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What PSU rating for Athlon 2400 with 6 HDDs?

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October 12, 2004 7:06:35 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,sci.electronics.components,sci.electronics.repair,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

What rating PSU should I use on a system which has an Athlon 2400+
with a modest graphics card (old GeForce2 MX 32MB) and 768 MB of SD-
RAM. Unusually, it will have *SIX* IDE internal hard drives.

All the rest of the system is pretty normal with no overclocking on
the cpu.

Would a decent 350W PSU be enough? I am thinking of this Nexus PSU.
http://www.nexustek.nl/nx3500.htm The specification chart shows
current delivery at min load, normal load, max load:

+3.3V 0.3A 14.0A 21.2/28A
+5V 1.0A 12.7A 30/25.5A
+12V 0.2A 4.5A 16A

(1) +3.3V & +5V total output not exceed 220Watt.
(1a) When +3.3V is loaded to 28A, then the +5V maximum load is 25.5A.
(1b) When +3.3V is loaded to 21.2A, the +5V maximum load is 30A.
(2) +3.3V & +5V & +12V total output not exceed 330Watt.

---

Is this any good for my needs?
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 12, 2004 7:06:36 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,sci.electronics.components,sci.electronics.repair,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

"Franklin" <no_thanks@mail.com> wrote in message
news:958099B49C7BC71F3M4@130.133.1.4...
> What rating PSU should I use on a system which has an Athlon 2400+
> with a modest graphics card (old GeForce2 MX 32MB) and 768 MB of SD-
> RAM. Unusually, it will have *SIX* IDE internal hard drives.
>
> All the rest of the system is pretty normal with no overclocking on
> the cpu.
>
> Would a decent 350W PSU be enough? I am thinking of this Nexus PSU.
> http://www.nexustek.nl/nx3500.htm The specification chart shows
> current delivery at min load, normal load, max load:

I can't comment on the power requirements, but I can say the power supply I
have is excellent. Its the Nexus NX 3000 (300W)and it really is quiet! If I
stop the other 2 fans in the system, I can only just hear it in a quiet
room! This power supply has a normal sized (80mm or 92mm?) fan and it is
quiet, so the big 120mm fan should be practically silent.

As for voltage regulation. I can't say if it is good or not (anyone
comment?), but I get the following readouts in my hardware monitor:
3.3v actually reads 3.312 or 3.328
5v actually reads 4.945
12v actually reads 12.096
-12v actually reads -12.196
-5v actually reads -5.005
5vsb actually reads 5.072 (don't know what vsb is!)
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 12, 2004 7:06:36 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,sci.electronics.components,sci.electronics.repair,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 15:06:35 +0100, Franklin wrote:

> What rating PSU should I use on a system which has an Athlon 2400+
> with a modest graphics card (old GeForce2 MX 32MB) and 768 MB of SD-
> RAM. Unusually, it will have *SIX* IDE internal hard drives.
>
> All the rest of the system is pretty normal with no overclocking on
> the cpu.
>
> Would a decent 350W PSU be enough? I am thinking of this Nexus PSU.
> http://www.nexustek.nl/nx3500.htm The specification chart shows
> current delivery at min load, normal load, max load:
>
> +3.3V 0.3A 14.0A 21.2/28A
> +5V 1.0A 12.7A 30/25.5A
> +12V 0.2A 4.5A 16A
>
> (1) +3.3V & +5V total output not exceed 220Watt.
> (1a) When +3.3V is loaded to 28A, then the +5V maximum load is 25.5A.
> (1b) When +3.3V is loaded to 21.2A, the +5V maximum load is 30A.
> (2) +3.3V & +5V & +12V total output not exceed 330Watt.
>
> ---
>
> Is this any good for my needs?

With 6 drives I'd go with a larger power supply, get at least a 450W
supply or even larger. An Antec 550W supply is only $108. You don't want
to waste your time hunting down system glitches because you saved 30 bucks
on a power supply.
Related resources
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 12, 2004 7:06:36 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,sci.electronics.components,sci.electronics.repair,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

Franklin wrote:
> What rating PSU should I use on a system which has an Athlon 2400+
> with a modest graphics card (old GeForce2 MX 32MB) and 768 MB of SD-
> RAM. Unusually, it will have *SIX* IDE internal hard drives.
>
> All the rest of the system is pretty normal with no overclocking on
> the cpu.
>
> Would a decent 350W PSU be enough? I am thinking of this Nexus PSU.
> http://www.nexustek.nl/nx3500.htm The specification chart shows
> current delivery at min load, normal load, max load:
>
> +3.3V 0.3A 14.0A 21.2/28A
> +5V 1.0A 12.7A 30/25.5A
> +12V 0.2A 4.5A 16A
>
> (1) +3.3V & +5V total output not exceed 220Watt.
> (1a) When +3.3V is loaded to 28A, then the +5V maximum load is 25.5A.
> (1b) When +3.3V is loaded to 21.2A, the +5V maximum load is 30A.
> (2) +3.3V & +5V & +12V total output not exceed 330Watt.
>
> ---
>
> Is this any good for my needs?

You really can't have too much, but you can have too little.

When it comes to power supplies, I would just get a good name - like Antec
True Power, around 430 watt to be safe.




--
Don Burnette
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 12, 2004 7:06:37 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,sci.electronics.components,sci.electronics.repair,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

"Gareth Tuckwell" <ContactGT@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:CIRad.1904$4y4.1098@newsfe3-win.ntli.net...
> "Franklin" <no_thanks@mail.com> wrote in message
> news:958099B49C7BC71F3M4@130.133.1.4...
>> What rating PSU should I use on a system which has an Athlon 2400+
>> with a modest graphics card (old GeForce2 MX 32MB) and 768 MB of SD-
>> RAM. Unusually, it will have *SIX* IDE internal hard drives.
>>
>> All the rest of the system is pretty normal with no overclocking on
>> the cpu.
>>
>> Would a decent 350W PSU be enough? I am thinking of this Nexus PSU.
>> http://www.nexustek.nl/nx3500.htm The specification chart shows
>> current delivery at min load, normal load, max load:
>
> I can't comment on the power requirements, but I can say the power supply
> I have is excellent. Its the Nexus NX 3000 (300W)and it really is quiet!
> If I stop the other 2 fans in the system, I can only just hear it in a
> quiet room! This power supply has a normal sized (80mm or 92mm?) fan and
> it is quiet, so the big 120mm fan should be practically silent.
>
> As for voltage regulation. I can't say if it is good or not (anyone
> comment?), but I get the following readouts in my hardware monitor:
> 3.3v actually reads 3.312 or 3.328
> 5v actually reads 4.945
> 12v actually reads 12.096
> -12v actually reads -12.196
> -5v actually reads -5.005
> 5vsb actually reads 5.072 (don't know what vsb is!)

I should add that my NX 3000 (300w) power used to run this system without
any problems:
Athlon 2400+ (normal voltage and clocking)
2GB (3 modules) SDRAM
3 IDE hard disk drives
1 IDE DVD drive
1 SCSI cd writer
Radeon 8500 AGP card
1 wireless PCI
1 network PCI
1 sound card PCI
9 fans!! (of various sizes)
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 12, 2004 7:06:37 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,sci.electronics.components,sci.electronics.repair,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

> "Franklin" <no_thanks@mail.com> wrote in message
> news:958099B49C7BC71F3M4@130.133.1.4...

> > What rating PSU should I use on a system which has an Athlon 2400+
> > with a modest graphics card (old GeForce2 MX 32MB) and 768 MB of SD-
> > RAM. Unusually, it will have *SIX* IDE internal hard drives.
> >
> > All the rest of the system is pretty normal with no overclocking on
> > the cpu.
> >
> > Would a decent 350W PSU be enough? I am thinking of this Nexus PSU.
> > http://www.nexustek.nl/nx3500.htm

Nexus is made by Fortron-Source, one of the best PSU makers in the
world, but I don't know if the 16A @ +12V is enough for all that
hardware. One person found that his XP1800+ system with five HDs
(RPM unknown) and a couple of CD drives consumed only 160W from the AC
lines, meaning that the computer was taking about 120W. And in 2002
C'T magazine measured several computers equipped with XP2400+ CPUs,
256M DDR, and GeForce3/Ti500 graphics cards and found that it took
about 9A @ +12V, 2-4A @ +5V, and 9-12A @ +3.3V.
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 12, 2004 8:09:35 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,sci.electronics.components,sci.electronics.repair,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 15:06:35 +0100, Franklin
<no_thanks@mail.com> wrote:

>What rating PSU should I use on a system which has an Athlon 2400+
>with a modest graphics card (old GeForce2 MX 32MB) and 768 MB of SD-
>RAM. Unusually, it will have *SIX* IDE internal hard drives.
>
>All the rest of the system is pretty normal with no overclocking on
>the cpu.
>
>Would a decent 350W PSU be enough? I am thinking of this Nexus PSU.
>http://www.nexustek.nl/nx3500.htm The specification chart shows
>current delivery at min load, normal load, max load:
>
>+3.3V 0.3A 14.0A 21.2/28A
>+5V 1.0A 12.7A 30/25.5A
>+12V 0.2A 4.5A 16A
>
>(1) +3.3V & +5V total output not exceed 220Watt.
>(1a) When +3.3V is loaded to 28A, then the +5V maximum load is 25.5A.
>(1b) When +3.3V is loaded to 21.2A, the +5V maximum load is 30A.
>(2) +3.3V & +5V & +12V total output not exceed 330Watt.
>
>---
>
>Is this any good for my needs?

Nexus relabels Sparkle PSU. If you can find a Sparkle (or
Fortron) 350W for lower price it would be better value.

350W is enough for your system but if motherboard uses 12V
for CPU (one sign of that would be that the board uses the
"Intel" P4 4-pin 12V connector in addition to the ATX 20 pin
connector) then it would provide more margin to choose 400W
or higher (Nexus/Sparkle/Fortron will still be a good choice
in 400W or higher).
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 12, 2004 8:27:13 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,sci.electronics.components,sci.electronics.repair,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

Franklin wrote:

> What rating PSU should I use on a system which has an Athlon 2400+
> with a modest graphics card (old GeForce2 MX 32MB) and 768 MB of SD-
> RAM. Unusually, it will have *SIX* IDE internal hard drives.
>
> All the rest of the system is pretty normal with no overclocking on
> the cpu.
>
> Would a decent 350W PSU be enough? I am thinking of this Nexus PSU.
> http://www.nexustek.nl/nx3500.htm The specification chart shows
> current delivery at min load, normal load, max load:
>
> +3.3V 0.3A 14.0A 21.2/28A
> +5V 1.0A 12.7A 30/25.5A
> +12V 0.2A 4.5A 16A
>
> (1) +3.3V & +5V total output not exceed 220Watt.
> (1a) When +3.3V is loaded to 28A, then the +5V maximum load is 25.5A.
> (1b) When +3.3V is loaded to 21.2A, the +5V maximum load is 30A.
> (2) +3.3V & +5V & +12V total output not exceed 330Watt.
>
> ---
>
> Is this any good for my needs?

The six hard drives will draw about 2 A each on startup. When running
this will drop considerably. You could monitor the +12V rail during
startup, but a normal voltmeter will not respond rapidly enough. A
digital voltmeter needs about a second to compare the voltage under test
to its internal standard and produce a reading. The 16 A rating should
be ample, if it's a true rating and you don't add other things requiring
+12 V.

If it boots OK, and everything works, the supply should be fine.

Virg Wall
--
A foolish consistency is the
hobgoblin of little minds,........
Ralph Waldo Emerson
(Microsoft programmer's manual.)
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 12, 2004 10:46:20 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,sci.electronics.components,sci.electronics.repair,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

>
> You really can't have too much, but you can have too little.
>
> When it comes to power supplies, I would just get a good name - like Antec
> True Power, around 430 watt to be safe.
>
>


Heh..
I dunno
Climb a highline pole and put a 5v light across the 15kv lines ;P
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 12, 2004 11:15:55 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,sci.electronics.components,sci.electronics.repair,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 18:46:20 GMT, "rstlne" <.@text.news.virgin.net>
wrote:

>>
>> You really can't have too much, but you can have too little.
>>
>> When it comes to power supplies, I would just get a good name - like Antec
>> True Power, around 430 watt to be safe.
>>
>>
>
>
>Heh..
>I dunno
>Climb a highline pole and put a 5v light across the 15kv lines ;P
>

That's too much voltage. The extra power is a secondary result, of
course.

Tom
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 13, 2004 12:08:49 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd (More info?)

On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 15:06:35 +0100, Franklin <no_thanks@mail.com>
wrote:

>What rating PSU should I use on a system which has an Athlon 2400+
>with a modest graphics card (old GeForce2 MX 32MB) and 768 MB of SD-
>RAM. Unusually, it will have *SIX* IDE internal hard drives.



Do what the big dogs do:

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?descripti...

$112

The published value of 36A on the 12 V rail is
correct. It is *not* a typo on the web site.
The box and the device itself mention this value of 36A also.

the 24 pin power connector is by design
backward compatible (search for the PDF file on
the ATX specification 2.2).

The only caveat is to have some space near pin 10
of the female connector to accomodate for the not
used 4 pins of the 24 pin male connector; if this space does
not exist one has to use a 20 to 24 pin adapter cable

http://www.pcpowercooling.com/products/cooling/accessor...
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 13, 2004 1:23:10 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,sci.electronics.components,sci.electronics.repair,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

>>Would a decent 350W PSU be enough? I am thinking of this Nexus PSU.
>>> http://www.nexustek.nl/nx3500.htm The specification chart shows
>>> current delivery at min load, normal load, max load:
>>>
>>> +3.3V 0.3A 14.0A 21.2/28A
>>> +5V 1.0A 12.7A 30/25.5A
>>> +12V 0.2A 4.5A 16A
>>>
>>> (1) +3.3V & +5V total output not exceed 220Watt.
>>> (1a) When +3.3V is loaded to 28A, then the +5V maximum load is 25.5A.
>>> (1b) When +3.3V is loaded to 21.2A, the +5V maximum load is 30A.
>>> (2) +3.3V & +5V & +12V total output not exceed 330Watt.
>>>
>>> ---
>>>
>>> Is this any good for my needs?
>
>
> With 6 drives I'd go with a larger power supply, get at least a 450W
> supply or even larger. An Antec 550W supply is only $108. You don't want
> to waste your time hunting down system glitches because you saved 30 bucks
> on a power supply.
>

You don't want to waste $30 for nothing, either.
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 13, 2004 1:47:08 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,sci.electronics.components,sci.electronics.repair,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

"Franklin" <no_thanks@mail.com> wrote in message
news:958099B49C7BC71F3M4@130.133.1.4...
> What rating PSU should I use on a system which has an Athlon 2400+
> with a modest graphics card (old GeForce2 MX 32MB) and 768 MB of SD-
> RAM. Unusually, it will have *SIX* IDE internal hard drives.
>
> All the rest of the system is pretty normal with no overclocking on
> the cpu.
>
> Would a decent 350W PSU be enough? I am thinking of this Nexus PSU.
> http://www.nexustek.nl/nx3500.htm The specification chart shows
> current delivery at min load, normal load, max load:
>
> +3.3V 0.3A 14.0A 21.2/28A
> +5V 1.0A 12.7A 30/25.5A
> +12V 0.2A 4.5A 16A
>
> (1) +3.3V & +5V total output not exceed 220Watt.
> (1a) When +3.3V is loaded to 28A, then the +5V maximum load is 25.5A.
> (1b) When +3.3V is loaded to 21.2A, the +5V maximum load is 30A.
> (2) +3.3V & +5V & +12V total output not exceed 330Watt.
>
> ---
>
> Is this any good for my needs?

Go for a cheap Sparkle / Fortron branded PSU of the region 350-450w.
My sparkle 300w has been heavily loaded over the last 3 years and still runs
cool + quiet.

Hamman
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 13, 2004 2:20:30 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,sci.electronics.components,sci.electronics.repair,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

i know very little about pwer, but from what i know a 350w will be ok, a
decent one though, i have a cheap one and i keep getting IRQL errors, im not
sure if they are related to the PSU or memory, but someone at uni has told
me a 400w PSU is reccomended with all AMD Athlon XP's
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 13, 2004 3:05:23 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,sci.electronics.components,sci.electronics.repair,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

Hmmm ... I think you should more seriously be thinking about an Antec 550
Watt True Power supply.

--
DaveW



"Franklin" <no_thanks@mail.com> wrote in message
news:958099B49C7BC71F3M4@130.133.1.4...
> What rating PSU should I use on a system which has an Athlon 2400+
> with a modest graphics card (old GeForce2 MX 32MB) and 768 MB of SD-
> RAM. Unusually, it will have *SIX* IDE internal hard drives.
>
> All the rest of the system is pretty normal with no overclocking on
> the cpu.
>
> Would a decent 350W PSU be enough? I am thinking of this Nexus PSU.
> http://www.nexustek.nl/nx3500.htm The specification chart shows
> current delivery at min load, normal load, max load:
>
> +3.3V 0.3A 14.0A 21.2/28A
> +5V 1.0A 12.7A 30/25.5A
> +12V 0.2A 4.5A 16A
>
> (1) +3.3V & +5V total output not exceed 220Watt.
> (1a) When +3.3V is loaded to 28A, then the +5V maximum load is 25.5A.
> (1b) When +3.3V is loaded to 21.2A, the +5V maximum load is 30A.
> (2) +3.3V & +5V & +12V total output not exceed 330Watt.
>
> ---
>
> Is this any good for my needs?
October 13, 2004 5:45:38 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,sci.electronics.components,sci.electronics.repair,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 23:05:23 GMT, "DaveW" <none@zero.org> wrote:

>Hmmm ... I think you should more seriously be thinking about an Antec 550
>Watt True Power supply.

With that many Hd's I'd be thinking about dedicating one good psu to
the motherboard and the optical drives/floppy and using separate
supplies for alll those Hd's.(maybe 2 drives to a psu rated at at
least 350-400 watts.)
Depends on what type of computing you'll doing and how intensive too.
October 13, 2004 5:53:07 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,sci.electronics.components,sci.electronics.repair,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 21:23:10 GMT, Al Smith <invalid@address.com>
wrote:

>>>Would a decent 350W PSU be enough? I am thinking of this Nexus PSU.
>>>> http://www.nexustek.nl/nx3500.htm The specification chart shows
>>>> current delivery at min load, normal load, max load:
>>>>
>>>> +3.3V 0.3A 14.0A 21.2/28A
>>>> +5V 1.0A 12.7A 30/25.5A
>>>> +12V 0.2A 4.5A 16A
>>>>
>>>> (1) +3.3V & +5V total output not exceed 220Watt.
>>>> (1a) When +3.3V is loaded to 28A, then the +5V maximum load is 25.5A.
>>>> (1b) When +3.3V is loaded to 21.2A, the +5V maximum load is 30A.
>>>> (2) +3.3V & +5V & +12V total output not exceed 330Watt.
>>>>
>>>> ---
>>>>
>>>> Is this any good for my needs?
>>
>>
>> With 6 drives I'd go with a larger power supply, get at least a 450W
>> supply or even larger. An Antec 550W supply is only $108. You don't want
>> to waste your time hunting down system glitches because you saved 30 bucks
>> on a power supply.
>>
>
>You don't want to waste $30 for nothing, either.

Yes you do. The lowest rated supply I use for Athalon systems is 400
watts, and that is only with one HD.
Anymore and I go with a 500 watt.
Believe me if you really try and do any serious computing loads with
an under rated power supply you're asking for serious migraines.
October 13, 2004 5:57:34 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,sci.electronics.components,sci.electronics.repair,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 22:20:30 +0100, "Christo" <chris@juststuff.co.uk>
wrote:

>i know very little about pwer, but from what i know a 350w will be ok, a
>decent one though, i have a cheap one and i keep getting IRQL errors, im not
>sure if they are related to the PSU or memory, but someone at uni has told
>me a 400w PSU is reccomended with all AMD Athlon XP's
>
Correct. And that is the lowest one should use.
I do video/film editing on Athalons and anything lower than 400 will
give you constant locks and blue screens.
The inrush and overcurrent ratings are critical too.
At least 30 on the 5v and 25 on the 12v is required.
You can NEVER have to much power.
A good trick is to split the load between multiple psu, does require a
bit of moding though.
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 13, 2004 8:44:48 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,sci.electronics.components,sci.electronics.repair,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

"General Schvantzkoph" <schvantzkoph@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:p an.2004.10.12.16.41.25.775421@yahoo.com...
> On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 15:06:35 +0100, Franklin wrote:
>
> > What rating PSU should I use on a system which has an Athlon 2400+
> > with a modest graphics card (old GeForce2 MX 32MB) and 768 MB of SD-
> > RAM. Unusually, it will have *SIX* IDE internal hard drives.
> >
> > All the rest of the system is pretty normal with no overclocking on
> > the cpu.
> >
> > Would a decent 350W PSU be enough? I am thinking of this Nexus PSU.
> > http://www.nexustek.nl/nx3500.htm The specification chart shows
> > current delivery at min load, normal load, max load:
> >
> > +3.3V 0.3A 14.0A 21.2/28A
> > +5V 1.0A 12.7A 30/25.5A
> > +12V 0.2A 4.5A 16A
> >
> > (1) +3.3V & +5V total output not exceed 220Watt.
> > (1a) When +3.3V is loaded to 28A, then the +5V maximum load is
25.5A.
> > (1b) When +3.3V is loaded to 21.2A, the +5V maximum load is 30A.
> > (2) +3.3V & +5V & +12V total output not exceed 330Watt.
> >
> > ---
> >
> > Is this any good for my needs?
>
> With 6 drives I'd go with a larger power supply, get at least a 450W
> supply or even larger. An Antec 550W supply is only $108. You don't
want
> to waste your time hunting down system glitches because you saved 30
bucks
> on a power supply.

The wattage is important, but int his case, the +12V is more important
because of the very high +12V current needed to start up the hard disks.
Someone else mentioned 2A per HDD at atartup but there are also other
+12V loads, such as the fans. So getting a PSU that has a lot higher
than usual +12V current rating is a _must_.

One other important thing. Putting 6 hard disks in a case demands that
there be a lot of air circulating around them. If you don't keep thenm
cool, then the ones closest to the middle of the stack will overheat and
die. I've seen that happen in servers. You might consider using
external HDDs if you have problems.
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 13, 2004 8:49:59 AM

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"Don Burnette" <d.burnette@clothes.comcast.net> wrote in message
news:D OCdnSqUMKM3kfHcRVn-gw@giganews.com...
> Franklin wrote:
> > What rating PSU should I use on a system which has an Athlon 2400+
> > with a modest graphics card (old GeForce2 MX 32MB) and 768 MB of SD-
> > RAM. Unusually, it will have *SIX* IDE internal hard drives.
> >
> > All the rest of the system is pretty normal with no overclocking on
> > the cpu.
> >
> > Would a decent 350W PSU be enough? I am thinking of this Nexus PSU.
> > http://www.nexustek.nl/nx3500.htm The specification chart shows
> > current delivery at min load, normal load, max load:
> >
> > +3.3V 0.3A 14.0A 21.2/28A
> > +5V 1.0A 12.7A 30/25.5A
> > +12V 0.2A 4.5A 16A
> >
> > (1) +3.3V & +5V total output not exceed 220Watt.
> > (1a) When +3.3V is loaded to 28A, then the +5V maximum load is
25.5A.
> > (1b) When +3.3V is loaded to 21.2A, the +5V maximum load is 30A.
> > (2) +3.3V & +5V & +12V total output not exceed 330Watt.
> >
> > ---
> >
> > Is this any good for my needs?
>
> You really can't have too much, but you can have too little.

What kind of twisted logic made you come up with that statement?
Why don't you say what you _really_ mean?
"You really should buy a PSU that has too much, rather than too little
power."


> When it comes to power supplies, I would just get a good name - like
Antec
> True Power, around 430 watt to be safe.

> --
> Don Burnette
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 13, 2004 8:50:41 AM

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"rstlne" <.@text.news.virgin.net> wrote in message
news:0EVad.1414$cm4.260@newsfe1-win.ntli.net...
> >
> > You really can't have too much, but you can have too little.
> >
> > When it comes to power supplies, I would just get a good name - like
Antec
> > True Power, around 430 watt to be safe.
>
> Heh..
> I dunno
> Climb a highline pole and put a 5v light across the 15kv lines ;P

Brilliant!!
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 13, 2004 11:46:08 AM

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Watson A.Name - "Watt Sun, the Dark Remover" wrote:

> "rstlne" <.@text.news.virgin.net> wrote in message
> news:0EVad.1414$cm4.260@newsfe1-win.ntli.net...
>
>>>You really can't have too much, but you can have too little.
>>>
>>>When it comes to power supplies, I would just get a good name - like
>
> Antec
>
>>>True Power, around 430 watt to be safe.
>>
>>Heh..
>>I dunno
>>Climb a highline pole and put a 5v light across the 15kv lines ;P
>
>
> Brilliant!!
>

Briefly
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 13, 2004 11:55:14 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,sci.electronics.components,sci.electronics.repair,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 01:53:07 -0500, none
<gothika@bellsouth.net> wrote:

>On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 21:23:10 GMT, Al Smith <invalid@address.com>
>wrote:
>
>>>>Would a decent 350W PSU be enough? I am thinking of this Nexus PSU.
>>>>> http://www.nexustek.nl/nx3500.htm The specification chart shows
>>>>> current delivery at min load, normal load, max load:
>>>>>
>>>>> +3.3V 0.3A 14.0A 21.2/28A
>>>>> +5V 1.0A 12.7A 30/25.5A
>>>>> +12V 0.2A 4.5A 16A
>>>>>
>>>>> (1) +3.3V & +5V total output not exceed 220Watt.
>>>>> (1a) When +3.3V is loaded to 28A, then the +5V maximum load is 25.5A.
>>>>> (1b) When +3.3V is loaded to 21.2A, the +5V maximum load is 30A.
>>>>> (2) +3.3V & +5V & +12V total output not exceed 330Watt.
>>>>>
>>>>> ---
>>>>>
>>>>> Is this any good for my needs?
>>>
>>>
>>> With 6 drives I'd go with a larger power supply, get at least a 450W
>>> supply or even larger. An Antec 550W supply is only $108. You don't want
>>> to waste your time hunting down system glitches because you saved 30 bucks
>>> on a power supply.
>>>
>>
>>You don't want to waste $30 for nothing, either.
>
>Yes you do. The lowest rated supply I use for Athalon systems is 400
>watts, and that is only with one HD.
>Anymore and I go with a 500 watt.
>Believe me if you really try and do any serious computing loads with
>an under rated power supply you're asking for serious migraines.


It's true that an insufficient power supply can cause both
instability and eventual damage, but the typical Athlon
system does not need 400W, and there is almost no "PC"
system that needs 500W, even if the vast majority of the
current were concentrated on only the 5V or 12V rail.

With a typical PC, that being current-gen CPU, a couple hard
drives, budget/low-end video card, etc, 300W PSU in a good
name brand is sufficient. SFF systems demonstrate every day
that even a 180-250W PSU will run a modern built with enough
margin for another hard drive or two... but the PSU may need
replaced sooner.

Generics on the other hand, are a lottery. Their wattage
rating means almost nothing, they can only be assumed to be
somewhere inbetween 200W and 400W without further evidence.
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 13, 2004 11:58:35 AM

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On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 01:57:34 -0500, none
<gothika@bellsouth.net> wrote:

>On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 22:20:30 +0100, "Christo" <chris@juststuff.co.uk>
>wrote:
>
>>i know very little about pwer, but from what i know a 350w will be ok, a
>>decent one though, i have a cheap one and i keep getting IRQL errors, im not
>>sure if they are related to the PSU or memory, but someone at uni has told
>>me a 400w PSU is reccomended with all AMD Athlon XP's
>>
>Correct. And that is the lowest one should use.
>I do video/film editing on Athalons and anything lower than 400 will
>give you constant locks and blue screens.
>The inrush and overcurrent ratings are critical too.
>At least 30 on the 5v and 25 on the 12v is required.
>You can NEVER have to much power.
>A good trick is to split the load between multiple psu, does require a
>bit of moding though.

Not true. I also have done quite a bit of video editing and
other full loads for extended periods of time and am quite
sure that 30A on 5V is not needed if CPU doesn't use 5V for
VRM circuit, and that even if CPU uses 12V for VRM circuit,
it will not need 25A. If you had instability you either
have very atypically high load beyond what was mentioned, or
very poor power supplies.... like generics that are quite
overrated.
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 13, 2004 1:22:57 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,sci.electronics.components,sci.electronics.repair,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 07:55:14 +0000, kony wrote:

> On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 01:53:07 -0500, none
> <gothika@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>
>>On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 21:23:10 GMT, Al Smith <invalid@address.com>
>>wrote:
>>
>>>>>Would a decent 350W PSU be enough? I am thinking of this Nexus PSU.
>>>>>> http://www.nexustek.nl/nx3500.htm The specification chart shows
>>>>>> current delivery at min load, normal load, max load:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> +3.3V 0.3A 14.0A 21.2/28A
>>>>>> +5V 1.0A 12.7A 30/25.5A
>>>>>> +12V 0.2A 4.5A 16A
>>>>>>
>>>>>> (1) +3.3V & +5V total output not exceed 220Watt.
>>>>>> (1a) When +3.3V is loaded to 28A, then the +5V maximum load is 25.5A.
>>>>>> (1b) When +3.3V is loaded to 21.2A, the +5V maximum load is 30A.
>>>>>> (2) +3.3V & +5V & +12V total output not exceed 330Watt.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ---
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Is this any good for my needs?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> With 6 drives I'd go with a larger power supply, get at least a 450W
>>>> supply or even larger. An Antec 550W supply is only $108. You don't want
>>>> to waste your time hunting down system glitches because you saved 30 bucks
>>>> on a power supply.
>>>>
>>>
>>>You don't want to waste $30 for nothing, either.
>>
>>Yes you do. The lowest rated supply I use for Athalon systems is 400
>>watts, and that is only with one HD.
>>Anymore and I go with a 500 watt.
>>Believe me if you really try and do any serious computing loads with
>>an under rated power supply you're asking for serious migraines.
>
>
> It's true that an insufficient power supply can cause both
> instability and eventual damage, but the typical Athlon
> system does not need 400W, and there is almost no "PC"
> system that needs 500W, even if the vast majority of the
> current were concentrated on only the 5V or 12V rail.
>
> With a typical PC, that being current-gen CPU, a couple hard
> drives, budget/low-end video card, etc, 300W PSU in a good
> name brand is sufficient. SFF systems demonstrate every day
> that even a 180-250W PSU will run a modern built with enough
> margin for another hard drive or two... but the PSU may need
> replaced sooner.
>
> Generics on the other hand, are a lottery. Their wattage
> rating means almost nothing, they can only be assumed to be
> somewhere inbetween 200W and 400W without further evidence.

The OP seems to be talking about a file server not a desktop PC. It's
hard to imagine why you would need 6 drives on a desktop. The disks are
going to be working much harder in a file server then they would be in a
PC. The symptom of a power supply problem on a file server is that a disk
suddenly drops off line, they system continues to run but you've lost that
drive until you do a reboot. It's very annoying. It's much better to spend
a few more dollars to get a robust supply. There will be $1000 worth of
drives in that system, it's silly to worry about 30 or 40 bucks extra for
a 550W supply vs a 350W.
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 13, 2004 1:26:46 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,sci.electronics.components,sci.electronics.repair,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

> One other important thing. Putting 6 hard disks in a case demands that
> there be a lot of air circulating around them. If you don't keep thenm
> cool, then the ones closest to the middle of the stack will overheat and
> die. I've seen that happen in servers. You might consider using
> external HDDs if you have problems.

You solve the problem by getting a server case that's designed to handle a
large number of drives. You want a case that has good air flow over all of
the drives. It's OK to passively cool a single drive in a desktop machine
because desktop drives have very little activity. In a fileserver the
drives work much harder so you need to blow air over them to keep them
cool.
October 13, 2004 1:38:59 PM

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"larrymoencurly" <larrymoencurly@my-deja.com> wrote in message
news:755e968a.0410121254.487a0a0c@posting.google.com...
>> "Franklin" <no_thanks@mail.com> wrote in message
>> news:958099B49C7BC71F3M4@130.133.1.4...
>
>> > What rating PSU should I use on a system which has an Athlon 2400+
>> > with a modest graphics card (old GeForce2 MX 32MB) and 768 MB of SD-
>> > RAM. Unusually, it will have *SIX* IDE internal hard drives.
>> >
>> > All the rest of the system is pretty normal with no overclocking on
>> > the cpu.
>> >
>> > Would a decent 350W PSU be enough? I am thinking of this Nexus PSU.
>> > http://www.nexustek.nl/nx3500.htm
>
> Nexus is made by Fortron-Source, one of the best PSU makers in the
> world, but I don't know if the 16A @ +12V is enough for all that
> hardware. One person found that his XP1800+ system with five HDs
> (RPM unknown) and a couple of CD drives consumed only 160W from the AC
> lines, meaning that the computer was taking about 120W. And in 2002
> C'T magazine measured several computers equipped with XP2400+ CPUs,
> 256M DDR, and GeForce3/Ti500 graphics cards and found that it took
> about 9A @ +12V, 2-4A @ +5V, and 9-12A @ +3.3V.

The problems tend to be under peak load, especially at cold boot. At cold
boot, when all the disks are spinning up for the first time, likewise the
fans, likewise the CPU initialising, the peak current required can be much
higher. And then you find problems like perhaps your soundcard doesn't
always initialise properly (which used to happen to me with an old Enermax
350w PSU).

Chip
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 13, 2004 7:42:25 PM

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On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 09:22:57 -0400, General Schvantzkoph
<schvantzkoph@yahoo.com> wrote:


>> It's true that an insufficient power supply can cause both
>> instability and eventual damage, but the typical Athlon
>> system does not need 400W, and there is almost no "PC"
>> system that needs 500W, even if the vast majority of the
>> current were concentrated on only the 5V or 12V rail.
>>
>> With a typical PC, that being current-gen CPU, a couple hard
>> drives, budget/low-end video card, etc, 300W PSU in a good
>> name brand is sufficient. SFF systems demonstrate every day
>> that even a 180-250W PSU will run a modern built with enough
>> margin for another hard drive or two... but the PSU may need
>> replaced sooner.
>>
>> Generics on the other hand, are a lottery. Their wattage
>> rating means almost nothing, they can only be assumed to be
>> somewhere inbetween 200W and 400W without further evidence.
>
>The OP seems to be talking about a file server not a desktop PC. It's
>hard to imagine why you would need 6 drives on a desktop. The disks are
>going to be working much harder in a file server then they would be in a
>PC. The symptom of a power supply problem on a file server is that a disk
>suddenly drops off line, they system continues to run but you've lost that
>drive until you do a reboot. It's very annoying. It's much better to spend
>a few more dollars to get a robust supply. There will be $1000 worth of
>drives in that system, it's silly to worry about 30 or 40 bucks extra for
>a 550W supply vs a 350W.
>

Possibly a file server but then why the Athlon XP2400?
Seems a bit overpowered if the goal is to minimize power
usage, or rather, buy an economical PSU for the role played.

Even so you may be right, _IF_ the drives, data, or
function, productivity loss is significant from a failure
then it's easily justifiable to budget more for larger
wattage PSU.
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 13, 2004 8:09:27 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,sci.electronics.components,sci.electronics.repair,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

Matt wrote:
> none wrote:
>
>> With that many Hd's I'd be thinking about dedicating one good psu to
>> the motherboard and the optical drives/floppy and using separate
>> supplies for alll those Hd's.(maybe 2 drives to a psu rated at at
>> least 350-400 watts.)

That way, he would have about 250-300 watts left over on each!
>
> That way he could avoid about a half hour's mental work.
>
> Except he would have to figure how to rig a computer using four power
> supplies instead of one.

Or he could put a 12V automobile storage battery and charger under the
desk and hook all the drive's 12V input to that! ;-) That way if he had
a power failure, the drives would keep spinning and upon power return,
he wouldn't have to let them warm up as another poster suggested. :-(

Seriously, once the drives are spun up, they require only ~1 A each.
Fans have even less requirements: < 1/2 A each.

Some motherboards and video cards use considerable 12V power, but this
is not the case here.

Having more real real available than is required does nothing for
stability or anything else!

Virg Wall
--
A foolish consistency is the
hobgoblin of little minds,........
Ralph Waldo Emerson
(Microsoft programmer's manual.)
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 13, 2004 8:29:00 PM

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On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 15:06:35 +0100, Franklin <no_thanks@mail.com> wrote:

>What rating PSU should I use on a system which has an Athlon 2400+
>with a modest graphics card (old GeForce2 MX 32MB) and 768 MB of SD-
>RAM. Unusually, it will have *SIX* IDE internal hard drives.
>
>All the rest of the system is pretty normal with no overclocking on
>the cpu.
>
>Would a decent 350W PSU be enough? I am thinking of this Nexus PSU.
>http://www.nexustek.nl/nx3500.htm The specification chart shows
>current delivery at min load, normal load, max load:
>
>+3.3V 0.3A 14.0A 21.2/28A
>+5V 1.0A 12.7A 30/25.5A
>+12V 0.2A 4.5A 16A
>
>(1) +3.3V & +5V total output not exceed 220Watt.
>(1a) When +3.3V is loaded to 28A, then the +5V maximum load is 25.5A.
>(1b) When +3.3V is loaded to 21.2A, the +5V maximum load is 30A.
>(2) +3.3V & +5V & +12V total output not exceed 330Watt.
>
>---
>
>Is this any good for my needs?

Thermaltake 420 watt PurePower $39.00
An excellent power supply that will meet your needs.
http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?descripti...

regards

Dud
--

You! Out of the gene pool!
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 13, 2004 9:03:07 PM

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On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 01:45:38 -0500, none <gothika@bellsouth.net>
wrote:

>On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 23:05:23 GMT, "DaveW" <none@zero.org> wrote:
>
>>Hmmm ... I think you should more seriously be thinking about an Antec 550
>>Watt True Power supply.
>
>With that many Hd's I'd be thinking about dedicating one good psu to
>the motherboard and the optical drives/floppy and using separate
>supplies for alll those Hd's.(maybe 2 drives to a psu rated at at
>least 350-400 watts.)
>Depends on what type of computing you'll doing and how intensive too.

I forget, but do the drives use both +5 and +12, and, if so, will this
arrangement be enough to regulate a supply?

Tom
October 13, 2004 10:45:15 PM

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"Tom MacIntyre" <tom__macintyre@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:p unqm0ht6vikt57vqnc1hj0nu1gniqqa8j@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 01:45:38 -0500, none <gothika@bellsouth.net>
> wrote:
>
>>On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 23:05:23 GMT, "DaveW" <none@zero.org> wrote:
>>
>>>Hmmm ... I think you should more seriously be thinking about an Antec 550
>>>Watt True Power supply.
>>
>>With that many Hd's I'd be thinking about dedicating one good psu to
>>the motherboard and the optical drives/floppy and using separate
>>supplies for alll those Hd's.(maybe 2 drives to a psu rated at at
>>least 350-400 watts.)
>>Depends on what type of computing you'll doing and how intensive too.
>
> I forget, but do the drives use both +5 and +12,

Yes.

> and, if so, will this
> arrangement be enough to regulate a supply?

I don't know what you mean by that.

Chip
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 13, 2004 10:45:16 PM

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On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 18:45:15 +0100, "Chip" <anneonymouse@virgin.net>
wrote:

>
>"Tom MacIntyre" <tom__macintyre@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>news:p unqm0ht6vikt57vqnc1hj0nu1gniqqa8j@4ax.com...
>> On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 01:45:38 -0500, none <gothika@bellsouth.net>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 23:05:23 GMT, "DaveW" <none@zero.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>>Hmmm ... I think you should more seriously be thinking about an Antec 550
>>>>Watt True Power supply.
>>>
>>>With that many Hd's I'd be thinking about dedicating one good psu to
>>>the motherboard and the optical drives/floppy and using separate
>>>supplies for alll those Hd's.(maybe 2 drives to a psu rated at at
>>>least 350-400 watts.)
>>>Depends on what type of computing you'll doing and how intensive too.
>>
>> I forget, but do the drives use both +5 and +12,
>
>Yes.
>
>> and, if so, will this
>> arrangement be enough to regulate a supply?
>
>I don't know what you mean by that.
>
>Chip
>
Computer supplies need to be regulated to achieve the correct output
voltage, and both the 12 and 5 volt supplies may need to be loaded to
a certain level to achieve this.

Tom
October 13, 2004 10:56:29 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,sci.electronics.components,sci.electronics.repair,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

On 13 Oct 2004, General Schvantzkoph wrote:

> On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 07:55:14 +0000, kony wrote:
>
>> On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 01:53:07 -0500, none
>> <gothika@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>>
>>>On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 21:23:10 GMT, Al Smith
>>><invalid@address.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>>>Would a decent 350W PSU be enough? I am thinking of this
>>>>>>Nexus PSU.
>>>>>>> http://www.nexustek.nl/nx3500.htm The specification chart
>>>>>>> shows current delivery at min load, normal load, max load:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> +3.3V 0.3A 14.0A 21.2/28A
>>>>>>> +5V 1.0A 12.7A 30/25.5A
>>>>>>> +12V 0.2A 4.5A 16A
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> (1) +3.3V & +5V total output not exceed 220Watt.
>>>>>>> (1a) When +3.3V is loaded to 28A, then the +5V maximum
>>>>>>> load is 25.5A. (1b) When +3.3V is loaded to 21.2A, the +5V
>>>>>>> maximum load is 30A. (2) +3.3V & +5V & +12V total output
>>>>>>> not exceed 330Watt.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ---
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Is this any good for my needs?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> With 6 drives I'd go with a larger power supply, get at
>>>>> least a 450W supply or even larger. An Antec 550W supply is
>>>>> only $108. You don't want to waste your time hunting down
>>>>> system glitches because you saved 30 bucks on a power
>>>>> supply.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>You don't want to waste $30 for nothing, either.
>>>
>>>Yes you do. The lowest rated supply I use for Athalon systems
>>>is 400 watts, and that is only with one HD.
>>>Anymore and I go with a 500 watt.
>>>Believe me if you really try and do any serious computing loads
>>>with an under rated power supply you're asking for serious
>>>migraines.
>>
>>
>> It's true that an insufficient power supply can cause both
>> instability and eventual damage, but the typical Athlon
>> system does not need 400W, and there is almost no "PC"
>> system that needs 500W, even if the vast majority of the
>> current were concentrated on only the 5V or 12V rail.
>>
>> With a typical PC, that being current-gen CPU, a couple hard
>> drives, budget/low-end video card, etc, 300W PSU in a good
>> name brand is sufficient. SFF systems demonstrate every day
>> that even a 180-250W PSU will run a modern built with enough
>> margin for another hard drive or two... but the PSU may need
>> replaced sooner.
>>
>> Generics on the other hand, are a lottery. Their wattage
>> rating means almost nothing, they can only be assumed to be
>> somewhere inbetween 200W and 400W without further evidence.


> The OP seems to be talking about a file server not a desktop PC.
> It's hard to imagine why you would need 6 drives on a desktop.

I am the OP. I guess I am a bit weird but it is my home PC on my
desktop and used as a single user system. I have 6 drives to back up
partitions and to store my data.

> The disks are going to be working much harder in a file server
> then they would be in a PC. The symptom of a power supply
> problem on a file server is that a disk suddenly drops off line,
> they system continues to run but you've lost that drive until
> you do a reboot. It's very annoying. It's much better to spend
> a few more dollars to get a robust supply. There will be $1000
> worth of drives in that system, it's silly to worry about 30 or
> 40 bucks extra for a 550W supply vs a 350W.

Nowadays these sort of drives cost about $100 each (for 120 GB or
thereabouts). The older drives cost me more but are even cheaper to
replace at today's cost.
October 13, 2004 11:05:57 PM

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On 13 Oct 2004, General Schvantzkoph wrote:

>> One other important thing. Putting 6 hard disks in a case
>> demands that there be a lot of air circulating around them. If
>> you don't keep thenm cool, then the ones closest to the middle
>> of the stack will overheat and die. I've seen that happen in
>> servers. You might consider using external HDDs if you have
>> problems.
>
> You solve the problem by getting a server case that's designed
> to handle a large number of drives. You want a case that has
> good air flow over all of the drives. It's OK to passively cool
> a single drive in a desktop machine because desktop drives have
> very little activity. In a fileserver the drives work much
> harder so you need to blow air over them to keep them cool.


I am the OP.

I have solved my problem of heat generation by not buying IBM/Hitchi
or Western Digital hard drives. Those drives undoubedly perform well
but they get way too hot and can be a bit too noisy for me.

My hottest drive is a Seagate Barracuda and Dtemp from
http://private.peterlink.ru/tochinov/ says it runs at 41 C. It is
the system drive with most of the read/write action, The other
drives run at a comfortable 30 to 35 C when idling.

My cooling is very simple. I have the PSU fan, the cpu fan and one
80mm case fan which I run at less than half speed to keep the noise
down. The ambient room temp is about 20C.

It is almost a 'bumble-bee' system. I am told that early dynamics
theory calculated that the bumble-bee should not be able to fly.
Theory suggests my PC should not be so cool nor so quiet. But in
real life it works.
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 14, 2004 12:59:59 AM

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Al Smith <invalid@address.com> wrote in message news:<2XXad.147054$Np3.6335131@ursa-nb00s0.nbnet.nb.ca>...
> >>Would a decent 350W PSU be enough? I am thinking of this Nexus PSU.
> >>> http://www.nexustek.nl/nx3500.htm The specification chart shows
> >>> current delivery at min load, normal load, max load:
> >>>
> >>> +3.3V 0.3A 14.0A 21.2/28A
> >>> +5V 1.0A 12.7A 30/25.5A
> >>> +12V 0.2A 4.5A 16A
> >>>
> >>> (1) +3.3V & +5V total output not exceed 220Watt.
> >>> (1a) When +3.3V is loaded to 28A, then the +5V maximum load is 25.5A.
> >>> (1b) When +3.3V is loaded to 21.2A, the +5V maximum load is 30A.
> >>> (2) +3.3V & +5V & +12V total output not exceed 330Watt.
> >>>
> >>> ---
> >>>
> >>> Is this any good for my needs?
> >
> >
> > With 6 drives I'd go with a larger power supply, get at least a 450W
> > supply or even larger. An Antec 550W supply is only $108. You don't want
> > to waste your time hunting down system glitches because you saved 30 bucks
> > on a power supply.
> >
>
> You don't want to waste $30 for nothing, either.

Actually I would. It takes very little time use up $30 tracking down
the problem. And THEN, you STILL have to get the bigger supply. After
the computer and 6 HDDs, $30 is nothing.
My $0.02
gg
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 14, 2004 1:03:03 AM

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On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 18:15:06 GMT, Tom MacIntyre
<tom__macintyre@hotmail.com> wrote:


>>> I forget, but do the drives use both +5 and +12,
>>
>>Yes.
>>
>>> and, if so, will this
>>> arrangement be enough to regulate a supply?
>>
>>I don't know what you mean by that.
>>
>>Chip
>>
>Computer supplies need to be regulated to achieve the correct output
>voltage, and both the 12 and 5 volt supplies may need to be loaded to
>a certain level to achieve this.
>
>Tom


Yes a drive, two at most is plenty of load for regulation
within tolerances on any halfway decent power supply.
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 14, 2004 6:08:19 PM

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In article <10mss5rdnqfa51d@corp.supernews.com>, Watson A.Name - \"Watt
Sun, the Dark Remover\" wrote:
>
>I'm surprised at all the posts that have so many assertions, yet so
>little thought and consideration. I don't think I've yet seen an
>authoritative URL or two to back up those assertions.
>
>Very little solid advice. Like check the hard disk and see what the
>current ratings are, and add them up to get a total. Especially the
>+12VDC because the motor takes quite a bit of current from that.
>
>And I really detest those claims that PCs don't use very much power.
>The most I can get on a 20A circuit is about a dozen, and the breaker
>blows. I figure that's about 150W per PC. And those are old timers,
>like P233s.

How many watts, how many volt-amps, and what's the efficiency as well
as the power factor of the power supply?

- Don Klipstein (don@misty.com)
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 14, 2004 9:25:36 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,sci.electronics.components,sci.electronics.repair,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

On Thu, 14 Oct 2004 15:49:37 GMT, Tom MacIntyre
<tom__macintyre@hotmail.com> wrote:


>>14A of stable, clean power is enough for most basic systems.
>>It might not be sufficient for 6 drives PLUS a CPU using 12V
>>rail for power, nor adding a high-end modern video card, but
>>it would run any typical mid-grade system fine (if that 14A
>>were from a decent PSU).
>
>The CPU doesn't need the 12 VDC, does it?
>
>That is part of the problem with PS choice...the consideration must be
>made for amperage needs for all voltages, not just total power.

Yes, modern P4 or Athlon 64 platforms and many (mostly
nForce2) Athlon XP do use 12V for CPU. The CPU power is
derived from 12V input by step down regulation. Any board
using 12V for CPU power will have the "Intel" 4-pin 12V
connector on it. When there is no 4-pin 12V input the odds
are overwhelming on a "PC" that it's using 5V for CPU power,
as did earlier Athlon & Pentium 3 'boards.
October 14, 2004 10:21:50 PM

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On 12 Oct 2004, kony wrote:
>
> Nexus relabels Sparkle PSU. If you can find a Sparkle (or
> Fortron) 350W for lower price it would be better value.
>
> 350W is enough for your system but if motherboard uses 12V
> for CPU (one sign of that would be that the board uses the
> "Intel" P4 4-pin 12V connector in addition to the ATX 20 pin
> connector) then it would provide more margin to choose 400W
> or higher (Nexus/Sparkle/Fortron will still be a good choice
> in 400W or higher).


Kony, aren't the power requirements (current at certain voltages) of
a mobo fairly fixed? You seem to suggest it is not so.

I had always thought that if I a mobo based on chipset X with a given
Athlon processor (say a T'bred B) then the current at various
voltages required to run this by most mobos on the market is pretty
much the same.

Is there a significant variation in voltages/current required?

Is any such variation mainly due to the design of the mobo? Or is it
mainly due to the choice of components (chipset and processor)?
October 14, 2004 11:21:39 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,sci.electronics.components,sci.electronics.repair,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

"kony" <spam@spam.com> wrote in message
news:eadtm0d5jj9l9l41pgv3gnhqlehdmrjcnt@4ax.com...
> On Thu, 14 Oct 2004 15:49:37 GMT, Tom MacIntyre
> <tom__macintyre@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>>>14A of stable, clean power is enough for most basic systems.
>>>It might not be sufficient for 6 drives PLUS a CPU using 12V
>>>rail for power, nor adding a high-end modern video card, but
>>>it would run any typical mid-grade system fine (if that 14A
>>>were from a decent PSU).
>>
>>The CPU doesn't need the 12 VDC, does it?
>>
>>That is part of the problem with PS choice...the consideration must be
>>made for amperage needs for all voltages, not just total power.
>
> Yes, modern P4 or Athlon 64 platforms and many (mostly
> nForce2) Athlon XP do use 12V for CPU. The CPU power is
> derived from 12V input by step down regulation. Any board
> using 12V for CPU power will have the "Intel" 4-pin 12V
> connector on it. When there is no 4-pin 12V input the odds
> are overwhelming on a "PC" that it's using 5V for CPU power,
> as did earlier Athlon & Pentium 3 'boards.

I think you may be mistaken there. I have come across a number of boards
that don't have the 4-pin connector, but still run the CPU off the 12v
supply. The Albatron nf2 board is one that springs to mind.

Chip
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 14, 2004 11:21:40 PM

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On Thu, 14 Oct 2004 19:21:39 +0100, "Chip"
<anneonymouse@virgin.net> wrote:


>>>The CPU doesn't need the 12 VDC, does it?
>>>
>>>That is part of the problem with PS choice...the consideration must be
>>>made for amperage needs for all voltages, not just total power.
>>
>> Yes, modern P4 or Athlon 64 platforms and many (mostly
>> nForce2) Athlon XP do use 12V for CPU. The CPU power is
>> derived from 12V input by step down regulation. Any board
>> using 12V for CPU power will have the "Intel" 4-pin 12V
>> connector on it. When there is no 4-pin 12V input the odds
>> are overwhelming on a "PC" that it's using 5V for CPU power,
>> as did earlier Athlon & Pentium 3 'boards.
>
>I think you may be mistaken there. I have come across a number of boards
>that don't have the 4-pin connector, but still run the CPU off the 12v
>supply. The Albatron nf2 board is one that springs to mind.

Nope, then it uses 5V for CPU. What made you think it used
12V? Measure it with a multimeter.

If this is the Albatron you're referring to,
http://www.amdboard.com/km18g-pro.jpg
it clearly is only 2 phase VRM, 5V CPU power.

If you have other boards in mind, supply link to a decent
picture. There are definitely NONE from any remotely
recognizable mainstream motherboard manufacturers, except
those not traditionally considered "PC" boards... something
using EPS 24 pin ATX or another deviation from the 20 pin
ATX connector. The reason for this is that no competent
designer will derive CPU power from a single 12V lead on the
ATX 20-pin wiring harness.
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 14, 2004 11:29:57 PM

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"Chip" <anneonymouse@virgin.net> wrote in message news:<2t7c2mF1shd7gU1@uni-berlin.de>...

"Qtec" - for example - are a very popular low-end
> brand. You might refer to them as a no-name, but arguably they are one step
> up from that. They produce a very popular 550w PSU.
>
> The first thing to note is that by 550w, they mean *Peak*. Which basically
> means nothing at all.

I didn't believe it until I visited their website. This has got to be
the first time that a company has admitted that its most prominently
advertised power rating was for peak power. Is it a sign of greater
honesty, or of lower standards?

Are you sure that Q-tec is a step above no-names? This picture of the
insides of their 550W model: www.bit-tech.net/images/review/123/7.jpg
Makes i seem more like a decent 250W.
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 14, 2004 11:32:21 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,sci.electronics.components,sci.electronics.repair,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

On Thu, 14 Oct 2004 18:21:50 +0100, Franklin
<no_thanks@mail.com> wrote:

>On 12 Oct 2004, kony wrote:
>>
>> Nexus relabels Sparkle PSU. If you can find a Sparkle (or
>> Fortron) 350W for lower price it would be better value.
>>
>> 350W is enough for your system but if motherboard uses 12V
>> for CPU (one sign of that would be that the board uses the
>> "Intel" P4 4-pin 12V connector in addition to the ATX 20 pin
>> connector) then it would provide more margin to choose 400W
>> or higher (Nexus/Sparkle/Fortron will still be a good choice
>> in 400W or higher).
>
>
>Kony, aren't the power requirements (current at certain voltages) of
>a mobo fairly fixed? You seem to suggest it is not so.

No, the voltage may be constant but just like with a CPU,
higher frequency causes higher current.


>
>I had always thought that if I a mobo based on chipset X with a given
>Athlon processor (say a T'bred B) then the current at various
>voltages required to run this by most mobos on the market is pretty
>much the same.

I don't understand what you're trying to say.

>
>Is there a significant variation in voltages/current required?
>
>Is any such variation mainly due to the design of the mobo? Or is it
>mainly due to the choice of components (chipset and processor)?

Any/all of these can vary current. One board may default
memory to different voltage, another may be running at
higher FSB speed, then the obvious things like chipset or
processor count too... these differences could offset each
other or add up to a signficant difference in some cases.
Even so, the difference between one motherboard and another
will often be much less than the difference between one CPU
or another (if large enough frequency or voltage, core
change), or comparing a budget video card to a high-end
model, or number of hard drives.
October 15, 2004 12:27:25 AM

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"kony" <spam@spam.com> wrote in message
news:tvitm09vdcmttobqj6ag8j0a5slu3airun@4ax.com...
> On Thu, 14 Oct 2004 19:21:39 +0100, "Chip"
> <anneonymouse@virgin.net> wrote:
>
>
>>>>The CPU doesn't need the 12 VDC, does it?
>>>>
>>>>That is part of the problem with PS choice...the consideration must be
>>>>made for amperage needs for all voltages, not just total power.
>>>
>>> Yes, modern P4 or Athlon 64 platforms and many (mostly
>>> nForce2) Athlon XP do use 12V for CPU. The CPU power is
>>> derived from 12V input by step down regulation. Any board
>>> using 12V for CPU power will have the "Intel" 4-pin 12V
>>> connector on it. When there is no 4-pin 12V input the odds
>>> are overwhelming on a "PC" that it's using 5V for CPU power,
>>> as did earlier Athlon & Pentium 3 'boards.
>>
>>I think you may be mistaken there. I have come across a number of boards
>>that don't have the 4-pin connector, but still run the CPU off the 12v
>>supply. The Albatron nf2 board is one that springs to mind.
>
> Nope, then it uses 5V for CPU. What made you think it used
> 12V? Measure it with a multimeter.
>
> If this is the Albatron you're referring to,
> http://www.amdboard.com/km18g-pro.jpg
> it clearly is only 2 phase VRM, 5V CPU power.

No, its not. As soon as I posted I thought perhaps on reflection it was not
their nf2 board.

>
> If you have other boards in mind, supply link to a decent
> picture.

I will if I can find it. I specifically remember a review of an Albatron
board where they were questioning the sanity of the designers not including
the P4 connector on a 12V board. Perhaps it was the KT600 or KT880 board, I
can't remember.

> There are definitely NONE from any remotely
> recognizable mainstream motherboard manufacturers, except
> those not traditionally considered "PC" boards... something
> using EPS 24 pin ATX or another deviation from the 20 pin
> ATX connector. The reason for this is that no competent
> designer will derive CPU power from a single 12V lead on the
> ATX 20-pin wiring harness.

Not so. See my comment above.

Chip
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 15, 2004 12:27:26 AM

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On Thu, 14 Oct 2004 20:27:25 +0100, "Chip"
<anneonymouse@virgin.net> wrote:

>
>"kony" <spam@spam.com> wrote in message
>news:tvitm09vdcmttobqj6ag8j0a5slu3airun@4ax.com...
>> On Thu, 14 Oct 2004 19:21:39 +0100, "Chip"
>> <anneonymouse@virgin.net> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>>>The CPU doesn't need the 12 VDC, does it?
>>>>>
>>>>>That is part of the problem with PS choice...the consideration must be
>>>>>made for amperage needs for all voltages, not just total power.
>>>>
>>>> Yes, modern P4 or Athlon 64 platforms and many (mostly
>>>> nForce2) Athlon XP do use 12V for CPU. The CPU power is
>>>> derived from 12V input by step down regulation. Any board
>>>> using 12V for CPU power will have the "Intel" 4-pin 12V
>>>> connector on it. When there is no 4-pin 12V input the odds
>>>> are overwhelming on a "PC" that it's using 5V for CPU power,
>>>> as did earlier Athlon & Pentium 3 'boards.
>>>
>>>I think you may be mistaken there. I have come across a number of boards
>>>that don't have the 4-pin connector, but still run the CPU off the 12v
>>>supply. The Albatron nf2 board is one that springs to mind.
>>
>> Nope, then it uses 5V for CPU. What made you think it used
>> 12V? Measure it with a multimeter.
>>
>> If this is the Albatron you're referring to,
>> http://www.amdboard.com/km18g-pro.jpg
>> it clearly is only 2 phase VRM, 5V CPU power.
>
>No, its not. As soon as I posted I thought perhaps on reflection it was not
>their nf2 board.
>
>>
>> If you have other boards in mind, supply link to a decent
>> picture.
>
>I will if I can find it. I specifically remember a review of an Albatron
>board where they were questioning the sanity of the designers not including
>the P4 connector on a 12V board. Perhaps it was the KT600 or KT880 board, I
>can't remember.

Ah, but the thing is, reviewers are often kids who barely
know what they're doing. Being "in print" doesn't make it
factual... something you will understand better when you are
older.


>
>> There are definitely NONE from any remotely
>> recognizable mainstream motherboard manufacturers, except
>> those not traditionally considered "PC" boards... something
>> using EPS 24 pin ATX or another deviation from the 20 pin
>> ATX connector. The reason for this is that no competent
>> designer will derive CPU power from a single 12V lead on the
>> ATX 20-pin wiring harness.
>
>Not so. See my comment above.

To be kind, you have assumed something that isn't true, or
trusted someone (a reviewer?) who is clueless. Some
reviewers I've corresponded with just don't have enough
experience to realize that even though AMD's later design
guides recommend 12V for CPU power, that doesn't mean all
motherboard manufacturers do so. They are headstrong and
foolish to never bother testing their theories, or bothering
to take voltage measurements.

There are no brand name boards having _ONLY_ 20 pin ATX
conn. that use 12V for CPU. If you do find a clueless
reviewer that claims differently, be sure to keep looking at
other reviews of the same motherboard before trusting a
reviewer who is in error.

I seriously doubt that even an unknown very poor generic
board manufacturer would have an engineer competent enough
to get any motherboard working, but would make the mistake
of trying to power CPU by 12V without 2nd 12V input, whether
it be from a 24 pin connector or 2nd, 4-pin connector or
something less common/proprietary.
October 15, 2004 12:46:05 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,sci.electronics.components,sci.electronics.repair,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

"kony" <spam@spam.com> wrote in message
news:tvitm09vdcmttobqj6ag8j0a5slu3airun@4ax.com...
> On Thu, 14 Oct 2004 19:21:39 +0100, "Chip"
> <anneonymouse@virgin.net> wrote:
>
>
>>>>The CPU doesn't need the 12 VDC, does it?
>>>>
>>>>That is part of the problem with PS choice...the consideration must be
>>>>made for amperage needs for all voltages, not just total power.
>>>
>>> Yes, modern P4 or Athlon 64 platforms and many (mostly
>>> nForce2) Athlon XP do use 12V for CPU. The CPU power is
>>> derived from 12V input by step down regulation. Any board
>>> using 12V for CPU power will have the "Intel" 4-pin 12V
>>> connector on it. When there is no 4-pin 12V input the odds
>>> are overwhelming on a "PC" that it's using 5V for CPU power,
>>> as did earlier Athlon & Pentium 3 'boards.
>>
>>I think you may be mistaken there. I have come across a number of boards
>>that don't have the 4-pin connector, but still run the CPU off the 12v
>>supply. The Albatron nf2 board is one that springs to mind.
>
> Nope, then it uses 5V for CPU. What made you think it used
> 12V? Measure it with a multimeter.
>
> If this is the Albatron you're referring to,
> http://www.amdboard.com/km18g-pro.jpg
> it clearly is only 2 phase VRM, 5V CPU power.

When you say "clearly", how can you be clear that its 5V CPU power? I can
see how you can deduce whether its two or three phase, but how can you tell
its a 5v design?

Chip
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 15, 2004 12:46:06 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,sci.electronics.components,sci.electronics.repair,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

On Thu, 14 Oct 2004 20:46:05 +0100, "Chip"
<anneonymouse@virgin.net> wrote:

>
>"kony" <spam@spam.com> wrote in message
>news:tvitm09vdcmttobqj6ag8j0a5slu3airun@4ax.com...
>> On Thu, 14 Oct 2004 19:21:39 +0100, "Chip"
>> <anneonymouse@virgin.net> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>>>The CPU doesn't need the 12 VDC, does it?
>>>>>
>>>>>That is part of the problem with PS choice...the consideration must be
>>>>>made for amperage needs for all voltages, not just total power.
>>>>
>>>> Yes, modern P4 or Athlon 64 platforms and many (mostly
>>>> nForce2) Athlon XP do use 12V for CPU. The CPU power is
>>>> derived from 12V input by step down regulation. Any board
>>>> using 12V for CPU power will have the "Intel" 4-pin 12V
>>>> connector on it. When there is no 4-pin 12V input the odds
>>>> are overwhelming on a "PC" that it's using 5V for CPU power,
>>>> as did earlier Athlon & Pentium 3 'boards.
>>>
>>>I think you may be mistaken there. I have come across a number of boards
>>>that don't have the 4-pin connector, but still run the CPU off the 12v
>>>supply. The Albatron nf2 board is one that springs to mind.
>>
>> Nope, then it uses 5V for CPU. What made you think it used
>> 12V? Measure it with a multimeter.
>>
>> If this is the Albatron you're referring to,
>> http://www.amdboard.com/km18g-pro.jpg
>> it clearly is only 2 phase VRM, 5V CPU power.
>
>When you say "clearly", how can you be clear that its 5V CPU power? I can
>see how you can deduce whether its two or three phase, but how can you tell
>its a 5v design?


Because of the amperage needed plus the 2 phase design,
there is not enough V margin for using 3V, and there isn't
sufficient supply line for 12V. There are no other
high-current rails on a PC power supply.

Then again there's experience, I get bored with same old
plug-part-A-in-slot-B, and hack away at boards just for the
heck of it, haven't had a board in years that I didn't take
voltage measurements on. You start to notice these things
after a while, and then there's overclocking... for extreme
overclocking on an Athlon board that uses 5V for CPU it may
be necessary to suppliment the power plane with a jumper
wire (among other things), as example:
http://69.36.189.159/usr_1034/M7NCG_5V_Mod.jpg
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 15, 2004 2:02:02 AM

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(irrelevant newsgroups removed)

none wrote:
> On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 23:05:23 GMT, "DaveW" <none@zero.org> wrote:
>
>> Hmmm ... I think you should more seriously be thinking about an
>> Antec 550 Watt True Power supply.
>
> With that many Hd's I'd be thinking about dedicating one good psu to
> the motherboard and the optical drives/floppy and using separate
> supplies for alll those Hd's.(maybe 2 drives to a psu rated at at
> least 350-400 watts.)

Umm, wha? That's complete overkill. A high-end drive ideally likes to eat
about 40W spinning up IIRC (mostly on the 12V line), so you'd have about 3A
per drive peak on the 12V line. For any halfway reasonable, or even
completely useless, PSUs you should be able to fit 3 drives/PSU, and
probably 4 or 5 if it's a reasonable one. 20A on the 12V line (with the rest
of the lines essentially unloaded) should be sufficient to power up all 6
drives. Also, if the drives are designed to delay spin-up when they're the
secondary drive, you should be able to handle double the number of drives
per PSU (ie: 6 drives if you've got ~10A available on the 12V line).

Incidentally, does anyone know how many "normal" SATA controllers implement
sequential spin-up?

> Depends on what type of computing you'll doing and how intensive too.

This is irrelevant to how many you can run off a single PSU. Power usage for
even high-end drives is below 10W mark (usally <400mA on 12V, <1A on 5V)
while operating, so you could have all six drives running off a PSU that's
only capable of 3A on the 12V line (though of course they won't have a hope
of spinning up ...).

--
Michael Brown
www.emboss.co.nz : OOS/RSI software and more :) 
Add michael@ to emboss.co.nz - My inbox is always open
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
October 15, 2004 6:37:09 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd,alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

Chip wrote:
[...]
> No. Its 14A. Read it and weep. 14A.
>
> It wouldn't power my laptop.

Damn, you must have short battery life on that laptop :) 

--
Michael Brown
www.emboss.co.nz : OOS/RSI software and more :) 
Add michael@ to emboss.co.nz - My inbox is always open
!