frank

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Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.asus (More info?)

A frined of mine has an old system he wants to upgrade.

Now my question is:

He got the following in mind

Asus A8V
AMD 64 3000+
512 MB
Cooler
1 hdd old
cd burner old
dvd player old
3 pci cards old
Geforce 3 Asus V8200 64 MB old

My question is: Is his old power source with 300w going to handle this or
will he need a new one?
I do not care about performance. i simply want to know wether we need a 350
Watt psu or stick with the old one.

Thanks
Frank
 
G

Guest

Guest
Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.asus (More info?)

Frank wrote:
> A frined of mine has an old system he wants to upgrade.
>
> Now my question is:
>
> He got the following in mind
>
> Asus A8V
> AMD 64 3000+
> 512 MB
> Cooler
> 1 hdd old
> cd burner old
> dvd player old
> 3 pci cards old
> Geforce 3 Asus V8200 64 MB old
>
> My question is: Is his old power source with 300w going to handle this or
> will he need a new one?
> I do not care about performance. i simply want to know wether we need a 350
> Watt psu or stick with the old one.
>
> Thanks
> Frank
>

It depends on the quality of the original PSU, but I wouldn't
really care to try to scrape by with only a 300 W PSU even
from a reputable brand.

I have built a few Athlon64 systems configured typically with:
Athlon 64 3200+
1 GB PC 3200 (2 x 512 MB)
12X DVD burner
2 x 120 GB SATA hard drive
Radeon 9600
that have done just fine with a 350 W PSU from PCPowerCooling.

The same systems fail with el-cheapo brand 400 W or 450 W PSUs
from the local shops.

However, even the PCPowerCooling 350 W PSU leaves little margin
for expansion in a system like that. For example I later expanded
the RAM in one of the systems from to 6 GB (2 x 2 GB, 2 x 1 GB)
and also had to upgrade the PSU to provide the additional 40 to 50 W
that the RAM upgrade needed.
 
G

Guest

Guest
Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.asus (More info?)

As an electrical engineer of some 15 years, my adage is don't run things at
peak output and expect performance 24/7. Better to under run a PSU than try
and over run a cheap 'un.....My 2p

Kap

"Frank" <schmidt@bth.de> wrote in message
news:41b33039$0$23153$9b622d9e@news.freenet.de...
>A frined of mine has an old system he wants to upgrade.
>
> Now my question is:
>
> He got the following in mind
>
> Asus A8V
> AMD 64 3000+
> 512 MB
> Cooler
> 1 hdd old
> cd burner old
> dvd player old
> 3 pci cards old
> Geforce 3 Asus V8200 64 MB old
>
> My question is: Is his old power source with 300w going to handle this or
> will he need a new one?
> I do not care about performance. i simply want to know wether we need a
> 350 Watt psu or stick with the old one.
>
> Thanks
> Frank
>
 

Paul

Splendid
Mar 30, 2004
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Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.asus (More info?)

In article <41b33039$0$23153$9b622d9e@news.freenet.de>, "Frank"
<schmidt@bth.de> wrote:

> A frined of mine has an old system he wants to upgrade.
>
> Now my question is:
>
> He got the following in mind
>
> Asus A8V
> AMD 64 3000+
> 512 MB
> Cooler
> 1 hdd old
> cd burner old
> dvd player old
> 3 pci cards old
> Geforce 3 Asus V8200 64 MB old
>
> My question is: Is his old power source with 300w going to handle this or
> will he need a new one?
> I do not care about performance. i simply want to know wether we need a 350
> Watt psu or stick with the old one.
>
> Thanks
> Frank

I cannot work out the exact power for you, but offer these two
systems for comparison. These numbers are measured by a DC clamp-on
current meter, using a meter similar to the one used on Tomshardware.

***********
P4C800-E, 2.8C, 2x512MB, 1 disk drive, 1 CDROM, ATI 9800 Pro video
Running Prime95. Dimms in dual channel config.

CPU+12 Mobo+3.3V Mobo+5V Mobo+12V (fans) AuxVideo+5 AuxVideo+12
5.55A 11.6A 0.55A 0.43A 3.13A 0.15A

P4C800, 2.8C, 4x512MB, 1 disk drive, 1 CDROM, ATI 9800 Pro video
Running Prime95. Dimms in dual channel config.

CPU+12 Mobo+3.3V Mobo+5V Mobo+12V (fans) AuxVideo+5 AuxVideo+12
5.55A 14.0A 0.57A 0.43A 3.13A 0.15A
***********
A7N8X-E, Barton 200x12, 2x512MB, 1 disk drive, 1 CDROM, ATI 9800 Pro
running Prime95. Dimms in dual channel config.

CPU+12 Mobo+3.3V Mobo+5V Mobo+12V (fans) AuxVideo+5 AuxVideo+12
---- 5.2A 16.6A 0.53A 3.13A 0.15A
***********
When running a graphics application ---- AuxVideo+5 AuxVideo+12
on the ATI 9800 Pro 5.5A 0.9A

There is additional power on the ATI9800, but it flows through
the AGP socket and that power is included in the measured
motherboard power. That AGP socket power will be similar to the
Geforce3 drawing power through the AGP socket, and that is
why the Geforce3 doesn't need a separate entry.

The first two P4C800-E measurements, are intended to show that
two additional DIMMs adds 2.4A*3.3V = 8 watts.

Your board will resemble the P4C800-E, as the A8V draws power
from +12V for the processor. To use the info above, you add
the currents together. Here, I assume the CPU is 100% busy, and
the video card is used for gaming. This is a pessimistic assumption,
as when you game, the CPU cannot run quite as fast, as it is
waiting for the video card. In any case:

+3.3V +5V +12V
11.6A 0.55A 0.43A ATX20 pin connector
5.55A ATX12V connector (P4 2.8C proc)
5.5A 0.90A Video card aux power (ATI9800pro)
-----------------------
Total 11.6A 6.05A 6.88A Gamer, 1 HD, 1CD system
1.0A 0.5A (Per additional idling storage device)

Since your board doesn't have an aux video power connector for
the Geforce3, you can scratch that entry.

Operating power for your processor is here. Most of the devices
listed here are 89 watts. Are you sure your processor is a 3000+
S939 processor ?

http://www.amd.com/us-en/assets/content_type/white_papers_and_tech_docs/30430.pdf

To figure out the power, the 89 watts flows through the Vcore
converter, and the converter is 90% efficient or so. Computing
the current gives:

(89W/12V) * (1.0/0.90) = 8.24A from ATX12V connector

Reworking the numbers:

+3.3V +5V +12V
11.6A 0.55A 0.43A ATX20 pin connector (mobo pwr)
8.24A ATX12V connector (Athlon64)
---- ----- Video card aux power (Geforce3)
1.0A 0.5A (for the one addition drive)

Total 11.6A 1.55A 9.17A A8V estimate

Computing total output power 3.3*11.6+5*1.55+12*9.17 = 156W

Missing from the calculation, is the disk drive draws 2A from
+12V while the spindle is accelerating, than drops back to 0.5A
once the spindle is at operating speed. At this point in time,
the BIOS is running, and I've measured processor current while in
the BIOS, and the processor runs at about half power. Thus, the
reduced processor current leaves room for hard drive spinup
current. That is why I haven't bothered to add yet more current
at spinup.

To shop for a supply, check the label on the PSU for the three
DC output currents. Usually, the +3.3V and +5V currents are so
large compared to the numbers above, it is hardly worth looking
at those numbers. Your +12V can be handled (barely) by a 10A
output supply, but I would recommend a 12V@15A supply for some
degree of comfort.

Note that, if you are contemplating a video card upgrade, video
card practices can vary. My 9800 Pro happens to draw most of its
current from +5V, but there is nothing to stop a more modern
card from using +12V instead. That is why, you should visit
Xbitlabs, for some of their power measurements:

http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/ati-vs-nv-power_2.html
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/ati-powercons.html

Xbitlabs has measured other cards, but the results are in
separate articles.

That is the limit of what you can achieve by "playing by the
rules". It is really difficult to rate power supply reliability,
and no matter what is printed on the label, there is still
nothing to stop a supply from failing six months from now.
Run the brand name of the supply and the word "failed" or
"burned" through Google, to get some idea of how bad a
given brand happens to be. The only brand with an absolutely
clean record is PCpowerandcooling, because no one can
afford to buy them :)

There is a correlation between the physical weight of the
power supply and its quality. If the old supply is pretty
heavy, it might be worth using.

HTH,
Paul
 

peter

Distinguished
Mar 29, 2004
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0
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Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.asus (More info?)

try this
http://takaman.jp/D/?english
peter
"Frank" <schmidt@bth.de> wrote in message
news:41b33039$0$23153$9b622d9e@news.freenet.de...
>A frined of mine has an old system he wants to upgrade.
>
> Now my question is:
>
> He got the following in mind
>
> Asus A8V
> AMD 64 3000+
> 512 MB
> Cooler
> 1 hdd old
> cd burner old
> dvd player old
> 3 pci cards old
> Geforce 3 Asus V8200 64 MB old
>
> My question is: Is his old power source with 300w going to handle this or will
> he need a new one?
> I do not care about performance. i simply want to know wether we need a 350
> Watt psu or stick with the old one.
>
> Thanks
> Frank
>
 
G

Guest

Guest
Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.asus (More info?)

Frank wrote:
> A frined of mine has an old system he wants to upgrade.
>
> Now my question is:
>
> He got the following in mind
>
> Asus A8V
> AMD 64 3000+
> 512 MB
> Cooler
> 1 hdd old
> cd burner old
> dvd player old
> 3 pci cards old
> Geforce 3 Asus V8200 64 MB old
>
> My question is: Is his old power source with 300w going to handle
this or
> will he need a new one?
> I do not care about performance. i simply want to know wether we need
a 350
> Watt psu or stick with the old one.
>
> Thanks
> Frank

A 300W supply could be marginal and I agree with the other postings
about the danger in running a supply near its maximum values. One
additional word of caution. Disk drives, floppies, cd's all have motors
and motors require more current when they are spinning up than when
they are running at normal speed. So, if you are doing a power budget
calculation, be sure to take that into account. Personally, with power
supplies so inexpensive these days, I'd just buy a 400 Watt Antec and
be done with it.

arnie
 
G

Guest

Guest
Archived from groups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.asus (More info?)

use this.. http://www.jscustompcs.com/power_supply/
<aberger@u.washington.edu> wrote in message
news:1103070717.553148.136630@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
>
> Frank wrote:
>> A frined of mine has an old system he wants to upgrade.
>>
>> Now my question is:
>>
>> He got the following in mind
>>
>> Asus A8V
>> AMD 64 3000+
>> 512 MB
>> Cooler
>> 1 hdd old
>> cd burner old
>> dvd player old
>> 3 pci cards old
>> Geforce 3 Asus V8200 64 MB old
>>
>> My question is: Is his old power source with 300w going to handle
> this or
>> will he need a new one?
>> I do not care about performance. i simply want to know wether we need
> a 350
>> Watt psu or stick with the old one.
>>
>> Thanks
>> Frank
>
> A 300W supply could be marginal and I agree with the other postings
> about the danger in running a supply near its maximum values. One
> additional word of caution. Disk drives, floppies, cd's all have motors
> and motors require more current when they are spinning up than when
> they are running at normal speed. So, if you are doing a power budget
> calculation, be sure to take that into account. Personally, with power
> supplies so inexpensive these days, I'd just buy a 400 Watt Antec and
> be done with it.
>
> arnie
>