Recommendations/guidance needed for building new PC (a lon..

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt (More info?)

Darth Joules wrote:

> My aim is to have a fast custom PC on a budget that will not need any
> hardware up-grades until mid/late 2005. I've already spent just under
> £600 ($800) for the present setup. I have a remaining budget of about
> another £600 ($800).
>
> Right, here's the new partst I'm looking to get....bear in mind I
> intend to overclock to a reasonable level.
>
> CPU:
> AMD Athlon 2600 or 2800 "Barton" core.

Nice choice. I just built a Linux system using the 2800+ on a Soyo SY-KT600
Dragon Plus board. It runs circles around the 600 MHz P3 system it
replaced.

I'm so tired of the monopoly that Intel has basically had, that I'm going
AMD from here on out. My next system will be an Athlon64 machine.

> MOBO:
> NForce 2 chipset preffered
> Dual channel DDR would be welcome.
> Good overclocking features (CPU, memory & GPU).
> Good Northbridge cooling...passive OK, a fan is better.
> 5 PCI slots or more.
> Must have room for a large CPU fan (like Coolmaster Aero 7+).
> A good ovrall layout, esp. AGP and DIMM slot orientation

Personally, I like Asus for their quality, but also like Gigabyte and MSI
for their features. How does this board look to you?:

http://usa.asus.com/products/mb/socketa/a7n8x-e-d/overv...

It's $90US at www.zipzoomfly.com

> CPU FAN:
> I sticking to fan cooling because I cannot afford water cooling. So
> it needs to be a damn good fan and heatsink combo! Must have manual
> speed control like the Coolmaster Aero 7+.

The Barton's actually come with pretty good HSF combos. I overclocked my
system to a FSB of 170 pretty safely. That's nothing major, but a solid
overclock on a machine that gets used daily. I do have good case cooling,
with an 80mm fan out back and a big fat 120mm fan up front.

> MEMORY:
> 512Mb (1 stick or 2 sticks of 256Mb?).
> Good for overclocking.

If you want to overclock, get some good Corsair memory. First of all, why
ask 1 or 2 sticks when you stipulated dual channel memory before. Of
course, that means 2 sticks. However, why not go for 1GB? Some people say
it doesn't give that much benefit over 512, but have a loaded XP system and
run a couple of apps like a good paint program, a browser, Windows Media
Player, and an email client. You'll eat up lots of memory, quick. When it
starts using virtual memory, you slow down.

> GENERAL COOLING:
> Because I'm not going down the water cooling path I'll need to control
> fan speeds. The Lian Li case has 2 intake fnas at the front and 2
> exhaust fans, 1 at the back and 1 at the top
>
>
> What I will definitely be buying the following:
>
> AMD Athlon motherboard
>
> a high quality CPU fan
> new memory (512Mb)
> Graphic card (not desided on budget for this yet)

ATi X700 Pro or the nVidia 6600GT should be priced right and give great
performance. Unfortunately, you'll have to wait a little bit longer to get
an AGP model.

> Fan bus controller (probably the black Vantec)
> another IBM 60Gb 7,200rpm Deskstar HD

Why? If you game, you'll want lots of HDD space. A few modern games
installed will eat up precious HDD space in a hurry. Get a brand new SATA
drive, at least 160GB large. Also, more modern HDD's are more dense and
will perform better. Get one with at least 8MB cache.

> UV cold cathode tube
> 2x Akasa Blue UV reactive 80mm Fans (for side panel)

Personally, the side window, lighted up mod thing is already passe'...

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt (More info?)

On Mon, 04 Oct 2004 09:05:44 GMT,
darthjoules@the.sith.temple (Darth Joules) wrote:

>Greetings all,
>
>I'm about 50% done buidling my new PC. I some guidance/views on what
>remaining hardware to buy. Below is what my PC (tower only) has
>inside. Old parts are marked with a *
>
>CASE: Lian Li PC-60 USB (black) with additional Lian Li side panel
>with window so I now have a spare panel to mod.
>
>CPU: Intel Pentium II 450Mhz (don't laugh) *
>
>PSU: QuietPC 300w Silent (I may need more power) *
>
>MOBO: ATX Asus P3B-F *
>
>MEMORY: 2x Crucial 256 Mb PC133-DIMM SDRAM *
>
>GPU: Matrox Millenium G400+MA32G (again don't laugh) *
>
>SOUND: Videologic SonicFury VL-60444
>
>ETHERNET CARD: 3Com 3CSOHO100-TX 10/100 Mbps PCI NIC *
>
>HD: IBM 60Gb 7,200rpm Deskstar 180GXP
>
>FLOPPY: Panasonic Black Floppy Disc Drive
>
>CD R/RW: Philips PCRW4816K CD-R/RW Drive (IDE) (and it sounds like a
>hoover!!!) *
>
>CASE FANS: 5x Antec 80mm Blue LED Fans (modded from 4-pin to 3-pin
>connection)
>
>My aim is to have a fast custom PC on a budget that will not need any
>hardware up-grades until mid/late 2005. I've already spent just under
>£600 ($800) for the present setup. I have a remaining budget of about
>another £600 ($800).
>
>Right, here's the new partst I'm looking to get....bear in mind I
>intend to overclock to a reasonable level.
>
>CPU:
>AMD Athlon 2600 or 2800 "Barton" core.

For proposed budget, you might consider Athlon 64 instead.


>MOBO:
>NForce 2 chipset preffered

Soon nForce4 will be out, (Athlon 64 board), but for an
Athlon 2600-2800, nForce2 is the best choice.

>Dual channel DDR would be welcome.

You only mention 512MB memory below, get 2 x 512MB PC3200
modules instead. IMHO, that is definitely worth squeezing
into the budget.

Your old power supply should be replaced, ~ 400W is a nice
range in name-brand unit like Antec, Sparkle/Fortron, PC
Power & Cooling.

>Good overclocking features (CPU, memory & GPU).

Abit NF7-S (for the Athlon XP)
However, for good o'c with Athlon XP, and a board with
versatile o'c support, you should get a Mobile Barton
XP2400-2600 instead of "regular" XP2600-2800. They are
definitely the overclocker's choice with a board providing
support (in other words, manual multipler adjustment, vcore
adjustment).

>Good Northbridge cooling...passive OK, a fan is better.

Frankly, "good" northbridge cooling is overrated,
particularly on late-revision nForce2 chipset a passive
'sink is plenty good enough and reduces noise and maintence
(those tiny thin fans are notorious for failure if not lubed
at a regular interval). Active (fanned) 'sink is really
only needed if you plan to hard-mod (reverse engineer the
chipset voltage supply circuit and modify it to overvolt the
northbridge). If you plan on doing that, get better than
PC3200 memory as you'd need it for the higher FSB support.

Now, you "could" try to reach crazy high FSB speeds (beyond
220MHz, DDR440 FSB) on socket A boards like the pioneers
did, but today it makes little sense with Athlon 64 in the
market, offering higher performance without all that bother
of extreme o'c, which is always harder than more modest o'c.

>5 PCI slots or more.

5 PCI is pretty much a given on any full ATX board.

>Must have room for a large CPU fan (like Coolmaster Aero 7+).
>A good ovrall layout, esp. AGP and DIMM slot orientation

What exactly where you looking for? Abit NF7-S has a gap
between the AGP and first PCI, so oversized videocard 'sink
doesn't eat up a slot, but otherwise it shouldn't matter a
whole lot. Particularly these days with so much integrated
onto modern boards, it's hard to fill 5 PCI slots unless you
have more gear than you mentioned.

>
>CPU FAN:
>I sticking to fan cooling because I cannot afford water cooling. So
>it needs to be a damn good fan and heatsink combo! Must have manual
>speed control like the Coolmaster Aero 7+.

There are far better than Coolermaster Aero 7+. It is loud,
and doesn't cool any better than quieter alternatives.
Check in at http://www.svc.com every now and then, sometimes
they have Thermalright SLK-series 'sinks on sale for $20,
the SLK-800, 900, or 947 are much better and can run very
overclocked CPU quietly with the right fan on top,
eliminating any need for fan speed control too.

>
>MEMORY:
>512Mb (1 stick or 2 sticks of 256Mb?).
>Good for overclocking.

Most people would benefit more from 2 x 512MB of
budget-grade brand-name PC3200, for about the same $$$ that
is. Memory is one of the primary ways many people waste
money on a build, paying 60-200% more for a mere 5%
performance increase in only a few select apps constrained
only by memory throughput. Same $ buys better CPU, HDD,
video card (which you failed to mention).

G400 is a great 2D video card, but (IIRC) is incompatible
with modern motherboards due to it being 3.3V-only, won't
even physically fit in the AGP slot of a modern Athlon
board. G400 has better 2D output than most modern cards,
but certainly MUCH slower at 3D than even a modern $40 card
from ATI or nVidia. If you really want to reuse the video
card you need an old chipset like KT333, which is not a good
choice for a new build.


>GENERAL COOLING:
>Because I'm not going down the water cooling path I'll need to control
>fan speeds. The Lian Li case has 2 intake fnas at the front and 2
>exhaust fans, 1 at the back and 1 at the top

How are they controlled now? No need to change them unless
they were running very, even incredibly, slow already. 2
intake and 2 exhuast is plenty for the most demanding of
parts even at relatively low RPM, providing the flow isn't
impeded by overly restrictive filters or stamped-in-metal
fan guards, front bezel with no air intake, etc.


>What I will definitely be buying the following:
>
>AMD Athlon motherboard
>
>a high quality CPU fan
>new memory (512Mb)
>Graphic card (not desided on budget for this yet)
>Fan bus controller (probably the black Vantec)
>another IBM 60Gb 7,200rpm Deskstar HD

No, there is no need nor benefit to buying another of those
drives. Even if you wanted to RAID 0 two drives, you'd be
better off with a faster newer larger drive. In fact, a
single current-gen drive will be faster for desktop "PC" use
than a pair of those in RAID 0 anyway. Consider a WD
Raptor SATA (for a motherboard with SATA support) or the
budget, high-capacity storage option would be a Seagate
(whichever model fits in the budget).

Regardling the CPU fan, you will get good cooling with
minimal noise and maintenance by using a moderate speed
80x25 mm fan. That is enough for overclocking provided that
hunk of metal under it is good too. Again, I'd think hard
about whether you really want Athlon XP this late in the
game, especially with an $800 budget. For a $400 build I
could understand it more.

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt (More info?)

>>CPU:
>>>AMD Athlon 2600 or 2800 "Barton" core.
>
>
> For proposed budget, you might consider Athlon 64 instead.
>
>

I'd agree.

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt (More info?)

1. Memory is very cheap, no good reason to skimp, so I recommend buying 1Gb
of it as 2x512Mb sticks. This will also, of course, allow dual channel
operation and on a decent board will allow you two more slots for upgrades
if it becomes necessary.

2. RAID 0 is of very limited use. With older drives it is a bad idea
because it won't be much, if at all, faster than a new single drive but is
half as reliable, by definition, as well as complicating installation of an
OS to it if used to store a boot partition. With newer drives... do you
really need more than 160Gb? If it is speed you want and you don't need
masses of storage look at a WD Raptor. Most people will be fine with a
single large capacity ATAPI drive. Use SATA if you want, but there is no
huge advantage and it can complicate OS installation if you want to store
the boot partition on it.

3. AMD64 is a better bet than Bartons unless you are on a really tight
budget. There is a host of new boards coming out and plenty of good ones
already on the market. 64 bit Athlons outperform older Athlons even on
32bit code in most cases, so performance isn't sacrificed even with an old
OS.

4. Older nVidia FX boards are not a bad 'budget' video card. Current
generation 6000 series boards are very nice, especially the 6800 Ultra. Ati
also have comparable offerings, but it's been a while since I used one or
bothered to look at their range, therefore I won't even touch on them.

5. 'Mods' are very much a matter of personal taste and opinion... but
personally I think glowing neon lights and cutaway panels are naff. If you
really like it, go for it. Most 'modders' I know consider it to be 'old
hat' now, but what you like is your business ;¬)

If you insist on going with the Bartons, I'd recommend an nForce 2 chipset.
MSI make nice ones I personally use a nice Gigabyte one and I am sure Asus
has good offerings too. It's a 'mature' technology and performs well in its
class.

My biggest piece of advice would be DON'T buy an old hard-drive. There is
nothing at all to be gained by doing so, in my honest opinion. Get a newer
large capacity drive and forget about RAID 0 or else buy TWO new drives and
stripe away. Don't try and buy another old drive to match the existing one,
it's not worth it.

John

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt (More info?)

I would go for the ASUS A78NX Deluxe MOBO with an Athalon 3200
G-Card - go for a ATI 9800pro (you cant fall off)

"Darth Joules" <darthjoules@the.sith.temple> wrote in message
news:3f5b68fe.606481@news.easynet.co.uk...
> Greetings all,
>
> I'm about 50% done buidling my new PC. I some guidance/views on what
> remaining hardware to buy. Below is what my PC (tower only) has
> inside. Old parts are marked with a *
>
> CASE: Lian Li PC-60 USB (black) with additional Lian Li side panel
> with window so I now have a spare panel to mod.
>
> CPU: Intel Pentium II 450Mhz (don't laugh) *
>
> PSU: QuietPC 300w Silent (I may need more power) *
>
> MOBO: ATX Asus P3B-F *
>
> MEMORY: 2x Crucial 256 Mb PC133-DIMM SDRAM *
>
> GPU: Matrox Millenium G400+MA32G (again don't laugh) *
>
> SOUND: Videologic SonicFury VL-60444
>
> ETHERNET CARD: 3Com 3CSOHO100-TX 10/100 Mbps PCI NIC *
>
> HD: IBM 60Gb 7,200rpm Deskstar 180GXP
>
> FLOPPY: Panasonic Black Floppy Disc Drive
>
> CD R/RW: Philips PCRW4816K CD-R/RW Drive (IDE) (and it sounds like a
> hoover!!!) *
>
> CASE FANS: 5x Antec 80mm Blue LED Fans (modded from 4-pin to 3-pin
> connection)
>
> My aim is to have a fast custom PC on a budget that will not need any
> hardware up-grades until mid/late 2005. I've already spent just under
> £600 ($800) for the present setup. I have a remaining budget of about
> another £600 ($800).
>
> Right, here's the new partst I'm looking to get....bear in mind I
> intend to overclock to a reasonable level.
>
> CPU:
> AMD Athlon 2600 or 2800 "Barton" core.
>
> MOBO:
> NForce 2 chipset preffered
> Dual channel DDR would be welcome.
> Good overclocking features (CPU, memory & GPU).
> Good Northbridge cooling...passive OK, a fan is better.
> 5 PCI slots or more.
> Must have room for a large CPU fan (like Coolmaster Aero 7+).
> A good ovrall layout, esp. AGP and DIMM slot orientation
>
> CPU FAN:
> I sticking to fan cooling because I cannot afford water cooling. So
> it needs to be a damn good fan and heatsink combo! Must have manual
> speed control like the Coolmaster Aero 7+.
>
> MEMORY:
> 512Mb (1 stick or 2 sticks of 256Mb?).
> Good for overclocking.
>
> GENERAL COOLING:
> Because I'm not going down the water cooling path I'll need to control
> fan speeds. The Lian Li case has 2 intake fnas at the front and 2
> exhaust fans, 1 at the back and 1 at the top
>
>
> What I will definitely be buying the following:
>
> AMD Athlon motherboard
>
> a high quality CPU fan
> new memory (512Mb)
> Graphic card (not desided on budget for this yet)
> Fan bus controller (probably the black Vantec)
> another IBM 60Gb 7,200rpm Deskstar HD
> UV cold cathode tube
> 2x Akasa Blue UV reactive 80mm Fans (for side panel)
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt (More info?)

Neil Watson a formulé ce mercredi :
> I would go for the ASUS A78NX Deluxe MOBO with an Athalon 3200
> G-Card - go for a ATI 9800pro (you cant fall off)

I agree with this for mobo and g-card.
For the proc, I would suggest a "simple" 2500+ barton; it has a very
good reputation for an easy o/c up to 3200 B-)
>>
>> My aim is to have a fast custom PC on a budget that will not need any
>> hardware up-grades until mid/late 2005. I've already spent just under
>> £600 ($800) for the present setup. I have a remaining budget of about
>> another £600 ($800).
>>
This will lead you to end of 2005, until for instance nForce4 is out,
available and cheaper than when it will be brand new ;-)

And for games, this will be powerful enough and you can deal with 512
Mo PC3200 (1 stick with AMD config), re-usable in a future config.

I cannot give you prices - I am from France, I have no idea of US
prices.
CPU fan: i recommend Zalman 7000B.

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