PATAs. I
am just trying to get to the bottom of what RAID drive config will
work. I am still hoping that the PATA IDE RAID controller will work
as advertized. In fact I have just sent in an inquiry to Asus on the
matter. I WILL keep you posted.

Quote Paul:
> Now, I find it strange that you are getting a Fasttrak message on
> the screen, when the SATA378 module in the PC-DL doesn't have that
> text string inside it ? I didn't disassemble all the different
> versions of the BIOS, so maybe you are using a version of the BIOS
> that has the Fasttrak BIOS module in it ?

I just updated to bios v 1006. It worked, and it added a line in the
bios (voice control in the POST messages) but it did not solve my
problems. I can only report that the RAID bios read the bios read
"FastTrak 378 (tm) BIOS version 1.00.0.37"

Quote Paul:
> The download page for the P4C800-E has two drivers for the 20378.
> It has an ATA driver and it has a RAID driver. I would expect
> putting the 20378 in IDE mode, then installing the ATA driver,
> would do the trick.

do what trick? Do you mean make them appear as vanilla IDE drives? The
trick I am after is to get the Fastrak 378 Raid Controller to see
themso I can make a 4 drive 0+1 RAID. If I want vanilla IDE, I can
connect them to the trad IDE channel or put the 20378 in IDE mode (in
the bios).

Quote Leythos:
> are you trying to combine your Promise SATA drives in RAID
> mode with the normal IDE (non-sata) drives on the standard IDE
> controller?

No, I am NOT trying to do that. I am trying to do simply what the
manual says I should do, use 2 PATA drives connected to the 20378
Parallel IDE RAID controller and 2 SATA drives connected to the PATA
chan 0 and 1.

Quote Paul:
> If you have installed the Windows RAID driver
> and utilities for the 20378, and you still cannot see
> anything on the IDE port, then again, that points to (1).

I did indeed install the Raid controller in WInXP. but, not sure if I
did install the Promise PDC20378 ATA Driver
So I reinstalled those drivers in WinXP from the CD. No joy.
Excellent detailed info on the the inner workings of the controller
chip btw!

Quote Leythos:
> If you need to do R5, then purchase a R5 controller card - the
Promise
> SX6000 IDE (not SATA) controller card will do 6 IDE drives

great idea. If I cannot get this to work, i may indeed go that route.

How completely annoying tho, that this RAID will not work as
advertized. As I mentioned earlier, I did put in an inquiry to ASUS
and hope I can get a solutions from them.

thanks for all your detailed analysis.

Thomas
Anonymous
a b V Motherboard
September 23, 2004 3:28:44 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.asus (More info?)

I just thought of something I might have missed in this thread -

To the OP - are you trying to combine your Promise SATA drives in RAID
mode with the normal IDE (non-sata) drives on the standard IDE
controller?

I've never tried it, can't imagine anyone really wanting to do something
as hokey as that, and it's quite possible that your entire RAID array
will be useless in the even of a fault.

This would be akin to someone attaching 3 drives on Channel 1 of a RAID
controller card, then 3 drives on channel 2 of the same RAID controller
card, and then building a 6 drive RAID 5 array. If any channel fails
(and I've seen it happen) then the entire array is useless.

If you need to do R5, then purchase a R5 controller card - the Promise
SX6000 IDE (not SATA) controller card will do 6 IDE drives, and works
perfectly - you can not use the Promise SX-6000 RAID card and the
onboard Promise SATA RAID controller at the same time - the drivers
conflict with each other.

--
--
spamfree999@rrohio.com
(Remove 999 to reply to me)
September 23, 2004 3:29:36 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.asus (More info?)

In article <41522f17$1_3@alt.athenanews.com>,
t@biomorphica-dot-com.no-spam.invalid (biomorphic) wrote:

> Quote Paul:
> > The download page for the P4C800-E has two drivers for the 20378.
> > It has an ATA driver and it has a RAID driver. I would expect
> > putting the 20378 in IDE mode, then installing the ATA driver,
> > would do the trick.
>
> do what trick? Do you mean make them appear as vanilla IDE drives? The
> trick I am after is to get the Fastrak 378 Raid Controller to see
> themso I can make a 4 drive 0+1 RAID. If I want vanilla IDE, I can
> connect them to the trad IDE channel or put the 20378 in IDE mode (in
> the bios).

The idea would be, if you set the 20378 up as an IDE controller,
and used the ATA driver, and you get the PATA interface on the
20378 to work, that proves the hardware works. I wasn't proposing
leaving it that way permanently.

In terms of constructing RAIDs, the best performing way to
set up the Promise, is to RAID a PATA with a SATA for your
first array, and another PATA with a SATA for your second
array. If you RAID a PATA with a PATA, the two PATA drives
contend for the cable, and some performance is lost. Someone
measured the 2 PATA array, and it was 20-30% slower.

If you don't have any data on the two SATA array, try this.
First, break the array (this should erase config info
from the two drives, in the hidden sector). Then, connect
one SATA drive and one PATA drive to the Promise, and see
if the RAID BIOS detects both of them. This isn't likely to
work any better than your other experiments, but while you
are waiting for an answer from Asus, it will give you something
to try.

HTH,
Paul
!