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So what if thermal compound spreads?

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April 11, 2004 4:53:37 AM

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What exactly is the problem if too much cpu compound is put on the
core and it gets squashed out onto the surrounding area?

Apart from looking messy, is there any real problem with this?
Anonymous
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April 11, 2004 4:53:38 AM

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CrackerJack wrote:

> What exactly is the problem if too much cpu compound is put on the
> core and it gets squashed out onto the surrounding area?
>
> Apart from looking messy, is there any real problem with this?


If you put on so much that the compound squashes out past the edges,
that's too much. It generally won't do any damage, but will be nowhere
near as efficient as if you had used less.


-WD
April 11, 2004 4:53:38 AM

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Depends, depends on how much and the CPU. On the Intel, much less of a
problem (as long as it's not creeping around on to the underside!). On the
AMD, much more problematic. The AMD core is *exposed*, and thus there are
various "bridges" that surround it. The last thing you want to do is
"short" one of those bridges because you got to sloppy w/ the thermal paste!

But having too much paste indicates another problem. The paste is ONLY
there to fill the microscopic imperfections between the mating surfaces. If
those surfaces were perfect, you wouldn't even need the paste, in fact, it
would *hinder* heat transfer. If you have so much paste on the mating
surfaces that installation causes much of it to squeeze out, it indicates
you have too much paste! Think of it this way, if we could use the paste to
fill ONLY the imperfections, that would be ideal. Every bit of paste that
*interferes* with contact between the CPU and heatsink is working NEGATIVELY
against heat trasnfer. We're only interested in preventing VOIDS between
the mating surfaces. Anything that's NOT filling the voids and is actually
*preventing* surface to surface contact between the CPU and heatsink and
thus *hindering* heat transfer, not helping.

Bottomline: The less the better, ideally zero, but since this is an
imperfect world, we need some, so use as little as possible.

HTH

Jim


"CrackerJack" <binaryblobNOTTHISBIT@hotpop.com> wrote in message
news:94C89175463C6AD265@64.62.191.93...
> What exactly is the problem if too much cpu compound is put on the
> core and it gets squashed out onto the surrounding area?
>
> Apart from looking messy, is there any real problem with this?
Related resources
Anonymous
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April 11, 2004 4:59:21 AM

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In article <94C89175463C6AD265@64.62.191.93>, "CrackerJack"
binaryblobNOTTHISBIT@hotpop.com says...
> What exactly is the problem if too much cpu compound is put on the
> core and it gets squashed out onto the surrounding area?
>
> Apart from looking messy, is there any real problem with this?
>
Only if it's electrically conductive, or if there's so much that it
actually holds the heatsink off the CPU. But why not just put a
reasonable amount on in the first place?
Anonymous
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April 11, 2004 6:04:43 AM

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On Sat, 10 Apr 2004 23:51:38 GMT, Will Dormann
<wdormann@yahoo.com.invalid> wrote:

>CrackerJack wrote:
>
>> What exactly is the problem if too much cpu compound is put on the
>> core and it gets squashed out onto the surrounding area?
>>
>> Apart from looking messy, is there any real problem with this?
>
>
>If you put on so much that the compound squashes out past the edges,
>that's too much. It generally won't do any damage, but will be nowhere
>near as efficient as if you had used less.
>

Unless you start out with an absolutely horrendous heatsink and don't
apply enough compound (it is practically impossible to apply EXACTLY the
amount needed) it will always squish out to a certain extent. Take off a
heatsink and look at the base, you see the outline of the CPU core due to
the compound squishing out. Even the thinnest layer of compound possible
should squish out a little if the heatsink is properly finished.
April 11, 2004 6:04:44 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd (More info?)

On Sun, 11 Apr 2004 02:04:43 GMT, kony <spam@spam.com> wrote:


>Unless you start out with an absolutely horrendous heatsink and don't
>apply enough compound (it is practically impossible to apply EXACTLY the
>amount needed) it will always squish out to a certain extent. Take off a
>heatsink and look at the base, you see the outline of the CPU core due to
>the compound squishing out. Even the thinnest layer of compound possible
>should squish out a little if the heatsink is properly finished.

So put some on and wipe it off. What's left is probably more than
enough. What part of "just a little" don't you understand ?
April 11, 2004 7:01:21 AM

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Conor <conor_turton@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:<MPG.1ae2ae31b90d7b0a98a2a5@news.claranews.com>...
> In article <94C89175463C6AD265@64.62.191.93>,
> binaryblobNOTTHISBIT@hotpop.com says...
> > What exactly is the problem if too much cpu compound is put on the
> > core and it gets squashed out onto the surrounding area?
> >
> > Apart from looking messy, is there any real problem with this?
> >
> Yes as it acts as an insulator. The idea of thermal compound is to fill
> the very small scratches on the faces.

Actually the thermal paste is non-conductive. For maximum heat
transfer from the core to the heatsink, the two metal pieces need to
touch as much as possible. Hence, the addition on the paste fills in
the imperfections.

Other than being a mess, things should work just fine.
April 11, 2004 1:17:53 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

No problem at all .... if you don't mind higher temps !
You need to maximise metal-metal contact.
With a mirror-shine finish (above 1200 grit), you only need invisible
amounts of goop.
Enough to take off the shine, only.

"CrackerJack" <binaryblobNOTTHISBIT@hotpop.com> wrote in message
news:94C89175463C6AD265@64.62.191.93...
> What exactly is the problem if too much cpu compound is put on the
> core and it gets squashed out onto the surrounding area?
>
> Apart from looking messy, is there any real problem with this?
April 11, 2004 1:18:51 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

You don't say why it's inefficient !
Do you mean wasteful or something else constituting inefficient.
A vague and meaningless answer.


"Will Dormann" <wdormann@yahoo.com.invalid> wrote in message
news:eM%dc.2804$T86.1685@fe2.columbus.rr.com...
> CrackerJack wrote:
>
> > What exactly is the problem if too much cpu compound is put on the
> > core and it gets squashed out onto the surrounding area?
> >
> > Apart from looking messy, is there any real problem with this?
>
>
> If you put on so much that the compound squashes out past the edges,
> that's too much. It generally won't do any damage, but will be nowhere
> near as efficient as if you had used less.
>
>
> -WD
April 11, 2004 1:19:22 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd (More info?)

<headbanger@wall.com> wrote in message
news:s1ph7093ei5rougrqpp2uvuv4u7jd8pamk@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 11 Apr 2004 02:04:43 GMT, kony <spam@spam.com> wrote:
>
>
> >Unless you start out with an absolutely horrendous heatsink and don't
> >apply enough compound (it is practically impossible to apply EXACTLY the
> >amount needed) it will always squish out to a certain extent. Take off a
> >heatsink and look at the base, you see the outline of the CPU core due to
> >the compound squishing out. Even the thinnest layer of compound possible
> >should squish out a little if the heatsink is properly finished.
>
> So put some on and wipe it off.


Or just put on as much as you need, to start with.
Duh !



What's left is probably more than
> enough. What part of "just a little" don't you understand ?
>
>
Anonymous
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April 11, 2004 3:22:05 PM

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In article <b24e73dd.0404110201.326cd75e@posting.google.com>, "John"
jkrytus@yahoo.com says...
> Conor <conor_turton@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:<MPG.1ae2ae31b90d7b0a98a2a5@news.claranews.com>...
> > In article <94C89175463C6AD265@64.62.191.93>,
> > binaryblobNOTTHISBIT@hotpop.com says...
> > > What exactly is the problem if too much cpu compound is put on the
> > > core and it gets squashed out onto the surrounding area?
> > >
> > > Apart from looking messy, is there any real problem with this?
> > >
> > Yes as it acts as an insulator. The idea of thermal compound is to fill
> > the very small scratches on the faces.
>
> Actually the thermal paste is non-conductive.

Eh?
April 11, 2004 3:22:06 PM

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"Rob Morley" <nospam@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.1ae32ca437f9894c98988e@news.individual.net...
> In article <b24e73dd.0404110201.326cd75e@posting.google.com>, "John"
> jkrytus@yahoo.com says...
> > Conor <conor_turton@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:<MPG.1ae2ae31b90d7b0a98a2a5@news.claranews.com>...
> > > In article <94C89175463C6AD265@64.62.191.93>,
> > > binaryblobNOTTHISBIT@hotpop.com says...
> > > > What exactly is the problem if too much cpu compound is put on the
> > > > core and it gets squashed out onto the surrounding area?
> > > >
> > > > Apart from looking messy, is there any real problem with this?
> > > >
> > > Yes as it acts as an insulator. The idea of thermal compound is to
fill
> > > the very small scratches on the faces.
> >
> > Actually the thermal paste is non-conductive.
>
> Eh?


You thought he meant thermally, we realised he meant electrically.



>
Anonymous
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April 11, 2004 4:04:27 PM

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In article <c5b83m$633$1@sparta.btinternet.com>, "QBall"
qball__@btinternet.com says...
>
> "Rob Morley" <nospam@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
> news:MPG.1ae32ca437f9894c98988e@news.individual.net...
> > In article <b24e73dd.0404110201.326cd75e@posting.google.com>, "John"
> > jkrytus@yahoo.com says...
> > > Conor <conor_turton@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:<MPG.1ae2ae31b90d7b0a98a2a5@news.claranews.com>...
> > > > In article <94C89175463C6AD265@64.62.191.93>,
> > > > binaryblobNOTTHISBIT@hotpop.com says...
> > > > > What exactly is the problem if too much cpu compound is put on the
> > > > > core and it gets squashed out onto the surrounding area?
> > > > >
> > > > > Apart from looking messy, is there any real problem with this?
> > > > >
> > > > Yes as it acts as an insulator. The idea of thermal compound is to
> fill
> > > > the very small scratches on the faces.
> > >
> > > Actually the thermal paste is non-conductive.
> >
> > Eh?
>
>
> You thought he meant thermally, we realised he meant electrically.
>
I realised he could have meant either, so asked for elaboration.
Actually some thermal compund is electrically conductive too, so I think
it was a dangerous statement to make.
Anonymous
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April 11, 2004 4:08:02 PM

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"Conor" <conor_turton@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.1ae2ae31b90d7b0a98a2a5@news.claranews.com...
> In article <94C89175463C6AD265@64.62.191.93>,
> binaryblobNOTTHISBIT@hotpop.com says...
> > What exactly is the problem if too much cpu compound is put on the
> > core and it gets squashed out onto the surrounding area?
> >
> > Apart from looking messy, is there any real problem with this?
>
> Yes as it acts as an insulator.

But more conductive than air, which is why it is used.

Alex
Anonymous
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April 11, 2004 4:59:55 PM

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"QBall" <qball__@btinternet.com> wrote in message
news:c5b2hr$l9s$1@titan.btinternet.com...
> You don't say why it's inefficient !
> Do you mean wasteful or something else constituting inefficient.
> A vague and meaningless answer.

He means heat transfer will not be as good due to the large gap between the
core and the heatsink (I think large is a good word because much of this is
discuss'd on a "microscopic level"
Anonymous
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April 11, 2004 7:31:31 PM

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Rob Morley <nospam@ntlworld.com> wrote:

>> What exactly is the problem if too much cpu compound is put
>> on the core and it gets squashed out onto the surrounding
>> area?
>>
>> Apart from looking messy, is there any real problem with
>> this?
>>
> Only if it's electrically conductive, or if there's so much
> that it actually holds the heatsink off the CPU. But why not
> just put a reasonable amount on in the first place?


It is hard to judge the exact amount. Rather than put too little
on and run the risk of not conducting heat away from the core, I
usually err on the side of putting too much on.
Anonymous
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April 11, 2004 7:32:33 PM

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"rstlne" <.@text.news.virgin.net> wrote:

>> You don't say why it's inefficient !
>> Do you mean wasteful or something else constituting
>> inefficient. A vague and meaningless answer.
>
> He means heat transfer will not be as good due to the large
> gap between the core and the heatsink (I think large is a good
> word because much of this is discuss'd on a "microscopic
> level"


If the goo squishes out then presumably the layer of goo is no
thicker or thinner than if it didn't squish out?
Anonymous
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April 11, 2004 7:35:21 PM

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jkrytus@yahoo.com (John) wrote:

>> > What exactly is the problem if too much cpu compound is put
>> > on the core and it gets squashed out onto the surrounding
>> > area?
>> >
>> > Apart from looking messy, is there any real problem with
>> > this?
>> >
>> Yes as it acts as an insulator. The idea of thermal compound
>> is to fill the very small scratches on the faces.
>
> Actually the thermal paste is non-conductive. For maximum
> heat transfer from the core to the heatsink, the two metal
> pieces need to touch as much as possible. Hence, the addition
> on the paste fills in the imperfections.
>
> Other than being a mess, things should work just fine.


So something like a pinhead or two should be enough?

And a matchhead would be too much?
April 11, 2004 7:36:05 PM

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Rob Morley <nospam@ntlworld.com> wrote:

>> > > > Yes as it acts as an insulator. The idea of thermal
>> > > > compound is to fill the very small scratches on the
>> > > > faces.
>> > >
>> > > Actually the thermal paste is non-conductive.
>> >
>> > Eh?
>>
>>
>> You thought he meant thermally, we realised he meant
>> electrically.
>>
> I realised he could have meant either, so asked for
> elaboration. Actually some thermal compund is electrically
> conductive too,


Which one?


> so I think it was a dangerous statement to
> make.
>
Anonymous
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April 11, 2004 7:48:05 PM

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In article <94C89EB51ADD861M2A@208.42.66.156>, "Max"
max.headroom@microsoft.com says...
> Rob Morley <nospam@ntlworld.com> wrote:
>
> >> > > > Yes as it acts as an insulator. The idea of thermal
> >> > > > compound is to fill the very small scratches on the
> >> > > > faces.
> >> > >
> >> > > Actually the thermal paste is non-conductive.
> >> >
> >> > Eh?
> >>
> >>
> >> You thought he meant thermally, we realised he meant
> >> electrically.
> >>
> > I realised he could have meant either, so asked for
> > elaboration. Actually some thermal compund is electrically
> > conductive too,
>
> Which one?
>
Any of the stuff that's filled with metallic particles is potentially
electrically conductive.
Anonymous
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April 11, 2004 7:51:07 PM

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In article <94C89DEF01E1731E75@130.133.1.4>, "Piotr Makley"
pmakley@mail.com says...
> Rob Morley <nospam@ntlworld.com> wrote:
>
> >> What exactly is the problem if too much cpu compound is put
> >> on the core and it gets squashed out onto the surrounding
> >> area?
> >>
> >> Apart from looking messy, is there any real problem with
> >> this?
> >>
> > Only if it's electrically conductive, or if there's so much
> > that it actually holds the heatsink off the CPU. But why not
> > just put a reasonable amount on in the first place?
>
>
> It is hard to judge the exact amount. Rather than put too little
> on and run the risk of not conducting heat away from the core, I
> usually err on the side of putting too much on.
>
If you're not sure then try with a very small amount, remove the
heatsink again and see how it's spread. Then clean and repeat. If you
don't clean it off in between applications there's more chance that you
will trap air in the compound.
Anonymous
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April 11, 2004 8:03:26 PM

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CrackerJack <binaryblobNOTTHISBIT@hotpop.com> wrote:

>What exactly is the problem if too much cpu compound is put on the
>core and it gets squashed out onto the surrounding area?

>Apart from looking messy, is there any real problem with this?

You'll always get a little but if you are squeezing a lot out it
indicates you've applied far too much, meaning the layer of paste
between the processor die/heatspreader and heatsink is too thick.

Remember, the idea is NOT to form a layer between the two surfaces.
The purpose of the paste is to fill the valleys in the contact
surfaces with something which is more efficient at transferring heat
away from the CPU core than the air which would otherwise fill the
gaps. Even the best thermal material is less efficient than direct
contact between the two metal surfaces.

Also, some thermal materials can be slightly electrically conductive,
so if leaks out and bridges gaps in electrical contacts it is possible
that it will result in reliability problems or even permanent damage
to components.

--
>iv< Paul >iv<
April 11, 2004 8:11:56 PM

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"Rob Morley" <nospam@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.1ae36bb2c4360fac98989b@news.individual.net...
> In article <94C89DEF01E1731E75@130.133.1.4>, "Piotr Makley"
> pmakley@mail.com says...
> > Rob Morley <nospam@ntlworld.com> wrote:
> >
> > >> What exactly is the problem if too much cpu compound is put
> > >> on the core and it gets squashed out onto the surrounding
> > >> area?
> > >>
> > >> Apart from looking messy, is there any real problem with
> > >> this?
> > >>
> > > Only if it's electrically conductive, or if there's so much
> > > that it actually holds the heatsink off the CPU. But why not
> > > just put a reasonable amount on in the first place?
> >
> >
> > It is hard to judge the exact amount. Rather than put too little
> > on and run the risk of not conducting heat away from the core,


You clearly have no understanding of thermal transfer, which is maximised
via metal-metal contact.
You fall into the ingenue's trap of believing more is better, when it fact
less is more.


I
> > usually err on the side of putting too much on.
> >
> If you're not sure then try with a very small amount, remove the
> heatsink again and see how it's spread. Then clean and repeat. If you
> don't clean it off in between applications there's more chance that you
> will trap air in the compound.
Anonymous
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April 11, 2004 11:52:03 PM

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Max wrote:

> Which one?


I do know that artic silver 1 is slightly conductive, but the more worrying
thing is the capacitance if it gets too close to contacts.

http://www.arcticsilver.com/arctic_silver_instructions....

--
Mark
Iligitimi Non Carborundum!
Twixt hill and high water, N.Wales, UK
Anonymous
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April 12, 2004 12:01:25 AM

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Matt <matt@themattfella.zzzz.com> wrote:

>>>>I realised he could have meant either, so asked for
>>>>elaboration. Actually some thermal compund is electrically
>>>>conductive too,

>> Any of the stuff that's filled with metallic particles is potentially
>> electrically conductive.

>Please name one.

Arctic Silver is capacitive, rather than conductive, but the same
applies in terms of application. Their instructions state:

"While much safer than electrically conductive silver and copper
greases, Arctic Silver should be kept away from electrical traces,
pins, and leads. While it is not electrically conductive, the compound
is slightly capacitive and could potentially cause problems if it
bridges two close-proximity electrical paths.)"

I wouldn't doubt there are other compounds around which are
electrically conductive.

--
>iv< Paul >iv<
April 12, 2004 12:20:42 AM

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On Sun, 11 Apr 2004 15:35:21 +0100, Piotr Makley <pmakley@mail.com> wrote:

>jkrytus@yahoo.com (John) wrote:
>
>>> > What exactly is the problem if too much cpu compound is put
>>> > on the core and it gets squashed out onto the surrounding
>>> > area?
>>> >
>>> > Apart from looking messy, is there any real problem with
>>> > this?
>>> >
>>> Yes as it acts as an insulator. The idea of thermal compound
>>> is to fill the very small scratches on the faces.
>>
>> Actually the thermal paste is non-conductive. For maximum
>> heat transfer from the core to the heatsink, the two metal
>> pieces need to touch as much as possible. Hence, the addition
>> on the paste fills in the imperfections.
>>
>> Other than being a mess, things should work just fine.
>
>
>So something like a pinhead or two should be enough?
>
>And a matchhead would be too much?

I've heard a grain of rice size is good. A matchhead should work.
I like to get single edged razor blades from the hardware to spread
it thinly and evenly. Think of frosting a cake<G>.
I've even heard it said that you should even be able to almost read
the CPU die thru a thin haze of compound but given the wide range
of heatsink finishes, I would only go that thinly on a lapped HS.
Take your time and run it out evenly to all corners of the die.
Then at the last, try to run the razorblade all the way across from one
side to the other making a single unbroken even surface.

The Artic Silver people suggest rubbing compound into the base of the
heatsink, and then wiping it all off (NOT with alcohol!) with a cloth
before putting it straight down on top of the CPU (no twisting/slipping).
Supposedly it will imbed some of the compound in the "pores" of the
HS. Sounds like a good idea to me.
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Remove "spamless" to email me.
April 12, 2004 12:26:53 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

Paul Hopwood <paul@hopwood.org.uk> wrote:

>>>>>I realised he could have meant either, so asked for
>>>>>elaboration. Actually some thermal compund is electrically
>>>>>conductive too,
>
>>> Any of the stuff that's filled with metallic particles is
>>> potentially electrically conductive.
>
>>Please name one.
>
> Arctic Silver is capacitive, rather than conductive, but the
> same applies in terms of application. Their instructions
> state:
>
> "While much safer than electrically conductive silver and
> copper greases, Arctic Silver should be kept away from
> electrical traces, pins, and leads. While it is not
> electrically conductive, the compound is slightly capacitive
> and could potentially cause problems if it bridges two
> close-proximity electrical paths.)"
>
> I wouldn't doubt there are other compounds around which are
> electrically conductive.


Hiya Paul. And now for something completely different .... Dan
compares toothpaste and Vegemite/Marmite to Artic Silver and finds
that both are actually better! At least they are until they dry
out.

http://www.dansdata.com/goop.htm

Dan is, of course, also the author of How To destroy Your Computer.
http://www.dansdata.com/sbs3.htm
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b K Overclocking
April 12, 2004 1:42:38 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

"Paul Hopwood" <paul@hopwood.org.uk> wrote in message
news:3tmi705don88c7m8q0ldvrvmc94hgmhloh@4ax.com...
| CrackerJack <binaryblobNOTTHISBIT@hotpop.com> wrote:
|
| >What exactly is the problem if too much cpu compound is put on the
| >core and it gets squashed out onto the surrounding area?
|
| >Apart from looking messy, is there any real problem with this?
|
| You'll always get a little but if you are squeezing a lot out it
| indicates you've applied far too much, meaning the layer of paste
| between the processor die/heatspreader and heatsink is too thick.

No matter how much you put on, the excess will get squeezed
out buy the pressure from the HS hold down clip, your layer will always
end up the same thickness. I have removed several and the "layer" looks the
same on both the carefully applied with no squizz-out and the sloppy with
heavy squizz.
|
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b K Overclocking
April 12, 2004 3:50:29 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

Conor <conor_turton@hotmail.com> wrote:

>> Remember, the idea is NOT to form a layer between the two surfaces.
>> The purpose of the paste is to fill the valleys in the contact
>> surfaces with something which is more efficient at transferring heat
>> away from the CPU core than the air which would otherwise fill the
>> gaps

>How I apply mine..

>Small pea sized lump on the heatsink. Spread thinly then scrape off
>with a razorblade.

>Very small dot on the CPU core. Spread extremely thinly so it is hardly
>visible.

I use a similar technique but use a bit less.

With the CPU fitted on the motherboard, I first apply a match head
sized dot to the top of the core and smear it around so it covers the
surface, then scrape most of it off with the edge of an old credit
card to leave very thin translucent layer covering the core.

I then clean the residue from the edge of the credit card with a ball
of cotton wool and use that to wipe the bottom the heatsink, just
sufficiently that it discolours the surface around where the core or
heat spreader will make contact, before fitting the cooler to the
board.

That way I use less compound and have cleaned my "applicator" in the
process; leaving just the cotton wool to discard. :-)

--
>iv< Paul >iv<
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b K Overclocking
April 12, 2004 5:27:12 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

"Rob Morley" <nospam@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.1ae36b04b0e5ce2d98989a@news.individual.net...
> In article <94C89EB51ADD861M2A@208.42.66.156>, "Max"
> max.headroom@microsoft.com says...
> > Rob Morley <nospam@ntlworld.com> wrote:
> >
> > >> > > > Yes as it acts as an insulator. The idea of thermal
> > >> > > > compound is to fill the very small scratches on the
> > >> > > > faces.
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Actually the thermal paste is non-conductive.
> > >> >
> > >> > Eh?
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> You thought he meant thermally, we realised he meant
> > >> electrically.
> > >>
> > > I realised he could have meant either, so asked for
> > > elaboration. Actually some thermal compund is electrically
> > > conductive too,
> >
> > Which one?
> >
> Any of the stuff that's filled with metallic particles is potentially
> electrically conductive.

Especially since silver is one of the best electrical conductors there is..
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b K Overclocking
April 12, 2004 7:50:54 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

> >>1) If the compound is not too viscous, and the heatsink is clamped on
> >>with some force, and you apply enough compound, the thickness of the
> >>layer of compound does not depend on the amount applied, which is to say
> >>that the excess gets squeezed out.
> >>
> >>2) Thermal compounds are not electrically conductive.
> >>
> >>3) Some thermal compounds (notably those containing silver compounds)
> >>have capacitative properties that can be problemmatic if compound gets
> >>between the chip's leads.
> >>
> >>4) If you use a compound that doesn't have the problemmatic capacitative
> >>properties and is not too viscous, in general it won't hurt to use too
much.
> >>
> >>
> >
> > 1) WRONG
> > 2) WRONG
> > 3) If 3 is true then 2) is wrong. You've just proved that yourself.
> > 4) WRONG.
> >

> Please start with this: In what way does 3 contradict 2?

How can you have capacitive properties if a compound is not conductive?

1) Wrong becausewhen you use too much compound, pressure will not squeeze
out to the same amount as if you had used the correct amount of compound to
start with.

2) EVERYTHING is electrically conductive to some degree. Even glass and
rubber are conductive in the right conditions.

3) True, but I've never had issues do to goo-ed up CPU's.

4) Too much compound is like wrapping your core in a blanket... It slows the
transfer of heat from the core to the sink/air.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b K Overclocking
April 12, 2004 9:51:42 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

Noozer wrote:
>>>>1) If the compound is not too viscous, and the heatsink is clamped on
>>>>with some force, and you apply enough compound, the thickness of the
>>>>layer of compound does not depend on the amount applied, which is to say
>>>>that the excess gets squeezed out.
>>>>
>>>>2) Thermal compounds are not electrically conductive.
>>>>
>>>>3) Some thermal compounds (notably those containing silver compounds)
>>>>have capacitative properties that can be problemmatic if compound gets
>>>>between the chip's leads.
>>>>
>>>>4) If you use a compound that doesn't have the problemmatic capacitative
>>>>properties and is not too viscous, in general it won't hurt to use too
>
> much.
>
>>>>
>>>1) WRONG
>>>2) WRONG
>>>3) If 3 is true then 2) is wrong. You've just proved that yourself.
>>>4) WRONG.
>>>
>
>
>>Please start with this: In what way does 3 contradict 2?
>
>
> How can you have capacitive properties if a compound is not conductive?
>
> 1) Wrong becausewhen you use too much compound, pressure will not squeeze
> out to the same amount as if you had used the correct amount of compound to
> start with.

I'me no AMD expert but i think basic physics will tell you that even
with a high friction coeficient between compound and material, a high
preassure like that will spread the relativley non-viscous compound to
its optimal value, PROVIDED that there are no air bubles or other
colloidal elements.

> 2) EVERYTHING is electrically conductive to some degree. Even glass and
> rubber are conductive in the right conditions.

Thats a pretty simplified view. I think your mixing up conductivity
with dielectric. Electrons can stream between anode and cathode with
resistance but "conductivity" comes from fermi-dirac effects within the
metal (not to be confused with the fermi level). Basically the easy
ionization of metals is what causes its high conductivity (because there
are electrons so close to the fermi level). You might get quantum
tunelling effects but thats another story.

In fact if you put a high enough charge through a molecule like, for
example a protein, you will destroy the protein's bindings before you
end up getting any real conductivity. It works like this. For an
electron do steam through a material, thats dielectric. For an electron
to conduct through a metal by going through orbits, thats conductivity.

And i think your ignoring that the minute, minute, minute conductivity
of the thermal compound might not be even tnough to short out anything
because remember the components do have a threshold value. I wouldn't
worry about conductivity. If it was soo easily conductive, wouldn't the
huge EM field coming from the processor affect it also?


> 3) True, but I've never had issues do to goo-ed up CPU's.
When you make the material, assuming the silver is uniform, you can
easily see if a charge has a big enough dialectric to conduct. I'me
sure the good poeple at GooCorp thought of that :) . If not i'me sure it
will be smaller than the threshold value assuming that the dielectric is
high enough. If your really worried, take some goo, punch in a
multimeter and see.


> 4) Too much compound is like wrapping your core in a blanket... It slows the
> transfer of heat from the core to the sink/air.

I'de be more worried about the presence of air bubbles when you goop it
on from a little tube nozzle, that can affect the heat transfer.

Also a nother thing though, if you don't put a lot of goop (not that
i'me advocating that too much goop is good) you might get dust between
the chip and the fan, and that my friends is bad since dust is
elctrostatically charged and does not act as a very good heat conductor.
April 12, 2004 1:21:20 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

"ntl: Victim" <ntl.victim@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:Jllec.273$3I2.157@newsfe1-win...
> "Rob Morley" <nospam@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
> news:MPG.1ae36b04b0e5ce2d98989a@news.individual.net...
> > In article <94C89EB51ADD861M2A@208.42.66.156>, "Max"
> > max.headroom@microsoft.com says...
> > > Rob Morley <nospam@ntlworld.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > >> > > > Yes as it acts as an insulator. The idea of thermal
> > > >> > > > compound is to fill the very small scratches on the
> > > >> > > > faces.
> > > >> > >
> > > >> > > Actually the thermal paste is non-conductive.
> > > >> >
> > > >> > Eh?
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> You thought he meant thermally, we realised he meant
> > > >> electrically.
> > > >>
> > > > I realised he could have meant either, so asked for
> > > > elaboration. Actually some thermal compund is electrically
> > > > conductive too,
> > >
> > > Which one?
> > >
> > Any of the stuff that's filled with metallic particles is potentially
> > electrically conductive.
>
> Especially since silver is one of the best electrical conductors there
is..


It matters not a jot if the matrix is an insulator.


>
>
April 12, 2004 1:26:44 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

"Queve Tientoo" <feesa@sbd.net> wrote in message
news:107k0dtjgpe46c0@corp.supernews.com...
>
> "Paul Hopwood" <paul@hopwood.org.uk> wrote in message
> news:3tmi705don88c7m8q0ldvrvmc94hgmhloh@4ax.com...
> | CrackerJack <binaryblobNOTTHISBIT@hotpop.com> wrote:
> |
> | >What exactly is the problem if too much cpu compound is put on the
> | >core and it gets squashed out onto the surrounding area?
> |
> | >Apart from looking messy, is there any real problem with this?
> |
> | You'll always get a little but if you are squeezing a lot out it
> | indicates you've applied far too much, meaning the layer of paste
> | between the processor die/heatspreader and heatsink is too thick.
>
> No matter how much you put on, the excess will get squeezed
> out buy the pressure from the HS hold down clip, your layer will always
> end up the same thickness.


And it's so thick, there's no metal-metal contact.
It's difficult enough to rub the goop away with a finger - try it for
yourself.
Try my method and watch your temps drop 5C !


I have removed several and the "layer" looks the
> same on both the carefully applied with no squizz-out and the sloppy with
> heavy squizz.
> |
>
>
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b K Overclocking
April 12, 2004 2:47:11 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

Conor <conor_turton@hotmail.com> wrote:

>> Hmmm greasy finger goop, damn boy if you worked in my place
>> and used your bare hands you'd be getting a twat round the
>> back of your head...
>>
> Why is that? Is it because you buy into the hype of the
> anti-static wristband manufacturers lies?
>
> And yes I know all about static damage...


I don't think he is referring to damage by static. I think there
is something "bad" about even a trace of grease like that from a
finger. I don't know why this is though.

Can anyone enlighten me (gently)?
April 12, 2004 2:47:12 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

"Piotr Makley" <pmakley@mail.com> wrote in message
news:94C96DB9B73531E75@130.133.1.4...
> Conor <conor_turton@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> >> Hmmm greasy finger goop, damn boy if you worked in my place
> >> and used your bare hands you'd be getting a twat round the
> >> back of your head...
> >>
> > Why is that? Is it because you buy into the hype of the
> > anti-static wristband manufacturers lies?
> >
> > And yes I know all about static damage...
>
>
> I don't think he is referring to damage by static. I think there
> is something "bad" about even a trace of grease like that from a
> finger. I don't know why this is though.


The reason for that is that you have no idea what you're talking about.
Until they dry out, vegemite and toothpaste work better than AS3 !


>
> Can anyone enlighten me (gently)?
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b K Overclocking
April 12, 2004 2:47:48 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

"QBall" <qball__@btinternet.com> wrote:

> I have fine, non-greasy skin.
> I notice other people's mice and keyboards are always covered
> in a sort of greasy/grainy mix ..... disgusting.
> You could always wash your finger first, you know.
> Using an implement allows the introduction of coarse
> particulate matter (which will screw the interface) - which a
> finger can easily detect.
>
> Anyway, the addition of a
> microscopic quantity of skin oil makes no difference
> whatsoever.

But why do people seem to worry about it?
April 12, 2004 2:47:49 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

"Piotr Makley" <pmakley@mail.com> wrote in message
news:94C96DD4DFC3E31E75@130.133.1.4...
> "QBall" <qball__@btinternet.com> wrote:
>
> > I have fine, non-greasy skin.
> > I notice other people's mice and keyboards are always covered
> > in a sort of greasy/grainy mix ..... disgusting.
> > You could always wash your finger first, you know.
> > Using an implement allows the introduction of coarse
> > particulate matter (which will screw the interface) - which a
> > finger can easily detect.
> >
> > Anyway, the addition of a
> > microscopic quantity of skin oil makes no difference
> > whatsoever.
>
> But why do people seem to worry about it?


Simple.
Because they spend too much time with their fingers stuck up their backsides
!
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b K Overclocking
April 12, 2004 4:11:18 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

On Mon, 12 Apr 2004 09:26:44 +0000 (UTC), "QBall" <qball__@btinternet.com>
wrote:

>And it's so thick, there's no metal-metal contact.

Metal to metal eh? Obviously you're only talking about CPUs with a heat
spreader on them. It makes a much greater difference how thick the
compound is when there's a spreader, because the retention force per sq.
mm is so much lower.

>It's difficult enough to rub the goop away with a finger - try it for
>yourself.

Well that's just a sign that your heatsink compound is too thick. If it
can't even be rubbed with a finger it's not going to be getting into the
crevasses very well either until it heats up, at which point it would also
tend to ooze out from between the 'sink and cpu too.

>Try my method and watch your temps drop 5C !

On a P4, using very thick compound, I'll believe it makes a 5C difference.
With compound of the proper consistency on an Athlon XP, maybe 1C if that,
though it might take a couple thermal cycles for some of the excess to
seep out.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b K Overclocking
April 12, 2004 4:37:18 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

"Queve Tientoo" <feesa@sbd.net> wrote:

>No matter how much you put on, the excess will get squeezed
>out buy the pressure from the HS hold down clip, your layer will always
>end up the same thickness. I have removed several and the "layer" looks the
>same on both the carefully applied with no squizz-out and the sloppy with
>heavy squizz.

If too much is applied the excess won't be squeezed out. If it's
applied properly their should be so little between the contact areas
that it'll be barely visible when you remove the heatsink.

--
>iv< Paul >iv<
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b K Overclocking
April 12, 2004 4:54:19 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

Matt wrote:
>
> Conor wrote:
> > In article <Dzgec.286$l14.105@news02.roc.ny>,
> > matt@themattfella.zzzz.com says...
> >
> >>CrackerJack wrote:
> >>
> >>>What exactly is the problem if too much cpu compound is put on the
> >>>core and it gets squashed out onto the surrounding area?
> >>>
> >>>Apart from looking messy, is there any real problem with this?
> >>
> >>I propose this answer:
> >>
> >>1) If the compound is not too viscous, and the heatsink is clamped on
> >>with some force, and you apply enough compound, the thickness of the
> >>layer of compound does not depend on the amount applied, which is to say
> >>that the excess gets squeezed out.
> >>
> >>2) Thermal compounds are not electrically conductive.
> >>
> >>3) Some thermal compounds (notably those containing silver compounds)
> >>have capacitative properties that can be problemmatic if compound gets
> >>between the chip's leads.
> >>
> >>4) If you use a compound that doesn't have the problemmatic capacitative
> >>properties and is not too viscous, in general it won't hurt to use too much.
> >>
> >>
> >
> > 1) WRONG
> > 2) WRONG
> > 3) If 3 is true then 2) is wrong. You've just proved that yourself.
> > 4) WRONG.
> >
>
> Your reply is practically content-free.
>
> Please start with this: In what way does 3 contradict 2?

Apart from the above, the word you're looking for is 'dielectric'. Look
up any elementary physics text book.
April 12, 2004 4:54:20 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

"Johannes H Andersen" <johs@sizefitter_0_0_0_0_.com> wrote in message
news:407A836B.759D1483@sizefitter_0_0_0_0_.com...
>
>
> Matt wrote:
> >
> > Conor wrote:
> > > In article <Dzgec.286$l14.105@news02.roc.ny>,
> > > matt@themattfella.zzzz.com says...
> > >
> > >>CrackerJack wrote:
> > >>
> > >>>What exactly is the problem if too much cpu compound is put on the
> > >>>core and it gets squashed out onto the surrounding area?
> > >>>
> > >>>Apart from looking messy, is there any real problem with this?
> > >>
> > >>I propose this answer:
> > >>
> > >>1) If the compound is not too viscous, and the heatsink is clamped on
> > >>with some force, and you apply enough compound, the thickness of the
> > >>layer of compound does not depend on the amount applied, which is to
say
> > >>that the excess gets squeezed out.
> > >>
> > >>2) Thermal compounds are not electrically conductive.
> > >>
> > >>3) Some thermal compounds (notably those containing silver compounds)
> > >>have capacitative properties that can be problemmatic if compound gets
> > >>between the chip's leads.
> > >>
> > >>4) If you use a compound that doesn't have the problemmatic
capacitative
> > >>properties and is not too viscous, in general it won't hurt to use too
much.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >
> > > 1) WRONG
> > > 2) WRONG
> > > 3) If 3 is true then 2) is wrong. You've just proved that yourself.
> > > 4) WRONG.
> > >
> >
> > Your reply is practically content-free.
> >
> > Please start with this: In what way does 3 contradict 2?
>
> Apart from the above, the word you're looking for is 'dielectric'. Look
> up any elementary physics text book.


Hehe ..... LOL
The contemporary edukation system has a lot to answer for.
Bad spelling is so freaking irritating.
April 12, 2004 5:07:44 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

On Mon, 12 Apr 2004 12:19:51 +0100, Conor <conor_turton@hotmail.com> wrote:

>In article <ymoec.80914$Pk3.59130@pd7tw1no>, dont.spam@me.here says...
>
>> > Please start with this: In what way does 3 contradict 2?
>>
>> How can you have capacitive properties if a compound is not conductive?
>>
>Precisely.

Actually, you can have a "capacitive property" without being conductive. Do
some research on dielectric constant. Every substance has one. Even a
vacum has one. Some substances with high dialectric constants, such as
silicones, have such high resistances they are effectively non-conductive
(you won't read any resistance with a standard ohmmeter), yet they do
increase the capacitance between between conductors. So there are 2 points

1. Everything has a capacitive property. It is called the dielectric
constant. It is not directly related to conductance or resistance.

2. Everything is also to some degree conductive. When the resistance (the
inverse of conductance) is high enough we can't practically measure it we
call that substance non-conductive.

http://www.rfcafe.com/references/electrical/dielectric_...
JT
April 12, 2004 5:19:12 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

On Mon, 12 Apr 2004 10:47:11 +0100, Piotr Makley <pmakley@mail.com> wrote:

>Conor <conor_turton@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>> Hmmm greasy finger goop, damn boy if you worked in my place
>>> and used your bare hands you'd be getting a twat round the
>>> back of your head...
>>>
>> Why is that? Is it because you buy into the hype of the
>> anti-static wristband manufacturers lies?
>>
>> And yes I know all about static damage...
>
>
>I don't think he is referring to damage by static. I think there
>is something "bad" about even a trace of grease like that from a
>finger. I don't know why this is though.
>
>Can anyone enlighten me (gently)?

Short term, skin oils are a poor heat conductor, so interfere with heat
transfer from cpu to heatsink. Long term most peoples skin oils are acidic
or salty enough to cause corrosion, which is also not a good thing to have
between a cpu and a heatsink

JT
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b K Overclocking
April 12, 2004 5:54:48 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

"QBall" <qball__@btinternet.com> wrote:

>> I don't think he is referring to damage by static. I think
>> there is something "bad" about even a trace of grease like
>> that from a finger. I don't know why this is though.
>
>
> The reason for that is that you have no idea what you're
> talking about. Until they dry out, vegemite and toothpaste
> work better than AS3 !


Maybe you can tell me whatyou think is happening if grease is
present and if it is good or bad. Thanks.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b K Overclocking
April 12, 2004 6:22:37 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

On Mon, 12 Apr 2004 13:19:12 GMT, JT <spam@dcplus.dyndns.info> wrote:

>On Mon, 12 Apr 2004 10:47:11 +0100, Piotr Makley <pmakley@mail.com> wrote:
>
>>Conor <conor_turton@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>> Hmmm greasy finger goop, damn boy if you worked in my place
>>>> and used your bare hands you'd be getting a twat round the
>>>> back of your head...
>>>>
>>> Why is that? Is it because you buy into the hype of the
>>> anti-static wristband manufacturers lies?
>>>
>>> And yes I know all about static damage...
>>
>>
>>I don't think he is referring to damage by static. I think there
>>is something "bad" about even a trace of grease like that from a
>>finger. I don't know why this is though.
>>
>>Can anyone enlighten me (gently)?
>
>Short term, skin oils are a poor heat conductor, so interfere with heat
>transfer from cpu to heatsink. Long term most peoples skin oils are acidic
>or salty enough to cause corrosion, which is also not a good thing to have
>between a cpu and a heatsink
>
>JT

Nonsense. NOBODY has enough oil on their fingers to significantly cause
corrosion or degrade the cooling efficiency. Now maybe if someone had
just finished picking their nose or painting a fence...
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b K Overclocking
April 12, 2004 6:38:50 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

"JT" <spam@dcplus.dyndns.info> wrote in message
news:D 6df40e0fb3d8519bcf550b358786db0@news.teranews.com...
> On Mon, 12 Apr 2004 10:47:11 +0100, Piotr Makley <pmakley@mail.com> wrote:
>
> >Conor <conor_turton@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >>> Hmmm greasy finger goop, damn boy if you worked in my place
> >>> and used your bare hands you'd be getting a twat round the
> >>> back of your head...
> >>>
> >> Why is that? Is it because you buy into the hype of the
> >> anti-static wristband manufacturers lies?
> >>
> >> And yes I know all about static damage...
> >
> >
> >I don't think he is referring to damage by static. I think there
> >is something "bad" about even a trace of grease like that from a
> >finger. I don't know why this is though.
> >
> >Can anyone enlighten me (gently)?
>
> Short term, skin oils are a poor heat conductor, so interfere with heat
> transfer from cpu to heatsink. Long term most peoples skin oils are acidic
> or salty enough to cause corrosion, which is also not a good thing to have
> between a cpu and a heatsink


Everything depends on the amount of skin-oil.
If you've recently washed your hands, very little will be deposited.
Some people barely secrete any oil, others have greasy skin.
Ultimately, the tiny amounts involved are unlikely to find their way onto
the sink because they'll be trapped under a layer of goop on the finger.


>
> JT
April 12, 2004 7:09:33 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

"CrackerJack" <binaryblobNOTTHISBIT@hotpop.com> wrote in message news:94C89175463C6AD265@64.62.191.93...
> What exactly is the problem if too much cpu compound is put on the
> core and it gets squashed out onto the surrounding area?
>
> Apart from looking messy, is there any real problem with this?

Is there any "real" problem? No.

Is the heat transfer less efficient? Yes.

By how much? Not very.

There is a point past which application thickness doesn't matter. For example, putting on a layer 1mm thick and 2mm or 3mm or more will give you the same amount between the heatsink and the core; the excess is squished out. Essentially, past a point, it can't possibly get any worse.

However, below a certain thickness (at which I could only guess), the thickness of the paste as applied will affect the thickness of the paste (and hence the thermal conductivity) once the heatsink is on. This point is only reached when no compound squishes out i.e. what you put on is what ends up between the HS and CPU. Here less is better.

Personally, I never worry about it. Unless it's dripping off the CPU, it'll be fine.

However, do heed the warnings that have been given. A silver-based compound, such as Arctic Silver, can cause problems if it comes in contact with the CPU bridges. No such problems exist with ceramic-based compounds, such as Ceramique.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b K Overclocking
April 12, 2004 11:32:44 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

"Matt" <matt@themattfella.zzzz.com> wrote in message
news:MPAec.1456$fG6.1374@news01.roc.ny...
> QBall wrote:
> > "Johannes H Andersen" <johs@sizefitter_0_0_0_0_.com> wrote in message
> > news:407A836B.759D1483@sizefitter_0_0_0_0_.com...
> >
> >>
> >>Matt wrote:
> >>
> >>>Conor wrote:
> >>>
> >>>>In article <Dzgec.286$l14.105@news02.roc.ny>,
> >>>>matt@themattfella.zzzz.com says...
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>CrackerJack wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>What exactly is the problem if too much cpu compound is put on the
> >>>>>>core and it gets squashed out onto the surrounding area?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>Apart from looking messy, is there any real problem with this?
> >>>>>
> >>>>>I propose this answer:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>1) If the compound is not too viscous, and the heatsink is clamped on
> >>>>>with some force, and you apply enough compound, the thickness of the
> >>>>>layer of compound does not depend on the amount applied, which is to
> >
> > say
> >
> >>>>>that the excess gets squeezed out.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>2) Thermal compounds are not electrically conductive.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>3) Some thermal compounds (notably those containing silver compounds)
> >>>>>have capacitative properties that can be problemmatic if compound
gets
> >>>>>between the chip's leads.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>4) If you use a compound that doesn't have the problemmatic
> >
> > capacitative
> >
> >>>>>properties and is not too viscous, in general it won't hurt to use
too
> >
> > much.
> >
> >>>>>
> >>>>1) WRONG
> >>>>2) WRONG
> >>>>3) If 3 is true then 2) is wrong. You've just proved that yourself.
> >>>>4) WRONG.
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>Your reply is practically content-free.
> >>>
> >>>Please start with this: In what way does 3 contradict 2?
> >>
> >>Apart from the above, the word you're looking for is 'dielectric'. Look
> >>up any elementary physics text book.
> >
> >
> >
> > Hehe ..... LOL
> > The contemporary edukation system has a lot to answer for.
> > Bad spelling is so freaking irritating.
> >
> >
> What was misspelled?


Dielectric was 'dialectric' - like dialectic !

>
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b K Overclocking
April 13, 2004 5:20:37 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

On Sun, 11 Apr 2004 20:26:53 +0100 As truth resonates honesty Lem
<lem@mail.com> wrote :

>Paul Hopwood <paul@hopwood.org.uk> wrote:
>
>>>>>>I realised he could have meant either, so asked for
>>>>>>elaboration. Actually some thermal compund is electrically
>>>>>>conductive too,
>>
>>>> Any of the stuff that's filled with metallic particles is
>>>> potentially electrically conductive.
>>
>>>Please name one.
>>
>> Arctic Silver is capacitive, rather than conductive, but the
>> same applies in terms of application. Their instructions
>> state:
>>
>> "While much safer than electrically conductive silver and
>> copper greases, Arctic Silver should be kept away from
>> electrical traces, pins, and leads. While it is not
>> electrically conductive, the compound is slightly capacitive
>> and could potentially cause problems if it bridges two
>> close-proximity electrical paths.)"
>>
>> I wouldn't doubt there are other compounds around which are
>> electrically conductive.
>
>
>Hiya Paul. And now for something completely different .... Dan
>compares toothpaste and Vegemite/Marmite to Artic Silver and finds
>that both are actually better! At least they are until they dry
>out.
>
>http://www.dansdata.com/goop.htm
>
>Dan is, of course, also the author of How To destroy Your Computer.
>http://www.dansdata.com/sbs3.htm

I can believe it.There's lot's of Hype about.
I bought this cooler for my O/C AMD XP 1800,
MicroFlow2 SPA07B2 (Skt A)
http://tinyurl.com/ybtn

look at the price

and it came with it's own tube of,"Artic" silver.So the whole
kit-and-kaboodle was actually less than the cost one tube
of,"Genuine","Artic Silver".
Even under my heaviest gaming loads it rarely goes above 40 Deg C and
trust me I give my system,"Hammer".
I did polish the bottom of the HS but the copper centre really does
the biz anyway.

As we speak Idle temps are,

37 Deg C

Running @ 143/143
:D 

As summer comes I expect it to hit 50 Deg C,but then that's nowt for
an AMD and the ting is near silent as well :) 

This has to be the bargain of the year IMNSHO :p 



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