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Motherboards With Bad Caps Epidemic

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Anonymous
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June 20, 2005 7:45:19 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd (More info?)

http://www.spectrum.ieee.org/WEBONLY/resource/feb03/nca...


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Anonymous
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June 20, 2005 5:27:39 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd (More info?)

While most people have known of the issue for some time, I sure didn't know
that a bootleg operation could be responsible for it. Interesting read.

"Ed Light" <nobody@nobody.there> wrote in message
news:47xte.4584$eV4.3574@fed1read01...
> http://www.spectrum.ieee.org/WEBONLY/resource/feb03/nca...
>
>
> --
> Ed Light
>
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>
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Anonymous
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June 20, 2005 5:27:40 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd (More info?)

"Philburg" <philburg2@sbcglobal.net> wrote

> While most people have known of the issue for some time, I sure didn't
> know that a bootleg operation could be responsible for it. Interesting
> read.

It's sure a new one on me, and I follow Tom's, Anand, etc.

I wonder how that poor scientist ended up? Maybe in exile.

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Anonymous
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June 20, 2005 10:31:11 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd (More info?)

"Ed Light" <nobody@nobody.there> wrote in message
news:47xte.4584$eV4.3574@fed1read01...
> http://www.spectrum.ieee.org/WEBONLY/resource/feb03/nca...
>
>
> --
> Ed Light
>
> Smiley :-/
> MS Smiley :-\
>
> Send spam to the FTC at
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More ammunition for a growing problem. I remember reading about the leaky
caps a couple years ago. Some were obviously failing very early. It looks
like the bilk of them have started failingin the last six months. I'm
wondering how large a problem this is going to be.
Anonymous
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June 21, 2005 5:37:46 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd (More info?)

dawg wrote:
> Ed Light wrote:
>> http://www.spectrum.ieee.org/WEBONLY/resource/feb03/nca...
>
> More ammunition for a growing problem. I remember reading about the
> leaky caps a couple years ago.

Do note, of course, that this article is from a bit of two years ago ;) 

> Some were obviously failing very
> early. It looks like the bilk of them have started failingin the last
> six months. I'm wondering how large a problem this is going to be.

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June 22, 2005 1:30:06 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd (More info?)

Michael Brown wrote:
> dawg wrote:
>
>>Ed Light wrote:
>>
>>>http://www.spectrum.ieee.org/WEBONLY/resource/feb03/nca...
>>
>>More ammunition for a growing problem. I remember reading about the
>>leaky caps a couple years ago.
>
>
> Do note, of course, that this article is from a bit of two years ago ;) 

2-3 years ago I had a couple of MSI boards fails with symptoms that made
me suspect bad capaitors, though I couldn't see any obvious leakage. I
found it most cost-effective at the time to just replace the
motherboards with newer models, as they were out of warranty, and I
wasn't absolutely certain the caps were to blame.

And, as Michael notes, I have not seen much mention of the problem since.

But, a couple of weeks ago, my webserver/firewall/gateway machine (a VIA
c3 on a VIA C3M266 motherboard) after having run almost 2 years without
a glitch began spontaneously rebooting, and after a day or so was
rebooting about once a minute. When I opened it up, most of the 1000uF
caps showed bulging or leakage.

(Slightly more on topic) I checked out replacing it with an undervolted,
underclocked mobile Athlon or Athlon 64, but that was relatively
expensive, and would have ended up using more power and generating more
heat.

I replaced 27 capacitors and now it is running again.

Pete



>
>
>>Some were obviously failing very
>>early. It looks like the bilk of them have started failingin the last
>>six months. I'm wondering how large a problem this is going to be.
>
>
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
a b V Motherboard
June 23, 2005 9:23:52 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd (More info?)

"Ed Light" <nobody@nobody.there> wrote in message
news:47xte.4584$eV4.3574@fed1read01...
> http://www.spectrum.ieee.org/WEBONLY/resource/feb03/nca...
>

Electronics engineers might like to note the bit about..

"capacitor's lifetimes are half or less of the 4000 hours of continuous
ripple current they are rated for."

4000 hours is only 166 days or about 6 months if left on 24/7.
Anonymous
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a b V Motherboard
June 23, 2005 9:23:53 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd (More info?)

"CWatters" <colin.watters@pandoraBOX.be> wrote
>
> Electronics engineers might like to note the bit about..
>
> "capacitor's lifetimes are half or less of the 4000 hours of continuous
> ripple current they are rated for."
>
> 4000 hours is only 166 days or about 6 months if left on 24/7.
>
I've got to think it was a typo.


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Anonymous
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June 24, 2005 3:23:46 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd (More info?)

On Thu, 23 Jun 2005 12:41:52 -0700, Ed Light wrote:

>
> "CWatters" <colin.watters@pandoraBOX.be> wrote
>>
>> Electronics engineers might like to note the bit about..
>>
>> "capacitor's lifetimes are half or less of the 4000 hours of continuous
>> ripple current they are rated for."
>>
>> 4000 hours is only 166 days or about 6 months if left on 24/7.
>>
> I've got to think it was a typo.

yep, I've got an old 486 novell server that's been running 24/7 for about
12 years now.:-)

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June 24, 2005 3:23:47 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd (More info?)

Wes Newell wrote:
> On Thu, 23 Jun 2005 12:41:52 -0700, Ed Light wrote:
>
>
>>"CWatters" <colin.watters@pandoraBOX.be> wrote
>>
>>>Electronics engineers might like to note the bit about..
>>>
>>>"capacitor's lifetimes are half or less of the 4000 hours of continuous
>>>ripple current they are rated for."
>>>
>>>4000 hours is only 166 days or about 6 months if left on 24/7.
>>>
>>
>>I've got to think it was a typo.
>
>
> yep, I've got an old 486 novell server that's been running 24/7 for about
> 12 years now.:-)
>
Actually, they are more often rated at 1000-2000 hours. The ratings
assume max temperature and high ripple, and guarantee that the
capacitance will not drop more than some percentage during that time.

On a motherboard at lower temps with smaller ripple they last much
longer, maybe even 12 years. :-)

There are also generally enough capacitors so that some decrease in
total capacitance is acceptable.

Pete
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
a b V Motherboard
June 24, 2005 3:23:48 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd (More info?)

I wish they would just use mylar caps and charge more.


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Anonymous
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June 24, 2005 11:26:02 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd (More info?)

"Ed Light" <nobody@nobody.there> wrote in message
news:47xte.4584$eV4.3574@fed1read01...
> http://www.spectrum.ieee.org/WEBONLY/resource/feb03/nca...
>
>
> --
> Ed Light
>
> Smiley :-/
> MS Smiley :-\
>
> Send spam to the FTC at
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>
>

That is old news, remember reading it when it came out in January 2003. I
have repaired 4 dual pentium3 motherboards, some twice and tossed 3 others.
I still have 3 alton and pc chips dual P3 running that have virtually all
new caps. I quickly found out about those bad CAPS when I built up my SETI
farm. Got about 78K work units. The real problem motherboards were alton
and pc chips.


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Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
a b V Motherboard
June 24, 2005 5:05:20 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd (More info?)

"Ed Light" <nobody@nobody.there> wrote in message
news:4gEue.284$Qo.26@fed1read01...
> > 4000 hours is only 166 days or about 6 months if left on 24/7.
> >
> I've got to think it was a typo.

Nope. You have to derate them - use a bigger capacitor so that it's not
operating at it's max ripple current, voltage and temperature all the time.
Just one of those real world things that newly qualified electronics
engineers can miss - after all a capacitor is just a capacitor right? Watch
out for the capacitors in cheap power supplies.
Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
a b V Motherboard
June 24, 2005 7:44:51 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd (More info?)

"Beemer Biker" <joestateson@grandecom.net> wrote
> That is old news

> The real problem motherboards were alton
> and pc chips.

Due to some pc's not being run alot, they are still failing today, and
included Gigabyte, IBM, Abit, etc.


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Anonymous
a b K Overclocking
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June 24, 2005 7:45:44 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd (More info?)

"CWatters" <colin.watters@pandoraBOX.be> wrote
>> I've got to think it was a typo.
>
> Nope. You have to derate them - use a bigger capacitor

Can they use mylar instead? Or would it be way too expensive?


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Anonymous
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June 25, 2005 6:32:25 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.overclocking.amd (More info?)

"Ed Light" <nobody@nobody.there> wrote in message
news:t20ve.1412$Qo.1103@fed1read01...
>
> "CWatters" <colin.watters@pandoraBOX.be> wrote
> >> I've got to think it was a typo.
> >
> > Nope. You have to derate them - use a bigger capacitor
>
> Can they use mylar instead? Or would it be way too expensive?

Too big as well.
!