speed of sata through pci card?

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I have an AN35N ultra. I need to add a HD. My choices seem to be:
ATA100 (another Seagate)
ATA133 (something) (there seem to be fewer of these - mostly Maxtor)
SATA drive connected to a pci adapter card.

My question is: since the sata is connected to a pci card, and I believe
the pci only runs at 66, it seems as though the sata would at best do 66.
Yes? So it would be slower than an ATA100 EIDE, yes?

(It will probably be a year or so before I upgrade the mobo to one with
sata ports)

thoughts?
tia!!
Kristi
--
Shuttle AN35N Ultra, XP2600Bart, 512mb, GeF4Ti4200, WinXP Pro SP2

 

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Kristi wrote:

> My question is: since the sata is connected to a pci card, and I believe
> the pci only runs at 66, it seems as though the sata would at best do 66.
> Yes? So it would be slower than an ATA100 EIDE, yes?

66? Mine runs at 33! 32 bits, though, which is four bytes. Theoretical
maximum is 130 some MB/s, but closer to 110 or 112 in real life, I heard.
In my book, ATA100 is plenty close for that occasional buffer burst.

SATA cards are pretty expensive-- $40, I think. I don't see any
advantage to SATA on that board, unless you were getting a Raptor.

If you don't have anywhere to plug your new drive, you can get an oem
Promise TX2 (ATA100) for about $27 shipped (cnetpc.com, Newegg).
I've seen them go for less than $20 shipped on eBay. My retail
WD1600JB came with a TX2, but I don't think the new FDB ones do.

 

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On Fri, 27 Aug 2004 23:29:46 GMT, Kristi <a@b.net> wrote:

>My question is: since the sata is connected to a pci card, and I believe
>the pci only runs at 66, it seems as though the sata would at best do 66.
>Yes? So it would be slower than an ATA100 EIDE, yes?
>
>(It will probably be a year or so before I upgrade the mobo to one with
>sata ports)

PCI is 133 MB/sek, but this is shared between the PCI-devices. But in
general, with a standard setup (no RAID, and not any other extremly
demanding PCI-deviced) there will not really be a performancehit if
you use a PCI Serial ATA-card compared to have a integrated Serial
ATA-controler in the chipset.

For normal use, the throughput for the harddrive ain't too many
MBytes/sec. Even on the fastes part of the drive (the start) and a
sequencial read, the max. for new drives are often not more than 60
MB/sek -- but this is not really with real usage.

Take a look at this image:
http://www.pconline.com.cn/pchardware/tpylab/storage/0401/pic/040115_7k250_hdtach_lg.png

As you can see the max for this drive, which is one of the fastest on
the market, is about 60 MB/sek in the start -- the average is down to
about 50 MB/sek.




--
Clas Mehus
--------------------------------------------------
Dataguiden : http://www.pcworld.no/dataguiden/
--------------------------------------------------
"Den som har flest prylar när han dör vinner..."

 

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Clas Mehus wrote:
> On Fri, 27 Aug 2004 23:29:46 GMT, Kristi <a@b.net> wrote:
>
>>My question is: since the sata is connected to a pci card, and I believe
>>the pci only runs at 66, it seems as though the sata would at best do 66.
>>Yes? So it would be slower than an ATA100 EIDE, yes?
>>
>>(It will probably be a year or so before I upgrade the mobo to one with
>>sata ports)
>
> PCI is 133 MB/sek, but this is shared between the PCI-devices. But in
> general, with a standard setup (no RAID, and not any other extremly
> demanding PCI-deviced) there will not really be a performancehit if
> you use a PCI Serial ATA-card compared to have a integrated Serial
> ATA-controler in the chipset.
>
> For normal use, the throughput for the harddrive ain't too many
> MBytes/sec. Even on the fastes part of the drive (the start) and a
> sequencial read, the max. for new drives are often not more than 60
> MB/sek -- but this is not really with real usage.
>
> Take a look at this image:
> http://www.pconline.com.cn/pchardware/tpylab/storage/0401/pic/040115_7k250_hdtach_lg.png
>
> As you can see the max for this drive, which is one of the fastest on
> the market, is about 60 MB/sek in the start -- the average is down to
> about 50 MB/sek.

Thanks!

I have a Seagate 40GB and a Maxtor 20GB - both 7200rpm and ATA100. HDtach3
says:
Seagate 40mbs down to about 25mbs with 59 burst
Maxtor 30mbs down to 20mbs with burst 35.2

So it looks like going with a SATA pci card and SATA drive would
dramatically increase the burst speed and possibly somewhat increase the
Sequential read speed. Whereas getting an ATA100 or ATA133 would result
in about the same performance I now have. Yes?

tia
Kristi
--
Shuttle AN35N Ultra, XP2600Bart, 512mb, GeF4Ti4200, WinXP Pro SP2

 

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Fishface wrote:
> Kristi wrote:
>
>> My question is: since the sata is connected to a pci card, and I believe
>> the pci only runs at 66, it seems as though the sata would at best do 66.
>> Yes? So it would be slower than an ATA100 EIDE, yes?
>
> 66? Mine runs at 33! 32 bits, though, which is four bytes. Theoretical
> maximum is 130 some MB/s, but closer to 110 or 112 in real life, I heard.
> In my book, ATA100 is plenty close for that occasional buffer burst.
>
> SATA cards are pretty expensive-- $40, I think. I don't see any
> advantage to SATA on that board, unless you were getting a Raptor.
>
> If you don't have anywhere to plug your new drive, you can get an oem
> Promise TX2 (ATA100) for about $27 shipped (cnetpc.com, Newegg).
> I've seen them go for less than $20 shipped on eBay. My retail
> WD1600JB came with a TX2, but I don't think the new FDB ones do.

Yes, I think that is right - 33mhz x 4bytes = 132mBs

SATA card cost - I just looked at newegg and found a LinkDepot for $22+$4
(good manual, but devoted mostly to RAID which I have no use for) it has a
silicon image chipset which I think might be good. There is a Kingwin for
19+5 that also looks very interesting and comes with good instructions.
I have had such bad experience with Promise and its drivers that I will
avoid them and look for something that will allow me to boot from an
attached sata drive.

It appears that while a sata pci plus a sata drive won't increase average
mBs, it will greatly increase burst rate...

Raptor... now that's an idea - but too expensive and I had bad luck with
WD and such good luck with Seagate. Maxtor is good, too, but Seagate is
faster...
Kristi
--
Shuttle AN35N Ultra, XP2600Bart, 512mb, GeF4Ti4200, WinXP Pro SP2

 

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Kristi wrote:

> SATA card cost - I just looked at newegg and found a LinkDepot for $22+$4
> (good manual, but devoted mostly to RAID which I have no use for) it has a
> silicon image chipset which I think might be good. There is a Kingwin for
> 19+5 that also looks very interesting and comes with good instructions.

They've come down since last I looked!

> I have had such bad experience with Promise and its drivers that I will
> avoid them and look for something that will allow me to boot from an
> attached sata drive.

Had no problem with my TX2, but downloaded the latest drivers and firmware
before using...

> It appears that while a sata pci plus a sata drive won't increase average
> mBs, it will greatly increase burst rate...

I hadn't heard that about the burst rate. I see some new Maxtors have 16MB
buffers...

> Raptor... now that's an idea - but too expensive and I had bad luck with
> WD and such good luck with Seagate. Maxtor is good, too, but Seagate is
> faster...

I RMA'd my noisy WD 160GB and it was painlessly replaced in a week. They
did get some points for that!

 

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Fishface wrote:
> Kristi wrote:
>
>> SATA card cost - I just looked at newegg and found a LinkDepot for $22+$4
>> (good manual, but devoted mostly to RAID which I have no use for) it has a
>> silicon image chipset which I think might be good. There is a Kingwin for
>> 19+5 that also looks very interesting and comes with good instructions.
>
> They've come down since last I looked!

)))

>
>> I have had such bad experience with Promise and its drivers that I will
>> avoid them and look for something that will allow me to boot from an
>> attached sata drive.
>
> Had no problem with my TX2, but downloaded the latest drivers and firmware
> before using...

good to hear, but I'll pass...

>
>> It appears that while a sata pci plus a sata drive won't increase average
>> mBs, it will greatly increase burst rate...
>
> I hadn't heard that about the burst rate. I see some new Maxtors have 16MB
> buffers...

the cheapest one newegg has is $243. If the low end Maxtors had 8mb that
would be a possibility. Right now the best for me seems to be a seagate
with 8mb, 80gb, for $73+1 (why is newegg doing this silly stuff with their
shipping rates???) But I will wait a bit before I go for it.

>
>> Raptor... now that's an idea - but too expensive and I had bad luck with
>> WD and such good luck with Seagate. Maxtor is good, too, but Seagate is
>> faster...
>
> I RMA'd my noisy WD 160GB and it was painlessly replaced in a week. They
> did get some points for that!

Great to hear - I know they sell a lot of HDs and they really should give
great cust support. I soured on them back several years ago when they
wouldn't support a HD on XP. Maxtor, on the other hand was quickly
swapping bad drives.
Kristi